Addax: 30 years with Fluoxetine and tapering

[Addax]

Decent week. Maybe a slight uptick of anxiety in the morning and fatigue during the week. But as usual, that could also be perimenopause stuff.  

Also some professional self-doubt creeping in.  I mean, that's probably just me and my imposter syndrome, but it's a bit more prominent, and from my past experience, self-doubt, albeit much more intrusive, was intense when I was hit hard with W/D all those years ago.  

Anyway, the symptoms (if that's even what they are) were not so bad that my confidence is shaken related to tapering, so down to 6.6 today.  It's just slightly below the 6.65 the brassmonkey taper would have me go to, but I haven't taken the time to figure out how to work in the second decimal place.  I'll see what it's like to continue to make .2mg/.2ml drops per week until I get to 6.  

I'm planning a relatively long hold when I reach 5mg.  I'm hoping I can get there without a hitch.  or at least without a disruptive hitch.  5mg is a huge milestone for me. I don't know why it feels any more significant that 10, but it very much does. 

Having been put on Prozac in my late teens for an eating disorder (Bulimia), part of me kept wondering whether the obsessive thinking and compensatory behaviors would come rushing back at this point.  Nope.  I'm not saying I'm content with my weight or body... but I've never been. And "never" includes the years I've been taking fluoxetine.  

[Addax]

((Screechy sound like someone moved the needle across a vinyl record))

Low grade depression has been around for a couple of days. I didn’t really know it was there until I thought more about the self-doubt I’ve been experiencing, and realized it was worse today that yesterday, and worse yesterday than the day before. Right now it’s pretty bad. I’m feeling low and ruminating on some negative feedback way more than is rational. And it was pretty minor as far as feed back goes, and has little to do with my job, but I’m kind of letting it consume and define me right now and my brain is making me think it will define my future, which is truly ridiculous. So ridiculous. But I’m writing that here, but also not believing it’s ridiculous because my brain is having me think it’s true. Man! I cannot wait for this wave to pass! This sucks. My brain is being mean… so it sucks too.

[Thorin]

3 minutes ago, Addax said:

((Screechy sound like someone moved the needle across a vinyl record))

Low grade depression has been around for a couple of days. I didn’t really know it was there until I thought more about the self-doubt I’ve been experiencing, and realized it was worse today that yesterday, and worse yesterday than the day before. Right now it’s pretty bad. I’m feeling low and ruminating on some negative feedback way more than is rational. And it was pretty minor as far as feed back goes, and has little to do with my job, but I’m kind of letting it consume and define me right now and my brain is making me think it will define my future, which is truly ridiculous. So ridiculous. But I’m writing that here, but also not believing it’s ridiculous because my brain is having me think it’s true. Man! I cannot wait for this wave to pass! This sucks. My brain is being mean… so it sucks too.

Sounds like your monkey mind is chiming in strongly. I have a loud one too. Turns itself right up when I’m struggling and tells me all sort of lies which are hard to ignore. For me, sharing the thoughts, like you’re doing, and ramping up the exercise a little, and doing things despite what the monkey mind says works in the long term. Sorry you’re struggling atm but it’s absolutely not a long term thing. You’ve got this. We’ve spoken about if before but I can’t remember. Do you have a good therapist? Maybe you were looking into it?

[Addax]

9 hours ago, Thorin said:

Sorry you’re struggling atm but it’s absolutely not a long term thing. You’ve got this. We’ve spoken about if before but I can’t remember. Do you have a good therapist? Maybe you were looking into it?

Thank you Thorin. You have the best timing. And a good memory. I was looking into it. But, as I do, the search loses its urgency when I feel good. So now, when I don’t feel great, I have to wait two weeks for an initial appointment. By then, I’ll (hopefully) feel better and will have to fight with myself not to cancel it. 
 

I think this morning is as bad as I’ve been since starting this taper again 2 yrs ago. Weepy, irritable, self-doubt like crazy. Even though there doesn’t seem to be a ton of difference between 6.64mg and 6.6mg (and 6.83 vs 6.8 before that) at this low dose, and given the length I’ve been on this med, likely makes a significant difference to my receptors, yeah? ((Sigh))

 

I’ll force myself out for a walk today and hope that helps. 


 

[Thorin]

11 hours ago, Addax said:

So now, when I don’t feel great, I have to wait two weeks for an initial appointment. By then, I’ll (hopefully) feel better and will have to fight with myself not to cancel it. 

