Nikki: hi, my rundown with ADs

[Nikki]

Not doing well at all.  The anxiety is bad.  This morning I realized that I've got some depression going on.  Feeling desperate.

Petu, yes thank you for sharing about the serzone.  It seems to have escalated since getting on Serzone. Wonder how much has o do with getting off Celexa.

 

This morning I had the thoughts about I would be better off dead and the suicide ideation.  Had trouble getting out of bed.  tired, disrupted sleep too.

 

Have been doing Attacking Anxiety and Depression Program diligently.  There are some issues that have come up that lurking beneath the surface which contribute to things.

 

I realize that I do need to taper the Serzone and worry about Imipramine later on.  Very scared about tapering.  I can't stand living like this day in and day out trying to figure it all out.

 

How do I overcome this - the anxiety and depression.  It lasts for hours in the morning, and there is a cloud the remainder of the day.  My lower back has been bothering me so I have taken Alleve and I wonder if that is contributing to things.

 

I feel like Alex did a few weeks back.  I need to find a way out of this misery.

 

Hugs.  Need to talk to people.

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Glad to see you are posting again, Nikki, but sorry things are still so rough for you. My hugs aren't squishy like mammaP's but here's one anyway:

 

{{hug}}

 

Sometimes that's all we can do, just treat ourselves well and get hugs. Doing the anxiety work is hard and you need to take breaks from it for a while. I'd put off starting a taper for a long time if I were you, till you get a handle on managing your anxiety. Yes, the meds might be contributing to it but it is your reaction to the feelings is what you are working on. Once you get that down pat, then you can start reducing the drugs.

[Nikki]

Hey Cymbalta hugs to you  too:)

 

The anxiety work is bringing stuff up.  You know how the past affects the present. 

 

Yes, the meds might be contributing to it but it is your reaction to the feelings is what you are working on.

 

I think this is true.  I am very jumbled up (mentally) right now and my first instinct is to fix - fix - fix stop the anxiety/depression.

 

Appreciate the input:)

[Altostrata]

Nikki, I'm positive we discussed this before:

 

http://www.drugs.com/interactions-check.php?drug_list=1323-0,1698-0

Interactions between your selected drugs

imipramine ↔ nefazodone

Applies to: imipramine, nefazodone

Talk to your doctor before using imipramine together with nefazodone. Combining these medications can increase the risk of a rare but serious condition called the serotonin syndrome, which may include symptoms such as confusion, hallucination, seizure, extreme changes in blood pressure, increased heart rate, fever, excessive sweating, shivering or shaking, blurred vision, muscle spasm or stiffness, tremor, incoordination, stomach cramp, nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea. Severe cases may result in coma and even death. You should contact your doctor immediately if you experience these symptoms while taking the medications. It is important to tell your doctor about all other medications you use, including vitamins and herbs. Do not stop using any medications without first talking to your doctor.

 

[Nikki]

Yes you and I think Barb sent me to this drug checker site.  I had already been on both meds and of course, stopping is not a solutions right now.  Tapering is the way I have to do this.

 

Aside from wondering why doctors don't use this info before prescribing I am also wondering about both meds causing the problems I currently have.  Almost chronic anxiety - bouts of depression - brain fog - blurred vision to a degree - I do dry heave some mornings but I chalk it up to anxiety.

 

Can you help me out here with your thoughts, and I know I need to muster up the courage to taper.  I have the syringes and have finally learned how to make a suspension.

 

I am seeing a therapist twice a month

I am doing Attacking Anxiety & Depression at home program

I go to my Al-anon meetings

I journal alot and present my findings to the therapist

 

I think these are all good things.  I want to recover from anxiety but I am starting to believe that it is not just me and my negative, fear based thinking and that it may be the drugs.....

 

Can you talk to me about that? 

 

Hugs

[Meimeiquest]

It may just be me, but niacin really helps my nausea. You can get 50 mg tabs by Carlson from Amazon. Niacinamide may be just as effective and flush-proof. I think this combo has made you worse. You could just start doing ten percent cuts of the Serzone every four weeks until you get a sense of what is going on. I actually made a 25% initial cut of Wellbutrin with just minor fallout. It seems like you are going to have anxiety maintaining or withdrawing.

 

What helps me is that I don't have a long history of anxiety, so even though I get very anxious sometimes, it never feels like it is me, it is just an uncomfortable symptom. I think anything you can do to de-identify yourself as an anxious person would help. Even if the neurotransmitter theory is untrue, if you can think "boy, this medicine is really giving me a norepinephrine surge right now," you are going to feel better than if you think, "Yuck, I'm so anxious, just like I have been my whole life."

[Northcoastboy]

My current anxiety is absolutely a symptom of of my withdrawal from my drug.

