Tranqdart: Mary’s Intro

[Tranqdart]

4 hours ago, Altostrata said:

Well done. The serotonin hypothesis has been disproven, it's not even a theory, it's a discarded nothingburger.

Fixed!

[Tranqdart]

2 hours ago, JanLexapro10mg said:

Mary my story is much like yours.  I wanted yonder how you are doing?  Do you have severe morning anxiety.

Hello @JanLexapro10mg, in spite of a lot of real-world stress in my life right now, my symptoms have improved a lot over the past two weeks. Morning anxiety had been very bad prior to that. So ,in the context of my history , I started a too-fast taper in 11/21, last .25 mg dose in 8/22, withdrawal symptoms showed up about 9/22, some easing of certain symptoms 3/23, including the morning anxiety. It had been my most challenging symptom. 

 

here is what helped me: 225mg magnesium at bedtime, consistent bedtime and wake time, no food 3 hrs prior to bedtime, no electronics or reading in bed, 1-2 mg topical melatonin either at bedtime or if I woke in the middle of the night.  I also started listening to light fiction as I slept to distract myself from anxious thoughts (Ladies’ detective agency, Alexander McCall smith… may not be your thing but if you want to try it, make sure the fiction and the narrator are super soothing to you ). Earlier, I used earplugs to block sound. I continue to use a sleep mask or watch cap for total darkness. I also kept a heating pad nearby and held onto it when I had that rush of cortisol in my chest and gut. I watched YouTube’s Therapy in a nutshell for tips on how to manage anxiety including certain breathing techniques. Lmk if you want my help finding that. I budgeted a lot of time for rest to compensate for the wakefulness 

 

im in my 60s so some wakefulness is to be expected. It helps a lot to separate what’s true — I’m in my lovely cozy bed comfy and safe — from what my neuro emotions are telling me. I recall noticing once that the thought that triggered my anxiety was realizing I needed to clean out my purse! — sick as I was, I recognized my response was excessive for that thought.

 

stiil struggling not to be depressed about feeling depressed, nor anxious about being anxious. 
 

I hope this helps and follow up if and whenever you like. Have a good night.

Mary. 

Edited April 6, 2023 by Tranqdart
Sent too soon

[JanLexapro10mg]

@TranqdartIm glad you are improving. I keep celebrating little improvements.

[Tranqdart]

250 days since my last tiny dose of Escitalopram. It's day after day of sadness and anxiety; a combination of neuro emotions and really challenging real-life circumstances related to family and money.

 

Feeling very alone with my symptoms and just getting through every day. If my mood is flat, I'm lucky. Mostly it's misery. Joy seems unattainable; I wonder if I'll ever know joy again.

 

After ~20 years of SSRI use, can anyone give me any idea how much longer this will go on?

[Onmyway]

@Tranqdart

Do you have a deficiency in either the B vitamins or the D? They tend to make withdrawal symptoms worse.  

Stopping them might give you some relief. 

 

Omw 

[Tranqdart]

3 hours ago, Onmyway said:

@Tranqdart

Do you have a deficiency in either the B vitamins or the D? They tend to make withdrawal symptoms worse.  

Stopping them might give you some relief. 

 

Omw 

I supplement with b6, b12, and D. I’ll try increasing those to see if it helps. Thanks 

[Onmyway]

@Tranqdart, these vitamins make withdrawal worse for many people. You are welcome to supplement but if you don't have a deficiency, your best bet is to stop  taking them. 

 

OMW

[Tranqdart]

26 minutes ago, Onmyway said:

@Tranqdart, these vitamins make withdrawal worse for many people. You are welcome to supplement but if you don't have a deficiency, your best bet is to stop  taking them. 

 

OMW

On my way, I’m so glad you wrote back! I completely misread your prior reply. I’ll experiment with taking less of the B and D.

[Onmyway]

@Tranqdart, 

that's good because I was confused by your response 

Many people recommend them for improving nervous system issues but if you don't have a deficiency (which can be measured by your doctor), you should not take supplements. You can stop them without tapering generally. 

