jack9: please help me what to do

[jack9]

Firstly hi, i wish someone can guide me, may 2021 i started on paxil 10 mg then 20 mg to the end of mars then i switched to zolof 50 mg then 25 mg but it gave me insomnia and lost my appetite so i switched to lexapro 5mg after 7 weeks on zoloft.. 

Lexapro always made me lose my appetite so i just stopped then i got into withdrawal so i used prozac to get rid of them after one week like this :

one week 5 mg prozac

One week 2.5 mg 

One week 1.25 

It got rid off dizziness and zaps but nauaea it still there after i finished prozac ( when i was on it i didnt have much appetite too ) 

Its 10 days ago 

So what should i do now plz help me 

Tough it out ? For how long ?

Or reinstate lex 2.5 mg but it will make me lose my appetite anyways 

Can i taper if i wasnt stable on it and still give me side effects ? 

Plz help and opinions and thanks..

[jack9]

Please approve it soon please

[jack9]

Please approve

 

Please approve my last post fast im suffering

 

Edited July 2, 2022 by ChessieCat
added Intro topic title before merging with intro topic

[getofflex]

Hello, and welcome to SA.  We are a volunteer-run community of people who have been or are getting off of psychiatric drugs.  I'm sorry to hear that you are suffering from these drugs.  In order to figure out which drug you should reinstate, we will need very specific and detailed information about what dates you were on each of your drugs. 

 

On 7/1/2022 at 9:46 PM, jack9 said:

i started on paxil 10 mg then 20 mg to the end of mars

Is this March?  Would the year be 2022? 

 

Can you please give us specific information in your signature about your drug history for all drugs you are on and have been on, especially for the past 18-24 months?  It would be especially helpful to have the details of your drugs in a concise vertical list (no symptoms), only drug names, specific dates (as best you can say for example early March if you don't recall the day) and dosages of each medication decrease or increase.  Use this format:

 

Drug name: date, dose, date, dose, date, dose…

Drug name: date, dose, date, dose, date, dose…

Etcetera

 

Please read the link below for instructions.  This will allow us to give you the best guidance.  

 

How to List Drug History in Signature

 

Here is some important information about how these drugs actually work.  This explains why we get symptoms from going off of these medications, and why it's so important to taper slowly and carefully, and be very cautious about changing our doses: 

 

How Psychiatric Drugs Remodel Your Brain

 

 

This helps you understand what withdrawal syndrome is: 

 

Video on Recovery from Psych Drugs

 

Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization

 

Here is a link with checklists of common WD symptoms: 

 

Dr Joseph Glenmullen Withdrawal Symptom Checklists

 

 

Here are some techniques to cope with symptoms: 

 

Non Drug Ways to Cope with Withdrawal Symptoms

 

Stability is really important when we are tapering off psych meds.  Please read the link about stability:

 

Keep It Simple, Slow, and Stable

 

 

We don't suggest many supplements, but 2 that many of us find helpful are magnesium and omega-3 fish oil. Here are the links for info about those. It is suggested to add one at a time, and start with a low dose to see how it affects you. 

Magnesium

Omega 3 Fish Oil

 

Finally, going back on a small dose of your drug, or increasing your dose, which we call reinstatement, is best done very carefully.  This is temporary, and after stabilizing you would then taper gradually off of this.  There is some risk involved, and we need more specifics about your drug history before we can suggest a good dose at which to reinstate.  Here is some information about reinstatement.  

 

About Reinstating and Stabilizing to Reduce Withdrawal Symptoms

 

Please hang in there, and we look forward to hearing again from you soon.  Please don't reinstate anything yet, until we give you a suggestion, because reinstating 2.5 mg Lexapro is probably too high, and could make you feel worse. You suggest that you had side effects and weren't stable on Lexapro.  What symptoms did you have while on Lexapro?  These may have been withdrawal symptoms from your previous drugs. 

