Marsha: can I taper off geodon before gabapentin?

[Marsha]

ReadWithdrawal dialogues & encouragement

Waking with panic or anxiety -- managing cortisol spikes

 

You've made so many changes recently, probably it would be best for you to let your nervous system settle down. Keep everything steady for a good while, maybe months. Please stop fixating on getting off all the drugs, you need to take care of yourself by being patient.

I read through the links you provided. Thank you. Patience has never been my virtue but now I have no choice but to learn and practice patience. But the choice to stop the geodon was nneeded because of tardive dyskenisia. At the dentist today my jaw was flopping around so much they had to put a block in my mouth to keep it still. Dr Breggin said to contact him after I have been off the geodon for a few months to decide what to do about it. Perhaps legal action may need to be taken. In the meantime I will concentrate on stabilizing. I'm not sure I should be trying all those supplements mentioned to reduce cortisol. I am taking omega 3 fish oil and the lactium for now. Should I risk experimenting with vitamin c sephiros, dhea (I am allergic to aspirin and nsaids but I can take tylenol in small doses. Do you have any recommendations as regards the above?

[Marsha]

I am pretty sure I had a disc go out in my low back. I am calling the doctor tomorrow. I don't know what to expect. My husband has a degenerative back and receives steroid injections for the pain. I certainly can't take any other drugs. I am still trying to stabilize after stopping geodon. I really didn't need this to happen at this time. Very poor timing.

[Marsha]

I just want my life back. I just want my life back. I know I will get my life back. I don't want to be a weak angry frustrated person. But this is what I feel. It is so wrong what is being done to us. I have suffered so much for 20 years and it's not over yet. I just have to let it out. These horrible horrible drugs. Left me so unimaginatively disabled. You are the only ones who understand. I just want my life back. Will I recover from the destruction of my life?

[Altostrata]

Have you tried magnesium?

 

Marsha, you are getting your life back already.

 

Please look into physical therapy for your back problem.

[Marsha]

Have you tried magnesium?

 

Marsha, you are getting your life back already.

 

Please look into physical therapy for your back problem.

thank you Altostrata. I am 62 years old with a sensitized nervous system from drugs and withdrawal also tardive dyskenisia though not advanced. I grew up in poverty and have ended up in poverty. My father physically beat me, my great grandfather sexually abused me and my mother drove me into becoming a hypochondriac. I was mentally abused by classmates in school. But I found something to help me let go of everything except the hypochondriac. Was taught to trust doctors implicitly. That's probably why I am in my present state. If I get sick with a serious illness I will die because I won't be able to take any drugs that could save my life or if I get cancer I will die a horrible painful prolonged death. These thoughts i can't get control of. I am going back to my therapist to try to learn to cope with everything. I have magnesium nitrate powder produced by now but I don't know when or how to take it. 1/2teaspoon contains 315 mg. I have read it helps sleep and anxiety and helps compromised nervous systems. Can you help me learn to start taking it? What I read about it in symptoms and self care confused me. My back is better now. I went to my chiropractor and everything eased up. Thank you for your help. I am grateful from the heart.

[Altostrata]

That would be magnesium citrate powder, correct? If I were you, I'd start with 1/4 teaspoon in some cold water, sip it over an hour or so and see how it affects you.

 

Yes, Marsha, you need to work with a therapist to accept your history and stop reliving the emotional pain. Stop thinking about "controlling" it, it's part of you, like a scar, and you need to learn to live with it.

 

Please look into non-drug physical therapy when you have physical pain, such as your back pain, and stop worrying about drug treatment.

[Marsha]

That would be magnesium citrate powder, correct? If I were you, I'd start with 1/4 teaspoon in some cold water, sip it over an hour or so and see how it affects you.

 

Yes, Marsha, you need to work with a therapist to accept your history and stop reliving the emotional pain. Stop thinking about "controlling" it, it's part of you, like a scar, and you need to learn to live with it.

