Venkat: tapering olanzapine / Zyprexa

[Venkat]

09/11/2022 ,0mg of sodium valproate. Was earlier on 1500mg of sodium valproate in 2019. Started to taper it by 50mg every month by cutting the tablet. When I reached 50mg of sodium valproate did not have the guts to jump to zero so using the syrup came down to 40mg for a month then 20mg for a month and took a jump to zero on 9/11/2022. I was alternatively olanzapine taper as well.

 

Drugs I was on when I entered SA.

Olanzapine, escitalopram, clonazepam, sodium valproate and valium. I could not put all details on signature because of space restrictions. 

 

So far so good, never had I dreamt that normalcy would embrace me although Alto had assured me I will get back my personality in a few months. 

 

Right now I have nothing to complain of. Filled with gratitude for SA. Thank you @Altostrata @manymoretodays @Shep @ChessieCat for your guidance, not just for me but for so many others like me.

Thank you @hayduke  @BadMedicine  @Rrsfc @rupa @herewego @Bokart@Emily02 @morgana for your company, guidance and encouragement during the journey. 

 

Not out of the woods yet ,but I feel I am beginning to step out of the tunnel into the light.

 

I was under the impression that even glimpses of normalcy was possible only after recharge 0mg of olanzapine but experienced some normalcy when I was reaching 2mg of olanzapine and it kept improving. 

 

Sleep is good. No anxiety, work is enjoyable. Cognition is improving. Able to go for morning walks, able to meditate and do yoga regularly. Lost good amount of weight after replacing rice with quinoa and multigrain flour. 

 

Presently tapering olanzapine at the rate of 5% of the previous dose once a month.

My dear wife is relieved that I am recovering. I am relieved that she and my son are relieved of my suffering. 

 

🙏

[morgana]

that is amazing @Venkat its sooo good to see people who never needed this **** in the first place finally get off it...zyprexa yes is a difficult one..but sounds like your doing fine...it great to hear....i hope i get my personality back one day too...good luck  and keep us updated  cheers morgana

[hayduke]

@Venkat that's really good to hear.  Slow and steady wins the race 🙂

@morgana there's no doubt your personality is excellent.  Being able to reconnect more with it emotionally will be super rewarding for you as you go.  Even when I was at my messiest many friends stood by me, so something there must have remained decent among the havoc.  I've no doubt it would be similar for you.

🙂

[BadMedicine]

Hi @Venkat. That is amazing news. You have done so well to get off so many drugs. It really is comforting to know that your personality has come back and that you are enjoying life again.

[Emily02]

@Venkat I’m really so happy to read your entry, so so happy.

Sorry I’m not very often online anymore, life is busy and still recovering alongside trying to get the best therapies for my son.

My cognition got a lot better as well after stopping Olanzapine. There’s still room for improvement but I guess the direction is right

All the bests

Emily

[Venkat]

3 hours ago, hayduke said:

@Venkat that's really good to hear.  Slow and steady wins the race 🙂



🙂

Thank you so much for all your help @hayduke. Yes being very slow and steady has helped. 

🙏

 

[Venkat]

3 hours ago, BadMedicine said:

Hi @Venkat. That is amazing news. You have done so well to get off so many drugs. It really is comforting to know that your personality has come back and that you are enjoying life again.

Thank you @BadMedicine. When I was about to give up tapering beyond 2.5mg , your words inspired me to continue. Best wishes with you always. 

🙏

[Venkat]

1 hour ago, Emily02 said:

@Venkat I’m really so happy to read your entry, so so happy.

Sorry I’m not very often online anymore, life is busy and still recovering alongside trying to get the best therapies for my son.

My cognition got a lot better as well after stopping Olanzapine. There’s still room for improvement but I guess the direction is right

All the bests

Emily

Appreciation from a fellow traveler means a lot @Emily02. Thank you. I am too very happy for you and your son , that you have recovered too. Yes there is scope for improvement for all of us after being so battered by these medications. Take care.

🙏

[Venkat]

4 hours ago, morgana said:

that is amazing @Venkat its sooo good to see people who never needed this **** in the first place finally get off it...zyprexa yes is a difficult one..but sounds like your doing fine...it great to hear....i hope i get my personality back one day too...good luck  and keep us updated  cheers morgana

Thank you so much @morgana. You seem to have got used to liquid taper and that is an excellent step to move ahead. All of us deserve to get back our personalities, you will definitely feel yourself very soon. Best wishes. 