[jack9]

I reinstated 2.5 mg lexapro and the nausea went away 

But anyways i have low appetite as a side effects from tge drug ( i had it when i switched to it so i stopped ) 

Now im thinking of going this tapering scehdule :  

1.25 then 0.6 then 0.3 

giving each one maybe 2 weeks or until i feel stabilised 

i know about the 10% method but i mean i wasnt on meds for that much ( 1 year for all of them combined ) and low doses 

so what do you think about this plan ? I saw a lot of people jumping from 2.5 mg to 0 and they didnt have much withdrawal symptoms for more than 3 weeks

p.s i dont mind having some withdrawal symptoms for one month even but not longer 

so can this plan work for me ? 

[getofflex]

Please make your drug signature as requested in my first post.  

[jack9]

Ok i made a signature

I just want to get rid of the drug as fast as i can becuase of the reduced appetite from lexapro and i dont know if it will go away so i prefer to stop

I dont mind some withdrawal for like 3 weeks

I wasnt on the ADs for too long and also low doses so  can i do like this : 

1.25 then 0.6 then 0.3 

each one for like 2 weeks if i dont feel withdtawal from these steps ? 

i know about the 10 % reduction but i mean i wasnt on it too long and i see its so conservative for my case and i cant handle the appetite thing for too long 

also i see a lot of people doing less taprer than this and jumping off 5 or 2.5 with no much issues so what do you think i should do ? 

 

[getofflex]

I want to make sure I have this right: 

Paxil: April 27 2021 to Sept 6 2021, and October 11 2021 to March 29 2022 between 10 mg and 20 mg.

 

Zoloft: March 29 2022 to May 1 2022 between 25 mg and 50 mg

 

Lexapro: May 18 2022 to May 25 2022, stopped, then May 25 to present. on 5 mg to 2.5 mg. 

 

Prozac: June 2 2022 to June 23 2022  On 5 mg, 2.5 mg, 1.25 mg 

 

Is all this correct?  

 

And you say you have side effects on the Lexapro? What side effects do you have on the Lexapro besides nausea?   

 

You say Lexapro got rid of the withdrawal in your drug signature. What were the specific symptoms of the withdrawal?  

 

 

 

 

[getofflex]

On 7/1/2022 at 9:46 PM, jack9 said:

Or reinstate lex 2.5 mg but it will make me lose my appetite anyways 

OK this is very confusing.  Your drug signature says you are on Lexapro, but here you ask about reinstating Lexapro.  Please clarify.  Did you just take it one day on July 2, or are you still taking it? 

 

Also, you mention that Lexapro makes you unstable and gives you side effects, but in your drug sig, you say it got rid of WD, yet gave you nausea.  

 

1) What side effects did Lexapro give you?

 

2) What withdrawal symptoms did you have when you were not on the Lexapro? 

Edited July 5, 2022 by getofflex

[jack9]

Ok listen 

When i switched to lexapro at 18 may i had reduced appetite and fatigue so i stopped it from 5 mg and i had bad withdrawal and used prozac to eliminate them and it helped but the nausea persisted so i got back to lexapro 2.5 mg on 2 july ( i asked you here then i reinstated because i couldnt take anymore and it got rid of nausea and now im still taking 2.5 mg and having reduced appetite as a side effect from the drug ) 

I had dizziness and brain zaps as withdrawal symptoms but using prozac got rid of them but as the nausea didnt stop i was worried and got back into lexapro and im on 2.5 mg now so i had the same side effect of reduced appetite now. Im considered on the first few weeks of the drug so they say the appetite should come back after but i think i prefer to taper and get rid of this crap.

So my question is : is the taper i listed above good not to have severe withdrawal in my case ? What should i do because im fed up with the appetite thing and i cant stop abruptly 

So its nausea off the drug due to stopping fast 

And reduced appetite on the drug as a side effect 

[Altostrata]

Welcome, @jack9

 

10 hours ago, jack9 said:

i was worried and got back into lexapro and im on 2.5 mg now so i had the same side effect of reduced appetite now.

 

Do you feel better or worse than when you were taking Prozac?

