SunnyRainyDays: mirtazapine 2 months - 2.5 months of withdrawal

[SunnyRainyDays]

Update 7#

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It's been now exactly 5 months since I stopped Mirtazapine. Unless I disturb my nervous system with something (or PMS), I'm 95% of the time stable and in minor pain. My emotional numbness started improving over the past few weeks, and my intrusive thoughts completely stopped. When my nervous system gets a bit unstable, suicidal ideation and intense anxiety are my loudest symptoms, as always. But I can shut it off much better now when it does come up, and at least minimize the pain of it.

I can now listen to music without trouble as well, it doesn't stir me up anymore - coffeine, B vitamins etc. though still throw me completely off balance. I'm also still psychically very sensitive and the slightest scary or disturbing things make my WD state go through the roof, as well as situations like arguing with someone, etc. that involves strong emotions.

I also have an issue with weight gaining and am very few kg too thin, which is okay, because I believe WD takes a ton of energy both mentally and physically. I'm monitoring it so it doesn't get bad and eat more fatty foods.

 

I did Hypnosis, and I felt pretty good four days after it - the first three days were horrible as my WD symptoms were extraordinarily present due to the strong emotions I experienced during Hypnosis.

I also experience mild hallucinations, vertigo and weird dellusions that my brain clashes on whether something is true or not even if it was a joke, depending on how bad the WD/destabilizing situation is (few days before period it's the worst - but the symptoms are nothing new, although the minor hallucinations are new.). Mood swings of irritability accompany me from time to time too.

Very good news is that I don't cycle through personalities anymore but am now stable and almost completely myself. I can confidently say again that I am Me. It feels very right on how I am now and I'm happy with myself again. No depersonalization anymore! My surrounding also feels more real now, not anymore as if I'm dreaming.

 

I've been getting interested in drawing, writing and other creative areas more and more too - things I've been always keenly into but stopping Mirtazapine completely took away from me, which left me quite depressed as I felt like I lost all that I loved.

My brain can't stop thinking about drawing as if it wants desperately to do it but my body isn't responding to it. This was very commonly the case with other things that then came back (appetite, libido, reading books, writing, socializing, playing video games etc.) that my brain obsessed over it, thinking about how it wants to eat a waffle or read a book again until a few weeks later the true craving for it came or I enjoyed reading books for the first time in months (and I was always a bookworm). As it is with WD though, these things disappear and reappear again - I might love food for a week then for a week I don't, until it comes back for another two weeks and then disappears again.

 

So yeah, I think that's all... overall I feel I improved this month the most. Haven't seen this many big improvements in month 4 and 3 put together.

 

Cheers

[Onmyway]

Such good news @SunnyRainyDays, great that you are improving. There will be sensitivity for a while but these windows and improvements are amazing at showing us what's possible on the other side. 

 

Cheering from the sidelines,

omw

[SunnyRainyDays]

Update 8#
—————

Got into a crash again sadly. Everything is back to zero again, no feelings, my brain feels dead - I can’t think properly, I don’t care for anything, need ages to process an information and my memory has the length of a fly’s. Very often dizzy, the slightest thing stresses me to maximum and I’m again scared of everything that is around me to the point of being this terrorized at times that I feel like going insane. Suicidal thoughts which were for the most time gone in the past week returned, tormenting me again - rarely though, luckily. I’m back with derealization and depersonalization. And it was all 90% gone before the crash, which makes it more frustrating.

 

I’m back to low weight again, even though I was making progress before the crash, stabilizing at a more proper weight. It managed to get -1,3kg in two days since the crash started. My hunger is all over the place, sometimes I feel like binge eating and sometimes I feel like I can’t eat anything even though I’m hungry. I’m full before I’m even full.

I’m doing relaxation each time I notice my body’s getting stiff and tense again, as I cannot allow for the stress to make me lose even more weight. If it gets even less, I will have to ask for an appetite stimulant or other means of weight gaining, but only if it gets really bad. I have a very fast metabolism which right now really doesn’t help. I think though that it’s because of the stress and intense fight-flight state that I cannot eat much and burn more fat, since people with a lot of anxiety said that the best strategy to lose weight is to be anxious. And I agree.

I relaxed yesterday evening my body whenever it got tense and had the best night sleep I had in the last few weeks without using melatonine. I suppose if I relax more then I will be able to eat a lot more and lose less. There is also the question of hormones, and my period ended a few days ago, which is always the worst time for me.

 

But so far, need to wait through the storm.

[PortugueseSea]

My word OP,

That is a rollercoaster. I am hoping to start tapering Mirtazapine later this year and am trying to learn more about the process.
It seems that symptoms changing and window/wave patterns happening is part of the process, it means you are healing.

Keep posting and keep hopeful. All these problems are functional, which means they will clear as the brain rebalances. Much love.

[SunnyRainyDays]

Update 9#

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Tomorrow will be my 6th month anniversary. This month hasn't been a good one - continious crashes and very brief, rare windows (which are wonderful). I've been constantly in a wave this month with changing symptoms. Suicidal ideation moved more into the background, but now huge anxiety has been my most troubling symptom. I believe to see things that aren't there, a shadow becomes a figure though I know there is nothing and it's just a shadow. My mind tries to convince me that there is constantly danger. I sometimes get a chocking sensation too and get into panic, even though I myself know that I breathe just fine. My mind also believes that there is plastic in my stomach and won't get rid of that obscure thought. Basically, it's again into a state where it believes the most ridiculous things and will fear everything that exists.

I've been dreaming often of spiders the past few weeks, which is something I'm extremely terrified off. It's most likely my mind again trying to convince me that there is danger, and because spiders can hide well and you most likely won't see them it gets this anxious and wants me to check every wall and corner as there is most likely one somewhere, and no matter how much it gets convinced by plain sight that there is none around, it still believes there is one somewhere. It puts me back to one of my posts where I talked about neuro-anxiety and how it tries to convince you about everything though it isn't true.

