Thorin: withdrawal from Latuda

[Carmie]

So good to hear that you’re on the home stretch @Thorin, 

 

Do you do a crossover when you change from tablet to liquid? 
 

Sending hugs🤗

[Thorin]

1 hour ago, Carmie said:

So good to hear that you’re on the home stretch @Thorin, 

 

Do you do a crossover when you change from tablet to liquid? 
 

Sending hugs🤗

Hi Carmie,

 

yes, switching from the tablet form of clonazepam to the liquid form to make tapering easier.

 

Hope you’re well!

[Thorin]

5 hours ago, Poppy745 said:

@Thorin Rooting for you Thorin! Not far now. I find watching the tapering coaches advice of Youtube really helpful and comforting. I have come across a few in America, so it would be good for there to be one in Australia. We need some in the UK as well. Everywhere would be good!

Hey Poppy, that’s what I was thinking. There  are a few in America and Canada but none in Australia. And none in the UK you say? We need more l! Need to get the word out and share information about this. I see people everywhere seeking help to get off these meds…… I’m going to look into it. Are you well? Where are you located if you don’t mind me asking. In the northern hemisphere somewhere I figure.

[Thorin]

8 hours ago, LotusRising said:

You are on the homestretch, this is exciting! How has your transition over to liquid been?

Thank you! When I first switched the middle dose there were a few minor rumbles. Nothing strong enough to make me stop and only short term. The switch for the nighttime dose seems fine and I imagine the morning one will be too. Then the home stretch!

[Thorin]

8 hours ago, LotusRising said:

Yes! I did this too - very cathartic! 

Oh I bet it feels great!!!! Really going to get some anger going when I do it and send those pills off properly! Are you still tapering clonazepam or are you off?

[LotusRising]

@Thorin I've been off since April! How has your taper been?

[Carmie]

Hi again @Thorin

 

What I meant when mentioning doing a crossover was not going directly from tablet to liquid, but doing it gradually as is mentioned on this site. I’ve done it myself. It makes for an easier transition. 
 

The formula is: 

 

3/4 old ( tablet ) , 1/4 new ( liquid ).   Hold for 3 to 7 days

1/2 old, 1/2 new for 3 to 7 days

1/4 old, 3/4 new for 3 to 7 days. 
All new afterwards
 

Again, I’m so happy to hear you’re on the homestretch🧡

Edited November 17, 2023 by Carmie
Typo

[Thorin]

3 hours ago, Carmie said:

Hi again @Thorin

 

What I meant when mentioning doing a crossover was not going directly from tablet to liquid, but doing it gradually as is mentioned on this site. I’ve done it myself. It makes for an easier transition. 
 

The formula is: 

 

3/4 old ( tablet ) , 1/4 new ( liquid ).   Hold for 3 to 7 days

1/2 old, 1/2 new for 3 to 7 days

1/4 old, 3/4 new for 3 to 7 days. 
All new afterwards
 

Again, I’m so happy to hear you’re on the homestretch🧡

Thanks Carmie. That’s basically what I’m doing. Slowly transitioning all to liquid over two weeks.

[Thorin]

4 hours ago, LotusRising said:

@Thorin I've been off since April! How has your taper been?

My taper’s been rough but I’m making good progress. Down from 2mg Xanax/day to 0.25mg clonazepam/day. Should be done with the taper by March 2024. How have you been since you jumped?

[Carmie]

2 hours ago, Thorin said:

Thanks Carmie. That’s basically what I’m doing. Slowly transitioning all to liquid over two weeks.

Well done! You’re doing amazing Thorin👏👏👏👏

[Thorin]

56 minutes ago, Carmie said:

Well done! You’re doing amazing Thorin👏👏👏👏

Thank you Carmie. It’s such such such a hard slog that I mostly don’t have any energy for anyone or anything else. But it’s progressing and I can see a point in the future when I can put this particular taper behind me. Hope you’re doing well!

