Shanti: tapering off Paxil

[bubbles]

Shanti, do you mind me asking about your nerve pain and the possible thyroid link? I have been a thyriod patient for, umm, 13 years? I was on one treatment for a while and had dreadful aches (though I was also very depressed at the time, but therapist said it didn't sound like typical depression pain). I'm curious about what your doc said, if you don't mind sharing. You can tell me to mind my own business if you prefer.

 

Bubbles

[Shanti]

Oh, it's okay, I don't mind. I'm here to share, give and receive support so I'm open here.

 

Well, unfortunately I found out that my thyroid is perfectly normal. That really bums me out. Now I have no clue about this pain. For a prognosis, all I have to go by is my dad as he has the same thing. Just severe nerve pain, burning, tingling, vibrating, shooting and stabbing. It can be crippling. I have no idea what it is. It's very similar to Multiple Sclerosis in symptoms, but both me and my dad have no MS Lesions on the brain. It started actually 20 years ago with Lhermitte's sign. Then it went away for many years. That is very telling of MS. MS is about the only thing I can think of, and I know that 1 in 10 MS patients have no lesions. So it could be. There is definite nerve damage that showed up on nerve conductivity tests. There are no Neurologists in my area that accept my insurance. I'm getting into a new Indian Clinic so maybe they can get me to a Neurologist, I hope. I'll be seeing them again in a couple weeks.

[Karma]

So Shanti,

 

Did the doc just run a TSH lab and pronounce that you are "in-range" so it can't be your thyroid or did your doc run Free T3, Free T4, Thyroid peroxidase antibody (TPOAb) and Thyroglobulin antibody (TgAb)? See this site for a wealth of information on thyroid and the endocrine system https://eaware.org/.

 

TSH is thyroid stimulating hormone - it is NOT thyroid hormone. It is a pituitary hormone. It is an indirect, and many would argue, ineffective measure of thyroid function. http://www.thyroid-info.com/articles/david-derry.htm

 

Free T3 and Free T4 are measures of the amount of storage thyroid hormone (T4) and active thyroid hormone (T3) available in the blood (not bond) - these are far better measures of thyroid function.

 

The reason to run the antibody tests is to see if there are thyroid antibodies which would indicate an autoimmune attack on your thyroid at some point ... if the results are in range the patient is not currently having an attack, if the results are above normal range the patient is undergoing an active antibody attack - usually when antibodies are present it can be predicted that the TSH will swing from the hyper-range to the hypo-range.

 

I'm not a medical professional - I'm just a thyroid patient who had to educate myself in order to get proper treatment ... and I cannot tell you how many people I know who have pressed the matter with their doctors and found that they did indeed have a thyroid issue - something that can be treated and the treatment can yield relief.

 

Karma

[Shanti]

Thank you Karma. I'm seeing a new doctor on the 20th and what I'll do is read the link you posted and then have my new doctor check out my thyroid. I just can't believe that I was in normal range. She said my TSH level was .55, very normal she said. Yeah, I'll have the new doc check me out.

[Shanti]

Hi Everyone. I'm just gonna update and in a couple days come back and check out the other parts of the forum. I've been busy lately. I'm doing great. I have energy and motivation like I haven't had in a year. I got back with the boyfriend that I broke up with when I was on Paxil. I actually care now. I got a new doctor at another Indian Clinic that I really like. He said he never prescribes meds like Paxil and Effexor because of the withdrawals. He is very aware of the evilness of these drugs. He's the mental health doc there. He told me I should just go ahead now and stop the Prozac. So I decided to go ahead and try, and it's been 3 days and I haven't had any Prozac. I pray I will continue to feel this good! I really feel this is it now. I haven't even had nausea for awhile. I'm getting up and ready every day. I just feel more alive and ready to live my life

[Tom]

I really hope it works out Shanti and that you keep feeling good, but I wonder, shouldn't you keep on tapering?