 

Note that chocolate has a lot of caffeine so if caffeine bothers you (it doesn't bother everyone) you might want to stop that as well. Then give yourself a couple of months to recover from the alcohol/supplements/coffee/tea withdrawals as well which can be significant if you were having them more regularly. 

You're on your way to feeling better with all these positive changes! Good job!

OMW

[Tranqdart]

Woke and started to cry. No better than I was last September, a month after my final dose. Noticing old pleasures don't interest me anymore. I need more support than my friends can give me, but I don't want to go for conventional mental health solutions (committing myself?). I don't feel like I can afford therapy. Strong sense that SSRI masked how empty and lonely by life has been all along. It's crazy I wound up back in the Northeast when family is worse than no help, actually hurtful. I have nowhere to turn. Hoping the weeping will calm me. I don't know what to do for myself. Nobody really understands that I'm falling apart and no one can help me.

 

Having a hard (anxious and depressed) day today... yesterday I bought a respirator and goggles so I can start my basement mold cleanup, so I'm face-to-face with the next step and can't seem to think my way past it. I've been reading about mold and now I'm very freaked out about it being all through the HVAC system and under the Pergo in the basement. Still coughing 2 weeks after recovering from bronchitis. Worried about mold allergy symptoms, which can include fatigue and cognitive problems. But there is nowhere else for me to stay. There is so much more I'm supposed to be doing for this house but I don't have the energy, the will, the discipline... there is shame attached to not doing, and there is shame attached to not having enough money to get someone else to do it. It's getting hard to think that I'll ever enjoy my life again.

[Tranqdart]

I've been very distressed the past several days. I'm going to add matcha to my daily routine and see if it helps.

 

I wonder if anyone can comment on their experiences recovering from very long use of antidepressants? Maybe it's too soon to be this impatient, but it's hard to go on feeling this way every day and not know when I might get some relief.

 

I'm 259 days since my last microdose and withdrawal symptoms remain very intense and uncomfortable. Probably compounded by a meager support network and loneliness. (On drugs, I was content to be this lonely.)

[Tranqdart]

Today I saw a new psychologist. She was asking: isn't this just relapse? What does your doctor say? I told her that her understanding the difference between withdrawal and relapse was really important to me, and she agreed to read some links I'd send her.  I explained that medical doctors are as ignorant about withdrawal as the general public.

 

Is it worth it to try to educate this shrink about SSRI withdrawal? I live in the country and shrinks who take my insurance are hard to find. I think I'm too fragile to work hard as in conventional therapy, but I have so little other support for my recovery. We ended the session with her saying she was open to learning more, but still undecided about what's really going on with me. Over the course of another couple of sessions, we agreed, we'd decide if we could work together. Already I feel like having to start the search again will be devastating to me. Also, she's a lot younger than I am... does that matter?

 

It's entirely possible that I'm BOTH in withdrawal AND relapsing. Anxiety sensations in chest and gut are physically painful most of the day. I'm crying several times a day. I've changed my lifestyle to support my health, but I don't feel any better than I did nine months ago, when withdrawal symptoms first showed up.

 

Since my last dose last August, I feel like the mask has come off: the life I've been living is too empty, lonely, unfulfilling. I'm doing everything I can to address it and it's exhausting me. But I don't want to go back on SSRIs. I'm nearly 64 and I just want a few good years feeling like my authentic self, if I can get there.

[Onmyway]

On 4/18/2023 at 6:26 PM, Tranqdart said:

Woke and started to cry. No better than I was last September, a month after my final dose. Noticing old pleasures don't interest me anymore. I need more support than my friends can give me, but I don't want to go for conventional mental health solutions (committing myself?). I don't feel like I can afford therapy. Strong sense that SSRI masked how empty and lonely by life has been all along. It's crazy I wound up back in the Northeast when family is worse than no help, actually hurtful. I have nowhere to turn. Hoping the weeping will calm me. I don't know what to do for myself. Nobody really understands that I'm falling apart and no one can help me.

