EdinburghGuy: Dilemma, tapering 10 years fluoxetine, dr wants me on venlafaxine

[Songbird]

17 hours ago, EdinburghGuy said:

I want to be healed, week 3 of prozac 20mg re-reinstatement, was thinking of waiting till 6 weeks to see if any improvement, if no improvement no idea what to do.

 

We all want to be healed, but unfortunately there is no quick fix.  It is usually best to stick with the same med, as switches can be very unpredictable.  The meds often don't cover for each other very well.  You have reported some improvement since reinstating Prozac.

 

I am wondering whether the zopiclone may be contributing to some of your problems.  If you took it for 2 weeks then stopped it suddenly, you may also be experiencing some withdrawal from that.  

[Altostrata]

On 5/11/2018 at 6:54 AM, EdinburghGuy said:

Bad anxiety and depression today. emailing Samaritins about suicidal thoughts. I don't think I can last months of this. Can't function or do anything without severe anxiety or depression (have some windows, but not good enough). When I see my dr they will tell me to change to another ssri. I was thinking lexapro might be safer than effexor. I want to be healed, week 3 of prozac 20mg re-reinstatement, was thinking of waiting till 6 weeks to see if any improvement, if no improvement no idea what to do. Maybe can't follow the advice here and have to listen to dr.

 

What time of day did you have anxiety? What times of day do you have windows? How's your sleep?

 

Please keep daily notes on paper about your symptoms, when you take your drugs, and their dosages.

 

You're not alone, everybody here wants uncomfortable symptoms to go away. Please read some of the Introductions topics to see what other people are going through.

 

This is a site for going off drugs. We don't treat people for depression, we leave it up to them to choose their method of self-care. Discussions about this can be found in

 

Non-drug techniques to cope with emotional symptoms

 

Dealing With Emotional Spirals

 

For those who are feeling desperate or suicidal

 

and other topics in the Symptoms and Self-Care forum.

 

We don't promise any immediate fixes. If you want someone to attempt to solve your problems with a drug, you should definitely listen to your doctor and deal with the ups and downs of a new drug or whatever.

 

[SkyBlue]

On 5/11/2018 at 8:54 AM, EdinburghGuy said:

Bad anxiety and depression today. emailing Samaritins about suicidal thoughts. I don't think I can last months of this. Can't function or do anything without severe anxiety or depression (have some windows, but not good enough). 

 

Hi EdinburghGuy,

I'm really glad you contacted Samaritans. 

Please try not to think of months. Think of hours. Minutes. I know it's hard. You are not alone. We are here.

[EdinburghGuy]

Update:

Looks like I've pretty much stabilized so far on 20mg - for the meantime anyway - have night sweats and bit of anxiety in the morning 6am but tends to go quickly. Have bits of anxiety during the day but doesn't bother me so much, I can function. My life isn't very stressful though at the moment, not sure how I’d be with lots of stress.

 

Also take 3 fish oil, magnesium, and started vitamin d. 

 

I am always hungry though and pee a lot. I have my sexual function back but with a bit of sexual anadonia (not a lot of feeling in head when orgasm) - Glad I can have sex again though. Headaches and dehydration but not as bad. Hard to cry too. This is probably side effects from Prozac.

 

I have problems with weight, really want to lose weight, but Prozac is probably stopping it happening for now. Which is really de-motivating. Don’t want to put on weight, but it could happen no I am back on the drug.

The re-instating did seem to work and I am not in hell for the time being which is good.

I had huge problems with motivation and energy at 40mg (before I withdrew), seems a little better at 20mg at the moment, but not sure if it will get worse over time.

 

I'm glad I have avoided effexor and benzo hell for now but still very worried about the future. 35, with parents and lost my job, single. Can't afford to go through that hell again, lost my job in the process.

 

I am really shocked and scared of this drug now and want to do a long slow tapper as suggested on this site asap - maybe not completely off until I am ready, but trying lower doses to see how I feel (very scared of PSSD so not sure when/if I can fully go off the drug) - but want to at least try 18mg and see how I feel, maybe 15mg etc.

Will see my Psychiatrist in middle of the month. Want to tapper to 18mg after seeing him. I’ll ask for two liquid Prozac 10mg – he might refuse. If so I might need to do it the open capsule method. You think this will be ok to do, any problems you could guess?

