Alua Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Me too. Weird intrusive thoughts are my most disturbing symptom. I find myself laughing at the ridiculous nature of them at times. I had them since I started ads and they are probably less since I started tapering but at times they come on thick and fast in a concentrated motion. So inexplicable that it is without doubt a side effect of the drugs. It's probably more common than realised as most people don't want to talk about it for fear of judgement. I have had two people tell me this week they have homicidal and suicidal thoughts for years but have never told anybody before. X <p>Various benzos 4 months for insomnia prior to Effexor 37.5mg may 2014 for two weeks, Mirtazapine 30mg june 2014 - feb 2015.Pristiq 50 mg Feb 2015. six weeks later attempted coming off with a six week taper. ten days off and it got ugly. Tapering now using compounded pristiq with slow release agent. 37.5 mg 3 weeks, 30 mg 6 weeks, 25mg 4.5 weeks, 20mg for 6 weeks, 17.5 mgs 7 weeks, 20 mg 8 weeks, 19 mg 3 weeks, 18 mg 3 weeks, 17 mg 3 weeks, 16 mg 3 weeks, 15mg 2 weeks, 14mg 2 weeks, 13 mgs 2 weeks, 12 mgs 6 weeks, 11mg 3 weeks, 10.5mg 2 weeks, 10 mg 3.5 weeks. 9mg 4 weeks. Jumped at 8mg currently 16 months free Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RubyTuesday Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Hi there, Some of you may know that RxISK has added a section focused on understanding protracted withdrawal - the intent is to discuss the possible biological mechanisms of withdrawal and devise theories of what may be wrong in the brain. There is a discussion forum here and I have added the comment below. I would encourage anyone with their thoughts about what is causing this to help provide information in understanding the complexity of withdrawal to add their thoughts. Note: it's not a forum for coping strategies, that's more the role of this message board. Rather it's goal is to focus on what is causing this in the brain. . I especially experience this whenever I think of something in the future that I have to remember to do – regardless of how insignificant the task. I suddenly feel like shrinking into a ball and conceding that I am unable to do this basic chore. However, re-running the thought after that reaction usually produces a less intense response. And it almost never prevents me from doing whatever task it was. As the sympathetic nervous system regulates the fight/flight response – our immediate responses to threats in our environment – the symptom must be associated with the biology of that part of our nervous system. I believe the sympathetic nervous system has, in its natural state, “chemical sentries” that tamp down responses to non threatening changes in the environment – that enable us to distinguish between actual menace and benign change. Whatever chemical apparatus is involved with that defense mechanism is seriously jeopardized by what ever disregulation is occurring in withdrawal. here is my theory for why this occurs. i saved this post on my email until I had time to sit down and reply. I have noticed this as well. my frontal cortex, that normally handles such tasks as paying bills and related things, is damaged, CBI, from psych meds. as a dancer and as a mom, I know that when the frontal cortex is not up for the work assigned to it, I fall back into a more primitive part of my brain that is motion oriented and is capable of incredible physical feats without sustenance. this is the part of us that evolved in the jungle. it is very powerful and is capable of pushing us through emergency situations, which in effect are created artificially by having to operate with a diminished frontal cortex, so to speak. I may not be using the correct terminology but I think you get my drift. anyway, this action then compensated for my the more primitive brain comes at a cost. the cost is the amped up adrenaline. so then we are having these extreme adrenaline reactions to simple tasks like paying a bill, or making a mental note to make that phone call or answer that email or whatever. our nervous system is out of balance and over-exhausted. it just takes time to balance out. 2002: "Situational depression" 2002-2010:Prozac.Birth Control.2011 Short trials: Paxil, Celexa, Lexipro, Wellbutrin, Xanax, Ativan- Gee, Doc never mentioned protracted AD wd syndrome. Imagine that. 2011-2015. Lamictal. Seroquel. Remiron. 2012: "Complex post traumatic stress disorder." Fast taper of Remiron jumped off June 2013. Slow tapers ever since of Seroquel & Lamictal. crippling muscle spasms. crying fits. panic attacks. akathisia. nerve twitches. the jitters. the heebie jeebies. de-personal/realization. numbness. tingling. fatigue. lethargy. nightmares.insomnia. weird images. eye pain.vertigo. dizziness. brain zaps. and on and on and on. withdrawal? side effects? which drug? impossible to know. Stopped Seroquel October 2015. Stopped Lamictal March 2016. Had more severe muscle/joint spasms that paralyzed me for 3 days at a time, last episode was March 2017.Going back to work as of February 2018 after 14 years off full-time work due to the crippling effects of psych meds. Check out Robert Whittaker "Anatomy of an Epidemic" for his breakdown of the rates of mental disability since the introduction of Prozac into the human population. Best solutions for me: Social support via AA meetings. Acupuncture. Meditation. Dance. Nature. Yoga. Social support online with psych med survivor community. Nutrition. Exercise. More outdoor time. Go sit in the sunshine for 5 minutes. Touch a tree. Breathe deeply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Emeritus manymoretodays Posted November 20, 2015 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted November 20, 2015 CBI= complex brain injury? Chemical brain injury? I think a lot of the resultant neuroemotions AND physical discomforts post medications is due to the whole autonomic nervous system trying, trying to revise itself. Just me......I get depressed if I think/feel I have a brain injury rather than a healing nervous/autonomic system. It sounds so fixed. Man, it's so complicated..........thankful that there are folks trying to figure it all out. Thanks for sharing. Late 2023- gone to emeritus status, inactive, don't @ me, I can check who I've posted on, and I'm not really here like I used to be......thanks. Started with psycho meds/psychiatric care circa 1988. In retrospect, and on contemplation, situational overwhelm. Rounding up to 30 years of medications(30 medication trials, poly-pharmacy maximum was 3 at one time). 5/28/2015-off Adderal salts 2.5mg. (I had been on that since hospital 10/2014) 12/2015---just holding, holding, holding, with trileptal/oxcarb at 75 mg. 1/2 tab at hs. My last psycho med ever! Tapered @ 10% every 4 weeks, sometimes 2 weeks to 2016 Dec 16, medication free!! Longer signature post here, with current supplements. Herb and alcohol free since 5/15/2016. And.....I quit smoking 11/2021. Lapsed. Redo of quit smoking 9/28/2022. Can you say Hallelujah?(took me long enough)💜 None of my posts are intended as medical advice. Please discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical provider. My success story: Blue skies ahead, clear sailing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RubyTuesday Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 CBI = Chronic Brain Impairment according to P Breggin, all psych meds cause CBI but I believe it is totally reversible due to neuroplasticity however, that doesn't mean it is easy 2002: "Situational depression" 2002-2010:Prozac.Birth Control.2011 Short trials: Paxil, Celexa, Lexipro, Wellbutrin, Xanax, Ativan- Gee, Doc never mentioned protracted AD wd syndrome. Imagine that. 2011-2015. Lamictal. Seroquel. Remiron. 