Venkat: tapering olanzapine / Zyprexa

[Rrsfc]

Hi venkat, you seem to be doing very well, I am very pleased. It was nice to know a little more about you and your habits. Sending you a big hug, hope you can accomplish all your goals. Namastê  🙏 🙏🙏

[Venkat]

Thank you @Rrsfc, I  always picture Hayduke, yourself and Badmedicine walking ahead and me following behind.

🙏

[hayduke]

5 hours ago, Venkat said:

Updating on SA is to me is a type of mental catharsis, a form of psychoanalysis where our dear mods and friends are psychoanalysts. It is a blessing. 

 

Olanzapine tapering going smoothly at the rate of 2.5% of the previous dose  every 2 weeks with hardly any troubling waves. 

 

Managing occasional episode of insomnia with an occasional 10mg of zolpidem, only if I have to work the next day. On weekends I don't mind living a day with insomnia. 

 

Fear of being on low dose of olanzapine for a long period has faded after observing how stable and settled Rrsfc, Badmedicine and morgana are.

 

Also realised that psychiatrists are after all not that bad always but just ignorant of the harmful effects of high doses of these medications and also the damage  rapidly withdrawing them can cause.

 

Have politely invited my SIL , a psychiatrist, to visit SA to witness what is happening to patients on high doses and what happens during unsafe withdrawal. She has agreed to. Hoping this knowledge will help her patients and in spreading word about the same. 

 

Politely turned down my employers offer for promotion with salary hike so as not to make my work stressful. Have allowed my junior to surpass me. No regrets at all. Happy with my decision. 

 

Have been able to beat these drug induced metabolic syndrome. Thanks to Dr Dixit Diet and life style modification. My weight is now within normal range for my height.

My diabetes is almost getting reversed, from 6 diabetics medicines a day, now only one tablet of 500mg of metformin SR in the night with good blood sugar control. I was sceptical about diabetes reversal earlier but I am believing now that it is a reality.

 

Morning walks time now extended from 20 min to 45 minutes. 

Morning meditation extended from 20 min to 45 minutes 

Evening yoga from 20 min to 45 minutes 

Building some arm and for arm muscles with dumbells as I need physical strength in my profession for another 20 years or so.

Gave up occasional social drinking, don't feel the need of it now.

 

Although I can manage social gatherings, avoiding them,  as I feel it is a waste of time and energy. Being alone most of the time, seems to be making more sense now. Family always there for company. 

 

While contemplating on the years that have passed by since childhood, at 53 my present state appears to be the best. Thanks to what these meds have done to me I have realised the worth of every moment of life of normalcy. 

 

Always grateful to SA , mods and friends on SA.

 

🙏

 

This is so pleasing to read, Venkat.  I am glad you are seeing comfort and benefits emerging.

 

1 hour ago, Venkat said:

Thank you @Rrsfc, I  always picture Hayduke, yourself and Badmedicine walking ahead and me following behind.

🙏

Heh, I'm hardly the first one down the mountain mate.  I have no doubt you inspire others too.  Every one of us who does this just makes it that bit easier for the next ones.

[Venkat]

Thank you so much for your support and guidance during those dreadful days @hayduke. Yes,  hope we can help the next ones find their way out of these meds safely and with confidence. 

🙏

[BadMedicine]

Great to hear you are doing so well @Venkat. Sounds like you have got a great self care routine in place as well which will stand you in good stead for the rest of your life. I’m glad you can find some positives from your experience with drugs as well. Makes the years of hardship that bit easier to bear. Keep up the good work. Best wishes. BM

[FireflyFyte]

I am so happy to hear that you are doing so well, Venkat, and that you are prioritizing yourself and your health. You will be down this mountain (stealing a metaphor from hayduke) of tapering before you know it.

[Venkat]

7 hours ago, BadMedicine said:

Great to hear you are doing so well @Venkat. Sounds like you have got a great self care routine in place as well which will stand you in good stead for the rest of your life. I’m glad you can find some positives from your experience with drugs as well. Makes the years of hardship that bit easier to bear. Keep up the good work. Best wishes. BM

Thank you so much @BadMedicine.

