Moonlitelotus: introduction/body zaps/questions

[Moonlitelotus]

Thank you pugknows!

 

Your words are helpful and reassuring. I needed it this morning so far because it's been kinda a rough morning. I have felt nauseated and my whole body aches. Going to take to take an Epsom bath soon.

 

I have already encountered some really wonderful people on here. I can't find that link on petunias thread to that story you are talking about. Is there anyway you could post it here? I would appreciate that.

 

Still haven't been able to eat much. I wish my appetite would come back. How long would two .5mg doses of prozac take to get out if the body. I know it has a long half life but I'm wondering with such tiny dose what it might be. I imagine its contributing to me still feeling sick.

[Moonlitelotus]

How long do people usually feel worse for after failed reinstatement? I'm still nauseated and have no appetite.

[Moonlitelotus]

I'm scared because I've started throwing up again. Is it good that I tapered 9 months before stopping my Meds? Even though it may have been too fast still. Does that give me a little better if a chance at a faster recovery? I'm feeling doomed right now that it's going to take me 7 years to recover. I feel even more doomed that I tried to reinstate. I was definitely better than I am now before I tried to do that. I feel so dumb.

[Pugknows]

Don't beat yourself up. You are healing as evidenced by your WD symptoms.

[Moonlitelotus]

I feel so sad about this mostly because my mom is so stressed out that this is something other than withdrawal. I keep trying to reassure her that it is just withdrawal and that I will get better. It will take time though and I have to stop stunting my progress by taking things to try and fix it. She just gets so upset to see me suffer and is worried and it makes me sad.

[Pugknows]

I know Moonlite. We moms love our kids and want to "fix" everything for them. She just can't this time. She can just be there to hug you and hold you.

[Moonlitelotus]

I wish science new more about this...I feel like I have the flu right now.. What do I do? This is from the prozac. Do I just have to ride it out? Is there any cause for concern? Have others had this happen?

[Babs]

There's nothing you can do but ride it out.  Our bodies are amazingly good at bouncing back when left alone to heal.  It's not doing you any good to keep worrying about whether you messed things up by reinstating, since you can't change that now.  Just focus on the future and your healing.  You'll get there.

[Moonlitelotus]

Are there any problems with taking Tylenol? I have a headache... I've got ice in the back of my neck and forehead

[Babs]

I think taking Tylenol would be fine.  I took pain relievers in withdrawal.

[Moonlitelotus]

Ok I feel achy and like a might have a fever so I'm just worried... I don't have a thermometer tho :/ probably should get one.

[Petunia]

 I can't find that link on petunias thread to that story you are talking about. Is there anyway you could post it here? I would appreciate that.

 

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=66397.0

[Moonlitelotus]

So very very happy to read that. Going to have my mom read it too. Thank you. It made me cry actually lol

[Moonlitelotus]

I have a mild fever 99.6.. My body aches I have a head ache and I'm nauseated. This started after taking prozac. The fact that a have a fever concerns me though.

[ladybug]

Lots of people experience experience flu like symptoms with WD, it's sometimes referred to as the "Paxil flu" but any drug can cause it. Of course, with the Paxil flu you won't have a high fever, but I guess it's possible to run a low grade fever with it. Normal body temp ranges are from 97-99 so you are only slightly above that.

[Moonlitelotus]

I just hope this stops soon. it is worrying me that I continue to throw up and have a fever. I guess it could be the regular flu but this started after taking prozac. Am I withdrawaling from the prozac I took? Taking a Tylenol helped I think. It brought the fever down and stopped the head ache and body aches. Still nauseated. I'm wondering if this is taking so long to stop this time than with trying lexapro because prozac has a long half life.

[Fresh]

Moonlite , it's most likely that this isn't going to stop soon.   You know that from reading other people's threads , and from the advice you've been given.

 

Settle in , it's a long ride.   

[Moonlitelotus]

I was not this sick before taking it!!! I'm feeling freaked out.

