Moderator Onmyway Posted September 4, 2023 Moderator Share Posted September 4, 2023 Hi @Peter23 If you're this asymptomatic perhaps you should hold off on tapering for a while? Omw "Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. Aug 2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used) Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up) September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0 Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering) citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg, 7/27/19 -1.5 mg, 8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate Link to comment
Peter23 Posted September 6, 2023 Author Share Posted September 6, 2023 Just started a short course of Amoxicillin for a sinus infection. On day day 2 and experiencing insomnia, nightmares and panic. Could this antibiotic cause withdrawal to worsen? 2000-Venlafaxine 150 mg and Olanzapine 10 mg started 2012- Venlafaxine(tapered off) to Sertraline 150 mg until 2021, added mirtazapine 30 mg until 2019 2018-2023, Oct- Pregabalin, started 150 mg to 600 mg 2019- Diazepam started 6mg 2022- July-restart mirtazapine(unsuccessful) Oct- ECT X 12, Zopliclone 7.5 mg start- present 2023- January, olanzapine decreased to 7.5 mg, Lorazepam 1 mg X 2 weeks, Diazepam increased- 20 mg, some tapering to June-Diazepam 10 mg March- Agomelatine added-25 mg October 9th, 2023 present meds bolded Link to comment
Peter23 Posted September 17, 2023 Author Share Posted September 17, 2023 Due to see a new psychiatrist on Friday. Can you advise me on what my response should be if she wants to start reducing more than one drug at a time. I am currently reducing Agomelatine by 10% every 4 weeks. I'm terrified that she might want me to come off some of my other meds at the same time. Thanks. 2000-Venlafaxine 150 mg and Olanzapine 10 mg started 2012- Venlafaxine(tapered off) to Sertraline 150 mg until 2021, added mirtazapine 30 mg until 2019 2018-2023, Oct- Pregabalin, started 150 mg to 600 mg 2019- Diazepam started 6mg 2022- July-restart mirtazapine(unsuccessful) Oct- ECT X 12, Zopliclone 7.5 mg start- present 2023- January, olanzapine decreased to 7.5 mg, Lorazepam 1 mg X 2 weeks, Diazepam increased- 20 mg, some tapering to June-Diazepam 10 mg March- Agomelatine added-25 mg October 9th, 2023 present meds bolded Link to comment
Mezzer Posted September 17, 2023 Share Posted September 17, 2023 Hi Peter, I’m no expert but I can safely assume a moderator will tell you to drop one med at a time. 1993 started 20mg Prozac. 2008 switched to 10mg of lexapro. 2015 added 50mg of Wellbutrin. Between 2015 and 2020 raised and lowered dosage of both. 2021 moved to Zoloft for one month then back to lexapro for one month. Then switched to 60mg cymbalta for four months. Then Basically cold turkeyed off cymbalta in two weeks using Prozac as a crossover med to reduce withdrawals. Not good. Then had Nortriptylene added to Prozac. Was on 20mg Prozac and 50mg of Nortriptylene for four months. Then did a four month ween off Nortriptylene. To date have been off cymbalta for approximately 11 months and Nortriptylene 7 weeks. Presently taking 12.5 mg Prozac. Also taking 10 mg of bystolic for BLood Pressure. I’m not sure how the Prozac makes me feel. It does nothing to make me feel not sad and anxious at times. I finally figured out the meds are not what I need. What I need is to get off the 12.5mg of Prozac and continue to work on my stuff. Any help is deeply appreciated thank you. Reduced from 12.5 to 10 then from 10 to 7.5. Too much of a drop. Bought a scale and went to 9. Stabilized and went to 8.2 oct 1, 2022. Just got hit with wicked low mood, high anxiety, fatigue, chills. The anxiety is high in the AM and lessons throughout the day. Hoping to stabilize soon Link to comment
Moderator Onmyway Posted September 17, 2023 Moderator Share Posted September 17, 2023 Hi @Peter23 what drugs are you on now? I only see agomelatine and zopiclone in your signature. #OMW "Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. Aug 2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used) Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up) September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0 Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering) citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg, 7/27/19 -1.5 mg, 8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate Link to comment
Peter23 Posted September 18, 2023 Author Share Posted September 18, 2023 I'm on Pregabalin 600mg as I was misdiagnosed with Generalised Anxiety Disorder and Olanzapine 7.5mg as I was misdiagnosed with Bipolar disorder due to Venlafaxine induced hypomania. I have been on both of these for several years. I am also on Diazepam 10mg daily for anxiety and have been prescribed it on a weekly prescription for several years. I have written a short statement for the psychiatrist explaining that I have now concluded that I am suffering from protracted antidepressant withdrawal and that I want to come off the Agomelatine by reducing the dose by 10% every 4 weeks as it is making my anxiety much worse and isn't helping my depression. I have also stated that I would like to come off the other medications I am taking one at a time by tapering them gradually. Just worried that I won't receive validation from her about the protracted antidepressant withdrawal. 2000-Venlafaxine 150 mg and Olanzapine 10 mg started 2012- Venlafaxine(tapered off) to Sertraline 150 mg until 2021, added mirtazapine 30 mg until 2019 2018-2023, Oct- Pregabalin, started 150 mg to 600 mg 2019- Diazepam started 6mg 2022- July-restart mirtazapine(unsuccessful) Oct- ECT X 12, Zopliclone 7.5 mg start- present 2023- January, olanzapine decreased to 7.5 mg, Lorazepam 1 mg X 2 weeks, Diazepam increased- 20 mg, some tapering to June-Diazepam 10 mg March- Agomelatine added-25 mg October 9th, 2023 present meds bolded Link to comment
Peter23 Posted September 22, 2023 Author Share Posted September 22, 2023 Saw my new psychiatrist this morning. Told her that I have protracted and withdrawal and that I am tapering the Agomelatine by 10% every 4 weeks by using a milligram scale to reducing the weight of of the tablet. Said she didn't think that was a good way to come off the drug. She thought that this method would give me different doses every night as the drug is not evenly distributed throughout the tablet. She suggested missing a full dose one night every week!!!??? I tried to explain that I experienced terrible withdrawals when I missed a dose. She proceeded to start talking about treatment resistant depression despite the fact that I had already explained that I was suffering from protracted antidepressant withdrawal. She also thought that I should try increasing the dose of Agomelatine up to 50mg!!! She is giving me a few weeks to decide what I want to do. I have already decided to continue tapering the Agomelatine by 10% every 4 weeks. Can someone advise me about my method of reducing the dose by using a nail file to take off 10% of the weight of each tablet? Just concerned that I might be getting a different dose each night. Unfortunately Agomelatine is insoluble in water so can't use a liquid method to taper more accurately. 2000-Venlafaxine 150 mg and Olanzapine 10 mg started 2012- Venlafaxine(tapered off) to Sertraline 150 mg until 2021, added mirtazapine 30 mg until 2019 2018-2023, Oct- Pregabalin, started 150 mg to 600 mg 2019- Diazepam started 6mg 2022- July-restart mirtazapine(unsuccessful) Oct- ECT X 12, Zopliclone 7.5 mg start- present 2023- January, olanzapine decreased to 7.5 mg, Lorazepam 1 mg X 2 weeks, Diazepam increased- 20 mg, some tapering to June-Diazepam 10 mg March- Agomelatine added-25 mg October 9th, 2023 present meds bolded Link to comment