 

 

[Rosetta]

Hi, Edinburgh Guy,

 

That is fantastic news.  You are very fortunate.  You may find that your nervous system has recovered quite nicely.  Now is not the time to make any changes.  I think the Mods will recommend that you hold steady for a few months on 20 mg to let your brain and nervous system have a break.  Reducing your Prozac dose right now isn't advisable.  What appears to happen to some people is that they recover from the first change rather quickly, but subsequent changes destabilize the nervous system severely. Holding steady can help you avoid that.  The addition of magnesium and fish oil are considered changes, too.  Vitamin D might be one change too many, but hopefully it won't be.  I'm glad to hear you have very little stress.  You may find that if you are careful,  you will be working and independent in the near future.  I hope so!

 

Peace, Rosetta

[Gridley]

Edinburgh guy,

 

Excellent news!

 

Rosetta's advice is spot-on.  Hold at 20mg for several months and give your system time to rest and stabilize.  Don't attempt any further tapers at this time.

[EdinburghGuy]

OK, even though I really want off this stuff I guess I should wait to be safe. I will do CBT and occupational therapy in coming months and more research. Really worried now what this stuff is doing to my body but maybe don't have a choice. 

 

When you say several months - like 3 months? 6 months? 

[Rosetta]

If I were you I would make that decision down the road.  I assume you are going to get a job and then later move to your own place.  You would not want to taper until a few months after the job started.  That's a change that stresses the nervous system.  Then the move -- another change.  So, once you have life changes made and you feel settled you may decide you want to hold a bit longer to take a break.  The closer the life change to the beginning of the taper, the higher the risk of developing symptoms.  

 

This is isn't what you want to hear, I know.  However, to avoid being caught in a cycle of continuing symptoms, you will have to be patient.  Being off the drug is not as important as being stable and keeping a job so that you can feel good and centered when you begin the taper.  During the taper things will come up in life that are unavoidable.  So, starting from a position of strength is key.  All my opinions based what I've seen and experienced.  

[EdinburghGuy]

Yeah thanks. Will see how it goes. I wanted to get this out of the way while I am at my parents and no job stresses etc. but tappering seems to be a long process so can't have it that way. 

 

...and thanks for your help  , glad I avoided effexor for now. but still not out the woods, will need your help during taper etc. Will try and do more research and be in touch on the site. 

 

 

[EdinburghGuy]

I'll try and help people too like you  we need to help each other through this horrible situation. I just need to figure myself out first, what is happening, still have a lot of confusion as regards to 'relapse vs withdrawal'. Anyway, hope people can find peace.

[Gridley]

These two links give information of relapse vs. withdrawal.  Since doctors don't believe in withdrawal, they will generally attribute symptoms to relapse or "return of the underlying condition."

 

This post and Is it withdrawal or relapse?

 

[EdinburghGuy]

Thanks, had bad sleep last night and anxiety this morning. Thinking about the meds increases my anxiety. 

 

The weight gain, constant hunger and peeing is really bothering me. Other people on review sites switch anitdepressants and have success. I want off these drugs but don't want to continually suffer bad Prozac side effects and not function. Anyway still not out the woods, but not as bad as I was. Also still not motivated and depressive thoughts.

 

Anyway, will try and update if things change.

 

 

[Songbird]

It's great to see the improvements you're having, that's a really good sign.  I would stay consistent for at least two months, and then see how you feel.  I know it's hard to be patient, but it will be worth it to get more stability.

[EdinburghGuy]

Good window tonight, have some evenings and nights when I feel good. But then get the 4am morning cortisol and have crap mornings and afternoon, but not as bad as it was. Desperately want off these drugs though. When I was off prozac I cried. It felt good even with the wd symtoms, like I was processing the pain, greiving properly. Now back on Prozac I can't cry and have more anger. Feels like it is trapped inside me if that makes sense. Plus weight gain is a big problem, don't want to gain the weight I lost when I was off the drug.

 

I wish I listened to you and tried 10mg (or smaller) first :(  -  I am guessing going down to 10mg from 20mg is not recommended. Here is all about the 10% tapper right? Has anyone gone down from 20mg to 10mg and held for some time after reinstating? Just thinking it over but probably bad idea. Trying to figure out if it is a risk worth taking. Just wish the dose wasn't so high.

