Rain: dropped dose of lexapro

[Rain]

Hi Rain,

 

I just read a few your initial posts, somehow I feel part, if not the most problems are still from the drug reaction to the 20 mg lex. I saw Alto also suggested it in your early posts, I wonder why you didn't try to taper down dosage. I don't have time to rad all your posts so if this has been discussed then forgive me bringing it up again.

 

I had a similar experience getting severe reaction from one day increased dose ( from 3.2 to 4.2mg) and have been suffering the bad symptoms of drug reaction ever since. Each time I make a cut, they subside, then flare back until another cut.

 

Have the new symptoms since 20mg lessened or worsened over the past months? I read some subsided since you got back down to 10mg, I am asking for changes since then.

Hi LexAnger:

 

Many thanks for your reply! 

 

You started a new idea to me, which is a good idea. The reason why I hold 10mg for 1 year long is because they all suggested me to HOLD due to I am still having an unstable nerve systems. 

 

By the time I dropped back to 10mg from 20mg, It did subside a lot of bad reactions! But that took about 3 months.. 

 

Then the symptoms changed and started to come by waves! Some were similar but some were new. Each wave was different but they improved a lot by the time. Then all suggestions were HOLD till I get stabilized. But it seems I am suddenly getting much worse since the 10th month of having 10mg. Now is nearly 12th month. I get hurt from both physical and emotionals, some were never happened in my life! 

 

So your suggestion will still be the same as you said? And how much dosage I should reduce? 

 

Thanks! 

[scallywag]

What are your symptoms?

Is there a daily pattern to your symptoms?

 

Please take notes on paper for a few days and post them here in your introduction topic. This post gives details of what's important in figuring this out: 

Take notes of doses and symptoms

[LexAnger]

Hi Rain,

 

After years struggling and effort analyzing my own situation hour by hour, day by day, I found its almost impossible to grab a sure clue in terms of causal relationship when one is stuck in between WD and Side effects which seems to me like your case too.

 

So I feel it's really difficult for anyone ( self included) to work out a strategy. Still, I believe the person knowing the best is own self as only the person can feel moment by moment how things are changing.

 

I brought up my experience as a possible situation for you to be aware of in case you haven't yet. You may want to try with extreme caution with tiny drops see what your body tells you. It may take a few such trial to see a pattern, and remember the pattern can change after a while ( happened to me just lately now I need to figure out the whole new dynamics).

 

You mentioned some symptoms got better with long holds, whose sounds From WD based on the outcome of long holds, and those got worse could be possibly from drug side effects, which needs to be confirmed after the try of cutting doses.

 

Going slow and small is the key to fight against two evils.

[Rain]

What are your symptoms?

Is there a daily pattern to your symptoms?

 

Please take notes on paper for a few days and post them here in your introduction topic. This post gives details of what's important in figuring this out: 

Take notes of doses and symptoms

 

Hi Scallywag,

 

My symptoms for these 2 weeks were terrible and so many. Also they were just came to me one by one or 2-3 together.

 

I had both body symptoms and mental symptoms. 

 

Body symptoms including: Fast uncomfortable heart palps, chest tightness, inner restless, very tense back neck feelings, cold flow/ hot flush in the body, especially in the head, red hot ears, ice cold trembling feet and hands, super weak feet (couldn't hold the car clutch pedal...), heavy dizzyness most of the time, stomach very sensitive to the foods and indigestion, throat tightness, tiredness. 

 

Mental symptoms including: severe anxiety most of the time, fear, guilty, slightly depressed. The most horrible new-starting symptom is: intrusive suicidal ideation with dark back ground feeling... This is unbelievable and unbearable! I called my mom to keep in touch with me to make sure I am ok all the time. 

 

The daily pattern of symptoms are changing all the time, also my sleeping pattern is changing, too. But mostly it turns to bad or changes feelings after taking lexapro. Approx 4-4.5 hours symptoms will change again but sometimes turned to better, sometimes worse. 

[Rain]

Hi Rain,

 

After years struggling and effort analyzing my own situation hour by hour, day by day, I found its almost impossible to grab a sure clue in terms of causal relationship when one is stuck in between WD and Side effects which seems to me like your case too.

 

So I feel it's really difficult for anyone ( self included) to work out a strategy. Still, I believe the person knowing the best is own self as only the person can feel moment by moment how things are changing.

 

I brought up my experience as a possible situation for you to be aware of in case you haven't yet. You may want to try with extreme caution with tiny drops see what your body tells you. It may take a few such trial to see a pattern, and remember the pattern can change after a while ( happened to me just lately now I need to figure out the whole new dynamics).

