Iggy131313 validation is imminent

[Iggy131313]

Thanks everyone for your replies and support, I have told my husband that things are likely to get alot worse when I come off the drug and yes last for years, but I have to be realistic and prepare him for whats going to happen to me, I cant bear the burdon of knowing on my own and I cant bear him to think Im gonna be just fine ina few months or a year etc.

 

Just for the record Im going to do what Brandy said...

 

Been on 1.04 for a week - theres no doubt that going lower in dose helps, things have changed even since december when I had that awful sense of inner restlessness (not akathisia I dont htink but horrific) it was constant, that has now changed in more of a generalised anxiety again but not super strong, enough to be life ruining but its been worse.

 

I have fallen into a very deep depression and cry constantly, I yearn to go 'home' to how I was and find even the sight of my son overwhelmingly sad. my concentration is poor, but alot of that is because I find it so hard to not think about how I am feeling, I do try to distract when I can, but Im always aware that Im trying to distract if you know what I mean.

 

Symptoms that have stopped for now are

 

heartburn

numbness in legs and arms

headpain

urinary retention

dp/dr (although may get 1 day here and there)

akathisia (may get that inner restlessness feeling for an hour per day at the most)

 

new symptoms

 

strange electric shock pains in my thighs and around my mouth - like a painful static feeling, and if I touch the area it gets alot worse

head zaps havent been around for a while

very sharp stabbing pains in my feet, legs arms and sometimes face

 

old and tiresome symptoms

 

constant anxiety, sometimes free floating, sometimes about my future

deep depression with crying at least 10 times per day for HOURS, i spend most of my time in tears

constant suicidal ideation with planning

constant eye twitching CONSTANT and periodic twitching in my arms, legs bottom and around my mouth

 

my sleep has got better as I have decreased, I am now sleeping on average 9 or 10 hours per night/day - I say this because I am sleeping from maybe 3 or 4 until 12, 1 or sometimes 2pm...so this could be becasue Im staying up so late that Im sleeping late...

 

I know some people may think I should change that pattern but I really dont want to for a few reasons

 

1) the time from midnight onwards is when I get a small respite from my symptoms, I dont want to miss this time

2) sleeping so late in the day shortens the endlessly long days

3) the mornings is the worst for anxiety so If I can sleep through that then thats better for me.

 

I know my sleep will get bad when Im off the 1mg, or maybe not, who knows, but most likely it will, but it really has improved over the past 7 months, when I first RIed I would BANG awake ina state of panic and terror, that doesnt happen now, at 10mg I could force myself back into a fitful unsettled sleep maybe for a couple of hours but its was uncomfortable and not restful...since then sleep has got better and better I still have very vivid dreams but I dont wake through the night and when I wake up in the morning (when our son wakes us up at 7) I can go back to sleep ok, Im aware of the anxiety nagging at me but once I get to sleep im ok again.

 

I have no idea what any of this means, probably nothing, I continue to see that a few hours after I take my 1mg my symptoms increase, I dont know of that shows a hypersensitive reaction or not.

[Skyler]

Thanks everyone for your replies and support, I have told my husband that things are likely to get alot worse when I come off the drug and yes last for years, but I have to be realistic and prepare him for whats going to happen to me, I cant bear the burdon of knowing on my own and I cant bear him to think Im gonna be just fine ina few months or a year etc.

Caroline, this is your depression talking. How about directing your husband here, so he can read some of the responses to your posts? We do not seem to be able to break through your fixation that WD will get worse once you are off, but maybe your husband would be able to incorporate some of the info we have given you more effectively. What do you think.

 

There appears to be a distortion in your thinking about WD, I'm not sure why.. but no matter. People sometimes develop this sort of thinking glitch when there has been a very big hurt, and WD seems to be your Waterloo. Whatever the reason, you do not seem able to shake the apprehension WD will necessarily get worse once you are off despite our numerous reassurances, so maybe it's time to take a different approach?

 

I'm very sorry this is so horrific for you. I don't remember specifically, do you have a therapist (not meaning a psych) who has been able to help you sort thru all this.. someone objective you can trust?

 

Edit 10:30 AM

[Iggy131313]

but it seems everyone gets worse skyler?

 

your right about one thing,I cant seem to change my way of thinking, you asked if I always thought this way...not at all, I was always so optimistic and was the person people would come to for reassurance as I was level headed and rational HA! all gone now, I think its all because I was fine until 5 months off after my CT last year. so I know how it can work, also because of what I went through initailly when I tried to RI and I know how much worse things could be, I mean, this is hell and Im suicidal, but that was constant torture, I only coped because I thought it would end in a week or 2 but I was still a hysterical mess.

 

Knowing what that was like and the intense trauma I have from that and now this, makes me fear it more than anything in the world, so much.

 

Im trying to tell myself that I dont know whats going to happen and even if things go to torture chanber hell again at 6 months off then I will just have to get through it, I know that that level of suffering doesnt last, and everyone improves from that state, usually it lasts about 5 months the acute torture feelings from what Ive seen.

 

If I was off the drug now I would say that I have improved, only slightly but improved all the same, and things have changed where they havent improved.