 

I guess I must learn patience.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Songbird]

I get where you're coming from, but the reason we say to stick with one dose for a good while, is because every change in dose causes instability in your system as it has to rebalance everything to cope with the change.  When you stick with one dose consistently, the body is able to adapt and make the changes it needs to stabilise.

 

Here is a good topic about keeping things as stable as possible: The rule of 3KIS keep it simple keep it slow keep it stable

 

The best way to taper is to get stable first, and only then begin to make very small dose reductions.  If you are not stable and make a dose reduction it is only going to further destabilise your system resulting in worse symptoms - then possibly another updose to try to alleviate them, so it ends up taking longer anyway.  It's like the old story about the turtle and the hare - the slow and steady turtle wins the race.

 

Please could you add start and stop dates to your signature including month and year (look at my signature and Gridley's for examples) - thanks.

Edited June 4, 2018 by Songbird

[EdinburghGuy]

I need to get more organized to deal with this hell. Will write a better signature soon.

 

At night I feel more normal, I even could cry a bit last night. I have had huge anger after taking prozac thoug,. I will get headaches and a rush of anger after Prozac. I think this might not be withdrawal, maybe my dose is too high or grief coming through - I don't know. Really want to go down to 10mg and hold, but still trying to figure stuff out. Will probably do the 10% method at some point. Seeing psychiatrist tomorrow, will refuse meds he offers, want to ask for the liquid Prozac and info on disability allowance (if I am applicable). I want some time to focus and get off this hell drug (if I can). He'll probably be useless but will see how it goes.

[EdinburghGuy]

I guess he'll say to at least go to 40mg, but I hated the fatigue at 40mg. Still have suicidal thoughts everyday. I guess I am not in the place to taper at the moment, just should give my body a rest. Learn acceptance etc. Educate myself more. At least nights I feel quite normal at the moment. Anyway will update after I see Dr and probaly be quiet for a while.

[EdinburghGuy]

Spent ages arguing with Psychiatrist, wants me on sertraline. I am not functioning, suicidal etc. Family and another psychiatrist want me on new meds. Think I give up, if i die i die. This hell is too much, strangers on the net say one thing, professionals say another. It is just tearing me apart. I can't live like this.

 

He said I stop prozac and just switch to sertraline, will get stomach upset first few weeks, it is safe it has been given to pregnant women apparently.

[Rosetta]

Yes, given to pregnant women -- safe then?  Nope.

 

This is not "some people on the Internet" telling you that you are dependent on Prozac and in WD.  Some doctors believe and know this is true -- very few -- at this point, but a few do.  Dr Glenmullen is one.  Alto doesn't make up her opinions.  She has researched this problem for at least 8 years, maybe 10 or more.  She is in contact with real doctors who care enough about this problem to help her understand it and some doctors even refer their patients to Survivingantidepressants!! 

 

The truth about ADs is starting to come out.  There was an article in the New York Times recently acknowledging AD withdrawal.  In 10 years or so, your doctor will know about it.  Please do not let the fact that he is ignorant ruin the next 10 years of your life!!

 

The truth is you won't die.  You will live in misery for far too long, but you won't die.  The only way to shorten your misery is to stay on Prozac until you stabilize.  I am finally stabilizing (I didn't reinstate; it was too late for me when I found SA.). It has taken me far longer to stabilize than it will take you, I'm sure, IF you stay with Prozac.  Prozac is just as "safe" as sertraline, in fact, safer according to the scientists.  Prozac is the only AD drug approved for children and the elderly in the US, I believe.  Sertraline is probably more dangerous.

 

 I understand your feeling of confusion and your frustration with a doctor who insists switching is the best, but being switched is what caused me to get sicker.  See my signature?  I was switched the night my baby was born -- TO sertraline.   The baby had Celexa (citalopram) during the whole pregnancy.  So did I.  We both went into WD after her birth.  That was 7 years ago.  It took me over 5 years to figure out what was wrong with me and commit to the solution.  