 

Please look into non-drug physical therapy when you have physical pain, such as your back pain, and stop worrying about drug treatment.

yes magnesium citrate. I reread about magnesium citrate and instead of taking 1/4teaspoon or 150 mgs. I took 25 mgs and drank it pretty quickly. I was completely relaxed all day. Then at 3:00 pm I took my clonazepam and gabapentin and a half hour later became anxious. Did I have a paradoxical reaction to the medication? My heart rate increased became sweaty. This has not ever happened before. I don't feel well. What could have happened l

[Altostrata]

I don't know. You can't tell anything from one incident. See if it happens again. Please keep daily notes.

[Marsha]

I don't know. You can't tell anything from one incident. See if it happens again. Please keep daily notes.

I don't think I will use the magnesium citrate. After thinking about how I felt all day after taking it, I really actually felt "stoned. " It was not a comfortable feeling. I feel much more alert today. But I talked with one of my sons this morning and his choices in life made me very sad and I felt depressed and cried. After the conversation was over, I recovered and feel better. Certain situations make me feel this way briefly but then I recover quickly. It's very uncomfortable when it happens. It doesn't happen often. Since coming off the geodon my cognitive function and memory have been affected adversely. I know it's a combination of geodon withdrawal and the cumulative effects of the benzodiazepine I have taken for 18 years. How can I help but feel dismayed. My brain is coming alive after 12 years and I am acutely aware of my limitations. I need to be strong and endure these most trying and frustrating times. I wish I could communicate more effectively and interact with people but that part of me that used to be here is gone and I don't know how to get it back. I lack confidence and self esteem. I want to be interacting and engaging people in conversation so desperately. I have been isolated for so long and adversely affected by psychiatric drugs, I have lost the ability to function in society. I am expressing myself the only way I know how. What are some ways I can break out of this isolation? I desperately need to learn how to interact with humans again. I will try to keep an open mind that my therapist will help but I must say I didn't glean much from my sessions with her previously. I seem to get more help from this and other websites instead although I have immense trouble trying to get the courage to engage anyone and join in the conversations. I need guidance in learning what steps to take to relearn how to enter society again even in my compromised state. What an indescribable feeling. It's like I have been in hibernation for an extended period and am just now waking up. Or like being in a coma and waking up and I have to relearn everything all over again. What an incredible journey I am experiencing. Tell me again I am going to recover. I need to convince myself that it will happen. I am doing everything in my power to come back to life.

[Marsha]

With all the terrible things in the news and web about benzodiazepines and ppis it's taking all the willpower I've been able to muster to just hold off tapering them until my nervous system settles down. What a temptation I'm battling. I need all the help I can get.

[Marsha]

Please could someone help me. I have been crying all day. I went to see my therapist yesterday and she didn't understand at all. I had to stop taking geodon an antipsychotic December 19. I developed a very serious condition called tardive dyskenisia which forced me off the drug before I could taper off according to plan. I have been able to deal with the withdrawal symptoms up until today. The impact of the last 20 years of polydrugging has just put me over the edge. I just can't stop crying. Please would someone just make a comment or ask me some questions? There is no reinstating for me. I must be able to see this through. I desperately need some encouraging words.

[Meimeiquest]

Marsha, I think you are doing well for all you have been through. Really, crying all day is okay. I was a mess of every single emotion, especially hot rage, and I went off over eight months, it will settle down...December 19 isn't long ago at all. The fact that it doesn't seem like you are over-activated, apart from insomnia, is really great. Just hold steady.

[Marsha]

Marsha, I think you are doing well for all you have been through. Really, crying all day is okay. I was a mess of every single emotion, especially hot rage, and I went off over eight months, it will settle down...December 19 isn't long ago at all. The fact that it doesn't seem like you are over-activated, apart from insomnia, is really great. Just hold steady.

Thank you meimei so very much for responding so quickly. I can see you understand. That is right no over-activation. Just the tears has taken me off guard and upset the status-quo.

