Emma86: Trying to heal after heavy withdrawal Lorazepam

[Emma86]

@Altostrata thank you! I understand that. I’m just aware there seems to be so many different ways and as I taper each drug starts to take a different affect. I felt as if the mirtazipine was causing adverse affects at this high dosage. I had asked about this earlier here before.. 

 

if I should go with the mirtazipine to get it down.

 

plus they are prescribing me the medication and we have a discussion and worked out that there were adverse affects from the mirt… she is very aware of how to taper very slowly.. thank god! 
 

I respect your opinion too! It’s just tricky when the phyc is also not on this thread.

 

it says in the tapering multiple drugs that this is a done thing and to taper the most activating drug first.. so we were also following that as well… 
 

 

[Altostrata]

4 hours ago, Emma86 said:

 15mg .. then we carry on the quetiapine taper.. I guess if we do that I’d have to wait a while then taper the quetiapine..  slowing the taper down somewhat. 
 

it’s been 2 days into cutting the 4mg. Mirtazipine 

 

I am utterly confused about what you're doing, or what your question is for us.

 

I thought you were going to hold both your drugs at the same dosages to allow your nervous system to settle down.

 

We strongly advise changing only one drug at a time. However, if you and your psychiatrist have decided to do something else, you need to talk to your doctor about any symptoms, not report them here. We're not responsible for your doctor's plan.

[Emma86]

@Altostrata hey yes that’s what I did I held all drugs and waited for my system to relax which it did. 
 

then my phyc said let’s do the mirtazipine as 30 is a high dosage.

It has been 2 months since I dropped on the quetiapine. So I thought ok perhaps it’s ok to do the mirtazipine 

 

my system felt stable to make a cut.

 

I will relay this to my phyc one drug at a time. I double checked in the tapering drugs and it says there to taper the most activating and is talking about the ADs. 
 

I was following that as well. 

 

 

[Altostrata]

Your psychiatrist is following instructions you get here?

[Emma86]

@Altostrata yes she respects the information here, and we discussed in depth each option of what to do. Including all that I had discussed with you here.

 

when I next speak to her I will highlight the one by one strategy again, as I too don’t want to get confused as to what’s giving me what. I almost feel even getting a bit of the mirt is enough, the worry was I’d be left after the quetIapine on 30mg mirt and at this high dose what could transpire. I know the quetiapine sedates me a lot. And I don’t know how I tolerate mirt without the others.
 

my phyc looks to this site for information she is really like gold dust.

 

 And don’t plan to be switching around any drugs after scraping this bit off the mirt. For my own sanity ! Literally.  
 

Even though getting to 22.5 would be a good middle ground. As I’m very Keen to carry on the quetiapine taper. 
 

im going to see how this cut feels and if I feel it’s not working, I’m terms of how I’m responding. Il return to the quetiapine after this cut when stabilised. 
 

I do want to keep it as simple as possible 🙏🏻

[Altostrata]

If you feel you can recommend this doctor, please add her contact information to Recommended doctors, therapists, and clinics

[Emma86]

@Altostrata I will ask her if it’s ok to share  

[Emma86]

@Altostrata 

@Frogie hey  so I asked my phyc if I could share her details, she said you guys have met! And she doesn’t mind me telling you who she is but not to be added to the site incase she doesn’t have capacity.

 

so I wanted to ask your opinion I tapered 4mg off mirtazipine on the 22nd of March 

I got a few symptoms here and there.. but was feeling ready to drop again last week, but my mum who is very volatile, attacked me! On Friday.. And I got extremely stressed and shaken. Since then Iv had a lot of symptoms! Burning skin, restless feeling, depression, more odd sensations I havnt had before. Feeling like I’m moving all sorts. Anxiety etc. weird chemical feelings. Confused. 

 

the last 3 days I changed to 15mg pills and I’m cutting from them .. before I was cutting from 30mg mirtazipine pill. 
 

im Also on quetiapine 100mg and it will be 3 months ago now that I have tapered from 400mg to 100mg. I was going to carry on this taper but the phyc thought mirt could be stimulating, as I was eating in my sleep and thought to taper it down slightly before carrying on with the quetiapine. 
 