2012: "Complex post traumatic stress disorder." Fast taper of Remiron jumped off June 2013. Slow tapers ever since of Seroquel & Lamictal. crippling muscle spasms. crying fits. panic attacks. akathisia. nerve twitches. the jitters. the heebie jeebies. de-personal/realization. numbness. tingling. fatigue. lethargy. nightmares.insomnia. weird images. eye pain.vertigo. dizziness. brain zaps. and on and on and on. withdrawal? side effects? which drug? impossible to know. Stopped Seroquel October 2015. Stopped Lamictal March 2016. Had more severe muscle/joint spasms that paralyzed me for 3 days at a time, last episode was March 2017.Going back to work as of February 2018 after 14 years off full-time work due to the crippling effects of psych meds. Check out Robert Whittaker "Anatomy of an Epidemic" for his breakdown of the rates of mental disability since the introduction of Prozac into the human population. Best solutions for me: Social support via AA meetings. Acupuncture. Meditation. Dance. Nature. Yoga. Social support online with psych med survivor community. Nutrition. Exercise. More outdoor time. Go sit in the sunshine for 5 minutes. Touch a tree. Breathe deeply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SalvadorAlcantara Posted December 6, 2015 Share Posted December 6, 2015 Neuro-Emotional Technique (NET) is a proven blend of the latest scientific research and centuries-old Eastern healing techniques. NET acknowledges the relationship between the body’s emotional health, environmental toxicity, nutritional balance and structural integrity. It is a methodology used to normalise unresolved physical and/or behavioural patterns in the body that has enabled patients worldwide to enjoy better health and emotional and physical wellbeing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polly1974 Posted December 12, 2015 Share Posted December 12, 2015 Hello everyone Would it be OK to ask a question here? My original OCD fear has increased to a level that is unbearable during my withdrawal from all my prescribed drugs (see signature). Could this terrible increase be classed as a neuro emotion too? It is so unbearable compared to pre meds. It would give me hope to know that this is possible and that's its going to go back down again when my brain heals more. I'd be most grateful to anyone kind enough to reply and give me some hope Thanks so much polly Prescribed Lorazepam for OCD/ fear for 6 years. Reached tolerance at 9mg Per day. Was taken off using only 30 mg Valium over 6 months. Didn't realise about withdrawal and was prescribed 7 anti depressants (8 week trial on each), 3 antipsychotics and then a reinstatement of 30 mg Valium Per day. Been drug free for 14 months but believe i am in severe withdrawal from stopping and starting all these medications. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Emeritus KarenB Posted December 13, 2015 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted December 13, 2015 Hey Polly, I think 'yes' your OCD is definitely amplified by the neuro-emotion effect. One of the aspects of neuro-emotions is that they are persistent and intrusive, much more so than 'regular' emotions - which sounds like the fear you are experiencing. It's also worth noting that OCD is often a response to a traumatic situation. So right now when you are in the trauma of w/d, your old coping mechanism is coming out to play again. So you've probably got that going on anyway, and then it's magnified by the neuro-emotion effect. I don't have OCD, so others may be able to help you with more detail about how people have learned to manage OCD in a drug-free way. This may be a good question for your own thread. There is also this thread, which you may have already found: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/3882-ocd-obsessive-thoughts-compulsive-behaviors/ I know some people have tried things like Emotional Freedom Technique (this has worked for me in other areas) and counseling. I hope that helps for a start, others will know more. KarenB 2010 Fluoxetine 20mg. 2011 Escitalopram 20mg. 2013 Tapered badly and destabilised CNS. Effexor 150mg. 2015 Begin using info at SurvivingAntidepressants. Cut 10% - bad w/d 2 months, held 1 month. Micro-tapering: four weekly 0.4% cuts, hold 4 weeks (struggling with symptoms). 8 month hold. 2017 Micro-tapering: four weekly 1% cuts, hold 4 weeks (symptoms almost non-existent). 2020 Still micro-tapering. Just over 2/3 of the way off effexor. Minimal symptoms, - and sleeping well. Supplements: Fish oil, vitamin C, iron, oat-straw tea, nettle tea. 2023 December - Now on 5 micro-beads Effexor. Minimal symptoms but much more time needed between drops. Symptoms begin to increase. 2024 April - Updosed to 6 microbeads - immediate increase in symptoms for 4 days. Decreased to 5 microbeads. 'The possibility of renewal exists so long as life exists.' Dr Gabor Mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RubyTuesday Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 it has been well documented that withdrawal can bring on a reaction much worse than the problem you were originally medicated for if the reaction is unbearable, look into micro tapering or on this forum it is called "why taper by 10%?". and you can always reinstate and then taper more slowly. it is very common to taper too fast and then have to slow down. I am off Seroquel now and tapering off of Lamictal. 2002: "Situational depression" 2002-2010:Prozac.Birth Control.2011 Short trials: Paxil, Celexa, Lexipro, Wellbutrin, Xanax, Ativan- Gee, Doc never mentioned protracted AD wd syndrome. Imagine that. 2011-2015. Lamictal. Seroquel. Remiron. 2012: "Complex post traumatic stress disorder." Fast taper of Remiron jumped off June 2013. Slow tapers ever since of Seroquel & Lamictal. crippling muscle spasms. crying fits. panic attacks. akathisia. nerve twitches. the jitters. the heebie jeebies. de-personal/realization. numbness. tingling. fatigue. lethargy. nightmares.insomnia. weird images. eye pain.vertigo. dizziness. brain zaps. and on and on and on. withdrawal? side effects? which drug? impossible to know. Stopped Seroquel October 2015. Stopped Lamictal March 2016. Had more severe muscle/joint spasms that paralyzed me for 3 days at a time, last episode was March 2017.Going back to work as of February 2018 after 14 years off full-time work due to the crippling effects of psych meds. Check out Robert Whittaker "Anatomy of an Epidemic" for his breakdown of the rates of mental disability since the introduction of Prozac into the human population. Best solutions for me: Social support via AA meetings. Acupuncture. Meditation. Dance. Nature. Yoga. Social support online with psych med survivor community. Nutrition. Exercise. More outdoor time. Go sit in the sunshine for 5 minutes. Touch a tree. Breathe deeply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polly1974 Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 Thanks so much both I'm really grateful for your kind replies. This has given me some hope. Thank you Polly Prescribed Lorazepam for OCD/ fear for 6 years. Reached tolerance at 9mg Per day. Was taken off using only 30 mg Valium over 6 months. Didn't realise about withdrawal and was prescribed 7 anti depressants (8 week trial on each), 3 antipsychotics and then a reinstatement of 30 mg Valium Per day. Been drug free for 14 months but believe i am in severe withdrawal from stopping and starting all these medications. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mort81 Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 Karen is right its amplified . I had OCD as a teenager and anxiety/panic in my mid 20's but completely controlled it and it weakened to nothing. During WD ive had it pop up now and again and felt a bit helpless. My thoughts run wild at times and I feel the Neuro emotion reaction. Its very aggravating because I know I don't care but my mind and body are telling me different still way too sensitive that everything is magnified. Was on 30mg (Lexapro) for 7-8yrs20mg for 3 months (This was my choice my Doc wanted me to drop much faster)15 mg 2week10mg 2 weeks 5 mg 1 week0 since August 24th . PPI Dexlant 30 mg taper has begun. Cutting 20% currently. using zantac as needed. Benzo is currently 0.10mg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mort81 Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 Even my reaction to debates or scary movies, sound etc..... Its completely off at the moment. Overtime it should continue to weaken as our systems strengthen. Pain in the a---!! Was on 30mg (Lexapro) for 7-8yrs20mg for 3 months (This was my choice my Doc wanted me to drop much faster)15 mg 2week10mg 2 weeks 5 mg 1 week0 since August 24th . PPI Dexlant 30 mg taper has begun. Cutting 20% currently. using zantac as needed. Benzo is currently 0.10mg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polly1974 Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 Thanks so much Mort I really appreciate your response, thanks for being kind and giving me some hope. Hope your coping OK with everything Polly Prescribed Lorazepam for OCD/ fear for 6 years. Reached tolerance at 9mg Per day. Was taken off using only 30 mg Valium over 6 months. Didn't realise about withdrawal and was prescribed 7 anti depressants (8 week trial on each), 3 antipsychotics and then a reinstatement of 30 mg Valium Per day. Been drug free for 14 months but believe i am in severe withdrawal from stopping and starting all these medications. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mort81 Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 No problem Polly, im doing okay, some days better than others. Being so sensitive is tough but all I can do is look forward to better days and acknowledge the progress Ive made. Was on 30mg (Lexapro) for 7-8yrs20mg for 3 months (This was my choice my Doc wanted me to drop much faster)15 mg 2week10mg 2 weeks 5 mg 1 week0 since August 24th . PPI Dexlant 30 mg taper has begun. Cutting 20% currently. using zantac as needed. Benzo is currently 0.10mg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newbeginning Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 I have a question: has any of you developed the neuro-emotions while tapering very slowly, or is this just a result of tapering too fast for most people? I did not have these symptoms before, but now I do. Makes me wonder if I should reinstate and cut less? SSRIs 3-4 times in the last 14 years; would take them for 6-8 months and then taper off under dr supervision with no problems. Med history prior to 2015: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/6012-newbeginning-my-withdrawal-story/?p=267313#entry267313 04/2015: Prozac decreased to 15mg over last 3 months; effexor held steady at 8mg; current effexor XR: 20 beads of a 75mg capsule per day (about 8mg) 06/2015: Prozac: 10mg; effexor XR: 19 beads (about 7.5mg); 07/2015: Prozac: 8.5mg; effexor 18 beads; 08/2015: Prozac: 7.5mg; effexor: 17 beads End of August: withdrawal: depressive symptoms, crying spells. Realized I was measuring prozac dose wrong for the last 2 months. Reinstated Prozac 8.5mg; Kept effexor at 17 beads. Stabilized in 5 weeks. 10/2015: Prozac: 8.5mg; effexor: 17 beads; 11/2015: Prozac: 1.9ml (7.5mg); effexor: 16 beads; 12/2015: Prozac: 1.6ml; effexor xr: 16 beads. Withdrawal: neuroemotions 01/2016: prozac: 1.6ml; effexor xr: reinstated 17 beads, withdrawal improved; 02/2016: Prozac 1.5ml; Effexor: 17 beads; 03/2016: Prozac 1.3ml(5mg); Effexor: 17 beads (7mg)-withdrawal (flu-like malaise, lightheaded, drowsy) started end of March. April 15: reinstated Prozac 1.5ml. Stabilized. 2 weeks ok. End of April: Withdrawal (neuroemotions). Eventually stabilized in April-May. Apathy improved. 3 month hold until August. August 2016: apathy came back; October 2016: updosed to Prozac 1.6ml. Bad reaction: anxiety, depression. End of October: went down Prozac 1.5ml. Stabilized over several weeks. Dec 9: tried macca for energy: anxiety/depression. Improved over several weeks, but not completely resolved. Dec 31: cut Effexor 5% to 16 beads. After 9 days: withdrawal anxiety, depression; tried updosing to 17 beads Feb 7 but anxiety got worse; went down to 16 beads May 2017: Anxiety improved; severe depression continues; September 2017: finally stabilized!!!!!! 09/07/2017-12/31/2017: hold Stable on Effexor 6mg and Prozac 6mg until around 2019-2020. Side effects (fatigue, anhedonia) continued, but had some long lasting windows thanks to therapy. Windows lasting 5-6 months each year followed by relapses. 2019: bad reaction to melatonin 3 mg. Withdrawal after taking it 2 months. When I tried to stop it developed severe insomnia that lasted 6 months even after I reinstated melatonin. Only slept again because I took hydroxyzine 5 mg 3 times a week for few months. Stopped hydroxyzine with no issues. Sleep normalized. 2020-2021: Holding on Prozac 6mg, Effexor 6mg, Tapered melatonin 1 drop every 2-4 weeks down to 1.5mg. Had to hold because further cuts were causing severe drowsiness. 2021: Insomnia returned due to caffeine use for few months (only started after months of use). I also had a concussion at this time. 2023: took hydroxyzine 5-100mg for one month (kept increasing dose every 3 days because I developed tolerance). Tapered for 1 week. After 1 month: withdrawal neuroemotions. Reinstated 5mg 2 months after stopping. Gradually increased to 25mg, stabilized, but withdrawal came back after 10 days. Kept increasing dose and withdrawal returning. Currently at 40mg. Not sure how to stabilize. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Emeritus Skyler Posted January 25, 2016 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted January 25, 2016 I have a question: has any of you developed the neuro-emotions while tapering very slowly, or is this just a result of tapering too fast for most people? I did not have these symptoms before, but now I do. Makes me wonder if I should reinstate and cut less? Please start reading this thread from the beginning, you will find your question is answered. As always, LISTEN TO YOUR BODY! A proud supporter of the 10% (or slower) rule. Requip - 3/16 ZERO Total time on 25 years. Lyrica: 8/15 ZERO Total time on 7 or 8 yrs.BENZO FREE 10/13 (started tapering 7/10) Total time on 25 years. Read my intro thread here, and check the about me section. "No matter how cynical you get, it's almost impossible to keep up." Lily Tomlin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newbeginning Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 Thanks! I skipped only a few. Guess it was in those I appreciate your reply! SSRIs 3-4 times in the last 14 years; would take them for 6-8 months and then taper off under dr supervision with no problems. Med history prior to 2015: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/6012-newbeginning-my-withdrawal-story/?p=267313#entry267313 04/2015: Prozac decreased to 15mg over last 3 months; effexor held steady at 8mg; current effexor XR: 20 beads of a 75mg capsule per day (about 8mg) 06/2015: Prozac: 10mg; effexor XR: 19 beads (about 7.5mg); 07/2015: Prozac: 8.5mg; effexor 18 beads; 08/2015: Prozac: 7.5mg; effexor: 17 beads End of August: withdrawal: depressive symptoms, crying spells. Realized I was measuring prozac dose wrong for the last 2 months. Reinstated Prozac 8.5mg; Kept effexor at 17 beads. Stabilized in 5 weeks. 10/2015: Prozac: 8.5mg; effexor: 17 beads; 11/2015: Prozac: 1.9ml (7.5mg); effexor: 16 beads; 12/2015: Prozac: 1.6ml; effexor xr: 16 beads. Withdrawal: neuroemotions 01/2016: prozac: 1.6ml; effexor xr: reinstated 17 beads, withdrawal improved; 02/2016: Prozac 1.5ml; Effexor: 17 beads; 03/2016: Prozac 1.3ml(5mg); Effexor: 17 beads (7mg)-withdrawal (flu-like malaise, lightheaded, drowsy) started end of March. April 15: reinstated Prozac 1.5ml. Stabilized. 2 weeks ok. End of April: Withdrawal (neuroemotions). Eventually stabilized in April-May. Apathy improved. 3 month hold until August. August 2016: apathy came back; October 2016: updosed to Prozac 1.6ml. Bad reaction: anxiety, depression. End of October: went down Prozac 1.5ml. Stabilized over several weeks. Dec 9: tried macca for energy: anxiety/depression. Improved over several weeks, but not completely resolved. Dec 31: cut Effexor 5% to 16 beads. After 9 days: withdrawal anxiety, depression; tried updosing to 17 beads Feb 7 but anxiety got worse; went down to 16 beads May 2017: Anxiety improved; severe depression continues; September 2017: finally stabilized!!!!!! 09/07/2017-12/31/2017: hold Stable on Effexor 6mg and Prozac 6mg until around 2019-2020. Side effects (fatigue, anhedonia) continued, but had some long lasting windows thanks to therapy. Windows lasting 5-6 months each year followed by relapses. 2019: bad reaction to melatonin 3 mg. Withdrawal after taking it 2 months. When I tried to stop it developed severe insomnia that lasted 6 months even after I reinstated melatonin. Only slept again because I took hydroxyzine 5 mg 3 times a week for few months. Stopped hydroxyzine with no issues. Sleep normalized. 