purplehummingbird: my journey to be free from citalopram and mirtazapine

[purplehummingbird]

Hi, 

 

I'm purplehummingbird, PHB for short  

 

My journey with psych drugs started 20 years ago when I was 17.

 

I was experiencing emotional difficulties stemming from a traumatic childhood and subsequent recreational drug taking from the age of 15. 

My doc prescribed me fluoxetine. I took one that night, felt like a zombie the next day and so threw the rest away. I wish that had been my only brush with psych drugs, but 9 years later, still experiencing the emotional difficulties and still recreational drug taking, I went back to the doc who put me on 50mg Citalopram. 

I took it for four months, decided it wasn't helping and then tried to stop. Queue 11 years of unrecognised withdrawal, misdiagnoses, medical gaslighting, more drugging, repeated attempts to stop and finally poly drugging.

 

Currently taking 7.5mg of Citalopram and 11.25mg of Mirtazapine. 

I quit recreational drugs in 2013 and last year I quit nicotine, alcohol and caffeine. 

 

I am so relieved to have found this incredible site and to finally realise what's been happening all along. That I was never 'mentally ill' (whatever that means), that I never 'needed' to take psychiatric medication and that it was the drugs themselves causing all the problems. 

 

I'm looking for (and hoping to give) support, guidance, connection, help and encouragement and to explore the deeper lessons in all of this as I finally taper off these drugs for good. I am intrigued by the non drug coping tools, as my toolbox is pretty bare, and I hope that I can use this opportunity to create healthy habits that can last me throughout my journey to freedom and beyond. 

 

PHB x 

[Frogie]

@purplehummingbird

 

Welcome to SA. We are a volunteer ran site helping people taper off psychiatric medications or have tapered off and are now healing.

 

This is your introduction page where you will receive information, ask questions and meet other members. We ask that you only have one introduction page so we can keep all your information together.

 

We don't suggest more than a 10% a month taper and many go much slower than that.

 

Why taper by 10% of my dosage?

 

The Brassmonkey Slide Method of Micro-tapering

Taking multiple psych drugs? Which drug to taper first?

 

Preparing to taper

Dr. Joseph Glenmullen's withdrawal symptom checklist

 

How do you talk to a doctor about tapering and withdrawal?

What is withdrawal syndrome?

 

The Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization

 

Here are some links on how to taper Citalopram and Mirtazapine.

 

Tips for tapering off citalopram (Celexa)

 

Tips for tapering off mirtazapine (Remeron)

 

We don't suggest supplements on here because they can be stimulating. We have found that Magnesium and Omega to be calming to the nervous system. If you would like to try these, try one in a small amount and wait a few days before introducing the other.

 

https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/15483-magnesium-natures-calcium-channel-blocker/

King of supplements: Omega-3 fatty acids (fish oil) - Symptoms and self-care - Surviving Antidepressants

 

After you have read the links provided please reach out with any questions you may have.

[Greatful]

@purplehummingbird

Welcome to SA.  You certainly are in the right place to find answers.  It's amazing to find out that you are not alone.  I remember feeling a sense of family when I found SA.  There is so much to learn.  The double edge sword is there are so many of us in this situation but thank goodness for SA we can learn and draw encouragement from each other.

 

You will also see there are many on here that have some sort of trauma and found themselves thinking the had a  mental illness which lead to years of drugging and never healing from the trauma.  Trauma can not be treated with drugs.  I found this out...I found a great bit of validation and relief when I started to read The Body Keep the Score by Bessel Nan Der Kolk.  Trauma is not a mental illness.  

 

Take a look around and get your feet under you.  We are here to lend a helping hand, encouragement and a listening ear.🌞 

[purplehummingbird]

@Frogie Thank you for stopping by and signposting me to the helpful links. 

 

@Greatful Thank you, I'm looking forward to getting to know the SA 'family', thank goodness for SA. It would be an even more lonely and confusing experience without it.

That's a great book; I read The Body Keeps the Score a few years ago but perhaps because I was drugged at the time, I don't remember any of it! I've got it on my list as one to revisit. I agree that trauma cannot be healed by chemicals, and the drugs are just an avoidance tactic. It's a cruel reality that people with trauma tend to end up on these drugs and then have even more trauma trying to get off them. 

