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Boomer: Olanzapine + Effexor XR + others


Boomer

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I am posting this on behalf of my husband who is quite unwell.  I am in a very vunerable place watching my husband deteriorate so please be kind.  We are in our 60's and have never experienced anything like this.  My husband was administered antidepressants for depression over 30 years ago and has remained on antidepressants all this time.  I cannot recall what they started him on but maybe 8 years ago he was moved to Effexor XR 75mg.  When it was increased to 150mg - we noticed a lack of feeling and low libido. We discussed the idea of coming off the Effexor XR and did this with the aid of high quality supplements - tapering by reducing the beads over a year.  There were horrible side effects - nausea, high anxiety and then the concentration started to be impacted.  After six months of being off the Effexor XR he deteriorated very quickly to the point where he became Psychotic and he couldn't get his brain to think how to get himself into the shower.  It was like his brain had frozen.  He kept saying I am losing it!  Unfortunately he was admitted to the Psychiatric Ward where they administered 10mg Olanzepine and 75mg Effexor XR then increased it up to 150mg.  He was released after three weeks. He was on Olazepine for about three months and the Psychiatrist reduced him off that.  Because he is still not stable the Psychiatrist was not sure whether to increase or reduce his medication. He has gone for the latter and we are administering 112mg every other day at around 10am this is our 3rd day (eg 150mg one day 112mg the next and so on).  I am monitoring him closely and notice that he is so much more responsive in the morning and quite normal, although says he feels really tired. His memory and concentration has been affected.  He has blurred vision.   After his medication is given I notice he begins pacing, not as responsive to talking and becomes quite anxious.  The Psychiatrist says he has had a relapse and has major depression. I don't know who to believe anymore but I just want my husband well again.  Please help?

Edited by scallywag
tags added

Effexor Brand changed over to Enlafax XR sometime during the first three months of 2017.
Reduced to 12.5mg Olanzapine, last reduction 25/4/17  on advice from PDoc to reduce the severe Akathesia, Panick Attacks and other disabling symptoms.  7/4/17 Propronolol @ 40mg  x 3 times per day increasing as required.  160mg Slow Release x 3 times per day for disabling Panic Attacks.   15/5/17 medication mix up, somewhere prior Mirtazapine increased to 60mg per day. PDoc concerned of Seratonin Syndrome reduced to 30mg per day.  21/6/17 Effexor 37.5mg  reduced.  22/8/17 Mirtazapine reduced 15mg. 14/9/17 Developed GERD added 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x1 Ferrous Fumarate, 17/9/17 Propranolol dosage between 320mg to 400mg 3 to 4x per every second day for disabling Panic Attacks.  17/9/17 Current Medication: 12.5mg Olanzapine, 187.5mg Enlafax XR, 15mg Mirtazpine, Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 pd, Propranolol 320mg to 400mg x 3 or 4 x perday. 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x 1 Ferrous Fumarate  29/9/17 Propranolol  Slow Release 160mg x 3pd, Propranolol 120mg x 3 pd = 840mg per day.  9/10/17 Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 per day, Propranolol 80mg x 3 per day = 720mg per day.  Increased 10/9/17 Propranolol 840mg per day. 14/10/17 Reduced Mirtazapine to13.5mg 18/10/17 Removed Mirtazpine 13.5mg  23/10/17 Reducing Propranolol by 10mg every second day down to 400mg per day. 13/12/17 Now at 400mg Propranolol per day - holding.  20/12/17 Reduced Olanzapine by 10% to 11.25mg.  21/1/18: Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg    Reducing Propranolol by 10mg per week.  8/3/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg . 6/4/18 Reduced .625mg Olanzapine. 4/5/18 Reduced .625 Olanzapine  31/5/18 Changed from Propranolol 160 SR to Propranolol 160. 8/6/18 Morning Olanzapine changed to wafer and reduced by .10mg. 15/6/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .10mg per week Current Medication:  8.345mg Olanzapine; 187.50 Enlafax SR;  Propranolol 55mg x 4 per day.  Minimum 30mins exercise per day.  Fortisip x 2 per day. 

6/7/18 Admitted to Hospital with Chronic Aspiration Pneumonia - medications reduced.  8/11/18 Effexor XR 75mg morning and 37.5mg evening, Madopar Rapid 62.5mg x 4 per day.

 

 

 

 

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Boomer, my heart goes out to you as something similar happened to my hubby 3 years ago - he had not been on any meds and after I got out of the hospital following a serious illness, my husband went psychotic. They had a hard time getting him stable and fortunately his psychiatrist believed in minimal meds. She titrated him off all of them and as of a year ago he was meds free. I hope you both have a therapist to talk to as well as the shrink. A good therapist using cognitive behavioral therapy can help with the anxiety episodes. (I was a therapist before I had to retire due to illness...)

I have a congenital neuromuscular disorder. On Celexa 10 mg on and off from 2002-2014; due to chronic pain was changed to Cymbalta 60 mg in 6/2014. Pleuropericarditis and hypothyroidism (.5 mcg synthroid daily) in 2013 and possible UCTD.On prednisone in doses up to 40 mg due to pleural effusion relapses from 2013-2015. Since 2014 off all gluten. Last Neuro visit he suggested reducing the Cymbalta to 30 mg due to risk of meds interaction causing Serotonin syndrome. Tried an every other day taper for 2 weeks then picked up Rx for 30 mg Cymbalta. Yes I'm depressed too!

 

Cymbalta 60 mg (for pain) – daily; Tramadol 50 mg as needed for pain; Baclofen 5 mg in a.m., 5 mg at HS;Ropinirole .5 mg in afternoon and at HS 

Flovent 110mcg 2 puffs twice a day; Astepro .15% 1 spray each nostril twice daily;Nasacort spray 1 sprays each nostril bid

Clarinex 5 mg 1 tab daily;Singulair 10 mg in afternoon/evening;Synthroid 50 mcg in a.m.; Nexium 40 mg in am

B complex + CoQ10; 1000mg Fish oil; Boswellia caplet; Chondriotin Sulfate; Undenatured Type II Collagen 40 mg;1500mg Calcium/Magnesium -bone health

****ALLERGY TO NSAIDS – CAUSES ASTHMA ATTACKS;ALLERGIC TO PENICILLIN;SENSITIVE TO OPIATES (CAUSE HALLUCINATIONS);ALLERGIC TO NEURONTIN (CAUSES EXTREME EDEMA);GLUTEN SENSITIVE - CAUSES JOINT PAINS AND SWELLING - 

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Hi, Boomer.

 

Welcome to the forum. I'm really sorry for what your husband is going through, but he's very lucky to have you researching his medication for him and acting as an advocate.

 

The symptoms you are describing sound very much like side effects and withdrawal effects of psychiatric drugs. The "pacing" you're witnessing is likely to be a symptom called "akathisia". Akathisia is a state of intense anxiety and inner restless that's very, very common when dealing with these types of medications. It will pass eventually, but in the meantime, please let him know that he's not alone with these symptoms. It is the drugs. 

 

Thank you for filling out the signature already. This thread is where you can make updates, report your husband's symptoms, and ask questions. 

 

Is your husband on any other medications and / or supplements? Please place all of his medications in the below medication checker and copy and paste it in this thread. If you need any assistance, please let us know.  

 

Drug Interactions Checker -- use it to reduce your drug burden

 

These are some links to read over about tapering:

 

Taking multiple psych drugs? Which drug to taper first?

 

Tips for tapering off Effexor (venlafaxine)

 

Tips for tapering off olanzapine (Zyprexa)

 

Why taper by 10% of my dosage?

 

These links are to familiarize yourself with withdrawal syndrome. 

 

 

What is withdrawal syndrome? 

 

The Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization

 

There's also a section of the forum to discuss and research your husbands symptoms:

 

 Symptoms and Self Care Forum

 

And this link will give you plenty of ways of handling symptoms without meds:

 

Non-drug Techniques to cope with emotional symptoms

 

This is a lot to take in, so please take your time reading over these links and ask as many questions as you need. 

 

If at any time your husband feels well enough to post himself, he is more than welcome to join us, too. 

Drug free May 22, 2015 after 30 years of neuroleptics, benzos, z-drugs, so-called "anti"-depressants, and amphetamines 

 

My Success Story:  Shep's Success: "Leaving Plato's Cave"

 

And what is good, Phaedrus, and what is not good — need we ask anyone to tell us these things? ~ Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance


I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice, but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs.

 

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Hi People, Thank you for being very encouraging and kind to me.  I was very nervous posting on this forum as I wasn't sure how people would respond.  I will read through all the information provided, but I am alittle mixed up over the tapering.  Do you think that taking 150mg one day and 112mg the next day is incorrect?  The Psychiatrist wanted me to reduce straight to 112mg but I was too frightened.  Can you please explain clearly (My brain is overwhelmed with this) as to how I would reduce from 150mg safely.  Like how do you reduce 10% of 150mg?  Thanks again.

Effexor Brand changed over to Enlafax XR sometime during the first three months of 2017.
Reduced to 12.5mg Olanzapine, last reduction 25/4/17  on advice from PDoc to reduce the severe Akathesia, Panick Attacks and other disabling symptoms.  7/4/17 Propronolol @ 40mg  x 3 times per day increasing as required.  160mg Slow Release x 3 times per day for disabling Panic Attacks.   15/5/17 medication mix up, somewhere prior Mirtazapine increased to 60mg per day. PDoc concerned of Seratonin Syndrome reduced to 30mg per day.  21/6/17 Effexor 37.5mg  reduced.  22/8/17 Mirtazapine reduced 15mg. 14/9/17 Developed GERD added 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x1 Ferrous Fumarate, 17/9/17 Propranolol dosage between 320mg to 400mg 3 to 4x per every second day for disabling Panic Attacks.  17/9/17 Current Medication: 12.5mg Olanzapine, 187.5mg Enlafax XR, 15mg Mirtazpine, Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 pd, Propranolol 320mg to 400mg x 3 or 4 x perday. 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x 1 Ferrous Fumarate  29/9/17 Propranolol  Slow Release 160mg x 3pd, Propranolol 120mg x 3 pd = 840mg per day.  9/10/17 Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 per day, Propranolol 80mg x 3 per day = 720mg per day.  Increased 10/9/17 Propranolol 840mg per day. 14/10/17 Reduced Mirtazapine to13.5mg 18/10/17 Removed Mirtazpine 13.5mg  23/10/17 Reducing Propranolol by 10mg every second day down to 400mg per day. 13/12/17 Now at 400mg Propranolol per day - holding.  20/12/17 Reduced Olanzapine by 10% to 11.25mg.  21/1/18: Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg    Reducing Propranolol by 10mg per week.  8/3/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg . 6/4/18 Reduced .625mg Olanzapine. 4/5/18 Reduced .625 Olanzapine  31/5/18 Changed from Propranolol 160 SR to Propranolol 160. 8/6/18 Morning Olanzapine changed to wafer and reduced by .10mg. 15/6/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .10mg per week Current Medication:  8.345mg Olanzapine; 187.50 Enlafax SR;  Propranolol 55mg x 4 per day.  Minimum 30mins exercise per day.  Fortisip x 2 per day. 

6/7/18 Admitted to Hospital with Chronic Aspiration Pneumonia - medications reduced.  8/11/18 Effexor XR 75mg morning and 37.5mg evening, Madopar Rapid 62.5mg x 4 per day.