[Petunia]

Try this:

 

A calming guided breathing exercise for symptom acceptance

[Moonlitelotus]

Thank you.

[Moonlitelotus]

So today I feel slightly better. At least at the moment. I started my period on time. Which is a good thing because that means my hormones are regulated so I'm happy about that. I was having off periods for a few months. My last one was a 40 day cycle and this one was my regular 30. So hopefully that's a good sign of my body starting to figure some things out.

 

I have not felt as nauseated but still have had slight nausea today so far but right now it has subsided. Appetite is better but still not good but managing to keep things down.

 

Achiness has gone away and I don't feel feverish at the moment but temp is still 99.4. Was 98.1 when I woke up but I did just get out of a hot bath so raised temp is probably from that.

 

I have dizziness again that is coming and going. I can't wait for it to go again. I'm still feeling fatigued and out of it. These are some symptoms that have come back that originally went away or were going away. Dang it! Oh well they will go again..

 

My ears are ringing really loud at the moment. :/

 

I had a good long cry in the bath. Today is the anniversary of my dads death. It's been 9 years without him. Can't believe its been that long already.

[Moonlitelotus]

Does anyone have an idea as to why if you weaned off over 9 months and stabilized each time you dropped your dose why withdrawal still sets in when you stop the medication?

[JanCarol]

G'day Moonlite - 

 

I came here first to see what was going on before answering PM.

 

There's nearly always a delayed reaction before the hard stuff settles in.  Sometimes, it's as late as a year or two later!

 

Why the delayed reaction?  I was just PMing with a friend about this.  Stuart Shipko seems to think that it's situational - perhaps your miscarriage started the pains of withdrawal. (I saw that on the pregnancy thread)  Perhaps the memory of your father;s death and your loss of him is deepening the shadows for you.  There are all kinds of trauma that can throw you into a tailspin - being diss'd by a friend, dominated by a Mom, abused by a father or stepfather, rejected by a boyfriend, losing your home, your job - the list is endless.  But here's the thing:  you can ruminate and postulate all you want - you will never really know why.  

 

You may develop insights into how your behaviour REACTED to those traumas, but you will never know.  For example, because of experiences I had when I was 17, there is a certain type of man that induces panic and hatred in me.  Okay, the trauma helps me understand why I react that way, and gives me a bit of power over my reaction - BUT I CANNOT CHANGE WHAT HAPPENED.

 

You are still exhibiting signs of impatience.  I know that pain and suffering are not your gig, but that's true for everyone.  It's how we deal with the pain and suffering that make us what we are.

 

You are walking through a dark forest, of scary trees and hoot owls and coyotes, and your spine tingles with fear and every shadow seems to jump out on you.

 

If you identify with the forest, and say "I am the forest," it will get worse and worse until you think you are the forest, and never come out the other side.

 

If however, you realize, "this is the forest, I am NOT the forest, I am Moonlitelotus" then the shadows will amazingly become silly, and the dark trees and chilling coyote calls will seem less threatening.  And eventually, Moonlitelotus will see through the trees to the sky ahead (a window) and realize that even though there may be 10, 20, 100 valleys (waves) in between here and the clearing - eventually - you will come out of the clearing into the light of day.

 

All you really have is the path ahead of you.  I'm so thankful that you have stopped messing with your doses, that you are going to stay free of them.  Please stay the course and continue to hold, don't muck about.   Yes, you will still have symptoms for 3, 6, 9 months, a year, 2 years, or life.  But those symptoms will decrease over time.  Really they will - you are in the depths of that withdrawal forest right now - but you are not the forest.

 

Ruminating on "should I, would I, could I?" is only going to keep you in the forest longer.