It comes from out of the blue as a neuro emotion.

It wakes me up in the night sometimes

 

As I said to you before I then go straight to mindfullness of breathing.

3 large deep breaths to calm myself.

 

Or I can start the usual "oh God I'm losing it, I'm going mad etc etc

 

I pre empt this by practising mindfullness twice a day, using John kabat Zin CDs

I've now got 2 of his books.

 

If I were you and I'm not, I would be straight round your friends who teaches this stuff and was taught by the master himself:-)

[mammaP]

I think you will start to feel better when you are tapering the serzone Nikki.  

It's a long and slow process but gets there in the end. I'm sorry you are feeling so bad again

and sending a squishy hug. 

[Nikki]

thanks guys...

 

I have never had anxiety like this (only one time and I didn't know it was anxiety and that was way back when which led me to Paxil).  Even when WDing from Lexapro it wasn't ongoing like this.  Yes....it is the meds.

 

It is more of a sense of feeling overwhelmed or racey than anxiety.  I never had palpitations like this.  It is a side effect of drug mixing.  At the pharmacy I had a refill of Xanax and a red flag came up on the Pharmacy Computer....do not mix Xanax with Nefazadone.  And yet the Doctor told me it was fine.

 

I know it is drugs and I am furious at the MD and at me for getting me into this mess.

 

Neuro emotions for sure. When I feel it coming on I Accept it's anxiety - Start Breathing - Ask myself was triggered it - And then begin Positive Self Dialogue.  It has been extremely helpful.

 

The second lesson on the program is the Self Dialogue.

 

Really nice program, getting alot out of it.  There are workbooks too.

 

I will start to taper the Serzone and will probably do a 5% reduction like you suggested MQ.  I agree with you MamaP I may actually feel somewhat better.

 

Thank you all very much:)

[Nikki]

I was reluctant to post this.  BUT last night I did start a taper from Serzone.  I did make the liquid suspension and only dropped by 2mgs.  I even thought about just dropping 1mg.  Sensitized nervous system.

 

I understand Cymbalta's suggestion to hold before tapering for a long time, but there is something that is telling me to lower the serzone as it may be a large part of the problem due to the norephinephrine and Serzone's ability to cause anxiety if you already have it.

 

I think MQ or MamaP said in a previous post that the anxiety may be present regardless.

 

Working on myself.  But something is not right here.  When I work on myself I can get some peace and a respite from anxiety....this isn't really happening as I expected and I think I may be jumbled up from drugs.

 

I would like to lean on a few of you for support.  I have go to do something.  I am not getting any younger and want to enjoy life not just try to get thru each day......

 

Hugs

[Zoe]

Sending hugs and prayers Nikki.

So glad that you are getting some help from the Attacking Anxiety program. 

 

Hang in there,

Zoe

[mammaP]

2mg is less than 5% Nikki and should be fine. I suspect that you will become anxious about

tapering and believe that anxiety is withdrawal.  Try and stick with the same dose and you 

may have some mild symptoms but hang in there and don't change anything for a few weeks.

Rooting for you Nikki. 

[Northcoastboy]

Good luck Nikki

I had massive panic attack last night so know where you are coming from. Anxiety sucks!

[Meimeiquest]

Hi Nikki, cheers to you for taking the plunge! You might like to sign up for the interviews at theanxietysummit.com. It's about natural treatment of the physical components of anxiety. To hear them all, you would have to start today. Blessings!

[Nikki]

Hey thanks guys:)

 

anxiety summit....that is hilarious MG.....a summit on anxiety.  Usually it is about world hunger, war, etc.  I guess anxiety is a way up there on the list of important events    I wonder if the President and other world leaders are attending....I had to say it

 

I will keep the 2mg. drop for a good amount of time.  For myself, the WD symptoms surface a few days after a drop, not right away.

 

Thank you all

[Meimeiquest]

Or maybe a summit to climb, lol

[Nikki]

Alto I did re read the post on the red lable warning.  Thank you for reposting it.  It's good to let others know about mixing drugs.

 

Are you basically saying that it is the drug mixture that is the main problem?  I think it is.

 

The only way I can see to change this is to taper one of them.  I was reading thru the tips on tapering and Serzone was the drug I was on the shortest amount of time which helped me make a decision as to which one to taper.  Been on Imipramine for years.

 

I have made a 2mg. cut using a liquid suspension for the last two nights, and I do have WD symptoms, mostly brains swooshes and brain fog.  An overall feeling of despair.

 

If there is anything you can suggest or have anything you can share I AM ALL EARS

 

Thank you

[Altostrata]

Nikki, I've said more than once that I think that combination is dangerous.

 

Please put your updates in your topic, not in the microtaper topic. Thank you.