I was thinking does there tend to be a delay  sometimes after tapering a drug after a few months…However I felt symptoms smoothed out by 2 months after my last taper of that drug.. quetiapine. 

 

have you ever heard people become unstable from using different pills? It’s the same brand though. 
 

last night I couldn’t sleep and kept getting a jolting feeling each time I tried to sleep. This is the first time Iv had any issues sleeping on these drugs. 
 

I reinstated the ativan 0.5 5 months ago and it took away all of my symptoms.. I was sleeping but had severe symptoms all over my body. So then I was like mmm Could this be tolerance?

But I was fine before my mum attacked me. And ready to drop again, was going to go to 22.5 and then return to quetiapine and carry on one by one.

 

it’s very odd how I couldn’t sleep? Is it the 4mg taper.. or the changing of the pills. Wondering what’s best to do here. As the sleeping and the weird jolting isn’t a good sign! 
 

im still on 0.5 Ativan.

 

timetable.. 0.25 ativan 11am and 6pm 

 

mirtazipine 26mg 10.30 pm 

quetiapine 100mg 10.30 pm 

 

I can private message you about the phyc? ♥️ Thank you! 

[Frogie]

@Emma86

 

It is very normal to have delayed wd symptoms. Even months after you taper. I would hold until they subside before tapering again.

[Emma86]

Thank you @Frogie 🙏🏻♥️

[Altostrata]

On 4/29/2022 at 8:50 AM, Emma86 said:

I reinstated the ativan 0.5 5 months ago and it took away all of my symptoms.. I was sleeping but had severe symptoms all over my body.

 

What are those symptoms? Is this still happening?

 

Most likely, the upset with your mum has upset your nervous system and your sleep. This happened yesterday?

 

See 

 

[Emma86]

@Altostrata Hi thank you for your response. 

It happened last Friday, and before hand I was feeling ok from my last mirtazipine taper, it had been 5 weeks, as soon as this happened with my mum I was thrown into a wave, its got better but still very off symptoms pain in body, buzzing head, tinnitus worse, twitching, burning, odd sensations all over my body of restlessness and a slight sickness, its not a normal feeling. Feelings of feeling spaced out, unease, anxiety, but chemical feelings none feel natural.

 

My sleep has got better over the last two nights thank god, I went back to taking the 30mg pill and cutting from that instead the two 15mgs, this seems to of made a difference..

im hoping this is a sign my system is calming down... and will heal from this, a real shame as it prolongs the taper. But I cant get angry as that doesn't help either.. 

 

Stress is clearly really not good. And this was really high stress! Im looking for a safe place to live! So this doesn't happen again. 

 

Thank you!

Emma

 

 

[Altostrata]

It does sound like, because of withdrawal, you are very sensitive to the situational stress. I hope you can find a better situation, that would help a lot.

[Emma86]

@Altostrata yes! Currently looking daily 🙏🏻 To tricky when withdrawal drops you from working too! Thank you ♥️

[Emma86]

@Altostrata @Frogie hey guys hope your both well! 
 

so a little update as I decided to do mirt as it could be activating, since Iv managed to get it down to 25 mg, I had a very stressful event with my mum that really set me back a couple of weeks and waited for the CNS to stabilise. 
 

because of my history I get the craziest symptoms and feelings, just feeling like I can’t move my body twitches, off feelings, just not normal sensations. Very weird, I never feel myself, It’s so much better than what I was like before the benzo reinstatement though 🙏🏻
 

i find myself really fearing it happening to me again as the experience was so severe! 
 

the mirtazipine made me feel completely spaced out when I tapered it first it took a while maybe 5/6?weeks for my brain to feel back on form, I couldnt remember anything and felt totally spaced out .. I waited a good while and then tapered just 1mg which was a much lighter experience far less symptoms! But one that was worrying was jolting and sleep paralysis before going to sleep and jolting and waking up early in the morning. This has happened over the last 4 weeks since tapering 1mg 
 

so I have not made any changes since.