[Shanti]

I really hope it works out Shanti and that you keep feeling good, but I wonder, shouldn't you keep on tapering?

 

Yeah. I noticed yesterday and last night that I was very easily startled. Sudden noises and someone touching me, I'd have a little panic attack. So along with all my good feelings coming back, fear is one of them. But I'm not feeling fearful, just startled a few times where as I'd been numbing my anxiety for so long and it was weird. So, what I'm going to do is continue to taper just to be safe. I'm on a good roll and don't want to mess it up. I think you are right, I should continue to taper. I just got so hopeful that I could just end it all because this doctor went to great lengths to explain to me and reassure me that the Prozac isn't bad to come off of.

[Altostrata]

Shanti, dear, please go back on 10mg Prozac (you were taking 14mg, right?).

 

You had such terrible withdrawal symptoms from Prozac, I'd hate to see that start up again after you've been doing so well. I'm worried about this startle response, that's a sign of withdrawal symptoms.

 

Even a rough taper of 5mg reduction every 2 weeks is better than just jumping off at 14mg.

 

You new doctor sounds like a good one, but like almost all of them, he doesn't know much about tapering and withdrawal syndrome.

[Tom]

 

 

Yeah. I noticed yesterday and last night that I was very easily startled. Sudden noises and someone touching me, I'd have a little panic attack. So along with all my good feelings coming back, fear is one of them. But I'm not feeling fearful, just startled a few times where as I'd been numbing my anxiety for so long and it was weird. So, what I'm going to do is continue to taper just to be safe. I'm on a good roll and don't want to mess it up. I think you are right, I should continue to taper. I just got so hopeful that I could just end it all because this doctor went to great lengths to explain to me and reassure me that the Prozac isn't bad to come off of.

 

 

Ok, good to hear.

[Altostrata]

Whew! Very relieved to hear you're still tapering.

 

Doctors believe Prozac is easy to quit. This is also part of their misinformation about tapering and withdrawal syndrome.

 

It may be a little easier than other drugs, but there are many, many reports on the Web from people who found getting off Prozac to be difficult.

[Shanti]

After I reinstated the 12 mg of Prozac, the startle response has disappeared. So I'll keep the tapering and try not to get ahead of myself. I'm almost there. I guess another reason I'm wanting to hurry and get this over with is that I want to get going on my Xanax taper and then finally be done with it all. Every night that I take the .5 mg before I got to bed, I feel annoyed that I'm taking it and just want it to end. Lord I need more patience.

[Altostrata]

That's good, Shanti. We want your nervous system to be calm.

[Shanti]

Well now that things are stabilized again after the hormone pill fiasco, I'm doing so much better. I'm doing better than ever in fact. I am now able to walk several blocks a day! That is a huge improvement

 

Intense dreams are now under control. The Stramonium did stop working so I switched to Arcenicum Album 30 C and it is working like a charm for my nightmares. Much better sleep. I'm sleeping about 10 hours a night.

[Karma]

Shanti

 

Thanks so much for the update. I'm so glad you are feeling better. The ability to walk more is also a good indicator as is the good amount of sleeping.

 

I noticed that you keep dropping by 2 mg of Prozac at a time ... which is more than a 10% drop from the original dose ... is that working? You're not having any symptoms from that size of a decrement? Just gathering information.

 

Love and light,

Karma

[Shanti]

Yeah, I'm dropping faster than if I were tapering off of a short half life antidepressant. I can go faster because Prozac has a very long half life. I'm dropping about 3 weeks too. It's not effecting me. The birth control pills threw me off, but that's all cleared up now, even though I dropped right after that. My doctor is trying to rush me. My new pain doc is also the mental health doc. So I'm really concerned about him taking care of my pain if I'm rebellious against his advice. He wanted me to stop taking the Prozac altogether when I was at 14 mg. But I just can't bring myself to do that. He has no idea how horrific withdrawals are.

[Altostrata]

Stay strong, Shanti. Tell him when you went faster, you got bad withdrawal symptoms and you don't want to endanger your health.