Moderator Onmyway Posted September 22, 2023 Moderator Share Posted September 22, 2023 Hi @Peter23 pls update your drug signature using the instructions below. We only need doses, not the narrative - this should be easy to read at a glance. Pls include current dosage with dates when you lowered. You can see my drug signature. We don't need the symptoms. Do list the ECT as well. We can't give you advice without a clear picture of what drugs you are taking. OMW "Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. Aug 2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used) Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up) September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0 Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering) citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg, 7/27/19 -1.5 mg, 8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate Link to comment
Moderator Onmyway Posted September 22, 2023 Moderator Share Posted September 22, 2023 10 hours ago, Peter23 said: Can someone advise me about my method of reducing the dose by using a nail file to take off 10% of the weight of each tablet? Just concerned that I might be getting a different dose each night. Unfortunately Agomelatine is insoluble in water so can't use a liquid method to taper more accurately. This may help: "Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. Aug 2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used) Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up) September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0 Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering) citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg, 7/27/19 -1.5 mg, 8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate Link to comment
Peter23 Posted September 23, 2023 Author Share Posted September 23, 2023 Edited my drug history as requested but it failed to save it. 2000-Venlafaxine 150 mg and Olanzapine 10 mg started 2012- Venlafaxine(tapered off) to Sertraline 150 mg until 2021, added mirtazapine 30 mg until 2019 2018-2023, Oct- Pregabalin, started 150 mg to 600 mg 2019- Diazepam started 6mg 2022- July-restart mirtazapine(unsuccessful) Oct- ECT X 12, Zopliclone 7.5 mg start- present 2023- January, olanzapine decreased to 7.5 mg, Lorazepam 1 mg X 2 weeks, Diazepam increased- 20 mg, some tapering to June-Diazepam 10 mg March- Agomelatine added-25 mg October 9th, 2023 present meds bolded Link to comment
Moderator Onmyway Posted September 23, 2023 Moderator Share Posted September 23, 2023 Hi @Peter23, can you post it in the right format in a post and I will try to edit/reorganize it. I hate to be a stickler for this but we do need the clear info at a glance because there are many people here and we won't be going reading back 100 posts and something gets lost and when we need to give you advice some weeks or months down the road we may make a mistake/give you the wrong advice because we didn't have the full information. How are you doing now? Will your doctor prescribe the agomelatine if you don't follow her guidelines to quit quickly. If that is the case, some members tell the doc that they have decided not to taper so that they can get their medicine and continue tapering in private. A better option is always to have the doctor on your side but we don't get to choose, do we? Do you have an option to get a different doctor? OMW "Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. Aug 2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used) Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up) September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0 Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering) citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg, 7/27/19 -1.5 mg, 8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate Link to comment
Peter23 Posted September 24, 2023 Author Share Posted September 24, 2023 Thanks for your message and advice about tapering the Agomelatine. I'm still struggling with anxiety and severe depression/lethargy. Think I will tell the psychiatrist that I just want to stay on 25mg Agomelatine and taper the dose in private as you suggested. She has suggested increasing the dose up to 50mg as she seems to think I have treatment resistant depression despite telling her I have protracted antidepressant withdrawal. She has offered this as an option which I will decline when I see her in two weeks time. Do you need my full drug history going back to 2000 or just over past two years? 2000-Venlafaxine 150 mg and Olanzapine 10 mg started 2012- Venlafaxine(tapered off) to Sertraline 150 mg until 2021, added mirtazapine 30 mg until 2019 2018-2023, Oct- Pregabalin, started 150 mg to 600 mg 2019- Diazepam started 6mg 2022- July-restart mirtazapine(unsuccessful) Oct- ECT X 12, Zopliclone 7.5 mg start- present 2023- January, olanzapine decreased to 7.5 mg, Lorazepam 1 mg X 2 weeks, Diazepam increased- 20 mg, some tapering to June-Diazepam 10 mg March- Agomelatine added-25 mg October 9th, 2023 present meds bolded Link to comment
Moderator Onmyway Posted September 24, 2023 Moderator Share Posted September 24, 2023 Hi @Peter23 a detailed history for the last 2 years but more broadly for the periods before that. Your psychiatrist works with old models of understanding this. You can give her the Royal College Of Psychiatrists guideline on withdrawal https://www.rcpsych.ac.uk/mental-health/treatments-and-wellbeing/stopping-antidepressants Withdrawal effects are often confused with relapse and start a merry-go-round of trials of new ADs which due to hypersensitivity and kindling make things worse and patients get labeled with treatment resistant depression and offered barbaric treatments like ECT. Have a look at this article about the usefulness of ADs. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4172306/ OMW "Nothing so small as a moment is insurmountable, and moments are all that we have. You have survived every trial and tribulation that life has thrown at you up until this very instant. When future troubles come—and they will come—a version of you will be born into that moment that can conquer them, too." - Kevin Koenig I am not a doctor and this should not be considered medical advice. You can use the information and recommendations provided in whatever way you want and all decisions on your treatment are yours. In the next few weeks I do not have a lot of capacity to respond to questions. If you need a quick answer pls tag or ask other moderators who may want to be tagged. Aug 2000 - July 2003 (ct, 4-6 wk wd) , citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn, wellbutrin for a few months, trazodone prn Dec 2004 - July 2018 citalopram 20 mg, xanax prn (rarely used) Aug 2018 - citalopram 40 mg (self titrated up) September 2018 - January 2019 tapered citalopram - 40/30/20/10/5 no issues until a week after reaching 0 Feb 2019 0.25 xanax - 0.5/day (3 weeks) over to klonopin 0.25 once a day to manage severe wd March 6, reinstated citalopram 2.5 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 mg for sleep 2-3 times a week Apr 1st citalopram 2.0 mg (liquid), klonopin 0.25 once a week (off by 4/14/19- no tapering) citalopram (liquid) 4/14/19 -1.8 mg, 5/8/19 - 1.6 mg, 7/27/19 -1.5 mg, 8/15/19 - 1.35, 2/21/21 - 1.1 (smaller drops in between), 6/20/21 - 1.03 mg, 8/7/21- 1.025, 8/11/21 - 1.02, 8/15/21 - 1.015, 9/3/21 - 0.925 (fingers crossed!), 10/8/21 - 0.9, 10/18/21 - 0.875, 12/31/21 - 0.85, 1/7/22 - 0.825, 1/14/22 - 0.8, 1/22/22 - 0.785, 8/18/22 - 0.59, 12/15/2022 - 0.48, 2/15/22 - 0.43, 25/07/23 - 0.25 (mistake), 6/08/23 - 0.33mg Supplements: magnesium citrate and bi-glycinate Link to comment