 

I just fear that this 1mg is holding back the hell I was in when I RIed, but fearing it doesnt help me I know that, it probably does the opposite as dalsaan said, I put pressure on my CNS by working myself up about it.

 

Damn the Drs and big pharma for doing this to me, to all of us, I was happy, I was so damn happy, I was one of those people who had it all, had everything ging for them, I was happy to be me and enjoyed my life so much, then out of the blue, with no warning, the gates of hell were opened and I was pushed in, for no reason and out of the blue.

 

I will try to take on board everyones advice and try to cope with each day as it comes, its not easy, its the worst thing that could happen to a human being (apart from it happening to my baby, or him dying, that would be worse, its the only thing that could be worse, someth=imes I think that the parents of the children who died in the recent school shooting would swap places with me, they would live with this to have their child back, Im aware of that and thank god that my chhild is well and happy and safe)

[Skyler]

but it seems everyone gets worse skyler?

 

your right about one thing,I cant seem to change my way of thinking.

 

Knowing what that was like and the intense trauma I have from that and now this, makes me fear it more than anything in the world, so much.

NO IT DOES NOT! But you are only relating to the negatives, they are what you remember because you are ruminating about all that is dreadful. You are not obsessively thinking thru those that are positive??

 

Caroline, this is where you are stuck.. sometimes when we are sick for long periods, our psychic energy is so depleted we revert to an earlier fears, in this case what it's like during a bad bad trauma. You are so low on energy your feeling thoughts are no longer directed toward external reality, but instead on an early 'primal' trauma. Kind of psychobabble short hand but hopefully the point is clear? You need to be in intensive counseling. You were/are more or less in the 'biz'.. are you familiar with the construct I'm using.

[Iggy131313]

yes I hear what your saying Skyler and I know that indeed some of my fears are as you say, but thats not to say that the suffering I have now is not real, it really is and as it is accompanied by a whole host of physical symptoms I know it is w/d or the adverse reaction etc.

 

I agree that at some point I will seek counselling, although its not easy to come by in the UK and I cant afford to pay for it, but right now when my suffering and pain is still so acute I dont think it would do me much good to be honest anyway.

 

I know I add to things by torturing myself with thoughts of doom, and I know its not helpful, but a very very difficult thing to break, I guess as when in w/d your thoughts automatically go towards the nagative and the painful that it magnifies things a greta deal.

 

So yes I do agree on many things you have said, BUT I dont agree that my current suffering is not based on reality but on a remembered trauma, this is still a very real suffering that I am enduring.

 

Thanks again for your support. xx

[Skyler]

yes I hear what your saying Skyler and I know that indeed some of my fears are as you say, but thats not to say that the suffering I have now is not real, it really is and as it is accompanied by a whole host of physical symptoms I know it is w/d or the adverse reaction etc.

WD symptoms are the gateway.. they are the reason your energy is so depleted, and in no way am I saying these are not as real as you experience them. Not in the least.

 

I agree that at some point I will seek counselling, although its not easy to come by in the UK and I cant afford to pay for it, but right now when my suffering and pain is still so acute I dont think it would do me much good to be honest anyway.

I think you need counseling now and would benefit from the right person. You need someone who can help you see the unrealistic threads in your thinking.. As you might have guessed, I'm a psychotherapist.. (LOL, dunno if this matters). I know WD!! Been there, think?

 

I know I add to things by torturing myself with thoughts of doom, and I know its not helpful, but a very very difficult thing to break, I guess as when in w/d your thoughts automatically go towards the negative and the painful that it magnifies things a great deal.

I think catastrophizing and negativity are symptoms (I'm not CBT) that have come about because your mind is struggling to make sense of the hurt (WD and betrayal by the Big Pharma, etc) you FEEL. And you need someone in real time, face to face to give you much needed support.

 

I dont agree that my current suffering is not based on reality but on a remembered trauma, this is still a very real suffering that I am enduring.

HUGE, of course you have real pain, that is what this is all about. What I don't agree on is your understanding of the meaning.. that WD suffering necessarily needs to go on forever. But it DOES END, and you are not being able to accept this, despite all you have learned and read on this site, and I'm sure others. You are obsessing on all the bad things... WHY?

[areyouthere]

Iggy,

 

Thinking of you. I'd highly recommend counseling too!!!

[peggy]

Iggy, you probably won't want to hear this, but i think you are more able than you think you are. You spend an incredible amount of time on the net based on your comments here about other boards and other people's experiences. That requires concentration and sitting still. That shows you CAN sit still and you CAN concentrate.

 

You are not helping your own recovery - for example your sleep schedule. You are reinforcing a faulty circadian rhythm. How can your hormonal system regulate itself if you are maintaining dysfunction? You should be trying to normalise your schedule not working it in an opposite direction.

[Iggy131313]

Ah yes, I can concentrate on w.d, but only that, its 'other things; I cant concentrate on...and yes I can sit still, I dont have the akathisia now, although when I did I was still serching the net for answers but pacing up and down whilst doing it

 

I go to the supermarket everyday and I pick up my son from school, I walk for 2 miles per day, I cook tea and I try to read in the evenings, these are the things that I do each day...but theres no way I am well enough to go back to work, especially in the job I have/had.