[Poppy745]

10 hours ago, Thorin said:

Hey Poppy, that’s what I was thinking. There  are a few in America and Canada but none in Australia. And none in the UK you say? We need more l! Need to get the word out and share information about this. I see people everywhere seeking help to get off these meds…… I’m going to look into it. Are you well? Where are you located if you don’t mind me asking. In the northern hemisphere somewhere I figure.

Hi @Thorin I am in the UK. There may be a couple of dr's, but I have not come across any coaches when searching in the UK. There may be some that I just have not come across. We seem to have a few people on social media that are trying to get the message out in the UK in conferences, training videos, podcasts, conferences, and the documentary of course, but it still does not seem to be a known thing. It really helps to find others that understand and have been there. 

[LotusRising]

9 hours ago, Thorin said:

My taper’s been rough but I’m making good progress. Down from 2mg Xanax/day to 0.25mg clonazepam/day. Should be done with the taper by March 2024. How have you been since you jumped?

 

So great, what an accomplishment  

 

I've been good since jumping! I went through all the really acute stuff when I started my taper, so I haven't had an increase in symptoms since I stepped off. Just residual things like really bad fatigue, nerve pain (way less intense), muscle tension, and autonomic stuff like exercise intolerance, heart rate fluctuations. But in general, better than I was at the beginning, and functional! so I can't complain.

 

Is it just the lurasidone left after you're done this taper? 

[Poppy745]

50 minutes ago, LotusRising said:

 

So great, what an accomplishment  

 

I've been good since jumping! I went through all the really acute stuff when I started my taper, so I haven't had an increase in symptoms since I stepped off. Just residual things like really bad fatigue, nerve pain (way less intense), muscle tension, and autonomic stuff like exercise intolerance, heart rate fluctuations. But in general, better than I was at the beginning, and functional! so I can't complain.

 

Is it just the lurasidone left after you're done this taper? 

Hi @LotusRising Can I ask if this experience of your taper was off Effexor or the benzo?  Good to hear that you are doing well. Thanks

[LotusRising]

4 hours ago, Poppy745 said:

Can I ask if this experience of your taper was off Effexor or the benzo?  Good to hear that you are doing well. Thanks

@Poppy745 I was referencing the benzo.

[Thorin]

On 11/18/2023 at 2:24 AM, LotusRising said:

 

So great, what an accomplishment  

 

I've been good since jumping! I went through all the really acute stuff when I started my taper, so I haven't had an increase in symptoms since I stepped off. Just residual things like really bad fatigue, nerve pain (way less intense), muscle tension, and autonomic stuff like exercise intolerance, heart rate fluctuations. But in general, better than I was at the beginning, and functional! so I can't complain.

 

Is it just the lurasidone left after you're done this taper? 

That’s so good that you’re doing reasonably well since jumping. And you’ll only continue to get better! I seek to be experiencing all the symptoms during my taper too so hopefully things won’t get worse when I jump. Will be worth it to be off this poison though. Yes, I’ll still have 14mg of Lurasidone to taper after the Benzo. But I’ll be more mindful of what condition I’m in while tapering that one. The Benzo I just need to be off (I can’t go much slower anyway). Being on the Lurasidone doesn’t mess me about as much so I can take my time getting off that one. See how I go though. I can be impatient and I hate being on meds! Are you on any other meds?

[Thorin]

So while I’ve been having a pretty rough time of it I’m noticing that some of the symptoms are fading away (replaced by others but a big sign of healing).

my GI issues that I didn’t know were Benzo induced seem to be settling after over 12 months of dealing with them.

The vertigo/dizziness/floaty boat feeling is much reduced and much less frequent. This one disturbed me for a long time and it’s a relief that it’s reduced.

the last couple of days I’m feeling less body load. Less physically ill. This seems to coincide with introducing a homemade tonic that’s super high in turmeric and treats inflammation. I randomly tried it when my partner bought some and we broth felt better very quickly after having a dose. It’s worked multiple days in a row.