 

i was asked to photograph a wedding it was 2 hours so I thought I feel ok I feel like maybe il feel good to do it, having been out of action for over a year. I freaked out on the drive there the roads were too long and it was too much I think mentally for me to deal with. I did the wedding, but afterwards the days that followed Iv just felt worried more anxiety just shaken by it, as I had a panick attack in the car. However I calmed but was left with akathasia like feelings for a few days and just weird CNS stuff. 

 

i guess I don’t trust my body on these drugs, and as the benzo stopped 1000s of horrific symptoms on the reinstatement I’m just baffled, and traumatised by what happened. I thought I was going to to die every minute of everyday for a year.I wake up thinking is today going to be the day I’m suddenly in benzo tolerance, the benzo really scares me! 
 

Sleep is so important and the mirtazipine was affecting that a lot! Just with these little movements. So Im leaving mirtazipine for now because of the sleep disturbance, i don’t need any of that now. 
 

im now leaning on concentrating on the quetiapine and keeping with that. I had expected to get lower on the mirt but instinctively felt it was too ropey to loose sleep this early on. 
 

that will be my next taper. It feels so disconcerting with the mirt as I thought I could of tapered it faster. 

 

do you guys or did you guys experience just really bizarre sensations? That are not of this world?  How do you navigate life? After a traumatic drug withdrawal experience.. like I’m never sure what’s too much to do.. I find travelling revs up my symptoms and being places where I feel far from home. But I also think that’s my fears as well. I’m really just fearing il suddenly break out into fear and terror again. Do you guys find you had to slowly start doing things again, as I taper I never know how il feel, I feel so weird in my body because of all the meds I never know quite how to ground myself. And don’t want to give myself a set back from doing too much! Like the wedding… 
 

as I almost died from the benzo CT its terrifying what Ativan can create and I’m like does that mean my benzo taper will be really hard this second time round? Or because I’m sleeping well now will I be ok.. as I have the other drugs to aid that, as the benzo hit me hard! However I did not taper it properly because of the Dr obviously. 

 

i plan to water taper it when the time comes. 
 

im just so aware that benzos are so bad, from my past experience, it created such hell. I really don’t want that to happen again it’s been 6months since reinstatement and it’s taking a good while to get the other drugs lower. It’s just always on my mind, how long to stay on the benzo for.. when pollydrugged. 
 

im finding each cut to cause quite an affect. But I’m going very slow!  
 

as I say I’m going for the quetiapine next, the mirt needs to stay put for sleep! Even at  25mg seems to cause sleep disturbance so I think leaving it here for now is sensible. 
 

i need to somehow stop thinking about benzo tolerance! 🙏🏻 What are your thoughts on tolerance on a benzo.. when it suddenly turns on you. I just couldn’t go through that again. 

 

 

much ♥️♥️
 

 

[Frogie]

@Emma86

 

I would say that the mirt gave you the wd symptoms and you just need to hold. It's normal to have wd symptoms long after you tapered also.

 

The jolting is probably cortisol and is very normal. Everyone has it, people on medications, seem to feel it more.

 

I wouldn't touch any of your doses right now. Your body need to stabilize and adding to more tapers of other medications will just add fuel to the fire.

 

 

[Emma86]

@Frogie ok that’s good to know it’s normal, yeah I won’t taper anything untill stable again. And the jolts have gone, it really does take a lot of time for the symptoms to subside! But slow and steady 🙏🏻 It’s just the sensations I feel are so so strange. Air hunger particularly bad. Thank you! X 

[Frogie]

@Emma86

 

Air hunger is very normal. Just know take some deep breaths and you'll. be ok

[Emma86]

Hi so this is my recent update… 

 

iv come far from where I was.. madness! 
so.. I’m currently now on 0.125mg lorazepam holding there 

 

I held the quetiapine at 100mg for a year whilst I water tapered the benzo from 0.5 to 0.125mg and decided to hold .. take a break.. 

 

and then began tapering the quetiapine again from 100mg XR by cutting the pills and spreading them out over an evening.. as I take them

at night.. to spread the dose as if it was XR .. 

 

before I was struggling to taper ten percent and had to wait 6 /7 weeks to recover from the quetiapine.. with severe symptoms..since holding for best part of a year.. and doing a bit of the benzo..