2020-2021: Holding on Prozac 6mg, Effexor 6mg, Tapered melatonin 1 drop every 2-4 weeks down to 1.5mg. Had to hold because further cuts were causing severe drowsiness. 2021: Insomnia returned due to caffeine use for few months (only started after months of use). I also had a concussion at this time. 2023: took hydroxyzine 5-100mg for one month (kept increasing dose every 3 days because I developed tolerance). Tapered for 1 week. After 1 month: withdrawal neuroemotions. Reinstated 5mg 2 months after stopping. Gradually increased to 25mg, stabilized, but withdrawal came back after 10 days. Kept increasing dose and withdrawal returning. Currently at 40mg. Not sure how to stabilize. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Emeritus KarenB Posted January 25, 2016 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted January 25, 2016 I had big neuro-emotions while tapering at 10% (way too fast for me) and very minimal neuro emotions now that I am tapering at 0.4%. 2010 Fluoxetine 20mg. 2011 Escitalopram 20mg. 2013 Tapered badly and destabilised CNS. Effexor 150mg. 2015 Begin using info at SurvivingAntidepressants. Cut 10% - bad w/d 2 months, held 1 month. Micro-tapering: four weekly 0.4% cuts, hold 4 weeks (struggling with symptoms). 8 month hold. 2017 Micro-tapering: four weekly 1% cuts, hold 4 weeks (symptoms almost non-existent). 2020 Still micro-tapering. Just over 2/3 of the way off effexor. Minimal symptoms, - and sleeping well. Supplements: Fish oil, vitamin C, iron, oat-straw tea, nettle tea. 2023 December - Now on 5 micro-beads Effexor. Minimal symptoms but much more time needed between drops. Symptoms begin to increase. 2024 April - Updosed to 6 microbeads - immediate increase in symptoms for 4 days. Decreased to 5 microbeads. 'The possibility of renewal exists so long as life exists.' Dr Gabor Mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newbeginning Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 Wow that's great to now. Thanks KarenB! I will try slowing down and see if things improve. Blessings SSRIs 3-4 times in the last 14 years; would take them for 6-8 months and then taper off under dr supervision with no problems. Med history prior to 2015: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/6012-newbeginning-my-withdrawal-story/?p=267313#entry267313 04/2015: Prozac decreased to 15mg over last 3 months; effexor held steady at 8mg; current effexor XR: 20 beads of a 75mg capsule per day (about 8mg) 06/2015: Prozac: 10mg; effexor XR: 19 beads (about 7.5mg); 07/2015: Prozac: 8.5mg; effexor 18 beads; 08/2015: Prozac: 7.5mg; effexor: 17 beads End of August: withdrawal: depressive symptoms, crying spells. Realized I was measuring prozac dose wrong for the last 2 months. Reinstated Prozac 8.5mg; Kept effexor at 17 beads. Stabilized in 5 weeks. 10/2015: Prozac: 8.5mg; effexor: 17 beads; 11/2015: Prozac: 1.9ml (7.5mg); effexor: 16 beads; 12/2015: Prozac: 1.6ml; effexor xr: 16 beads. Withdrawal: neuroemotions 01/2016: prozac: 1.6ml; effexor xr: reinstated 17 beads, withdrawal improved; 02/2016: Prozac 1.5ml; Effexor: 17 beads; 03/2016: Prozac 1.3ml(5mg); Effexor: 17 beads (7mg)-withdrawal (flu-like malaise, lightheaded, drowsy) started end of March. April 15: reinstated Prozac 1.5ml. Stabilized. 2 weeks ok. End of April: Withdrawal (neuroemotions). Eventually stabilized in April-May. Apathy improved. 3 month hold until August. August 2016: apathy came back; October 2016: updosed to Prozac 1.6ml. Bad reaction: anxiety, depression. End of October: went down Prozac 1.5ml. Stabilized over several weeks. Dec 9: tried macca for energy: anxiety/depression. Improved over several weeks, but not completely resolved. Dec 31: cut Effexor 5% to 16 beads. After 9 days: withdrawal anxiety, depression; tried updosing to 17 beads Feb 7 but anxiety got worse; went down to 16 beads May 2017: Anxiety improved; severe depression continues; September 2017: finally stabilized!!!!!! 09/07/2017-12/31/2017: hold Stable on Effexor 6mg and Prozac 6mg until around 2019-2020. Side effects (fatigue, anhedonia) continued, but had some long lasting windows thanks to therapy. Windows lasting 5-6 months each year followed by relapses. 2019: bad reaction to melatonin 3 mg. Withdrawal after taking it 2 months. When I tried to stop it developed severe insomnia that lasted 6 months even after I reinstated melatonin. Only slept again because I took hydroxyzine 5 mg 3 times a week for few months. Stopped hydroxyzine with no issues. Sleep normalized. 2020-2021: Holding on Prozac 6mg, Effexor 6mg, Tapered melatonin 1 drop every 2-4 weeks down to 1.5mg. Had to hold because further cuts were causing severe drowsiness. 2021: Insomnia returned due to caffeine use for few months (only started after months of use). I also had a concussion at this time. 2023: took hydroxyzine 5-100mg for one month (kept increasing dose every 3 days because I developed tolerance). Tapered for 1 week. After 1 month: withdrawal neuroemotions. Reinstated 5mg 2 months after stopping. Gradually increased to 25mg, stabilized, but withdrawal came back after 10 days. Kept increasing dose and withdrawal returning. Currently at 40mg. Not sure how to stabilize. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coopergirl1 Posted February 1, 2016 Share Posted February 1, 2016 Hi you guys! Can an intrusive thought come during a normal action and make you feel your action was bad too? Thnx so much Started Prozac 20 MG March 2014-Sept 2014 New doctor switched me to Lexapro 10 MG and it helped from Sept 2014-Feb 2015 and then I felt the Lexapro wasn't helping as much so he changed the dose to 20 MG and I took that from Feb 2015-July 2015 when I decided to get off pills completely.I had to reinstate as I was feeling so bad and very pressured to go back on pills. My Dr put me on 50 MG zoloft and I took it for about a week..made me feel brain dead. Went down to 25 before I really learned the trouble of fast tapering..finally got a jewelry scale to properly weigh out my pills. Looking to just feel OK. Unsure where to go next. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Emeritus KarenB Posted February 1, 2016 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted February 1, 2016 For sure. I think that neuro-emotions really mess with our perspective, causing us to misunderstand many things including our own actions and those of others. Recognising these thoughts for what they are when they show up, and learning to separate them out can help a lot. It gets easier with practice. 2010 Fluoxetine 20mg. 2011 Escitalopram 20mg. 2013 Tapered badly and destabilised CNS. Effexor 150mg. 2015 Begin using info at SurvivingAntidepressants. Cut 10% - bad w/d 2 months, held 1 month. Micro-tapering: four weekly 0.4% cuts, hold 4 weeks (struggling with symptoms). 8 month hold. 2017 Micro-tapering: four weekly 1% cuts, hold 4 weeks (symptoms almost non-existent). 2020 Still micro-tapering. Just over 2/3 of the way off effexor. Minimal symptoms, - and sleeping well. Supplements: Fish oil, vitamin C, iron, oat-straw tea, nettle tea. 2023 December - Now on 5 micro-beads Effexor. Minimal symptoms but much more time needed between drops. Symptoms begin to increase. 2024 April - Updosed to 6 microbeads - immediate increase in symptoms for 4 days. Decreased to 5 microbeads. 'The possibility of renewal exists so long as life exists.' Dr Gabor Mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coopergirl1 Posted February 1, 2016 Share Posted February 1, 2016 I appreciate your response so much Karen, thank you! Started Prozac 20 MG March 2014-Sept 2014 New doctor switched me to Lexapro 10 MG and it helped from Sept 2014-Feb 2015 and then I felt the Lexapro wasn't helping as much so he changed the dose to 20 MG and I took that from Feb 2015-July 2015 when I decided to get off pills completely.I had to reinstate as I was feeling so bad and very pressured to go back on pills. My Dr put me on 50 MG zoloft and I took it for about a week..made me feel brain dead. Went down to 25 before I really learned the trouble of fast tapering..finally got a jewelry scale to properly weigh out my pills. Looking to just feel OK. Unsure where to go next. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Emeritus elbee Posted April 19, 2016 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted April 19, 2016 I've now read this entire thread, and it's interesting to read about people's different takes on this. One common theme that appeared to me is whether an emotion is "real" or not and/or is the emotion "really me" or not. It seems like some people think of a neuro emotion as something along the lines of a "misfire" emotion (brain just kind of going skewy?). Others have talked about neuro emotions as those that might have a kernel of truth, but gets amplified. Still others have talked about it as perhaps "pent up" emotions that get "released" after having been suppressed as an effect of the meds they were on. All of these takes seem to make sense to me. How do I personally relate to the idea of neuro emotions? I can relate to the idea at some level I think as what I feel when I'm in the throes of a panic attack. Incredible generalized fear, impending doom . . . emotions that just don't seem to match up to the reality of the moment. And generally, this "mis-match" creates such horror . . . it feels so awful! Maybe I can relate to it from past drinking, saying something that was perhaps rooted in a kernel of truth, but in that moment seems intense and important and for whatever reason I'm compelled to express. Or perhaps in the drinking context, it's been something I've sat on, not expressed and let build up that through alcohol finds it's way to the surface. I think I most relate to neuro emotions with some of the therapy type work I've been doing, and through my involvement/participation with Adult Children of Alcoholics and Dysfunctional Families (ACA/ACOA). I've been able to identify that sometimes I feel emotions VERY INTENSELY, where I have felt "triggered" (experiencing emotions that are rooted in the past). I'm feeling something in the present as an adult, but I'm feeling it as though it were me as a little kid. Again, in this context I'm experiencing emotions that of course feel very real, that have some element of "truth" to them, and that definitely feel amplified so that they don't really appear to match the context of the situation. Experiencing emotions in this way makes me feel crazy and out of control, and left wondering what the hell is going on with me!?!? And it could be that I simply haven't experience neuro emotions (yet?) in ways that some others have experienced them. But those are my thoughts. My suggestions are not medical advice. They are my opinions based on my own experience, strength and hope. You are in charge of your own medical / healing / recovery choices. My success story | My introduction thread ZOLOFT FREE - COMPLETELY DRUG FREE 4/28/2019! - total time on 28+ years BENZO FREE! 4/7/2018 - total time on 27+ years REMERON FREE! 12/11/2016 - total time on 15 months Caffeine & Nicotine Free 2014 / 2015 - smoked for 28 years Alcohol Free 4/1/2014 - drank for 30 years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FightingForHope Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 This thread is so helpful, the same way that Breggin's book Medication Madness has been helpful to me, in understanding and forgiving myself for the things I did while on psych drugs, and learning to trust myself again. I think I experienced similar distortions of emotion while I was ON the meds, not just during withdrawal. Hello Rhiannon, I agree with you this thread is so helpful in understanding; I am pretty sure that I too experienced some serious distortions of emotion while I was ON the meds, as well. My emotions were heightened, and for the longest time I wasn't really myself, sad as that is to say. Also, I unsuccesfully tried tapering/quitting a few times before, and had the same neuro-emotions I'm having now, so I am familiar with them, I just was not sure before that it wasn't me. About 20 year history on and off SSRIs, beginning with Prozac 20mg (?) then Lexapro (from which I unwittingly did a traumatic and disastrous cold turkey) then last 14 years on Paxil 20mg, then 10mg, with unsuccessful attempts at cessation Finally successfully tapered from 20mg to 0 over the last year. Last dose was on 12/11/2015. I was also prescribed Clonazepam concomitantly for anxiety, to take as needed. I took about 0.125mg to 0.5mg, 0 to twice weekly (?). Stopped taking altogether beginning April 2016. Overall my recollection of this timeline is scattered - lots of life and doctor changes, moves, poor record keeping on my part, and my memory has not been the best lately, but I am noticing improvements. Also took antihistamines and decongestants for years for chronic allergies, all of which I also stopped Dec 2015. Currently taking fish oil, pro-biotics, Vit. D for deficiency, and Magnesium (but only occasionally). End of April 2016 started taking Trader Joe's "Calming Sleep Formula" which seemed to help; it is L-Theanine 200mg, 5-HTP 30mg, and Melatonin 3mg - but I read 5-HTP affects serotonin, so I am going to stop that also, and try only Melatonin instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FightingForHope Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 That's the thing for me too--most of my emotions are not unsurprising in the context of my life, they're just so intensified. Plus I don't feel well and strong enough right now to make the changes in my life that would change the conditions that contribute to those emotions. And I'm not really certain how much, or what, I need to or should do, because frankly I still don't trust my judgment, rightly so. I know that during my long hold spells when I get to feeling pretty well, my judgment is better. So I know it's being affected by withdrawal and I know from past experience that it's drastically affected by the drugs themselves. So I'm just holding the course, so to speak. And meanwhile time is passing and my remaining years are passing and I'm getting older and having to face that I may never have even the simple things I have always hoped for. Hello Rhiannon, I feel the same way; a lot of my emotions are not all completely unwarranted, they are just so intense and impossible to handle. And I don't feel well enough or sane enough right now to make the necessary changes, or take any action. I'm not even sure they are necessary changes, because I don't trust myself and what I am feeling and thinking right now. So I too am "holding the course", and "getting older and having to face that I may never have even the simple things I have always hoped for" as you say. I feel like time passes and life slips ... Which only adds to my impatience and the intensity of my neuro-emotions and misery. I know this is an old post, so I hope things are much better for you now ... I am fairly new and learning/reading my way around the site still... there is a lot, mercifully. Thank you for your insights! About 20 year history on and off SSRIs, beginning with Prozac 20mg (?) then Lexapro (from which I unwittingly did a traumatic and disastrous cold turkey) then last 14 years on Paxil 20mg, then 10mg, with unsuccessful attempts at cessation Finally successfully tapered from 20mg to 0 over the last year. Last dose was on 12/11/2015. I was also prescribed Clonazepam concomitantly for anxiety, to take as needed. I took about 0.125mg to 0.5mg, 0 to twice weekly (?). Stopped taking altogether beginning April 2016. Overall my recollection of this timeline is scattered - lots of life and doctor changes, moves, poor record keeping on my part, and my memory has not been the best lately, but I am noticing improvements. Also took antihistamines and decongestants for years for chronic allergies, all of which I also stopped Dec 2015. Currently taking fish oil, pro-biotics, Vit. D for deficiency, and Magnesium (but only occasionally). End of April 2016 started taking Trader Joe's "Calming Sleep Formula" which seemed to help; it is L-Theanine 200mg, 5-HTP 30mg, and Melatonin 3mg - but I read 5-HTP affects serotonin, so I am going to stop that also, and try only Melatonin instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FightingForHope Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 I've now read