 

Aside from the fact that I hold out hope that my child is better off because I breast fed her with sertraline instead of Celexa, the switch from Celexa was the beginning of a disaster for both of us.  I was already struggling with some form of WD before I got pregnant.  That was caused by missing doses and running out of pills.  I was not in the hell that you are in yet.  You are not yet in the hell that you will be in if you make the wrong decision right now.

 

The thing that really hurt me was that switch of AD because the sertraline didn't "work."  It didn't work because I needed Celexa.  I was dependent on Celexa.  Sertraline is NOT Celexa, (and it's not Prozac.)  So, I was in WD while on the sertraline.  These drugs are NOT interchangeable.  I kept getting sicker mostly with anxiety and so, the doctor raised the dose of sertraline over and over.  With each increase I became sicker.  It's called kindling.  Each increase further destabilized my nervous system.  I could have eventually stabilized on Sertraline if the dose had been left at 10 mg, but the doctor didn't know about WD.  (Instead the doctor added a benzo, and I had a reaction to it.  I'm lucky for that because it made me stop the benzo before I was addicted.). Your doctor doesn't know about AD WD either. Again, I wasn't completely destabilized the way you are.  I had a chance to avoid the severe illness at that point if my doctor had any idea what he was doing.  He didn't.  Neither does yours.

 

What MOST doctors don't know is that ADs are just as dangerous as benzos when it comes to withdrawal.  The same destabilization caused by benzo WD happens to some AD users when they quit.  The First treatment is reinstatement of the correct AD and waiting for the destabilization to correct itself.    (Doctors have known about benzo WD for a very, very long time, but the pharma companies have pretended that the new benzos "aren't as addictive."  They are still very, very addictive.  We are now finding out that ADs are, too.  Doctors aren't doctors these days.  The are just technicians prescribing what the pharm companies tell them to prescribe.  The pharm comoanies leave it to the doctors to clean up the mess and the doctors don't bother to prevent or correct the results of their mistakes.  Your doctor is making an enormous mistake!

 

I really hope you will spare yourself the suffering of switching from Prozac.  I really do.  You need to be firm with your doctor, EdinburgGuy.  You can't let him do this to you.  

 

There are several books about AD WD.  There's a lot of info on this site if you want to give yourself the chance to believe what is here.  I can't give you links, but maybe someone else will.  There's a thread on books, a thread on kindling, a thread on doctors who know about AD WD.  If you can read it, you will come to believe what I say here.

 

If you are too overwhelmed to read it all, you can just trust the people here or you can trust your doctor.  When you say "if I die, I die," that tells me you don't trust your doctor.  I'm sorry you are in this position.  I've been there; I am there.  It's awful.  Please don't give up and make it even more awful.  You can get through this, but you have to fight.  You have to insist that your doctor, or SOME doctor, give you Prozac in order to avoid even more severe destabilization.  You are too ill right now to make another change to your medication.  I hope someone will give you a link on the harm of changes to a destabilized nervous system.

 

Peace, Rosetta

[EdinburghGuy]

I've had two psychiatrists (one close to my family) tell me to take new medicine (one said going back on original dose too as an option). This conflicting information is driving me crazy, tearing me apart. I am ill and want to get better and in this constant state of uncertainty. I hate these drugs now. but need to get on with my life and can't get more sick. This dilemma of who to believe is causing so much anxiety in me now.

 

People online switch and be ok? They find the right meds that suit them. 

I don't want to be on meds, but i don't want to suffer and go through hell - there isn't lots of success stories. Benzo withdrawal seems more establish and understood, ssri's seems so confusing to me a the moment.

 

There is so much false info online, putting my trust in it seems crazy but I have been doing it up till this point. Don't know what to do now.

 

Psychiatrist think after 5 months of being ok that it isn't withdrawal. that  really sucks. I am on 20mg proac which is a therapeutic dose, it makes sense i feel better if I had a relapse. yet I am not well enough to feel 'normal'.

The chance of getting new side effects is what is keeping me away from new drugs esp. pssd, sexual disfucntion. At the moment.

Also the dr offered me effexor which seems like a hell drug that makes me suspicious of them now. 

 

Heart is broke.

 

I knew a woman who was scared to take medicine, thyroid medicine, she didn't take it, had a stroke and was disabled and in a home the rest of her life. I could get really ill taking new drug, I could get really ill and keep suffering not taking the drug.