[AliG]

Marsha.      I think you're doing amazingly well . This is a time where everything is changing for you , and like you said your brain is coming alive after 12 years.  That is a huge change , and it will take a while to center yourself , both physically & emotionally.  You might need to gather together some healing strategies, to deal with the lack of confidence and self- esteem , that you're trying to cope with . Please don't feel alone in this , though , as many here including myself are dealing with this as a result of the drugs.  It can take a while to piece your life back together , again. However , it does happen in increments.  Maybe ,not as soon as we would like it to . I think isolation can be a natural response , to the devastating effects of these drugs, and it is a common reaction  shared by many here. You will recover, but it might take a little while. The great thing is that you are waking up & coming out of your " hibernation" . At least, now you know ! Once you are through this, you are free !

 

Have a read of this link . You might pick up some tips , that will help you through this rough patch .

Non-drug techniques to cope with emotional symptoms

 

Hugs, Ali

[Marsha]

Thank you so very much Ali for responding to my call. I have been awake all night with anxiety insomnia and crying. I tried to read the link that you provided but my brain is so scrambled right now that it all looked like gibberish. My main anxiety is that I am still on two drugs that are progressively destroying my brain. It seems like most everyone in my condition is already off drugs. Oh the tears are starting again as I think about these drugs. I am trying not to be overwhelmed. Can you tell me what is one thing I can do right now to just get through this? r

Marsha.      I think you're doing amazingly well . This is a time where everything is changing for you , and like you said your brain is coming alive after 12 years.  That is a huge change , and it will take a while to center yourself , both physically & emotionally.  You might need to gather together some healing strategies, to deal with the lack of confidence and self- esteem , that you're trying to cope with . Please don't feel alone in this , though , as many here including myself are dealing with this as a result of the drugs.  It can take a while to piece your life back together , again. However , it does happen in increments.  Maybe ,not as soon as we would like it to . I think isolation can be a natural response , to the devastating effects of these drugs, and it is a common reaction  shared by many here. You will recover, but it might take a little while. The great thing is that you are waking up & coming out of your " hibernation" . At least, now you know ! Once you are through this, you are free !

 

Have a read of this link . You might pick up some tips , that will help you through this rough patch .

Non-drug techniques to cope with emotional symptoms

 

Hugs, Ali

[AliG]

Marsha.    I understand the anxiety, insomnia and even the crying !  This is probably one of the hardest challenges , you will ever go through. It's tough - no question. I would say that you have to  " dig deep" into your innermost reserves of strength , doing the absolute best you can , knowing that your future health & well being  depends on it. Once you accept that , and also know the truth ( about drugs )  there is no going back !

You have to feel in your heart , that you are doing the " absolute" right thing , for your healing . Once you realize that , there is only resolve to go forward & to get through it , all the while feeling that you are improving your quality of life, forever. You will never have to go through this again !  You will be free.

It is a state of mind .

This way of thinking, helps me get through .

Hugs,

Ali

[Marsha]

AliG:  

Marsha.    I understand the anxiety, insomnia and even the crying !  This is probably one of the hardest challenges , you will ever go through. It's tough - no question. I would say that you have to  " dig deep" into your innermost reserves of strength , doing the absolute best you can , knowing that your future health & well being  depends on it. Once you accept that , and also know the truth ( about drugs )  there is no going back !
You have to feel in your heart , that you are doing the " absolute" right thing , for your healing . Once you realize that , there is only resolve to go forward & to get through it , all the while feeling that you are improving your quality of life, forever. You will never have to go through this again !  You will be free.
It is a state of mind .
This way of thinking, helps me get through .
Hugs,
Ali

 

 

what a storehouse of encouragement you are! So positive and so refreshing to the soul. Yes these tribulations will pass and we will be whole once again.

