LostInCanada: Need help and direction to taper off Paroxetine

[Chompoo]

@LostInCanada so sorry about the shakes, constant wake-ups and light sleep. They're so delibitating aren't they? When I'm in a wave, nothing improves my sleep and I just have to suffer through them. I hope your wave passes soon and gives you a higher baseline afterwards.

[AmitV]

36 minutes ago, LostInCanada said:

@AmitV the weird thing is I can usually fall back to sleep quickly it is just the constant waking. I never get deep into rem...just wherever 90 minutes takes me. I had tried oxazepam years ago not knowing it was a benzo and zopiclone 7.5 mg and it didn't help at all. This sleeping crazy all started when the pharmacy gave me sertaline instead of paroxetine and I never noticed in 2016. I only realized this going through medical receipts this year.

I understand. Are you sure you’re ready to taper? I mean I feel you’re trying to get all the withdrawals over with at once. Perhaps a little more consultation with the mods may be helpful.

 

Unfortunately, some of these meds from what I’ve read in literatures do “poop out”. They just stop working and it’s possible the reinstatement didn’t do anything but just make withdrawals worse. But still I would consult the mods.

[LostInCanada]

@AmitV the reinstatement saved my life. I was suicidal, dp/ dr, constant dry wrenching and on and on before it. The CT was the worst thing ever experienced. I am so much more stable now. Having a cortisol rush in the morning is candy compared to CT before reinstatement. I don't understand what you mean by trying to get all my withdrawals over with at once. I am trying to figure out my withdrawal normal if that is what you are talking about. Reinstatement doesn't mean you will feel perfect. Withdrawal normal is when you are stable enough without any huge swings, it has been described as not great but not bad, more or less blah.

[AmitV]

11 minutes ago, LostInCanada said:

@AmitV the reinstatement saved my life. I was suicidal, dp/ dr, constant dry wrenching and on and on before it. The CT was the worst thing ever experienced. I am so much more stable now. Having a cortisol rush in the morning is candy compared to CT before reinstatement. I don't understand what you mean by trying to get all my withdrawals over with at once. I am trying to figure out my withdrawal normal if that is what you are talking about. Reinstatement doesn't mean you will feel perfect. Withdrawal normal is when you are stable enough without any huge swings, it has been described as not great but not bad, more or less blah.

fair enough. I meant if you wanted to just get it done with seeing that it’s been several months of withdrawals already. But I understand better now.

[AmitV]

Also did your balance issues get better eventually?

[LostInCanada]

@AmitVthey pop in to visit when they feel like it but yes it isn’t constant anymore. That’s the thing about this process, you can only eat healthy, maintain a good routine, accept and try to be positive because you never know what’s around the corner.

[AmitV]

22 minutes ago, LostInCanada said:

@AmitVthey pop in to visit when they feel like it but yes it isn’t constant anymore. That’s the thing about this process, you can only eat healthy, maintain a good routine, accept and try to be positive because you never know what’s around the corner.

 

That's wonderful. I've been living with it 24/7.

[LostInCanada]

@AmitVbut you are at a peak 3 month point. Hopefully some relief like gorgeous window is near. When the window comes bask in it, don’t think you have to make up for lost time because it will shorten the window. Just let your body and brain relish it.

[AmitV]

31 minutes ago, LostInCanada said:

@AmitVbut you are at a peak 3 month point. Hopefully some relief like gorgeous window is near. When the window comes bask in it, don’t think you have to make up for lost time because it will shorten the window. Just let your body and brain relish it.

I can’t wait to see this window. Did you ever have this imbalance 24/7, or did it just come and go?

[LostInCanada]

@AmitV I did have some days 24/7 and like you just laid in bed not moving. Couldn't do anything. Your withdrawal is normal and you just need time. It will change with time and you will heal. We all experience pretty similar things, just wherever the body has a weakness for each individual seems to be the worst symptoms. Mine is definitely my gut.

[SertralineIssues29]

Hey @LostInCanada just wanted to pop in and make sure your doing ok

Been thinking of you and the support you've shown me. I wrote a decent paragraph on my page but I've now hit a wave so I'm currently riding that out. 