Haha that old chestnut. Therapy feels pointless when you’re feeling good but like it would be incredibly healthy when you feel rough. Maybe if you have it in place and you give plenty of notice you can cancel it that week/fortnight if you don’t need it. Or if you know the schedule of your WD just have it booked in fo that period? Or maybe you ‘lol find things that you want to talk about even when you feel good once you start to get into it 🤷‍♂️

 

11 hours ago, Addax said:

I think this morning is as bad as I’ve been since starting this taper again 2 yrs ago. Weepy, irritable, self-doubt like crazy. Even though there doesn’t seem to be a ton of difference between 6.64mg and 6.6mg (and 6.83 vs 6.8 before that) at this low dose, and given the length I’ve been on this med, likely makes a significant difference to my receptors, yeah? ((Sigh))

For it help knowing what it is? That whole what you’re experiencing is ‘real’ that it’s WD and not actually you? I’m hoping that sort of thing makes it just a little easier when I start again. The feelings can be so intense though!

[Addax]

11 hours ago, Thorin said:

For it help knowing what it is? That whole what you’re experiencing is ‘real’ that it’s WD and not actually you?

It does help. In some ways, a lot. Rather than feeling hopeless and like I’ll be stuck in the downward spiral forever, and that my imagined catastrophic outcomes are really going to happen, I know there is a light at the end of the tunnel, where before I did not. I might not be able to see that light, but it’s helpful knowing that there’s potential to see it. It’s not full proof, but I can at least recognize that my thoughts could be wrong, where before I was 100% convinced they were accurate. I guess, on an intellectual level I know enough to question my experience and doubt my doomsday thinking and have hope… maybe even anticipation… that the wave will end. Basically, prior to knowing what I know now, and prior to my experiences and reading the experiences of other, I couldn’t see passed a wave and that there was an other side. As far as I was concerned, the wave went on forever. Now? I’m still struggling to see passed it, but I know there is an other side. The rub is that I don’t know when I’ll get there.  If I think back to other waves, I’m going to guess tomorrow or tomorrow night I’ll feel a good deal of relief. This morning  I’m going to allow myself to bask a little in self pity, distract myself with a terrible TV show, and hopefully feel well enough for a long walk with my husband later. I do feel some pressure to feel well asap because the next two weeks at work will be high stress… recipe for a hold.
 

It does help to write about it all… I sometimes forget how much engaging with others on here and having them engage with me can be so helpful. 😊

[Thorin]

1 hour ago, Addax said:

It does help. In some ways, a lot. Rather than feeling hopeless and like I’ll be stuck in the downward spiral forever, and that my imagined catastrophic outcomes are really going to happen, I know there is a light at the end of the tunnel, where before I did not. I might not be able to see that light, but it’s helpful knowing that there’s potential to see it. It’s not full proof, but I can at least recognize that my thoughts could be wrong, where before I was 100% convinced they were accurate. I guess, on an intellectual level I know enough to question my experience and doubt my doomsday thinking and have hope… maybe even anticipation… that the wave will end. Basically, prior to knowing what I know now, and prior to my experiences and reading the experiences of other, I couldn’t see passed a wave and that there was an other side. As far as I was concerned, the wave went on forever. Now? I’m still struggling to see passed it, but I know there is an other side. The rub is that I don’t know when I’ll get there.  If I think back to other waves, I’m going to guess tomorrow or tomorrow night I’ll feel a good deal of relief. This morning  I’m going to allow myself to bask a little in self pity, distract myself with a terrible TV show, and hopefully feel well enough for a long walk with my husband later. I do feel some pressure to feel well asap because the next two weeks at work will be high stress… recipe for a hold.
 

It does help to write about it all… I sometimes forget how much engaging with others on here and having them engage with me can be so helpful. 😊

It’s good to hear that it all helps….. I’m….. not anxious but not happy about starting my taper again. Cautious and wary is probably right.

 

I find chatting on here really does help. And in other places too. I can’t be here all the time as it can get to me a little (not the people but thinking about withdrawal).

 

I like chatting with you guys though

[Addax]

1 hour ago, Thorin said:

It’s good to hear that it all helps….. I’m….. not anxious but not happy about starting my taper again. Cautious and wary is probably right.

I was incredibly wary or starting my taper again.  I waited over 5 years to restart and went exceedingly slow my first 20 months before taking on the brassmonkey slide. I was pretty scared by my last experience. The brassmonkey slide is conservative, but I’d been going even slower. Did I need to hold for so long and go so slow to avoid symptoms? Probably not. The hold and initial slowness was dictated solely by my anxiety around restarting. 

[Thorin]

12 minutes ago, Addax said:

I was incredibly wary or starting my taper again.  I waited over 5 years to restart and went exceedingly slow my first 20 months before taking on the brassmonkey slide. I was pretty scared by my last experience. The brassmonkey slide is conservative, but I’d been going even slower. Did I need to hold for so long and go so slow to avoid symptoms? Probably not. The hold and initial slowness was dictated solely by my anxiety around restarting. 

My first drop will be 3.57% (0.5mg) because of my nervousness. If that works ok I’ll go a little bigger the next month and so on. The trauma from this stuff is real!

[Addax]

9 minutes ago, Thorin said:

The trauma from this stuff is real!

