2cats2272: Introduction

[2cats2272]

Hello, I am 2 months off Effexor. I was on 150mg for 17 years. I started tapering at the end of October and finished at the end of January. 
to say it’s been difficult is an understatement. However, I am seeing progress. Some days my

anxiety is extremely high and I’m not sure how to handle that. My body is always tense. I have to literally tell myself to relax.

Going off Effexor was a choice and I don’t want to start again. I guess I’m just wondering if it’s going to

continue you to get better (I know there will be tough days too) 

[Altostrata]

Welcome, @2cats2272

 

It's likely you are experiencing moderate withdrawal syndrome from going off Effexor too fast, even though it took 3 months.

 

How's your sleep?

 

Many people find fish oil and magnesium supplements helpful, see

 

https://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/36-king-of-supplements-omega-3-fatty-acids-fish-oil/

 

https://survivingantidepressants.org/topic/15483-magnesium-natures-calcium-channel-blocker/

 

You might try a little bit of one at a time to see how it affects you. Please let us know how you’re doing.

[2cats2272]

Hello everyone,

I’m just over 10 weeks off Effexor. I was on 150mg for 17 years. I started my taper at the end of October. Went to 112.5mg, end of November went to 75mg, end of December 37.5mg, end of January 0.

things have improved for sure but I’m still exhausted. My body hurts. I do have low mood but I think that’s mostly due to the physical symptoms I’m experiencing. 
I am trying to be patient and understand this is a process. I am seeing a counsellor as well as taking vitamins. 
I guess I’m just looking for someone who has had similar experiences. 

thank you all 💜

[Onmyway]

Hi @2cats2272

Welcome to SA! Hope you are feeling a bit better. 

I merged your post from the Symptoms and Self Care forum here. Here are some guidelines on what to post where and how to connect to others better on the website. 

OMW

[Altostrata]

How are you doing, @2cats2272?

[2cats2272]

Hi @Altostrata

im doing ok, the last 3 days have been not so great. But last week and the previous week were quite good. 

[Altostrata]

Good to hear. Would you say you're feeling better now than in February?

[2cats2272]

I’m absolutely doing better now compared to February 

[Altostrata]

What symptoms have gone away, what symptoms are bothering you now? Please stay in touch.

 

Many people find these to be helpful:

 

Magnesium, nature's calcium channel blocker 

Omega-3 fatty acids (fish oil) 

 

You might try a low dose of one at a time to see what it does for you.

[2cats2272]

the last two weeks have been much better. Sleep has still been an issue. I’ve had very low

mood and lack of motivation and energy since Saturday. Accompanied by sadness and tears again 😓

[Altostrata]

That sounds normal for withdrawal. Treat your nervous system gently and it will continue to fix itself. If your symptoms get worse, please let us know.

 

To strengthen sleep:

 

What is the sleep cycle?

 

Waking with panic or anxiety -- managing the morning cortisol spike

 

Tips to help sleep -- so many of us have that awful withdrawal insomnia

 

Path to Better Sleep FREE online for everyone from the US Veterans Administration

 

Music for self-care: Calms hyperalertness, anxiety, aids relaxation and sleep

 

White noise devices for sleep

 

Melatonin for sleep: Many people find it helpful

 

TV or computer use in evening can disrupt sleep: Bright light signals the brain that it's daytime

 

Strange sensations while falling asleep -- surges, zaps, jerks

 

Hypnic / hypnagogic jerks when falling asleep

 

[2cats2272]

Thank you. I’m frustrated because I had a good 2 (ish) weeks. Today is better but the last 4 days have been tough. Lots of ruminating thoughts. Sadness and tears. Then I start thinking I need medication. 
however, I look back to how yucky I felt then how good I felt. 

[Altostrata]

Waves and windows are common in withdrawal syndrome, but if your symptom pattern gets substantially worse over several days, please let us know.

 

See

 

 

The Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization

 

Neuro-emotions

 

Non-drug techniques to cope with emotional symptoms

 

Easing your way into meditation for a stressed-out nervous system

[2cats2272]

Thank you. They’re actually getting better now. 

[2cats2272]

@Altostrata things are better than a week ago but still not great. I know that if I go to my doctor, he will suggest a new antidepressant. I think that I just have to keep moving forward. From what I’ve read, what I’m dealing with is pretty normal. 
the worst time of day is first thing in the morning. The anxiety is bad. Around noon, it dissipates. I’m doing everything recommended. 

[Altostrata]

Good to hear you're feeling better. It can take some time for your nervous system to settle down, hang in there.

[2cats2272]

I’ve been off Effexor for just over three months. The physical withdrawal’s subsided. I had 2 good weeks and then bam. Hit with waves of anxiety and depression. It’s been like this for 2 weeks. The mornings tend to be harder. 
However, yesterday was better and today is better. Should I reinstate? Or keep pushing through? Another strange thing I noticed is I haven’t dreamed since I stopped Effexor. 