Edited April 13, 2016 by JanCarol
remove HTML code, clean up quotes

[Marsha]

Update: My horribly compromised brain is really starting to heal from 12 years of antipsychotic drugs. My personality is starting to reemerge. I am still dealing with mild tardive dyskenisia fatigue and fear. But things are settling down after the abrupt discontinuation of the geodon. A few more months and I will resume tapering. First the acid stomach blocker and then I will tackle the klonopin. Ideally I should taper off the gabapentin first because of clearance but the benzodiazepine has been strongly implicated in memory loss so I need to take some years to get off it and hopefully recover my memory before I turn 70 and have to take the written test at DMV to renew my driver license. So all good.

[Marsha]

I will be seeing my doctor on April 29. The same one who grossly abused me but the only doctor who will prescribe the clonazepam. At that time he will want me to start tapering. However I have an appointment with a movement disorders neurologist before. I feel apprehensive. I'm still having sleep disturbances and body aches. I really don't want to keep going to this doctor who abused me. It seems to have come down to the fact that I am going to have to start tapering the clonazepam. He is going to let me taper the prevacid first thankfully. So I see him every three months so I could possibly delay having to start tapering clonazepam until the end of July. That will be seven months off geodon. I pray I will be more stable by that time. Honestly, I don't think I can convince him to let me have more time. And this is the man who just two years ago was prescribing 6-8 mgs of clonazepam and also told my husband he would have to keep taking xanax for the rest of his life. My husband was able to go from 2 mgs of xanax per day to in two days go to 25 mgs of librium per day and was down to 5 mgs in just five months. He experienced just minor withdrawal symptoms. Anyway, if anyone has anything to add to what I have been discussing or has any suggestions or anything to add please by all means do so. My history and situation are complex.

[AliG]

Marsha .  Can you not find , a new doctor ?        There is no way I would set foot in a doctor's office , who had abused me in any way .  Even , without abuse , I'm wary and only go if I absolutely have to .

[Marsha]

Marsha .  Can you not find , a new doctor ?        There is no way I would set foot in a doctor's office , who had abused me in any way .  Even , without abuse , I'm wary and only go if I absolutely have to .

I am disabled because no doctors or nurse practitioners would help me 15 years ago when I begged for an answer to my memory loss. It was the benzos. Instead I was sent to this doctor a psychiatrist. I was also having an adverse reaction to zoloft. I was in a bad way and didn't know at that time it was the drugs. Anyway, abuse aside, there simply no other doctors who will prescribe clonazepam. It's getting to be scary now that doctors are reluctant to prescribe benzos. I fear the state I will be in if I have to taper when not stable. The reason I am going to this doctor is that I have the upper hand in that I know he will not give me any antipsychotics or any other drug because I have grounds for legal action against him and he knows it. In fact I am going to make him undiagnose me. I just need time to relatively stabilize before beginning another taper. But I will taper if I have no choice.

[AliG]

Marsha.  It sounds like you are in control , of the situation .  That is the main thing .         Just remember , that you are only using him for your own purposes.  You have a plan , and hopefully you can stick to it !   He is only there , to write up your scripts .   He works for you . Try , not to forget that !

Ali

[Shep]

Hi, Marsha.

 

Thank you for posting on my Intro. I left you a message with a link to a video that helped me out a lot when I was fearing this is permanent brain damage. I'm going to place it here on your own Intro just to make sure you see it. It's really important to know this isn't permanent and that you're going to be okay.

 

 

Dr Norman Doidge , The Brain That Changes Itself  

 

I hope this helps. 

[Marsha]

I am not in a very good place right now. I am not completely recovered from c/t 40 mgs geodon due to tardive dyskenisia. My doctor is going to let me taper off the prevacid before the clonazepam but he going to make me start the taper in may. I have no other doctor I can go to who will prescribe the clonazepam. It's just so frustrating. I am going to have to taper while still experiencing withdrawal symptoms from the geodon. I have no other place to go. He will not make me take any other drugs and I will probably be able to taper at my own discretion. For years I voiced my concerns about the drugs side effects to many doctors only to fall on deaf ears. I had to do what I had to do to get off the geodon mostly because of tardive dyskenisia but also i knew it was only a matter of time before I would be forced to withdraw from clonazepam. That time has come. I would like to ask for some help as to how to deal with this ominous situation. May will only be five months off of geodon. Is there anyone here that has faced a situation like this? I'm trying not to scare the bejeebers out of myself but this is indeed uncharted territory for me. What am I going to do? Would someone please help?