So real. 

[j1290]

On 5/5/2023 at 7:28 PM, Addax said:

. But I’m writing that here, but also not believing it’s ridiculous because my brain is having me think it’s true

Always. Feels. True.   No matter how many times I go through an emotional wave of some type or other I'm always convinced it will never end  and I need to get used to my new life LOL.  It's ridiculous but true.  I try to stick to my rule of not making any major changes for 30 days because I get some big ideas of what I need to do to fix things asap.  Invariably I feel better within a week.   

 

On 5/6/2023 at 5:03 PM, Thorin said:

Haha that old chestnut. Therapy feels pointless when you’re feeling good but like it would be incredibly healthy when you feel rough. Maybe if you have it in place and you give plenty of notice you can cancel it that week/fortnight if you don’t need it.

LOL so true.   I didn't learn till I was an adult that this tangentally applies to friendships and work connections as well.   I need to keep those relationships watered so I'm not just reaching out when times are rough.  I fully admit I don't have a great track record on this, to my detriment.   But yeah, my last therapy appointment was kinda dull and I mentioned that and he said that could be seen as progress.  I think there's truth to that as well.  

18 hours ago, Addax said:

The hold and initial slowness was dictated solely by my anxiety around restarting. 

This **** is terrifying.  I try to keep it moving so I don't get too scared of getting back on the horse, so to speak.  That said, the path forward is lit by the fire of the bridges I've burned behind me 🤣 and not everybody has the room to do that.   I've always been a bit foolhardy, which might explain why I didn't question more before I started taking these pills 🤪

[Addax]

12 hours ago, j1290 said:

It's ridiculous but true.  I try to stick to my rule of not making any major changes for 30 days because I get some big ideas of what I need to do to fix things asap.  Invariably I feel better within a week.   

Ridiculous is the perfect word for it. I like your rule. I think I have the same one. I will sometimes try to think of things that will “help,” and I immediately think, “no. Wait!” Or “ Don’t! You could make it worse.” So I guess I combat my ideas with my  fear.  More ridiculousness! If only we could remember and believe the “invariably” part when we needed to.

 

14 hours ago, j1290 said:

my last therapy appointment was kinda dull and I mentioned that and he said that could be seen as progress.  I think there's truth to that as well. 

What do you mean by dull? Was it uncomfortable? I always think progress can come out of discomfort. 

14 hours ago, j1290 said:

the path forward is lit by the fire of the bridges I've burned behind me 🤣

That needs to be on a t-shirt or poster or something. I have to find a way to fit it into a conversation. No doubt it will get me some cool points! 😆

 

14 hours ago, j1290 said:

I've always been a bit foolhardy, which might explain why I didn't question more before I started taking these pills 🤪

Im guessing very few of us questioned, foolhardy or not. I know I didn’t, and my mom didn’t when she okayed it. And when I was an adult I didn’t question when the doc said Wellbutrin would be a good addition. We trusted. We didn’t have reason not to. 

[j1290]

13 hours ago, Addax said:

sometimes try to think of things that will “help,” and I immediately think, “no. Wait!” Or “ Don’t! You could make it worse.

I might have mentioned this ITT, but sounds like "when in doubt, don't", which I think is outstanding advice!  I invariably make things worse if I hurry to fix them.  My rule is to sit on my hands for 10 or 15 minutes when I think I have to solve something immediately.  I find it nearly impossible 😂, everytime feels like an exception to the rule, but when I do it helps.   

 

13 hours ago, Addax said:

I always think progress can come out of discomfort. 

I always want intensity and discomfort so I feel like I'm accomplishing something.  When things are kinda just average in a session I feel like maybe I missed out 🤷‍♂️.   I'm starting to suspect that's a trauma thing where I seek out disorder and intensity for various coping reasons.  You ever watch this YouTuber?  It always hits home so it's a little tough for me to watch, but I feel like she has a lot of good insights. 

 

13 hours ago, Addax said:

If only we could remember and believe the “invariably” part when we needed to.

One day I will.  I went through this last night.  I'm just going to have to strengthen my muscle memory of focusing on the present and getting out of the feelings.   It helps for a few moments at a time, and I think that's evidence that there can be more improvement.   It's easy for me to talk a good game but when I'm in the moment, I can tell I need more practice at handling anxiety.   

 

13 hours ago, Addax said:

I have to find a way to fit it into a conversation. No doubt it will get me some cool points! 😆

haha I stole from the best, my executive coach told me that once and it stuck with me.   It paints a vivid word picture 🤣

 

13 hours ago, Addax said:

And when I was an adult I didn’t question when the doc said Wellbutrin would be a good addition.

Did you get pitched the 'drug cocktail' line?!?  🍸  Sounded great at the time!  

[Hanna72]

Hi @Addax

Wanted to drop by your thread.