🙏

[Rrsfc]

Hi @Venkat, I am so proud of your progress and thrilled to learn that you're thriving with your wonderful family at your side. I loved reading your post, it warmed my heart ☺️. I wish this new year brings you even more health and success on your endeavours, I wish you all the best. Sending you a big hug! Namastê 🙏

[Venkat]

Thanks a lot @Rrsfc. It felt good to see your post early in the morning. I am sure you are feeling stable and enjoying your life. Meditation must be relaxing you. I don't feel like going out of the house without meditating. I try to carry it into work place as well. Happened to listen to eckhart tolle, felt nice. You might like Tilopa's mahamudra. Enjoying your company. Take care. 

🙏

[FireflyFyte]

I haven't started my Olanzapine taper but reading your story has helped ease some anxiety around starting it when I am ready. It's good to see how going slow and steady has worked for you and glad that you are feeling better, Venkat.

[Venkat]

Dear @FireflyFyte , thank you. SA is the right place to be in while tapering psychiatric medications. You will get abundant support and guidance for a safe taper. Yes as you said it slow slow and steady. All the best. I Will do my best too , to support you. Take care.

[rupa]

@Venkat

Great update venkat.

It's not about weight.

I felt rice is a miracle grain to induce sleep and completely curing insomnia.

 

If you came up experimenting with other food which is  more effective,that's a good suggestion for others.

 

My experienced sense ,saying,people with multiple medicines can fast taper all the medicines,exept one,giving ample of time to brain to adjust changes,one medicine at a time with four weeks interval.

 

I was put on 1 mg resperidone which is very powerful if been stopped abrupt,then at suffering i was put on again but with  double medication this time,from which I stopped resperidone by taking 0.1ml four weeks.1mg mixed with 100ml water by soaking 4hours.

Now,I feel,long years of slow taper will not be required if first time itself,before stopping any medicine,1 ml liquid medicine be used for four weeks,then taper in four months.

I did this experiment on all my known people who are on meds,and they all escaped withdrawal turmoil.

 

Most important thing venkat,you are cutting the tablet ,which is risk ,for every day minute changes.

 

Instead I would suggest to soak and measure with syringes.

 

Take care.Best wishes.

 

 

 

[FireflyFyte]

4 hours ago, Venkat said:

Dear @FireflyFyte , thank you. SA is the right place to be in while tapering psychiatric medications. You will get abundant support and guidance for a safe taper. Yes as you said it slow slow and steady. All the best. I Will do my best too , to support you. Take care.

 

I am grateful that I found this site after a terrible withdrawal from another medication. I appreciate the support.

[Venkat]

Hi @rupa , thank you, hope you are doing good. You are doing a great job helping people on meds to taper. 

 

Because I have suffered so much with side effects and withdrawals  I do not have the courage to experiment anything new other than what is suggested on SA.

 

Hope some day the method of tapering that you are suggesting becomes time tested and help many more.

 

Yes rice with curds and onion which you had suggested did help me get sleep when I was struggling with insomnia. 

 

Since I was reducing sodium valproate at 50mg per month and the tablet was available in 200mg and 300mg it was easy to taper by cutting into half or quarter.

 

Olanzapine tapering  initially when I was on 6.5mg ,half solid tablet and rest liquid preparation. Later when I came down to 2.5mg it was all liquid preparation.

 

Take care 

🙏

 

 

[Venkat]

Also @rupa tapered valium (diazepam) by cutting the tablet using Ashton manual as diazepam too was available as 2mg, 5mg, and 10mg. 

 

So also with Clonazepam, tapered by cutting solid tablet as tolerated before SA.

 

Escitalopram too ,tapered slowly as tolerated before SA.

 

Inj paliperodone , I had stopped abruptly before coming to SA and suffered extensive withdrawals for more than 6 months without knowing it was withdrawals.

 

But with olanzapine I was strictly following suggestions by SA.

[Venkat]

My sister in law is an adolescent psychiatrist in UK. She was also responsible along with my brother for getting me forcefully admitted in a psychiatric hospital when I was spontaneously recovering from mania. She never understood what the medications were doing to me inspite of telling her. She kept saying those meds don't have those side effects and what I am going through is PTSD. Then when I was just beginning to recover last year and was able to type a bit I requested her not to prescribe antipsychotics to her patients as it would destroy them . But she replied to me saying she will continue to prescribe if need be. I sent her an article where a study was conducted related to the brain damage by antipsychotics, she replied saying they don't trust those articles. She is a good person by heart but ignorant and adamant. In case she realizes what she is doing to those adolescents I don't know how she is going to regret. I also realised her livelihood  too depends on prescribing those medications but at what cost. I even tried to get her to see how people are struggling with those medications on SA.