 

 

 

 

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Boomer, welcome from me too. I also was on AD s for many years including Effexor for a long time.

The withdrawal has been horrible but am now 14 months from my last dose and have experienced a few windows of recovery.

It is  tough what you and your husband are going through but it will get better particularly with the support of this great site 

and all the information available.

 

Sending all best wishes for  healing.

Anti Depressants for  25 years. Valium between 2006 to 7 tapered off over a month without too bad withdrawals.

For last 15 years 150 mg of Effexor and 30 mg of Mirtazapine. Occasional short term benzo use without habituation.

March 2015 stopped Effexor after rapid taper. 6 weeks. 

One month fluoxetine June 2015...stopped CT July 2015.

October 2013 to December 2015 Zopiclone 15 mg at night,

Dec 2015 to Early March 2016 Lyrica 75 mg at night. 

Stopped too quickly as  adverse side effects.

January to May 2016 tapered Zopiclone to 7.5mg 

Crossed over to Valium and now ..March 28th 2017 Benzo Free.

Also on 30 mg Mirtazapine and holding until have finished Benzo taper.

IN protracted WD from Effexor.

 

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Hi, Boomer.

 

Welcome to the forum. I'm really sorry for what your husband is going through, but he's very lucky to have you researching his medication for him and acting as an advocate.

 

The symptoms you are describing sound very much like side effects and withdrawal effects of psychiatric drugs. The "pacing" you're witnessing is likely to be a symptom called "akathisia". Akathisia is a state of intense anxiety and inner restless that's very, very common when dealing with these types of medications. It will pass eventually, but in the meantime, please let him know that he's not alone with these symptoms. It is the drugs. 

 

Thank you for filling out the signature already. This thread is where you can make updates, report your husband's symptoms, and ask questions. 

 

Is your husband on any other medications and / or supplements? Please place all of his medications in the below medication checker and copy and paste it in this thread. If you need any assistance, please let us know.  

 

Drug Interactions Checker -- use it to reduce your drug burden

 

These are some links to read over about tapering:

 

Taking multiple psych drugs? Which drug to taper first?

 

Tips for tapering off Effexor (venlafaxine)

 

Tips for tapering off olanzapine (Zyprexa)

 

Why taper by 10% of my dosage?

 

These links are to familiarize yourself with withdrawal syndrome. 

 

 

What is withdrawal syndrome? 

 

The Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization

 

There's also a section of the forum to discuss and research your husbands symptoms:

 

 Symptoms and Self Care Forum

 

And this link will give you plenty of ways of handling symptoms without meds:

 

Non-drug Techniques to cope with emotional symptoms

 

This is a lot to take in, so please take your time reading over these links and ask as many questions as you need. 

 

If at any time your husband feels well enough to post himself, he is more than welcome to join us, too. 

Hi Shep

Reducing from 150mg to 112mg seems to be quite a dramatic reduction don't you think?  

Effexor Brand changed over to Enlafax XR sometime during the first three months of 2017.
Reduced to 12.5mg Olanzapine, last reduction 25/4/17  on advice from PDoc to reduce the severe Akathesia, Panick Attacks and other disabling symptoms.  7/4/17 Propronolol @ 40mg  x 3 times per day increasing as required.  160mg Slow Release x 3 times per day for disabling Panic Attacks.   15/5/17 medication mix up, somewhere prior Mirtazapine increased to 60mg per day. PDoc concerned of Seratonin Syndrome reduced to 30mg per day.  21/6/17 Effexor 37.5mg  reduced.  22/8/17 Mirtazapine reduced 15mg. 14/9/17 Developed GERD added 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x1 Ferrous Fumarate, 17/9/17 Propranolol dosage between 320mg to 400mg 3 to 4x per every second day for disabling Panic Attacks.  17/9/17 Current Medication: 12.5mg Olanzapine, 187.5mg Enlafax XR, 15mg Mirtazpine, Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 pd, Propranolol 320mg to 400mg x 3 or 4 x perday. 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x 1 Ferrous Fumarate  29/9/17 Propranolol  Slow Release 160mg x 3pd, Propranolol 120mg x 3 pd = 840mg per day.  9/10/17 Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 per day, Propranolol 80mg x 3 per day = 720mg per day.  Increased 10/9/17 Propranolol 840mg per day. 14/10/17 Reduced Mirtazapine to13.5mg 18/10/17 Removed Mirtazpine 13.5mg  23/10/17 Reducing Propranolol by 10mg every second day down to 400mg per day. 13/12/17 Now at 400mg Propranolol per day - holding.  20/12/17 Reduced Olanzapine by 10% to 11.25mg.  21/1/18: Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg    Reducing Propranolol by 10mg per week.  8/3/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg . 6/4/18 Reduced .625mg Olanzapine. 4/5/18 Reduced .625 Olanzapine  31/5/18 Changed from Propranolol 160 SR to Propranolol 160. 8/6/18 Morning Olanzapine changed to wafer and reduced by .10mg. 15/6/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .10mg per week Current Medication:  8.345mg Olanzapine; 187.50 Enlafax SR;  Propranolol 55mg x 4 per day.  Minimum 30mins exercise per day.  Fortisip x 2 per day. 

6/7/18 Admitted to Hospital with Chronic Aspiration Pneumonia - medications reduced.  8/11/18 Effexor XR 75mg morning and 37.5mg evening, Madopar Rapid 62.5mg x 4 per day.

 

 

 

 

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The key is to take a consistent dose everyday not to alternate doses. It will be like playing ping pong with the brain.

 

How long has he been taking the 150mg, 3-4 months?

Was he stable prior to the olanzipine taper ?

Has the 'pacing' just started up since you have started alternating doses or has it been going on for a while?

 

Dont let CWT scare you. You cannot get off this stuff quickly.

You can only taper off at a rate that the brain can cope with and no faster.

 

Once your husband gets stable on a consistent dose the good folk here can walk him through a safe taper (it may take years).

He is going to be ok.

 

Im so sorry you are in this difficult place. Dont be nervous about posting this is a safe place.

Im sure i speak for everyone here we are all deeply concerned for everyone who joins.

 

Other NZers are here to you might like to check in here. Although it may be more a priority to read the above excellent threads Shep gave you first.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/7803-new-zealand-members-please-check-in-here/

 

The Psychiatrist says he has had a relapse and has major depression.

The pdoc is simply misinformed and wrong.

 

nz11

Thought for the day: Lets stand up, and let’s speak out , together. G Olsen

We have until the 14th. Feb 2018. 

URGENT REQUEST Please consider submitting  for the petition on Prescribed Drug Dependence and Withdrawal currently awaiting its third consideration at the Scottish Parliament. You don't even have to be from Scotland. By clicking on the link below you can read some of the previous submissions but be warned many of them are quite harrowing.

http://www.parliament.scot/GettingInvolved/Petitions/PE01651   

Please tell them about your problems taking and withdrawing from antidepressants and/or benzos.

Send by email to petitions@parliament.scot and quote PE01651 in the subject heading. Keep to a maximum of 3 sides of A4 and you can't name for legal reasons any doctor you have consulted. Tell them if you wish to remain anonymous. We need the numbers to help convince the committee members we are not isolated cases. You have until mid February. Thank you

Recovering paxil addict

None of the published articles shed light on what ssri's ... actually do or what their hazards might be. Healy 2013. 

This is so true, with anything you get on these drugs, dependance, tapering, withdrawal symptoms, side effects, just silent. And if there is something mentioned then their is a serious disconnect between what is said and reality! 

  "Every time I read of a multi-person shooting, I always presume that person had just started a SSRI or had just stopped."  Dr Mosher. Me too! 

Over two decades later, the number of antidepressant prescriptions a year is slightly more than the number of people in the Western world. Most (nine out of 10) prescriptions are for patients who faced difficulties on stopping, equating to about a tenth of the population. These patients are often advised to continue treatment because their difficulties indicate they need ongoing treatment, just as a person with diabetes needs insulin. Healy 2015

I believe the ssri era will soon stand as one of the most shameful in the history of medicine. Healy 2015

Let people help people ... in a natural, kind, non-addictive (and non-big pharma) way. J Broadley 2017

 

 

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  • Administrator

 

Hi Shep

Reducing from 150mg to 112mg seems to be quite a dramatic reduction don't you think?  

 

 

Going from 150 mg to 112 mg is a 38 mg decrease, which is a 25.33% decrease. 

 

So yes, that is quite a dramatic reduction. 

 

 

Hi People, Thank you for being very encouraging and kind to me.  I was very nervous posting on this forum as I wasn't sure how people would respond.  I will read through all the information provided, but I am alittle mixed up over the tapering.  

 

I know this can be quite overwhelming. Plus you're a primary caregiver and I know from helping take care of my parents how hard that is. So first, please take care of yourself. Use the ideas from the self care sections (epsom salt baths if you can tolerate magnesium, gentle music, etc) and take care of yourself, too. 
 
Hopefully, once you get him set on a very, very slow taper, some of these symptoms will let up.
 
 

 

Do you think that taking 150mg one day and 112mg the next day is incorrect?  The Psychiatrist wanted me to reduce straight to 112mg but I was too frightened.  Can you please explain clearly (My brain is overwhelmed with this) as to how I would reduce from 150mg safely.  Like how do you reduce 10% of 150mg?  Thanks again.

 

 

 
No, we do not recommend alternating doses. Like nz11 says, it's like "playing ping pong with the brain". Here's a great post written by Alto on this subject: 
 
 
The best way to get from 150 mg down is to reduce by no more than 10%, which would be 135 mg and staying there for 3 to 4 weeks. 
 
Another option is the microtaper:
 
 
Is his psychiatrist willing to work with you and your husband for a "harm reduction" approach? This would involve no more than 10% reduction consistently administered every day (not every other day), with the ability to increase or decrease the taper rate according to your husband's wishes and his symptoms. 
 
Like NZ said, this is a safe place, so please feel free to ask plenty of questions. 

Drug free May 22, 2015 after 30 years of neuroleptics, benzos, z-drugs, so-called "anti"-depressants, and amphetamines 

 

My Success Story:  Shep's Success: "Leaving Plato's Cave"

 

And what is good, Phaedrus, and what is not good — need we ask anyone to tell us these things? ~ Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance


I am not a medical professional and this is not medical advice, but simply information based on my own experience, as well as other members who have survived these drugs.

 

Link to comment

The key is to take a consistent dose everyday not to alternate doses. It will be like playing ping pong with the brain.

 

How long has he been taking the 150mg, 3-4 months?

Was he stable prior to the olanzipine taper ?

Has the 'pacing' just started up since you have started alternating doses or has it been going on for a while?

 

Dont let CWT scare you. You cannot get off this stuff quickly.

You can only taper off at a rate that the brain can cope with and no faster.

 

Once your husband gets stable on a consistent dose the good folk here can walk him through a safe taper (it may take years).

He is going to be ok.

 

Im so sorry you are in this difficult place. Dont be nervous about posting this is a safe place.

Im sure i speak for everyone here we are all deeply concerned for everyone who joins.

 

Other NZers are here to you might like to check in here. Although it may be more a priority to read the above excellent threads Shep gave you first.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/7803-new-zealand-members-please-check-in-here/

 

The Psychiatrist says he has had a relapse and has major depression.