I can understand that you are afraid of tapering, I have been there too. When we go through something horrific, it’s normal to put the breaks on and be extra careful. It’s only human and everyone would feel that way. I am extremely proud of how far you have come, I mean 7 mg is awesome. Don’t focus on the time, always have your well-being number one. 
You will get there, I have no doubt. 
I believe in you, and thank you for your support.

Never forget how far you have come.

We will have our success stories here one day, mark these words.

 

Hugs

Hannah

Edited May 11, 2023 by Hanna72

[Addax]

@Hanna72, thank you so much for your encouraging and kind words.  It feels like I have such a long haul in front of me, but as you’ve reminded me, I’ve come a long way already, and really, I have come a longer way than I still have to go, so there is that. I suppose it’s the bumpy and oddly delicate path ahead that scares me and makes me feel more more vulnerable.  But as you also reminded me, despite how it feels sometimes trudging through this, I am not alone.

[Addax]

On 5/9/2023 at 11:03 AM, j1290 said:

"when in doubt, don't"

I dig this! … but… sometimes I catch myself not doubting enough 😜.  

 

On 5/9/2023 at 11:03 AM, j1290 said:

My rule is to sit on my hands for 10 or 15 minutes when I think I have to solve something immediately.  I find it nearly impossible 😂, everytime feels like an exception to the rule, but when I do it helps. 

 10 - 15 minutes?! You have some great patience. I’m not sure I could do it unless I was watching a movie or something. Luckily my great idea - fear of my great idea loop seems to keep me in check for now.

On 5/9/2023 at 11:03 AM, j1290 said:

When things are kinda just average in a session I feel like maybe I missed out 🤷‍♂️.   I'm starting to suspect that's a trauma thing where I seek out disorder and intensity for various coping reasons. 

You’re probably not be wrong. Depending on the trauma and how long it went on, people adapt to it to survive it, and as horrible as it can be, it becomes familiar, as does the level of arousal, hypervigilance, etc. I’m sure it can be hard to turn those things off.  If you’re primed disorder or threat, and neither is present, I imagine it could feel very uncomfortable.

 

On 5/9/2023 at 11:03 AM, j1290 said:

It's easy for me to talk a good game but when I'm in the moment, I can tell I need more practice at handling anxiety. 

Ditto x2!

 

On 5/9/2023 at 11:03 AM, j1290 said:

haha I stole from the best, my executive coach told me that once and it stuck with me.   It paints a vivid word picture 🤣

It does! And I tried to use it the other day, but got it all wrong, then I tried to explain what I mean to say…  minus 3 cool points 😞

On 5/9/2023 at 11:03 AM, j1290 said:

Did you get pitched the 'drug cocktail' line?!?  🍸  Sounded great at the time!

I was told it would help counter the side effects of Prozac, which, yeah sounded great at the time. 
 

The link to YouTube turned out to be a link to “Tremor Journal.”  I’m intrigued! I want to see what you meant to link to.

 

On 5/9/2023 at 11:03 AM, j1290 said:

I'm just going to have to strengthen my muscle memory of focusing on the present and getting out of the feelings.

 

I have to do this too, but for me it’s distracting myself from the thoughts - pulling myself out of the negative thought loop or spiral. Work helps me do that, but if I’m not at work and am in that loop I’m generally also tired, so if I have to find someway to motivate myself to do something that will pull my attention away from my thoughts and feelings. Sometimes I can do it with TV, but then that becomes a sort of security blanket.  Guilt helps get me going sometimes … I feel badly that my husband’s wife (me) sometimes turns into a potato, so I’ll pretend I’m okay and not a potato, and do things like I’m okay…and that potatoes can’t do… and that will sometimes help. 
 

[j1290]

5 hours ago, Addax said:

I dig this! … but… sometimes I catch myself not doubting enough 😜.

bwahahaha!!!  I hear that!!!  I'm always certain this time is an exception to the rule.  Much like the rule about not panicking for 10 minutes or ruminating that my symptoms will never end (they always do LOL)😂

 

6 hours ago, Addax said:

 10 - 15 minutes?! You have some great patience.

I break this rule on the daily, ofc.  It works great when I do it.  

 

 

6 hours ago, Addax said:

but for me it’s distracting myself from the thoughts - pulling myself out of the negative thought loop or spiral.

This is so smart!

 

6 hours ago, Addax said:

I’m intrigued! I want to see what you meant to link to.

Oh whoops.  I meant to link to The Crappy Childhood Fairy.  I hope none of the topics resonate with you, but for me they do.  She does a lot of trauma stuff.  

[Addax]

Quick update for the record…

 

After those several very bumpy days, and some lingering akathisia like symptoms, anxiety and negative thoughts and self doubt I can seem to shake completely, I’ve decided to hold at 6.6 mg. It definitely in a better place than I was last weekend, but the negative thoughts that are feeding my self-doubt and exacerbating my impostor syndrome are just too uncomfortable and are interfering with my quality of life. I’m thankful I’m functional and can do what I need to do, but it’s taking more effort.
 