 

I never thought about my sleep pattern in that way, do others agree with that? am I having negative impact on my healing by stayinmg up very late and sleeping late? I would be very disapointed to miss the only hours of the day that I feel ok and replace them with the most hellish ones, ugh! But if it will help me to heal then I will try to do so, does everyone agree?

 

So when you say I am more able than I think I am, I am trying to do as much as I can, its not the physical restraints that are ruining my life, its the mentakl ones, so yes I am able to walk to the shops, but I cry all the way there, and back, I can get confused, if I have to stand in a queue my anxiety and agitation go through the roof, I feel like a stranger amongst the 'normals'.

 

so ability to do things, yes, in a way, but in a state no one would ever want to be in, I see it like chewing a rock on a bad tooth (with toothache etc) I can do it but its incredibly painful. Do you think Im not trying hard enough? (that doesnt read like I meant it to, I dont mean that in a bad way, Im genuinly asking) how far do you push yourself in this?

[Altostrata]

I believe I have mentioned more than once that keeping regular hours, early to bed and early to rise, reinforces the sleep cycle.

 

If you are on the computer late at night posting on Web sites, you are getting too much bright light at the wrong time. This can adversely affect your sleep, too.

 

There are a number of topics on this in the Symptoms forum. It's self-serve. Please go there and do some reading, Iggy.

[Iggy131313]

hmm, thanks alto, I have read them all, the issue is not my sleep though, Im getting enough sleep and the quality is also good. I think I could change that pattern around, but do you think that my others symptoms are effectsed by having an odd sleep pattern?

 

does keeping odd hours hinder my recovery as peggy suggested? I will change it if it does

 

oh, and when Im up at those hours Im usually laying down reading my book as my system has calmed down nd Im able to relax and red at last!

[Brandy]

I have a lot of thoughts that will have to wait til a little later. There's a lot of excellent advice here, and I'll add what I hope might be helpful also.

 

I do disagree about the sleep advice though. I know the advice given here re sleep (and computer) schedules has been helpful to many people here, but it's been the opposite for me.

 

I'm a night owl by nature, and never feel as well when forced to keep so-called (!) "normal" hours for work and other life situations. I manage, just like night shift workers who aren't night owls are, but never as well and it never normalizes.

 

Interestingly, when I went into paxil w/d, my body reverted to what would be considered a "normal" schedule (for the first time in my life!), and it made me feel ghastly. This went on for a long time.

 

When I started feeling better my sleep schedule instantly went back to what for me is normal (staying up pretty much all night, sleeping in the morning), and my mental state especially normalized.

 

I'm certainly not recommending this for anyone, but I do think if Caroline feels better on her present schedule and gets sufficient (actually plenty of!) restful sleep, that shouldn't be an issue. If sleep becomes a problem, she could certainly try the recommendations here.

 

I say if her present sleep schedule is helping her get through this better, if it ain't broke, don't fix it!

 

But a few other things may be slightly cracked even though not actually broken. I think some misunderstandings (conclusions based on insufficient or inaccurate information) may have led to some obsessive-type thinking (common in w/d) that do need a bit of repair!

 

Will post more on those other topics in these recent posts a little later.

[Brandy]

Thanks everyone for your replies and support, I have told my husband that things are likely to get alot worse when I come off the drug and yes last for years, but I have to be realistic and prepare him for whats going to happen to me, I cant bear the burdon of knowing on my own and I cant bear him to think Im gonna be just fine ina few months or a year etc...

 

I know my sleep will get bad when Im off the 1mg, or maybe not, who knows, but most likely it will, but it really has improved over the past 7 months, when I first RIed I would BANG awake ina state of panic and terror, that doesnt happen now, at 10mg I could force myself back into a fitful unsettled sleep maybe for a couple of hours but its was uncomfortable and not restful...since then sleep has got better and better I still have very vivid dreams but I dont wake through the night and when I wake up in the morning (when our son wakes us up at 7) I can go back to sleep ok, Im aware of the anxiety nagging at me but once I get to sleep im ok again.

 

I have no idea what any of this means, probably nothing, I continue to see that a few hours after I take my 1mg my symptoms increase, I dont know of that shows a hypersensitive reaction or not.

 

Well, I said I'd try to reply later, and it's later. I'm pretty tired and don't have the coffee supporting my brain (coffee is definitely my drug of choice lol), but I'll do my best to add a few thoughts I think are important. (Caroline, I'm not forgetting about our emails and you asked some interesting things, but my allergies have made me too sick and spacy to reply coherently in detail, and I think the most important things right now are in these posts from recent days - and discussing them here might bring some helpful replies from others as well.

 

This line is perhaps the most important thing you've written and the one that definitely needs to be dealt with --

 

You wrote:

 

I have told my husband that things are likely to get alot worse when I come off the drug and yes last for years, but I have to be realistic and prepare him for whats going to happen to me, I cant bear the burdon of knowing on my own and I cant bear him to think Im gonna be just fine ina few months or a year etc...

This is the medication talking. It's altered your mind-set and thought processes. That happened to me too. It happened to so many people, and we don't really see it until we get better.