My heartbeat is all over the place too. A bit of running is enough to send my heartbeat into a skyrocketing pace, and even sometimes when not doing anything it will just suddenly start beating faster and skipping beats. My blood pulse is completely fine though nevermind how fast it beats and it's something that just started occuring with the last crash. I had also heartburn for a while which appeared at the same time, which passed after one, two weeks and I haven't seen it since.

 

So far it's been a rough time, and the rougher it gets the less one believes to heal one day fully. I try not to think about a doomed future, for withdrawal is so unpredictable that in five minutes I might get a week long window or just as well another crash.

A week ago I ate a chocolate bar and felt so amazing after the sugar rush, yet ate another chocolate bar two days ago and felt tense and anxious. It's just too unpredictable. I might sip a little coffee and honestly I can't predict what will happen - saying for sure that the same thing will happen again if I do it a day later is impossible. I remember when a small sip of coffee put me into a window, and I remember a day where it just send me into a panicking state. It's like a game purely based on luck.

[SunnyRainyDays]

Update 10#

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I'm now 7,5 months off. The last two months have been terrible without a single window.

I feel absolutely zero, no empathy, nothing, just emptiness, deprived completely of emotions or any sensation. I kind of just exist, and that's about it. I feel no pleasure eating food and am more annoyed by hunger than anything because it just means to me that I have to stuff myself with something again. Libido is also almost non-existent for most of the time. To me, who always saw sense in life simply because she could feel emotions, this is absolute hell. I always lived for emotions, I loved the sadness, happiness, anger, the intensity of everything. Now everything is gone most of the time since withdrawal and I feel like I'm dying inside because of that. I want to lash out and scream because of the agony that I can't feel anything. And I do sometimes cry because of that, mostly out of frustration. I'm completely not myself, I don't recognize my thinking, my behaviour, nothing. All that's left of me are my memories where I was myself.

I also have trouble going to school, as withdrawal keeps going on with random dizziness or other things it can currently think of. Without black tea that keeps me more stable,, focused and awake every day I wouldn't make it. I can't drink caffeine, but theanine is okay - though I also can only use weak black tea else withdrawal shoots up. My short-term memory is still mostly broken even though it was one of the first things to heal... apparently.

I want my emotions back, I don't care about anything else. Should I have dizziness forever, I don't care, I just want to feel like I did again. I have posts where I described that I felt like my old self again, but now that it's been so long since the last improvement or window I completely forgot what any good was like.

Jesus - I can't else but to pity people that go through years and years of this until they heal. I can't help but feel so sorry for them, for those that end up unlucky and have to wait so many years to feel better. I understand why withdrawal drives people to suicide. This is worse than depression, this is worse than my initial problem I took the drugs for. I will always regret this decision, this naivety when I trusted doctors who didn't even know that hormonal imbalance causes problems mentally and physically. Should I be dying I won't take this ****.

[SunnyRainyDays]

Update 11#

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I'm doing better now. I'm neither in a wave nor window since around beginning of december. I'm again at a point of stability and continuing to improve. The lack of emotions, extreme sensitivity to any negativity and suicidal ideation still are my worst enemies, but I try to be patient. 

On the 4th January I'll be 10 months off Mirtazapine, and I'm still amazed at how 2 months of taking a little pill at the lowest recommended dose still causes issues till today. But I'm happy that I came this far and that I'm getting closer and closer to recovery with each day.

 

Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to everyone. I wish you all that 2023 will be the year where you fully recover, 100%.

[SunnyRainyDays]

Update 12#

~11 Months off

----------------

 

Tomorrow I'll be 11 Months off.

Did things get better over the past few months that I've been gone? Yes. Definitely.

 

:The Good

I don't react as sensitive to things like caffeine, sugar or vitamins anymore as long as they're in small doses if taken at once.

I don't need as much sleep anymore - I'm functioning fine with just 7 hours of sleep, unlike before where I had to get 9-8 hours of sleep with no exceptions.

I don't exhaust easily anymore and I'm most of the time not dizzy anymore.

My mind is sharp again, I can think and imagine well just as I once could.

My bluntness of feelings improved. I can feel more now - still not at baseline, far from it, but it definitely improved and shows more or less from time to time. My personality isn't still as it should be, as I know myself well and how I think and react, but for that I need the bluntness to lift. I noticed that the more I feel the more I am myself.

Intrusive thoughts lessened. I don't get images or thoughts of graphic content as often as in the past.

Sleep cycle regulated itself. Back then it was all over the place.

I can tolerate 98% of food that I once ate frequently.

 

:The Bad

Still feeling sometimes suicidal - since stopping Mirtazapine it has been one of my most prevalent symptoms.

PSSD + PGAD. Yes, both of them - not as strong that it would deliberate me and not 24/7, but at times it's hard to ignore. PGAD is definitey way worse than PSSD and right now the symptom that troubles me most. It just appeared a month/two ago or so and shows up from time to time (thank god just from time to time.) Combined with intrusive thoughts, it can become a nightmare - luckily only a short one, it never lasts too long. PSSD is sometimes less sometimes more - overall both of them aren't something I'm worried about that it won't heal, I understand it takes time and I'm not even finished with withdrawal. PGAD appearing out of nowhere is just another proof that things are changing and healing. One day it will vanish, just like the other symptoms.

Anxiety - sometimes I get extremely anxious without reason, suddenly I get the sensation that I don't get enough air, etc.

PMDD is still heavy - right before period it makes me extremely depressed and ramps up my withdrawal symptoms, and shortly after period it also causes trouble like brain fog or tiredness.

Random compulsions that appear randomly and vanish randomly still are there (ex. urge to touch or do something constantly, like constantly wanting to touch your hair, tap your fingers, close on eye, etc.)