 

Having a hard (anxious and depressed) day today... yesterday I bought a respirator and goggles so I can start my basement mold cleanup, so I'm face-to-face with the next step and can't seem to think my way past it. I've been reading about mold and now I'm very freaked out about it being all through the HVAC system and under the Pergo in the basement. Still coughing 2 weeks after recovering from bronchitis. Worried about mold allergy symptoms, which can include fatigue and cognitive problems. But there is nowhere else for me to stay. There is so much more I'm supposed to be doing for this house but I don't have the energy, the will, the discipline... there is shame attached to not doing, and there is shame attached to not having enough money to get someone else to do it. It's getting hard to think that I'll ever enjoy my life again.

Hi @Tranqdart

I was reading your post (I've been dealing with lots of health issues so didn't get a chance to respond earlier) and it seemed to me that you have dark goggles on.  It's not uncommon during withdrawal for things to seem darker than they are, it's the nature of the beast.  

 

I understand what you mean by family being worse than no family sometimes and I have dealt with mold issues as well - i'm allergic to alternaria and developed asthma from it. How did the mold cleanup go? But it is not unusual to have coughing after bronchitis for weeks after getting better.  My last bout was 6 weeks post getting better. 

 

Withdrawal can take a long time.  

 

Have you looked into CBT? Look for cognitive distortions - may help you refocus your attention.

 

Regarding the psychologist,  you need solutions from her regardless of what she thinks it is that's causing your distress. She can believe what she wants about withdrawal as long as she gives you tools to deal with the difficult feelings.  Don't waste your limited time on convincing her.  She's just one tool in your recovery not the determiner of truth in life.  If she is doing CBT, that would be helpful (ask her).

 

I am sorry you are feeling lonely. It is not an uncommon feeling whether one is in withdrawal or not.  It is something we all feel from time to time being human. Is there a way to get more or different kind of human contact? Have you tried AA or AlAnon or both? 

 

Omw, also a long term SSRI user and not completely off. 

Edited May 27, 2023 by Onmyway

[Tranqdart]

Dear OMW,

 

Thanks for replying, and for working to moderate this forum. I'm sorry to hear about your health problems and I hope you are on the mend. As for me, I've been maintaining a daily log since I began reducing my dose, and my distress is definitely getting worse. Now it's 293 days since my last tiny dose. Anxious, agitated, sad... I wake up from bad nights of broken sleep and start to cry. I promised myself I'd go back on some antidepressant or other if suicidal ideation became a real problem, but I keep thinking maybe I'm just about to start feeling better. A good friend observed that I also have more than my share of real-life sadness and real-life stressors, on top of withdrawal symptoms.

 

I wonder if there is anyone I can talk to who's kicked a 20-year habit and wound up feeling okay again? Is there anyone like that in this forum? Because I think I might need to go back on drugs, even though it feels like a defeat, like I'll never again have an authentic experience of life again, if I do go back on.

 

Thanks for being here. It means a lot.

 

Mary

[Onmyway]

10 hours ago, Tranqdart said:

Dear OMW,

 

Thanks for replying, and for working to moderate this forum. I'm sorry to hear about your health problems and I hope you are on the mend. As for me, I've been maintaining a daily log since I began reducing my dose, and my distress is definitely getting worse. Now it's 293 days since my last tiny dose. Anxious, agitated, sad... I wake up from bad nights of broken sleep and start to cry. I promised myself I'd go back on some antidepressant or other if suicidal ideation became a real problem, but I keep thinking maybe I'm just about to start feeling better. A good friend observed that I also have more than my share of real-life sadness and real-life stressors, on top of withdrawal symptoms.

 

I wonder if there is anyone I can talk to who's kicked a 20-year habit and wound up feeling okay again? Is there anyone like that in this forum? Because I think I might need to go back on drugs, even though it feels like a defeat, like I'll never again have an authentic experience of life again, if I do go back on.

 

Thanks for being here. It means a lot.