 

What do you mean by nausea and reduced appetite? How often are you nauseous? How much are you eating? What other drug-related symptoms do you have now? How's your sleep?

[jack9]

My sleep is good

I feel like the same when i took prozac as a bridge 

Just small appetite 

Im eating now on small portions all day 

But the withdrawal was nausea feeling all day not just low appetite 

When i stopped prozac bridge the nausea persisted 

So after i came back to lexapro i felt the nausea lessened but its giving me a bad appetite ( the same cause why i stopped it ) so what should i do now ? Just push through and this is side effect that should go like they say or i should start to taper like i said above ? 

[jack9]

My doctor suggested adding amitriptyline or mirtazapine to increase appetite and combat the side effect of lexapro what do you think ? How long does it take to help ?

[getofflex]

Almost all doctors are going to push drugs on you.  They have been brainwashed by drug manufacturers to do this.  Going on yet another psychiatric med will put you at significant risk of destabilizing you even further, and making your situation worse.  

 

What other side effects is your Lexapro giving you?  These symptoms may be from the other drug switches you've done in the recent past.  

 

Is your ultimate goal to get off of psychiatric drugs?  

Edited July 6, 2022 by getofflex

[jack9]

Mostly just reduced appetite

Aldo some fatigue which is not concerning

Yes i want to get off because of the reduced appetite but if i can solve it i can wait its ok 

I heard a lot of people use mirtazapine and amitriptyline and they increase appetite tho

[Altostrata]

Hello, @jack9. You must understand, this is a site for going off psychiatric drugs. We do not assist people to choose psychiatric drugs to take.

 

12 hours ago, jack9 said:

Im eating now on small portions all day 

....

So after i came back to lexapro i felt the nausea lessened but its giving me a bad appetite

 

It appears reinstatement of 2.5mg escitalopram has reduced some of your withdrawal issues. You have been taking 2.5mg escitalopram for 4 days. It takes at least that long to get to full effect. You need to give your withdrawal symptoms more time to settle down with the help of the reinstatement.

 

While frustrating, we would not say this is a withdrawal symptom pattern requiring drug escalation.

[jack9]

Can i ask you What do you mean by the last phrase ? 

Should i have pushed through instead or reinstating ?

[getofflex]

I believe what altostrata meant, and she can correct me if I'm wrong, is that we don't suggest you add mirtazapine or amitriptyline in order to try and restore your appetite.  In doing so, you could cause yourself a lot more hurt and pain.  

 

Is your goal here to go off psychiatric drugs, or is it to try and find a drug to fix yourself and feel better?  

 

You had asked previously about doing a fast taper:

 

On 7/5/2022 at 5:46 AM, jack9 said:

I wasnt on the ADs for too long and also low doses so  can i do like this : 

1.25 then 0.6 then 0.3 

each one for like 2 weeks if i dont feel withdtawal from these steps ? 

i know about the 10 % reduction but i mean i wasnt on it too long and i see its so conservative for my case and i cant handle the appetite thing for too long 

also i see a lot of people doing less taprer than this and jumping off 5 or 2.5 with no much issues so what do you think i should do ? 

Because you have been on and off various AD's for the recent past, I would not suggest you do this.  Doing the various and frequent drug and dose changes means that your nervous system is probably pretty sensitized and destabilized at the point, hence the symptoms.  My suggestion would be to stay on the 2.5 mg Lexapro reinstatement for several months. which seems to be helping you.  You are able to eat small amounts throughout the day, so it doesn't sound like your lack of appetite is a life threatening issue.  Many people we see in here with symptoms can't sleep, are very anxious and agitated, depressed, in severe physical and mental pain, and housebound, and have many other symptoms to cope with.  You run the risk of ending up like this, if you rush a taper, and it could take months to years to recover.  So please do the taper as suggested in my first post, after you have stabilized on your Lexapro reinstatement for at least several months.  Please keep in touch, and let us know how you are doing.  

[ChessieCat]

2 hours ago, jack9 said:

Should i have pushed through instead or reinstating ?