Very sensitive - reading, hearing or seeing something even slightly disturbing can get me into a state of suicidal distress - the intrusive thoughts sometimes do that. I'm not as extremely sensitive though as I once was, and process these things now much faster and don't react as strong anymore.

Having to pee every 1-1,5 hours except at night when sleeping or lying. At very rare occassions I have days where I don't need to pee for 3-4 hours, but they're extremely rare. I hope that improves some day soon, as it's really annoying.

 

So, how would I say that things improved? I'd definitely say that I've done 50%+ of the road. Maybe about 60%. It's hard to judge - I scarcely remember how I was once heavy into withdrawal, but I remember it was awful and deliberating. A few months ago I was functioning only with great effort - today I can go out safely out of my home without having to worry that I'll collapse. I don't have to watch as closely anymore to not overexhaust myself from simple things. I remember being hopeless a few months ago, but today I'm patiently watching as symptoms come and go, as I have an assurance that they will go away - whether it'll be in a few days, weeks, months, years - it'll eventually go away. If it improves in any way, or comes completely back even for just a few seconds - that means full healing of this particular symptom is possible.

 

 

 

[SunnyRainyDays]

13# Trigger warning, might upset
——-

Three days before the 1 year mark I got into an intense wave. I stressed too much, and before I noticed it happened - ringing in ears, back pain, jaw pain, intense suicidal ideation, depression, not wanting to eat, intense anxiety. The instability in withdrawal is huge, a small thing can tip it over. Once when a barber ruined my hair - such a little thing - I got suicidal and feeling awful, because emotions stirred my withdrawal up. It’s terrible. And nothing against it works; no calming technique, nothing.

I thought at first my panic/anxiety attacks returned, as they feel somewhat similar, but unlike those, this one here doesn’t react to calming down and it feels different. It feels more like when I first stopped the Mirtazapine and had intense suicidal feelings and thoughts for two weeks. I hope this wave won’t last as long, as right now I’m in really intense pain, and death would be only a release. I yearn for death almost. I have also crying spells over everything. A single sad thing and I feel like crying my eyes out. I’m dizzy again too. My veins all over my body feel like they have cold water flowing through them. It feels like my suffering is eternal, but I’m waiting for it to calm down as when the wave lessens a bit I don’t feel like wanting to die at all. But in this wave I feel like I always suffered and there is no way out, no other way out. If I had a gun, I’d probably do it - but luckily I don’t have a gun and no way to get one; and all other methods are too long, too painful, too scary. I thought like that when I first stopped Mirtazapine too, exactly the same thoughts. I want to live badly beneath it, but without this suffering. When the wave stops for a few seconds it feels sometimes like I don’t understand how I ever wanted to die; the same in windows. I don’t understand what was this bad.

I’m waiting through it, with the thought that “If it’s still bad in ____ (time), I can do it later”, which surprisingly, no matter how morbid, keeps me fighting through.

I want badly to be able to live to the age of 80, and I want badly to be able to tell one day that “I made it” and do a success story, and look back to how awful it was and tell that it gets much better and it all passes and it’s all an illusion of the destabilized brain. I had to get all of that off my chest; feels a bit better now.

But right now thinking about anything just depresses me; I can’t find anything to be happy about even a tiny little bit. My emotions got again flatter than ever. I haven’t had windows in months already. I don’t know which thoughts are mine and which are from withdrawal. I don’t know at all anymore how it was to feel normal, before withdrawal.

[SunnyRainyDays]

14#
——

In terms of functionality I feel worse off than I was 6 months ago. If I do any of these, my withdrawal symptoms ramp up or put me entirely in a wave.

 

I can’t have any caffeine.

I can only have limited theine.

I can’t sleep too much.

I can’t sleep too less.

I can’t move too much.

I can’t get too excited, nervous or stressed.

I can’t be hungry.

I can’t be thirsty.

I can’t stay around in hot temperature.

I can’t stay around in too cold temperature.

If I eat something bad that causes stomachaches the withdrawal symptoms ramp up too.

I can’t have too much sugar.

I can’t have too low sugar.

I can’t stare too long at a screen.

I can’t get too tired.

I can’t watch anything even slightly triggering.

I have to avoid negative situations, like arguing, entirely. Slightest stir can put me in a bad state.

I can’t have any vitamins.

I can’t even have any melatonine anymore, because it causes me to feel extremely bizarre.

 

All of it causes such difficulties to function properly in life. I have to constantly watch if I feel hungry, tired or anything because I know if it gets too bad I’ll get symptoms like dizziness, weird vision and breathing issues. It makes it also stressful and hard to go to school often, but I have to manage. The worst thing is when I’m in a wave and I have to go.

When I first stopped the pill I didn’t have such deliberating issues at all for so many months. Now a few months ago they popped up and wreck havoc. This extreme sensitivity to everything makes me annoyed and angry. Even if I stay at home I still feel awful, and I need to stay from time to time at home because it’s just too deliberating sometimes.

I even fainted once, twice in a row because of this **** withdrawal. I was almost never close to even fainting before, not even when I lost a lot of blood due to a very strong period. And here I just got up from bed and it happened. A year ago it would have been unthinkable to me, even just six months ago it was unthinkable.

Before all the stories with antidepressants happened I went wandering for 6 hours in a forest, and except for paining legs I didn’t have anything; and I’m not really sporty. 

But this once strong body now breaks as easy as a twig in just the slightest wind. Walking 5 minutes too much now causes trouble.

 

I’m worried about the summer, because if it gets really hot I don’t know if I’ll even manage to go to school. Six months ago I went on more or less intense bicycling and almost nothing happened. But since that sensitivity to everything kicked in I can’t even go on a bicycle at all. How if I’m even dizzy at home, without doing anything?

When I’m at school I have to watch if I’m getting too strained, because if I am, I have to go home. I often don’t last 8 hours in school, max 4-6 hours. Luckily we barely have school for more than 6h.