 

Such a **** scary decision to make.

 

 

 

[Songbird]

On 6/2/2018 at 3:34 AM, EdinburghGuy said:

Looks like I've pretty much stabilized so far on 20mg - for the meantime anyway - have night sweats and bit of anxiety in the morning 6am but tends to go quickly. Have bits of anxiety during the day but doesn't bother me so much, I can function.

 

On 6/2/2018 at 5:11 PM, EdinburghGuy said:

Anyway still not out the woods, but not as bad as I was.

 

On 6/4/2018 at 8:46 AM, EdinburghGuy said:

Good window tonight, have some evenings and nights when I feel good. But then get the 4am morning cortisol and have crap mornings and afternoon, but not as bad as it was. 

 

On 6/7/2018 at 9:34 PM, EdinburghGuy said:

At night I feel more normal, I even could cry a bit last night.

 

On 6/8/2018 at 5:30 AM, EdinburghGuy said:

At least nights I feel quite normal at the moment. 

 

It looks like you've had some improvements and good windows since reinstating.  Has your anxiety improved over the past few weeks?  What symptoms are you having now and how do they compare to when you first reinstated?

 

 

[EdinburghGuy]

When I first started it was hell, Panic all the time, and when no panic really bad depression, like concrete in my head, very suicidal, starting prozac upped the anxiety. I would walk and find it difficult, like being pulled to the ground, anxiety rushing through body. couldn' stop shaking and trembling. Huge corisol mornings that were keeping me up all night apart from an hour or so. plus lots of night sweats. 

 

Anxiety has improved but still not at a normal, functioning level.

 

Now I still have cortisol mornings night sweats etc. and wake up at 12 or 2, but can go back to sleep and wake up at 5, yesterday was up till 2 -5, but slept, 6 till 9ish.

 

Depression is not as severe as the start, but get waves, usually better at evenings, same with anxiety. depression has improved the most probably, not so concrete in head. but anxiety still bad.

Get headaches, sometimes water or sugar help it.

 

Had really bad temperature fluctuations, this seems better on prozac.

 

less suicidal.

 

The worse is the mornings, psychiatrist says that is classic with depression, times of the day etc.

 

When off drugs hard to get errection etc. back on prozac it has come back.

 

Any stress, esp. regarding meds sends me into very anxious state.

 

Dr thinks it is agitated depression. Never been this bad my whole life. I don't have a clue if it is relapse or withdrawal or both. I hate the drugs but hate suffering too. 

 

Some evenings can have windows of quite normal and happy/relaxed.

 

Need to pee a lot, when I pee it is hard to go, urge to pee a lot.

Hungry all the time since starting prozac.

 

I am so stressed and anxious most of the day still. Trying to calm myself all day. Everything is very stressful. Can't function well. no motivation to do anything because situation is so bad, lye in bed most of the time or go for a walk.

I don't want to take any more drugs, but I don't see any other way to improve but waiting / time or taking new drug. Either options might not work or make me worse.

 

The cortisol mornings is the main thing that screws me up. I use eye mask and some binaural beats apps to help me sleep.

 

Take fish oil, magnesium and vit c (stopped d)

 

[Songbird]

Psychiatrists think five months off is too late for withdrawal and so call it "relapse".  It is true that withdrawal symptoms usually show up within the first few weeks, but it is not uncommon for it to happen several months down the track.  We've seen it here many times.  Relapse does sound a plausible explanation for people whose original symptoms return, but many people experience many new symptoms that they never had before and even the original symptoms may be much more severe.  If you are getting symptoms you didn't have before the AD, it's very likely withdrawal rather than relapse.

 

Psychiatrists are often switching people from one med to another trying to find the "right" one.  This just confuses the system even further as you end up with withdrawal from the original drug plus start-up effects of the new drug and it's hard to tell what is causing what.  These drugs do not seem to cover for each other very well.  The original drug usually works the best for withdrawal because that's the one your body got used to.  You are right to be wary of Effexor - the SNRIs (Effexor, Pristiq, Cymbalta) are worse than SSRIs - they have short half-lives, and are difficult to taper.