I am glad your decision making seems to be becoming easier and for good. When we can do things to ease us and please us rather than do it for the sake of others a new dimension to life is revealed which is devoid of the vicious circle of rat race and there is true happiness. 

Wishing you also the very best Badmedicine. 

🙏

[Venkat]

4 hours ago, FireflyFyte said:

I am so happy to hear that you are doing so well, Venkat, and that you are prioritizing yourself and your health. You will be down this mountain (stealing a metaphor from hayduke) of tapering before you know it.

Thank you very much @FireflyFyte. Yes all of us will be down this mountain sooner or later. Take care ,all will be well with you soon.

🙏

[Emily02]

Hi Venkat

It was so good reading about you doing well, I’m really glad for you.

Keep going and journaling 

Kind regards 

Emily

[Venkat]

Thank you @Emily02 . Happy to see you being busy ,which means you are doing well. I keep remembering your son. Hope he is doing good. My best wishes with him always. Take care. 

🙏

[hayduke]

Doing ok there @Venkat?

[Venkat]

Doing ok @hayduke, thank you. Hope you are taking good care of yourself. 

One question hayduke. Suppose I make a cut today and am feeling stable after 3 or 4 days, can I go for another cut on the 5th day or should I have to wait for usual next cut.

[hayduke]

2 minutes ago, Venkat said:

Doing ok @hayduke, thank you. Hope you are taking good care of yourself. 

One question hayduke. Suppose I make a cut today and am feeling stable after 3 or 4 days, can I go for another cut on the 5th day or should I have to wait for usual next cut.

Sometimes I found I could get away with it.  Other times less so.  I wouldn't be too shy of gently experimenting a bit with that, let us know how you go!

[Venkat]

Thanks @hayduke , will give it a try from next month and will update. 

[hayduke]

It's all trial and error in the end, the trick is not to bite off more than you can chew with any particular change.  Which of course requires some trial and error, hence why we advise sticking within 10%/mo 🙂

[Venkat]

Time for a bit of catharsis.

Doing fairly good at 1.05mg of olanzapine at 5 % of the previous dose every month. It has been one kind of a journey from 6.5mg. Although not out of the woods yet, glad I am  beginning to be myself and not dependent like a child which I used to be. My cognitive functions are recovering  well. 

 

Told my sis in law that my brother had played dirty in my life, that I have forgiven him, but I will not be associated with  him anymore. This boundary was just out of fear that, given the slightest chance he will not hesitate to institutionalize me just for the sheer pleasure of controlling someone. I am happy and relieved after taking that decision. My wife has approved that decision as well. 

 

After reading what hayduke had gone through I was reminded of the way I felt being back stabbed by my parents and family members when I was 1st forcefully institutionalized. Maybe my parents intentions were good but they could not see the hell they were pushing me into by my brother's prodding and that made me lose trust in my parents too. I have relinquished my rights over my parents property, happily, to avoid any association with my brother. I am happy and content with what I have and what I am earning. In India the new trend is to bribe people at psychiatric hospitals and institutionalize normal people forcefully to settle property disputes. Do we need a hell anywhere else in the sky.

 

Work is beginning to be enjoyable. 

Extended early morning walks to 5 kilometers (1hour). Taking my physical health for granted and neglecting yoga since a month but I am determined to be spending more time regularly with it.

Meditation is keeping me grounded.

Sleep is good for about 8 hours unless I spoil it with too much of internet or tobacco or alcohol. 

 

Tried a beer one weekend, it disturbed me for the next one week. Now wise enough to avoid alcohol and tobacco.

 

Olanzapine seems to have sucked my feelings and empathy. That is too worthy a quality to be lost. Not sure if my original quality of feelings will ever come back. There is no love in me. Not able to give or receive love. I know it. But patience I have enough. Lust feeling have emerged, trying to sublimate them for my good in my own way. No, not suppressing them or expressing them either. Attempting to transcend it and it is working.

 

Feeling much better after typing all this.

 

My prayers with my fellow travellers for a stable and a peaceful life sooner or later. 