There was a week, not so long ago, where I lasted 8h and more without feeling strained. That felt really good and like an accomplishment; sadly, that was only for a week. But at least it’s something. But it felt so good being able to exhaust oneself and not feel any worse withdrawal symptoms because of it.

 

I also had a short window that lasted about ten minutes yesterday. I felt like myself, I felt even joy, and I felt like I could do and accomplish anything; extremely optimistic, and for those few minutes almost no withdrawal symptoms were there. It felt like nothing mattered much, like I could survive anything, like the whole future was before me. I hadn’t felt like that almost since the beginning of withdrawal.

 

It’s been extremely an up and down since the last few months, more down though. But I’m past the one year mark now, and I’m happy I lasted this long. I’m curious what’ll be at the two year mark. I’m not any close to recovery, very little symptoms improved permanently (my memory and concentration is now entirely back to normal since a few months), and I have still a long way ahead of me. Sometimes it does feel like I made half the way, and sometimes it feels like I still have a few long roads to cross. Withdrawal is unstable though and anything can change any second for the worse or the better. In my eyes, judging by the progress so far, until I can write a success story, it might take maybe 1,5-2,5 more years. It can’t be sped up, but I hope I have the worst year behind me.

 

[Onmyway]

Hi @SunnyRainyDays, 

these are the symptoms of a severely destabilized nervous system and with patience they will resolve. Some things have already left. Take this as an opportunity to tune into your own needs (even hunger/quiet/other external stimuli) - a chance to practice self care. So often we are not at all in tune with our bodies and needs. 

 

Hope you keep healing, 

OMW

[SunnyRainyDays]

15#
——

I’m stuck again in a really bad wave.

It feels overall like I cold-turkeyed a high dose. The anxiety is massive, almost paranoid, I feel weak, like fainting at any time. Had to stay at home now for the past days since it started. I almost feel like shaking. Everything scares me, at random times I get traumatizing pictures in my head from the past. It feels almost unbearable. Nothing works against it, I can’t calm down. I feel like doom is looming over me all the time.

I honestly feel so much worse a year off than a half year off. A half year ago I was at least functioning well enough, now I almost stay all the time at home because I can’t do anything and I feel just constantly stuck in waves. It seems endless. There wasn’t a day since a long long time where I just felt good, where the future seemed bright. It’s just a constant struggle, all the time. I wish for just a few minutes of quiet, with no anxiety, nothing. I don’t even want to do anything, just sit and distract myself. I don’t have the strength to do anything.

The only escape is sleeping and dreaming at night. I had a few times where I was scared of sleeping for no reason, but I know this anxiety that’s scared of every little thing well enough. It’s unlogical and I don’t understand it, therefore it’s not out of my own head. But it’s there all the time, and I don’t feel reality because of it in the slightest. I can touch myself and the anxiety goes up, and asks itself paranoid “what’s touching me?” even when it sees, knows that it’s me touching myself. Everything is dangerous to it, needs to give alarm all the time that something’s wrong when there isn’t. It’s very, very tiring.

[SunnyRainyDays]

16#
——

I got an entirely new set of symptoms that I didn’t have before; my body feels electrical sensations all throughout, too in the head, except in the legs, which I never had before. I also got head pressure for the first time, and headaches in certain places. It was alarming to me first, I was thinking that I’m getting into some kind of seizure with twitches before realizing a few days later, now not long ago, that these are just new WD symptoms. I’m also having mood swings and vertigo/slight balance issues. I get sometimes random bursts of anxiety and severe stress, which are then a few minutes later replaced by a certain happiness before getting replaced by anxiety or sadness again.

I stayed home today again too because of being afraid of falling or getting a seizure or similar. It’s better now, so I’m trying to go out tomorrow and attempt at functioning normal again. It’s reassuring to know this is just WD, and not something serious. These sensations really scared me for a while.

Right now what just worries me most is that I sometimes get chocking sensations, as if not getting enough air, and I’m afraid of triggering it, as I’m almost panicking when I get it. It also comes sometimes random without any cause and goes away after a few minutes or less. It’s still so uncomfortable though.

 

I’m happy I’m in a better place now than I was a few days ago or two weeks ago. I had a few hours where I felt zero suicidal ideation or any kind of depressed feeling, which made me feel very myself again as I got into my old way of thinking.

I’m most sensitive right now to stimulation (meaning no music or fast changing on screens, too long phone time) which sometimes goes away for a short while. It’s always unusual when I can listen to music or watch something fast paced without anything happening. Almost weird. Overall when I’m able to do something I normally cannot do it’s almost fascinating.

I hope I can one day regain that strong body and mind I once had. I’m getting closer at least.

[SunnyRainyDays]

17#

---

Changing of symptoms has been in the last week/two quite aggressive. Almost every day there is a new set of symptoms, changing, with some old gone and some not, some reappearing and some not. Like extreme mood swings, consantly changing. Most significant in that though is that symptoms appear that I've never had before (electrical sensations, head pressure, brain feels frozen, needle stinging in certain parts of the head and headaches in these parts, etc.) which I take as a good sign, because it means the brain is in a (completely) different state than it was a few months or a year ago.

Suicidal feelings is the one symptom that persists though no matter what, whether weak or strongly present. It rarely ever disappears, and when it does, it's almost only in windows. A week ago it disappeared for a few hours completely, and it felt really good. It just didn't feel like I'm suffering and close to dying all the time; a state that was very well bearable.

[SunnyRainyDays]

#18

——

Found out that my hormonal contraceptives that I take against my PCO-Syndrome aren’t the right ones…

I took a different brand a year ago which I was very well for me until pharma started selling me a different one, telling it’s the exact same just with a different name. But I noticed immediately that I feel different on them, but hey, it’s the same one I thought. But it isn’t.

Will get my usual hormones prescription and buy my former one, not accepting any other.