this entire thread, and it's interesting to read about people's different takes on this. One common theme that appeared to me is whether an emotion is "real" or not and/or is the emotion "really me" or not. It seems like some people think of a neuro emotion as something along the lines of a "misfire" emotion (brain just kind of going skewy?). Others have talked about neuro emotions as those that might have a kernel of truth, but gets amplified. Still others have talked about it as perhaps "pent up" emotions that get "released" after having been suppressed as an effect of the meds they were on. All of these takes seem to make sense to me. How do I personally relate to the idea of neuro emotions? I can relate to the idea at some level I think as what I feel when I'm in the throes of a panic attack. Incredible generalized fear, impending doom . . . emotions that just don't seem to match up to the reality of the moment. And generally, this "mis-match" creates such horror . . . it feels so awful! Maybe I can relate to it from past drinking, saying something that was perhaps rooted in a kernel of truth, but in that moment seems intense and important and for whatever reason I'm compelled to express. Or perhaps in the drinking context, it's been something I've sat on, not expressed and let build up that through alcohol finds it's way to the surface. I think I most relate to neuro emotions with some of the therapy type work I've been doing, and through my involvement/participation with Adult Children of Alcoholics and Dysfunctional Families (ACA/ACOA). I've been able to identify that sometimes I feel emotions VERY INTENSELY, where I have felt "triggered" (experiencing emotions that are rooted in the past). I'm feeling something in the present as an adult, but I'm feeling it as though it were me as a little kid. Again, in this context I'm experiencing emotions that of course feel very real, that have some element of "truth" to them, and that definitely feel amplified so that they don't really appear to match the context of the situation. Experiencing emotions in this way makes me feel crazy and out of control, and left wondering what the hell is going on with me!?!? And it could be that I simply haven't experience neuro emotions (yet?) in ways that some others have experienced them. But those are my thoughts. Hello again elbee I can relate almost entirely to the way you describe experiencing these intense emotions mis-matched to reality, which is what I personally think of as neuro-emotions ... Just yesterday I had another extremely intense bout of something very like this: "I'm feeling something in the present as an adult, but I'm feeling it as though it were me as a little kid. Again, in this context I'm experiencing emotions that of course feel very real, that have some element of "truth" to them, and that definitely feel amplified so that they don't really appear to match the context of the situation. Experiencing emotions in this way makes me feel crazy and out of control, and left wondering what the hell is going on with me!?!?" I feel like a kid, reacting and feeling the events around me as I might have done as a kid, but worse, and as you say in an amplified way. The worst part is I can't hide it, and people at work or outside pick up on it and must think me crazy, because 1) the changes in me are obvious if one knows me somewhat, and 2) I am definitely not a kid. All of which also adds to my not-so-mild-anymore sense of being picked on and looked upon unfavorably. It's so awful I feel like disappearing! I have been feeling this way since I began my taper, yesterday and at times quite badly, in fact. I struggle with identifying whether what I am feeling is rooted in something real and pertinent to my life and my past, or is a complete fabrication, I suspect the latter. Other intense feelings that arise at times seem like pent up emotions that blow up, others like grand structures built on top of a kernel of truth- perhaps previously unaddressed ... some feel simply like overreactions to something I might more easily brush off (or not?) ... I seem to go through all kinds, it's very confusing, and my thoughts scatter About 20 year history on and off SSRIs, beginning with Prozac 20mg (?) then Lexapro (from which I unwittingly did a traumatic and disastrous cold turkey) then last 14 years on Paxil 20mg, then 10mg, with unsuccessful attempts at cessation Finally successfully tapered from 20mg to 0 over the last year. Last dose was on 12/11/2015. I was also prescribed Clonazepam concomitantly for anxiety, to take as needed. I took about 0.125mg to 0.5mg, 0 to twice weekly (?). Stopped taking altogether beginning April 2016. Overall my recollection of this timeline is scattered - lots of life and doctor changes, moves, poor record keeping on my part, and my memory has not been the best lately, but I am noticing improvements. Also took antihistamines and decongestants for years for chronic allergies, all of which I also stopped Dec 2015. Currently taking fish oil, pro-biotics, Vit. D for deficiency, and Magnesium (but only occasionally). End of April 2016 started taking Trader Joe's "Calming Sleep Formula" which seemed to help; it is L-Theanine 200mg, 5-HTP 30mg, and Melatonin 3mg - but I read 5-HTP affects serotonin, so I am going to stop that also, and try only Melatonin instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FightingForHope Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 I struggle with identifying whether what I am feeling is rooted in something real and pertinent to my life and my past, or is a complete fabrication, I suspect the latter. I apologize, I actually meant "the former"! About 20 year history on and off SSRIs, beginning with Prozac 20mg (?) then Lexapro (from which I unwittingly did a traumatic and disastrous cold turkey) then last 14 years on Paxil 20mg, then 10mg, with unsuccessful attempts at cessation Finally successfully tapered from 20mg to 0 over the last year. Last dose was on 12/11/2015. I was also prescribed Clonazepam concomitantly for anxiety, to take as needed. I took about 0.125mg to 0.5mg, 0 to twice weekly (?). Stopped taking altogether beginning April 2016. Overall my recollection of this timeline is scattered - lots of life and doctor changes, moves, poor record keeping on my part, and my memory has not been the best lately, but I am noticing improvements. Also took antihistamines and decongestants for years for chronic allergies, all of which I also stopped Dec 2015. Currently taking fish oil, pro-biotics, Vit. D for deficiency, and Magnesium (but only occasionally). End of April 2016 started taking Trader Joe's "Calming Sleep Formula" which seemed to help; it is L-Theanine 200mg, 5-HTP 30mg, and Melatonin 3mg - but I read 5-HTP affects serotonin, so I am going to stop that also, and try only Melatonin instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Emeritus elbee Posted April 22, 2016 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted April 22, 2016 Hey FightingForHope, I've had some success addressing those old, triggered emotions through EMDR. I don't know why it seems to work for me, but it does. As I've been doing it, things that used to trigger me like that don't, or don't as much. But there is still more. I had that sensation of "deep/old" feelings come up today . . . that "little kid trying to navigate an adult world" feeling. I'm also involved in ACA, and that program / support has been really useful to me. So what I'm finding is that while these emotions don't match up to my reality, there does seem to be a basis for them (from a repressed memory / trauma perspective, anyway). But at the same time, this all seemed to come out of nowhere. The end of last week I was actually feeling really great, and then this past Sunday it shifted on me. It's frustrating not to be able to point a finger at any one thing and say, ahh yes, this is what set me off. Perhaps that's neuro emotions? Anyway, I just try to let the emotions out as they come up and roll with it. Based on your description, it sounds like we may be having some similar experiences. Thanks for sharing yours! LB My suggestions are not medical advice. They are my opinions based on my own experience, strength and hope. You