 

Really, your well-being should be his first priority!!

[Skyler]

Yeah, I'm dropping faster than if I were tapering off of a short half life antidepressant. I can go faster because Prozac has a very long half life. I'm dropping about 3 weeks too. It's not effecting me. The birth control pills threw me off, but that's all cleared up now, even though I dropped right after that. My doctor is trying to rush me. My new pain doc is also the mental health doc. So I'm really concerned about him taking care of my pain if I'm rebellious against his advice. He wanted me to stop taking the Prozac altogether when I was at 14 mg. But I just can't bring myself to do that. He has no idea how horrific withdrawals are.

 

Shanti.. the doc is your pain doc, he is not supposed to CAUSE pain. Maybe he needs a reminder that not all pain is in your muscles and back?? You are not supposed to be afraid of the treatment?

 

I looked at your web site today.. very nice, very nice indeed. Howze about giving your doc the link?

[Shanti]

Thank you Schuyler and Alto. I see the new doctor on the 2nd. I was hoping I'd somehow be off Prozac by then, but there's no way. I have a plan. First I'm going to show him all the pain meds I get from my other doctor. I want to show him that I have a doctor that is quite willing to prescribe me Methadone for my pain, and to let him know that I am not there to try to get narcotics off him. If that were the case, I'd just stick to my old doc. I'm going to tell him that I tried the Cymbalta and it made me nauseous and didn't help with pain. If he insists that I try another antidepressant, I'm going to go ahead and take the prescription but I won't "take" them. I'll just tell him they aren't working for pain. All I want is alternatives, such as patches, shots or something. I absolutely refuse to take anymore antidepressants. I mean seriously, over my dead body! If he says anything about my slow taper off Prozac, I'll tell him what you said, that I tried to go faster several times but I get bad reactions and it terrifies me. It's all I can do.

[Nikki]

Shanti so glad you are feeling better. I saw that you can drop the Prozac by 2 mgs. without problems. That's a plus. 2mgs. was always too much for me.

 

Like Alto said your health and well being come first. Don't let anyone rush you.

 

You should be done with your Prozac taper in no time. I really never heard anyone say that their AD helped with pain. If anything they cause a great deal of pain while withdrawing.

 

Shanti what is the pain/condition that you have?

 

Hugs

[Shanti]

Thank you Nikki After all the hell I went through with Paxil, I am so glad I am nearly done with this. I know that my CNS will be sensitive for some time, and I'll have to be careful. I have never seen anyone say that AD helped them with pain either, and I have been on several different pain forums.

 

They aren't sure what I have. My dad has Dilapidated Disease of the Central Nervous System, and I have the same symptoms. I have nerve damage in all my extremities. I also have an Annular Fissure in my lumbar spine that causes extreme pain. I've heard that some fissures don't cause pain, but if it touches some nerves, it causes severe chronic pain. The symptoms I have are much like MS.

[Shanti]

I thought I was doing so good. I'd been doing the back exercises every day the doc told me to do. It's very gentle and no big deal. So I started walking about 4 blocks every day. I did this for 4 days, then oh my gawd, the pain was unbearable for 4 days after that. Electric pain down my left leg and both feet. Then on the fourth day, I had a total relapse in withdrawals in that I thought I wasn't going to survive the night. I wasn't afraid to die at all. But I was just afraid that my son or daughter would find me dead. Just such hard electrical zaps throughout my head and body, my heart and lungs. It was doing that weird sudden inbreath thing too. I did this two days, and now I'm back to normal, but scared to death to walk! I thought maybe a gentle short bike ride would be better? Any thoughts on that, as I think the shock of my feet hitting the pavement is what killed my nerves. Bad news is that my disability is going to appeals and will take 15 to 18 months to get there. So I contacted the Indian Manpower and asked them to please help me. They said they could get me in job training and try to find me something where I can at least sit down most the day. I have to do something. It will be torture having to work.