I'm currently trying to read Anatomy of an Epidemic although it's difficult to concentrate so it's taking a while. 

 

I have a question regarding magnesium. I bought a tub of magnesium citrate to try and I'm wondering how much to start with, as well as when and how to take it. Any suggestions?

 

[ChessieCat]

Hi,

 

It's best to start with a small amount, to find out how it affects you.  You can then increase the dose.  Once you know if you are okay taking it you can then take it several times a day to get the calming effect.  Be aware that if you take calcium then they need to be taken 2 hours apart, otherwise the calcium will negate the calming effect.

 

And only make one change at a time, so you would make a reduction or start something else new.

 

Magnesium

[Mirtazapine20mg]

Hi @purplehummingbird, what a lovely name. I have been on the citalopram+mirtazapine combo just like you for 15 years and basically for the same reason as you. The moderators here know all about tapering, so I will leave that to them, but if you ever want to exchange views on life on citalopram/mirtazapine combo, I am here. I have also given up alcohol, smoking and the street stuff. Btw, I am pretty sure that citalopram was the drug that created my taste for street stuff and alcohol. Long story short: I am here :-). 

[Ariel]

Hi @purplehummingbird

 

Welcome to SA. 

I'm sorry for what has brought you here and glad you found us when you did. 

You've come to the right place, PHB.

I trust you'll find the support you're looking for here, both from the experienced and knowledgable moderators and from other compassionate members of this community. 

 

On 6/29/2022 at 8:24 PM, purplehummingbird said:

My journey with psych drugs started 20 years ago when I was 17.

 

There's a thread you might find interesting (I post there, too):

 

Peace and healing <3

A. 

[purplehummingbird]

Hi @ChessieCatthank you for the tips on magnesium and the helpful link. I think I will start with 25mg a day and see how I go. I saw that Altostrata suggested dissolving the magnesium citrate in cold water and sipping it throughout the day. I'm currently holding the drug doses I'm on so it's a good time to try the MC. 

 

Hi @Mirtazapine20mgthank you for stopping by to say hello, it's great to 'meet' another Mirt + Cit survivor. That's interesting you say that you think Citalopram may have had a hand in creating your taste for recreational drugs and alcohol. I know what you mean, although for me it was the Mirtazapine that caused me to develop some pretty strange obsessions like compulsively buying houseplants and cleaning products! Better than drugs and alcohol I guess 😏

 

Hi @Arielthank you for your kind words and for the link to the thread, I will definitely take a look. I can already sense that SA is a very helpful and compassionate place to be and I'm very happy to be here. Peace and healing to you too.

 

PHB x

[purplehummingbird]

I am going to start the 25mg of magnesium citrate trial today, I think I will dissolve it in a glass of water and drink it before bed. 

 

Interested to get people's thoughts regarding therapy while in withdrawal: I've been seeing a therapist for a couple of years and although I think it was helpful at first, since I've been reducing the drugs I am now noticing that when I have a session it can throw me into a wave for a couple of days afterwards.

I'm going to email my therapist and tell her I'd like to stop. As she's not withdrawal-informed, she's taking a lot of my neuro-emotions and neuro-thoughts as signs of deeper stuff going on when I'm beginning to think that they are just withdrawal induced distortions that I wouldn't be feeling if I was healed. 

 

Does anyone else have a theory on whether what we think / feel in withdrawal is unconscious stuff we've buried and need to face or whether a lot of it is a symptom of drug induced messed up brain chemistry? Also, therapy in general during withdrawal might be too stressful and best to leave that for once we've healed?

I'm so on the fence with therapy anyway, sometimes I think it's helpful and other times I think it's not and may even be harmful..

 

Hope everyone is keeping as well as possible

 

PHB x

 

 

 

[Greatful]

@purplehummingbird

As she's not withdrawal-informed, she's taking a lot of my neuro-emotions and neuro-thoughts as signs of deeper stuff going on when I'm beginning to think that they are just withdrawal induced distortions that I wouldn't be feeling if I was healed. 