I wish I could use capsules during holding periods. Measuring liquid to 6.6 is tedious when I just want to be able to pop a capsule and be done. It’s was why I wanted to get to 5mg. I have 5mg capsules from the compounding pharmacy. However, as I learned, transitioning from capsules to liquid (and different manufacturers) upset the apple cart. So I must assume that transitioning back to capsules would do the same… and only to transition back to liquid again after the hold. Just not worth the risk.

 

The other pain in the ass is that if I want to make small reductions, i.e., dropping .15 mg weekly rather than .2mg, I’m going to need to use two syringes. The tedium is maddening to think about. I try not to think about the fact that this will go on for 2-3 years and stick to the one day at a time, but it’s not always easy.

 

I hate all of this right now (((sigh))).

 

Also, I had a med management appointment with the NP who questioned my experience of withdrawal and the need to taper at such a slow rate. I hoped she would have read the articles I provided her. If she did, it didn’t sway her. She dismissed my account of my rough patch and balked when I mentioned possibly slowing the rate of my taper and suggested I do the drops daily rather than weekly. I had intended to cancel the appointment since my PCP wrote the prescription for the fluoxetine solution with 24 refills, which will take me well beyond the 2 years I need it.  But, I forgot and the didn’t want to pull a no call/no show. 
 

So I’m hoping my WD symptoms will continue to subside as I hold at 6.6. 

[Thorin]

14 hours ago, Addax said:

After those several very bumpy days, and some lingering akathisia like symptoms, anxiety and negative thoughts and self doubt I can seem to shake completely, I’ve decided to hold at 6.6 mg. It definitely in a better place than I was last weekend, but the negative thoughts that are feeding my self-doubt and exacerbating my impostor syndrome are just too uncomfortable and are interfering with my quality of life. I’m thankful I’m functional and can do what I need to do, but it’s taking more effort.

Holding seems like a wise choice. It’s horrible how WD can invade every part of your life. You’re nearly there though. I know they’re small drops but 6.6mg means you’ve come a long way!

 

14 hours ago, Addax said:

Also, I had a med management appointment with the NP who questioned my experience of withdrawal and the need to taper at such a slow rate. I hoped she would have read the articles I provided her. If she did, it didn’t sway her. She dismissed my account of my rough patch and balked when I mentioned possibly slowing the rate of my taper and suggested I do the drops daily rather than weekly. I had intended to cancel the appointment since my PCP wrote the prescription for the fluoxetine solution with 24 refills, which will take me well beyond the 2 years I need it.  But, I forgot and the didn’t want to pull a no call/no show. 

This person is clearly not helpful. I would be staying well away from them. I’m so sick of these clueless people.

 

I like that you’re going slow and being careful. I will be doing the same!

[Addax]

I’m posting this link to the forum about what’s happening in the brain during withdrawal so I have it here and hopefully remember to share it. The first/original post is amazing. The explanation is about Benzo w/d but the description can absolutely be generalized to ADs.

What’s happening in your brain

[Addax]

It was / is a tough week. Waves and windows in quick succession with this terrible self doubt plaguing me. The last two days were better in most ways and the waking anxiety has pretty much abated, but today the wave has really been amping up the self-doubt and ruminating.  I have held for a couple weeks now at 6.6mg, but because one of my objectives was to do manage things enough that tapering/withdrawal wouldn’t interfere with work. While it’s not interfering with my ability to work or the quality, the self-doubt and negative thoughts are causing me enough anxiety that I’m very uncomfortable and anxious. I’m entertaining a reinstatement of .2mg.  However, the thing that sucks about Fluoxetine’s long half-life is that it’s so hard to tell which drop affected the increase in symptoms or triggered the wave. Although fluoxetine’s half-life is typically 1-4 days, its metabolite, norfluoxetine ranges anywhere from 7  - 15 days, with some sources citing 28 days. Also,  as most of theses meds do, Fluoxetine has a nonlinear pharmacokinetic profile, but I don’t know what that means in terms of elimination, or how elimination or metabolism of the drug changes at lower doses. I’m going to tag @Shep on this, hoping he might have some thoughts, or a link to a thread I’ve overlooked. Also, might the long half-life make the brassmonkey slide less of a good idea than 4-6 week 10% drops?

 

Part of me very much wants to get to 5mg so I can hang there at flat number for awhile.  Something about 5 seems like a comfortable place to hold… and easy to measure in a syringe.