 

Mary

Hi @Tranqdart, 

there are plenty of people who were on ADs long term and are feeling great already. I was on them for 19 years and while the last few months have been tough with external stressors I have been generally feeling OK. My first 5 months were absolutely awful where I took things 1 minute/hour/day at a time, then they became awful but bearable and now they are ok most of the time with spikes of awful. I have been been tapering extremely slowly during this time and stopped for months - 4/5 at a time to let my body adapt. The lowest doses are very hard for me and every time it gets bad for months (this time Feb - May) I worry how long it is going to go but sure enough a window comes (and a wave later). It's the ebb and flow of life. If you look closely, you will recognize an hour here, half a day there where things are slightly better, you are optimistic, your sleep is better etc. These are your windows. As time goes on the windows will get bigger and better and the waves fewer and shorter. I didn't have a window for many months in the beginning. But surely they came. They will for you as well. Try to catch them when they come and enjoy them. 

 

The thing about drugs is that they do not actually in clinical trials cure depression or anxiety better than placebo 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4172306/

 

and if you are in such severe withdrawal you are more likely to get kindled. https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/27800-hypersensitivity-and-kindling/

 

 

All you need to do is use your techniques for managing emotional symptoms (Claire Weekes, CBT, distraction) - whatever modality works for you is OK. This forum has a lot of helpful experiences shared over the years. https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/forum/8-symptoms-and-self-care/ Don't use alcohol or other psychoactive drugs/herbs etc. Try magnesium. 

 

Things will get better. If you look really hard you will see that tiny bits of it are already getting better. 

OMW

[manymoretodays]

Hi Mary, @Tranqdart,

11 hours ago, Tranqdart said:

I wonder if there is anyone I can talk to who's kicked a 20-year habit and wound up feeling okay again? Is there anyone like that in this forum? Because I think I might need to go back on drugs, even though it feels like a defeat, like I'll never again have an authentic experience of life again, if I do go back on.

 

Mine was a 28 year drug dependency situation, with many WD's throughout.  I feel okay.........hmmm.........totally okay cumulatively I'd say about 9 or 10 months out of the year now.  At 6 and 1/2 years off many drugs, not just SSRI's.  And I don't worry about SI too much when I have fleeting thoughts that way......I catch it, and change it, and realize quickly that I do have so very much to keep living for and so very many that care about me......family, friends-old and new- and know I wouldn't ever leave that horrible legacy of the big S for those closest to me to struggle with.  And likely so very much left for me to do and give to this world.  Even when I don't know it.  Life is a gift.  I have to make the most of it.  Do I?  At all times?  Heck no!  It's a lot of work this being human and always will be.  I still struggle.  I still seek out more non-drug healing skills and balancers.

 

So.......Yeah, even still it's not all roses all the time  I know I do have to continue to work hard at staying neutral.  I likely toy with the idea of going back on drugs at about the same frequency as perhaps any SI may pass through my thoughts.  And it's hard........I know.........when sometimes it seems like everyone I know and their brother and children take these types of drugs.  The mainstream, as I call it.  I readily admit........I cannot educate them or change them all by myself.  Nor can any of us.  It's not a war in my eyes........I'm happy I was enlightened and happy when I might be able to enlighten someone else if and when that opportunity arises.  Sometimes it does!!!  And that is very cool.  I have to be harm reduction about that too, and stick to what I know, about me and my journey.  I sure don't want anyone ditching their drugs CT after talking to me........and so I learn.......how to make the best out of my experience.  And sometimes can point them to the literature and research, and even to take a look here at site......or show them how to get to know their own medication(s) better and that less is often more, and things like that..........

 

  I may be the sole hold-out in my 12 step group, or AA fellowship......who doesn't....take meds....I just tell them I tried that and do my best not to pill shame them, as I don't expect them to "no pill" shame me either, and that all works out okay.  So many come in, do sobriety, and then get diagnosed and on meds.  I was the exact opposite.   

 

Somewhere recently I read that for folks like me, age and prescribed psych drug history.........it could take 7 years for a full recovery/healing.........and oh no, comparing again and fantasizing on how this upcoming December I'll be fully in the clear........like 100% back to some normal I don't even remember.  Completely okay all the time......me???  Maybe so if okay means acceptance and moving towards the right stuff. 