 

The reason that we've urged you to taper slowly even at these low doses is so that you can prevent or greatly (I stress, greatly) minimize the impact of coming off the drug.

 

I know the fear factor ("anxiety" is not an adequate way to describe the kind of biochemical terror I was in and I certainly think you are in) makes this seem like a certainty, but honestly, it is extremely unlikely. I think you read a lot of frightening personal histories when you were at a biochemically highly suggestible mental state and these got locked in your mind. Unfortunately, as I've mentioned, you had no way of knowing that while many of the people you mentioned in your emails were all telling the truth, I'm certain, those stories were unwittingly not the full story. You have to realize that every person you've mentioned to me, with one exception who I think is medically in a very different situation from you, had to recover from multiple meds (even if they never thought to post it - that never occurred to most of us until relatively recently) and also either c/t'd or tapered at what they thought was a slow taper but was not. And as you know, most groups (with the exception of this group and a small benzo w/d group I belong to) advise jumping off at low doses that I've long thought were way too much for some people with highly sensitive systems.

 

Since you've been tapering slowly for a while now - and having a number of improvements that seem to me you're well into the healing process - and plan to continue to do so, listening even more carefully to your body for a while, I think you're warning (read: scaring) your husband about something that isn't going to happen.

 

I find it so hard to urge you to taper slowly knowing that this med is causing such a bad reaction for you. But you'd been back on it long enoughby the time you realized it was w/d and joined w/d groups, that it seemed important to taper off carefully instead of quickly discontinuing it, as I would have advised had you just been back on the med a brief time.

 

But I think the most likely scenario if you continue tapering slowly and carefully is that you may or may not feel a little worse in some ways (most likely physically) but will also feel better in other ways when you are at the point where you can safely go off the med.

 

Recovery from these meds is not an either/or matter of "horrible" or "just fine" for a while. Although you cannont promise your husband that you'll be "just fine" immediately after going off the med, you equally should not mislead him that you will get "a lot worse" or "for years" when you do.

 

I think you're unwittingly (and I emphasize "unwittingly") and with the best of intentions, misleading and frightening him. Wrong conclusions your brain formed at a very frightening stage of early w/d and/or the adverse RI and stuck to tenaciously (which is not that uncommon a phenomenon these w/d can cause), and that mindset that's like a scratched record (anybody remember phonograph records lol?) stuck in a groove and replaying over and over no matter what.

 

I'm trying to think of ways to get that "record" unstuck, but I think it's very important for your marriage that you help your husband realize, even if your brain can't really acknowledge it yet at this point in your healing, that what you've told your husband is not factually true or likely.

 

Think about it - What if the positions were reversed, and your husband was going through this and telling you what you've been telling him? I think you'd be confused, frightened (i.e., scared shitless), and not knowing what to do.

 

I think the suggestion of having your husband participate here, if he's willing to do so, is an excellent one. He must be feeling very alone with this. (Add to that the fact that guys especially feel like they should be able to "fix things" and hard as it is for any of us to realize, he can support you through this but he can't fix it; only time and your body's natural healing processes can - and will - do that.)

 

If he won't, or if you don't feel comfortable with that, remember that I once suggested that I'd be glad to try to explain some of what's going on to him. I should have mentioned that we could certainly do this through your email - nothing behind your back. As I think I mentioned, I would never have thought of this if someone hadn't asked me to do this once. He asked me to write a letter to someone and I did so - sent it to his email for that family member to read. He told me later that hearing it from someone else - someone who'd gone through it - made a huge difference in their then extremely tense relationship.

 

(Before I get ten million PMs - I can't do this normally. Hard enough to keep up with even ordinary correspondence. But I could do this in this situation if it would help, because I do understand from what I experienced some of what I think is in play here.)

 

A couple of other suggestions --

 

Don't mention the w/d/failed RI to your husband very often. Trust me, he's very aware of what you're going through even if he understandably can't understand it like someone who's actually been through it. When you start crying inexplicably, or otherwise acting unlike your real self, believe me, he knows it's the med.

 

Consider doing things differently. You can't help getting symptoms for a while, but maybe when you start crying and can't stop, perhaps say something like "Sheesh, the fountain's starting again" or something. Let him know that's your "signal" for "I don't mean to be crying but I can't help it."

 

I'm not minimizing what you're going through, believe me. But we have to find ways to deal with the unthinkable until we get better. If you have a catch phrase that will remind him that it's the meds and you can't help it, without frightening him or triggering his feelings of helplessness about wanting to "fix" it for you, both of you might feel a little more comfortable about dealing with this time period that nobody wants but has happened and you have to get through.

 

Maybe set a certain time - and time limit! - for discussing this crisis in your lives and updating him, but where he knows the rest of the time you both can try to carry on as normally as possible. Like I said, it won't make your symptoms go away, but it may make the atmosphere at home better for both of you.

 

 

but it seems everyone gets worse skyler?...

 

I just fear that this 1mg is holding back the hell I was in when I RIed, but fearing it doesnt help me I know that, it probably does the opposite as dalsaan said, I put pressure on my CNS by working myself up about it.