 

It sounds like the 20mg Prozac has helped significantly to ease withdrawal symptoms so far.  It's possible you may get some more improvement in time.  Waves and windows are to be expected during the process.  Here is a topic about the "cortisol mornings": waking with panic or anxiety managing cortisol spikes

 

Did you check out the topic about Dr. Claire Weekes?  I highly recommend her books and audio recordings for dealing with anxiety.

 

Another thing you might try is relaxation exercises.  These can help to reduce anxiety by calming the nervous system.  You could try progressive muscle relaxation, gentle yoga, meditation, guided visualisation, calming breathing exercises, or whatever kind of relaxation exercise works for you.  I like to use recordings with relaxing music and an instructor's calming voice telling me what to do, so I can just follow the instructions and not have to think about it too hard.  Whenever I have a patch of very bad anxiety I do the exercises two or three times a day for a while.  The idea is to calm down the "fight-or-flight response" (sympathetic nervous system) and stimulate the "relaxation response" (parasympathetic nervous system).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[EdinburghGuy]

I'm just caught in a limbo right now, no idea what to do. Not working, not doing anything, just in my room worrying. I can't remember me before taking prozac, all I know I have never had depression this bad before. I know if i didn't get put on this crap maybe my life wouldn't be ruined.

The Sertraline could help (says the dr). but I'd be stuck on this evil crap even longer. But there are no good success stories from coming off meds, it just sounds like 4 years-ish of hell and not being normal again.

 

People who have recovered really should speak out more.

 I find it all too much to take. Rock and hard place. Thought of death in my head everyday now, like I'm screwed either way.

 

I need to get on with my life, don't know how. 

 

Wish I had a plan, wish I could just feel normal.

[Rosetta]

Ok, the idea that its 4 years of Hell is a misconception.  That is true for very few people, but those people tend to be active here at SA longer.  This place becomes a wonderful source of support for them.  The number of people who come and go with short WD periods can't be known definitively because they disappear.  Very few of them make strong connections here, and even if they do, they start to live life again.  SA isn't as important to them.  I began to have that misconception that I would be sick for 4 years, too, and I worried myself sick about it, but at about 16 months I'm living my life.  I'm not in Hell everyday by any means.  It does take time to get well, and if you can find a way to pass that time that is good for you its less awful.  

 

I believe that taking a walk everyday was a good thing for me.  You are doing that.

 

Are you you sleeping all right?  You don't mention an issue with sleep.  If you are sleeping more or less all right, you are lucky.  I think that will help you heal faster.  If your sleep does start to be a problem don't worry because it will get better again.  

 

You have the fish oil on board.  If its been a couple of weeks since you started, I would start adding a little magnesium.  A little more after a week, and eventually try to get up to 400 to 500 mg very slowly.  I can't take more than about 300, but some people tolerate more.  It causes loose stools.  If you have that problem back off.  I take small amounts at a time all through the day and that allows me to take more.  Sometimes, I take Epsom salts baths.

 

Anxiety and cortisol spikes are a big problem for me, but the anxiety is much less than it used to be and the cortisol spikes fewer.  I can function now almost everyday.  I believe a lot of my anxiety is caused by low blood sugar.  You should try eating protein for every meal and snacks between meals.  Treat yourself like a toddler -- breakfast -snack - lunch -snack - dinner - snack before bed (protein).  Adding extra protein seemed to help especially before bed and first thing in the morning.  Having some cheese or meat in the middle of the night and the same as soon as I woke up helped.

 

You are bored, you are lonely, you have nothing to do.  I understand completely.  This is going to be difficult, but you can do it.  It's a waiting game.  At least you have the reinstatement.  That should help you get stable faster than 16 months.  You will be able to live life much sooner than I.

 

Try to find books in series.  Adolescent fiction is fine.  Sci-fi worked for me.  Read them outside in the sunlight.  Find TV shows for after dark.  Watch old movies.  See if your parents will play board games with you.  Maybe learn to play an instrument from YouTube.  I learned to play violin early in WD.  Going to practice soothed my anxiety and focused my mind.  The Suzuki method is good.  You can order the books online and the CDs, too.  (You only need the CDs when you get to the harder pieces at the end of book one. You can google and listen to the rest on YouTube.)  Maybe violin isn't your idea of fun.  So, try guitar or maybe you have a piano?  You can do this from home; you don't have to get to a lesson or pay for them.  At least listen to music.  It's good for the brain.  