 

this time round Iv managed to taper down without any symptoms if any they are mild

 

I’m now at 36mg of quetiapine 

 

I am focusing on this drug and plan to get off this one first.. then take a break to begin one of the others.. 

 

I am still on mirtazipine 25mg down from 30mg .. I am hoping tapering this will become easier as it was very difficult before! Worse than either of the others.. 

 

I am experiencing good sleep if anything I’m sleeping lots! As they knock me out at night. 
 

I do get air hunger .. twitches.. head pressure and eye pressure but it’s been mild rather than crippling. 
 

I am being careful and listening to my body before I do another cut .. with help from a great taper mentor! 

 

next drug I was thinking to do the mirtazipine.. try it.. see how it goes if easier I could do that one then the benzo last.. 

 

thoughs are my thoughts.. 

 

since ! I have been making a documentary and I’ve written a song about all this posted on YouTube.. to spread awareness. Documentary still in the making ! 

song is titled IM NOT DEAD benzowithdrawal on YouTube  infact.. here it is.. 

 

 

 

It’s been good therapy to atleast try bring awareness!!

 

thanks! 
Emma  

[j1290]

@Emma86

Hi there, just wanted to drop by and say how much I enjoyed your video.  It turned out fantastic, brilliant work!

[Soup]

@Emma86 great video . You are doing really well 

[FeralCatman]

@Emma86 That video is fantastic. I already shared it with everybody that I know and have already had two replies that they are going to pass it along to everybody they know so what you are doing is making a difference and people are listening. I have been poly drugged since 1994 and at one point was on multiple medications, seven I think, and I am now down to two and holding to take a break. I am lucky to have good providers and have shared that video with them including my psych provider who is also having trouble coming off of medication. Thank you again for putting that together it really is truly an amazing piece of work. 😉✌️😺😺

[Emma86]

Thank you so much ! Appreciate your support and words, and for sharing it 🙏🏼♥️ 

 

meant to tag @Go2zeroin my update as my tapering mentor 🙏🏼 wasn’t sure if that was ok to do in here.. but checked  all

good, he’s been a god send and vital for knowing and talking over what’s the next sensible move ⚡️⚡️

 

 

[manymoretodays]

Oh my gosh....the video!  Well done.  And I thank you so much for bringing some of the other drugs into it, e.g. antidepressants and antipsychotics....mentioning them as well.  As I was mainly a AD withdrawal that was never acknowledged or discussed that led to some serious overdrugging and diagnosing that went on for far too many years.  My withdrawals......Not so different from what you've illustrated, at various times in this journey. So glad to hear you have improved and that some symptoms are "not crippling" anymore.  Well done again Emma86.  You are a star in my eyes and.....I'm inspired....I write/ramble and surely must paint again- watercolor I love.  Fabrics too!  Keep creating! Oh so healing.  Love, peace, healing, and growth.  manymoretodays and p.s. keep coming around too.  We can, I believe, make change, that so needs to happen. Creating awareness is super....I too, will share.  And keep healing.  Happy too, that you found help here.  

[FeralCatman]

@Emma86 Keep in mind that this website is more and more being mentioned in research articles and is being used by people researching withdrawal and trying to figure out what to do about it. The more of your experiences that get posted here the more likely one of these researchers is going to read it and factor your experiences in to whatever solutions they come up with. The more complete stories they have to go on the more it tells the story of what people are going through which will properly inform them as to the severity of this issue. Even if you have somewhere else that you go to post information you may want to consider posting that link here on your thread so researchers can refer to it and have it included in the research database. By keeping all of this stuff in one place it makes it easier for them to see the big picture and the patterns that are involved in withdrawal and Recovery.

[Go2zero]

14 hours ago, Emma86 said:

meant to tag @Go2zeroin my update as my tapering mentor 🙏🏼 wasn’t sure if that was ok to do in here.. but checked  all

good, he’s been a god send and vital for knowing and talking over what’s the next sensible move ⚡️⚡️

 

Maybe good to clarify something here about the special relationship Emma and I have. And why I have been assisting her personally and mainly outside of SA. Please understand that she is a special case because I know her father. Normally I only assist here on SA. I do not do private contacts, outside a very few people I know in person.