Peter23 Posted September 25, 2023 Author Share Posted September 25, 2023 2000 Venlafaxine 150mg. 2003 Olanzapine 10mg. 2005-2012 Numerous attempts to taper Venlafaxine. 2012 Crossed over to Sertraline 150mg 2012 Tapered off Venlafaxine. 2015 Sertraline stopped working 2015 Started Mirtazapine 30mg. 2015-2018 On both Sertraline and Mirtazapine. 2018 Both Sertraline and Mirtazapine stopped working. 2018 Started Pregabalin 150mg 2018-2019 Pregabalin dose gradually increased to 600mg-Present. 2019 Sarted Diazepam 6mg 2018-2019 Gradual Taper off Mirtazapine. 2019-Feb 2021 Tapered off Sertraline using liquid formulation by 10% / month. July 2022 Unsuccessful reinstatement of Mirtazapine Oct 2022 Hospitalised for 12 treatments of ECT. Oct 2022 Started Zopiclone 7.5mg.-Present. Jan 2023 Olanzapine dose reduced to 7.5mg- Present Jan 2023 Started Lorazepam 1mg as required for 2 weeks. Jan Diazepam increased to 20mg. Feb-March 2023 Diazepam dose tapered to 15mg. March 2023 Started Agomelatine 25mg. April-June Diazepam reduced to 10mg- Present. August 2023 Agomelatine dose reduced by 10% for 4weeks. September 2023 Agomelatine dose reduction paused for 2 weeks due to withdrawals. Present medication: Agomelatine 25mg. Olanzapine 7.5mg. Diazepam 10mg. Zopiclone 7.5mg Pregabalin 600mg 2000-Venlafaxine 150 mg and Olanzapine 10 mg started 2012- Venlafaxine(tapered off) to Sertraline 150 mg until 2021, added mirtazapine 30 mg until 2019 2018-2023, Oct- Pregabalin, started 150 mg to 600 mg 2019- Diazepam started 6mg 2022- July-restart mirtazapine(unsuccessful) Oct- ECT X 12, Zopliclone 7.5 mg start- present 2023- January, olanzapine decreased to 7.5 mg, Lorazepam 1 mg X 2 weeks, Diazepam increased- 20 mg, some tapering to June-Diazepam 10 mg March- Agomelatine added-25 mg October 9th, 2023 present meds bolded Link to comment
Peter23 Posted September 25, 2023 Author Share Posted September 25, 2023 Hope my previous post is helpful. I have done my best to remember dates. My memory has been adversely affected by the 12 treatments of ECT last year. Thank you so much for your help and advice. It's much appreciated. 2000-Venlafaxine 150 mg and Olanzapine 10 mg started 2012- Venlafaxine(tapered off) to Sertraline 150 mg until 2021, added mirtazapine 30 mg until 2019 2018-2023, Oct- Pregabalin, started 150 mg to 600 mg 2019- Diazepam started 6mg 2022- July-restart mirtazapine(unsuccessful) Oct- ECT X 12, Zopliclone 7.5 mg start- present 2023- January, olanzapine decreased to 7.5 mg, Lorazepam 1 mg X 2 weeks, Diazepam increased- 20 mg, some tapering to June-Diazepam 10 mg March- Agomelatine added-25 mg October 9th, 2023 present meds bolded Link to comment
Peter23 Posted September 30, 2023 Author Share Posted September 30, 2023 Sorry forgot to add 12 ECT treatments in September-October 2022. 2000-Venlafaxine 150 mg and Olanzapine 10 mg started 2012- Venlafaxine(tapered off) to Sertraline 150 mg until 2021, added mirtazapine 30 mg until 2019 2018-2023, Oct- Pregabalin, started 150 mg to 600 mg 2019- Diazepam started 6mg 2022- July-restart mirtazapine(unsuccessful) Oct- ECT X 12, Zopliclone 7.5 mg start- present 2023- January, olanzapine decreased to 7.5 mg, Lorazepam 1 mg X 2 weeks, Diazepam increased- 20 mg, some tapering to June-Diazepam 10 mg March- Agomelatine added-25 mg October 9th, 2023 present meds bolded Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus manymoretodays Posted October 5, 2023 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted October 5, 2023 (edited) Hey there Peter23, @Peter23 Welcome and wow.......this is dizzy- ing and I wonder if you've been chasing some bad WD(withdrawals) for years with more medications and even ECT I wanted to attempt to help clarify or make your signature clearer and this is what I came up with: 2000-Venlafaxine 150 mg and Olanzapine 10 mg started 2012- Venlafaxine(tapered off) to Sertraline 150 mg until 2021, added mirtazapine 30 mg until 2019 2018-2023, Oct- Pregabalin, started 150 mg to 600 mg 2019- Diazepam started 6mg 2022- July-restart mirtazapine(unsuccessful) Oct- ECT X 12, Zopliclone 7.5 mg start- present 2023- January, olanzapine decreased to 7.5 mg, Lorazepam 1 mg X 2 weeks, Diazepam increased- 20 mg, some tapering to June-Diazepam 10 mg March- Agomelatine added-25 mg I bolded the present meds. And I can copy your present signature here now too. You have a great memory of 23 years of medications/drugs. I'm impressed. There is some history in your present signature too, and so I don't know if that is in your narratives or not. Usually history and symptoms do go in narratives. Started Effexor in June 2000 due to severe depression and anxiety. Became hypomanic and was prescribed Olanzapine 10 mg. On and off Olanzapine several times. Tried numerous times to come off Effexor by very gradual dose reduction but experienced severe withdrawals each time. Started cross over to Sertraline 150mg I think around 2014. Experienced Sertraline poop out around 2017 and was put on Mirtazapine 30mg. Sudden onset of severe anxiety and depression March 2018 while still on Sertraline and Mirtazapine. Diagnosed as having Generalised Anxiety Disorder and put on Pregabalin 200mg three times daily. Still on Pregabalin 600mg Tapered off Mirtazapine without any significant withdrawals. Then tapered off Sertraline gradually by 10% reductions every week with no significant withdrawals in 2021 .Started Lithium but could 'not tolerate and no improvement in symptoms 2021. Trial with Trazodone for very short time and symptoms worsened. On diazepam at low dose continually for about 4years on a weekly prescription. Admitted to hospital in October 2022 for course of ECT with no response. Readmitted to hospital January 2023. Currently on Agomelatine a non SSRI antidepressant with no significant response. Also on Zopiclone since first admission to hospital in October 2022. Continue to experience severe anxiety and depression. Edited October 5, 2023 by manymoretodays copy present signature, notification Late 2023- gone to emeritus status, inactive, don't @ me, I can check who I've posted on, and I'm not really here like I used to be......thanks. Started with psycho meds/psychiatric care circa 1988. In retrospect, and on contemplation, situational overwhelm. Rounding up to 30 years of medications(30 medication trials, poly-pharmacy maximum was 3 at one time). 5/28/2015-off Adderal salts 2.5mg. (I had been on that since hospital 10/2014) 12/2015---just holding, holding, holding, with trileptal/oxcarb at 75 mg. 1/2 tab at hs. My last psycho med ever! Tapered @ 10% every 4 weeks, sometimes 2 weeks to 2016 Dec 16, medication free!! Longer signature post here, with current supplements. Herb and alcohol free since 5/15/2016. And.....I quit smoking 11/2021. Lapsed. Redo of quit smoking 9/28/2022. Can you say Hallelujah?(took me long enough)💜 None of my posts are intended as medical advice. Please discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical provider. My success story: Blue skies ahead, clear sailing Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus manymoretodays Posted October 5, 2023 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted October 5, 2023 So, if my signature version is correct and works for you........go ahead and add it in to replace your old one. Easy access for: edits/updates-AccountSettings/signature Consider yourself in the learning phase now and we are getting to know you as well phase. I'd like you to go to: Drug Interaction Checker-Drugs.com And plug in all of your 5 current medications, and then link us to the results or copy and paste in a reply for us. Let me know how that goes and what you think as well. Drugs.com is a good resource always for looking up medications singularly and checking interactions too. I don't think most of us are getting the kind of full disclosures we should be before starting medications/drugs. Okay, all from me, for now. Ohh, I feel for you and it sounds like it has been pretty tough ever since the first WD's......if only...... Yet, you sound pretty good overall. Do share current symptoms that you are having too. Love, peace, healing, and growth, manymoretodays(mmt) Late 2023- gone to emeritus status, inactive, don't @ me, I can check who I've posted on, and I'm not really here like I used to be......thanks. Started with psycho meds/psychiatric care circa 1988. In retrospect, and on contemplation, situational overwhelm. Rounding up to 30 years of medications(30 medication trials, poly-pharmacy maximum was 3 at one time). 