 

I want you to know that many, many people are reasonably functioning at the one year, 1.5 to 2 year mark and a lot of them much, much sooner.  Even if functioning every day isn't possible that horrible anxiety lessens and becomes intermittent.  For some its just a few months!!  It does not matter how long they took the drugs, how they quit them, how old they are, which drug -- there no correlation between healing time and those factors that can be found.  It's sad that people get so down about the long term sufferers because they are outliers and making yourself miserable now for something that may never happen to you is a waste.

 

Yes, this is all easy for me to say because I'm not a nervous wreck today.  I don't feel awful right now.  It's very hard to wrap one's brain around positive thoughts when in your condition, but reading that someone got much better only 16 months after stopping meds without reinstatement should help you the way it did me.  I hope so.  With reinstatement you should be better off than I have been.  

 

Being in limbo is really, really hard.  And you are right - no depression is so deep as this post SSRI cessation depression!  It's much, much worse than before I started Celexa.  I never had recurring, daily, thoughts of death for weeks and weeks prior to Celexa.  Never.  But it will go away.  You are going to get your life back.  You will work.  You will go out.  You will have friends.  You will live again!  Right now, you need to take care of yourself like you would a baby.  Feed yourself, let yourself sleep when you need to, and calm yourself.  Let yourself cry, and do not feel bad about it.  You have had an injury to the brain.  Thank goodness the brain is one organ that can heal itself if you don't interfere and re-injure it.

 

Now, plan to have a good breakfast and go for a walk tomorrow.  Buy some books or a Kindle, and try those calming exercises that Songbird suggested.  You can do this!

[EdinburghGuy]

Thanks for your post. Sorry I am torn, but I think you can understand. Its a horrible place to be.

 

The options I seem to be presented with:

·         Stay at 20mg Prozac for a while and see if things get better. Once I feel ready later tapper slowly.

·         Dr suggests: go on Sertraline as Prozac has stopped working (not as effective) – can tapper off properly later.

·         Go back up to 40mg – which cuased lots of fatigue

·         Trying halfing to 10mg (not recommended by anyone, something i think about sometimes, probably stupid, but don’t know if Prozac causes more agitation in me sometimes)

·         Suicide

 

I don’t know. Prozac causes weight gain for me (which dr doesn’t believe). I have bouts of peeing a lot too, hunger, anger, - it might mess with gluclose, my dad is diabetic and I don’t want to become one.

Sleep and the morning are the worse. I sleep till 2 / 3 ish and wake up. Sometimes can sleep again, sometimes not.  I do sleep better since re-instating, can relax at times which i couldn’t before.

Mornings are hell though. Messes me up most of the day.

Evenings are usually better.

I don’t know if I am strong enough for this, Just think about ending it every day.

 

If dr is right - Maybe sertraline will be a better fit for me, and then tapper off slowly later

If you guys are right it could mess me up even further.

 

Anyway, I am stuck now. I just can't make a decision and it drives me nuts. Plus it is causing pain to my elderly parents.

I have stayed away from new drugs as hate them, plus scared of new side effects, plus scared of it making me worse, plus will probably need to get off them in the future.

But don't know if this approach is just hurting me. If the drug works I could get on with my life and tapper very slowly later when I am strong enough.

 

Anyway,  might be quiet for a while, watching comedy show I like, don't read books really. Walking helps, but some days like today just hide in my room.

Thanks for your time.

 

[Rosetta]

I do understand.  I didn't believe the advice on this site right off the bat either.  I was afraid to reinstate, and so I had the time to read and understand the information about how ADWD affects the nervous system.  It is all true.  I am recovering.  I could have tried reinstatement and been hurt by it.  You did it, and you haven't been hurt by it as far as I can see.  If you are sleeping better that's a very encouraging sign that the reinstatement was a good idea.  If you can relax at all you are in better shape than I was in the same amount of time after stopping the AD.  

 

I don't think that Prozac has "stopped working."  You stopped it and you threw your body into destabilization.  Your doctor is very poorly informed, but that's not unusual for doctors these days.  Please look around the site.  Peruse my thread and find the parts that talk about what destabilization means and how it causes symptoms.  There are some links there to the parts of the site that explain destabilization.  You owe it to yourself to at least try to understand what the curators of this site say about WD before you take any option other than holding at 20 mg Prozac.  You owe it to your parents.  