[Nikki]

I could not wait to share this

 

Last night was night 3 of the taper and I did not have any WD symptoms (brain swooshes).  I read a novel and went to sleep.

I woke up without anxiety...CAN  YOU BELIEVE IT?

 

I did notice that when I started to think into the future and all of the things I want to accomplish I felt a little anxiety.  So I followed the advice given by the Therapist and the Attacking Anxiety & Depression Program. 

 

Stop and realize that my thoughts brought it on.  I focused on today's work only.  Said a few prayers and did some deep breathing.

 

I was over joyed for the first time in a long time and felt a sense of hope.

 

MamaP said that I could actually start to feel better when I lower the drug.

 

It is so important to know if drugs can or cannot be mixed.  Because our health care professionals don't know.

 

Keep fingers crossed this continues and thanks to all of you for your help and patience

[lexicon]

This is wonderful Nikki

 

Thinking of you, and holding you in prayer ..

 

Keep walking .. You will get to the end of this

 

Love, Lexi

 

[trouper]

this is great news and i hope you continue to see good days.

[Nikki]

Okay today not good.  Why do the good days have to come to an end

 

Sciatic keeping me up.  Sleep deprivation most definitely contributes to a downer.  Serzone does induce sleep so dropping it causes insomnia.

 

And then from there I spiral downward.  Been working hard at turning myself around with Anxiety Program and Tapering and then today it all seems like it is gone and no hope.

 

Did go over to read NeuroEmotions by Healing as a reminder.

 

How come we can help others and not ourselves?????

[Utahgal]

I know what you mean about the occasional good day. It just feels so good, and I am always so thankful to God, and then the next day comes and BOOM........relentless anxiety and nausea returns! If we can have the occasional good day, why can't there be more? Why does the suffering always return!

 

I hope more good days come your way!

[Nikki]

Well I think I have stabilized from a 3mg.drop in dose from Serzone.  The big problem is lack of sleep.  Serzone can induce sleep so changing it has caused insomnia,

 

Sleep is crucial for anyone on or off AD's.

 

All other symptoms have abated.  I am getting so much out of the attacking anxiety and depression program.  I really recommend it.

I do see a therapist once a month too. 

 

I still have anxiety but it is low grade and manageable.  Someday I hope to be free from it.  At this point in time I think medications and jumping around and mixing them may have contributed to anxiety/depression rather then help.

 

Best regards to all.  I include anyone on all the support groups in a prayer for healing each morning.

 

Hugs

[Meimeiquest]

So good to hear! Just remember when you're awake in the night you have many SA friends awake with you . Where did you get the anxiety and depression program from?

[Nikki]

MQ I had this program years back and got the new updated version.  Attacking Anxiety and Depression by Lucinda Bassett @ the Midwest Center for anxiety.

 

Really really good stuff.  Anything to help:)

 

Right now I have strong anxiety.

 

My daughter is very sick again with the Interstitial Cystitis (an autoimmune disease of the bladder).  She was in remission and that has stopped.  She will not take pain meds.  She has very bad anxiety and is quite depressed.  Picking up some meds today that seem to help.  Pyridiu, Flomax, Macrodantin (to prevent infection). 

 

Please send prayers.

 

As for myself. I am still holding at 47mgs. down from 50mgs.  Still wake with anxiety but it is alot better from the program.

 

Hugs

[trouper]

hi nikki,

just seeing how you are doing. is the program still working out for you? i looked it up and it seems like a good program! hopefully your anxiety is better and also hope your daughter is feeling better as well.

[tezza]

Hi Nikki,

 

What trouper said...thinking of you.

 

HUGS

[Nikki]

Hi Guys......

 

I had posted this morning in the Benzo section.  My daughter has been tapering Xanax (I didn't know it) and then she decided to stop CT as she was disgusted and getting sick from the taper.  She ended up having a Grand Mal Seizure this weekend.

 

She is in the hospital.  She has been tapering another medication for almost a year now.  Long story.

 

The likelihood of having another seizure if she comes home and has to taper xanax is very strong.

 

She will be medically detoxing from it tomorrow.  Please send some good vibes this way:)

 

Her bladder issue is getting better and hopefully going into remission again.

 

As for Me    I am still tapering the serzone.  I am down from 50mgs. to 45mgs.  Not too bad.  I have been using (this past week) Rescue Remedy (Bach Flowers) and it really helps alot with anxiety.

 

For the past few months I have been working each evening on myself in a cognitive manner?  I guess...I am doing the Attacking Anxiety and Depression Program and working the homework assignments.

 

I have also been using several other resources to help me change my thinking.  If I weren't such a negative thinker I would probably not have anxiety.  I practice daily using positive self dialogue and a few other techniques and I see a therapist every three weeks.