 

About the "it seems everyone gets worse" sentence - hopefully I covered that in what I just wrote above. No, not everyone gets worse. I think you got worse and are in that right now. But you're doing things differently now, and in a while more and more will get better.

 

You said that you had about a half hour "window" recently. It certainly sounded like a window. I know how gut-wrenching it is when the window "closes" but I know for me it was the proof I needed after suffering relentlessly so long, that it really was in me to feel better.

 

I had really worried that my ability to feel happiness or any sense of my true self was gone, destroyed. Even the shortest (and certainly not complete) window was a revelation that what I had thought was destroyed was really still there. That's when I started realizing I'd get better.

 

I just can't see that the 1 mg is doing what you think. The reason we advised you to taper it slowly was to prevent problems from going off the RI. I mean, it's part of an RI that didn't work. You need to taper off it to prevent any future w/d problems (from the RI) when the healing process your body is already going through will be complete.

[compsports]

Totally agree Brandy.

 

As one who has been consistently sleep deprived due to my difficulties in adjusting to cpap treatment, my motto is if you find a sleep schedule that works even if it is extremely unconventional, go with it. Sleep is just too precious to mess around with if it is working for you.

 

CS

 

I have a lot of thoughts that will have to wait til a little later. There's a lot of excellent advice here, and I'll add what I hope might be helpful also.

 

I do disagree about the sleep advice though. I know the advice given here re sleep (and computer) schedules has been helpful to many people here, but it's been the opposite for me.

 

I'm a night owl by nature, and never feel as well when forced to keep so-called (!) "normal" hours for work and other life situations. I manage, just like night shift workers who aren't night owls are, but never as well and it never normalizes.

 

Interestingly, when I went into paxil w/d, my body reverted to what would be considered a "normal" schedule (for the first time in my life!), and it made me feel ghastly. This went on for a long time.

 

When I started feeling better my sleep schedule instantly went back to what for me is normal (staying up pretty much all night, sleeping in the morning), and my mental state especially normalized.

 

I'm certainly not recommending this for anyone, but I do think if Caroline feels better on her present schedule and gets sufficient (actually plenty of!) restful sleep, that shouldn't be an issue. If sleep becomes a problem, she could certainly try the recommendations here.

 

I say if her present sleep schedule is helping her get through this better, if it ain't broke, don't fix it!

 

But a few other things may be slightly cracked even though not actually broken. I think some misunderstandings (conclusions based on insufficient or inaccurate information) may have led to some obsessive-type thinking (common in w/d) that do need a bit of repair!

 

Will post more on those other topics in these recent posts a little later.

 

[flower]

I agree..Sleep when you can..I wake up to take a sleeping pill sometimes. Seems I'm defeating the purpose but I'm afraid of what will happen if I don't take that Trazadone. Hang in there Iggy. We can be rid of this drug..

[tezza]

I agree, too, sleep when you can. I would. I have changed my sleeping habits since early WD only because I was waking at 4am even if I stayed up til 2am. That's when I started going to bed earlier. If I coulda slept until 9 or so I woulda stayed up later.

[antoinette]

Iggy i can relate with the husband situation. Im in an anger wave right now and i screamed at him yesterday and then sobbed. I told him how sorry I was and he said he knows.im.having a hard.time so i went and sat with him and talked and got it all out. If you can, try and talk with your husband, just even sitting by him. They are just as lost and confused as us and i agree with everyone else they are fixers so its very hard they cant do anything for us

 

I think its wonderful you go to the shops and walk and get your son. Thats huge. You are trying and doing.great at that. Everyday i have to push myself and i still feel like you said the anxiety and dp/dr. I just roll along with it and know thats exactly what it is is just that. Its scary but cant or wont hurt us. It all will pass. You mentioned alot of your symptoms have passed already, i know you still have some but thats ok they will pass too.

 

By trying to live normally everyday you will.eventually feel normal. I realized that very quick. I.didnt leave or so anything for 3 mos and i felt worse. You are really trying and i see that. I made myself do one thing everyday for myself even if i hated it but i swear it helps. I really wish you could do cbt my thinking was just like yours until i did it and it totally changed my thinking. Im sorry if i annoy you too, i feel like you never respond to me but i just like to help in any way i can. Ive been in that hell and i feel so bad for you. Just keep fighting thats the only way! And quit reading the horror stories, you never know the full story of thier life.

[Iggy131313]

lol, dont be daft antoinette, I LOVE your dvice, nd Im sorry if you feel I dont reposnd to you, Im just so overwhemed etc, thats never been my intention! Thanks for your support and advice and I hope you get well soon too.

 

Thanks to Brandy and everyone else who has been so thoughtful and helpful, I really do appriciate all the wonderful advice and comfort that I get here, it helps, alot.

[antoinette]

Lol ok good! Unfortunately one of my symptoms is a little paranoia! Just kidding, but hang in there iggy your improving whether you see it or not. Its a slow process. I look back to even 2 mos ago and see that i indeed have improved. Its like peeling an oinion, tons of layers to get through and it stinks but you will get your true self again.

[tezza]

Its like peeling an oinion, tons of layers to get through and it stinks but you will get your true self again.