5/28/2015-off Adderal salts 2.5mg. (I had been on that since hospital 10/2014) 12/2015---just holding, holding, holding, with trileptal/oxcarb at 75 mg. 1/2 tab at hs. My last psycho med ever! Tapered @ 10% every 4 weeks, sometimes 2 weeks to 2016 Dec 16, medication free!! Longer signature post here, with current supplements. Herb and alcohol free since 5/15/2016. And.....I quit smoking 11/2021. Lapsed. Redo of quit smoking 9/28/2022. Can you say Hallelujah?(took me long enough)💜 None of my posts are intended as medical advice. Please discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical provider. My success story: Blue skies ahead, clear sailing Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus manymoretodays Posted October 5, 2023 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted October 5, 2023 We don't recommend skipping doses. The rule of 3KIS: Keep it simple, slow, and stable Nor do we recommend tapering more than one drug at a time. Sometimes, once a member has a good knowledge of their drugs though......alternating tapers can be done. Tapering multiple psych drugs? Which drug to taper first? More for you to look at. And look forward to your next update. Late 2023- gone to emeritus status, inactive, don't @ me, I can check who I've posted on, and I'm not really here like I used to be......thanks. Started with psycho meds/psychiatric care circa 1988. In retrospect, and on contemplation, situational overwhelm. Rounding up to 30 years of medications(30 medication trials, poly-pharmacy maximum was 3 at one time). 5/28/2015-off Adderal salts 2.5mg. (I had been on that since hospital 10/2014) 12/2015---just holding, holding, holding, with trileptal/oxcarb at 75 mg. 1/2 tab at hs. My last psycho med ever! Tapered @ 10% every 4 weeks, sometimes 2 weeks to 2016 Dec 16, medication free!! Longer signature post here, with current supplements. Herb and alcohol free since 5/15/2016. And.....I quit smoking 11/2021. Lapsed. Redo of quit smoking 9/28/2022. Can you say Hallelujah?(took me long enough)💜 None of my posts are intended as medical advice. Please discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical provider. My success story: Blue skies ahead, clear sailing Link to comment
Administrator Altostrata Posted October 6, 2023 Administrator Share Posted October 6, 2023 Hello, Peter. You first joined this site in January 2021. Since then, you have had these drug changes 2019-Feb 2021 Tapered off Sertraline using liquid formulation by 10% / month. July 2022 Unsuccessful reinstatement of Mirtazapine Oct 2022 Hospitalised for 12 treatments of ECT. Oct 2022 Started Zopiclone 7.5mg.-Present. Jan 2023 Olanzapine dose reduced to 7.5mg- Present Jan 2023 Started Lorazepam 1mg as required for 2 weeks. Jan Diazepam increased to 20mg. Feb-March 2023 Diazepam dose tapered to 15mg. March 2023 Started Agomelatine 25mg. April-June Diazepam reduced to 10mg- Present. August 2023 Agomelatine dose reduced by 10% for 4weeks. September 2023 Agomelatine dose reduction paused for 2 weeks due to withdrawals. Present medication: Agomelatine 25mg. Olanzapine 7.5mg. Diazepam 10mg. Zopiclone 7.5mg Pregabalin 600mg Were all these treatments prescribed for "treatment-resistant depression"? On 9/5/2023 at 6:30 PM, Peter23 said: Just started a short course of Amoxicillin for a sinus infection. On day day 2 and experiencing insomnia, nightmares and panic. Could this antibiotic cause withdrawal to worsen? Antibiotics can cause odd symptoms, especially in nervous system vulnerable from withdrawal. Are you past the adverse effects of the antibiotic? What drug changes have you made in the last month? Please do not make any more changes until we identify your baseline symptom pattern. What times o'clock do you take your drugs, with their dosages? This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment
Peter23 Posted October 9, 2023 Author Share Posted October 9, 2023 Thank you ManyMoreTodays for clarifying my drug signature. I would be grateful if you could copy your version to replace my old version as I am not sure how to navigate the site to edit my signature. The reason I have ended up on so many meds is as follows. I was prescribed Venlafaxine 150mg (Effexor) in 2000 following the breakdown of my marriage of 16 years. I developed hypomania within a month of starting it.My psychiatrist reduced the dose to 75mg and I suffered what I now know to be withdrawal symptoms. The dose was subsequently increased back up to 150mg and Olanzapine 10mg was prescribed as a mood stabilizer due to the hypomania. After several years on Venlafaxine I attempted to gradually reduce it but found the withdrawal symptoms too severe. Eventually my psychiatrist crossed me over to Sertraline 150mg and I came off the Venlafaxine. I was stable on Sertraline for several years until it "pooped out". I was then prescribed Mirtazapine 30mg but wasn't advised to taper off the Sertraline. Therefore I ended up on both drugs for several more years. I think psychiatrist like to call this " augmentation ". All was well in my life until March 2018 when the Mirtazapine "pooped out" and I started to experience severe anxiety and depression, much worse than my original anxiety and depression before starting antidepressants. Because my main symptom was severe anxiety my psychiatrist diagnosed me as having Generalised Anxiety Disorder and prescribed Pregabalin 150mg. As my anxiety wasn't responding the dose was rapidly increased to 600mg daily. Around the same time I was prescribed Diazepam 6mg on a weekly prescription. I gradually reduced and came off Mirtazapine after reading about Tardive dysphoria which frightened me as it was stated in a few articles that coming off antidepressants may reverse it. I then tapered off Sertraline using the liquid formulation by 10% every 4 weeks. My last dose of Sertraline was in February 2021. I didn't really experience any physical withdrawals at this stage. However my mental state deteriorated rapidly. My psychiatrist obviously thought I was severely ill and prescribed 12 treatments of ECT as an inpatient in a psychiatric ward in October 2022. On admission to the ward I was prescribed zopiclone 7.5mg for sleep. I was in the ward for about 6 weeks. I failed to respond to the ECT and was discharged home. My anxiety and depression became very acute again in January 2023 and I was readmitted to the same psychiatric ward for what my psychiatrist called a drug holiday. Meaning she wanted to take me off some of the medications that weren't working, namely Olanzapine:Pregabalin and Diazepam. However on admission I asked for something for my severe anxiety and was prescribed Lorazepam 1mg 4 times daily as required. After about two weeks the Lorazepam dose (4mg daily) had to be converted to 20mg of Diazepam. The dose of Diazepam was gradually reduced to 15mg and I was prescribed Agomelatine 25mg at night. My anxiety was noticeable much worse in the morning after starting Agomelatine and my psychiatrist suggested remaining on 15mg of Diazepam on discharge from hospital. After discharge from hospital my primary physician gradually reduced the Diazepam dose to 10mg. I have attempted to reduce the dose of Agomelatine by 10% of the weight of a 25mg tablet every 4 weeks but had to stop temporarily due to withdrawals. At the moment I continue to experience very severe anxiety and depression. I am now seeing a difference psychiatrist and have tried to explain to her that I am suffering from protracted antidepressant withdrawal but she keeps talking about treatment resistant depression. She wants to increase my dose of Agomelatine to 50mg which I don't want to do as it is making my anxiety much worse and isn't helping my depression. In short I am in much worse shape since all the treatments I received in hospital. 