I wonder how many symptoms are actually from the bootleg contraceptive. Surely a lot of the blood pressure and hunger/blood sugar ones. Are more depressed on it too. Heart is unwell on it. Didn’t have any of these problems on my former one.

[SunnyRainyDays]

#19

——

Symptoms change almost all the time right now, things are getting fast and quick changing. They change about every 3-5 hours, either an old one goes or a new comes in. Some stay untouched.

I’m shortly before period, and it always gets worse before that.

Taking an antibiotic stirred me up for two days though, but it’s back to stable now mostly. I’m not fond of taking it, since the story with remeron I don’t have even a little tick of trust in medicine, especially medication that isn’t ibuprofen or paracetamol. But if you have to, you have to. When it gets fully out though I get stirred up because it’s now not used to not having the antibiotic. Well, withdrawal is very sensitive after all.

 

It’s been now 1 year and 1,5 months since quitting. For someone with WD it is a very, very long time. The more suffering the longer it seems. Yesterday I had a crash that made it seem like forever, and that it would go on forever. But I do my best to not listen to it. I hope for the better days to come soon and that it will be gone one day soon too.

Survival through bad times is better when you know this isn’t you; and you know because it doesn’t feel right at all, and nothing like yourself. You know these aren’t your feelings and thoughts, but are withdrawal’s fault. It makes you just strong enough to go through it. WD’s best ally is despair.

 

[SunnyRainyDays]

#20

——

I have mental Akathisia almost all the time… I first got this feeling when I went on Effoxor and didn’t know it was caused by the drug, but I was surprised because I never experienced this feeling ever before. After stopping Mirtazapine I now have it almost all the time, but only now found the name for it. It’s like something needs to happen or I will go crazy, sitting still for 2 minutes without distraction is absolutely painful. It makes sitting at home the worst experience to be. And I sometimes have to stay at home, like now because the withdrawal is too heavy and agarophobia too big.

I also somehow have intense urges to spend money, and I can’t keep my head off it. It lead me to being scammed, not for a lot of money, but still it annoys me. I don’t even want to spend money, it’s just like an urge that I have to resist with all my might. I never ever had slightest problem with money before and was always a very analyzing person before buying something, wanting to spend very wise. This here reminds me about how bipolar people go on spending sprees when having a high.

I have often urges about different things though since stopping the Mirt, be it about violence, washing hands, sexuality or touching my face, clenching teeth. It’s extremely painful to fight these intrusive thoughts and compulsions. It makes the suicidal feelings worse, as it seems to be the only way out of this nightmare sometimes. As if I can’t control my hands, it’s scary.

The derealization I experience right now makes it even worse as everything feels like nothing matters and is real. I don’t even know if I’m real during these phases. It feels like a simulation going on. Sometimes I think or say something or something happens and I’m not sure if I really said it or it really happened. My dreams are very disorganized and unusual too since lately. Paranoia kicks in sometimes too, thoughts about being monitored all the time. Or that someone is behind me when I go on walks outside.

I’m stuck again in a very heavy wave. I’m 1-2 days before my period so it might make it worse. I just hope for fast relief, it’s god awful. One of the worst days.

[SunnyRainyDays]

This is the worst I’ve ever been. The mental Akathisia is unbearable, I’m overwhelmed with this torture so much that I feel like I’ll go crazy the next second and scream and scratch at the walls. Being housebound since a month makes it worse, all I can manage is go on a short walk outside. I feel like I’m deprived of senses. I have a constant buzzing sound in my head, the one you hear when you’re about to faint. I can’t hear as good either. I also feel often like I’m about to faint.

I’m most afraid that I’ll really go crazy and they hospitalize me for being overly psychotic. I have also a very strange way of thinking and believe I can talk with ghosts and catastrophes are coming. I never had that before.

I’m failing school because I can’t go anywhere. In this state I won’t be able to get any kind of job or any school. I have no future this way. Going on short-term disability and staying housebound seems like my only option.

 

Why am I crashing down this severely after over a year of being off? It feels like doom is coming over me, like the world is crashing. It feels like this since two months already, but since yesterday it’s especially bad. Time seems endless, I don’t have any feeling of routine or anything. It got so bad I don’t know why I’m eating or sleeping anymore. I’m completely derealized, out of touch with everything. My legs feel sometimes numb, and I don’t feel touch anywhere properly.

I just took the lowest dose of Remeron for 2 months. Why is it this severe after so long off??? A half year ago I felt like recovery is close. Right now I feel like I cold turkeyed several high doses at once. As if withdrawal just started; and when it started back then it was only a fraction of what I have now. I feel like I’m dying constantly over again all the time. I don’t recognize myself in the slightest. I can’t recognize my voice when speaking, my thoughts when thinking. It’s the worst hell. It just seems to be getting worse and worse and worse, as if my state doesn’t improve but instead deteriorates all the way down.

[JandD]

Hello SunnyRainyDays,

I am only a non-professional, but my feeling is that your withdrawal symptoms should have improved with the mirtazapine after more than a year. 

Therefore, it may be something else that is causing you to have this difficult condition. 

My guess is the hormone supplements you are taking or a serious nutrient deficiency. 

Maybe have a look at https://www.walshinstitute.org/ and have a comprehensive examination of your blood and hormone levels. By a professional who thinks of the patient first. In Germany, there are also some people who come into question for me in this area. 

All the best!

[SunnyRainyDays]

3 hours ago, JandD said:

Hello SunnyRainyDays,

I am only a non-professional, but my feeling is that your withdrawal symptoms should have improved with the mirtazapine after more than a year. 

Therefore, it may be something else that is causing you to have this difficult condition. 

My guess is the hormone supplements you are taking or a serious nutrient deficiency. 

Maybe have a look at https://www.walshinstitute.org/ and have a comprehensive examination of your blood and hormone levels. By a professional who thinks of the patient first. In Germany, there are also some people who come into question for me in this area. 