 

 

This made me smile, reminded me of another post somewhere! Lol

[antoinette]

Lol! It just came to me out of nowhere!

[angie007]

Hi Iggy, i realise how hard wd is for the biggest majority i really do -as im probably one of the longest taperers on here, and now coming up to 2 yrs drug FREE, the info that Antoinette gave you is the best advice there is regarding wd --------if you can manage to do just one thing for yourself each day, it becomes a habit that our brains quickly remember as being the norm, afterall, wd is chemical change, we have to re train the brain, how better than to do what we normally used to do -----it also distracts away from the negative stinking thing we all suffer from in wd --- why not try it and see if it helps you too!! to do something to help yourself is far healthier than doing nothing at all, hope it helps somewhat.

[Nikki]

Iggy get outside and start walking. Let it become a new habit. Like the others said, sleep is so precious, if you are doing something that provides you with a night of sleep go with it.

 

Angie I did not know that you have been drug free for 2 years. I tried to look up your introduction and couldn't find it.

 

Hugs ladies

[angie007]

Hi Nikki, yes i have been off paxil 2 yrs in May, and although every single day isnt perfect as yet, its certainly better !!! although last couple of days iv had darn anxiety again but hey ho, keep walking through eh, what dont kill us, makes us stronger lol, all the best guys and gals x

[laineyk]

Thanks guys I will stay at 2.5 for now and see.

 

Im having a very VERY difficult time at the moment switching off from withdrawal victim mode, I dont know how to do it.... Im scared to be with my family and I dont know why, the only thing I can focus on is this sh1t, I seem to spend all my time on these forums searching for a way out but I know that there isnt one.

 

I know I should try to distract myself from it but I find it so hard to even THINK about anything else, whatever I am doing the constant thoughts about how my life is over because of this w/d are with me 24/7.

 

I really dont know how much I am adding to the chemical fear myself, but I have ZERO confidence...part of it is that when I am downstairs with my family and not hiding in the bedroom things feel so 'wrong' and 'off' maybe its some DP/DR but it scares me so much that I can only take it for a few minutes and then Im running back to the bedroom again.

 

Being on the bedroom doesnt take the feelings away and being on these forums doesnt take the feelings away, but at least its something that occupies my mind, when I try to do anything else my mind always comes back to focus on how I am feeling, that things feel wrong that I feel out of control and that Im loosing my mind.

 

Maybe these thoughts are all part of it, If Im honest I wish I could get back on the drug and just be ok again without all these thoughts and anxiety, whether t be my own or chemical.

 

I feel OBSSESSED by what is happening to me and I cant seem to break free, I want to be able to wake up and say, its over now, but I will NEVER be able to do that.

 

what should I do? Im so so scared

 

 

 

 

Iggy, I havent made it to the end of these posts but when I got to this one Its EXACTLY what I feel & do. I spend 99.9% of the day in my room...it to does not make it better really but when I am out of my room its more anxiety provoking

[laineyk]

ok now I finished reading all 11 pgs...and you & I sound so much alike with our symptoms.......I wish I could tell you what works for me but NOTHING has as of yet. I take clonazepam, had to in the beginning of all this to get to work each day...I'm a nurse at a hospital of all things. SO now I will have to deal with coming off that also after this fantastic ride I'm on now.

 

I exercise daily (right now on treadmill) when weather is good I power walk 3 miles everyday. I try to force myself to get out a couple times a week (church on Sundays) but its always with fear & trepidation...feeling like I want to crawl out of my skin.

 

Please keep in touch and we can swap horror stories...and someday we will swap success!!!!!

[strawberry17]

I'm sorry I can't keep quiet any longer, about the sleeping pattern. Iggy I feel very differently about this to everyone else here, I think you should think about gradually bringing back your sleep schedule, say about half an hour a week? until eventually you reach a normal sleep schedule. You desperately want to go back to work at some point and to take your son to school and fit and get back to your old life, the longer you leave this odd sleep schedule the more deeply entrenched it will become surely.

 

Did you talk to Mr Iggy131313 about reading this thread and this site as well?

[Brandy]

Strawberry, I'm too tired and still have too much to do to want to post, but in this case I can't keep quiet in my concern for how dangerous your advice could be for someone who's still in as precarious emotional state as Caroline is.

 

I mean, when the house is on fire, shopping for new curtains is not the priority.

 

This is nothing personal and I admire you for helping out on this site.

 

But please read again and take seriously what Caroline wrote in the post you were responding to:

 

 

 

...

 

Symptoms that have stopped for now are

 

heartburn

numbness in legs and arms

headpain

urinary retention

dp/dr (although may get 1 day here and there)

akathisia (may get that inner restlessness feeling for an hour per day at the most)

 

new symptoms

 

strange electric shock pains in my thighs and around my mouth - like a painful static feeling, and if I touch the area it gets alot worse

head zaps havent been around for a while

very sharp stabbing pains in my feet, legs arms and sometimes face

 

old and tiresome symptoms

 

constant anxiety, sometimes free floating, sometimes about my future

deep depression with crying at least 10 times per day for HOURS, i spend most of my time in tears

constant suicidal ideation with planning

constant eye twitching CONSTANT and periodic twitching in my arms, legs bottom and around my mouth

 

my sleep has got better as I have decreased, I am now sleeping on average 9 or 10 hours per night/day - I say this because I am sleeping from maybe 3 or 4 until 12, 1 or sometimes 2pm...so this could be becasue Im staying up so late that Im sleeping late...