 

I live in Spain and I have been knowing Emma’s dad (who is living here too), for several years. He and I share some interests like making music and sailing.

 

About 2 years ago he and I joined on a sailing trip and he saw me taking one of my mini dosages of Wellbutrin. He asked what I was doing and why. I told him about my long lasting tapering story.

 

Suddenly he reacted. He told me about his daughter Emma who was struggling so much with psychotropic medication. He told me that she was so bad that she could not handle it anymore and that she wanted to die.

 

Everybody (except Emma herself) thought Emma was having psychiatric problems at that moment. But when talking to her dad it became clear to him and me that it was most probably withdrawal from lorazepam that had sent her in this terrible state.

 

The lorazepam was given to her for 6 months or longer for tinnitus, which was a left over of a covid infection. She had never suffered from any mental or psychiatric issue.

 

She wasn't told by her doctor that one should not take a benzo that long. He kept giving new prescriptions. And as often, she was not told to taper the benzo...

 

Long story short, she was sent to mental hospitals several times, after having very severe withdrawal symptom. She got all kinds of diagnoses (like psychotic and bipolar). Got poly drugged then with benzo, antidepressants and several anti psychotics.

 

I contacted Emma (in London) by phone and WhatsApp. And then the journey started.

 

It was good that her her parents started to understand that her problem was caused by medication.

 

I advised her to start an account and thread here on SA.

 

Her case was quite complicated by then, so I was glad to have the backup of SA. Aside of all help from SA, Emma and I had frequent talks over the phone and lots of WhatsApp conversations. She was doing very bad in that period. But healing slowly started, after she was not given new drugs anymore and after she started slowly tapering.

 

Her tapering story can be found in this thread of Emma.

 

I will never forget the moment when she started to feel better. After re-instating a bit of lorazepam. That did the trick in her case.

 

I have seen her twice in the last few months when she was is Spain. Two days ago we made a nice walk along the beautiful coast here. I still get tears in my eyes thinking how terrible here state was was 2 years ago. Seeing her now and how she is doing is such a Gift. I feel so grateful in such momente, to be able to assist and guide others in the processes we all go through here.

 

To see someone who clearly wanted to live deep inside, but who was suffering that much that she wanted to die…. And now, I see a young women completely alive! Being positive, while still tapering and having symptoms now and then. Still a way to go. But so motivated and strong.

 

Emma you will get there! I am proud of you! And I am grateful of walking along with you in this tapering journey.

 

(by the way, Emma is ok that I am sharing this here).

 

🙏

Edited September 10, 2023 by Go2zero

[littlebird]

Love your video!! So cool, thank you for making it. 

[Soup]

@Go2zero I have read Emma’s story and she spoke of a lovely man who helped her and her family realize what was happening to her . So wonderful you are the man she mentioned . You are doing amazing things basically saving people’s life with your support . I am grateful for all you have shared here as well . 

[LostInCanada]

@Emma86 @Go2zero beautiful... ♥️♥️♥️

[Go2zero]

13 hours ago, Soup said:

I have read Emma’s story and she spoke of a lovely man who helped her and her family realize what was happening to her

 

Thank you for this lovely message @Soup.  You know, I am there to guide you through tapering too, when you are ready. ✨🙏

[Emma86]

Thank you all for your support  @Go2zero and your words! .. such a lovely message 🥰🥰🥰 : ) x 

[Go2zero]

26 minutes ago, Emma86 said:

Thank you all for your support  @Go2zero and your words! .. such a lovely message 🥰🥰🥰 : ) x 

 

🥰 ❤️✨🙏

[Emma86]

Hey guys : ) UPDATE 

 

as I lie here dealing with a wave, I thought why not share my progress, so I am tackling the Quetiapine and have been doing so the last few months. 

 

I may be repeating myself here but .. to give a slight lead up.. 
 