2000-Venlafaxine 150 mg and Olanzapine 10 mg started 2012- Venlafaxine(tapered off) to Sertraline 150 mg until 2021, added mirtazapine 30 mg until 2019 2018-2023, Oct- Pregabalin, started 150 mg to 600 mg 2019- Diazepam started 6mg 2022- July-restart mirtazapine(unsuccessful) Oct- ECT X 12, Zopliclone 7.5 mg start- present 2023- January, olanzapine decreased to 7.5 mg, Lorazepam 1 mg X 2 weeks, Diazepam increased- 20 mg, some tapering to June-Diazepam 10 mg March- Agomelatine added-25 mg October 9th, 2023 present meds bolded Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus manymoretodays Posted October 10, 2023 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted October 10, 2023 Hi Peter23, New signature in place. On 10/6/2023 at 4:17 PM, Altostrata said: Antibiotics can cause odd symptoms, especially in nervous system vulnerable from withdrawal. Are you past the adverse effects of the antibiotic? What drug changes have you made in the last month? Please do not make any more changes until we identify your baseline symptom pattern. What times o'clock do you take your drugs, with their dosages? See if you can attend to the ?'s above. Me, I'd avoid any further drug changes with your shrink now. That's what they always say.........oof, "treatment resistant depression". Meantime you are worse since your hospitalization you said.......Gad's, brings back memories. Just knowing......sometimes helps.......that this is not the real you, and the real you does still exist. I think so many of your symptoms now are due to so many drug changes and you're recovering from that ECT too. How are you situated with supports outside of the system? Friends, family, any others who have not benefited from psychiatric "best practices" in your network? Support will be helpful. Check out some of the success stories here, or personal blogs at MadInAmerica.......so many have found healing and good lives after psychiatry. Ask for help when you need it. Find people who won't panic, and understand that many of your current problems may have stemmed from overzealous drugging and other. It will get better. Stick with positive people too, as much as possible. Do what you need to do to get through the day. I used to color mandalas and had other great coloring books......you can find them online or in bookstores. I still do color with my colored pencils, and do many of the things I did in acute distress.......and carry things with me to do if finding myself having to wait somewhere or something. Watch shows that bring you joy or help you cry even. Above all, hang on. What's going on now is likely not at all like what you once sought help for. Get to those questions Alto asked. And we will likely have more.......so we can get a good feel for how we can help get your drugs best minimized, with a long range goal of drug freedom. In the most harm reduction way possible. Best, L, P, H, and G, mmt 1 Late 2023- gone to emeritus status, inactive, don't @ me, I can check who I've posted on, and I'm not really here like I used to be......thanks. Started with psycho meds/psychiatric care circa 1988. In retrospect, and on contemplation, situational overwhelm. Rounding up to 30 years of medications(30 medication trials, poly-pharmacy maximum was 3 at one time). 5/28/2015-off Adderal salts 2.5mg. (I had been on that since hospital 10/2014) 12/2015---just holding, holding, holding, with trileptal/oxcarb at 75 mg. 1/2 tab at hs. My last psycho med ever! Tapered @ 10% every 4 weeks, sometimes 2 weeks to 2016 Dec 16, medication free!! Longer signature post here, with current supplements. Herb and alcohol free since 5/15/2016. And.....I quit smoking 11/2021. Lapsed. Redo of quit smoking 9/28/2022. Can you say Hallelujah?(took me long enough)💜 None of my posts are intended as medical advice. Please discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical provider. My success story: Blue skies ahead, clear sailing Link to comment
Peter23 Posted October 10, 2023 Author Share Posted October 10, 2023 Thanks Altostra for summarising my drug history and for your answer to my question about sensitivity to antibiotics. I never had any problem with antibiotics prior to being in protracted antidepressant withdrawal. Unfortunately I initially thought I was suffering from "Tardive dysphoria ". It was not until recently that I became aware of protracted SSRI withdrawal. As previously stated my psychiatrist misdiagnosed me on several occasions and prescribed inappropriate medications. My admissions to a psychiatric ward have made things much worse for me. Here is the list of when I approximately take my medication:- 9:00am Pregabalin 200mgs and 6mgs Diazepam ( My anxiety is very acute first thing in the morning ). 15::00 Pregabalin 200mg. 16:00 Diazepam 4mgs. 21:00 Pregabalin 200mgs 12:00 Olanzapine 7.5mgs: Zopiclone 7.5mgs: Agomelatine 25mg . I noticed while I was in hospital that my anxiety was worse in the morning. Unfortunately I didn't relate this to the Agomelatine until I was discharged back home and my diazepam dose was reduced from 20mg to 10mg. Was seen by a new psychiatrist this morning. She discussed various options to start me on other medications such as Fluoxetine and Respiridone. She even suggested hospitalization. I informed her again that I am suffering from protracted antidepressant withdrawal. She still insisted that I might be suffering from" treatment resistant depression". I managed to convince her that I wanted to remain on my current medication regimen. We also discussed possible psychological approaches to my treatment going forward. I have a Community Psychiatric Nurse and a very supportive partner. I also discussed starting to taper off my medication one drug at a time starting with the Agomelatine once I have given my nervous system a chance to stabilise after the ECT and medication changes in hospital. I have had several external stressors recently which I have found to be very challenging. 2000-Venlafaxine 150 mg and Olanzapine 10 mg started 2012- Venlafaxine(tapered off) to Sertraline 150 mg until 2021, added mirtazapine 30 mg until 2019 2018-2023, Oct- Pregabalin, started 150 mg to 600 mg 2019- Diazepam started 6mg 2022- July-restart mirtazapine(unsuccessful) Oct- ECT X 12, Zopliclone 7.5 mg start- present 2023- January, olanzapine decreased to 7.5 mg, Lorazepam 1 mg X 2 weeks, Diazepam increased- 20 mg, some tapering to June-Diazepam 10 mg March- Agomelatine added-25 mg October 9th, 2023 present meds bolded Link to comment
Peter23 Posted October 11, 2023 Author Share Posted October 11, 2023 Hi Altostra was wondering if it might be worth trying to reinstate a very small dose of Sertraline? My symptoms are very debilitating at the moment. My last dose of Sertraline was in February 2021. 2000-Venlafaxine 150 mg and Olanzapine 10 mg started 2012- Venlafaxine(tapered off) to Sertraline 150 mg until 2021, added mirtazapine 30 mg until 2019 2018-2023, Oct- Pregabalin, started 150 mg to 600 mg 2019- Diazepam started 6mg 2022- July-restart mirtazapine(unsuccessful) Oct- ECT X 12, Zopliclone 7.5 mg start- present 2023- January, olanzapine decreased to 7.5 mg, Lorazepam 1 mg X 2 weeks, Diazepam increased- 20 mg, some tapering to June-Diazepam 10 mg March- Agomelatine added-25 mg October 9th, 2023 present meds bolded Link to comment