All the best!

 

I do have the plan of switching the contraceptive until a right one is found... I have the most chaotic hormonal chaos in existence. Every symptom one can find in hormonal imbalance I probably have. Most websites play it off mildly, as it isn't even that well researched. But digging deeper, there are articles of how it can cause psychosis, sleep distruption and panic attacks and much more.

I sadly don't have any doctor who cares about nutrition near me, nor the walsh way. German blood tests about nutrition are also scarce and only cover vitamins and few metals like iron. I took an antibiotic not long ago, and it could have stirred everything up too, destroying microbiome and causing problems in hormones too.

I'm trying to get the hormones right. I'll try the nutrition if that won't show the desired effects.

Thank you for your advice and reply!

[SunnyRainyDays]

I think I am just in a heavy wave next to my hormonal problems. I have constant electric shock sensations, and they’re especially strong if I immerse myself into music (can’t listen to music still though. Stirs up a lot, here I just tried to do it for a few seconds.) I also have sometimes on various body parts numbness or burning sensation. These are all symptoms for CNS damage, even if you Google one of these symptoms it immediately appears. I guess I have to wait it out. Maybe the severe hormone imbalance causes it to act so bad. After all during withdrawal one is extremely sensitive to any changes in the body (like taking vitamins, caffeine etc) not to mention nearly all women are affected by PMS/PMDD during withdrawal. Biology of such things is so complex, especially when it comes to the brain, that I can’t assume anything.

I had in mind something like a delayed acute withdrawal, as to say “the true withdrawal” starts first now, but I haven’t found here anything like that so far. I found people though with Mirtazapine whose withdrawal started first after 6-12 months and it’s also a tricyclic class of its own that acts different than any other tricyclic/antidepressant according to research sites, so who knows… the brain is really complex. But one thing I surely know is that this drug is one of the most unpredictable when going off it.

The withdrawal effects of Mirtazapine are also most commonly electric shock sensations, confusion and abnormal dreams. I currently have the three the strongest. Especially the shocks all over my back that make sometimes my stomach, chest and arms hurt, like hundreds of volts are running through my body.

So it is a theory that acute withdrawal might be starting really now. But I don’t know, it sounds silly… but it wasn’t ever this bad like it was the past few weeks. I seriously feel like I cold-turkeyed a high dose of an AD. Before the severe crash I had a few weeks period where my symptoms constantly switched every hour, along with completely new symptoms I didn’t have before ever. It is weird and confusing. Let’s see how the coming few weeks and months will change stuff.

[JandD]

On 6/3/2023 at 3:40 PM, SunnyRainyDays said:

 

I do have the plan of switching the contraceptive until a right one is found... I have the most chaotic hormonal chaos in existence. Every symptom one can find in hormonal imbalance I probably have. Most websites play it off mildly, as it isn't even that well researched. But digging deeper, there are articles of how it can cause psychosis, sleep distruption and panic attacks and much more.

I sadly don't have any doctor who cares about nutrition near me, nor the walsh way. German blood tests about nutrition are also scarce and only cover vitamins and few metals like iron. I took an antibiotic not long ago, and it could have stirred everything up too, destroying microbiome and causing problems in hormones too.

I'm trying to get the hormones right. I'll try the nutrition if that won't show the desired effects.

Thank you for your advice and reply!

 

My wife got a thrombosis from the antibaby pill, which almost cost her life. We then used the temperature method and condoms for over 10 years without any hormones. It worked excellent. Also when we decided to have a child.

[SunnyRainyDays]

@JandD I’m not using the pills to not get pregnant but because of PCOS

[SunnyRainyDays]

Had blood tests done again at the gynecologist, severe PCOS confirmed. Starting new contraceptive and seeing if it works better. Normally you do a low-carb diet for it too but I’m too thin and have problems with gaining weight so it’s too dangerous for me in case I lose weight. Cutting off sweets though.

Getting also my spine checked.

Started psychotherapy as well.

Was advised to take D3, so I’m looking if it causes any stir ups like it did half a year ago. If no, I’ll keep taking it.

[pianoblueman1000]

Have you gotten any better since you posted last June?  Please keep us posted. 

[SunnyRainyDays]

Not that much really. One improvement I noticed is that vitamins or supplements or things like caffeine don’t stir me up like they used too; I can now take moderate doses of various supplements with little to no side effects. Other than that… most things got worse.

 

I’ll update my list of symptoms as it’s been long since I did it last time:

 

-Extreme brain fog

-Suicidality that pops up from time to time

-Depressed and irritable mood

-Heavy anxiety (sometimes better sometimes worse; the contraceptive now tuned it down somewhat)

-PSSD (something that had its ups and downs since quitting Mirtazapine and still does. Currently it’s not in a good state since a few months. PGAD pops up from time to time.)

-Derealization/Depersonalization (heavy at the time)

-Mood swings (most probably Hormone related)

-Weird vision perception where things seem closer than they are

-Pins and needles in head

-Tinnitus (new)

-Blood pressure swings

-Intrusive thoughts and personality changes that pop up from time to time

-Permanent Fatigue

-Forgetfulness

-Permanently feeling overwhelmed 

-Electric shocks in back, neck, arms (getting MRI of spine to rule out clenched nerves, etc)

-Feeling like not getting enough air

-Anhedonia (also has ups and downs where it’s sometimes better and sometimes worse)

[Adeeva78]

12 hours ago, SunnyRainyDays said:

Not that much really. One improvement I noticed is that vitamins or supplements or things like caffeine don’t stir me up like they used too; I can now take moderate doses of various supplements with little to no side effects. Other than that… most things got worse.

 

I’ll update my list of symptoms as it’s been long since I did it last time:

 

-Extreme brain fog

-Suicidality that pops up from time to time

-Depressed and irritable mood

-Heavy anxiety (sometimes better sometimes worse; the contraceptive now tuned it down somewhat)

-PSSD (something that had its ups and downs since quitting Mirtazapine and still does. Currently it’s not in a good state since a few months. PGAD pops up from time to time.)