[Altostrata]

So sorry to hear that, Shanti.

 

Did you add or change any other medications?

 

Maybe this is a time to hold a bit on your Prozac taper.

 

Gentle bike riding might be good, don't push yourself.

[Shanti]

I did think about what I could've taken that would cause a setback but I didn't take anything different. It had have been the walks. Maybe if I do it every other day and not as far. The bike didn't work that great. It is also flaring up the neuropathy in my hands and arms, which I didn't think of until it did it.

[Altostrata]

Yes, the bike used to aggravate my shoulder pain.

 

How about swimming?

[Shanti]

Swimming would be great if I had access to a pool. I did physical therapy in a pool and it was better on my pain. Though at the time I wasn't tapering off the Paxil yet, so I don't know how it is with wd. I decided to walk 2 blocks every other day. That gives my body one day to repair in between. So far so good. I have lost 10 pounds in the last 2 months! I'm happy about that. So it's not taking much exercise for me to get rid of this excess fat. I haven't changed my diet much, so it's just been this little bit of walking that's helped.

[meistersinger]

Swimming would be great if I had access to a pool. I did physical therapy in a pool and it was better on my pain. Though at the time I wasn't tapering off the Paxil yet, so I don't know how it is with wd. I decided to walk 2 blocks every other day. That gives my body one day to repair in between. So far so good. I have lost 10 pounds in the last 2 months! I'm happy about that. So it's not taking much exercise for me to get rid of this excess fat. I haven't changed my diet much, so it's just been this little bit of walking that's helped.

 

Since Mom died back in November, I've lost Over 50 lbs. Not having a car (until recently) was more than a good reason to walk. Now if I could find work...

[Shanti]

Sorry about your mom

 

I haven't worked for a long time too. And my disability is in appeal and could be another 15 months before I find out if I even get it. I finally got tired of waiting. There is just no possible way I can work at a job where I stand up all day and no one would hire me since I haven't worked so long. So I just applied for a pell grant and going to take Medical Office Management course next fall that has job training too. I figured the only way to get back into the workforce is to either go to school again or do some volunteer work just so I could have a reference. I'm going on with it even though I don't know if I'll be able to do it. But setting the goals have really helped my state of mind about the whole mess. One step at a time. I hope you're feeling better.

[Altostrata]

Shanti, you have so much initiative. I am lost in admiration.

[Nikki]

Shanti in Whatever's post about herself she explained the gap in her resume to fill in the lost time. Of course, I don't remember what she said....ask her.

 

Yes, Pell Grants abound

[meistersinger]

Shanti in Whatever's post about herself she explained the gap in her resume to fill in the lost time. Of course, I don't remember what she said....ask her.

 

Yes, Pell Grants abound

 

Not for graduate school they don't. If I were to go back to get my master's in music, there would be nothing available.

[Shanti]

Thank you Alto! Nikki, that is awesome, I'm going to read her intro. I haven't been there a while.

 

I don't feel as confident as I may sound. lol. I'm just at a point that I am in a better state of mind. I'm not depressed or full of anxiety like I was in the beginning. But whenever I think about my living situation, it scares the hell out of me. I am completely dependent on my mom. She is getting old and I'd love to see her go to the retirement home she used to be in and not have to worry about me. Plus, if anything happens to her, I will be homeless, and that kind of dependency is scary. I have two choices, either drug myself up and cover up my fears and just lay on my recliner all day, or I have to start making plans that will give me independence and security. I totally balk at the idea of even working, especially in pain. But I've gone into an acceptance and have to have faith that it will be okay.