Peter23 Posted October 12, 2023 Author Share Posted October 12, 2023 I am currently almost completely debilitated by my withdrawal symptoms. Don't know how I'm going to cope. Finding it very difficult to get washed and dressed and to eat. 2000-Venlafaxine 150 mg and Olanzapine 10 mg started 2012- Venlafaxine(tapered off) to Sertraline 150 mg until 2021, added mirtazapine 30 mg until 2019 2018-2023, Oct- Pregabalin, started 150 mg to 600 mg 2019- Diazepam started 6mg 2022- July-restart mirtazapine(unsuccessful) Oct- ECT X 12, Zopliclone 7.5 mg start- present 2023- January, olanzapine decreased to 7.5 mg, Lorazepam 1 mg X 2 weeks, Diazepam increased- 20 mg, some tapering to June-Diazepam 10 mg March- Agomelatine added-25 mg October 9th, 2023 present meds bolded Link to comment
Moderator LotusRising Posted October 12, 2023 Moderator Share Posted October 12, 2023 Hi @Peter23, What WD symptoms are you finding particularly difficult at the moment? Sometimes coping is just getting through the next minute, the next hour, or the next day. What coping skills are you using? 1 2003-2009 on and off various SSRI's for short periods, Ativan prn 2010-2011 Ativan, up to 1.5mg/day - tapered off without issue 2013-2021 ativan 1-1.5mg 10-12x/month, daily starting Oct 21 to help with buspar WD 2016 - Effexor 75mg, short-term 2021 Mar -Jun Buspar ADR at high dose, tapered 3 months 2021 Aug Wellbutrin 150mg for 5 days (ADR), then MIrtazapine 7.5mg for 7 days (ADR) Oct 22/21 - Direct switch ativan to clonazepam (don't do this) Tapered clonaz Oct/21 - Apr/23 - 0mg! Supplements: omega-3, mag-glycinate "Believe that your tragedies, your losses, your sorrows, your hurt, happened for you, not to you. And I bless the thing that broke you down and cracked you open, because the world needs you open" - Rebecca Campbell *** Disclaimer: Please note, my suggestions/comments are based on my own personal experiences. Please consult a knowledgeable practitioner to discuss decisions regarding your medical care *** *** Please do not send me PM's *** Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus manymoretodays Posted October 13, 2023 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted October 13, 2023 On 10/10/2023 at 11:18 AM, Peter23 said: 9:00am Pregabalin 200mgs and 6mgs Diazepam ( My anxiety is very acute first thing in the morning ). 15::00 Pregabalin 200mg. 16:00 Diazepam 4mgs. 21:00 Pregabalin 200mgs 12:00 Olanzapine 7.5mgs: Zopiclone 7.5mgs: Agomelatine 25mg . Hi Peter23! This is almost a Note/daily drug and symptom log Do another. Date at the top. Times on the left. Drugs on the right, name, dose. Keep up the times even between the drugs, and note symptoms as they occur. Is that 12:00 an error? Did you mean 24:00, military time for 12 midnight? It may NOT be tardive dysphoria. Gads, that's a catchall term they use along with "drug resistant depression". It might be that you are over-medicated with damping down, or brake like drugs. A little hard to tell still with the information supplied. Keep going, give us more. 5 hours ago, Peter23 said: I am currently almost completely debilitated by my withdrawal symptoms. Don't know how I'm going to cope. Finding it very difficult to get washed and dressed and to eat. I hear you. Eat. Do what little you can for personal hygiene and a change of clothes now and again. Rest when needed. Your better days are coming.........don't lose site of that. What skills help? Coping? L, P, H, and G, mmt Late 2023- gone to emeritus status, inactive, don't @ me, I can check who I've posted on, and I'm not really here like I used to be......thanks. Started with psycho meds/psychiatric care circa 1988. In retrospect, and on contemplation, situational overwhelm. Rounding up to 30 years of medications(30 medication trials, poly-pharmacy maximum was 3 at one time). 5/28/2015-off Adderal salts 2.5mg. (I had been on that since hospital 10/2014) 12/2015---just holding, holding, holding, with trileptal/oxcarb at 75 mg. 1/2 tab at hs. My last psycho med ever! Tapered @ 10% every 4 weeks, sometimes 2 weeks to 2016 Dec 16, medication free!! Longer signature post here, with current supplements. Herb and alcohol free since 5/15/2016. And.....I quit smoking 11/2021. Lapsed. Redo of quit smoking 9/28/2022. Can you say Hallelujah?(took me long enough)💜 None of my posts are intended as medical advice. Please discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical provider. My success story: Blue skies ahead, clear sailing Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus manymoretodays Posted October 13, 2023 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted October 13, 2023 Hi again Peter23, Your drug interaction report: Drugs.com You will need to register or get an account there, at Drugs.com. They won't bother you with ads or emails. What do you think, after seeing that? Also it would not accept agomelatine, as it's not used in the U.S. It did go to a little more about it here Certainly we would recommend a harm reduction approach to any tapering of the agomelatine, as you've been on it long enough to incur physiologic dependency. Have you noted any improvement since the agomelatine? I'm sure it was given in an attempt to bring you up of the drug induced haze from your other drugs. We'd love to see a couple days of daily Notes/drug and symptom logs next. Here's a sample note: We may ask you to keep a daily symptom diary in this simple list format. Here's how to respond to our request for 24 hours of daily symptom notes: 6 AM woke with anxiety 8 am took 2.5 mg lexapro 10 am stomach is upset 10:30 am ate breakfast 11:35 am got a headache, lasted one hour 12:35 ate lunch 4 pm feel a bit better 5 pm took 2.5 mg lexapro 6 pm ate dinner 9:20 pm headache 10:00 pm took 50 mg Seroquel 10:30 pm feeling dizzy 10:30 pm fell asleep 2:30 am woke, took 3 mg Ambien 2:45 am fell asleep 4:30 am woke, but got back to sleep 6 AM woke with anxiety 8 am took 2.5 mg lexapro 10 am feel nauseous Do what you did with your drugs, but then add in additionally any symptoms before and after each drug is taken........in the format shown above. Meantime, hang on. This will help us help you, and a couple of days worth is what we'd like. I'm hoping you are beginning to commit to a better way for yourself, as well as beginning to see how many of your problems, have been caused by drug treatment and changes. It took me awhile to see, in my own case and history.........just what was happening. But, then it was clear completely why I kept getting worse. And I had to do much on my own as far as learning, and then taking charge of what I put into my body- in the way of meds/drugs. I rarely got my doctors approval......nor did I get any apologies for the sometimes over medication done. Just hoping that brings you hope and helps with committment to starting and then staying the course. Alrighty. You are reporting better, and staying engaged here. I hope you'll continue. Sending much hope for healing and a better day where you do feel more able. L, P, H, and G, mmt Late 2023- gone to emeritus status, inactive, don't @ me, I can check who I've posted on, and I'm not really here like I used to be......thanks. Started with psycho meds/psychiatric care circa 1988. In retrospect, and on contemplation, situational overwhelm. Rounding up to 30 years of medications(30 medication trials, poly-pharmacy maximum was 3 at one time). 5/28/2015-off Adderal salts 2.5mg. (I had been on that since hospital 10/2014) 12/2015---just holding, holding, holding, with trileptal/oxcarb at 75 mg. 1/2 tab at hs. My last psycho med ever! Tapered @ 10% every 4 weeks, sometimes 2 weeks to 2016 Dec 16, medication free!! Longer signature post here, with current supplements. Herb and alcohol free since 5/15/2016. And.....I quit smoking 11/2021. Lapsed. Redo of quit smoking 9/28/2022. Can you say Hallelujah?(took me long enough)💜 None of my posts are intended as medical advice. Please discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical provider. My success story: Blue skies ahead, clear sailing Link to comment