 

Dear @hayduke @rupa@BadMedicine @Rrsfc @morgana  @Emily02 you are in my thoughts and prayers always.

 

Thank you @Altostrata @manymoretodays @Shep @ChessieCat 

 

🙏

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Altostrata]

Good to hear from you, @Venkat And your voice seem to be so much stronger, too.

[manymoretodays]

Hi Venkat!  Feels like a long time......but so good to read your most recent update.  And I had no idea what you were/are dealing with on the family member situation.  Just goes to show.......how we never really do know what another is going through.

 

I agree.  You rock!!!

 

I'm just going out on the limb a bit too, to say that I am feeling more than certain that your feelings will return again....in a more natural way, comfortable way.  And at first it might feel uncomfortable too, to feel them.  I know I still seem to with hold my tears from others and the few times I have released them in a group or something, then I......feel weird.  Sometimes for me, just one other person who will take all of me, as well as good faith too, really truly helps.  I mean life, unfortunately, isn't all roses and sunshine.  Yet, learning to be in it, with it, has been so wonderful for me.

 

Don't forget......it's also only a little over 1/2 year since you got off the Na Valproate.......if I'm reading correctly.  It all takes time.......  I mean I suppose there are those who bounce back to their personal normal quickly too.  Yet, it isn't all bad......or wasn't......for me.  Not at all.  I feel like the gains were worth waiting for, because they do exist.  Life is good for me.  I'm forever thankful, despite some of my losses incurred.

 

L, P, H, and G,

mmt

[hayduke]

@Venkat good to see your update.

 

Setting boundaries is really important.  It's good you have your partner to support you here.  

I hope your family respects your wishes and leaves you in peace.  It can be good to research - there are a lot of good videos to watch on wrangling narcissistic control, like Dr Ramani's series on youtube - and/or have a psychologist help you manage these boundaries if they don't respect your boundaries.

 

I agree with mmt, I think you'll start getting more in touch with your emotions again as you go.

 

Keep an eye out for tremors, twitchiness etc at the low dosages you are on.  If I'd known then what I know now, I would have held at the lower doses until they passed, even if it took some time.  As you've noted, wise to steer clear of the beers until you're well out of the woods too.

 

Cheers

[Venkat]

22 hours ago, Altostrata said:

Good to hear from you, @Venkat And your voice seem to be so much stronger, too.

Just a word or a sentence from you @Altostrata gives me lots of support and strength, and to all members as well I am sure. May your kind increase. 

🙏 

[Venkat]

12 hours ago, manymoretodays said:

Hi Venkat!  Feels like a long time......but so good to read your most recent update.  And I had no idea what you were/are dealing with on the family member situation.  Just goes to show.......how we never really do know what another is going through.

 

I agree.  You rock!!!

 

I'm just going out on the limb a bit too, to say that I am feeling more than certain that your feelings will return again....in a more natural way, comfortable way.  And at first it might feel uncomfortable too, to feel them.  I know I still seem to with hold my tears from others and the few times I have released them in a group or something, then I......feel weird.  Sometimes for me, just one other person who will take all of me, as well as good faith too, really truly helps.  I mean life, unfortunately, isn't all roses and sunshine.  Yet, learning to be in it, with it, has been so wonderful for me.

 

Don't forget......it's also only a little over 1/2 year since you got off the Na Valproate.......if I'm reading correctly.  It all takes time.......  I mean I suppose there are those who bounce back to their personal normal quickly too.  Yet, it isn't all bad......or wasn't......for me.  Not at all.  I feel like the gains were worth waiting for, because they do exist.  Life is good for me.  I'm forever thankful, despite some of my losses incurred.

 

L, P, H, and G,

mmt

Thank you @manymoretodays for your, as usual, kind and encouraging words. I am extremely happy that you are happy in your life. If only I could meet you and spend a few moments with you. For now I know it is just wishful thinking. 

🙏

[Venkat]

5 hours ago, hayduke said:

@Venkat good to see your update.

 

Setting boundaries is really important.  It's good you have your partner to support you here.  