 

The idea of reinstating is not to get rid of withdrawal symptoms completely but to bring them to a bearable level.

 

It sounds like your symptoms ARE bearable.  But I think you might be stressing yourself out which can add more symptoms which aren't withdrawal but can make things worse.

 

Read the labels on this diagram to see how stress and anxiety can be affect the body:

 

From https://www.getselfhelp.co.uk/anxiety-self-help/

 

[jack9]

How can i know if im stabilised on the med ? 

What is stabilisation ? 

I mean side effects from the med can go or stay.

Like if someone has low sex drive or diarrhea for example on an antidepressant so should he wait until they go to say he is stabilised ? I think you mean by stablisation that not having more withdrawal symptoms but the reduced appetite and fatigue or diarrhea of mine are caused by the med him self so what is the reason of waiting months before i taper ? How can i cope with this if it doesnt change ?

[ChessieCat]

Dr Joseph Glenmullen's WD Symptoms Checklist

 

Stability

 

WDnormal

 

And Brassmonkey talks more about it here:

 

tao-of-the-brassmonkey

[jack9]

Ok now im more confused but i mean im having the same side effects of the drug so im stabilised ? Even if its just a week why does the side effects matter anyway they will go when you stop.

If thats not withdrawal symptoms so can you taper if its just side effects from the drug ? And when you taper focus on if anything new happen 

Is it ok ? 

[getofflex]

8 hours ago, jack9 said:

Ok now im more confused but i mean im having the same side effects of the drug so im stabilised ?

You were given the link that explains stabilization in the previous post.  Please read this.  You plainly told us your only symptoms on the current Lexapro 2.5 mg reinstatement were lack of appetite and fatigue, but you could accept the fatigue.  No, you are not stabilized yet, but if you stay on this reinstatement dose for a long time (several months), and take it precisely and consistently, you should stabilize.  You indicated in your first few posts that you were suffering, but then when you got on the Lexapro reinstatement, and Altostrata asked you what your symptoms were then, you said this below: 

 

22 hours ago, jack9 said:

Mostly just reduced appetite

Aldo some fatigue which is not concerning

 

This is not severe or moderate withdrawal, this is pretty mild compared to other folks here.  I think you are overthinking all this. 

[jack9]

How can i know if im stabilised on the med ? 

What is stabilisation ? 

I mean side effects from the med can go or stay.

Like if someone has low sex drive or diarrhea for example on an antidepressant so should he wait until they go to say he is stabilised ? I think you mean by stablisation that not having more withdrawal symptoms but the reduced appetite and fatigue or diarrhea of mine are caused by the med him self so what is the reason of waiting months before i taper ? How can i cope with this if it doesnt change ?

 

THE QUESTION IS IF IM HAVING SIDE EFFECTS FROM THE MED AND NOT THE WITHDRAWAL IS THIS CONSIDERED DESTABLISATION ? 

[Mirtazapine20mg]

45 minutes ago, jack9 said:

Like if someone has low sex drive or diarrhea for example on an antidepressant so should he wait until they go to say he is stabilised ?

I am also insecure about this. I don't really feel stable at any time. So I just reduce by 5% on the first ok day after at least two weeks have passed. Sometimes I have to wait more than a month. But I am not a moderater, just someone confused as you. Btw, how are things in Aleppo? Often think about how life must be there.

[getofflex]

3 hours ago, jack9 said:

What is stabilisation ? 

Stabilization is when you feel about the same from day to day, without any big highs or lows.  It doesn't mean feeling good, it just means feeling the same level of blah from day to day. 

 

3 hours ago, jack9 said:

THE QUESTION IS IF IM HAVING SIDE EFFECTS FROM THE MED AND NOT THE WITHDRAWAL IS THIS CONSIDERED DESTABLISATION ?

No, this is not considered destabilization.  Stabilization just means not having big swings up and down in symptoms.  You can still have med side effects, and yet be stabilized.  But since you just reinstated to 2.5 mg Lexapro a few days ago, you should wait at least 4 weeks before starting to taper off of that.  And then, as stated before, reduce by only 10% of your current dose, so your next dose would be 2.25 mg Lexapro. 