I am a lot like my old self of age 13 or 14.......in how I sense things.......and so that is both good and bad I guess....... or likely somewhere right in the middle, which is totally fine by me.  Just uncomfortable at times.

 

I still have hopes of further healing, until then Acceptance works great for me too.  As does limiting comparing myself with others and their sometimes perceived better lives or situations, or lack of understanding all of me........the whole me that I am just coming into really knowing and accepting, and loving and nurturing.  I'm a sensitive type......and sometimes so vulnerable as well, not always........sometimes though.  Ever thankful for more time really and getting closer to what ever I am meant to get closer too in this lifetime.  Giving it over sometimes- completely- to my maker and feeling peace that way.  Most do accept me too.  Some know what I am still challenged with.  Some don't and that's okay.  And oh my gosh.......so many have it so much harder than I.......drugs or no drugs.  How can I help them?  Shifting the focus off me and out of me sure helps.

 

Anyway......I've made a ton of progress in healing.  Much more to came I expect.

 

There is also Shep.  You'll find Shep's story in the Success Stories too.  Pretty sure it was more than 20 years and multiple classes of medications(drugs) for them.  Recent updates there too.

 

I don't even go with protracted withdrawal syndrome anymore, as far as how I define my health.  Might be just me.  Iatrogenic damages is sounding too freaky lately too.  I just am these days.  I like my health care people/pros to be aware of my medical/psychobabble history...... and I'm able to elucidate a bit more concisely, what I've been through and any special concerns I have due to that.

 

I sure hope that helps, as you attempt to gain perspective.  I'm hoping to break off totally from the site for at least a few months soon, on my way to doing that anyway........so likely won't be available for much back and forth discussion/talking for a little while.  You can post on my Success Story anytime and eventually I'll attend to it.

 

Love, peace, healing, and growth,  and more quickly than you can imagine.......💜

manymoretodays........

Edited May 29, 2023 by manymoretodays

[Tranqdart]

Yesterday, a friend told me it is breaking her heart to watch me go through withdrawal. It’s getting hard to know whether my symptoms represent withdrawal from SSRI or relapse into anxiety and depression. I do feel I was prone to anxiety and depression before I ever treated myself with an antidepressant. Now, at 64, I feel plagued by plenty of real world sorrows and stresses, and with the anxiety and sadness I’m feeling, I don’t feel strong enough to cope or confront my problems.
 

I’m thinking about going back on medication, even though there was plenty I didn’t like about myself on these drugs. I think psychiatric medication is still in a crude infancy; today’s drugs are blunt instruments. But considering how long post acute withdrawal syndrome can last, my age, and my situation, going back on an SSRI might be my best option. I certainly can’t go on the way I have been. It’s a little over 300 days with no Lexapro at all . I don’t see my withdrawal symptoms improving; I think they’re getting worse. Im armed at how bad I am feeling, and the anxiety is exhausting.

 

I recognize in a form like this, the bias might be toward persevering with abstinence from anti-depressants. I just wonder what guidance, encouragement, or other opinions, people here might have for me.

[Onmyway]

Hi @Tranqdart, 

we would count your withdrawal (or adaptation) from the time you stopped alcohol. Your nervous system has started its road to stability from then. 

 

While I do not believe that these drugs are more effective than placebo from the articles I posted earlier - I have no feelings or judgement about what you decide to do for yourself. You will bear the consequences of whatever action you take. I am worried that you may get kindled and things can get worse and I wish that you had applied the non-drug techniques that we suggest such as those by Claire Weekes especially for anxiety (look her up on YouTube). But in the end it is up to you. We don't often see these drugs working for withdrawal this far out but there are occasional cases where they do. 

 

You can read about different experiences here.

Whatever you decide to do, I hope you get some relief. This journey is very hard and my heart goes out to you. 

 

Here are some more techniques to help you cope with emotional symptoms. 

OMW

[Tranqdart]

7 hours ago, Onmyway said:

Hi @Tranqdart, 

we would count your withdrawal (or adaptation) from the time you stopped alcohol. Your nervous system has started its road to stability from then. 