[Shep]

@2cats2272 I moved your last post off another member's thread and placed it here in your own intro/update thread. Please continue posting here so all your information is in one place.

 

It sounds like things are overall improving. Mornings tend to be hard during withdrawal due to elevated cortisol. Please see:

 

Early-morning waking - managing the morning cortisol spike

 

How many hours are you sleeping each night? Has your sleep pattern improved (other than not dreaming)? 

[2cats2272]

I’m sleeping about 6 hours a night. Compared to a couple months ago, my sleep has improved so much. I was sleeping about 2 hours a night for a while. 
mom just struggling with anxiety and low mood. It comes in waves throughout the day and I find myself with ruminating thoughts. Appetite is hardly there either. Has a lot to do with my stomach being upset from anxiety. 

[Shep]

20 hours ago, 2cats2272 said:

Has a lot to do with my stomach being upset from anxiety. 

 

You may want to try going through a short guided meditation before you eat. Perhaps this will help:

 

The Breathing Space by Jon Kabat Zinn video (4 minutes)

 

Learning to breathe deeply and relax the mind/body can be very helpful. There are a ton of videos out there to explore. 

 

20 hours ago, 2cats2272 said:

I find myself with ruminating thoughts.

 

Another great video:

 

Guided Meditation for Detachment From Over-Thinking (Anxiety / OCD / Depression) video (42 minutes)

 

If we can learn mindfulness as a skill during the worst of withdrawal, it's a skill that will serve us well the rest of our lives. 

 

20 hours ago, 2cats2272 said:

I’m sleeping about 6 hours a night. Compared to a couple months ago, my sleep has improved so much. I was sleeping about 2 hours a night for a while. 

 

Excellent! You will likely see a lot of improvements as your sleep improves. 

[2cats2272]

I’m about 3.5 months off Effexor. I’m on a slight upward trend. Last night I woke up from a nightmare (first one in years and years). When trying to go back to sleep, I had brain zaps again. Which is very strange to me because those went away rather quickly early in my taper. 
my other issues are super tight shoulder/neck muscles and jaw from clenching. 
wondering if this is part of the process. 
I had an appointment scheduled for the 25th to potentially reintroduce and taper slower. I’ve changed this to June 7th because I’m feeling progress. Hopefully it’s the right move 

[Shep]

@2cats2272 The fact that you're seeing improvements is great. If you do reinstate, it would need to be at a very, very low dose, considering how far out you are from stopping. Please see:

 

About reinstating and stabilizing to reduce withdrawal symptoms

 

19 hours ago, 2cats2272 said:

my other issues are super tight shoulder/neck muscles and jaw from clenching. 
wondering if this is part of the process. 

 

Yes, many people have tight muscles and jaw clenching during withdrawal. Are you currently using a night guard when you sleep? That can really protect the teeth and save you from future dental work. You can get night guards from your dentist or cheaper ones available at many drug stores. Very well worth the investment. 

 

Facial tics, jaw, tongue muscle tension and pain, bruxism, teeth clenching, TMJ

 

Gentle stretches can be helpful for tight muscles. You can find easy yoga for beginners videos on YouTube. Even just placing your feet up the wall can be relaxing. Please see:

 

Legs Up The Wall - Foundations of Yoga video (6 minutes)

 

Regardless of your age, the gentle yoga for seniors can be great for folks dealing with a destabilized nervous system and tense muscles.

 

Yoga For Seniors | Slow and Gentle Yoga video (28 minutes)

 

If you're able to tolerate magnesium, you can take warm baths with epsom salts to help relax the muscles. Please see:

 

Magnesium, nature's calcium channel blocker

 

Doing gentle stretches when you wake up and before you go to sleep can be very helpful for keeping your muscles relaxed. 

 

You may find more helpful suggestions here:

 

Non-drug techniques to cope with emotional symptoms

 

[2cats2272]

@Shep thank you for the response. I am taking magnesium before bed. I may add another one. I do wear a night guard from my dentist thankfully because my teeth would be a mess. 
im leaning towards not reinstating because I’m so far out. 
I will implement the stretches. Thanks again. I’m sure I’ll be back here soon 

[2cats2272]

Windows and waves are still very much happening. However, lately there just seems to be low/sad points in my day. Mornings are still tough and it’s starts to get better late afternoon/evening. Which I’m attributing to cortisol. 
I tend to get annoyed easily and sleep is ok but not wonderful.

I think I’ve decided not to reintroduce Effexor as I’m so far out and managing. Im still taking fish oil and magnesium. 

[Shep]

You may find some relief using the techniques listed here:

 

Non-drug techniques to cope with emotional symptoms

 

The "get annoyed easily" may be neuro-emotions.

 

Neuro-emotions

 

All of this will fade out over time. 

[2cats2272]

Thanks @Shep I’ve read about neuroemotions and Wow! It really rings true. I have always been proud of the mom I have been. That was one thing I was sure of. However, lately, even thinking about that makes me cry and be upset because I should have done better or don’t things differently. I’d be reduced to tears and horrible feelings. 
It’s reassuring to read this is Ott of the process. 
 