Edited May 19, 2023 by Addax
Added to

[Shep]

On 5/19/2023 at 1:12 PM, Addax said:

It was / is a tough week. Waves and windows in quick succession with this terrible self doubt plaguing me. The last two days were better in most ways and the waking anxiety has pretty much abated, but today the wave has really been amping up the self-doubt and ruminating.  I have held for a couple weeks now at 6.6mg, but because one of my objectives was to do manage things enough that tapering/withdrawal wouldn’t interfere with work. While it’s not interfering with my ability to work or the quality, the self-doubt and negative thoughts are causing me enough anxiety that I’m very uncomfortable and anxious. I’m entertaining a reinstatement of .2mg.  However, the thing that sucks about Fluoxetine’s long half-life is that it’s so hard to tell which drop affected the increase in symptoms or triggered the wave. Although fluoxetine’s half-life is typically 1-4 days, its metabolite, norfluoxetine ranges anywhere from 7  - 15 days, with some sources citing 28 days. Also,  as most of theses meds do, Fluoxetine has a nonlinear pharmacokinetic profile, but I don’t know what that means in terms of elimination, or how elimination or metabolism of the drug changes at lower doses. I’m going to tag @Shep on this, hoping he might have some thoughts, or a link to a thread I’ve overlooked. Also, might the long half-life make the brassmonkey slide less of a good idea than 4-6 week 10% drops?

 

Part of me very much wants to get to 5mg so I can hang there at flat number for awhile.  Something about 5 seems like a comfortable place to hold… and easy to measure in a syringe.

 

@Addax Sorry I missed this until today. 

 

I think it may be less of the specific drug at play, and more about you now being down to the lower doses. Please see:

 

Why taper? SERT transporter occupancy studies show importance of gradual change in plasma concentration

 

Prozac (fluoxetine) is highlighted in that first post, along with several other drugs. 

 

You may want to go with a micro-taper going forward, especially in order to stay functional for work. Perhaps even as low as 3%. 

 

You could either do a tiny updose or simply hold until you stabilize and then slowly, slowly taper at the micro-taper rate until you're off this drug.

 

Please post your thoughts. 

 

[Addax]

@Shep, Thank you for responding and no worries. Nothing urgent. I was just frustrated by my symptoms and Fluoxetine’s long half-life making it difficult to pinpoint which drop may have been responsible for the bumpy few weeks.  
 

In the end I stuck it out at 6.6mg. Thankfully, I started to feel some relief by Monday. I woke up with some heightened anxiety Tuesday morning, then a strange thing happened. So weird, in fact, that I took note of the time. Just a few minutes past 11 AM on Tuesday, shortly after a meeting ended, I had a strange sensation that I can only describe as something like when your ears clear after feeling plugged up on an airplane. And poof! The wave of symptoms was over. No anxiety this morning, and feeling pretty much at baseline today. The very moment it happened was oddly obvious.  But it just feels a little weird and good to be true.  Even so, although I’m due for a drop Friday, next week is going to be stressful, so I’m going to hold until at least next Friday.

 

As for the micro-taper, I think that’s probably the way to go. Or,  I was also thinking of using the brassmonkey calculations, but dropping every 2 weeks rather than weekly. That would put me at about a 5% drop/month. 

 

Thank you again, Shep!

[Shep]

11 hours ago, Addax said:

Just a few minutes past 11 AM on Tuesday, shortly after a meeting ended, I had a strange sensation that I can only describe as something like when your ears clear after feeling plugged up on an airplane. And poof! The wave of symptoms was over. No anxiety this morning, and feeling pretty much at baseline today.

 

Wow, this is interesting how sudden a wave can go "poof! gone!"

 

Very glad to read you're feeling better. Waiting a bit longer for your next drop sounds like a wise plan. Please let us know how you do. 

[Fifree]

13 hours ago, Addax said:

I had a strange sensation that I can only describe as something like when your ears clear after feeling plugged up on an airplane. And poof! The wave of symptoms was over.

HI Addax. I just wanted to let you know that I have had a similar experience. When I switched from Effexor to Lexapro, I had to have a 2 week washout from the Effexor (so effectively a CT which was truly dreadful). After 2 weeks, I started Lexapro and the next day, I swear I got this lurching sensation in my head that had very similar vibes to an ear-pop. And then I was completely fine.

 

I tried to explain this sensation to my head doc and he looked very sceptical. Very glad to read someone else has had it.

 

I'm glad to read that your wave has abated. Good on you for hanging in there and surfing it!

 

 

[Addax]

@Fifree,

It’s reassuring to read you had a similar experience. I was thinking that people were probably pretty skeptical and was beginning to question my experience. It was THAT strange. One of the journal articles I’ve read, and maybe even one I posted in a forum on this site, reports on a man who had a similar experience. Just walking down the street and, gone!

 

I don’t wish to experience it again, because to do so I would have to be feeling poorly.

 

I’m not a fan of surfing, but in this case I’m glad I did it.  The urge to find relief is hard to resist, even when previous experience tells me the discomfort will be temporary.