 

Look here to learn about Rumination, and how it is self defeating:  (no I am not a Buddhist, nor do I play one on the internet - this was just a more accessible page than all that scholarly gobbledygook):  http://bidushi.com/mindfulness-meditation-stops-rumination-severe-danger-mental-health/

 

Off to see what you wrote to me about....JC

[JanCarol]

 

Moonlite wrote:  

I was reading about ways to help the brain repair itself and go into neurogenesis and in the article it said how antidepressants can create neurons and neurogenisis. But how is that the case when they down regulate receptors. I believe we are trying to unregulate the receptors by doing healthy things to rebuild the cells and induce neurogenesis. But it doesn't make sense to me that an antidepressant does this when they are obviously the reason we are in this in the first place. Seems like they do the opposite. I just thought that was interesting. Maybe misleading information. It also talked about infrared light therapy to stimulate neurogenesis. They use it for those with Alzheimer's. Has anyone ever tried that? 

 

Neurogenesis is not always your friend.  

 

It is neurogenesis which gives so many SSRI withdrawals an awful time.

 

It works like this (just read this tonight, in "Blaming the Brain" by Eliot Valenstein - a colleague of my Uncle) 

SSRI goes in, blocks receptors for serotonin

Serotonin has nowhere else to go - so floods the system, including the brain

Body says: whoa!  where's all this serotonin coming from?

Body self regulates by producing more serotonin.

 

In withdrawal, as the neurons regenerate, the system is still not regulated properly - so those new neurons are right sensitive.  Hence, the effects that all of us exoerience.

 

Think of baby neurons as baby snakes.  Terri Irwin (of Steve-O's Australia Zoo and mother of his children) says that baby snakes are the most dangerous.  Mature snakes, she says, are experienced, and know just how much venom to inject for desired effect on different animals.  But baby snake doesn't know this.  If baby snake feels threatened, it freaks out and bites and injects the WHOLE LOAD of venom.  Very deadly.

 

So your baby neurons are extra reactive, and have venoms of their own.  You need to take it gentle, take it slow, until those baby neurons are a little more experienced!

 

There - felt like a little storytelling tonight.  Hope it helps.

 

ps - I am not a scientist, but in a parallel universe, I am a mad scientist.  Bwaaa-haaa-haaaaa!

[Moonlitelotus]

Lol! I really love the baby snake analogy. AND I love Terri Irwin and Steve Irwin (RIP) I grew up watching them. Thank you for helping me to understand what is going on. So the body is up regulating and the baby neurons are maturing?

[Moonlitelotus]

I have a question about taking amino acids in the form of SUPER BALANCED NEUROTRANSMITTER COMPLEX supplement or Whey protein. According to studies about addiction the use of amino acid therapy greatly improved the recovery process. I would just like others opinion on this before I go buying whey protein or something:

[imac]

I have a question about taking amino acids in the form of SUPER BALANCED NEUROTRANSMITTER COMPLEX supplement or Whey protein. According to studies about addiction the use of amino acid therapy greatly improved the recovery process. I would just like others opinion on this before I go buying whey protein or something:

Oh God. Every time I have tried anything with amounts of amino acids ( other than straight food) it blew my brains out and set me back quite far. I had a pumpkin protein powder shake one at 2 years off ( i didn't think it would affect me) and it brought in all kinds of new brain symptoms and painful ones at that. This shake was from a health food store and had 17 amino acids in it.

Id be careful with trying new things this early in the game. The best thing would probably be to just eat healthy foods and maybe try an omega and magnesium. They seem to be what most can tolerate but Id be careful with the anino acids. They're all connected with neurotransmitters. And you have to understand that you don't have a normal persons brain right now so anything that would normally be VERY good for our neurotransmitters may actually be way too much for the chaos already happening.

[JanCarol]

Hey Moonlite - it is the policy of this forum to discourage "combination supplements" that have smatterings of this and that and the whole kitchen sink thrown in.  

 

NOTHING will stop the pain of withdrawal.  Fish oil and magnesium will help make it smoother.