[Shep]

Hi, Marsha. I know you're scared and struggling, but you're doing amazingly well after coming off the number of drugs you've taken over the years. And yes, the clonazepam is not easy to come off of. I came off of benzos and a lot of other drugs after 30 years use, so I hear you. I also voiced concerns over my medication, but I was told that these drugs were necessary for bipolar disorder and my side effects were attributed to a worsening of the condition. This, of course, was a lie. I am so much better off meds. Still struggling, but definitely healing. 

 

Have you read through this thread on coming off of PPI's like Prevacid? 

 

Tips for tapering off stomach acid blockers or PPIs...

 

Since these types of stomach meds can cause all sorts of problems like vitamin B12 deficiency, some of your issues with memory problems and depression may be helped by slowly tapering off. And that link also has links to non-medication ways of handling your stomach problems. 

 

I made some changes in my diet because of the GI problems I had when I came off my last medication, Seroquel, an antipsychotic. And these changes really helped, like no caffeine, limited sugar and carbs, and at times, I had to eliminate dairy. I also drink peppermint and ginger tea for nausea. Your diet will be different, but know that there are ways of handling stomach problems without meds.

 

I hope you can find another doctor for your clonazepam taper so you can have a slow and safe taper. With your history, if you can do a micro taper, that would be the easiest on your already fragile CNS. 

 

In the meantime, take care of yourself. 

[Marsha]

I spent most of the day in the er. Had jelly legs when I woke up and was dizzy and shaky and extremely weak. Had an excellent doc who checked my tardive dyskenisia thoroughly. My pulse was 43 to 50. After the usual tests she said I was ok because my blood pressure was normal. Apparently I have sinus bradycardia but am not symptomatic but was told to have my np keep an eye on it. She agreed with me all the symptoms I had written down were due to geodon withdrawal. I was an athlete before drugs and my pulse has always been below 60 bpm. Never in the forties. Anyone else have sinus bradycardia?

Edited April 22, 2016 by Petunia
post moved from symptoms forum

[Marsha]

Marsha, I think you are doing well for all you have been through. Really, crying all day is okay. I was a mess of every single emotion, especially hot rage, and I went off over eight months, it will settle down...December 19 isn't long ago at all. The fact that it doesn't seem like you are over-activated, apart from insomnia, is really great. Just hold steady.

hi meimei. I am planning on starting a taper of prevacid sometime in may. 6% at a time. Is this too soon? I just don't know. Everyone says listen to your body but I don't understand what that means. I can't wait for two years like alexjuice and lexicon did. What do I need to feel like to begin tapering again? I'm under pressure also to taper the clonazepam but my doctor has agreed to let me get off the prevacid first. I'm trying to milk that for as long as I can. Do you have any questions or anything I can draw from your experience?

[Meimeiquest]

I think a Prevacid taper would be a great idea. It may need to be done as part of an overall gut health enhancement which would probably make these last tapers much easier. I am working on gut health inhancement right now myself before I go in for the "final descent."

[Marsha]

I think a Prevacid taper would be a great idea. It may need to be done as part of an overall gut health enhancement which would probably make these last tapers much easier. I am working on gut health inhancement right now myself before I go in for the "final descent."

My husband and I are on a very limited income and he is on a cardiac diet. I basically didn't eat hardly at all for twelve years but was on so many different drugs and there were drug interactions where I actually gained weight even while eating very little. I am eating the best that I afford now but I know it's not really the right food. Just can't afford to eat the optimum gut health diet. You can't squeeze blood out of a turnip. I know what foods to avoid in coming off a stomach acid blocker which is probably a good thing as far as gut health. What is your diet consist of as an overall gut health enhancement diet? Where do you get your information from?