Would it clarify things to tell you that I didn’t have a problem with alcohol, but only quit three or four drinks a week in an effort to improve neurogenesis?

 

Thank you so much for your considered response. I have looked at both links you shared, and I will save looking up Claire Weekes on YouTube for another day, since it’s 4 o’clock in the morning now and I’ve been up since 230 after going to bed at 11.

 

The discussion about reinstating is truly frightening to me, but so too is continuing the way I have been feeling. I relocated six years ago and I don’t have any intimate friendships nearby. I can’t rely on my family for much emotional support either. I’ve got three or four long-distance friends, who listen supportively over the phone, and that’s it. I started seeing a shrink and I’ll have my fourth session with her the day after tomorrow.
 

When I was a lexapro, I would say retrospectively my behavior and decisions were reckless. That makes it very scary to consider going back on. Soon after relocating here, I bought an expensive house while at the same time  I semi retired from consulting to write freelance. I’ve never managed to build up that business to the point where I’m prospering with it. The house I bought is poorly crafted and I can’t cope with all of the trouble and expense. But I don’t feel like I can cope with moving either… Not just the logistics of getting myself out of here,  but the real estate I can afford here at this point just seems so depressing to me. I don’t love the region where I’m living, but I would have even less support anywhere else I might choose to go. I know these are first world problems.

 

It would make financial sense to take a fresh look at resuming consulting full-time, even though I worry I’m too old and I’ve been away from it too long, and I doubt in my current emotional state I can handle the pressure.

 

 I find I have to act on all of these high stress problems, even as fragile and debilitated as I am feeling, with practically no emotional or practical support. I never sleep through the night. I never make it through the day without breaking down and crying a few times. I’m alone much too much. I don’t know if other people get this, but when I quit anti-depressants, I also lost my faith in God.

 

I’m not sure why I am telling you all of this… Just lonely and miserable and short on sleep, I guess. At the end of my rope with no good options.

[Onmyway]

Dear  Mary, 

the reason we count alcohol is not because we are worried about you being dependent on it but because every time you have a glass it disturbs the fragile balance that your nervous system has achieved and you sort of start again. Maybe not from the beginning but certainly some progress is lost. This is common. Have a look here. This is also true of other psychoactive substances. 

https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/8717-alcohol-including-wine-and-beer/#comment-9075

Also, my reading of the literature is that alcohol, even in low quantities is detrimental to human health and I don't think it supports neurogenesis, quite the opposite - it increases cell death and interferes with a variety of neurotransmitters, hence with recovery from withdrawal. 

 

I understand how difficult it is to not be in a place you like and to which you are connected to. I am struggling with similar issues right now. But those are problems you can solve - perhaps with some compromises. I don't know what that may look like for you but I am sure that there is a solution to your problem. That solution may involve moving to a less preferred area or to building a community where you are or traveling to meet the people who are far away but I am sure that the solution is there. As a consultant people hired you to solve problems and I am sure that you are a great problem solver. I have no doubt that you can solve this problem as well if you put your mind to it. The issue is to move from a problem mindset to a solution mindset even if the solution is temporary. 

What I find for myself is that I often resist facing my frustrations head on and instead get angry about how this is unfair, annoying etc. But when I get over that initial episode (which can go on for months), I find that there are alternative solutions available. I am now trying to buy a house and the area that I really, really, really liked turns out had a lot of industrial activity before and while toxic clean up has been done, I don't think I would be ever comfortable with it - after the SSRI withdrawal fiasco I don't know that I trust authority that much. I spent days being angry about it, trying to look for workarounds, trying to convince myself that this wasn't an issue - basically resisting this new info. But the better option is to mourn what was lost and move on. You may need to mourn the mistake that you made moving there - we ALL make mistakes because we are not omniscient and we can't know ahead of time how things are going to turn out. We are human. We need to forgive ourselves, learn what we can and then continue knowing that we WILL make more mistakes, it's inevitable. Each one will be a problem that needs to be solved and when the time comes we will solve these problems. And once that mourning is faced and done you will solve this issue in a manner that is satisfactory to you - be it starting work again, be it building a community, be it working with a psychologist. 