 

After few years of meditations she told me I should start tapering olanzapine. When I told her about withdrawal effects like insomnia she immediately said there is zolpidem. How can they be so ignorant about the side effects of benzodiazepines, its addiction and its side effects and difficulty in tapering. 

 

What is saddening is for every one person getting rid of these medications and attaining normalcy there are thousands being pushed into dependency and destruction by ignorant psychiatrists every day.

 

Dear mods I don't know if this was the right place to post this. I didn't know where else to post. If it needs to be moved else where kindly do so.

🙏

[Rrsfc]

Hi, you seem to have suffered a lot and you did right to try to share what you and a lot of people went through. But it's hard for psychiatrists to admit that what they were taught is wrong. The truth is that antipsychotics are effective for some people, I'm one of them. If I didn't have medications in my crisis I don't know what would have happened to me. They're overperscribed but in some cases they are adequate. So rest assured your sister in law is not harming everyone, maybe some of her patients but not all. They have side effects like any other drug and you have to weight the risks and benefits but they can increase life quality in some cases. A lot of people don't experience withdrawal or nasty effects.  Just wanted to share my experience with you so you can be more at ease with your situation, hope my words bring you some comfort. Psychiatric drugs are very powerful and we are beginning to see what they can really do, in time all will be well. But it takes time, science is very slow to evolve. There are already some psychiatrists that aknowledge withdrawal and are careful with drug perscription, the numbers will increase in time. You can send love and kindness to you sister in law and her patients and pray for the psychiatrists to be more open to the suffering of patients. Namastê 🙏

[Venkat]

Hi @Rrsfc , I am truly sorry I hadn't seen it from your point of view. Thank you for enlightening.

I work in a hospital atmosphere where I see psychiatric patients on medications never fully being themselves, always like zombies and related my suffering to them , added to the huge number of people on SA trying to taper because the drugs were doing more harm than good, I expressed unilaterally. 

Sorry again. 

🙏

[Venkat]

Yesterday I sent a WhatsApp msg to my psychiatrist (whom I had stopped seeing since 2 yrs) explaining what I had gone through with the meds and how I have been recovering with the help of SA. He replied back today saying he was very happy for me . I wanted to suggest to him to start a detox clinic but did not know how he would react to it. But may be some time soon I will request him to.

[Rrsfc]

NoNo need to be sorry ☺️ I just felt you were suffering and I was trying to show you that some people do benefit from the drugs so you won't feel so bad. The zombie like people is a sad reality though 😔. But before the zombies the hospitals were filled with out of control mad people (I would be one of them). What we have is by no means perfect but the medication made possible outpatient treatments, a lot of people have an almost normal life and without the drugs that just wouldn't be possible. I was also very angry because of the state of things and it was not good for me. Now I think I got past the hurt and I'm trying to be as healthy and happy as I can. I try to raise awareness too whenever I can, you should do it also. Your vision of a detox clinic is wonderful maybe you can persuade someone in time. Just be prepared to get some negative answers in the process... This is a start:

 

https://iipdw.org/

 

Things are changing but very slowly. I'm glad you're so full of energy and recovering well. ☺️  I wish you a wonderful day.

[Venkat]

Thank you @Rrsfc .

Hope someday we will have medications that target only the symptoms instead of shutting down most of the brain functions and the human being alongside. 

 

Until then let's hope psychiatrists use very small dosage of medicines and only when really needed and for a short period of time. If only safe tapering methods were included in their text books humanity would be benefited. 

 

Take care 

🙏

 

 

[Venkat]

Dear @ChessieCat I wish to contribute a little bit once in a while. When I tried to follow the link to contribute it was in dollars. Our currency is rupees. Did not know how to proceed. Kindly guide. 

🙏

[Venkat]

Dear @ChessieCat , tried again today. When I entered the country as India, I received a notification. "Donations to this recipient aren't supported in this country "

 

Can I ask my niece who lives in Boston to do the transaction. Thank you. 

🙏

[Venkat]

@Rrsfc went through the link you sent. IIPDW seems to be a great initiative. Signed up for its news letter. Thank you. 

🙏

[Venkat]

Need to keep reminding myself that there is still a long way to go before being completely normal. This thought keeps me grounded. Lots of ground yet to be covered to find inner stability and peace. 

 

Facing the real world after about seven years of hibernation isn't easy either.

 

Keeping my head down as I was all these years helps to face the society.

 

Also realised the outer society isn't as bad as it is usually projected. It has tolerated and accommodated me and not destroyed me when I was down and out. It has allowed me to work, earn ,take care of myself ,my family ,my health and my profession even when I wasn't myself. 