The pdoc is simply misinformed and wrong.

 

nz11

Hi NZ - thanks for info .  Husband been on 150mg for maybe 4 months. How do I decrease 10% - by counting the beads?  Olanzapine made him like a robot, withdrawn.  He was stable but he has cognitive impairment.  Has difficulty making decisions and concentrating.  Uum not sure about the pacing when that started!  Thanks for the NZ link. 

Effexor Brand changed over to Enlafax XR sometime during the first three months of 2017.
Reduced to 12.5mg Olanzapine, last reduction 25/4/17  on advice from PDoc to reduce the severe Akathesia, Panick Attacks and other disabling symptoms.  7/4/17 Propronolol @ 40mg  x 3 times per day increasing as required.  160mg Slow Release x 3 times per day for disabling Panic Attacks.   15/5/17 medication mix up, somewhere prior Mirtazapine increased to 60mg per day. PDoc concerned of Seratonin Syndrome reduced to 30mg per day.  21/6/17 Effexor 37.5mg  reduced.  22/8/17 Mirtazapine reduced 15mg. 14/9/17 Developed GERD added 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x1 Ferrous Fumarate, 17/9/17 Propranolol dosage between 320mg to 400mg 3 to 4x per every second day for disabling Panic Attacks.  17/9/17 Current Medication: 12.5mg Olanzapine, 187.5mg Enlafax XR, 15mg Mirtazpine, Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 pd, Propranolol 320mg to 400mg x 3 or 4 x perday. 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x 1 Ferrous Fumarate  29/9/17 Propranolol  Slow Release 160mg x 3pd, Propranolol 120mg x 3 pd = 840mg per day.  9/10/17 Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 per day, Propranolol 80mg x 3 per day = 720mg per day.  Increased 10/9/17 Propranolol 840mg per day. 14/10/17 Reduced Mirtazapine to13.5mg 18/10/17 Removed Mirtazpine 13.5mg  23/10/17 Reducing Propranolol by 10mg every second day down to 400mg per day. 13/12/17 Now at 400mg Propranolol per day - holding.  20/12/17 Reduced Olanzapine by 10% to 11.25mg.  21/1/18: Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg    Reducing Propranolol by 10mg per week.  8/3/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg . 6/4/18 Reduced .625mg Olanzapine. 4/5/18 Reduced .625 Olanzapine  31/5/18 Changed from Propranolol 160 SR to Propranolol 160. 8/6/18 Morning Olanzapine changed to wafer and reduced by .10mg. 15/6/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .10mg per week Current Medication:  8.345mg Olanzapine; 187.50 Enlafax SR;  Propranolol 55mg x 4 per day.  Minimum 30mins exercise per day.  Fortisip x 2 per day. 

6/7/18 Admitted to Hospital with Chronic Aspiration Pneumonia - medications reduced.  8/11/18 Effexor XR 75mg morning and 37.5mg evening, Madopar Rapid 62.5mg x 4 per day.

 

 

 

 

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Thanks CWT i can totally understand where you are coming from.

 

I didnt mean to be disrespectful to your post. I apologise. I certainly didnt interpret it as do a cold turkey.

If you meant taper off over several years  taking as long as needed then i agree with you. (ALAP).

 

I felt Boomer was already scared enough.

 

Would you recommend someone taper if already unstable?

How do you define ASAP ? 

 

Go well.

Thought for the day: Lets stand up, and let’s speak out , together. G Olsen

We have until the 14th. Feb 2018. 

URGENT REQUEST Please consider submitting  for the petition on Prescribed Drug Dependence and Withdrawal currently awaiting its third consideration at the Scottish Parliament. You don't even have to be from Scotland. By clicking on the link below you can read some of the previous submissions but be warned many of them are quite harrowing.

http://www.parliament.scot/GettingInvolved/Petitions/PE01651   

Please tell them about your problems taking and withdrawing from antidepressants and/or benzos.

Send by email to petitions@parliament.scot and quote PE01651 in the subject heading. Keep to a maximum of 3 sides of A4 and you can't name for legal reasons any doctor you have consulted. Tell them if you wish to remain anonymous. We need the numbers to help convince the committee members we are not isolated cases. You have until mid February. Thank you

Recovering paxil addict

None of the published articles shed light on what ssri's ... actually do or what their hazards might be. Healy 2013. 

This is so true, with anything you get on these drugs, dependance, tapering, withdrawal symptoms, side effects, just silent. And if there is something mentioned then their is a serious disconnect between what is said and reality! 

  "Every time I read of a multi-person shooting, I always presume that person had just started a SSRI or had just stopped."  Dr Mosher. Me too! 

Over two decades later, the number of antidepressant prescriptions a year is slightly more than the number of people in the Western world. Most (nine out of 10) prescriptions are for patients who faced difficulties on stopping, equating to about a tenth of the population. These patients are often advised to continue treatment because their difficulties indicate they need ongoing treatment, just as a person with diabetes needs insulin. Healy 2015

I believe the ssri era will soon stand as one of the most shameful in the history of medicine. Healy 2015

Let people help people ... in a natural, kind, non-addictive (and non-big pharma) way. J Broadley 2017

 

 

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Shep has pointed out the reason for not alternating very well

 

If i was you since you have been taking the 150 for 4 months keep taking that and taper it by 10%

The rec hold is one month before doing the next drop and its only two weeks since the exit off zyprexa so Im not sure i would start a taper today. Maybe a mod can comment on this

It may be too soon.

 

Boomer you are right you will need to count the beads.

Because of variation you may like to count the beads in several and then get an average.

You will need to remove 10% and then swallow the remainder.

After such a long use i would consider starting off at 5%.

 

KarenB is a kiwi and a mod and tapering effexor so hopefully she can add some wise thoughts soon.

Thought for the day: Lets stand up, and let’s speak out , together. G Olsen

We have until the 14th. Feb 2018. 

URGENT REQUEST Please consider submitting  for the petition on Prescribed Drug Dependence and Withdrawal currently awaiting its third consideration at the Scottish Parliament. You don't even have to be from Scotland. By clicking on the link below you can read some of the previous submissions but be warned many of them are quite harrowing.

http://www.parliament.scot/GettingInvolved/Petitions/PE01651   

Please tell them about your problems taking and withdrawing from antidepressants and/or benzos.

Send by email to petitions@parliament.scot and quote PE01651 in the subject heading. Keep to a maximum of 3 sides of A4 and you can't name for legal reasons any doctor you have consulted. Tell them if you wish to remain anonymous. We need the numbers to help convince the committee members we are not isolated cases. You have until mid February. Thank you

Recovering paxil addict

None of the published articles shed light on what ssri's ... actually do or what their hazards might be. Healy 2013. 

This is so true, with anything you get on these drugs, dependance, tapering, withdrawal symptoms, side effects, just silent. And if there is something mentioned then their is a serious disconnect between what is said and reality! 

  "Every time I read of a multi-person shooting, I always presume that person had just started a SSRI or had just stopped."  Dr Mosher. Me too! 

Over two decades later, the number of antidepressant prescriptions a year is slightly more than the number of people in the Western world. Most (nine out of 10) prescriptions are for patients who faced difficulties on stopping, equating to about a tenth of the population. These patients are often advised to continue treatment because their difficulties indicate they need ongoing treatment, just as a person with diabetes needs insulin. Healy 2015

I believe the ssri era will soon stand as one of the most shameful in the history of medicine. Healy 2015

Let people help people ... in a natural, kind, non-addictive (and non-big pharma) way. J Broadley 2017

 

 

Link to comment

Shep has pointed out the reason for not alternating very well

 

If i was you since you have been taking the 150 for 4 months keep taking that and taper it by 10%

The rec hold is one month before doing the next drop and its only two weeks since the exit off zyprexa so Im not sure i would start a taper today. Maybe a mod can comment on this

It may be too soon.

 

Boomer you are right you will need to count the beads.

Because of variation you may like to count the beads in several and then get an average.

You will need to remove 10% and then swallow the remainder.

After such a long use i would consider starting off at 5%.

 

KarenB is a kiwi and a mod and tapering effexor so hopefully she can add some wise thoughts soon.

Thank you for NZ forum and NZ contact.  Will message KarenB.

Effexor Brand changed over to Enlafax XR sometime during the first three months of 2017.
Reduced to 12.5mg Olanzapine, last reduction 25/4/17  on advice from PDoc to reduce the severe Akathesia, Panick Attacks and other disabling symptoms.  7/4/17 Propronolol @ 40mg  x 3 times per day increasing as required.  160mg Slow Release x 3 times per day for disabling Panic Attacks.   15/5/17 medication mix up, somewhere prior Mirtazapine increased to 60mg per day. PDoc concerned of Seratonin Syndrome reduced to 30mg per day.  21/6/17 Effexor 37.5mg  reduced.  22/8/17 Mirtazapine reduced 15mg. 14/9/17 Developed GERD added 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x1 Ferrous Fumarate, 17/9/17 Propranolol dosage between 320mg to 400mg 3 to 4x per every second day for disabling Panic Attacks.  17/9/17 Current Medication: 12.5mg Olanzapine, 187.5mg Enlafax XR, 15mg Mirtazpine, Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 pd, Propranolol 320mg to 400mg x 3 or 4 x perday. 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x 1 Ferrous Fumarate  29/9/17 Propranolol  Slow Release 160mg x 3pd, Propranolol 120mg x 3 pd = 840mg per day.  9/10/17 Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 per day, Propranolol 80mg x 3 per day = 720mg per day.  Increased 10/9/17 Propranolol 840mg per day. 14/10/17 Reduced Mirtazapine to13.5mg 18/10/17 Removed Mirtazpine 13.5mg  23/10/17 Reducing Propranolol by 10mg every second day down to 400mg per day. 13/12/17 Now at 400mg Propranolol per day - holding.  20/12/17 Reduced Olanzapine by 10% to 11.25mg.  21/1/18: Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg    Reducing Propranolol by 10mg per week.  8/3/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg . 6/4/18 Reduced .625mg Olanzapine. 4/5/18 Reduced .625 Olanzapine  31/5/18 Changed from Propranolol 160 SR to Propranolol 160. 8/6/18 Morning Olanzapine changed to wafer and reduced by .10mg. 15/6/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .10mg per week Current Medication:  8.345mg Olanzapine; 187.50 Enlafax SR;  Propranolol 55mg x 4 per day.  Minimum 30mins exercise per day.  Fortisip x 2 per day. 

6/7/18 Admitted to Hospital with Chronic Aspiration Pneumonia - medications reduced.  8/11/18 Effexor XR 75mg morning and 37.5mg evening, Madopar Rapid 62.5mg x 4 per day.

 

 

 

 

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Hello Boomer and welcome to SA,

 

I see there has been a lot going on for your husband.  The reason the doc said reduce to 112 is that it's available in pills. 

 

Considering your husband has recently finished a taper off Olanzepine, I would suggest he stay at a steady dose for a while.  What we need to know is for how long he has been alternating doses between 112 and 150?  If only a week or so, I would think he could return to the 150 and stabilise there.  If it has been longer then we might need to choose a lower dose, somewhere between those figures. 