[Meimeiquest]

I remember that you are doing all this incredible work on like no money, which makes you even more amazing. When my mom went off Nexium, she transitioned from tapering the PPI to taking an acid-blocker like Pepcid or Zantac on an as needed basis, to taking an antacid on an as-needed basis. You maybe could sub baking soda dissolved in warm water for those things.

 

Here is a main gut thread. http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/3413-digestive-problems-nausea-diarrhea-bloating-gerd/page-1

[Fresh]

Hi Marsha , what type of tapering schedule is your doctor proposing for the clonazapam taper?

[Marsha]

Hi Fresh. That's a good question. I actually have no doctor who knows how to properly help me taper off the clonazepam. In fact, I have found only one doctor who will prescribe it. He has agreed to let me wean myself off the stomach acid blocker first and stable or not, I have to begin that taper when I see him again at the end of April. He has recently added to his specialties that he works with addictions, and this the man who had me on 8 mgs of clonazepam just over a year ago. I did read someplace that he gets a lot of clients from the detox centers so maybe he has received some training in benzo tapering. I intend to taper it properly and since I have grounds for legal action against him he has been extremely agreeable to my wishes. It ain't a pretty situation but it's the best that I have been able to come up with. Do you have any input? Thank you for your inquiry.

[Marsha]

Hi Marsha , what type of tapering schedule is your doctor proposing for the clonazapam taper?

Hi Fresh. That's a good question. I actually have no doctor who knows how to properly help me taper off the clonazepam. In fact, I have found only one doctor who will prescribe it. He has agreed to let me wean myself off the stomach acid blocker first and stable or not, I have to begin that taper when I see him again at the end of April. He has recently added to his specialties that he works with addictions, and this the man who had me on 8 mgs of clonazepam just over a year ago. I did read someplace that he gets a lot of clients from the detox centers so maybe he has received some training in benzo tapering. I intend to taper it properly and since I have grounds for legal action against him he has been extremely agreeable to my wishes. It ain't a pretty situation but it's the best that I have been able to come up with. Do you have any input? Thank you for your inquiry.

[Fresh]

Hmm , maybe time for a new doctor?

I was curious about what you wrote on Shep's thread ... I couldn't figure out what it is that you're not allowed

to talk about here.

 

Any clues?

[JanCarol]

Hey Marsha - you have been through so much since I last visited!

 

It sounds like you are getting through it - I know it's hard, but you ****are**** getting through it.

 

I believe that the Prevacid taper is wise.  My stomach acid drug was the first one to go (a consulting pharmacist took me off it.)  I didn't even taper it (I didn't know any better)

 

I use baking soda, TUMS, and DGL (Deglycinated Licorice) to help with tummy upsets.  

 

One of the most healing things for your gut is bone broth.  It's not expensive, and seems (to me) to be so soothing.  It's part of the GAPS protocol diet:  SCD/GAPS/Paleo Diets  but I find the whole GAPS diet to be too restrictive.  When I'm having nausea, diarrhea, tummy trouble, I just do a few days on bone broth (ham was my favorite for taste, I will do lamb next) and took yogurt starter (probiotic), and things settle pretty well.

 

I think you will feel so much better after you get off the prevacid.  These drugs are never checked for long term effects!  http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/2533-that-acid-reflux-pill-may-be-causing-your-health-problems/

 

Also I believe that our tapering protocols for stomach acid drugs are faster:  http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4361-tips-for-tapering-off-stomach-acid-blockers-or-ppis-esomeprazole-lansoprazole-omeprazole

 

How has your hubby's taper been going?  I haven't heard a peep about him since I last visited.

 

I hope you are seeing the light, the improvement, the lifting of load soon.

[Marsha]

Hmm , maybe time for a new doctor?I was curious about what you wrote on Shep's thread ... I couldn't figure out what it is that you're not allowedto talk about here.Any clues?

No worries Fresh. I was just trying to encourage Shep albeit awkwardly.