are in charge of your own medical / healing / recovery choices. My success story | My introduction thread ZOLOFT FREE - COMPLETELY DRUG FREE 4/28/2019! - total time on 28+ years BENZO FREE! 4/7/2018 - total time on 27+ years REMERON FREE! 12/11/2016 - total time on 15 months Caffeine & Nicotine Free 2014 / 2015 - smoked for 28 years Alcohol Free 4/1/2014 - drank for 30 years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FightingForHope Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 Hey FightingForHope, I've had some success addressing those old, triggered emotions through EMDR. I don't know why it seems to work for me, but it does. As I've been doing it, things that used to trigger me like that don't, or don't as much. But there is still more. I had that sensation of "deep/old" feelings come up today . . . that "little kid trying to navigate an adult world" feeling. I'm also involved in ACA, and that program / support has been really useful to me. So what I'm finding is that while these emotions don't match up to my reality, there does seem to be a basis for them (from a repressed memory / trauma perspective, anyway). But at the same time, this all seemed to come out of nowhere. The end of last week I was actually feeling really great, and then this past Sunday it shifted on me. It's frustrating not to be able to point a finger at any one thing and say, ahh yes, this is what set me off. Perhaps that's neuro emotions? Anyway, I just try to let the emotions out as they come up and roll with it. Based on your description, it sounds like we may be having some similar experiences. Thanks for sharing yours! LB Hi elbee, I'm not familiar with EMDR, but I can see how these emotions would have a basis in a repressed life event or past trauma; it's interesting to hear that's what you're finding out. It is puzzling how they come out of the blue, I don't know whether I have a trigger either; my last horrible episode came right after a short period of feeling better than I had in a long time, as a matter of fact. It was a pretty intense one too, and it took me a couple of days to dig myself out ... today was a better day, after resting a lot and finally getting a much needed decent night's sleep. It seems that these neuro-emotions won't let up until they've done ALL the housekeeping in there! Every unresolved emotion bubbling up to the surface ... or at least the key ones? I wonder. Anyway, I wish you continued success with your therapies and support! And thank you as well for sharing; it's helpful to hear. All the best! About 20 year history on and off SSRIs, beginning with Prozac 20mg (?) then Lexapro (from which I unwittingly did a traumatic and disastrous cold turkey) then last 14 years on Paxil 20mg, then 10mg, with unsuccessful attempts at cessation Finally successfully tapered from 20mg to 0 over the last year. Last dose was on 12/11/2015. I was also prescribed Clonazepam concomitantly for anxiety, to take as needed. I took about 0.125mg to 0.5mg, 0 to twice weekly (?). Stopped taking altogether beginning April 2016. Overall my recollection of this timeline is scattered - lots of life and doctor changes, moves, poor record keeping on my part, and my memory has not been the best lately, but I am noticing improvements. Also took antihistamines and decongestants for years for chronic allergies, all of which I also stopped Dec 2015. Currently taking fish oil, pro-biotics, Vit. D for deficiency, and Magnesium (but only occasionally). End of April 2016 started taking Trader Joe's "Calming Sleep Formula" which seemed to help; it is L-Theanine 200mg, 5-HTP 30mg, and Melatonin 3mg - but I read 5-HTP affects serotonin, so I am going to stop that also, and try only Melatonin instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Help777 Posted April 27, 2016 Share Posted April 27, 2016 Any advice on how to manage neuro anger? It hits so quickly and fiercly. Meditation doesn't help. I end up rumaging through closets and crying, screaming, throwing so much out. It feels like an inner restlesness where i am going to explode or implode. It ends with me sobbing on the floor for 30 mins until i am so utterly exhausted that I start to calm down. Then i am just so, so sad. Anyone relate? What helps? May 12th 2016 took last bead of effexor. 8 month taper. Bridge = prozac 5mg, 300mg Lithium May 31st took last of prozac. Lithium 300 mg, estrogen patch 150, magnesium. June 14th reinstated 1mg Prozac due to intolerable emotional distress. Cont with lithium 300mg, 150 magnesium, re added omega 3, cont estrogen patch. June 15-july 5th had marked improvement of emotional wd symptoms, likely due to the reinstatement. July 5th intense emotional symptoms returned. July 15 decreased 50 mg of lithium to see if it improved low heart rate. July 19th - increased prozac to 1.5mg. July 22 marked improvement of emotional symptoms...again, likely due to increase of prozac. However sudden agitation developed so decreased back down to 1.25mg prozac. Realizing increasing dose is dangerous because of these adverse effects and also seeing that wave is inevitable regardless of reinstatement. Continuing 250 lithium, 1.25mg prozac, estrogen. Oct 31st - continued 250 lithium, 1 mg prozac, estrogen patch. Jan 2018 - off of prozac (bridge) as of Dec 2017. Starting to taper Lithium 250 mg. Will do 10% per month. May 2018 - lithium 115mg. Still having waves but they aren’t as bad. However, I really struggle with emotional symptoms about 1 week after a cut. dec 2018- 80mg lithium. Tapering 1 mg per week since last June. Symptoms improving overall but still very sensitive to light, sound, social stimulation and I cry a lot. March 2019 - 65 mg lithium. Still tapering 1mg per week. Jan 2021- down to 4 mg lithium (get it compounded). Reinstated 5 mg Prozac. Jan 2023- withdraw 5mg prozac over one month Feb 20th 2023- reinstated 1mg Prozac. Still taking 4 mg lithium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RubyTuesday Posted April 27, 2016 Share Posted April 27, 2016 I can totally relate. with anger, gratitude helps. after I calm down, I massage my head, and if, for example I have just freaked out because I lost my car keys, I say a short prayer that I am thankful that I own a car. when I get angry that I have lost 14 years of my life to psych meds, I thank God that I got to get off them and remind myself that I know I will feel much better next year. 2002: "Situational depression" 2002-2010:Prozac.Birth Control.2011 Short trials: Paxil, Celexa, Lexipro, Wellbutrin, Xanax, Ativan- Gee, Doc never mentioned protracted AD wd syndrome. Imagine that. 2011-2015. Lamictal. Seroquel. Remiron. 2012: "Complex post traumatic stress disorder." Fast taper of Remiron jumped off June 2013. Slow tapers ever since of Seroquel & Lamictal. crippling muscle spasms. crying fits. panic attacks. akathisia. nerve twitches. the jitters. the heebie jeebies. de-personal/realization. numbness. tingling. fatigue. lethargy. nightmares.insomnia. weird images. eye pain.vertigo. dizziness. brain zaps. and on and on and on. withdrawal? side effects? which drug? impossible to know. Stopped Seroquel October 2015. Stopped Lamictal March 2016. Had more severe muscle/joint spasms that paralyzed me for 3 days at a time, last episode was March 2017.Going back to work as of February 2018 after 14 years off full-time work due to the crippling effects of psych meds. Check out Robert Whittaker "Anatomy of an Epidemic" for his breakdown of the rates of mental disability since the introduction of Prozac into the human population. Best solutions for me: Social support via AA meetings. Acupuncture. Meditation. Dance. Nature. Yoga. Social support online with psych med survivor community. Nutrition. Exercise. More outdoor time. Go sit in the sunshine for 5 minutes. Touch a tree. Breathe deeply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swede Posted April 27, 2016 Share Posted April 27, 2016 What are the differences between intrusive-thoughts-neuroemotions and intrusive-thoughts-OCD??? Klomipramin 25-150mg 2002-2013 Sertralin - 6 weeks in 2009 Mirtazapin - 7 weeks 2013 Cipralex - 20mg Nov 2013 - Nov 2014 Tapered Cipralex from Nov 2014-Mars 8 2015 Thyroid - Low metabolism Levaxin - 2010 - 25ug - 175ug Liothyronin(T3) - 10ug - Nov 2014 - Nov 2015 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonstoneblue Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 I've had bad anger today. I came home and changed my clothes ready to hoover and clean the house and my parents said they were watching tv, so I kinda flew off the handle and felt angry. I felt extremely stressed and everything. I was stressed out because I needed to clean and had to cook dinner. My mums unwell so she's unable to do much. I feel bad. I'm worried I'll do the same when I return to work. A little bit of stress turns into something huge. My chest feels like it's going to explode. 