-Derealization/Depersonalization (heavy at the time)

-Mood swings (most probably Hormone related)

-Weird vision perception where things seem closer than they are

-Pins and needles in head

-Tinnitus (new)

-Blood pressure swings

-Intrusive thoughts and personality changes that pop up from time to time

-Permanent Fatigue

-Forgetfulness

-Permanently feeling overwhelmed 

-Electric shocks in back, neck, arms (getting MRI of spine to rule out clenched nerves, etc)

-Feeling like not getting enough air

-Anhedonia (also has ups and downs where it’s sometimes better and sometimes worse)

Thanks for sharing your update! I myself have been in withdrawal since end of March and experience some Pgad symptoms mainly burning and tingling. I also experience sleep orgasms on and off that I hate. I am so sorry you are still experiencing these symptoms. I also have some suicidal thoughts that come and go. 
 

When your Pgad flares do you get a burning sensation?

 

all my best to you!!

[SunnyRainyDays]

Hey @Adeeva78,

 

I do get sometimes burning sensations. Over the course of my withdrawal I have experienced numbness, burning, pain and pressure feeling. It changes from time to time. I even had extreme dizziness from the slightest of arousal for a few weeks. That stopped thankfully not long ago - PGAD at that time did not make it better.

Sexual symptoms are certainly one of the worst parts of withdrawal if you have them.

 

I wish you a smooth and short journey : ) PGAD usually doesn’t last too long when it comes up

 

 

 

[SunnyRainyDays]

My brain feels dead for weeks already with no change. I’m disconnected from reality, heavily anxious to the excess of paranoia and have zero feeling of time or existence. My brain is kind of thinking on its own, throwing random thoughts here and there and won’t shut up. I’m in a state of confusion all the time. I haven’t had silence in me or mental rest since what feels like an eternity. My feelings of hunger and sleep are all over the place. I feel like I’m going crazy. It’s like my brain cannot get used to the fact that Remeron isn’t there anymore. It’s like it won’t revert to proper homeostasis and is stuck in this disfunctional state. I’m almost completely housebound except for five minute walks here and there and can’t care for myself on my own. It never was this bad. Four months ago I was functioning almost normal with the exception of symptoms here and there that came and passed over the course as it is with withdrawal.

Now I can only go outside in the evenings for a short time because loud sounds like a dog’s barking trigger me to the point electric shocks come all over my body, I can’t breathe correctly and start to suffer panic. A single little thing like this is only needed to tip me over like this. My mind sees danger literally everywhere. I’m afraid to bathe because my mind believes strongly that I’m going to drown. When a person is walking behind me my mind strongly believes that they’re going to attack me and so and so on. It annoys me so much. I’m stuck 24/7 in a hyper-alert state I can’t get out of no matter what I try. Nothing helps. I tried Ashwagandha for a few days to see if it does something, but it barely had any effects at all so far (I might resume it to give it more time to work after I find a good contraceptive). There is nothing more I wish than just at least five minutes of silence in my mind. No anxiety, no thoughts at all, nothing. Just silence. Awful tinnitus which started a week or two ago just makes it worse.

 

I started also Psychotherapy two or three weeks ago; it does work in a way that I understand and grasp it all, but it faces the one situation I had a year ago when I stopped Remeron: I think that the anxiety is stupid and unreasonable and makes no sense - this is somewhat proof that it doesn’t come out of my own head. I can explain my real fears, I can tell what is scaring me about it. But if thoughts like “you’re going to drown” are pissing me off it means that I know and think it is bullsh*t. This isn’t me fearing it. This is neuroanxiety. It’s not real.

And when sometimes moments happen where I feel like myself, when the fog lifts and I can breathe clearly, that’s where the cracks start to show. I enjoy these moments because I know they’re short. But I also hope to be like this fully again someday.

 

Days pass by extremely quickly when you have zero feelings of time or existence, so at least I don’t experience that much “how long yet”. But I hope it is soon; just a little improvement to give a little optimism. Right now it feels like it won’t change for ages or ever, but I try to avoid this doom thinking.

The longer I get through this, the more I respect and admire people who survived years in withdrawal. They truly spit death in the face and are one of the strongest people to possibly be on earth.

[BelaLugosi]

Hoping you get better omg. Thank god we have windows at least

[andy96gr]

Hello @SunnyRainyDays,are you feeling any better?🥺

[SunnyRainyDays]

Hello @andy96gr,

 

Both yes and no…

I’m still extremely plagued by anxious feeling. I think it’s mostly because of my symptom of dissociation. I don’t feel like I exist really, but more like I’m just watching life go by. It’s very distressing and uncomfortable, and exists whether I’m anxious or not. Right now I’m in an especially bad wave, mostly because my period should start very soon and that’s when things always get worse.

I was so desperate I got prescribed Escitalopram in liquid to get rid of the permanent anxiety, but couldn’t go beyond a single drop because it just made me feel all kinds of awful and upset. I stopped after a week because my heart rate got tested and it was too slow, so I had to stop taking it - not that it helped at all. That was two months ago. I still feel 1-2 side effects from it lingering from time to time, but they’re becoming less and less.

I never experienced such anxiety pre Remeron, never. I never experienced that much anxiety. And it doesn’t calm down no matter what. I can just get used to it throughout the day and bear with it.

It didn’t also do me any good to be prescribed random hormones over the past few months that “should help”. Pure progesterone was awful, awful. And trying around with medication is not a good idea for a recovering body I found, no matter the meds.

 

Good news are that I don’t have to be so cautious anymore when in better times. What joy it was when I realized I was able to drink coffee again, when I could take large amount of vitamins and not feel anything from it, to get tired and not feel like my brain froze, to be able to handle more stress again, look at screens a lot without consequence and overall recover very quickly if something like that upset.