I hope your family respects your wishes and leaves you in peace.  It can be good to research - there are a lot of good videos to watch on wrangling narcissistic control, like Dr Ramani's series on youtube - and/or have a psychologist help you manage these boundaries if they don't respect your boundaries.

 

I agree with mmt, I think you'll start getting more in touch with your emotions again as you go.

 

Keep an eye out for tremors, twitchiness etc at the low dosages you are on.  If I'd known then what I know now, I would have held at the lower doses until they passed, even if it took some time.  As you've noted, wise to steer clear of the beers until you're well out of the woods too.

 

Cheers

Dear @hayduke I have followed your expertise and it has helped immensely. Yes I will be cautious for those tremors and twitchiness and I will hold till it passes.

 

I hope you are holding well in your personal life and with paliperidone tapering as well. Wish I could do much more for you other than pray but don't know how else...

 

My parents were innocent and really good ,misguided by my brother and his Psychiatrist friend. Ofcourse my parents are no more and my conscience is clear that I had taken care of them in their old age when my brother left, persueing his dreams in UK.He is a doctor there.

 

Will go through Dr Ramani's YouTube hayduke. Please take care.

 

🙏

[BadMedicine]

Hi @Venkat. Great to hear you have got so low on the olanzapine. Wish you great success in your continuing taper. I truly believe your emotions will come back. You have seen great improvements so far so there is no reason not to believe that these improvements will continue. I know it’s hard to maintain patience but maybe by focussing on the improvements you have had so far you can keep your hope and spirits high.

 

very wise to set boundaries. After all your hard work getting off these drugs you must make sure you are not forced back on them unnecessarily by ill meaning people.

[Venkat]

Hi @BadMedicine thank you so much. 

Hope you are stabilizing well. I did read your recent post on your thread but did not know what to say. Still i do not have the self confidence to support others and still not able to grasp what others are trying to say in their posts. I keep remembering you and Rrsfc and hoping both of you would stabilize and do well. Hope things are ok on the work front as well. Please take care. 

 

🙏

[Rrsfc]

Hi @Venkat I'm so glad you are doing well. 1mg of olanzapine is wonderful, I am so happy for you. I believe you will make it and you will recover well, just give your brain a little more time. It's very hard when our family decides to institutionalize us, I also went through that in 2007 and I still fell hurt about how I was treated. Luckily it's over and you have your wife's support, that's so important.

 

Things are going well for me, I just take the pills and don't think about tapering anymore, I've been focusing on other things. I just made peace with it and I feel well and happy not at all lethargic or lacking emotion.

 

But you, you must feel really proud of yourself and your accomplishments regarding olanzapine. I wish you all the best! Sending you a big hug 😊

[Venkat]

16 hours ago, Rrsfc said:

Hi @Venkat I'm so glad you are doing well. 1mg of olanzapine is wonderful, I am so happy for you. I believe you will make it and you will recover well, just give your brain a little more time. It's very hard when our family decides to institutionalize us, I also went through that in 2007 and I still fell hurt about how I was treated. Luckily it's over and you have your wife's support, that's so important.

 

Things are going well for me, I just take the pills and don't think about tapering anymore, I've been focusing on other things. I just made peace with it and I feel well and happy not at all lethargic or lacking emotion.

 

But you, you must feel really proud of yourself and your accomplishments regarding olanzapine. I wish you all the best! Sending you a big hug 😊

Hi @Rrsfc thank you so much.

I am happy that you are doing so well. 

When I sit down for meditation in the morning I imagine you doing the same regularly and finding that space.

 

Glad you are focusing on other things as well and that you are having your emotions. I will wait for mine. Yes I will give as much time as needed. Always will remember the inspiration you provided. Wishing you a peaceful life. Take care Rrsfc.

 

🙏

 

 

[Venkat]

A small update that could be helpful to someone in a similar situation. 