 

For me, when I think about it, there are other areas that I can learn to love. I have had to rebuild in new places multiple times - moved continents twice and lived for longer than a year in 4 different countries with different languages. Rebuilding a new life is not easy and does take time. But it is also exciting. I know withdrawal puts grey/dark tinted glasses on our eyes so it is harder to see these as opportunities rather than challenges. 

 

All this is to say that your problems seem very real and human and not something that is wrong with you that a drug can fix. So starting a new drug is not the solution in this case.  If I knew that reinstatement would make it easier for you to solve these problems without creating new ones I wouldn't hesitate to recommend it. But it has its own issues and may be risky this far out. 

 

There are solutions - I am reading a book called - 90 minutes to a better life which was recommended to me by @Carmie (I highly recommend following her thread as she is someone I greatly admire and who has been a great support to me and others). The book talks about not avoiding feelings as painful as they may seem and I find myself doing that often. I feel like from your description you are in the same boat. It may help. 

 

Please have a look at the various resources @Tranqdart, I am sure that you can find a good way forward. If it involves a trial of reinstatement, please do it carefully and at a very low dose - I would recommend - 0.25mg of escitalopram as a way to wet your feet and see if there is a reaction. But I would give the non-drug techniques a try first. 

OMW

 

[Tranqdart]

On 6/12/2023 at 1:01 PM, Onmyway said:

Dear  Mary, 

the reason we count alcohol is not because we are worried about you being dependent on it but because every time you have a glass it disturbs the fragile balance that your nervous system has achieved and you sort of start again. Maybe not from the beginning but certainly some progress is lost. This is common. Have a look here. This is also true of other psychoactive substances. 

https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/8717-alcohol-including-wine-and-beer/#comment-9075

Also, my reading of the literature is that alcohol, even in low quantities is detrimental to human health and I don't think it supports neurogenesis, quite the opposite - it increases cell death and interferes with a variety of neurotransmitters, hence with recovery from withdrawal. 

Actually, we are in complete agreement, and the reason I quit drinking alcohol, was to support neurogenesis. That is what I meant to say.

 

Along the same lines, I have an MRI coming up in December, and because I am allergic to the contrast dye, I’m going to have to take prednisone, which has been pretty disruptive to my mood in the past. I imagine it would “count“ in the same way that alcohol does in terms of resetting my recovery clock. But I think I’m stuck with it.

 

Thanks, as usual for your considered response. I will look for the book that you mention. I also have on order books by Johann Hari, as well as Claire Weekes.

[Tranqdart]

I have just recovered from a sudden attack of SSRI withdrawal symptoms. That attack came on when I got home from a brief vacation. At this point in my recovery, I want to look back on the attack as a phenomenon to study. Going away was a vacation from all the problems in my life. Visiting with two very generous and attentive hosts, I had constant companionship while I was away. My brief stay was nothing but sun and sand and pleasure-seeking. Witnessing my hosts’ strong and loving partnership had me thinking about how I would’ve liked to have found something like that for myself. I don’t like where I live right now, and coming home wasn’t easy. (I’m also not feeling strong enough just yet to consider changing where I live.)

 

After three intensely miserable days, I started taking charge, calling local friends and distant friends, making plans for this week and for next year, taking on projects, getting to the gym, to the book club , to painting class, and seeing friends. Noticing that after six years living here, I’m running into folks I know when I’m out and finding opportunities to spark and build new friendships.

 

Studying the phenomenon of the attack: the abruptness of its onset, the depth of the despair I was feeling, the emotional liability and crying jags, the suicidal ideation are nothing like the sadness and anxiety I had known as a sensitive person before I ever started taking these medications in 1998. Therefore, the symptoms are nothing like a relapse that some clinicians or pharmaceutical companies might claim. It is very clear to me that these attacks are episodes of emotional illness brought on by having taken Lexapro for so many years, and then withdrawing from it. 

 

… And the trick will be to remember through the worst of these attacks that they’re merely islands in a rising sea of better moods. A year ago what these attacks feel like was my constant state. I persevered. I prevailed. I am prevailing.