I also had a window that lasted 3 days, appeared suddenly and where I felt just almost completely myself. It was pure bliss. No anxiety, no fear, no pain, way less anhedonia… beautiful, just beautiful.

I think these two are big steps in terms of recovery. I remember how strict I had to be a year ago with everything, not being able to sip more than quarter of a glass of Coca Cola because of the caffeine. Now, except on worse days like waves of course, I can drink a bottle along with a coffee and a black tea, and feel completely fine. I still feel joy from this when I think about it. And I never had windows like that, especially not ones that lasted days.

 

I’m sinking into a bit of a wave hole again, but with the course of how it’s been going I should be optimistic I think. I was feeling pretty fine a week ago, so I’m definitely accusing the incoming period.

 

I still have anhedonia, PSSD, (no pgad anymore though, at least didn’t have the past month or two), dissociation, hostility, weird vision perceiving often, twitches/spasms, getting depressed sometimes, suicidal thoughts sometimes but rare etc. but I hope for it all to get better with time, especially since I’m hitting my 2 year mark in the spring of next year. I still don’t feel like myself, but I definitely came a little closer, even if just a little bit.

[SunnyRainyDays]

Antibiotics didn't do me good in terms of stability. Felt mentally horrible on them, extremely aggressive and hostile. Now that I stopped taking them a few days ago all the symptoms of it are gone. My brain still is a bit startled, not being able to really adjust temperature (cold, hot, cold, hot) and blood pressure at the time (made me nearly pass out today) & still sleep issues from the antibiotic. I'm taking a probiotic with a wide spectrum of bacteria to make up for the antibiotic damage (I had to take two antibiotics in the past few months) and to try it out overall, maybe it'll help with anxiety or etc. PSSD. I'll post about it when I'm taking it some weeks as they take some time to work.

I still have that horrid anxiety. It's all over the place all day, sometimes it's almost gone, and sometimes I think I'm getting a panic attack. I'm also often excited for no reason lately, in a way that I can't sit still and have thousand of things running through my head, mentally not feeling tired while my body does and wants to sleep, which just worsens the anxiety and overall well being. I'm overall often very agitated. I'm at a point where I can't really tell is this withdrawal, or isn't it? But then I get startled by random things like antibiotics and are reminded that it's not over. But now somehow 1 year later in April anxiety struck me heavily, with all possible anxiety symptoms imaginable. It started half a year ago, but has lessened a bit. Half a year ago I got such severe agoraphobia I couldn't go out because I would get so dissociated from reality I wasn't able to talk properly. Now I can go out but are often in distress when I'm outside, mostly due to light sensitivity, sounds, everything is too loud, too much is happening; it's like my brain is overloaded with too much that's happening and can't handle it. I never had that before Mirta, so I can only assume it's still withdrawal. I'm just surprised that 1,5 years later I'm still hit so severe with some symptoms. I'm thinking "I took it for 2 months, how can it be that long? Maybe it is me?" but afterwards always the thought "I never had those symptoms ever before the drug". And I always remember how my old anxiety was, and how it was controllable through words, situations etc. but this anxiety here is just chaotic, and one can't do anything against it. It lessens when it wants to, it shots up when it wants to, not even sleep herbal tea does much. In the past weeks I was wondering if I was becoming schizophrenic because of the overly weird thoughts and anxieties.

It made me think about the past, it made me remember how it was taking Mirta. I remember that exactly the worst parts of it were the suicidality and severe anxiety, two things that are till today the most persistent ones. Both come and go, but both are the only left symptoms that come back with a vengeance sometimes. No other withdrawal symptoms are as strong anymore as these two. I remember the first time I took it I almost killed myself. Maybe I had an adverse reaction, because it hit me hellish. To be honest, I don't know how I'm still alive after some of the things Mirta did. It brought me to contemplating suicide so often, on and off it. It still does regularly, but gladly not as strongly and not as often as in the beginning. In the past I had it for weeks or days straight severely, now it's popping up for a few minutes , rarely an hour, and goes and some days it's not there at all.

 

It makes me curious, were your worst side effects on your drug your worst withdrawal symptoms afterwards?

[Rudbeckie17]

@SunnyRainyDays

I have symptoms similar to pgad but without pain, since August 2023 after taking Zoloft for only 1 week and 5 days! I immediately stopped taking Zoloft. My symptoms are getting less and less worse, but the first 3 weeks after stopping it were really disturbing! but slowly it calms down but it comes back when I ovulate, a little before a little after or when I'm under a lot of stress. But this symptom is the worst. I also have muscle spasms and I have had heart palpitations, nausea, stomach aches. Everything is gone except the kind of pgad and the muscle spasms.

 

[SunnyRainyDays]

Nowadays I can safely say that I am 95% healed, and all that is left are my personal issues and of course some small poke from past symptoms rarely here and there.

I cannot believe that a year ago I was so afraid that I would never heal. The agony seems so long ago.

 

I can finally do everything I always did without having to fear anything from withdrawal - coffee, sleeping and random times, exercise, vitamins etc.

 

What is left is PSSD - which I don’t believe is PSSD. I have great anxiety issues which play the largest part here - a chronically overly stressed body will not do an activity that requires relaxation.

I shortly enrolled in therapeutic treatment of therapy, exercise etc. and should see results soon. But I can at least say that the anxiety is mine, and not of withdrawal, although I believe the time through it contributed as well. I had anxiety issues since mid teens, which gradually got worse over the years until this point. I am extremely motivated to conquer them though, just like I won against withdrawal.

 

I wish you all a Merry Christmas 🎄 

[Onmyway]

What wonderful news @SunnyRainyDays!

I am so glad that you are feeling better and you are empowered to look for solutions.

May you find more peace and joy in your life and may the healing continue! 
OMW