 

 

[j1290]

38 minutes ago, Addax said:

I was thinking that people were probably pretty skeptical and was beginning to question my experience.

All this stuff is so weird, the odd symptoms that come and go, it doesn't surprise me a bit.  Now if I'd never experienced the oddities myself, I might be skeptical.  I'm just glad to hear it happened!  I hope you can do something nice to celebrate.   

[Addax]

41 minutes ago, j1290 said:

I'm just glad to hear it happened!  I hope you can do something nice to celebrate.

I’m glad it happened, but I’m compelled to hold off celebrating until I’m 4 months past the drop to 0mg. It’s probably a good idea to celebrate these small victories, because they very much are victories. It’s like I don’t want to jinx it… and I don’t even believe in the whole “jinx” thing. 

[j1290]

2 hours ago, Addax said:

I’m glad it happened, but I’m compelled to hold off celebrating until I’m 4 months past the drop to 0mg. It’s probably a good idea to celebrate these small victories, because they very much are victories. It’s like I don’t want to jinx it… and I don’t even believe in the whole “jinx” thing

 

I totally hear what you're saying.  With these weirdo symptoms and unpredictability of tapering, I can get superstitious in ways I never used to be.   I need to take some victory laps myself.  This is such a long and difficult struggle, I need to take every opportunity I can.  

 

Getting closer to zero every day, Addax!  You'll be there before you know it.   

[Thorin]

5 hours ago, Addax said:

I’m glad it happened, but I’m compelled to hold off celebrating until I’m 4 months past the drop to 0mg. It’s probably a good idea to celebrate these small victories, because they very much are victories. It’s like I don’t want to jinx it… and I don’t even believe in the whole “jinx” thing. 

I need to celebrate all the small wins. It helps me keep going. You should do the same. Then have your BIG celebration when you’re feeling confident that you’re really off this stuff for good…… got any of your awesome questions about Australia for me? I love them! Which part of the states are you in? I may have questions for you too!

[Addax]

6 hours ago, j1290 said:

Getting closer to zero every day, Addax!  You'll be there before you know it. 

I’m going to print this out and stick it on my fridge. 🙂

[Addax]

2 hours ago, Thorin said:

I need to celebrate all the small wins. It helps me keep going. You should do the same. Then have your BIG celebration when you’re feeling confident that you’re really off this stuff for good

I have a chunk of time-off coming up, maybe I’ll celebrate then.  Next week is going to be stressful with work, so if I make it to next Friday, then the few days before my time off without a wave, I will feel a bit more confident and able to relax and celebrate.

 

Stay tuned for questions about Australia and being Aussie…

[Addax]

Reflecting on the last few weeks…

It’s been a bumpy ride. Low grade depression I couldn’t shake, morning anxiety bursts, anxiety and ruminations through out the day accompanied by shakiness (as if I’d had too much caffeine, a paranoia of sorts that that people had lost confidence in my abilities, intense insecurities about my abilities and professionalism acumen. Reading into people’s tones and behaviors, tearfulness, intermittent but subtle akathisia. Not necessarily all of it everyday, but definitely hit buy clusters of symptoms. During the last few days of the wave I struggled to believe that I would ever be able to completely come off Prozac/ Fluoxetine. I started trying to accept that I’d come as far as a I will ever be able to. That after thirty years my brain would always need some of this sh** in its system in order to function. I remained generally functional through all this, and no one was the wiser, not even my office mate who I spent 8 hours a day with. There is something to be said for that. 
As horrific as it sounds, it was only the last few days of the wave that I really began to lose hope and became frustrated with my symptoms and angry about Fluoxetine’s half-life being so long.  My efforts to dispute my irrational thoughts, distract myself, and remind myself of the overwhelming evidence that waves are time limited were failing me. I tried to shift to radical acceptance that how I felt would be my new normal.

 

I have to mention that as bad as my symptoms were, they didn’t hit a level where I wasn’t functioning…it felt like it was going that way, but it never quite got there. I was pretty miserable and the symptoms were disrupting my life,, but I was functional. Also, as happens with these things, I was sucked in by my irrational thoughts and symptoms so much that I hadn’t realized most of the improvements as they were happening, or maybe didn’t appreciate them. It is only now, looking back, while I’m not hyperfocused on my symptoms that I realize negative symptoms had begun to melt away before the ear-popping-like experience. The changes were likely  subtle, but I can now identify them. 
 

So here I am post a several weeks long wave… and I’m at baseline, albeit in a state of hypervigilance waiting for a shoe to drop.  If I could yank my brain from my head and shake it and yell, “Why do you make me believe I’ll never get better when you (and I) know full well that’s untrue?!! WTAF, Brain?!”  I might fall back on “Fool me once, shame on you, brain, fool me twice, shame on me.” But that’s hard when the only reason I’m me is because of my brain.  