I was really happy and relieved to experience an easier taper after holding it for about a year whilst I water tapered the benzo down slightly. 
 

as I couldn’t move it without 5% giving me long waves before the hold. 
 

this time round it’s been much smoother and have managed to get to 8mg Quetiapine 🙌🏼 which is crazy to think .. coming from the original 400mg, this has taken 2 years.. 

I’m holding the benzo at 0.125mg 

and the mirtazipine 25mg 

 

I held it at 100mg and have been tapering from 100mg to where I am now

 

I cut the extended release pills and have been dry cutting, due to not wanting to change the pill or the brand. 
 

I had to spread the dose out over the evening and my body would soon adjust, there were some mild symptoms when this was going on but nothing worrying 

 

so I did a long drive and off the back of that the recent cut was sore. It was I think too much stimulation for my body this time round, being down to the small bits, things can get more sensitive I see and hear from people, so il be sure to be extra mindful of this in future! 
 

I also did a short gong bath a friend offered and I thought well it’s one instrument it doesnt make the binaural beats that people speak of being problematic.. but afterwards I did experience headache and head pain .. but then it was the 2 week mark on the dot from the recent cut that’s when things really began .. 

 

which tells me it’s largely the taper mixed in with too much stimulation as I happened to be driving on the day it hit .. 
 

this time it was different more physical pain.. severe muscle cramping /burning that turned into severe migraines and head pressure to the point of vomiting and being bed bound

 

it is slowly getting better, but I can’t do too much, so it’s resting and eating well 

 

I dropped my clean eating these last few months with my tapering going so well.. but now I will return to no wheat no sugar .. it’s hard sometimes not to just have a cake but one becomes like ten 🤣 and I really notice food sensitivity at the moment 

 

So it’s back to an anti inflammatory diet etc.. which is good in the long run! 

 

I do feel it’s a great achievement to get to 8mg after everything that went on, in my history and the crazy Benzo withdrawal 

 

it can feel terrifying at times but I believe with a slow taper we can get through this and free of the medication 

 

i plan to hold and rest until I feel fully back to myself and will do a smaller cut next time see how that feels 

 

you never know how it will go, guess it’s listening and making good moves! that’s all we can do. 
 

it’s been 3 weeks so far of this but I managed to walk today, and be a passenger in my dads car without feeling really weird! 
 

lots of love to everyone 🫶🏼♥️ will update signature x 
 

 

 

[getofflex]

It sounds like you are doing a great job of tapering your drugs.  You are correct - with a very slow and cautious taper we can get off these drugs!  

 

Can you please add years to the dates in your signature?  The last half I don't see years, so I can't tell if this is in 2022 or 2023.  Thanks.  

[getofflex]

It sounds like you are doing a great job of tapering your drugs.  You are correct - with a very slow and cautious taper we can get off these drugs!  

 

Can you please add years to the dates in your signature?  In this part I don't see years, so I can't tell if this is in 2022 or 2023:  

 

- Sept 3 hospital  – Oct 13th -quetiapine within 1 week 50mg-400mg + 30 mg mirtazapine 

- 6 weeks in hospital  - Home -  300 mg for 4 weeks

 - Reinstated 24th Nov - 0.5 Ativan - stabilised - 1st Dec went to 150mg quetia - 24thDec went to 100mg - Went to 31st Dec 112.5 - 30th Jan 100mg holding. Dropped -22nd March, Mirt -26mg - 9th May, Mirt -25mg.  I take Quetiapine and MIrtazipine at night before bed 22pm, I take Ativan in the morning 9am-10am and in the early eve 17.00 splitting the 0.5

 

 

 

[Emma86]

Sure thing will sort the signature now, also to add! 
 

I took aspirin and paracetamol little bits of each like a baby dose, I got the advice from a fellow friend who’s tapering and whom I trust, I eventually after much deliberation took some, as I was so worried for a reaction. Due to getting a reaction from most things ! 
 

But this had really helped, I found the aspirin to be more effective for me personally so I am taking that more so..

 

If the migraines get really bad I would take little bits of the two as the combination when it’s severe works as a good one 

 

it feels as though the aspirin brings down the inflammation happening in the brain 🙌🏼

 

little by little with lots of rest 🙏🏼 hopefully be back to myself