 

NZ and Shep have given you great help and links - please do read them as knowledge is power :)

 

At this end of the taper I wouldn't worry too much about bead size.  A good option is to buy a micro-scale and weigh amounts.  It's fiddly, but it gets you there. 

 

Karen

2010  Fluoxetine 20mg.  2011  Escitalopram 20mg.  2013 Tapered badly and destabilised CNS.  Effexor 150mg. 

2015 Begin using info at SurvivingAntidepressants.  Cut 10% - bad w/d 2 months, held 1 month. 

Micro-tapering: four weekly 0.4% cuts, hold 4 weeks (struggling with symptoms).

8 month hold.

2017 Micro-tapering: four weekly 1% cuts, hold 4 weeks (symptoms almost non-existent).

2020 Still micro-tapering. Just over 2/3 of the way off effexor. Minimal symptoms, - and sleeping well.
Supplements: Fish oil, vitamin C, iron, oat-straw tea, nettle tea.

My story of healing:ContinuedHealing

***I am not a doctor; please do your own research and be able to take responsibility for decisions you make.*** 

           'The possibility of renewal exists so long as life exists.'  Dr Gabor Mate.

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Hello Boomer and welcome to SA,

 

I see there has been a lot going on for your husband.  The reason the doc said reduce to 112 is that it's available in pills. 

 

Considering your husband has recently finished a taper off Olanzepine, I would suggest he stay at a steady dose for a while.  What we need to know is for how long he has been alternating doses between 112 and 150?  If only a week or so, I would think he could return to the 150 and stabilise there.  If it has been longer then we might need to choose a lower dose, somewhere between those figures. 

 

NZ and Shep have given you great help and links - please do read them as knowledge is power :)

 

At this end of the taper I wouldn't worry too much about bead size.  A good option is to buy a micro-scale and weigh amounts.  It's fiddly, but it gets you there. 

 

Karen

Hi KarenB - He has only been alternating since Friday 13th.  When I gave him the 150mg he looked terrible but perhaps we just have to go back up there? The reason for the reduction was the Psych wondered whether he is overdrugged.  Slow slurred speech, brain can't process very quickly, etc. etc.  I notice that since making the reductions and first thing in the morning he is so much better, responding quicker, more alive and with it.  After taking Effexor he changes - agitated etc.  Yes NZ11 and Shep have provided alot of information.  So when you taper did you open several capsules and count the beads then divided the beads by the number of capsules to give you the correct amount?  Or did you just use a micro-scale and if so where did you purchase it please?  We have a check in with Psych tomorrow to check on Hubby's process and I really want to be clear about all this information.  Thanks for your help.

Effexor Brand changed over to Enlafax XR sometime during the first three months of 2017.
Reduced to 12.5mg Olanzapine, last reduction 25/4/17  on advice from PDoc to reduce the severe Akathesia, Panick Attacks and other disabling symptoms.  7/4/17 Propronolol @ 40mg  x 3 times per day increasing as required.  160mg Slow Release x 3 times per day for disabling Panic Attacks.   15/5/17 medication mix up, somewhere prior Mirtazapine increased to 60mg per day. PDoc concerned of Seratonin Syndrome reduced to 30mg per day.  21/6/17 Effexor 37.5mg  reduced.  22/8/17 Mirtazapine reduced 15mg. 14/9/17 Developed GERD added 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x1 Ferrous Fumarate, 17/9/17 Propranolol dosage between 320mg to 400mg 3 to 4x per every second day for disabling Panic Attacks.  17/9/17 Current Medication: 12.5mg Olanzapine, 187.5mg Enlafax XR, 15mg Mirtazpine, Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 pd, Propranolol 320mg to 400mg x 3 or 4 x perday. 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x 1 Ferrous Fumarate  29/9/17 Propranolol  Slow Release 160mg x 3pd, Propranolol 120mg x 3 pd = 840mg per day.  9/10/17 Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 per day, Propranolol 80mg x 3 per day = 720mg per day.  Increased 10/9/17 Propranolol 840mg per day. 14/10/17 Reduced Mirtazapine to13.5mg 18/10/17 Removed Mirtazpine 13.5mg  23/10/17 Reducing Propranolol by 10mg every second day down to 400mg per day. 13/12/17 Now at 400mg Propranolol per day - holding.  20/12/17 Reduced Olanzapine by 10% to 11.25mg.  21/1/18: Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg    Reducing Propranolol by 10mg per week.  8/3/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg . 6/4/18 Reduced .625mg Olanzapine. 4/5/18 Reduced .625 Olanzapine  31/5/18 Changed from Propranolol 160 SR to Propranolol 160. 8/6/18 Morning Olanzapine changed to wafer and reduced by .10mg. 15/6/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .10mg per week Current Medication:  8.345mg Olanzapine; 187.50 Enlafax SR;  Propranolol 55mg x 4 per day.  Minimum 30mins exercise per day.  Fortisip x 2 per day. 

6/7/18 Admitted to Hospital with Chronic Aspiration Pneumonia - medications reduced.  8/11/18 Effexor XR 75mg morning and 37.5mg evening, Madopar Rapid 62.5mg x 4 per day.

 

 

 

 

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  • Moderator Emeritus

I use a micro scale - the Gemini 20.  I got it online somewhere - could have been fishpond or something like that. 

 

It does sound as if hubby is better on less efexor.  However, his symptoms could also be a result of tapering Olanzepine (which he probably did fast?) and then worsened by alternating doses.  That's why I'm thinking that stabilising at 150mg until it has been one month since his last dose change could be a good idea.

 

I'll probably get another mod to look in and see if they agree. 

 

Actually, when did he start on 150g?  (If all these details of dates and dosages could go in the signature that would be very handy).

 

Karen

2010  Fluoxetine 20mg.  2011  Escitalopram 20mg.  2013 Tapered badly and destabilised CNS.  Effexor 150mg. 

2015 Begin using info at SurvivingAntidepressants.  Cut 10% - bad w/d 2 months, held 1 month. 

Micro-tapering: four weekly 0.4% cuts, hold 4 weeks (struggling with symptoms).

8 month hold.

2017 Micro-tapering: four weekly 1% cuts, hold 4 weeks (symptoms almost non-existent).

2020 Still micro-tapering. Just over 2/3 of the way off effexor. Minimal symptoms, - and sleeping well.
Supplements: Fish oil, vitamin C, iron, oat-straw tea, nettle tea.

My story of healing:ContinuedHealing

***I am not a doctor; please do your own research and be able to take responsibility for decisions you make.*** 

           'The possibility of renewal exists so long as life exists.'  Dr Gabor Mate.

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Just wondering what your thoughts are on giving 75mg Effexor in morning and then 75mg Effexor in afternoon instead of 150mg all at once.  I notice he is more responsive in the morning and then once given the Effexor he becomes quieter and withdrawn and his thinking is more impaired as the day wears on?

Effexor Brand changed over to Enlafax XR sometime during the first three months of 2017.
Reduced to 12.5mg Olanzapine, last reduction 25/4/17  on advice from PDoc to reduce the severe Akathesia, Panick Attacks and other disabling symptoms.  7/4/17 Propronolol @ 40mg  x 3 times per day increasing as required.  160mg Slow Release x 3 times per day for disabling Panic Attacks.   15/5/17 medication mix up, somewhere prior Mirtazapine increased to 60mg per day. PDoc concerned of Seratonin Syndrome reduced to 30mg per day.  21/6/17 Effexor 37.5mg  reduced.  22/8/17 Mirtazapine reduced 15mg. 14/9/17 Developed GERD added 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x1 Ferrous Fumarate, 17/9/17 Propranolol dosage between 320mg to 400mg 3 to 4x per every second day for disabling Panic Attacks.  17/9/17 Current Medication: 12.5mg Olanzapine, 187.5mg Enlafax XR, 15mg Mirtazpine, Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 pd, Propranolol 320mg to 400mg x 3 or 4 x perday. 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x 1 Ferrous Fumarate  29/9/17 Propranolol  Slow Release 160mg x 3pd, Propranolol 120mg x 3 pd = 840mg per day.  9/10/17 Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 per day, Propranolol 80mg x 3 per day = 720mg per day.  Increased 10/9/17 Propranolol 840mg per day. 14/10/17 Reduced Mirtazapine to13.5mg 18/10/17 Removed Mirtazpine 13.5mg  23/10/17 Reducing Propranolol by 10mg every second day down to 400mg per day. 13/12/17 Now at 400mg Propranolol per day - holding.  20/12/17 Reduced Olanzapine by 10% to 11.25mg.  21/1/18: Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg    Reducing Propranolol by 10mg per week.  8/3/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg . 6/4/18 Reduced .625mg Olanzapine. 4/5/18 Reduced .625 Olanzapine  31/5/18 Changed from Propranolol 160 SR to Propranolol 160. 8/6/18 Morning Olanzapine changed to wafer and reduced by .10mg. 15/6/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .10mg per week Current Medication:  8.345mg Olanzapine; 187.50 Enlafax SR;  Propranolol 55mg x 4 per day.  Minimum 30mins exercise per day.  Fortisip x 2 per day. 

6/7/18 Admitted to Hospital with Chronic Aspiration Pneumonia - medications reduced.  8/11/18 Effexor XR 75mg morning and 37.5mg evening, Madopar Rapid 62.5mg x 4 per day.

 

 

 

 

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Just wondering what your thoughts are on giving 75mg Effexor in morning and then 75mg Effexor in afternoon instead of 150mg all at once.  I notice he is more responsive in the morning and then once given the Effexor he becomes quieter and withdrawn and his thinking is more impaired as the day wears on?

 

Boomer,

 

Just to be clear, you are saying he wakes up and before he is given the Effexor he is more lucid and responsive and that once he is given the Effexor he becomes more impaired?  What does he feel during those periods, i.e., is he more comfortable before administration of the med than afterwards?  If that is the case, trying the lower amount two times a day and possibly even more dosages at lower amounts might be a good option.

 

Unfortunately, much of this is trial and error because not even the companies that make these drugs know how or why they react the way they do.

 

Best,

 

Andy

Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012

increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement

Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first")

Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15

Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid 
Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15

Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016

10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg.  No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold.

After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation

Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C,

 

Link to comment

 

Just wondering what your thoughts are on giving 75mg Effexor in morning and then 75mg Effexor in afternoon instead of 150mg all at once.  I notice he is more responsive in the morning and then once given the Effexor he becomes quieter and withdrawn and his thinking is more impaired as the day wears on?

 

Boomer,

 

Just to be clear, you are saying he wakes up and before he is given the Effexor he is more lucid and responsive and that once he is given the Effexor he becomes more impaired?  What does he feel during those periods, i.e., is he more comfortable before administration of the med than afterwards?  If that is the case, trying the lower amount two times a day and possibly even more dosages at lower amounts might be a good option.

 

Unfortunately, much of this is trial and error because not even the companies that make these drugs know how or why they react the way they do.

 

Best,

 

Andy

 

Thanks Andy - yes before taking the Effexor he is quick at respondinging to conversation but after taking the Effexor he said he can feel it affecting his brain (thinking becomes delayed can't find the correct words says he is stuck).  If he delays taking the Effexor he gets terrible anxiety, can't eat etc.  We had dropped him down to 112mg but it is obvious the drop is too much so have reinstated the 150mg today.  But then thought after what about trying 75mg twice per day but wasnt sure if this would be ping ponging his brain!  