 

I so hate this. Mid 2025, when I estimate I will be Fluoxetine free for several months and will have written my success post, can’t come soon enough.  
 

 

Edited May 26, 2023 by Addax

[Thorin]

16 minutes ago, Addax said:

Reflecting on the last few weeks…

It’s been a bumpy ride. Low grade depression I couldn’t shake, morning anxiety bursts, anxiety and ruminations through out the day accompanied by shakiness (as if I’d had too much caffeine, a paranoia of sorts that that people had lost confidence in my abilities, intense insecurities about my abilities and professionalism acumen. Reading into people’s tones and behaviors, tearfulness, intermittent but subtle akathisia. Not necessarily all of it everyday, but definitely hit buy clusters of symptoms. During the last few days of the wave I struggled to believe that I would ever be able to completely come off Prozac/ Fluoxetine. I started trying to accept that I’d come as far as a I will ever be able to. That after thirty years my brain would always need some of this sh** in its symptoms in order to function. I remained generally functional through all this, and no one was the wiser, not even my office mate who I spent 8 hours a day with. There is something to be said for that. 
As horrific as it sounds, it was only the last few days of the wave that I really began to lose hope and became frustrated with my symptoms and angry about Fluoxetine’s half-life being so long.  My efforts to dispute my irrational thoughts, distract myself, and remind my self of the overwhelming evidence that waves are time limited were failing me. I tried to shift to radical acceptance that how I felt would be my new normal.

 

I have to mention that as bad as my symptoms were, they didn’t hit a level where I wasn’t functioning…it felt like it was going that way, but it never quite got there. I was pretty miserable and the symptoms were disrupting my life,, but I was functional. Also, as happens with these things, I was sucked by my irrational thoughts and symptoms so much that I hadn’t realized most of the improvements as they were happening, or maybe didn’t appreciate them. It is only now, looking back, while I’m not hyperfocused on my symptoms that I realize negative symptoms had begun to melt away before the ear-popping-like experience. The changes were likely  subtle, but I can now identify them. 
 

So here I am post a several weeks long wave… and I’m at baseline, albeit in a state of hypervigilance waiting for a shoe to drop.  If I could yank my brain from my head and shake it and yell, “Why do you make me believe I’ll never get better when you (and I) know full well that’s untrue?!! WTAF, Brain?!”  I might fall back on “Fool me once, shame on you, brain, fool me twice, shame on me.” But that’s hard when the only reason I’m me is because of my brain.  

 

I so hate this. Mid 2025, when I estimate I will be Fluoxetine free for several months and will have written my success post, can’t come soon enough.  
 

 

You’re being really strong Addax. You’ve had a hellish few weeks. It sounds like it’s been really overwhelming. This is a horrible journey you’re going through and I’m so glad you’re out the other side of your recent hellish wave. Just think. One day this will all be a horrible memory. Eventually you’ll probably barely think about it. Life will have its ups and downs but they’ll mostly be within the normal bounds of experience rather than the actuate overwhelming hell that is withdrawal. You’re being very strong my friend and in the not too distant future you won’t have to worry about this anymore. It may not be an easy journey to get to that not too distant place but you’ve absolutely already shown you’re tough enough to get there. Did you say you’re going to hold for a little bit and then try the brass monkey slide? I imagine that may be just a little bit kinder on the system than the drop and clench (hold) method. Keep checking in with us. We’re here.

[j1290]

I can tell you after my last cut was particularly intense, it really helped me to give it a few extra weeks to settle down and let my nervous system become less sensitive.   This tapering business is all nightmare-fuel👻  I'm back to my regular med side effects rather than having a raging case of anxiety on top of them.  

 

28 minutes ago, Addax said:

they didn’t hit a level where I wasn’t functioning…it felt like it was going that way, but it never quite got there.

Same, on my last cut.   I don't know how I managed, really, but somehow I did.  I had to give up trying to be employee of the month while I taper.  Ain't happening.  A grade of C is still passing, so that's going to have to be good enough.  I'm chalking this up in the Win column for you and me both!

 

31 minutes ago, Addax said:

But that’s hard when the only reason I’m me is because of my brain.  

I'm convinced that feeling of never getting better is related to the WD process and just another uncomfortable part of healing.  I can't control it any more than I can control wanting to itch a sunburn.   When I'm gently reminded by an incredible group of confederates that it's not going to last forever, that helps snap me out of the hypnosis.   It doesn't fix my 'sunburn', but helps me get out of my head about it. 

 

If you get that feeling this will never end, maybe you can post about it or hit someone up in DMs.  I'm happy to remind you that this too shall pass, my friend!  

[Hanna72]

Following your progress @Addax

You are doing amazingly even though you might not see it or feel it, a progress is being made. So proud of how far you have come.

Keep having faith and never stop believing.

Rooting for you💕