I seem to be having a bit of a window for about 5 hours in the middle of each day the last few days. I’m not even close to 100% in the windows but so much better than last week.

my crazy cravings for sugar have left thankfully. I was eating whole blocks of chocolate followed by biscuits. Whatever I could get my hands on. I have nearly no desire for sugar atm.

my sleep is a little worse but I’m also not having 3-4 hour sleeps in the middle of the day which will help me keep my job!

I can think more clearly. It’s still an effort but so much better.

my ability to concentrate is better than it was.

i’m sure there’s more but I just needed to note that things are improving despite how difficult it all is.

I started at over 2mg Xanax a day. I’m now down to 0.25mg clonazepam. And have moved completely to a liquid version of the med as of yesterday. In a week or two I’ll dispose of my pills in a little ceremony I think. This is a big step!

[littlebird]

20 hours ago, Thorin said:

This seems to coincide with introducing a homemade tonic that’s super high in turmeric and treats inflammation.

I've been thinking of trying some turmeric for inflammation! Good to hear it's been helpful.

 

20 hours ago, Thorin said:

I can think more clearly. It’s still an effort but so much better.

my ability to concentrate is better than it was.

This makes me so happy to hear, man. Good sign things are improving!

 

20 hours ago, Thorin said:

I started at over 2mg Xanax a day. I’m now down to 0.25mg clonazepam. And have moved completely to a liquid version of the med as of yesterday. In a week or two I’ll dispose of my pills in a little ceremony I think. This is a big step!

You've done so much work to get here! Hope you're able to celebrate yourself.

[Thorin]

17 minutes ago, littlebird said:

I've been thinking of trying some turmeric for inflammation! Good to hear it's been helpful.

It hasn’t fixed everything but it’s made a difference for sure. If you have it you need to take it with cracked pepper and some sort of fat. Seems to really help!

 

18 minutes ago, littlebird said:

This makes me so happy to hear, man. Good sign things are improving!

Things are definitely improving over time. Man this taper’s taking it out of me. Can’t wait to be off. Four more months!

[littlebird]

1 hour ago, Thorin said:

If you have it you need to take it with cracked pepper and some sort of fat.

Oh, good to know. I just have it in the spice cabinet, was wondering if I need to cook with it a bit more. Someone mentioned Golden Milk and it sounded amazing, might have to experiment with turmeric more; could definitely use some anti-inflammation. Glad you found something that helps!

 

1 hour ago, Thorin said:

Four more months!

Four months till graduation! That's so close, finals will be here before you know it and then it's straight into freedom. 😎

[Thorin]

1 hour ago, littlebird said:

Oh, good to know. I just have it in the spice cabinet, was wondering if I need to cook with it a bit more. Someone mentioned Golden Milk and it sounded amazing, might have to experiment with turmeric more; could definitely use some anti-inflammation. Glad you found something that helps!

 

Four months till graduation! That's so close, finals will be here before you know it and then it's straight into freedom. 😎

Apparently unprocessed turmeric is the go but I read that ground turmeric will do if you can’t get raw.

 

Man it feels like these four months are gonna be really really difficult. I guess the reality is I’ve already been going for about 100 days since I restarted this taper and while it has been brutal, I have survived. Only 125 days more to go and then however long it takes to heal once I’m off…… man I’m exhausted. On the plus side a chunk of today was nice. I was maybe 70% good. Felt nice. Got a little more difficult later in the afternoon though.

Things have been so tough with this taper that I haven’t really checked in on anyone else. How’s your taper going. Do you have much left. Is the way you’re feeling changing as you taper? Are you having any good days/times. Your persistence at this shows your strength!

[Thorin]

Man I’ve gotta come clean to someone. I’m really struggling to get through work and have been taking quite a few early days. This is not good but not something I can see how to fix at the moment. I’m genuinely pushing through to the best of my ability!