When I made a cut from 1.05mg to 1.02mg of olanzapine ( 5% of the previous does) I was not able to steady my self even after 2 weeks ( usually used to steady after 5 days ). Mainly sleep issue , which got associated  with anxiety as I had to continue working.  Got worried too that I might break down if insomnia continued. Immediately updosed to 1.05mg (increase by 2.5 % of the dose that I was taking), started to eat curd rice with raw onion for dinner, as rupa had suggested , and warm milk with fried poppy seed powder. Not sure which one worked but sure small updosing made me sleep good and stabilize myself. Doing fine since a week. 

 

Realised , tapering by 2.5% of the previous dose every 2 weeks is more tolerable than 5% of the previous dose once a month at this stage of tapering olanzapine. 

🙏

[hayduke]

4 hours ago, Venkat said:

A small update that could be helpful to someone in a similar situation. 

When I made a cut from 1.05mg to 1.02mg of olanzapine ( 5% of the previous does) I was not able to steady my self even after 2 weeks ( usually used to steady after 5 days ). Mainly sleep issue , which got associated  with anxiety as I had to continue working.  Got worried too that I might break down if insomnia continued. Immediately updosed to 1.05mg (increase by 2.5 % of the dose that I was taking), started to eat curd rice with raw onion for dinner, as rupa had suggested , and warm milk with fried poppy seed powder. Not sure which one worked but sure small updosing made me sleep good and stabilize myself. Doing fine since a week. 

 

Realised , tapering by 2.5% of the previous dose every 2 weeks is more tolerable than 5% of the previous dose once a month at this stage of tapering olanzapine. 

🙏

I wonder if you are crossing over a receptor affinity layer.  Wise to take it slow here now, and look for signs of dopamine supersensitivity from here on out.

 

Well done on the effective minimal updose.  No doubt Rupa's suggestions are good too.

 

Cheers

[Venkat]

Sure @hayduke, will be taking it slow, maybe even 2.5% once a month if needed. Thank you. 

 

Happy to see you doing well hayduke, please take care. 

[BurntButterscotch]

Hi @Venkat  

 I’m not sure if you are still active here but I wanted to say thank you for the tapering schedule you created for yourself. I will be tapering for the same dosage and am also have issues with the math as well. This is extremely helpful. Hope you are still doing well. 

[Venkat]

Hi @BurntButterscotch I am so glad it is of help. 

 

l am still active here, just that hadn't updated lately. 

 

You will do well, please keep it slow.

 

Take care.

 

Regards

 

 

[BurntButterscotch]

On 12/28/2022 at 10:57 AM, Venkat said:

@BoyMom70 here is what I found 

[BoyMom70]

1 hour ago, BurntButterscotch said:

@BoyMom70 here is what I found 

This looks good. I’m a little scared of water titration because they say olanzapine doesn’t dissolve in water so I’m a little worried about if it would distribute evenly.  But people do it all the time so it must work. It’s all very intimidating honestly. I think if I can find a method of water titration that I feel secure enough with I would try it. 
I feel like it’s probably more exact that shaving down pills. But it does scare me a bit. But I’m going to look into it some more. A lot of people switch from pill cutting to water titration as the get down to smaller amounts. 
I really want to try maybe I will ask my pharmacist.. 

 thank you for this. I’m going to look into it. I wish you luck. I’m here if you 

need support.  Be brave. 
 

[BoyMom70]

On 3/8/2024 at 5:32 PM, BurntButterscotch said:

@BoyMom70 here is what I found 

Is the rest of this schedule available? 
I would also like to know how this water titration was working for other people. I want to try but I’m scared it won’t dissolve correctly and the dose will be questionable. 

[Venkat]

Hi @BoyMom70 i have been tapering below 1mg by making cuts in ml. I still haven't calculated in mgs. Will be planning calculations in mgs with my wife's help this weekend. 

 

Water titration method had worked well for hayduke and is working for me as well.

 

I too had the same doubts about olanzapine dissolving in water and the dose obtained from it. It forms a suspension in water not a solution which would be preferred. But I tried this method and this is working reasonably well.

 

🙏

 

 

 

[hayduke]

@BoyMom70 I have moved your last post into your own intro topic as these are general questions about your taper more than Venkat's.  @Venkat, feel free to reply over there if you like.