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/36-king-of-supplements-omega-3-fatty-acids-fish-oil/

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1300-magnesium-natures-calcium-channel-blocker/

 

Aminos are a mixed bag of tricks, and should be approached as carefully as you would approach a psych med.  You don't want to disregulate what you are already trying to heal.  Tweaking your neurotransmitters with aminos is the same game.  YES, it can help if you get the RIGHT ones in the RIGHT quantities.  I take them under the care of an MD.  But there are rules - some should not be taken with others in an either / or fashion, and some of them are better in the morning and some are better at night.  There's a TON of homework you have to do even before you consider the FIRST one, much less a combination of them.  These combinations are made for the same reason psych drugs are made:  to market to people in pain and desperate to try anything.

 

And are you sure this is the time to experiment with your brain?  Keep it Simple, Keep It Slow, Keep it Stable.  

 

Wait.  Hold.  Cry, if you need to, scream if you must.  But don't change anything, other than to consider fish oil and magnesium - and even those - you may need to bring them in gradually to see how your system will tolerate them.  

 

Eat leafy greens and nuts and liver.  That will help, and be more stabilising than mucking about with aminos.

 

And learn about mindfulness, it is the best emotional regulation strategy available.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/5873-mindfulness-and-acceptance/

 

My favorite one on this page is "The Mindful Way Through Depression" with Jon Kabat-Zinn

Edited February 16, 2015 by cymbaltawithdrawal5600
fixed link

[Moonlitelotus]

I just thought maybe having a protein shake a day wouldn't hurt. I just read about amino IV therapy that they use for withdrawal from benzos and other drugs and it's had 80% success rate at helping people through withdrawal more smoothly and so I thought maybe having whey protein shakes wouldn't hurt. I didn't really want to take the supplement I was just curious about it. But I was interested in whey protein. Some people have said it helped them with withdrawal. Some of the same ingredients are in the nutritional shake from Costco I've been drinking and I've not felt great the last few days but definitely better and stronger. So I'm not sure if it's the nutritional shakes that are doing anything or just is what it is right now but nothing has been getting worse or feeling fried. In fact it seems each day has gotten better, still had an emotional bump yesterday but definitely better than last week. I have been drinking nutrition shakes with vitamins and minerals and some amino acids ( didn't know it had any aminos until I looked today) and I've been taking B12, I tolerate that fine. I've been doing epsom salt relaxation baths and meditations or sensory deprivation baths with completely dark no noise no nothing for an hour. I have been eating healthy too. Eating flax muffins for my omegas and eating fish and veggies and fruit. Not sure about taking fish oil again yet. So anyway I don't know if I should try whey or not or just stick to what I'm doing. But so far I don't seem to have sensitivity to what I'm doing now with vitamins, minerals, and what aminos there are. I think with what I have been doing it has helped my nervous system bounced back pretty fast after the prozac incident. I see improvement everyday from the day the prozac made me sick. I definitely feel stronger. I even had energy to dance around to music last night around the house. Lol. That was a good window.

[JanCarol]

Ah, dance!  That would feel good!

 

Pea Protein is richer in aminos than whey, with no dairy involved.  Some of us can't handle dairy.

 

Look on my thread for my "barley water recipe" - it's a gentle natural way to take enough aminos without throwing you into overload.  I originally started making it to heal my kidneys, but now I just like it, it is soothing.

[LoveandLight]

dancing sounds good! Glad your experiencing windows.

[Moonlitelotus]

I felt so close to normal today... It was awesome! I had a great day!

[Purplestars22]

Yay so happy for you on having a window. Definitely signs of improvement.

[Petunia]

Its great to hear you are feeling better Moonlight.  If what you're doing now is working, keep doing it, like JC wrote, don't change anything for now, the fact that you are having a window so soon is a good sign, I'm sure you will recover quickly if you keep taking care of yourself like you are now.

[imac]

I agree. If what you're doing is working, keep doing it. Just take things slow and don't change things up. You sound like you can tolerate a lot more than many of us can.

[Moonlitelotus]

Thank you! I'm really happy about it too. I kinda feel like the window started closing a little bit towards the end of today. I feel a little more out of it and fatigued again but I'm looking forward to the next window and I enjoyed having a break from the symptoms.