 

You don't have children.  So, I don't expect you to understand how off the charts devastating your suicide would be to them, but take it from me, it would destroy them.  There is nothing at all like the death of a child.  I'm sure of it although I haven't experienced it myself.  I simply know how my love for my child is unlike anything I have ever felt in my life.  You have their support.  They may not know what to do beyond that, but you have the space and time to heal.  Take it.  If not for you then for them.  Just wait this out for several weeks, several months and see where you are then.  You will be better.  And you will come to the point at which you know that you can't do that to yourself.  For now, just wait.  Give your parents some more time to support you while you heal.  Eventually, you will realize that you did the right thing and that you are healing.  Until then just hold on for dear life.  You can do it; your are stronger than you know.

[Altostrata]

On 6/7/2018 at 2:34 AM, EdinburghGuy said:

....

At night I feel more normal, I even could cry a bit last night. I have had huge anger after taking prozac thoug,. I will get headaches and a rush of anger after Prozac. ....

 

How often do you get these headaches? What time of day do you take Prozac? How's your sleep? What is your daily symptom pattern? Please keep daily notes on paper about your symptoms, when you take your drugs, and their dosages.

 

Also, please put the date you reinstated 20mg Prozac in your signature.

 

On 6/8/2018 at 5:47 AM, EdinburghGuy said:

Spent ages arguing with Psychiatrist, wants me on sertraline. I am not functioning, suicidal etc. Family and another psychiatrist want me on new meds. Think I give up, if i die i die. This hell is too much, strangers on the net say one thing, professionals say another. It is just tearing me apart. I can't live like this.

 

He said I stop prozac and just switch to sertraline, will get stomach upset first few weeks, it is safe it has been given to pregnant women apparently.

 

Yes, we do suffer from being peer support versus your psychiatrist's degrees. We try to back up our suggestions with common sense and references to scientific findings.

 

It's unfortunate that physicians know so little about getting people off these drugs and people have to find help on the Internet, but there you go. We wouldn't be doing this if we didn't think it was important -- it's a heck of a lot of unpaid work!!

 

You have to decide for yourself which way you want to go.

[EdinburghGuy]

sorry i cant take this anymore. again hell morning. taking the sertraline. You can't help me. Dr can't help me. The contradictory information is hurting me more than the anxiety. I can't take it anymore. I will take the sertraline as Prozac is just as evil. if I get worse I'll take my own life.

[EdinburghGuy]

I will get no help, no support if i just keep refusing the dr's advice. If I get more ill at least I know the truth. I can't live like this.

[Songbird]

31 minutes ago, EdinburghGuy said:

I will get no help, no support if i just keep refusing the dr's advice. If I get more ill at least I know the truth. I can't live like this.

 

I'm sorry you're under such pressure to switch meds.  We usually say to stick with the same med because that's the one your body has got used to, and we don't recommend switching because it's very unpredictable whether a switch will work or not.  If you do have to switch, you may be lucky, as some people do manage to switch okay.  Be aware that all changes are destabilizing, and it's possible you might feel worse for a while.  Your body needs time to adapt after any change.  That doesn't mean you won't eventually stabilise.  Whichever decision you make, you need to be patient and give your body the time it needs.

[EdinburghGuy]

I took one ******* sertraline tablet and i can't get it up. Am I going mad? I can't take this. this is too much..

[EdinburghGuy]

I had pssd when i stopped prozac, got it back when re-instated, i take one sertraline tablet and find it difficult to get it up and feels weird. **** this, i think ill go back on prozac. this is a nightmare! Maybe I am crazy. I don't know.

 

[Songbird]

You are not crazy.  Please try to calm down - take some slow deep breaths.  What was your doctor's plan for switching from Prozac to sertraline?  What dose of sertraline did you take and when?

[EdinburghGuy]

straight onto 50, no tappering just switch, my groin feels more numb and can't get it up. **** i don't need this. Think AI'll go back to prozac, **** that dr. When I first took prozac my sex came back. This is pure hell.

[EdinburghGuy]

I took it in the morning, not sure about 7, it is 12 now