 

With gratitude 🙏

[rupa]

How unfortunate and pathetic,if a new thing makes an individual joyful and enthusiastic,or helpless,the person been labelled and sent to brain meds.

Labels as Mania,paranoia etc etc.

These meds are for people who harm self and others.

Instead,meds are prescribed for every individual.

 

[Venkat]

[Venkat]

[Venkat]

8 hours ago, Venkat said:

Also

To taper at 5% of the previous dose once a month, follow every 2nd row once a month.

 

To taper at 7.5% of the previous dose once a month, follow every 3rd row once a month.

 

To taper at 10% of the previous dose once a month, follow every 4th row once a month.

 

It can also help in gradual updosing starting from 2.5% of the dose being taken by moving upwards in the table. 

 

I am preparing a similar table to taper from 5mg to 2.5mg. Will post it when it is done.

 

🙏

[Venkat]

[manymoretodays]

Hi Venkat,

Long time........

Is this your own olanzapine tapering dose schedule?

Very cool!

 

Oh, okay......I scrolled up and read and see what you are doing with the charts.  Those will be helpful.

 

Easy does it now though......I see you got off the sodium valproate just on December 9th.

So I am hoping you are HOLDING or in that holding pattern now.

 

Any new symptoms or old symptoms lingering as far as WD goes now?

In other words......how are you faring?

 

Okay.  L, P, H, and G,

mmt

[Venkat]

So happy to be hearing from you @manymoretodays. That is my tapering schedule. Thank you.

 

When I first came to SA I was looking exactly for something like this because I was in no situation to think , comprehend or calculate tapering schedule. So thought this chart could help someone. 

 

My computer knowledge isn't that good either. My wife helped me prepare and post it. Sorry for the multiple inserts. Could not delete it. 

 

Yes I am done with sodium valproate. 

I don't seem to be having any specific withdrawal symptom as of now. I am doing farely well. Although I am not my complete original self yet.

 

I always remember your kindness towards me. Thank you manymoretodays. 

 

🙏

[Venkat]

Video of Olanzapine suspension preparation for liquid taper. 

 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/15oSVGHgLUy5xB1TfvdXio9d4C8kU5q4X/view?usp=drivesdk

 

When you are discarding either 1ml ,or 2ml , or 3ml of Olanzapine suspension using a 5ml syringe, instead of 20ml syringe will be more convenient. 

 

Hope this New Year brings us closer to our tapering goals safely. 

 

Happy New Year 

 

🙏

 

[Venkat]

Updating on SA is to me is a type of mental catharsis, a form of psychoanalysis where our dear mods and friends are psychoanalysts. It is a blessing. 

 

Olanzapine tapering going smoothly at the rate of 2.5% of the previous dose  every 2 weeks with hardly any troubling waves. 

 

Managing occasional episode of insomnia with an occasional 10mg of zolpidem, only if I have to work the next day. On weekends I don't mind living a day with insomnia. 

 

Fear of being on low dose of olanzapine for a long period has faded after observing how stable and settled Rrsfc, Badmedicine and morgana are.

 

Also realised that psychiatrists are after all not that bad always but just ignorant of the harmful effects of high doses of these medications and also the damage  rapidly withdrawing them can cause.

 

Have politely invited my SIL , a psychiatrist, to visit SA to witness what is happening to patients on high doses and what happens during unsafe withdrawal. She has agreed to. Hoping this knowledge will help her patients and in spreading word about the same. 

 

Politely turned down my employers offer for promotion with salary hike so as not to make my work stressful. Have allowed my junior to surpass me. No regrets at all. Happy with my decision. 

 

Have been able to beat these drug induced metabolic syndrome. Thanks to Dr Dixit Diet and life style modification. My weight is now within normal range for my height.

My diabetes is almost getting reversed, from 6 diabetics medicines a day, now only one tablet of 500mg of metformin SR in the night with good blood sugar control. I was sceptical about diabetes reversal earlier but I am believing now that it is a reality.

 

Morning walks time now extended from 20 min to 45 minutes. 

Morning meditation extended from 20 min to 45 minutes 

Evening yoga from 20 min to 45 minutes 

Building some arm and for arm muscles with dumbells as I need physical strength in my profession for another 20 years or so.

Gave up occasional social drinking, don't feel the need of it now.

 

Although I can manage social gatherings, avoiding them,  as I feel it is a waste of time and energy. Being alone most of the time, seems to be making more sense now. Family always there for company. 

 

While contemplating on the years that have passed by since childhood, at 53 my present state appears to be the best. Thanks to what these meds have done to me I have realised the worth of every moment of life of normalcy. 

 

Always grateful to SA , mods and friends on SA.

 

🙏