Effexor Brand changed over to Enlafax XR sometime during the first three months of 2017.
Reduced to 12.5mg Olanzapine, last reduction 25/4/17  on advice from PDoc to reduce the severe Akathesia, Panick Attacks and other disabling symptoms.  7/4/17 Propronolol @ 40mg  x 3 times per day increasing as required.  160mg Slow Release x 3 times per day for disabling Panic Attacks.   15/5/17 medication mix up, somewhere prior Mirtazapine increased to 60mg per day. PDoc concerned of Seratonin Syndrome reduced to 30mg per day.  21/6/17 Effexor 37.5mg  reduced.  22/8/17 Mirtazapine reduced 15mg. 14/9/17 Developed GERD added 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x1 Ferrous Fumarate, 17/9/17 Propranolol dosage between 320mg to 400mg 3 to 4x per every second day for disabling Panic Attacks.  17/9/17 Current Medication: 12.5mg Olanzapine, 187.5mg Enlafax XR, 15mg Mirtazpine, Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 pd, Propranolol 320mg to 400mg x 3 or 4 x perday. 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x 1 Ferrous Fumarate  29/9/17 Propranolol  Slow Release 160mg x 3pd, Propranolol 120mg x 3 pd = 840mg per day.  9/10/17 Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 per day, Propranolol 80mg x 3 per day = 720mg per day.  Increased 10/9/17 Propranolol 840mg per day. 14/10/17 Reduced Mirtazapine to13.5mg 18/10/17 Removed Mirtazpine 13.5mg  23/10/17 Reducing Propranolol by 10mg every second day down to 400mg per day. 13/12/17 Now at 400mg Propranolol per day - holding.  20/12/17 Reduced Olanzapine by 10% to 11.25mg.  21/1/18: Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg    Reducing Propranolol by 10mg per week.  8/3/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg . 6/4/18 Reduced .625mg Olanzapine. 4/5/18 Reduced .625 Olanzapine  31/5/18 Changed from Propranolol 160 SR to Propranolol 160. 8/6/18 Morning Olanzapine changed to wafer and reduced by .10mg. 15/6/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .10mg per week Current Medication:  8.345mg Olanzapine; 187.50 Enlafax SR;  Propranolol 55mg x 4 per day.  Minimum 30mins exercise per day.  Fortisip x 2 per day. 

6/7/18 Admitted to Hospital with Chronic Aspiration Pneumonia - medications reduced.  8/11/18 Effexor XR 75mg morning and 37.5mg evening, Madopar Rapid 62.5mg x 4 per day.

 

 

 

 

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  • Moderator Emeritus

 

Thanks Andy - yes before taking the Effexor he is quick at respondinging to conversation but after taking the Effexor he said he can feel it affecting his brain (thinking becomes delayed can't find the correct words says he is stuck).  If he delays taking the Effexor he gets terrible anxiety, can't eat etc.  We had dropped him down to 112mg but it is obvious the drop is too much so have reinstated the 150mg today.  But then thought after what about trying 75mg twice per day but wasnt sure if this would be ping ponging his brain!   

 

 

I would definitely be tempted to try splitting the dose to see if you can find levels at which he is more functional yet not anxious.  It's tricky but you may well be on to an approach that works for him. 

 

Andy

Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012

increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement

Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first")

Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15

Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid 
Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15

Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016

10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg.  No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold.

After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation

Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C,

 

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I use a micro scale - the Gemini 20.  I got it online somewhere - could have been fishpond or something like that. 

 

It does sound as if hubby is better on less efexor.  However, his symptoms could also be a result of tapering Olanzepine (which he probably did fast?) and then worsened by alternating doses.  That's why I'm thinking that stabilising at 150mg until it has been one month since his last dose change could be a good idea.

 

I'll probably get another mod to look in and see if they agree. 

 

Actually, when did he start on 150g?  (If all these details of dates and dosages could go in the signature that would be very handy).

 

Karen

Hi Karen - Have altered and updated my signature and will keep adding as I remember things.  Fishpond seem to stock the Gemini 20. But they have them foraround $150?  Would that be the price?  Thanks for all your help.

Effexor Brand changed over to Enlafax XR sometime during the first three months of 2017.
Reduced to 12.5mg Olanzapine, last reduction 25/4/17  on advice from PDoc to reduce the severe Akathesia, Panick Attacks and other disabling symptoms.  7/4/17 Propronolol @ 40mg  x 3 times per day increasing as required.  160mg Slow Release x 3 times per day for disabling Panic Attacks.   15/5/17 medication mix up, somewhere prior Mirtazapine increased to 60mg per day. PDoc concerned of Seratonin Syndrome reduced to 30mg per day.  21/6/17 Effexor 37.5mg  reduced.  22/8/17 Mirtazapine reduced 15mg. 14/9/17 Developed GERD added 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x1 Ferrous Fumarate, 17/9/17 Propranolol dosage between 320mg to 400mg 3 to 4x per every second day for disabling Panic Attacks.  17/9/17 Current Medication: 12.5mg Olanzapine, 187.5mg Enlafax XR, 15mg Mirtazpine, Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 pd, Propranolol 320mg to 400mg x 3 or 4 x perday. 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x 1 Ferrous Fumarate  29/9/17 Propranolol  Slow Release 160mg x 3pd, Propranolol 120mg x 3 pd = 840mg per day.  9/10/17 Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 per day, Propranolol 80mg x 3 per day = 720mg per day.  Increased 10/9/17 Propranolol 840mg per day. 14/10/17 Reduced Mirtazapine to13.5mg 18/10/17 Removed Mirtazpine 13.5mg  23/10/17 Reducing Propranolol by 10mg every second day down to 400mg per day. 13/12/17 Now at 400mg Propranolol per day - holding.  20/12/17 Reduced Olanzapine by 10% to 11.25mg.  21/1/18: Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg    Reducing Propranolol by 10mg per week.  8/3/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg . 6/4/18 Reduced .625mg Olanzapine. 4/5/18 Reduced .625 Olanzapine  31/5/18 Changed from Propranolol 160 SR to Propranolol 160. 8/6/18 Morning Olanzapine changed to wafer and reduced by .10mg. 15/6/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .10mg per week Current Medication:  8.345mg Olanzapine; 187.50 Enlafax SR;  Propranolol 55mg x 4 per day.  Minimum 30mins exercise per day.  Fortisip x 2 per day. 

6/7/18 Admitted to Hospital with Chronic Aspiration Pneumonia - medications reduced.  8/11/18 Effexor XR 75mg morning and 37.5mg evening, Madopar Rapid 62.5mg x 4 per day.

 

 

 

 

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Boomer have you had a look on trademe i have seen them for much cheaper there..i'll see if i can find one and post it for you.

 

Regarding this splitting the dose thing my understanding is if you are taking effexor XR there is no need to split the dose.

 

I'm putting my vote for taking the 150mg and stabilizing and not making any changes just for now. Remember we could still have zyprexa symptoms in the pipeline yet to surface it was only two weeks ago 10mg  was exited in what looks like  a very short taper (10mg to 1mg at the 10% rate is about 21 months not 2 weeks). Stopping other drugs makes the cns very vulnerable to withdrawal symptoms. And you dont want to risk triggering escalating wdl at this stage...it could go on for a long time.

This is a very sensitized brain with 20 years of apparent switching and yo yoing.

 

If one is dead set on splitting the dose then maybe that is an opportunity to switch to regular effexor. (Then you can crush it and weigh it )

Making small changes will have small consequences.

Thought for the day: Lets stand up, and let’s speak out , together. G Olsen

We have until the 14th. Feb 2018. 

URGENT REQUEST Please consider submitting  for the petition on Prescribed Drug Dependence and Withdrawal currently awaiting its third consideration at the Scottish Parliament. You don't even have to be from Scotland. By clicking on the link below you can read some of the previous submissions but be warned many of them are quite harrowing.

http://www.parliament.scot/GettingInvolved/Petitions/PE01651   

Please tell them about your problems taking and withdrawing from antidepressants and/or benzos.

Send by email to petitions@parliament.scot and quote PE01651 in the subject heading. Keep to a maximum of 3 sides of A4 and you can't name for legal reasons any doctor you have consulted. Tell them if you wish to remain anonymous. We need the numbers to help convince the committee members we are not isolated cases. You have until mid February. Thank you

Recovering paxil addict

None of the published articles shed light on what ssri's ... actually do or what their hazards might be. Healy 2013. 

This is so true, with anything you get on these drugs, dependance, tapering, withdrawal symptoms, side effects, just silent. And if there is something mentioned then their is a serious disconnect between what is said and reality! 

  "Every time I read of a multi-person shooting, I always presume that person had just started a SSRI or had just stopped."  Dr Mosher. Me too! 

Over two decades later, the number of antidepressant prescriptions a year is slightly more than the number of people in the Western world. Most (nine out of 10) prescriptions are for patients who faced difficulties on stopping, equating to about a tenth of the population. These patients are often advised to continue treatment because their difficulties indicate they need ongoing treatment, just as a person with diabetes needs insulin. Healy 2015

I believe the ssri era will soon stand as one of the most shameful in the history of medicine. Healy 2015

Let people help people ... in a natural, kind, non-addictive (and non-big pharma) way. J Broadley 2017

 

 

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  • Moderator Emeritus

I hear you on the dose splitting with the XR, NZ, but it still has a relatively short half-life and that can vary by person.  It might be worth a shot although I like the idea of switching to the regular if that helps.  More flexibility.

 

Andy

Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012

increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement

Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first")

Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15

Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid 
Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15

Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016

10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg.  No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold.

After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation

Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C,

 

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  • Moderator Emeritus

One downside to splitting a dose is the extra weighing that is required.  (Though if it helps your husband it's worth it.)  I am on a split dose myself, which I did to try to reduce dizziness, but it didn't help noticeably.  Now I'm weighing twice as much as I'd have to otherwise and sometimes I get annoyed. 

 

Of course this is not a reason to not split the dose if that's what's needed. 

 

Thanks for the signature.  Good idea, NZ, to try trademe. 

2010  Fluoxetine 20mg.  2011  Escitalopram 20mg.  2013 Tapered badly and destabilised CNS.  Effexor 150mg. 

2015 Begin using info at SurvivingAntidepressants.  Cut 10% - bad w/d 2 months, held 1 month. 

Micro-tapering: four weekly 0.4% cuts, hold 4 weeks (struggling with symptoms).

8 month hold.

2017 Micro-tapering: four weekly 1% cuts, hold 4 weeks (symptoms almost non-existent).

2020 Still micro-tapering. Just over 2/3 of the way off effexor. Minimal symptoms, - and sleeping well.
Supplements: Fish oil, vitamin C, iron, oat-straw tea, nettle tea.

My story of healing:ContinuedHealing

***I am not a doctor; please do your own research and be able to take responsibility for decisions you make.*** 

           'The possibility of renewal exists so long as life exists.'  Dr Gabor Mate.

Link to comment

Recently got a recommendation from a fellow kiwi on scales for weighing, i posted it here:

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/7803-new-zealand-members-please-check-in-here/?p=226432

Thought for the day: Lets stand up, and let’s speak out , together. G Olsen

We have until the 14th. Feb 2018. 