Would love to hear from you sometime 

 

Trai xx 

[LostInCanada]

@SertralineIssues29hey Trai, I came through a pretty long window and now am in a bit of a wave. Just feeling overwhelmed by it all. But this to will pass for us both. Acceptance and patience. We will get that window again. 👍 Minute by minute as always.

[Chompoo]

@LostInCanada praying fo better times 🙏

[LostInCanada]

Since the 18th, I started with the early morning shakes again. The 19th was nausea and crying. Still riding this wave with these symptoms. Sleeping is still a constant issue. Burning feet has been lessening. Blood test showed low B12. Will taking a dessicated liver supplement be a better choice than a B12/folate vitamin?

I am still seeing improvement from my reinstatement despite the waves so I guess I should still hold before tapering. It looks like my CNS is still destabilized. It is so hard being patient when you just want off this drug.

 

[RachelSusan]

@LostInCanadaI am very sorry to read that you are suffering. These waves are heartbreaking after having a window. We think we are doing well and then out of nowhere it hits us.  This has happened to me quite a few times.  The agony of it. I hope you see a window soon

 

 

[SertralineIssues29]

47 minutes ago, LostInCanada said:

Since the 18th, I started with the early morning shakes again. The 19th was nausea and crying. Still riding this wave with these symptoms. Sleeping is still a constant issue. Burning feet has been lessening. Blood test showed low B12. Will taking a dessicated liver supplement be a better choice than a B12/folate vitamin?

I am still seeing improvement from my reinstatement despite the waves so I guess I should still hold before tapering. It looks like my CNS is still destabilized. It is so hard being patient when you just want off this drug.

 

I think your doing great, low b12 can be annoying although I have found fortified cereal to be a great start to each day if you can handle gluten. 

 

Your have so much patience staying there but I think you made the right choice, any of us cold turkey peeps would probably say the same thing

 

Keep fighting and being as strong as you can, like you said a window will come eventually xx

[LostInCanada]

@SertralineIssues29 since this crazy I have developed an allergy to oats which is added to so many cereals now. I have been eating an organic corn flakes sweetened with honey but it is not fortified. Maybe time to find a new cereal that I can tolerate. I just get nauseated so easily as well. Good suggestion.👍

[Emonda]

5 hours ago, LostInCanada said:

I am still seeing improvement from my reinstatement

 

Hey @LostInCanada, I know you've been doing it tough with the waves, but this is cause for celebration!

 

 

5 hours ago, LostInCanada said:

I guess I should still hold before tapering

 

Holding a while yet sounds prudent to me. Time and patience remain your friends....you've been very patient and positive....keep going.

 

You'll be peaking through a window down the track, and I look forward to reading that update.

 

Wishing you well.

[Chompoo]

@LostInCanada so sorry you are suffering. It's good that you can still be positive about the improvements you're seeing from the reinstatement. I hope your central nervous system stabilises soon. It's such a long and hard journey, isn't it? Sending healing vibes.

[Vonnegutjunky]

@LostInCanada I had a “Holy Sh&*” moment thanks to your thread here and @Go2zero Paxil chart - after 7 YEARS! 
 

It would take days to read through my intro thread - so I will summarize here - 

 

I was on Paxil for 8 years for PPD -20mg for the first 4 years and 10mg for the last  4 - my symptoms since I was child were always ocd and anxiety - 

 

Decided in 2015 I wanted to taper - I got down to 5mg every other day over the course of 5 mos- things got bad in dec 2015  - doc said - “your symptoms are returning go back on” - 

 

so I go back on 10mg Jan 2016 - I wait until may 2016 and I have very little improvement - so may 2016 she says - “most women going through menopause need an ssri” (I was 40 going thru menopause, I fully blame the Paxil for this) 

 

the day after I took 20mg my cns exploded - fried - I was in a whole new level of hell. 
 

I of course waited to try to stabilize - I couldn’t figure out why…. Why am I not getting better? And of course becuase of what the med did to me (side effect adverse reaction) I was not willing to touch another drug- I was stuck in fear waiting to stabilize with all of these horrid symptoms - 

 

I waited until sept 2016 and decided (with the help of this site) to start tapering - 

 

I would taper a bit and feel a little bit better - but still I was not stabilizing- - I was holding my tapers for 5-10 mos at a time- I got down to 10mg and held for a year - still I did not stabilize - I went down to 9mg and held for a year thinking - it has to be mostly out of my system - why am I not stabilizing??? 
 