 

You mentioned some symptoms got better with long holds, whose sounds From WD based on the outcome of long holds, and those got worse could be possibly from drug side effects, which needs to be confirmed after the try of cutting doses.

 

Going slow and small is the key to fight against two evils.

 

Many thanks Lexanger! 

 

As you can see my symptoms that described to Scallywag, most of them were not belong to myself original symptoms. 

 

So I decided to try to taper my Lexapro. Before doing that, I would like to know, how much cut is safe and you recommend? 1mg cut? or 0.5mg?

 

Thanks

[LexAnger]

I would even try smaller like 0.25 mg see how you feel, you can always increase if it works, if it doesn't the harm shouldn't be huge and you should be able to stabilize quickly.

 

Going back up with dose never did good to me, so I always approach with extreme caution.

[scallywag]

Rain, thanks for the summary of the last 2 weeks. It's more useful to review actual notes from several days, though. Have a look at the post I linked above where a format is suggested for a daily log of doses and symptoms.

[bubble]

From your description it seems to be that you are going through a typical pattern of stabilisation with rapidly changing waves and small windows.

 

You do write there are brief periods of milder symptoms and I would expect these periods to get longer.

 

Overall you don't seem to be doing worse and there are even some improvements. If that is the case I would continue to hold. LexAnger's case is very specific amd we don't see members in a similar situation.

[Rain]

I would even try smaller like 0.25 mg see how you feel, you can always increase if it works, if it doesn't the harm shouldn't be huge and you should be able to stabilize quickly.

 

Going back up with dose never did good to me, so I always approach with extreme caution.

 

Thanks LexAnger! So currently i am taking 10mg lexapro half tablet, if want to cut, how you can make it? Sorry about I am new to taper. I have a micro jewery scale can measure tablet by 0.001g. 

 

Also, If once I have a reactions to the med, is that mean, this meds actually doesn't make any positive effect to me? 

 

Thanks! 

[Rain]

Rain, thanks for the summary of the last 2 weeks. It's more useful to review actual notes from several days, though. Have a look at the post I linked above where a format is suggested for a daily log of doses and symptoms.

 

Many thanks scallywag, I really appreciate that you have looked at my summary. 

 

Ya, I will definitely make a notes to record my daily symptom patterns. I will post it once I made it.  

[Rain]

From your description it seems to be that you are going through a typical pattern of stabilisation with rapidly changing waves and small windows.

 

You do write there are brief periods of milder symptoms and I would expect these periods to get longer.

 

Overall you don't seem to be doing worse and there are even some improvements. If that is the case I would continue to hold. LexAnger's case is very specific amd we don't see members in a similar situation.

 

 

Hi Bubble! Thanks for your suggestion! I hope this is still the typical pattern of stabilisation, I do see big improvements during April to August, however, since the end of August, things became bad again, I can't tell if it is better than the begining of my withdrawal. This wave is so long and some symptoms are unbelievable. 

 

As Alto mentioned at begining of my withdrawal, Once I got distablization to the meds, I seems to not get stabilized to meds (SSRI). I wonder If this is really what I am going through, then HOLD maybe an endless suffering. 

[LexAnger]

Thanks bubble to chime in.

 

Rain, I think the best is to go with the majority per statistical principle giving the high variability among individuals.

 

Good luck!

 

Lex

[Frogie]

Hey Rain welcome!  I am glad you decided to sign up.  This is the best place for all your questions. Im stitch on medchat and Mort in these parts of town. Lots of people with tons of firsthand experience with these meds

 

Hi Mort:

I saw you tapered pretty fast off Lexapro. I am tapering, and did some pretty stupid things. What were your WD symptoms? I tapered in 6 weeks from 20 to 10mg and have been nauseated ever since. I take a PPI (Prilosec) tried to taper it and am really nauseous from that now too. You can read my signature page and get more info. I'm holding now and not going anywhere with my dosages for quite a while. I just wish I knew how to get rid of the nausea, I would be ok then. Thanks for any ideas you might have!

[Rain]

Thanks bubble to chime in.

 

Rain, I think the best is to go with the majority per statistical principle giving the high variability among individuals.

 

Good luck!

 

Lex

 

Thanks Lex for your suggestion! 