[Thorin]

Had a good window for a chunk of today. Sat outside and worked at my computer in the sun. Then the anxiety kicked in and what felt like trauma coming up. I guess it’s good to address these things and let the emotions out. Very painful though. Struggled through my son’s basketball game this evening. Talking to people. All the noise etc. But then I did something that was well out of my comfort zone and I felt a little better. Instead of letting the anxiety and withdrawal beat me I stared it down and felt stronger afterwards. Onwards and upwards!

[Thorin]

Whelp time to admit that I’m struggling too much at the moment and need some help getting off the last of the benzo. I found a clinic here in Australia that helps you taper slowly from home. 10% drops every 2-4 weeks which is the recommendation from the Benzo bible written by Heather Ashton. I’ll try their recommendation but will decide myself how I taper. You have a Telehealth (online) appointment every 1-2 weeks. They help you taper benzos and teach you the skills required to live without the drug. It’s run by psychologists not doctors. I could be wrong but I suspect the taper will be just as difficult as the water taper I’ve been doing but the support and new skills will hopefully be invaluable. I also booked back in with my regular therapist after a break of a good few months. Time to get this show on the road!

[littlebird]

51 minutes ago, Thorin said:

You have a Telehealth (online) appointment every 1-2 weeks. They help you taper benzos and teach you the skills required to live without the drug. It’s run by psychologists not doctors.

Dude, this is fantastic news! So glad you're getting some extra support with this. Well done you for reaching out, you're killing the taper.

[Thorin]

19 minutes ago, littlebird said:

Dude, this is fantastic news! So glad you're getting some extra support with this. Well done you for reaching out, you're killing the taper.

Thanks LB. I hope this extra support is enough to help me get across the finish line in a couple of months. All they do is help people of benzos. Their tapering method is appropriate as well. Sounds like they really know what they’re doing. I do I take tomorrow and will see how we go. How are you going?

[LotusRising]

For sure the last bit can be tough, but no doubt you will do it!

 

I'm intrigued by a clinic run by psychologists that helps only with benzos 🤔 It almost sounds too good to be true. Do psychologists prescribe medication in Australia?

 

How have you been tapering your benzo so far?

[Thorin]

4 hours ago, LotusRising said:

For sure the last bit can be tough, but no doubt you will do it!

 

I'm intrigued by a clinic run by psychologists that helps only with benzos 🤔 It almost sounds too good to be true. Do psychologists prescribe medication in Australia?

 

How have you been tapering your benzo so far?

I can absolutely do it. Just hit a stumbling block is all.

No, psychologists do not prescribe medication in Australia. But Drs and psychiatrists have no idea how to get off this stuff and having spoken to the manager of the place briefly they follow the Ashton Manual which is absolutely the best way to get off benzos. 
I started by dropping by quarter of a tablet under my doctor’s instruction. He had bridged me to clonazepam from Xanax. I later found out I should have been bridged to diazepam for the longer half life. The linear taper was too much (it would be for many people) so he told me maybe I need to stay on Benzos.useless. I’ve just removed 1/3 of my remaining dose using a water taper which I learned how to do online. I’ll either continue that or try the 10% drops every 2-4 weeks which this clinic recommends. That’s also what they recommend on here obviously. 10% a month. How did you taper? How was it for you?

[LotusRising]

11 minutes ago, Thorin said:

o he told me maybe I need to stay on Benzos.

 

What a ridiculous statement. Of course you don't need to stay on benzos 🤦‍♀️

 

Yes, psychiatrists, doctors etc. are grossly unaware about how to taper properly. It's unfortunate. I was direct switched from ativan to clonazepam by my GP at a dose that wasn't equivalent and I became destabilized really fast. I really didn't know anything about equivalencies etc. at the time and when my brain started working properly, it was sort of too late to try to turn it around. I guess I basically tapered in tolerance. It wasn't great. Fortunately, the psychiatrist I was assigned to allowed me to taper slowly and I switched over to a compounded liquid, which was uneventful.

 

Does this clinic only help with tapering benzos, or do they do other drugs as well? Just curious how it all works, since it seems one of a kind. 