Peter23 Posted October 13, 2023 Author Share Posted October 13, 2023 Thanks manymoredays for your advice and suggestions. I will start from tomorrow to give you a timetable of my drugs and symptoms. I think that some of my anxiety is down to diazepam addiction. I seem to be experiencing rebound withdrawal symptoms from the diazepam. I have been taking it daily for several years and my psychiatrist acknowledged that I was probably addicted to it. I have read that longterm use of benzodiazepines can actually cause anxiety and sleep disorders. I have in the past contacted the Drug and Alcohol services to ask for support in coming off the diazepam, but they don't seem to deal with benzodiazepine addiction only hard drugs. I think that I really have to bit the bullet and ask my doctor to gradually reduce my diazepam dose perhaps using the liquid formulation. I would appreciate your advice about this issue. 2000-Venlafaxine 150 mg and Olanzapine 10 mg started 2012- Venlafaxine(tapered off) to Sertraline 150 mg until 2021, added mirtazapine 30 mg until 2019 2018-2023, Oct- Pregabalin, started 150 mg to 600 mg 2019- Diazepam started 6mg 2022- July-restart mirtazapine(unsuccessful) Oct- ECT X 12, Zopliclone 7.5 mg start- present 2023- January, olanzapine decreased to 7.5 mg, Lorazepam 1 mg X 2 weeks, Diazepam increased- 20 mg, some tapering to June-Diazepam 10 mg March- Agomelatine added-25 mg October 9th, 2023 present meds bolded Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus manymoretodays Posted October 14, 2023 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted October 14, 2023 (edited) On 10/13/2023 at 1:02 PM, Peter23 said: I have in the past contacted the Drug and Alcohol services to ask for support in coming off the diazepam, but they don't seem to deal with benzodiazepine addiction only hard drugs. I think that I really have to bit the bullet and ask my doctor to gradually reduce my diazepam dose perhaps using the liquid formulation. I would appreciate your advice about this issue. Let's get a look at the NOTES first. And then, we do have a couple moderators, who can help with the benzo dependency and diazepam questions. I'll @LotusRising, who has been here already. Then there is Frogie, Alto, and Shep. So you are in good hands. Edited October 14, 2023 by manymoretodays grammar Late 2023- gone to emeritus status, inactive, don't @ me, I can check who I've posted on, and I'm not really here like I used to be......thanks. Started with psycho meds/psychiatric care circa 1988. In retrospect, and on contemplation, situational overwhelm. Rounding up to 30 years of medications(30 medication trials, poly-pharmacy maximum was 3 at one time). 5/28/2015-off Adderal salts 2.5mg. (I had been on that since hospital 10/2014) 12/2015---just holding, holding, holding, with trileptal/oxcarb at 75 mg. 1/2 tab at hs. My last psycho med ever! Tapered @ 10% every 4 weeks, sometimes 2 weeks to 2016 Dec 16, medication free!! Longer signature post here, with current supplements. Herb and alcohol free since 5/15/2016. And.....I quit smoking 11/2021. Lapsed. Redo of quit smoking 9/28/2022. Can you say Hallelujah?(took me long enough)💜 None of my posts are intended as medical advice. Please discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical provider. My success story: Blue skies ahead, clear sailing Link to comment
Peter23 Posted October 14, 2023 Author Share Posted October 14, 2023 (edited) 09:00am woke with severe anxiety, obsessional thoughts,tinnitus, abdominal pain and nausea. 9:00am did some deep breathing exercises 9:10am anxiety reduced slightly 9:30am can't face eating breakfast due to anxiety; abdominal pain and nausea. 10:00 am took diazepam 6mg and Pregabalin 200mg. 10:30am anxiety reduced further; but still have nausea and abdominal pain. 11:00am Had a cup of decaf coffee. 11:30am Anxiety a little bit less evident but have general feeling of dysphoria and lethargy. Still have abdominal pain and nausea. Can't face eating yet. 11:45am Managed to eat breakfast. 12:00pm Struggling to get washed and dressed. 13:20pm Washed and dressed. Continue to experience dysphoria. Anxiety and obsessive thoughts a little bit more manageable. Everything I need to do seems like an impossible task though pushing myself to do them. Abdominal pain and nausea have resolved. Still have bad tinnitus. 2:00pm Out for coffee and some shopping with a friend and my partner and . Feeling anxious and dysphoric. Depersonalistion and derealisation. 4:00pm Diazepam 4mg and Pregabalin 200mg. 4:30 pm Feeling a little bit less anxious but still obsessive thoughts. 5:00pm Continued anxious obsessive thoughts. 6:00pm Had dinner. 7:00pm Did some relaxation with very limited effect on anxiety and obsessive thoughts. 8:00pm Watching TV. Concentration poor. Continued anxious obsessive thoughts. 10:00pm Took Pregabalin 200mgs. 10:30pm Little effect from Pregabalin on anxiety and obsessive thoughts. 11:50pm Took Zopiclone 7.5mg and Olanzapine 7.5mg. Agomelatine 25 mg 12:15am In Bed. Edited October 17, 2023 by manymoretodays bolded drugs, added Agomelatine from post below this 2000-Venlafaxine 150 mg and Olanzapine 10 mg started 2012- Venlafaxine(tapered off) to Sertraline 150 mg until 2021, added mirtazapine 30 mg until 2019 2018-2023, Oct- Pregabalin, started 150 mg to 600 mg 2019- Diazepam started 6mg 2022- July-restart mirtazapine(unsuccessful) Oct- ECT X 12, Zopliclone 7.5 mg start- present 2023- January, olanzapine decreased to 7.5 mg, Lorazepam 1 mg X 2 weeks, Diazepam increased- 20 mg, some tapering to June-Diazepam 10 mg March- Agomelatine added-25 mg October 9th, 2023 present meds bolded Link to comment
Peter23 Posted October 14, 2023 Author Share Posted October 14, 2023 Forgot to add that I took Agomelatine 25mg at 11:50pm. 2000-Venlafaxine 150 mg and Olanzapine 10 mg started 2012- Venlafaxine(tapered off) to Sertraline 150 mg until 2021, added mirtazapine 30 mg until 2019 2018-2023, Oct- Pregabalin, started 150 mg to 600 mg 2019- Diazepam started 6mg 2022- July-restart mirtazapine(unsuccessful) Oct- ECT X 12, Zopliclone 7.5 mg start- present 2023- January, olanzapine decreased to 7.5 mg, Lorazepam 1 mg X 2 weeks, Diazepam increased- 20 mg, some tapering to June-Diazepam 10 mg March- Agomelatine added-25 mg October 9th, 2023 present meds bolded Link to comment
Peter23 Posted October 15, 2023 Author Share Posted October 15, 2023 (edited) 04:45 :Woke with anxiety 05:00: Had a cup of decaf coffee and Diazepam 2mg. 05:10 Went back into a very restless sleep 09:00: Woke up with awful anxiety, obsessive thoughts, abdominal and back pain and tinnitus. 09:15 Did some breathing exercises with limited effect. 09:30 Took 4mg Diazepam and Pregabalin 200mg 09:45 Anxiety easing a little bit but still having obsessive thoughts, abdominal/ back pain and tinnitus. 10:00 Can't eat breakfast due to anxiety, nausea and abdominal pain. Feeling very tired and lethargic. Low mood. 10:30 Tried some CBT techniques on obsessive thoughts with limited effect. 11:00 Continue to experience anxiety, obsessive thoughts, lethargy, low mood, abdominal pain and tinnitus. 11:30 Took an high protein drink. 12:00 Did breathing exercises with limited effect. 12:30 Did some progressive muscle relaxation. 13:00 Rested for an hour. 14:00 Continuing anxiety, obsessive thoughts, lethargy, low mood, abdominal/back pain and tinnitus. 15:00 Took Diazepam 4mg and Pregabalin 200mg. 15:30 Slight decrease in anxiety and obsessive thoughts. Still feeling lethargic and low in mood. Struggling with activities of daily living. 