URGENT REQUEST Please consider submitting  for the petition on Prescribed Drug Dependence and Withdrawal currently awaiting its third consideration at the Scottish Parliament. You don't even have to be from Scotland. By clicking on the link below you can read some of the previous submissions but be warned many of them are quite harrowing.

http://www.parliament.scot/GettingInvolved/Petitions/PE01651   

Please tell them about your problems taking and withdrawing from antidepressants and/or benzos.

Send by email to petitions@parliament.scot and quote PE01651 in the subject heading. Keep to a maximum of 3 sides of A4 and you can't name for legal reasons any doctor you have consulted. Tell them if you wish to remain anonymous. We need the numbers to help convince the committee members we are not isolated cases. You have until mid February. Thank you

Recovering paxil addict

None of the published articles shed light on what ssri's ... actually do or what their hazards might be. Healy 2013. 

This is so true, with anything you get on these drugs, dependance, tapering, withdrawal symptoms, side effects, just silent. And if there is something mentioned then their is a serious disconnect between what is said and reality! 

  "Every time I read of a multi-person shooting, I always presume that person had just started a SSRI or had just stopped."  Dr Mosher. Me too! 

Over two decades later, the number of antidepressant prescriptions a year is slightly more than the number of people in the Western world. Most (nine out of 10) prescriptions are for patients who faced difficulties on stopping, equating to about a tenth of the population. These patients are often advised to continue treatment because their difficulties indicate they need ongoing treatment, just as a person with diabetes needs insulin. Healy 2015

I believe the ssri era will soon stand as one of the most shameful in the history of medicine. Healy 2015

Let people help people ... in a natural, kind, non-addictive (and non-big pharma) way. J Broadley 2017

 

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Thanks NZ11

 

Recently got a recommendation from a fellow kiwi on scales for weighing, i posted it here:

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/7803-new-zealand-members-please-check-in-here/?p=226432

Effexor Brand changed over to Enlafax XR sometime during the first three months of 2017.
Reduced to 12.5mg Olanzapine, last reduction 25/4/17  on advice from PDoc to reduce the severe Akathesia, Panick Attacks and other disabling symptoms.  7/4/17 Propronolol @ 40mg  x 3 times per day increasing as required.  160mg Slow Release x 3 times per day for disabling Panic Attacks.   15/5/17 medication mix up, somewhere prior Mirtazapine increased to 60mg per day. PDoc concerned of Seratonin Syndrome reduced to 30mg per day.  21/6/17 Effexor 37.5mg  reduced.  22/8/17 Mirtazapine reduced 15mg. 14/9/17 Developed GERD added 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x1 Ferrous Fumarate, 17/9/17 Propranolol dosage between 320mg to 400mg 3 to 4x per every second day for disabling Panic Attacks.  17/9/17 Current Medication: 12.5mg Olanzapine, 187.5mg Enlafax XR, 15mg Mirtazpine, Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 pd, Propranolol 320mg to 400mg x 3 or 4 x perday. 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x 1 Ferrous Fumarate  29/9/17 Propranolol  Slow Release 160mg x 3pd, Propranolol 120mg x 3 pd = 840mg per day.  9/10/17 Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 per day, Propranolol 80mg x 3 per day = 720mg per day.  Increased 10/9/17 Propranolol 840mg per day. 14/10/17 Reduced Mirtazapine to13.5mg 18/10/17 Removed Mirtazpine 13.5mg  23/10/17 Reducing Propranolol by 10mg every second day down to 400mg per day. 13/12/17 Now at 400mg Propranolol per day - holding.  20/12/17 Reduced Olanzapine by 10% to 11.25mg.  21/1/18: Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg    Reducing Propranolol by 10mg per week.  8/3/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg . 6/4/18 Reduced .625mg Olanzapine. 4/5/18 Reduced .625 Olanzapine  31/5/18 Changed from Propranolol 160 SR to Propranolol 160. 8/6/18 Morning Olanzapine changed to wafer and reduced by .10mg. 15/6/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .10mg per week Current Medication:  8.345mg Olanzapine; 187.50 Enlafax SR;  Propranolol 55mg x 4 per day.  Minimum 30mins exercise per day.  Fortisip x 2 per day. 

6/7/18 Admitted to Hospital with Chronic Aspiration Pneumonia - medications reduced.  8/11/18 Effexor XR 75mg morning and 37.5mg evening, Madopar Rapid 62.5mg x 4 per day.

 

 

 

 

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Update - the Psych reduced to 112mg on May 14 - has become Psychotic, Psych added 2.5mg Olazanpine 25th May - husband still very confused, unstable.  Husband was not himself even when on 150mg - his cognitive function is impaired and he seemed overdrugged, hence the reason the Psych reduced.  Saw slight improvements and yesterday reasonably okay but today he is not functioning very well at all.  Finds its difficult to get himself in the shower, takes a hour to get dressed.  Just can't function.  My husband is in a bad way - mentally.  Thoughts please?

Effexor Brand changed over to Enlafax XR sometime during the first three months of 2017.
Reduced to 12.5mg Olanzapine, last reduction 25/4/17  on advice from PDoc to reduce the severe Akathesia, Panick Attacks and other disabling symptoms.  7/4/17 Propronolol @ 40mg  x 3 times per day increasing as required.  160mg Slow Release x 3 times per day for disabling Panic Attacks.   15/5/17 medication mix up, somewhere prior Mirtazapine increased to 60mg per day. PDoc concerned of Seratonin Syndrome reduced to 30mg per day.  21/6/17 Effexor 37.5mg  reduced.  22/8/17 Mirtazapine reduced 15mg. 14/9/17 Developed GERD added 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x1 Ferrous Fumarate, 17/9/17 Propranolol dosage between 320mg to 400mg 3 to 4x per every second day for disabling Panic Attacks.  17/9/17 Current Medication: 12.5mg Olanzapine, 187.5mg Enlafax XR, 15mg Mirtazpine, Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 pd, Propranolol 320mg to 400mg x 3 or 4 x perday. 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x 1 Ferrous Fumarate  29/9/17 Propranolol  Slow Release 160mg x 3pd, Propranolol 120mg x 3 pd = 840mg per day.  9/10/17 Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 per day, Propranolol 80mg x 3 per day = 720mg per day.  Increased 10/9/17 Propranolol 840mg per day. 14/10/17 Reduced Mirtazapine to13.5mg 18/10/17 Removed Mirtazpine 13.5mg  23/10/17 Reducing Propranolol by 10mg every second day down to 400mg per day. 13/12/17 Now at 400mg Propranolol per day - holding.  20/12/17 Reduced Olanzapine by 10% to 11.25mg.  21/1/18: Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg    Reducing Propranolol by 10mg per week.  8/3/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg . 6/4/18 Reduced .625mg Olanzapine. 4/5/18 Reduced .625 Olanzapine  31/5/18 Changed from Propranolol 160 SR to Propranolol 160. 8/6/18 Morning Olanzapine changed to wafer and reduced by .10mg. 15/6/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .10mg per week Current Medication:  8.345mg Olanzapine; 187.50 Enlafax SR;  Propranolol 55mg x 4 per day.  Minimum 30mins exercise per day.  Fortisip x 2 per day. 

6/7/18 Admitted to Hospital with Chronic Aspiration Pneumonia - medications reduced.  8/11/18 Effexor XR 75mg morning and 37.5mg evening, Madopar Rapid 62.5mg x 4 per day.

 

 

 

 

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Hi Boomer, your sig says that you went back up to 150mg on 15 May, is he still at 150mg? 

Did he become psychotic after the reduction?  He needs to reduce more slowly, did he get  tablets and a capsule to get the 112? 

The tablets can be made into a liquid so you can get the smaller dose.  

The doctor doesn't know what to do so is doing the only thing he knows, trying more drugs. 

I was housebound for years and bedridden for a lot of the time when I was taking effexor, I couldn't think, feel or get motivated. Didnt shower 

for days because I didn't have the energy. My memory had gone and all my were discussing a nursing home for me. 

The psych added and changed drugs making things even worse, then told me I would need his poison for the rest of my life and that I would get 

worse as I got older. I couldn't keep up with the housework and the place was an embarrassment.  I was in a real sorry mess.

Then I started to taper, on my own because the psych wouldn't support me. My GP gave me the usual take 1 every other day schedule, and said that I would have to go back on again because I needed them like a diabetic needs insulin. 

 

I got better as the dose lowered but like your husband I tapered for a year then went into withdrawal and reinstated but reinstated at just 5 beads after finding this site. Restarted my taper after 6 months and have now been off for 15 months. 

It is such a shame that you didn't find us earlier because reinstating to 150 was far too high. The nervous system becomes sensitive and can no longer tolerate the high doses.  Hopefully your husband will start to feel better as the dose lowers too but it will need to be slow. 

 

He could also be in withdrawal from olanzapine and would be why he felt a little better after taking it again. 

  

Making a liquid.http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/2693-how-to-make-a-liquid-from-tablets-or-capsules/

**I am not a medical professional, if in doubt please consult a doctor with withdrawal knowledge.

 

 

Different drugs occasionally (mostly benzos) 1976 - 1981 (no problem)

1993 - 2002 in and out of hospital. every type of drug + ECT. Staring with seroxat

2002  effexor. 

Tapered  March 2012 to March 2013, ending with 5 beads.

Withdrawal April 2013 . Reinstated 5 beads reduced to 4 beads May 2013

Restarted taper  Nov 2013  

OFF EFFEXOR Feb 2015    :D 

Tapered atenolol and omeprazole Dec 2013 - May 2014

 

Tapering tramadol, Feb 2015 100mg , March 2015 50mg  

 July 2017 30mg.  May 15 2018 25mg

Taking fish oil, magnesium, B12, folic acid, bilberry eyebright for eye pressure. 

 

My story http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4199-hello-mammap-checking-in/page-33

 

Lesson learned, slow down taper at lower doses. Taper no more than 10% of CURRENT dose if possible

 

 

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  • Administrator

Hello, Boomer.

 

Your husband is now taking 150mg Effexor XR and 2.5mg olanzapine? At what time of day does he take these drugs?

 

What is his daily symptom pattern? Please keep notes on paper about symptoms, when he takes the drugs, and their dosages?

 

When you say "psychotic," what do you mean? Did this happen after you increased Effexor XR to 150mg again?

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

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Hi Boomer, your sig says that you went back up to 150mg on 15 May, is he still at 150mg? 

Did he become psychotic after the reduction?  He needs to reduce more slowly, did he get  tablets and a capsule to get the 112? 

The tablets can be made into a liquid so you can get the smaller dose.  

The doctor doesn't know what to do so is doing the only thing he knows, trying more drugs. 

I was housebound for years and bedridden for a lot of the time when I was taking effexor, I couldn't think, feel or get motivated. Didnt shower 

for days because I didn't have the energy. My memory had gone and all my were discussing a nursing home for me. 

The psych added and changed drugs making things even worse, then told me I would need his poison for the rest of my life and that I would get 

worse as I got older. I couldn't keep up with the housework and the place was an embarrassment.  I was in a real sorry mess.

Then I started to taper, on my own because the psych wouldn't support me. My GP gave me the usual take 1 every other day schedule, and said that I would have to go back on again because I needed them like a diabetic needs insulin. 

 

I got better as the dose lowered but like your husband I tapered for a year then went into withdrawal and reinstated but reinstated at just 5 beads after finding this site. Restarted my taper after 6 months and have now been off for 15 months. 