I recently went down to 8mg (that’s 8mg off a 10 mg tablet that weighs 12.5, I’m down to almost half the pill) 

 

I have been doing great but having bad hyper vigilance and sensory issues and waves are bad- so I’m reading your thread and see the Paxil chart and I’m like wtf?! 
 

no wonder!!!! I’m still on too much of the med! The med works too good! It’s keeping my cns sensitized and blocking all of my receptors! Or whatever it does - it’s keeping me in this state of sensitization!

 

so I know I need to keep tapering - I goes toy thought more of the drug in my system was gone and I was just a person who “needed meds” after 7years of struggling with this- I probably should have been tapering quicker - but I was so so so afraid of getting bad again - that adverse reaction absolutely traumatized me - now I am fearful and often feel stuck - 

 

until today- I feel a bit more hopeful now and I feel it makes sense - the drug was causing this all along- not necessarily wd - 

 

 

[LostInCanada]

@Vonnegutjunkythank you for writing me. I am so afraid of getting worse... nothing like CT to give a person PTSD. I've been reading some getting lower on their tapers and feeling better. I pray that will be us. ☀️❤️🌻

[LostInCanada]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m001n39z

[Shep]

18 hours ago, LostInCanada said:

Since the 18th, I started with the early morning shakes again. The 19th was nausea and crying. Still riding this wave with these symptoms. Sleeping is still a constant issue. Burning feet has been lessening. Blood test showed low B12. Will taking a dessicated liver supplement be a better choice than a B12/folate vitamin?

 

@LostInCanada Are you a vegetarian? If not, are you eating enough red meat? Are you able to bring some beef liver into your diet? I get organ meats at my local farmers' market, but I know that's not an option everywhere. There are some good brands of desiccated liver supplements, but if supplements have been causing problems for you, you may want to look into adding certain foods into your diet. 

[LostInCanada]

@Shep I was vegetarian before the cold turkey...after that I craved meat. Since WD my blood work has shown B12 slowly going down (3 tests 3 months apart). I eat beef 1-2 times a week, eggs, yogurt, milk everyday. Fortified bread every day. Because of nausea, the smell of organ meat cooking and pork is a no go. Any recommendations for a good supplement, I would hope dessicated liver would be easier to take than a B vitamin since it is more like eating a food? Still I would start small. Thanks so much.

[Comecloser80]

3 hours ago, LostInCanada said:

@Shep I was vegetarian before the cold turkey...after that I craved meat. Since WD my blood work has shown B12 slowly going down (3 tests 3 months apart). I eat beef 1-2 times a week, eggs, yogurt, milk everyday. Fortified bread every day. Because of nausea, the smell of organ meat cooking and pork is a no go. Any recommendations for a good supplement, I would hope dessicated liver would be easier to take than a B vitamin since it is more like eating a food? Still I would start small. Thanks so much.

Hi @LostInCanada Just a heads up, see if you can find Vegemite(Australian) in supermarkets in Canada. You might not like the taste at the beginning but you will get use to it in few days.

I had never tried them before WD but nowadays, I eat one toast everyday. It’s a very good source of B vitamins.

 

 

[LostInCanada]

@Puraethanks for the suggestion. I don't think we can get it here but that led me to nutritional yeast, a great alternative. 👍

[Comecloser80]

5 minutes ago, LostInCanada said:

@Puraethanks for the suggestion. I don't think we can get it here but that led me to nutritional yeast, a great alternative. 👍

https://www.greataussiefood.com/collections/vegemite
 

See if it’s available online.

[LostInCanada]

@Purae I was under the impression it wasn't allowed here but it is available through Amazon.ca. lolol mixed reviews on the taste.

[AmitV]

B-12 deficiency may be a significant contributor to your present state including memory, cognitive function, balance and coordination. It would be beneficial to find a strong source of natural supplementation. There is a significant relationship between B-12 and natural serotonin production in the body.

[LostInCanada]

@AmitVthanks…the nutritional yeast is packed with most of the B’s and I love the taste…kind of salty cheesy. I hope it does the trick. I am not in the deficient range but have been steadily getting lower so the next blood test in a few months should let me know if this is a good idea. How have you been… I was thinking about you today. 