16:00 Contiue to experience obsessive thoughts, anxiety, lethargy and low mood. Also feeling restless and irritable. 17:00 Abdominal and back pain resolved but still don't feel like eating very much. 18:00 Struggling to do housework. Continue to experience anxiety, obsessive thoughts, lethargy, restlessness and low mood. 19:00 Managed to eat dinner. 20:00 Watching TV. Great difficulty in concentrating due to anxiety and ruminations. Still lethargic and in low mood. 21:00 Managed to have a shower. 21:30 Took Pregabalin 200mg. Continuous anxious ruminations. Mood improved slightly. 22:00 Listening to music and trying to relax. Continued anxious ruminations. 23:15 Took Agomelatine 25mg: Zopiclone 7.5mg and Olanzapine 7.5mg. 23:35: In bed. Edited October 17, 2023 by manymoretodays drugs bolded 2000-Venlafaxine 150 mg and Olanzapine 10 mg started 2012- Venlafaxine(tapered off) to Sertraline 150 mg until 2021, added mirtazapine 30 mg until 2019 2018-2023, Oct- Pregabalin, started 150 mg to 600 mg 2019- Diazepam started 6mg 2022- July-restart mirtazapine(unsuccessful) Oct- ECT X 12, Zopliclone 7.5 mg start- present 2023- January, olanzapine decreased to 7.5 mg, Lorazepam 1 mg X 2 weeks, Diazepam increased- 20 mg, some tapering to June-Diazepam 10 mg March- Agomelatine added-25 mg October 9th, 2023 present meds bolded Link to comment
Peter23 Posted October 16, 2023 Author Share Posted October 16, 2023 I have recorded two days of my medications and symptoms throughout each day. It is very clear to me that not only am I dealing with protracted antidepressant withdrawal, but also the side effects and drug interactions due to the polypharmacy I have ended up with as a result of misdiagnosis on several occasions. I also recognize my addiction to diazepam and probably the zopiclone as well. My situation has been much worse since I started taking the Agomelatine as anxiety is a side effect of this drug. It causes release of noradrenaline which as you are probably aware is a fight-or-flight hormone. That I think is why I am experiencing a cortisol type reaction in the morning. I am desperately afraid of the future at the moment as I can't see a way out of my situation. 2000-Venlafaxine 150 mg and Olanzapine 10 mg started 2012- Venlafaxine(tapered off) to Sertraline 150 mg until 2021, added mirtazapine 30 mg until 2019 2018-2023, Oct- Pregabalin, started 150 mg to 600 mg 2019- Diazepam started 6mg 2022- July-restart mirtazapine(unsuccessful) Oct- ECT X 12, Zopliclone 7.5 mg start- present 2023- January, olanzapine decreased to 7.5 mg, Lorazepam 1 mg X 2 weeks, Diazepam increased- 20 mg, some tapering to June-Diazepam 10 mg March- Agomelatine added-25 mg October 9th, 2023 present meds bolded Link to comment
Moderator Emeritus manymoretodays Posted October 17, 2023 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted October 17, 2023 (edited) Thanks Peter23, Good job. What are the dates for the 2 days that you've done? Are you sleeping all night at this point? Try to remain as calm as possible. Lot's of symptoms to deal with I see. Do you have any favorite non-drug coping practices that you do? I do see the CBT techniques noted with limited effect. I'll alert the others that you've gotten some notes done now, and maybe go in and just bold the medications in what you've done. Good job. Here's our topic on: Early-morning waking-managing the morning cortisol spike and sounds like you are trying some music to relax, and unfortunate no relief later in the day Also: Withdrawal causing repetitive or intrusive thoughts, rumination and increased panic? Obsessive compulsive disorder or OCD: Repetitive intrusive thoughts, compulsive behaviors Try to remember a thought is just that, a thought. Don't fight them, they'll go. I mean I know it's not easy. Perhaps some guided meditations? So many out there to choose from. I like the Waking Up App, and then sometimes listening to some of my favorites to get out of my head when needed and find that silence with in. You tube is great for finding your own favorites and then perhaps just sitting with them while listening. Some WD, some drug adversities too. And refresh me here too, when was your last drug change-date, and what was it? Thanks. L, P, H, and G, mmt Patience is tough and frankly, I'm amazed at what you are doing. Hang on. Keep going. 6 hours ago, Peter23 said: I am desperately afraid of the future at the moment as I can't see a way out of my situation. That's a spiral ^ Dealing With Emotional Spirals Edited October 17, 2023 by manymoretodays Late 2023- gone to emeritus status, inactive, don't @ me, I can check who I've posted on, and I'm not really here like I used to be......thanks. Started with psycho meds/psychiatric care circa 1988. In retrospect, and on contemplation, situational overwhelm. Rounding up to 30 years of medications(30 medication trials, poly-pharmacy maximum was 3 at one time). 5/28/2015-off Adderal salts 2.5mg. (I had been on that since hospital 10/2014) 12/2015---just holding, holding, holding, with trileptal/oxcarb at 75 mg. 1/2 tab at hs. My last psycho med ever! Tapered @ 10% every 4 weeks, sometimes 2 weeks to 2016 Dec 16, medication free!! Longer signature post here, with current supplements. Herb and alcohol free since 5/15/2016. And.....I quit smoking 11/2021. Lapsed. Redo of quit smoking 9/28/2022. Can you say Hallelujah?(took me long enough)💜 None of my posts are intended as medical advice. Please discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical provider. My success story: Blue skies ahead, clear sailing Link to comment
Peter23 Posted October 17, 2023 Author Share Posted October 17, 2023 Thanks Manymoredays for your reply, suggestions and advice. The dates for my medication and symptoms are the 14th and 15th October 23. I will look at sites you have kindly given me . I generally go to sleep around midnight and waken around 3am of 4am . I usually manage to get back into a restless sleep until 7am or 8am. Some of my repetitive obsessive thoughts are about not getting my medication on time from my doctor and pharmacy. I panic that might not get my medication and go into withdrawals. I keep having to check with my doctor's practice and with pharmacy that my medication is ready for me. This is probably due my addictions to the diazepam and zopiclone. As stated earlier I have previously contacted the local Drug & Alcohol services. However they don't seem to deal with benzodiazepine addiction. I have tried group CBT in the past but think I need to have individual CBT with a qualified therapist. I know someone who specialises in CBT for addiction so was thinking about contacting him to arrange an appointment. I have tried guided mindful meditation but still find it difficult to switch off my recurrent obsessive thoughts. At the moment I just feel so overwhelmed by everything I have to do. My partner suffers from fibromyalgia and is going through a rough time at the moment. He is very supportive and does his best to help with the housework. Trying to keep pushing myself to do what I can each day. However it is very challenging both physically and mentally. Thanks for your support and advice. It is much appreciated. 2000-Venlafaxine 150 mg and Olanzapine 10 mg started 2012- Venlafaxine(tapered off) to Sertraline 150 mg until 2021, added mirtazapine 30 mg until 2019 2018-2023, Oct- Pregabalin, started 150 mg to 600 mg 2019- Diazepam started 6mg 2022- July-restart mirtazapine(unsuccessful) Oct- ECT X 12, Zopliclone 7.5 mg start- present 2023- January, olanzapine decreased to 7.5 mg, Lorazepam 1 mg X 2 weeks, Diazepam increased- 20 mg, some tapering to June-Diazepam 10 mg March- Agomelatine added-25 mg October 9th, 2023 present meds bolded Link to comment
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