[ChessieCat]

It might be a good idea to Rate Symptoms Daily to Check Patterns and Progress

 

When we aren't feeling good it can be hard to remember how we felt before, was worse, not as bad or different to how we are feeling now.  Rating your symptoms might help you to see the difference in how you are feeling now compared to before.

[Rain]

Some New Updates:

 

I had some Ok days after 2 months of hell. So Last week, I flew to see Doctor Yolande Lucire in Sydney. She is a famous withdrawal expert who I know about her on this AD forum. 

 

What she suggest me to do is to taper the Lexapro to 9mg, instead of 10mg. So on 11th I cut lexapro by weighing it's weight. For example, my 10mg lexapro weighs 0.130g, so I cut it to 0.117g, which should be 10% of drop and 9mg of the dose. I don't know if this has any problem to do like this. 

 

For the first of two days I was alright. But since yesterday and today, things went bad again, I feel I am back the hell feeling again! God... 

 

So if the taper acts like that, what seems to be like now? Worsening Withdrawal? or taper too fast? 

 

Many thanks! 

[scallywag]

What did Dr. Lucire suggest that you do if you had difficulties?

[Rain]

What did Dr. Lucire suggest that you do if you had difficulties?

She Suggests me to take delayed release from compound pharmacy. But I am poor enough to buy these in the long run. So I decided to cut tablets by myself. 

[bubble]

I'm sorry you don't feel well. I would say you started tapering too soon. It would probably be better if you had stayed on the dose longer even after you started to feel better.

 

Also cutting by 10 % could be too much for you. Next time you could try 5 %.

 

I make my own liquid with water. It's very easy actually.

 

You will start feeling better again once your brain adjusts to the next dose. When I cut it can take a week for the symptoms to appear and then another 10 days to subside. And then I allow my brain time to rest before cutting again.

[Rain]

I'm sorry you don't feel well. I would say you started tapering too soon. It would probably be better if you had stayed on the dose longer even after you started to feel better.

 

Also cutting by 10 % could be too much for you. Next time you could try 5 %.

 

I make my own liquid with water. It's very easy actually.

 

You will start feeling better again once your brain adjusts to the next dose. When I cut it can take a week for the symptoms to appear and then another 10 days to subside. And then I allow my brain time to rest before cutting again.

Many thanks Bubble! 

 

I agree with your opinion! I don't know if i am right, my understand now is, since the symptoms are worsening after reduce the dose, it might indicates I am having previous withdrawal symptoms more than reverse reactions of Lexapro. 

 

Dr. Lucire is a very kind doctor, she helped me a lot and she felt for me. But as we all know, when in WD, no one can tell what will happen in the future. She might misunderstood me, so she think all I am suffering at the moment is all because of the reverse reaction from Lexapro. In that case, she wants me to reduce the Lexapro as fast as I can. She suggests me to try 9mg first,then next week to 8mg, which I think is too fast to me.

[Rain]

I couldn't post pictures. sorry

[bubble]

 

 

I had some Ok days after 2 months of hell.

 

For example, my 10mg lexapro weighs 0.130g, so I cut it to 0.117g, which should be 10% of drop and 9mg of the dose.

 

For the first of two days I was alright. But since yesterday and today, things went bad again

 

You are right when you say it's hard ti say what is what with these drugs. But reading through your post which I quoted above it seems pretty clear: you started feeling better, you made a cut, you feel worse. Typical withdrawal.

 

How long has it been since you made the cut? If the symptoms are too harsh and you think you can't ride them out you can just go back to 10 mg and wait to stabilise some more. Maybe you just started cuttibg too soon and holding would have helped especially since you finally started feeling better.

[Rain]

 

 

I had some Ok days after 2 months of hell.

 

For example, my 10mg lexapro weighs 0.130g, so I cut it to 0.117g, which should be 10% of drop and 9mg of the dose.

 

For the first of two days I was alright. But since yesterday and today, things went bad again

 

You are right when you say it's hard ti say what is what with these drugs. But reading through your post which I quoted above it seems pretty clear: you started feeling better, you made a cut, you feel worse. Typical withdrawal.

 

How long has it been since you made the cut? If the symptoms are too harsh and you think you can't ride them out you can just go back to 10 mg and wait to stabilise some more. Maybe you just started cuttibg too soon and holding would have helped especially since you finally started feeling better.

I cutted about 5 days ago, it is getting worse for sure but it is still bearable at the moment. I am trying not to make it worse, but it's hard to tell if I can make it. 

 

It has been just 1 year since Withdrawal starts on me. Then I cut it to 9mg... I think it is too fast to cut. 