 

I know some people may think I should change that pattern but I really dont want to for a few reasons

 

1) the time from midnight onwards is when I get a small respite from my symptoms, I dont want to miss this time

2) sleeping so late in the day shortens the endlessly long days

3) the mornings is the worst for anxiety so If I can sleep through that then thats better for me.

 

...

 

The akathisia and DP/DR being gone are HUGE. Her sleep is good - that's HUGE. She has accepted the difficult fact that she unfortunately has to stay on decreasing doses of a medication that has caused her huge problems, to prevent future (withdrawal) problems from the length of time her reinstatement lasted prior to realizing the drug was the problem, after her doctor advised her to increase the dose rather than go off it immediately after she developed an adverse reaction.

 

I don't understand why you would write the following to someone who is still so depressed she's still meticulously planning suicide:

 

I'm sorry I can't keep quiet any longer, about the sleeping pattern. Iggy I feel very differently about this to everyone else here, I think you should think about gradually bringing back your sleep schedule, say about half an hour a week? until eventually you reach a normal sleep schedule. You desperately want to go back to work at some point and to take your son to school and fit and get back to your old life, the longer you leave this odd sleep schedule the more deeply entrenched it will become surely.

 

...

 

She has stated that much as she wants to return to her job, preventing her husband from leaving and taking her son with him is her priority. She has never to my knowledge said that taking her son to school is an issue, much less something she desperately wants. She does pick him up from school every day, difficult as that is for her, and she cooks his meals and plays with him and attends his school functions etc. Difficult as those things are for her.

 

She has found a time schedule that works for her and is keeping her going - with good restful sleep. She has and still is putting great effort into making many lifestyle changes that were hard for her but were important in terms of her getting out and in terms of her family's well-being.

 

When one doesn't have a sleep problem (as she doesn't), changing a sleep schedule can be annoying but not a problem. I have worked in various capacities including hospital work where I frequently had to switch between working day and night shifts. My ex-boyfriend was a cop - same thing. Many people do this so that people have the services that keep our way of life going, and none of us enjoy it, but it's not an issue.

 

And I still think we should respect Caroline's judgement, which I agree with, that keeping going, staying alive for the son who needs her and will need her always, and making changes to repair and preserve her marriage (a frequent problem in w/d, as we have already seen) are the priorities. I just don't understand why you thing it's so important to add to her stress about a non-issue and to change a schedule that gives her some peace during this acute stage of w/d, that you can't refrain from trying to do just that.

 

Please consider that the importance of a schedule that you don't consider "odd" may say more about your priorities and needs than hers. I have been struggling for some time to help her realize that her situation is not hopeless and that I truly believe she has a life of happiness and doing good for her family and others ahead of her - very likely sooner than she expects. But in so many cases on various groups, I have to spend so incredibly much time deflecting dogmatic thinking of various kinds, and too often I feel like I'm swimming upstream.

 

One size does not fit all.

[tezza]

I must say, Strawberry makes a good point, especially where your child is concerned.

[compsports]

Strawberry, as one who has gone through hell with my sleeping problems, I have to totally agree with Brandy. When you are under extreme duress and in severe crisis, you don't mess with the one thing that is working well.

 

And if Iggy started having problems with her sleep due to trying to adjust it, as one who has to use every ounce of willpower I have not go down a bad path, I can say that would be devastating to her.

 

I beg people to stop bugging Iggy about changing her sleeping schedule since she is fulfilling her responsibilities. Please, as one who would give anything to be able to sleep on a regular basis, think about what you are asking of her.

 

CS

[Iggy131313]

im very scared and confused and i really dont know what to do...

 

I have spoken to several people who have RIed and tapered off slowly only to find themselves back in the hell that felt the same as CT...of course I know that each w/d will be worse than the one before and it leads me to depair over my future...what does it all mean for me?

 

after my severe kindling reaction trying to RI I am left tapering this citalopram that has damaged me further on RI ontop of my stupid CT 15/16 months ago..10 months on from the adverse reaction I am non functional and living in hell, obsessing over suicide but how can I kill myself when I have a child who needs me, if Im alive that helps him somewhat...dont get me wrong if I was 10 months off the drug and feeling like this I would have more hope because I would have 10 months behind me of healing but all this time feels so wasted as I am still on the drug and doing so sovery badly.

 

so if someone whos symptoms were relieved by RI has an equally hard time coming off, what does that mean for me whos cns is in such chaos and pain/.? if things got any worse I would have no choice but to end it, the pain now is unbearable, I have no idea how Im making it through each hellish and ever;lasting day..

 

march, march I had a semi window, I felt a little better, for no reason, I became more functional, I even had days where I fely ok and did things with my son, after 4 weeks of comparible bliss I became intensly dizzy and sick, then EVERYTHIGN came back, everything, the pain was excruciating, every second was like a lifetime, akathisia, panic, anxiety, deep despair, hallucinations, and indescribable other symptoms....this was 5 months after my last large taper - from 4mg - 2mg, could it have been the cause?