2001 - Prozac 20mg for a week weeks 2001- Venelaxafine 37.5 mg 2006 - Ciptralex 10mg I think 2008 - Mirtazipine (not sure of dose, was the lowest though). 2008 - Citalopram (standard dose) 2009 - Prozac 20mg until 29 Feb 2016 2016 - Setraline 25mg for 3 days (from March 3rd until March 5th). 2016 - 11th March Reinstated 5mg prozac. 26th May 2016 down to 4.5mg Prozac. 26June 2016 down to 4mg prozac. Back up to 5mg on 3rd July 2016. Supplements - B- Complex, Flaxseed oil, L-lysine 1000mg, Iron 20mg. Spirulina 500mg. Quest Synergist Magnesium 150mg, Salmon oil 1000mg twice a day, Evening Primrose oil 500mg. Cipralex 10mg 17th July 2016. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Help777 Posted May 5, 2016 Share Posted May 5, 2016 Does anyone experience a rage attack that would seem like a panic attack in that it is short lived, follows a similar pattern except instead of panic it is an anger or rage that lasts for about 20 mins and then it leaves your body just as quickly as it came on? If so, what helps? May 12th 2016 took last bead of effexor. 8 month taper. Bridge = prozac 5mg, 300mg Lithium May 31st took last of prozac. Lithium 300 mg, estrogen patch 150, magnesium. June 14th reinstated 1mg Prozac due to intolerable emotional distress. Cont with lithium 300mg, 150 magnesium, re added omega 3, cont estrogen patch. June 15-july 5th had marked improvement of emotional wd symptoms, likely due to the reinstatement. July 5th intense emotional symptoms returned. July 15 decreased 50 mg of lithium to see if it improved low heart rate. July 19th - increased prozac to 1.5mg. July 22 marked improvement of emotional symptoms...again, likely due to increase of prozac. However sudden agitation developed so decreased back down to 1.25mg prozac. Realizing increasing dose is dangerous because of these adverse effects and also seeing that wave is inevitable regardless of reinstatement. Continuing 250 lithium, 1.25mg prozac, estrogen. Oct 31st - continued 250 lithium, 1 mg prozac, estrogen patch. Jan 2018 - off of prozac (bridge) as of Dec 2017. Starting to taper Lithium 250 mg. Will do 10% per month. May 2018 - lithium 115mg. Still having waves but they aren’t as bad. However, I really struggle with emotional symptoms about 1 week after a cut. dec 2018- 80mg lithium. Tapering 1 mg per week since last June. Symptoms improving overall but still very sensitive to light, sound, social stimulation and I cry a lot. March 2019 - 65 mg lithium. Still tapering 1mg per week. Jan 2021- down to 4 mg lithium (get it compounded). Reinstated 5 mg Prozac. Jan 2023- withdraw 5mg prozac over one month Feb 20th 2023- reinstated 1mg Prozac. Still taking 4 mg lithium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Emeritus SkyBlue Posted May 6, 2016 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted May 6, 2016 Help, yes. Absolutely yes. I have ripped a shirt almost right off my body (tore the sleeve right off at the seam). What helps = only time. Sometimes talking to my immediate family who is with me at the time. They assure me that I am safe and won't let me become unsafe. I have this at night also (wake up, heart pounding, in a total rage, wanting to break things). So when I'm in a period where this is happening regularly, removing my computer from my room so I don't destroy it. Also, does anyone know what this might be? (What is causing it-- cortisol?) 2020: After 18+ years (entire adult life) on Paxil, a dangerous doctor-led "taper" in 2015, and four years tapering off the last 1 mg thanks to SA and the Brassmonkey slide, I AM COMPLETELY FREE OF PAXIL! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! Forever. 2021: Began conservative, proper, CNS-respecting taper of Zoloft, led by the only expert on me -- me. Making own liquid. 5-10% plus holds. 2022: Holding on Zoloft for now. Current dose 47 mg. Hanging in, hanging on. Severe protracted PAWS, windows and waves. While I may not be doing "a lot" by outside standards, things are graaaaadually getting better. Yoga (gentle to medium); walks; daily breath practice; nutrition, fruits/veg; nature; water; EastEnders (lol); practicing self-compassion, self-care; boundaries; connection; allowing feelings; t r u s t ing that I, too, will heal. (--> may need to be reminded of this.) "You are not alone, and this is not the end of your story." - Baylissa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FightingForHope Posted May 7, 2016 Share Posted May 7, 2016 Help, yes. Absolutely yes. I have ripped a shirt almost right off my body (tore the sleeve right off at the seam). What helps = only time. Sometimes talking to my immediate family who is with me at the time. They assure me that I am safe and won't let me become unsafe. I have this at night also (wake up, heart pounding, in a total rage, wanting to break things). So when I'm in a period where this is happening regularly, removing my computer from my room so I don't destroy it. Also, does anyone know what this might be? (What is causing it-- cortisol?) I also have anger when I wake up in the middle of the night or early morning - around the times they say cortisol beings to spike, so maybe it is related? About 20 year history on and off SSRIs, beginning with Prozac 20mg (?) then Lexapro (from which I unwittingly did a traumatic and disastrous cold turkey) then last 14 years on Paxil 20mg, then 10mg, with unsuccessful attempts at cessation Finally successfully tapered from 20mg to 0 over the last year. Last dose was on 12/11/2015. I was also prescribed Clonazepam concomitantly for anxiety, to take as needed. I took about 0.125mg to 0.5mg, 0 to twice weekly (?). Stopped taking altogether beginning April 2016. Overall my recollection of this timeline is scattered - lots of life and doctor changes, moves, poor record keeping on my part, and my memory has not been the best lately, but I am noticing improvements. Also took antihistamines and decongestants for years for chronic allergies, all of which I also stopped Dec 2015. Currently taking fish oil, pro-biotics, Vit. D for deficiency, and Magnesium (but only occasionally). End of April 2016 started taking Trader Joe's "Calming Sleep Formula" which seemed to help; it is L-Theanine 200mg, 5-HTP 30mg, and Melatonin 3mg - but I read 5-HTP affects serotonin, so I am going to stop that also, and try only Melatonin instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Emeritus SkyBlue Posted May 7, 2016 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted May 7, 2016 Very interesting! It sounds like it could be related. 2020: After 18+ years (entire adult life) on Paxil, a dangerous doctor-led "taper" in 2015, and four years tapering off the last 1 mg thanks to SA and the Brassmonkey slide, I AM COMPLETELY FREE OF PAXIL! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! Forever. 2021: Began conservative, proper, CNS-respecting taper of Zoloft, led by the only expert on me -- me. Making own liquid. 5-10% plus holds. 2022: Holding on Zoloft for now. Current dose 47 mg. Hanging in, hanging on. Severe protracted PAWS, windows and waves. While I may not be doing "a lot" by outside standards, things are graaaaadually getting better. Yoga (gentle to medium); walks; daily breath practice; nutrition, fruits/veg; nature; water; EastEnders (lol); practicing self-compassion, self-care; boundaries; connection; allowing feelings; t r u s t ing that I, too, will heal. (--> may need to be reminded of this.) "You are not alone, and this is not the end of your story." - Baylissa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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