[bubble]

This has been caused by a cut so it will gradually decrease. I made two cuts to my Lexapro after a long hold. For some 7 to 10 days I didn't feel anthing and after that things got quite ugly: strong anxiety, DP/DR, extreme fatigue of such level that I couldn't leave the bed for 2 days. But the good news is that after around 5 days of intense symptoms things started improving and I got to my baseline again.

 

Such controlled cut makes you safe. Things won't spiral out of control. It's very likely that you will soon see decrease in symptoms. As I said, when you cut next lowering by 5 % instead of 10 % should make withdrawal symptoms less ugly.

 

Hang in there.

[Rain]

This has been caused by a cut so it will gradually decrease. I made two cuts to my Lexapro after a long hold. For some 7 to 10 days I didn't feel anthing and after that things got quite ugly: strong anxiety, DP/DR, extreme fatigue of such level that I couldn't leave the bed for 2 days. But the good news is that after around 5 days of intense symptoms things started improving and I got to my baseline again.

 

Such controlled cut makes you safe. Things won't spiral out of control. It's very likely that you will soon see decrease in symptoms. As I said, when you cut next lowering by 5 % instead of 10 % should make withdrawal symptoms less ugly.

 

Hang in there.

Thanks Bubble for your suggestion! 

 

Last night I got some severe symptoms, restless feet, chest, ears burning hot and red, etc... Thoughts have death feeling, big anxiety... 

 

But I still would like to see if it will get worse or not, it has been 6 days since i cut. 

 

I will let you know. 

 

Thanks! 

[Rain]

Some updates:

 

After about a week of cutting the dose, I started feeling best Windows I have ever had in the past one year. And that lasts pretty long, 1.5 weeks! longest windows I have ever had! 

 

However, things went ugly again after 2.5- 3 weeks of cutting dose. I started having angry moods again, bad akathisia. Then, regreting crying waves hits me. Recent five days, things getting much worse... Nausea stomach, diahrrea, bowel movements, want crying feelings but couldn't cry out, extremely Anxiety symptoms again, etc... 

 

Some symptoms were like my first time having WD a year ago, some are from worsening Akathisia that newly happened 2 months ago... I also feel after taking the med for about 4 hours, symptoms usually gets worse. 

 

So I was in a big mess at the moment, also confusing what's going on with me now? what indicates the pattern I am having? Should I do anything now or just keep hold by now? 

[Frogie]

Some updates:

 

After about a week of cutting the dose, I started feeling best Windows I have ever had in the past one year. And that lasts pretty long, 1.5 weeks! longest windows I have ever had! 

 

However, things went ugly again after 2.5- 3 weeks of cutting dose. I started having angry moods again, bad akathisia. Then, regreting crying waves hits me. Recent five days, things getting much worse... Nausea stomach, diahrrea, bowel movements, want crying feelings but couldn't cry out, extremely Anxiety symptoms again, etc... 

 

Some symptoms were like my first time having WD a year ago, some are from worsening Akathisia that newly happened 2 months ago... I also feel after taking the med for about 4 hours, symptoms usually gets worse. 

 

So I was in a big mess at the moment, also confusing what's going on with me now? what indicates the pattern I am having? Should I do anything now or just keep hold by now? 

Hi Rain:

 

I'm sorry you feel this way.

 

It's an evil drug. I was stupid and cut my dosage in 1/2 in the spring and I've had nausea since June.

 

It will get better. That's what I tell myself.

 

Just take care of yourself.

 

Take care,

Frogie xx

[LexAnger]

Hi Rain,

 

Here is me again. Ever since last time Iposted in your thread, it seems what happens to you confirmed my original suspension, that you are getting more severe side effects ( mostrobabaly from the 20 mg dose incraese).

 

There are many ( Gemini Girl, Reachforthestar, others I don't remember names) are in similar situation. Mor I read, more I found it quite common.

 

Ever since my reaction to dose increase, the only windows were brought up by fast tapering. I'm doing 1% cut everyday now ( not recommended just show how strong the reaction is still is since it started one year ago and I already got down from 3.2 to 1 mg)

 

It's very tricky when one is in between WD and reaction. You have to constantly work out the ever changing strategy to balance symptoms from both.

[Rain]

 

Some updates:

 

After about a week of cutting the dose, I started feeling best Windows I have ever had in the past one year. And that lasts pretty long, 1.5 weeks! longest windows I have ever had! 