 

Also, therapy in general during withdrawal might be too stressful and best to leave that for once we've healed?oughts as signs of deeper stuff going on when I'm beginning to think that they are just withdrawal induced distortions that I wouldn't be feeling if I was healed. 

 

What were you seeing her for to begin with?  Do you have a good relationship with her?  Is she open to learning about Withdrawal?  

will see be open reviewing information?

Here link to a for information for therapist.   https://prescribeddrug.info/

Guidance for Psychological  Therapist Enabling conversations taking or withdrawing from prescribed psychiatric drugs.

 

This is on Antidepressant Withdrawal Syndrome and it's Management https://youtu.be/PSjYH044-2Q    

 

I've been seeing my therapist for years.  She is learning about withdrawal from me.  We talk about my withdrawal and also work on my personal healing through normal therapy.  

 

I guess if she is not open to what your needs are it might not be a good fit for you right now. Maybe a open dialog with her will help you decide.

 

 

 

 

 

[Ariel]

Hi @purplehummingbird

 

Personally I have not found psychotherapy to be helpful in withdrawal (WD). However, I had decades of therapy prior to WD, so I had done a lot of healing work already and had a good toolkit coming into this. The therapy sessions that I did have during WD were more stressful than anything else, as neither my therapist at the time nor I knew I was in WD (and even if we had known, I'm not sure it would've changed anything). Therapy ended up being unduly taxing on my nervous system and the experiences were ultimately harmful so I quit. Those last sessions remain encoded as distressing. 

 

Some members do find therapy helpful in WD, but I think this depends greatly on a) finding the right therapist; b) being stable enough to handle therapy; c) the general life circumstances of the individual member during WD. As usual, there's no one-size-fits-all. Go with your gut on this one, PHB. 

 

There are a bunch of topics that offer discussion of various therapies and their merits in WD:

 

 

 

[purplehummingbird]

@Greatfuland @Ariel thank you both again for taking the time to read my post and for writing such helpful responses. The links look really informative and I will go through them while I decide whether to continue with therapy, take a break or perhaps try a different kind. 

 

@Greatfulthe reason I went into therapy in the first place was to process and heal early childhood trauma. It was my therapist who actually encouraged me to come off the drugs as she could sense I wasn't able to access my emotions, necessary for healing. I'm so glad she did as it led me to 'wake up' to the hindrance and harm that these drugs actually cause otherwise I would have likely just remained spellbound. 

 

PHB x

[Greatful]

@purplehummingbird

Funny you  bring up childhood trauma.  I never really thought I was that impacted by my childhood.  When WD hit the floodgates open and I could see how much I was impacted and how it  shaped me.  I learned so many unhealthy skills to functions.  My Molly tried to help me for years but the drugs got in the way.   She is not trained in trauma therapy but she is so helpful for listening to me and helping navigate through learning heather ways of thinking.  She does think eventually I will  need some edmr or some type of trauma therapy.  I don't know if I would have been able to cope when  the worst of WD hit without her reassurance.  I was having flashbacks and was totally beside myself with so much flooding over me.  Last summer and through the winter was a nightmare.  

 

 

If you have a good relationship and she is open to learning she might be a good support system.  Molly let's me guide what I need at the time.  Sometimes it's just to rant and rave about the injustice and dangers of these drugs and how doctors need to step up and learn. Sometimes I do a lot of crying from feeling so awful. She tries to help me navigate  and stay focused on how to help myself.   

I had an appointment with her today and she let me talk and as I talked I would got  more insight into what I was feeling and what were heathier ways to do things.

She is a sounding board at time and she can validate if I am heading in the right direction with my thoughts and redirect me if I am not looking in the right direction and heading down the negative or unhealthy thought patterns.  She does gently point me in taking responsibility for myself.  She is not a pushover LOL

 

I hope to turn her head around about these drugs.  I gently stress the importance for her to learn and  recognize drug withdrawal and adverse effects, if a client maybe having poop out from the drug.   I think it's working, she sees what is happening to me, she had a client that was not responding well to a drug switch and she told her to get off it after a few weeks....   She also has a client with trauma and she admitted that drugs will not heal trauma.  Trauma is not a mental illness.  Yeah score 2 for me.....She is in a tough position...She has to be careful and not overstep her bounds with the doctors at her clinic when it come to medication.  I hope that she will learn more  and find a way like Baylissa Frederick does to help inform the doctors without overstepping her boundaries.  To bad the patients get the short end of the stick.