Edited July 7, 2022 by getofflex

[jack9]

@Mirtazapine20mg the situation in aleppo is not that good but better than before 

 

@getofflexok i got it so when i reduce the dose i should consider if other sypmtoms happen because anyways me appetite is reduced, do you understand what i mean ?

[jack9]

@getofflex  also im i did more than this 10 % and felt fine is it ok ? I think im not that sensitive 

[ChessieCat]

Lexapro is a very strong drug.  I don't think it would be worth the risk to try to taper faster than 10%.  You might end up making things much worse than what they are now.

 

  

On 5/27/2011 at 12:16 PM, Altostrata said:

If you are taking 5mg of Lexapro, it's not tiny, it's equivalent to 10-20mg Paxil or Celexa.

Consequently, when you taper off escitalopram, you should be careful to decrease by small amounts, as each drop is magnified by escitalopram's extra potency. If you find withdrawal symptoms from a 10% decrease to be too difficult, after 3-4 weeks decrease by a smaller amount.

 

 

Edited July 8, 2022 by ChessieCat

[jack9]

I know you are a site for coming off ADs but can i ask you in general does the appetite come back after the first weeks ? I hear people say that ADs cause weight gain

[getofflex]

6 hours ago, jack9 said:

@getofflexok i got it so when i reduce the dose i should consider if other sypmtoms happen because anyways me appetite is reduced, do you understand what i mean ?

Yes, that is correct. I don't know if the appetite will come back after the first weeks.  

[jack9]

I feel like my appetite is getting better.. thanks god ! 

But i have a last question 

For someone who isnot on the drug for that long does it make sense to taper for a period longer than the period which he took the drug for ? 

I mean if i did 20% reduction every 4 weeks and felt fine so why not continue like that and if i feel something bad reduce less slowly 

Most people dont need such slow reductions especially if they take the drug less than a year right ?

[jack9]

I feel abit dizzy now 

But i think its a side effect from lex because i stopped feeling dizzy from the withdrawal even before i reinstated so its possible that lex is making me a bit dizzy especially when standing up fast

[jack9]

Can you reply to my last post ? 

@getofflex

when i stopped first time i had it for 2 weeks then subsided 

And now after one week of reinstating lex im feeling dizzy so i think its a side effect from lex since im on my first weeks right ?

[getofflex]

On 7/9/2022 at 12:59 PM, jack9 said:

or someone who isnot on the drug for that long does it make sense to taper for a period longer than the period which he took the drug for ? 

Yes, we often must taper for longer than we were on the drug, because of how our brains become so dependent upon it.  Did you read and watch the links I gave you in my first post? 

 

On 7/9/2022 at 12:59 PM, jack9 said:

I mean if i did 20% reduction every 4 weeks and felt fine so why not continue like that and if i feel something bad reduce less slowly

WE at SA use a harm reduction approach, so we always suggest a taper of only 10% reduction at most, no more often than every 4 weeks.  Many times, things that worked for people in the past no longer work, because the nervous system becomes sensitized, and it becomes harder to withdraw off drugs the more we go on and off them, and change their doses.  You've done quite a few drug changes in the past several years.  If you taper too fast, or too much, like 20%, and it messes you up, it could take you many months to recover from that.  Here is what you can do:  do a reduction of 10%, and see if any symptoms show up in the next 4 weeks.  Do another reduction, see if any symptoms show up in that month.  If you have 2 good months like this with no symptoms, then, you could reduce by 10%, but then do another reduction in 3 weeks instead of 4. 

Edited July 13, 2022 by getofflex

[getofflex]

6 hours ago, jack9 said:

And now after one week of reinstating lex im feeling dizzy so i think its a side effect from lex since im on my first weeks right ?

It may be a side effect of the lex, or it may be from withdrawal, from the various drug changes you've made recently.  Did you have this dizziness before reinstating the lexapro on July 2?