 

However, things went ugly again after 2.5- 3 weeks of cutting dose. I started having angry moods again, bad akathisia. Then, regreting crying waves hits me. Recent five days, things getting much worse... Nausea stomach, diahrrea, bowel movements, want crying feelings but couldn't cry out, extremely Anxiety symptoms again, etc... 

 

Some symptoms were like my first time having WD a year ago, some are from worsening Akathisia that newly happened 2 months ago... I also feel after taking the med for about 4 hours, symptoms usually gets worse. 

 

So I was in a big mess at the moment, also confusing what's going on with me now? what indicates the pattern I am having? Should I do anything now or just keep hold by now? 

Hi Rain:

 

I'm sorry you feel this way.

 

It's an evil drug. I was stupid and cut my dosage in 1/2 in the spring and I've had nausea since June.

 

It will get better. That's what I tell myself.

 

Just take care of yourself.

 

Take care,

Frogie xx

 

Thank you Frogie for your encouragement, since dropping the dose, I experienced a lots of low mood, it is awful, before I never experienced that!

[Rain]

Hi Rain,

 

Here is me again. Ever since last time Iposted in your thread, it seems what happens to you confirmed my original suspension, that you are getting more severe side effects ( mostrobabaly from the 20 mg dose incraese).

 

There are many ( Gemini Girl, Reachforthestar, others I don't remember names) are in similar situation. Mor I read, more I found it quite common.

 

Ever since my reaction to dose increase, the only windows were brought up by fast tapering. I'm doing 1% cut everyday now ( not recommended just show how strong the reaction is still is since it started one year ago and I already got down from 3.2 to 1 mg)

 

It's very tricky when one is in between WD and reaction. You have to constantly work out the ever changing strategy to balance symptoms from both.

 

Many thanks LexAnger! Yes, my symptoms of cutting dose is worsening! Especially low mood! I have never experienced low mood and despair like that! Have you also experienced of that? What do you recommend me to do at this stage? Hold for stabilized?

[scallywag]

Rain, you might want to consider making smaller dose reductions for a while. Instead of 10%, reduce by 5% or less.

 

Micro-taper instead of 10% or 5% decreases.

 

A version of a microtaper: The brassmonkey slide, link to a post in his introduction topic describing the method.

I've posted an example of calculations for the slide in this post.

[Rain]

Rain, you might want to consider making smaller dose reductions for a while. Instead of 10%, reduce by 5% or less.

 

Micro-taper instead of 10% or 5% decreases.

 

A version of a microtaper: The brassmonkey slide, link to a post in his introduction topic describing the method.

I've posted an example of calculations for the slide in this post.

Many thanks Scallywag, 

 

Your information is very important to me. So by now it sounds I'd better to hold current dosage for diminishing the symptoms. 

[LexAnger]

Hi rain,

 

Unfortunately I don't think I can give you recommendations. The reason is, 1) this whole thing is very individualized and no one really knows what and how and 2) it's especially so since my opinion is different from other experienced members.

 

The best thing others can do is to share their experience and guess around while the best judge is oneself, as no one really knows how you feel day by day, minute by minute and all the other factors that are hard for others to connect. There are so many things can impact how you feel, and the interaction of everything with each unique brain will result in millions different scenarios.

[Rain]

Hi rain,

 

Unfortunately I don't think I can give you recommendations. The reason is, 1) this whole thing is very individualized and no one really knows what and how and 2) it's especially so since my opinion is different from other experienced members.

 

The best thing others can do is to share their experience and guess around while the best judge is oneself, as no one really knows how you feel day by day, minute by minute and all the other factors that are hard for others to connect. There are so many things can impact how you feel, and the interaction of everything with each unique brain will result in millions different scenarios.

Hi LexAnger, thanks for that, It is ok, I try to keep taking this dosage for a while and see hows it going. 

 

Hope I will get better soon!

 

Regards 

Rain

[AliG]

Rain. You can't go wrong if you hold for quite a while. Yes the Brass slide could possibly be good for you. What have you decided ?

[Rain]

Rain. You can't go wrong if you hold for quite a while. Yes the Brass slide could possibly be good for you. What have you decided ?

Many thanks AliG!

 

It looks so confused to me, but I can feel this is the exactly I need to do. Sorry about my english level to understand that article. 

 

So I have got a micro scale, my orignal lexapro weighs around 0.130g, currently my calculation is quite simple: 10% reduce so now my first reduce to 9mg is 0.117g. 

 

Can you explain hows brassmokey slide measured? 

 

Thanks 

 

Regards

 

Rain