It is such a shame that you didn't find us earlier because reinstating to 150 was far too high. The nervous system becomes sensitive and can no longer tolerate the high doses.  Hopefully your husband will start to feel better as the dose lowers too but it will need to be slow. 

 

He could also be in withdrawal from olanzapine and would be why he felt a little better after taking it again. 

  

Making a liquid.http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/2693-how-to-make-a-liquid-from-tablets-or-capsules/

Hi - We tried to reinstate the Effexor slowly before contacting the Doctors but he was in a really bad state.  He kept telling me his brain was shutting down.  He was Psychotic/Paranoid - believing that people were going to come and take him away.  We were also concerned about suicide thats why we made the call.  I don't think the Olazapine has made him better I think he is more unstable.  He seemed overdrugged before the reductions but now his state of mind if all over the place.

Effexor Brand changed over to Enlafax XR sometime during the first three months of 2017.
Reduced to 12.5mg Olanzapine, last reduction 25/4/17  on advice from PDoc to reduce the severe Akathesia, Panick Attacks and other disabling symptoms.  7/4/17 Propronolol @ 40mg  x 3 times per day increasing as required.  160mg Slow Release x 3 times per day for disabling Panic Attacks.   15/5/17 medication mix up, somewhere prior Mirtazapine increased to 60mg per day. PDoc concerned of Seratonin Syndrome reduced to 30mg per day.  21/6/17 Effexor 37.5mg  reduced.  22/8/17 Mirtazapine reduced 15mg. 14/9/17 Developed GERD added 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x1 Ferrous Fumarate, 17/9/17 Propranolol dosage between 320mg to 400mg 3 to 4x per every second day for disabling Panic Attacks.  17/9/17 Current Medication: 12.5mg Olanzapine, 187.5mg Enlafax XR, 15mg Mirtazpine, Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 pd, Propranolol 320mg to 400mg x 3 or 4 x perday. 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x 1 Ferrous Fumarate  29/9/17 Propranolol  Slow Release 160mg x 3pd, Propranolol 120mg x 3 pd = 840mg per day.  9/10/17 Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 per day, Propranolol 80mg x 3 per day = 720mg per day.  Increased 10/9/17 Propranolol 840mg per day. 14/10/17 Reduced Mirtazapine to13.5mg 18/10/17 Removed Mirtazpine 13.5mg  23/10/17 Reducing Propranolol by 10mg every second day down to 400mg per day. 13/12/17 Now at 400mg Propranolol per day - holding.  20/12/17 Reduced Olanzapine by 10% to 11.25mg.  21/1/18: Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg    Reducing Propranolol by 10mg per week.  8/3/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg . 6/4/18 Reduced .625mg Olanzapine. 4/5/18 Reduced .625 Olanzapine  31/5/18 Changed from Propranolol 160 SR to Propranolol 160. 8/6/18 Morning Olanzapine changed to wafer and reduced by .10mg. 15/6/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .10mg per week Current Medication:  8.345mg Olanzapine; 187.50 Enlafax SR;  Propranolol 55mg x 4 per day.  Minimum 30mins exercise per day.  Fortisip x 2 per day. 

6/7/18 Admitted to Hospital with Chronic Aspiration Pneumonia - medications reduced.  8/11/18 Effexor XR 75mg morning and 37.5mg evening, Madopar Rapid 62.5mg x 4 per day.

 

 

 

 

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Hello, Boomer.

 

Your husband is now taking 150mg Effexor XR and 2.5mg olanzapine? At what time of day does he take these drugs?

 

What is his daily symptom pattern? Please keep notes on paper about symptoms, when he takes the drugs, and their dosages?

 

When you say "psychotic," what do you mean? Did this happen after you increased Effexor XR to 150mg again?

The difficulty we have in New Zealand is the Psychiatrist/Doctors write the medical certificates so we can either take leave from work or claim a sickness benefit. So it is advisable to try and work with the Psych/Doc which can be difficult. Reading the information on this site and trying to relay it to the Psychiatrist in a way that doesn't offend is difficult.  The Psychistrist reduced him to 112mg and reinstated the Olanzapine as per my signature.  Paranoid/Pychosis - can't remember exact situations at the moment but I know the Psych reinstated the Olanzapine because of his paranoia and talk of harming himself.  When we first reduced him to 112mg I noticed a difference to his demeanor (a bit of his old self returned) first thing in the morning before he took the Effexor.  But then he slowly deteriorated again and I haven't seen that old self.  He is taking the 112mg in the morning and the 2.5mg Olanzapine in the evening.  His pattern is when he awakes he usually panicky about our situation and sometimes tells me he can't go on like this.  He can take 2 hours to get himself showered/dressed and have breakfast, sometimes it is nearly lunch time by the time he has finished breakfast.  His brain cannot think clearly.  By afternoon he can be alittle better.  I would like to reinstate more Effexor but the Psych wants to perservere!  By the way the Psych has gone on holiday and won't be back for 2 weeks.  Difficult situation as my husband his eating but not how he should be to put on weight, infact I think he has lost weight, looks so incredibly thin.  Has constipation, hard to get him to drink fluids etc....

Effexor Brand changed over to Enlafax XR sometime during the first three months of 2017.
Reduced to 12.5mg Olanzapine, last reduction 25/4/17  on advice from PDoc to reduce the severe Akathesia, Panick Attacks and other disabling symptoms.  7/4/17 Propronolol @ 40mg  x 3 times per day increasing as required.  160mg Slow Release x 3 times per day for disabling Panic Attacks.   15/5/17 medication mix up, somewhere prior Mirtazapine increased to 60mg per day. PDoc concerned of Seratonin Syndrome reduced to 30mg per day.  21/6/17 Effexor 37.5mg  reduced.  22/8/17 Mirtazapine reduced 15mg. 14/9/17 Developed GERD added 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x1 Ferrous Fumarate, 17/9/17 Propranolol dosage between 320mg to 400mg 3 to 4x per every second day for disabling Panic Attacks.  17/9/17 Current Medication: 12.5mg Olanzapine, 187.5mg Enlafax XR, 15mg Mirtazpine, Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 pd, Propranolol 320mg to 400mg x 3 or 4 x perday. 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x 1 Ferrous Fumarate  29/9/17 Propranolol  Slow Release 160mg x 3pd, Propranolol 120mg x 3 pd = 840mg per day.  9/10/17 Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 per day, Propranolol 80mg x 3 per day = 720mg per day.  Increased 10/9/17 Propranolol 840mg per day. 14/10/17 Reduced Mirtazapine to13.5mg 18/10/17 Removed Mirtazpine 13.5mg  23/10/17 Reducing Propranolol by 10mg every second day down to 400mg per day. 13/12/17 Now at 400mg Propranolol per day - holding.  20/12/17 Reduced Olanzapine by 10% to 11.25mg.  21/1/18: Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg    Reducing Propranolol by 10mg per week.  8/3/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg . 6/4/18 Reduced .625mg Olanzapine. 4/5/18 Reduced .625 Olanzapine  31/5/18 Changed from Propranolol 160 SR to Propranolol 160. 8/6/18 Morning Olanzapine changed to wafer and reduced by .10mg. 15/6/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .10mg per week Current Medication:  8.345mg Olanzapine; 187.50 Enlafax SR;  Propranolol 55mg x 4 per day.  Minimum 30mins exercise per day.  Fortisip x 2 per day. 

6/7/18 Admitted to Hospital with Chronic Aspiration Pneumonia - medications reduced.  8/11/18 Effexor XR 75mg morning and 37.5mg evening, Madopar Rapid 62.5mg x 4 per day.

 

 

 

 

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Since he has only been at 112mg efexor for 6 days, then it's probably best to hold that dose for a while longer.  The reason for that is that each dose-change can cause further destabilisation - and it's clear that your husband's CNS is already suffering a lot.  Some of the problems may have been caused by tapering and reinstating olanzapine - have a look at Tips for Tapering Olanzapine where I found this:

Very careful tapering is necessary when you have had psychotic symptoms. Such symptoms can appear as withdrawal symptoms; that will cause you to become diagnosed as relapsed and re-medicated. Read Psychiatrist: Some patients are better off without antipsychotics...

 

Unfortunately it's not a situation that can resolve quickly, but with time and good care your husband will likely improve.  I know it's scary, and an awful situation to be in, but it's still best to keep things Simple; Keep it Slow; Keep it Stable.  More sudden changes will probably just make things worse.

 

Regarding weight loss, many people eat things like protein shakes, smoothies with banana and berries, avocado, hearty soups with cream in them.  I remember Alto telling someone else that for a while she ate buttered croissants.  The idea is to make each meal count.  Can you add fish oil and magnesium into his diet?

 

You may also like to try some different things to help your husband through the morning - you'll have a better idea of what might work.  Maybe gentle yoga poses, guided meditations, colouring in, listening to soothing music.  I know it doesn't seem like much of an answer when you are in such a tough situation, but building up these little things can make a difference. 

 

Karen

2010  Fluoxetine 20mg.  2011  Escitalopram 20mg.  2013 Tapered badly and destabilised CNS.  Effexor 150mg. 

2015 Begin using info at SurvivingAntidepressants.  Cut 10% - bad w/d 2 months, held 1 month. 

Micro-tapering: four weekly 0.4% cuts, hold 4 weeks (struggling with symptoms).

8 month hold.

2017 Micro-tapering: four weekly 1% cuts, hold 4 weeks (symptoms almost non-existent).

2020 Still micro-tapering. Just over 2/3 of the way off effexor. Minimal symptoms, - and sleeping well.
Supplements: Fish oil, vitamin C, iron, oat-straw tea, nettle tea.

My story of healing:ContinuedHealing

***I am not a doctor; please do your own research and be able to take responsibility for decisions you make.*** 

           'The possibility of renewal exists so long as life exists.'  Dr Gabor Mate.

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2010  Fluoxetine 20mg.  2011  Escitalopram 20mg.  2013 Tapered badly and destabilised CNS.  Effexor 150mg. 

2015 Begin using info at SurvivingAntidepressants.  Cut 10% - bad w/d 2 months, held 1 month. 

Micro-tapering: four weekly 0.4% cuts, hold 4 weeks (struggling with symptoms).

8 month hold.

2017 Micro-tapering: four weekly 1% cuts, hold 4 weeks (symptoms almost non-existent).

2020 Still micro-tapering. Just over 2/3 of the way off effexor. Minimal symptoms, - and sleeping well.
Supplements: Fish oil, vitamin C, iron, oat-straw tea, nettle tea.

My story of healing:ContinuedHealing

***I am not a doctor; please do your own research and be able to take responsibility for decisions you make.*** 

           'The possibility of renewal exists so long as life exists.'  Dr Gabor Mate.

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Boomer, can you explain more about your husband being "paranoid"?

 

It's sounding to me like he is in high distress from severe withdrawal symptoms, but not psychotic. Many people think they're losing their minds when they experience adverse effects from drugs. Thoughts of suicide are fairly common in these situations, they're not psychotic per se.

 

Please tell your husband he's having an adverse drug effect, you'll work through it. Ask him to stay as calm as possible and not get frightened by his symptoms, which generate enough anxiety on their own. The symptoms are coming from the chemicals, not from him.