[Thorin]

15 minutes ago, LotusRising said:

 

What a ridiculous statement. Of course you don't need to stay on benzos 🤦‍♀️

 

Yes, psychiatrists, doctors etc. are grossly unaware about how to taper properly. It's unfortunate. I was direct switched from ativan to clonazepam by my GP at a dose that wasn't equivalent and I became destabilized really fast. I really didn't know anything about equivalencies etc. at the time and when my brain started working properly, it was sort of too late to try to turn it around. I guess I basically tapered in tolerance. It wasn't great. Fortunately, the psychiatrist I was assigned to allowed me to taper slowly and I switched over to a compounded liquid, which was uneventful.

 

Does this clinic only help with tapering benzos, or do they do other drugs as well? Just curious how it all works, since it seems one of a kind. 

I’ve only just come to realise I was in tolerance for a good while before restarting my taper. Had some horrible symptoms but those ones are fading as I taper. 
 

Sorry for your experience. The medical world seems largely useless when it comes to deprescribing. If you don’t know how to help people off the drug then don’t use it!

 

You’re off Benzos completely now aren’t you? I may have asked but are you out the other side with regard to benzo recovery?

 

yes, Reconnexion only assist with benzos. That’s all they do. I’m not sure if their views on other psych meds yet. Hopefully find out today when they call.

[Thorin]

Phew, that’s a relief. I’ve been getting BIG morning cortisol spikes the last couple of days. Not too bad this morning and I feel moderately human. Somewhat fit for consumption. Feels like it will be an ok day.

[LotusRising]

1 hour ago, Thorin said:

You’re off Benzos completely now aren’t you? I may have asked but are you out the other side with regard to benzo recovery?

 

Completely off since April!

 

Yes, slowly seeing the other side. Some residual symptoms and a LOT of fatigue right now, but otherwise, functional and happy to be off. Just trying to take things slowly, which is rather difficult with two kiddos and a life, but I'll take this here right now, over what I was dealing with during my taper. So, it's all good and I can't complain  

 

Best of luck on the call!

[Thorin]

6 minutes ago, LotusRising said:

 

Completely off since April!

 

Yes, slowly seeing the other side. Some residual symptoms and a LOT of fatigue right now, but otherwise, functional and happy to be off. Just trying to take things slowly, which is rather difficult with two kiddos and a life, but I'll take this here right now, over what I was dealing with during my taper. So, it's all good and I can't complain  

 

Best of luck on the call!

That’s so good to hear and makes me happy! Those residual storks and fatigue will pass in time and you’ll be good as new! I hear you about kids and life. Two teenagers here and some sort of life going as well. Thanks 🙏🏻 

[Thorin]

I’ve decided to extend my hold until I improve. I am slowly improving day by day but it’s still outside my window of tolerance. Apparently withdrawal symptoms from clonazepam peak at day 17. I only switched out the morning dose for liquid 4 days ago and stopped tapering 16 days ago. My body needs a rest and it’s time to listen. I’m also going to try dropping by 5-10% every 2-4 weeks when I restart my taper rather than dropping a little every day. I can feel the withdrawals have slowly ramped up over time. Doing a cut and drop will give my body a rest every so often. May be a little gentler. Had my first intake with Reconnexion. They sounded very knowledgeable but apparently I have to have a second intake session to see whether I’ll receive the full service. Not sure I need the full service but it would likely make things easier.

[Thorin]

@LotusRising how was your anxiety during your taper? Phew! Mine’s big at times. How is your anxiety now you’re off? 

[LotusRising]

On 11/23/2023 at 8:45 PM, Thorin said:

how was your anxiety during your taper? Phew! Mine’s big at times. How is your anxiety now you’re off? 

My anxiety has been pretty good! It was off the charts right at the beginning, but since then most of my taper has been primarily physical symptoms. I'd say my symptoms still trigger my anxiety sometimes, but the anxiety itself is okay. 

 

What type of anxiety are you experiencing? I know it can look a little different for everyone.