 

or could it have been that the day before I forgot to take my dose and the symptoms, I think came on just after I had taken it again, could it have been another adverse reaction to reintroducing the citalopram even just after 1 missed dose? I cant see it being a w/d reaction after 1 day, as the w/d mostly seems to be delayed with these drugs.

 

But what to do from here? I am on 0.48mg now and plan to taper all the way down to 0.01, but should I even taper at all? if things are going to get worse for me then shouldnt I stay on this for life? would it last? I really need some advice on this, all I can see in my future is more misery and pain, non functional and desperate and suicidal.

 

Alto says while I am on this small amount that my nervous system is recovering, should I stay on this small amount for a prolonged amount of time and see if I can recover with the drug in my system, there are conflicting opinions about if someone can really heal with any amount of the drug in the system?

 

in my first post alto said that going off should help me, but then later warns of the w/d, I know no one has any answers to all of this but Im begging, pleading for advice on how to advance from here, I want things to get better, I dont want the 18 months or more of tapering in agony to be for nothing.

 

I dont think my taper has made my symptoms any worse, I cant see any correlation between my taper and my symptoms, only the suffering from the inicial CT 15 months ago and the adverse reacttion 10 months ago.

 

Im so scared to come off, and so scared to stay on...I dont know whether the 0.48 is helping me or making me worse, and I dont know the right action to take, alto I know you dont like me but I beg you to give me your honest opinion on this and what course of action I should take. please help me

[Timinjapan]

HI Iggy, I know less than you do about this but I'll give you my opinion for what that's worth. You are now on a very low dose, less than 1/80th of the dose you were on for the first two years. Although going off completely will be another change for your nervous system to have to adjust too, I really don't think it will make much difference whether you stay on your current dose, taper a bit more, or stop from here.

 

The advantages of quitting now are (1) no more worrying about what dose to take and (2) the stability of having no more of the drug in your system. The disadvantage is a potential for further disruption of your CNS. In the end, it is your call. But it seems to me that the best strategy now is to make a decision, stick with it, and trust that it was the best decision you could have made in the circumstances, regardless of the outcome.

[Iggy131313]

thanks Tim, I definitly feel I should taper lower, alto thinks I should, but Im wondering if tapering when my cns is in such distress is what I should do, I do think I am still reacting badly to even this tiny amount of citalopram, it brings on akathisia after I take it, especially ina wave I feel much MUCH worse after taking it, my body hates it and is hypersensitive to it I know that but alto said I should aggrivate the cns by making too big cuts or by jumping off too soon, I do think that 0.48 is too soon for me to jump, I plan to continue to taper up until christmas with 10/20% drops as alto suggested (see alto I have listened!! and am so so grateful for your advice) but I just dont know what to do for the best

 

I myself cant tell if I am feeling any w/d from dropping over the past 10 months, I honestly dont think I am, but am just feeling the waves from the inicial CT and the adverse reaction/ my biggest concern is that I am so kindled that going off this tiny dose is going to make things even worse for me, is it helping or hidering me?

 

I honestly think, even though I am in a very bad way that I have got slightly better on smallere and smaller doses, my sleep is better now in that I go to bed at 11pm and sleep until maybe 10am, I had also been alot more active and able to do more things, even if they were painful and I did them only to pass rthe endless hours in the day...

 

however since this MEGA wave hit me on 1st April, and it was so vicious, so brutal and violent it left me reeling, I have gone downhill again and have spent the past week once again hiding in the bedroom crying and researching suicide, a sorry state indeed,

 

but what caused the wave? could it have been (as I said earlier) the reintroduction of the citalopram after missing a dose? could it have been missing the dose? or perhaps that it was 5 months to the day that I did a 50% drop? no one can know, of course it could have just been a natural wave that happens, but it nearly killed me, and continues to threaten my life.

 

I WISH I was off the drug and had these 10 months behind me, I may then begin to feel a little hope that another year or so and I could see improvements, but its not so, Im suicidally depressed, confused and feel like there is no way out for me.

[Angel7366]

Hi Iggy

 

I am fairly new here but also trying to sort out my own mess of CT, RI, adverse reaction and dropped dosage.

 

I've read your thread and it's really easy to slip into a negative attitude. I know, I have been there and now, going through really nasty withdrawals it's easy to lose hope. But you have to see the positives in this.

 

I can't comment on your taper as I am not experienced but I have read it can sometimes be difficult when you get really low and you have to go really slowly. I would love to be at the stage you are at. You are almost done with it. It is unlikely you will suffer long w/ds if you have tapered slowly. Also may that missed dose had something to do with the way you are feeling now.

 

You are nearly done. You will soon be able to enjoy your life

again. Soon you will be out of this nightmare. I think you are lucky!

 

I expect Alto or someone else will be along soon with expert advice.

 

But stay strong!

 

Angel

[Iggy131313]

thanks angel, thats so sweet of you. praying for you. xx

[Iggy131313]

Hi, I know I have been a pain here and got on everyones nerves, but please PPLEASE I need some advice about whwre to go from here