 

I HAVE NOT CORNERED THE MARKET on successful self help but I knew I needed to do something different from what I was doing and realized how deeply my thinking has been affecting me.  The anxiety has left me with many limitations which I am working on.  I joined the gym.  Went to a workshop on healing crystals, things to change the monotony.

 

As a result although I am very sad and yes worried about my daughter, I am not in a heap on the floor.  Not yet anyway.

 

I want to say hello to Mamap, Alex, Petu, MQ, Bubbles, Moody Blues, Lobster, Tezza, Trouper, Rhi, Jemima......on and on...

 

Hugs

[alex]

Hello Nikki; I am having mixed emotions right now:I`m glad to hear from you, and so sorry for your daughter, and for you...

I think it is very normal to feel sad and worried about your daughter.But I believe she is going to be ok;she is young, and that is a goog thing on her side.

 

Sending you ALL the good vibes.

 

Hugs,A.

[Nikki]

Good morning Alex:)

 

Last night my daughter called and said she is coming home today.  I don't know why other than maybe the case worker did not book a spot for her in detox.

 

Alex I am very worried about her coming home today.  Will speak to her boyfriend shortly to find out more details.  He has been wonderful.

 

I am trying to help myself with the feelings and thoughts that surge almost all of the time lately.  I am telling myself it is normal under the circumstances but I do have moments where I feel life like this not life at all.  This issue with my daughter has been on going and I have a 90 year old mother who causes alot of stress. 
Fee very boxed in and wish there were a way out into a life where there is simplicity and peace.

 

Hugs

[mammaP]

Sorry to hear about your daughter Nikki and hope she is ok.  It is such a worry for you and

you're being amazing, you are doing so well! 

 

Huge Mamma hugs.

[Nikki]

MamaP to be honest I am tired of coping with anxiety from WD and from life's problems.  It is a battle every morning.  As soon as my eyes open I begin practicing techniques to overcome my thinking.

 

I am afraid to fall apart and yet I am inside.  I have an overwhelming sense of 'life is too difficult.'

 

Maybe it wouldn't be if my own WD and my daughter's issues were not present.

 

My daughter's boyfriend just told me that the detox centers are requiring a very substantial down payment which I do not have.  The insurance with cover the remaining balance.  Her father is not making himself available for her either.

 

I don't know what to do.  She may have to come home and do a slow taper.

 

God please help.....

[Petunia]

I'm sorry to hear about your daughter Nikki, is she back on the xanax now?  Perhaps coming home and doing a slow taper would be the best thing, they need to be reduced by 10% per month just like antidepressants.

 

Sending ((hugs))

[alex]

  Perhaps coming home and doing a slow taper would be the best thing, they need to be reduced by 10% per month just like antidepressants.

 

I agree with that.

May I ask how much Xanax was she taken and for how long?

That could make a difference.

I also have personal issues that doesn't help to this process at all.

 

My thoughts are with you.

[Nikki]

She is home and she actually went back to work.  She has forgetfulness which is supposed to clear up.

 

I don't know how much the dose of xanax was.  She did not take it regularly - there were times when she would stop.

 

My daughter was prescribed Oxycontin for her bladder disease about two years back.  She became addicted to it and abused it.

She told her father and I she was addicted.  He took her to an outpatient place and she saw a Addictions Psych.  My daughter tapered down from Oxy on her own and then after seeing the Psych she prescribed Suboxone.

 

Suboxone is given for pain and also given to taper narcotics.  It comes in a strip that looks like scotch tape.  In the last year my daughter tapered the suboxone and was down to about 1mg.

 

She got off Imipramine.

 

Was taking Xanax for anxiety which she has alot of (long before meds).

 

She decided to be completely med free and tapered Xanax and then Cold Turkeyed it.

 

When she was in the hospital I found out for the first time about suboxone and that she had been tapering Xanax.

She never told me.

 

She is off Xanax....in the hospital she was given a low dose of Ativan.

 

She is not doing a medical detox.  When they told me how much it would cost even with insurance I nearly fainted.  I do not have that kind of money and truthfully she did not ask.

 

She was so agitated and confused that she was unbearable to be around.  She has been rather abusive (it has simmered down alot) but I am very tired of that behavior when she takes drugs.

 

So she is now giving me the silent treatment.  Is nice to everyone around her.  I do not know what her treatment plan is.

 

I am glad, very glad that she is okay and being young has it's advantages in being able to bounce back quickly.

 

I have to tell you......I WONDER WHY I HAVE ANXIETY

 

My serzone taper is really not that bad.  The work I am doing to overcome causes for anxiety seem to be working.

But this would give anyone anxiety.

 

Let's see what drama befalls me tomorrow.......pray for me