 

Is your Effexor XR the kind with tiny beads inside a capsule? How often are you required to see the psychiatrist?

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

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Boomer, can you explain more about your husband being "paranoid"?

 

It's sounding to me like he is in high distress from severe withdrawal symptoms, but not psychotic. Many people think they're losing their minds when they experience adverse effects from drugs. Thoughts of suicide are fairly common in these situations, they're not psychotic per se.

 

Please tell your husband he's having an adverse drug effect, you'll work through it. Ask him to stay as calm as possible and not get frightened by his symptoms, which generate enough anxiety on their own. The symptoms are coming from the chemicals, not from him.

 

Is your Effexor XR the kind with tiny beads inside a capsule? How often are you required to see the psychiatrist?

He firmly believes that someone is going to take him away.  I am assuming he is meaning to the Psych Ward.  He keeps saying he has lost it.  He seems to be talking to himself alot. He doesn't hear voices.  It is a battle to get him to take fluids (I think his thinking is he will not make it to the toilet in time when he does want to go).  He is hardly eating.  He is very very thin and I can now see the outline of bone on his face. He tried to brush his teeth last night and tried several times to get the toothbrush up to his mouth but his brain wouldn't work.  I have to assist him to get to bed. The Psych didn't want to reinstate Olanzapine but because the Psych was going away for two weeks and my husband was talking about suicide he decided to reinstate up to a maximum of 5mg of which I am trying to only give him 2.5mg.  Before tapering he was stable but he didn't have any emotion and had severe cognitive functioning (before all this occurred he was a friendly, happy, hospitable person whom was liked by many).  When he first tapered off last year his symptoms became so severe he couldn't get himself to the toilet or shower himself.  I would find him in the toilet wanting to use the toilet but not knowing how to achieve that.  I am not sure how long I wait until he requires medical intervention as if I am finding I have to make him drink fluids and make him eat.  He is on the Effexor Xr capsules with the beads inside.  I had wondered whether we should reinstate the 150mg and reduce more slowly or is it better to try and battle through?

Effexor Brand changed over to Enlafax XR sometime during the first three months of 2017.
Reduced to 12.5mg Olanzapine, last reduction 25/4/17  on advice from PDoc to reduce the severe Akathesia, Panick Attacks and other disabling symptoms.  7/4/17 Propronolol @ 40mg  x 3 times per day increasing as required.  160mg Slow Release x 3 times per day for disabling Panic Attacks.   15/5/17 medication mix up, somewhere prior Mirtazapine increased to 60mg per day. PDoc concerned of Seratonin Syndrome reduced to 30mg per day.  21/6/17 Effexor 37.5mg  reduced.  22/8/17 Mirtazapine reduced 15mg. 14/9/17 Developed GERD added 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x1 Ferrous Fumarate, 17/9/17 Propranolol dosage between 320mg to 400mg 3 to 4x per every second day for disabling Panic Attacks.  17/9/17 Current Medication: 12.5mg Olanzapine, 187.5mg Enlafax XR, 15mg Mirtazpine, Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 pd, Propranolol 320mg to 400mg x 3 or 4 x perday. 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x 1 Ferrous Fumarate  29/9/17 Propranolol  Slow Release 160mg x 3pd, Propranolol 120mg x 3 pd = 840mg per day.  9/10/17 Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 per day, Propranolol 80mg x 3 per day = 720mg per day.  Increased 10/9/17 Propranolol 840mg per day. 14/10/17 Reduced Mirtazapine to13.5mg 18/10/17 Removed Mirtazpine 13.5mg  23/10/17 Reducing Propranolol by 10mg every second day down to 400mg per day. 13/12/17 Now at 400mg Propranolol per day - holding.  20/12/17 Reduced Olanzapine by 10% to 11.25mg.  21/1/18: Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg    Reducing Propranolol by 10mg per week.  8/3/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg . 6/4/18 Reduced .625mg Olanzapine. 4/5/18 Reduced .625 Olanzapine  31/5/18 Changed from Propranolol 160 SR to Propranolol 160. 8/6/18 Morning Olanzapine changed to wafer and reduced by .10mg. 15/6/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .10mg per week Current Medication:  8.345mg Olanzapine; 187.50 Enlafax SR;  Propranolol 55mg x 4 per day.  Minimum 30mins exercise per day.  Fortisip x 2 per day. 

6/7/18 Admitted to Hospital with Chronic Aspiration Pneumonia - medications reduced.  8/11/18 Effexor XR 75mg morning and 37.5mg evening, Madopar Rapid 62.5mg x 4 per day.

 

 

 

 

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Since he has only been at 112mg efexor for 6 days, then it's probably best to hold that dose for a while longer.  The reason for that is that each dose-change can cause further destabilisation - and it's clear that your husband's CNS is already suffering a lot.  Some of the problems may have been caused by tapering and reinstating olanzapine - have a look at Tips for Tapering Olanzapine where I found this:

Very careful tapering is necessary when you have had psychotic symptoms. Such symptoms can appear as withdrawal symptoms; that will cause you to become diagnosed as relapsed and re-medicated. Read Psychiatrist: Some patients are better off without antipsychotics...

 

Unfortunately it's not a situation that can resolve quickly, but with time and good care your husband will likely improve.  I know it's scary, and an awful situation to be in, but it's still best to keep things Simple; Keep it Slow; Keep it Stable.  More sudden changes will probably just make things worse.

 

Regarding weight loss, many people eat things like protein shakes, smoothies with banana and berries, avocado, hearty soups with cream in them.  I remember Alto telling someone else that for a while she ate buttered croissants.  The idea is to make each meal count.  Can you add fish oil and magnesium into his diet?

 

You may also like to try some different things to help your husband through the morning - you'll have a better idea of what might work.  Maybe gentle yoga poses, guided meditations, colouring in, listening to soothing music.  I know it doesn't seem like much of an answer when you are in such a tough situation, but building up these little things can make a difference. 

 

Karen

Thanks Karen.  I have also updated my signature as I hadn't explained my process very clearly.  He has been on 112mg longer than six days.  Thanks for information.

Effexor Brand changed over to Enlafax XR sometime during the first three months of 2017.
Reduced to 12.5mg Olanzapine, last reduction 25/4/17  on advice from PDoc to reduce the severe Akathesia, Panick Attacks and other disabling symptoms.  7/4/17 Propronolol @ 40mg  x 3 times per day increasing as required.  160mg Slow Release x 3 times per day for disabling Panic Attacks.   15/5/17 medication mix up, somewhere prior Mirtazapine increased to 60mg per day. PDoc concerned of Seratonin Syndrome reduced to 30mg per day.  21/6/17 Effexor 37.5mg  reduced.  22/8/17 Mirtazapine reduced 15mg. 14/9/17 Developed GERD added 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x1 Ferrous Fumarate, 17/9/17 Propranolol dosage between 320mg to 400mg 3 to 4x per every second day for disabling Panic Attacks.  17/9/17 Current Medication: 12.5mg Olanzapine, 187.5mg Enlafax XR, 15mg Mirtazpine, Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 pd, Propranolol 320mg to 400mg x 3 or 4 x perday. 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x 1 Ferrous Fumarate  29/9/17 Propranolol  Slow Release 160mg x 3pd, Propranolol 120mg x 3 pd = 840mg per day.  9/10/17 Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 per day, Propranolol 80mg x 3 per day = 720mg per day.  Increased 10/9/17 Propranolol 840mg per day. 14/10/17 Reduced Mirtazapine to13.5mg 18/10/17 Removed Mirtazpine 13.5mg  23/10/17 Reducing Propranolol by 10mg every second day down to 400mg per day. 13/12/17 Now at 400mg Propranolol per day - holding.  20/12/17 Reduced Olanzapine by 10% to 11.25mg.  21/1/18: Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg    Reducing Propranolol by 10mg per week.  8/3/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg . 6/4/18 Reduced .625mg Olanzapine. 4/5/18 Reduced .625 Olanzapine  31/5/18 Changed from Propranolol 160 SR to Propranolol 160. 8/6/18 Morning Olanzapine changed to wafer and reduced by .10mg. 15/6/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .10mg per week Current Medication:  8.345mg Olanzapine; 187.50 Enlafax SR;  Propranolol 55mg x 4 per day.  Minimum 30mins exercise per day.  Fortisip x 2 per day. 

6/7/18 Admitted to Hospital with Chronic Aspiration Pneumonia - medications reduced.  8/11/18 Effexor XR 75mg morning and 37.5mg evening, Madopar Rapid 62.5mg x 4 per day.

 

 

 

 

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Yesterday was the first time in three weeks that my husband was alot calmer.  Still can't focus, concentrate and takes along time (an hour or more) to get his brain to process actions.

Effexor Brand changed over to Enlafax XR sometime during the first three months of 2017.
Reduced to 12.5mg Olanzapine, last reduction 25/4/17  on advice from PDoc to reduce the severe Akathesia, Panick Attacks and other disabling symptoms.  7/4/17 Propronolol @ 40mg  x 3 times per day increasing as required.  160mg Slow Release x 3 times per day for disabling Panic Attacks.   15/5/17 medication mix up, somewhere prior Mirtazapine increased to 60mg per day. PDoc concerned of Seratonin Syndrome reduced to 30mg per day.  21/6/17 Effexor 37.5mg  reduced.  22/8/17 Mirtazapine reduced 15mg. 14/9/17 Developed GERD added 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x1 Ferrous Fumarate, 17/9/17 Propranolol dosage between 320mg to 400mg 3 to 4x per every second day for disabling Panic Attacks.  17/9/17 Current Medication: 12.5mg Olanzapine, 187.5mg Enlafax XR, 15mg Mirtazpine, Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 pd, Propranolol 320mg to 400mg x 3 or 4 x perday. 40mg Omeprazole x 1, 200mg x 1 Ferrous Fumarate  29/9/17 Propranolol  Slow Release 160mg x 3pd, Propranolol 120mg x 3 pd = 840mg per day.  9/10/17 Propranolol Slow Release 160mg x 3 per day, Propranolol 80mg x 3 per day = 720mg per day.  Increased 10/9/17 Propranolol 840mg per day. 14/10/17 Reduced Mirtazapine to13.5mg 18/10/17 Removed Mirtazpine 13.5mg  23/10/17 Reducing Propranolol by 10mg every second day down to 400mg per day. 13/12/17 Now at 400mg Propranolol per day - holding.  20/12/17 Reduced Olanzapine by 10% to 11.25mg.  21/1/18: Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg    Reducing Propranolol by 10mg per week.  8/3/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .625mg . 6/4/18 Reduced .625mg Olanzapine. 4/5/18 Reduced .625 Olanzapine  31/5/18 Changed from Propranolol 160 SR to Propranolol 160. 8/6/18 Morning Olanzapine changed to wafer and reduced by .10mg. 15/6/18 Reduced Olanzapine by .10mg per week Current Medication:  8.345mg Olanzapine; 187.50 Enlafax SR;  Propranolol 55mg x 4 per day.  Minimum 30mins exercise per day.  Fortisip x 2 per day. 

6/7/18 Admitted to Hospital with Chronic Aspiration Pneumonia - medications reduced.  8/11/18 Effexor XR 75mg morning and 37.5mg evening, Madopar Rapid 62.5mg x 4 per day.

 

 

 

 

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