 

I am so sick of this doctor. I'll tell you that I was so close to actually going to her office and slapping her face. I mentioned before that my 18 yr old daughter has a tumor in her pineal gland. It's benign, thank God, so time is not of the essence. It's not life or death. But she suffers a lot from it. All her hormones are so messed up that she's lost half her hair, has super high cortisol, low thyroid, just everything. We can not go into a hormone therapy until after she sees the specialists at UC Davis, and they'd decide whether to remove it or not. It takes 3 months to wait for a call back from them. So I waited 2 months and thought I should call the doctor and check on things, and sure enough, the doctor forgot to send the referral! I was so pissed. So now I have to call her every day and make sure she does stuff. I'm taking myself and daughter to the Rancheria to get another doctor. Also, the doctor sent me in for MRI on my back, and it is very hard to get an approval for that with my type of insurance. I had them sent to my new doctor at Rancheria and he said she didn't even order the MRI for the right area of my back. Total waste of an MRI that is very hard to get in the first place. Fortunately, he is able to order me a new one and it will be covered by Rancheria if Medi-Cal doesn't cover it. But man, I really wanted to slap her! After all this bs with the drugs and then this?? Arrgh.

[Altostrata]

That doctor sounds worthless, Shanti. Good idea, get another doctor.

[Shanti]

I joined Benzo Buddies as I started to taper off the .5 mg Xanax the other day. I had extremely severe pain in my back. It kept me up all night and I called the doctor begging to give me a shot in the back of something. But he wouldn't do it until I have the MRI. It was horrible. But I made it through and the pain lessoned last night. I then realized that the pain in my back is probably from the Xanax, as the pain started about the time I started taking Xanax! I searched the internet and sure enough, that happens. So like you told me before Alto, taking the Xanax, even at a low dose only at night, was causing me w/d during the daytime. I just didn't realize the back pain was a w/d. Now it makes sense, as the pain always went away at night. In a way, I am relieved and hope this is true, as that means when I am done with the taper and recovered, my back pain should go away. I hope! So that is why I am going to go ahead and try tapering and see if I do okay, even before I'm finished with the a/d taper. We'll see.

[Altostrata]

I surely hope this helps, Shanti. Please let us know how you're doing.

[Nikki]

Hi Shanti

 

"I don't feel as confident as I may sound. lol. I'm just at a point that I am in a better state of mind. I'm not depressed or full of anxiety like I was in the beginning. But whenever I think about my living situation, it scares the hell out of me. I am completely dependent on my mom. She is getting old and I'd love to see her go to the retirement home she used to be in and not have to worry about me. Plus, if anything happens to her, I will be homeless, and that kind of dependency is scary. I have two choices, either drug myself up and cover up my fears and just lay on my recliner all day, or I have to start making plans that will give me independence and security. I totally balk at the idea of even working, especially in pain. But I've gone into an acceptance and have to have faith that it will be okay."

 

 

I am happy to know that you are not depressed or anxious like you were. This is wonderful.

This can set the stage for you to go onto a new highway of rebuilding. Where does your Mom currently live? Many women have a fear of homelessness. There is actually a name for it.

Bag Lady Syndrome....I swear I am not making this up.

 

Going back to work may take your mind off of the pain. It takes my mind off of everything which is good. Can you think of a business for yourself instead of the treadmill or work?

 

Once you start to get busy with finding a job, you will be more at ease. The dependency will lift.

 

Lots of Hugs

[Shanti]

Hi Nikki. I'm living with my mom right now. She doesn't mind, but I still feel bad living off her. Going to school next year will really help me with feeling independent. Thank you for your encouragement Oh yes, Barb and I were talking about Bag Lady Syndrome a while back! I don't have it near as bad as I used to. I went more into a surrender and faith that everything works out. But there is still the motivation to get independent. Which I think is probably normal.

 

I've decided to suspend the Prozac taper while I go ahead and taper off the Xanax. I don't want to wait because of the pain it's causing me. So I'll just stick to the dose I'm at now for a while. It doesn't seem like Xanax tapers are as long as AD tapers. Especially at the dose I'm at. I did have some other Benzo wd today that was weird. Rushing, buzzing feeling in my body. But these things just don't freak me out anymore. lol. I'll be fine, especially if that's as bad as it gets. They said at BB that since I'm on 4 days, the worse on this amount is probably over. Until my next drop.