 

It's so hard to grow up at my age LOL   

 

Do what is right for you🌞

 

[Erin9]

Hey @purplehummingbird

 

Reading your post I could see a few similarities between our stories with antidepressants - you can read my intro topic for the long version, but in short I am also trying to taper off citalopram and also had a run in with mirtazpine. We were both started on the drugs fairly young, too. I recently found SA as well and it has given me that bit of reassurance and made me feel less alone and lost, so I'm glad you've found it too. I find the physical symptoms really hard to deal with, and doctors seem quite nonplussed about it which just leads to diagnosing everything as an anxiety symptom, despite the fact that I've jumped from 40mg of citalopram to 15mg in the space of only 7 months, which I've learned now is very fast (particularly as I've been on SSRI's for 10 years). Of course anxiety comes alongside it, and I definitely feel my health anxiety peaking at the moment, but having SA to validate my feelings and symptoms is so helpful in reducing that anxiety and loneliness. 
 

On 7/7/2022 at 5:24 PM, purplehummingbird said:

Interested to get people's thoughts regarding therapy while in withdrawal: I've been seeing a therapist for a couple of years and although I think it was helpful at first, since I've been reducing the drugs I am now noticing that when I have a session it can throw me into a wave for a couple of days afterwards.

 

I've been having therapy for years and I've found that while going through withdrawal over the past 6 months, it is sometimes not as helpful because the neuro-emotions aren't something that can be helped in the same way as regular anxiety or depression. But I'm lucky in that I have a great relationship with my counsellor, who I've been speaking to for 3 years, and so there is no dismissal or gaslighting or misinterpretation of my feelings or symptoms. She is aware of the withdrawal, aware that its a very difficult and confusing time and more than anything she just listens and supports, rather than trying to advise. And if there is any suggestion of causes for how I'm feeling, they are always just suggestions and ideas, as opposed to trying to 'figure out' what's going on. But yeah I think you need to find the right person and have the right relationship with them to have therapy that remains supportive during WD. 

 

On 7/7/2022 at 5:24 PM, purplehummingbird said:

I am going to start the 25mg of magnesium citrate trial today, I think I will dissolve it in a glass of water and drink it before bed. 

 

I hope this goes well for you - I've tried a few supplements since stopping mirtazapine (and still being on citalopram) and they gave me massive headaches the next day. But I think I took too high a dose for my nervous system to cope with so I may try a mini dose again at some point. 

 

On 7/7/2022 at 5:24 PM, purplehummingbird said:

Does anyone else have a theory on whether what we think / feel in withdrawal is unconscious stuff we've buried and need to face or whether a lot of it is a symptom of drug induced messed up brain chemistry?

 

I started to wonder the same, but I find its scarier and worse to think that WD lets out all this unconscious stuff that's the 'real me'. I think after reading some topics on here I'm inclined to believe that its a lot of messed up brain chemistry, and it doesn't reflect who we are necessarily. During WD (and even beforehand, when I was on hormonal contraception and also when I believe my citalopram started to lose effectiveness) I started to have these thoughts that I was going mad. I'd never ever believed I was going insane before, but every couple of months I'd genuinely have these thoughts that I was crazy. I still get it every so often and its terrifying. But they have only started happening since I've been on different medications which have affected my hormones, or been in WD. This reassures me that its a result of brain chemistry changes. And the same with my increased anxiety, paranoia, and other mental health symptoms. 

 

On 7/4/2022 at 7:54 AM, purplehummingbird said:

I'm currently trying to read Anatomy of an Epidemic although it's difficult to concentrate so it's taking a while.

 

Just wanted to say I'm glad I'm not alone in this symptom - I've been unable to read books for months, my head is so fuzzy and concentrating is so difficult, and any sort of rapid eye movement makes my head all tingly! It's so annoying because I've got a long reading list that I want to get into 😢