[AmitV]

5 minutes ago, LostInCanada said:

@AmitVthanks…the nutritional yeast is packed with most of the B’s and I love the taste…kind of salty cheesy. I hope it does the trick. I am not in the deficient range but have been steadily getting lower so the next blood test in a few months should let me know if this is a good idea. How have you been… I was thinking about you today. 

thank you for thinking of me. I actually had a fairly good weekend. Albeit with side to side head movement vision lag and feeling of walking on clouds. But it was a good change. My wife was surprised how I managed to do what I did over the weekend. Must be a window. It’s not symptom free by any means, but it truly lifted a very thick layer of  fog off my mind. 

[AmitV]

On 6/26/2023 at 9:44 PM, AmitV said:

thank you for thinking of me. I actually had a fairly good weekend. Albeit with side to side head movement vision lag and feeling of walking on clouds. But it was a good change. My wife was surprised how I managed to do what I did over the weekend. Must be a window. It’s not symptom free by any means, but it truly lifted a very thick layer of  fog off my mind. 

and back to brain fog and fatigue. Not as bad as before though. The reasoning symptoms still persist. I believe the inner ear thing for me is a separate issue, although I did talk to a guy on reddit who had the same inner ear issue, vision lag, etc. coming off from SSRI. He said it resolved after a year. 

[LostInCanada]

@AmitV the intensity should lessen and the waves hopefully will get shorter. Just keep being kind to yourself... don't overdo it. 👍

[Emonda]

Hey @LostInCanada,

Thanks for dropping over and saying hi.

 

I always enjoy reading your posts here and on other introductions. You are super proactive and encouraging of many on this site. Thank you 👍

 

Where are you sitting at the moment on the spectrum of Wave to Window?

 

Is hubby still taking good care of you?

 

On 6/23/2023 at 8:59 AM, LostInCanada said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m001n39z

 

I'd love to watch this, but it seems to be blocked in AUS.

 

 

On 6/24/2023 at 5:54 AM, LostInCanada said:

lolol mixed reviews on the taste.

 

Vegemite....mixed reviews on the taste is a very polite description, in my view. My kids and wife love it, but the smell...it's not for me.

 

Take care of yourself, and keep fighting. We are going to beat these ADs 🙂. Time and patience.

[LostInCanada]

53 minutes ago, Emonda said:

 

Where are you sitting at the moment on the spectrum of Wave to Window?

 

Is hubby still taking good care of you?

I kind of had a mini wave, still not through it but feeling a bit better. I seem to be cycling through them every week or so. Hubby is still my biggest cheerleader lol. 

Search Panorama on here...I put a link for the transcript and someone posted this and it is still up.

https://rumble.com/v2wlt7g-the-antidepressant-story-bbc-panorama-documentary.html

I did a wee little dosage cut...1.5% to test the waters. How will I know the difference between a wave or withdrawal? That is my quandary now lol. I just hope I am stable enough to keep going. Guess time will tell.

Thanks @Emonda

 

[Emonda]

7 hours ago, LostInCanada said:

Hubby is still my biggest cheerleader lol

 

Great to have your own personal cheerleader 😜 We both seem to be blessed in that area.

 

7 hours ago, LostInCanada said:

kind of had a mini wave, still not through it but feeling a bit better.

 

No one likes waves, but the fact that you describe them as 'mini waves' is more positive than the alternative.

 

7 hours ago, LostInCanada said:

I did a wee little dosage cut...1.5% to test the waters. How will I know the difference between a wave or withdrawal?

 

Well done on taking the step and making a small reduction. How long ago did you do that? How are you feeling after the reduction? How long will you hold at -1.5% before considering the next steps? There is no rush as you know.  

 

Wave versus withdrawal = a good question. I've always asked myself about relapse versus withdrawal. I'd love to hear the thoughts of others on this.

 

For me, withdrawal is distinguished by increased dizziness and other symptoms a few days after the reduction, which abates within a week (not completely). Waves seem to hit me harder and linger longer.

 

Thanks for the updated link to the movie / transcript. I'll take a look tonight.

 

Wishing you well.