[Shep]

Yes, this is all a part of the process. You may find these links helpful:

 

Deep emotional pain and crying spells, spontaneous weeping

Shame, guilt, regret, and self-criticism

[2cats2272]

I have an appointment Friday to discuss reinstatement. I wish I knew what the right thing to do was. I feel like I’m doing all the right things but I’m still feeling sad, hopeless and I don’t know… dread??? Unease????

I feel like I’m just going through the motions. 
I don’t want to reinstate and make things worse but I know the longer I wait, the less options I have. 
I still have little windows of good, enjoyable times but the waves come and it’s hard to remember the windows (if I’m using them correctly).

 

[Shep]

Please let us know how your appointment goes Friday and if you decide to reinstate or not. You may find this thread helpful:

 

How do you talk to a doctor about tapering and withdrawal?

 

You may want to print out one or more of the links at the top of that first post to give to your prescriber. 

 

[Altostrata]

@2cats2272 please be aware that you need not go back to your earlier whole dose. Even 10 beads out of an Effexor XR capsule can be enough.

 

 

About reinstating and stabilizing to reduce withdrawal symptoms

[2cats2272]

Thanks @Shep and @Altostrata. My appointment is now June 5th. I’m seriously on the fence. I have very good days and managing but when I’m in a wave, it’s like everyone else has said. It feels like nothing is good or ever will be again. 
mom also going to look into acupuncture. 

[Shep]

@2cats2272 Please see this thread for information on acupuncture:

 

Acupuncture

 

Note what Alto wrote here:

 

On 7/15/2011 at 8:08 PM, Altostrata said:

Make absolutely sure your acupuncturist understands you want calming treatments, not stimulating treatments. Some may make the same mistake doctors do, thinking your "depression" needs some kind of stimulation.

 

[2cats2272]

@Shep I will for sure make it known i  only want calming treatments. The lingering issue I’m having is anxiety, Fatigue and lack of appetite too. Everything else seems to be clearing up (for now). I worry that it isn’t withdrawal and is the original issue. I went on Effexor for GAD. 
This feels different (I think. 17 years ago is a wee bit of time). I didn’t have lows before. I didn’t cry like I do. 
I think that reinstating (like I was considering) May not be the answer. 
The mornings are the worst for anxiety. I cannot sleep past 6 ish. I used to be a pro sleeper. I’ve read about cortisol in the morning. 

[FindRest]

The symptoms you mention above sound very much like Effexor withdrawal. Many of us were told it was our original “illness” coming back and that we either needed to get back on it at a higher dose, add another AD or AP to it, or change completely to a different AD. Looks like you’ve already realized “this feels different” than your original diagnosis. Regardless, there are a ton of non-pharmaceutical ways to deal with GAD. 
 

You’ve been on Effexor for 17 years. What they didn’t tell us back then is that we were only supposed to be on them a few weeks or months. I believe the longest clinical trial was something like 12 weeks. Those of us who have been on longterm tend to have more withdrawals, especially if taken off rapidly like you were.

 

Reading your story reminds me of myself when I was abruptly taken off once I got down to 37.5. It was a nightmare for 6 months. I eventually reinstated a few beads, working my way up to 20-something beads. I am so glad I did. It wasn’t easy, and still isn’t. But life is a lot more manageable now. Like others here have said, if you reinstate, starting with a just a few beads is key. 
 

BTW, the “dread” you speak of is very real. It’s hard to explain its depth to others who haven’t endured withdrawals. 

Edited May 26, 2023 by FindRest

[2cats2272]

I’m leaning towards reinstating…. Again. I don’t know if it will help. I am going to consult with a program here and hopefully start back in a low dose @FindRest how did you reinstate? I haven’t actually opened any capsules but I have almost a full months worth of 37.5 still. 
I think I’m just at a point that I was to feel good again. I really don’t think I have it as hard as others and maybe I should power through. I’m just very worried that it’s going to get worse and not better. 

[FindRest]

You can read my introductory thread to see how I reinstated in detail. Basically, I started with 10 large beads of name brand Effexor, eventually getting to 22 beads. (Effexor has multiple sizes of beads in each capsule). Everyone is different, however, and I’d recommending asking a mod or Alto to help you come up with a plan just for you.
 

4 hours ago, 2cats2272 said:

I am going to consult with a program here and hopefully start back in a low dose

What program? Most of them still don’t know what they are doing, so you have to be very careful with the guidance you get and do your own research on what they advise before implementing it. 

 

4 hours ago, 2cats2272 said:

think I’m just at a point that I was to feel good again.

I can surely understand that. Know, however, that reinstating probably won’t get you back to where you used to be pre-withdrawals. Sadly, it doesn’t quite work like that for most. You may notice quite an improvement in your symptoms, however. That would be the goal.