Tapertrauma: Prozac Tapering withdrawal symptons

[getofflex]

Previous post moved to your intro topic to keep your history all in one place.  Please post questions and discussion about your situation in this one thread, to avoid confusion and duplication of efforts.  Thank you.  

 

I found your taper details in a prior post.  I'll take the liberty of adding this to your signature. 

 

1 hour ago, Tapertrauma said:

In the interim O was prescribed two other ADs for short periods and withdrew from them just as quickly. 

What were these AD's, and when was this? We need to see all your drugs in your drug history.  

 

Have you been drinking any alcohol?  Have you had any other mood altering substances?  Have you added or subtracted any other drugs or supplements? Has there been significant stressors, changes in diet, vaccines, illnesses or injuries, or anything else unusual?  

 

Edited November 29, 2023 by getofflex

[Tapertrauma]

Hiya

 

I have updated my signature, as far as I can remember. I haven't seen my GP for over 12 months so I can't check with him. I keep making appointments and then cancelling them as I'm not sure he would be of any help. He has said he hadn't heard of anyone having trouble coming off Prozac due to its half-life. Last time I spoke to him he said I could either go  back on the Prozac @ 20mg or stop completely and put up with the side effects which he said would last 2 weeks!! I have asked my neighbour who is also a GP and she had little knowledge of withdrawal either - except to say that living in the beautiful countryside would help with withdrawal.

 

I don't drink any alcohol at all - I haven't had a drink for over 20 years and I don't use any other substances. Over the last month, I have started to take magnesium and flax seed oil.

 

I am trying so hard to stay positive - I am lucky in that I sleep quite well and I really try to eat well and get some light exercise. But when I feel so poorly so much of the time, I find myself feeling so low and very very sad and can't see a light at the end of the tunnel

[Angus]

@Tapertrauma I’m so sorry that you are still feeling badly. I’m sure it’s very frustrating - I can relate to not feeling well even though each journey is individual. I trust that even though it doesn’t seem possible at times, healing is happening and you will have better days. Take care.🌸

Angus

[Tapertrauma]

Hi Angus,

Thank you for coming back to me. I really appreciate your support. Today has been awful and I've had a long cry. 

 

You're right in that healing must be happening, despite feeling so bad at the moment! 

 

Hope you're feeling ok at the moment; best regards.

[Poppy745]

19 minutes ago, Tapertrauma said:

Hi Angus,

Thank you for coming back to me. I really appreciate your support. Today has been awful and I've had a long cry. 

 

You're right in that healing must be happening, despite feeling so bad at the moment! 

 

Hope you're feeling ok at the moment; best regards.

Hi @Tapertrauma I am so sorry you feel so awful. If it helps I feel awful too and really wish I could cry, but have not been able to since WD started. I believe that healing is happening. I guess that is why sometimes we feel okish, sometimes not. I send you much strength!! We can do this. 💛

[Tapertrauma]

Hi Poppy745

 

Thank you so much for coming back to me.

I do hope we are healing; but it's so hard when you're feeling so bad.

 

Hang on in there. 

 

Best Regards

[Angus]

@Tapertrauma I was also thinking about your comments about your experiences w/ doctors and WD. I share the same experience- my dr told me that Prozac was no problem to stop and when I told her I thought I was in WD she told me that she’d bet her practice that I wasn’t. WD is overwhelming by itself but not having medical support just adds to it. My heart hurts for everyone here - we were trying to help ourselves. Stay strong and take each day as it comes. 

[getofflex]

8 hours ago, Tapertrauma said:

Last time I spoke to him he said I could either go  back on the Prozac @ 20mg or stop completely and put up with the side effects which he said would last 2 weeks!!

If I were you, I would not follow either suggestion of your doctor.  Unfortunately, the vast majority of doctors are woefully ignorant about the dependency these drugs cause, and how to properly taper off the drugs.  That is why this site exists.  

 

I believe that your symptoms are from tapering way too fast.  Back on January 8, 2023, you dropped from 15 mg to 8 mg, which is way more than our harm reduction approach here of reducing by 10% of current dose. That is almost a 50% drop.  Then, you dropped subsequently from 8 mg to 4 mg in May and June.  No way does this give your brain time to adjust to these dosage decreases.   

 

Tapering is best done extremely slowly, and we generally taper by 10% of the current dose no more than once every 4 weeks, so that the reduction becomes exponentially smaller.

 

 Why Taper by 10% of my Dosage  

 

 

This explains why we get symptoms from going off of these medications, and why it's so important to taper slowly and carefully, and be very cautious about changing our doses: 

 

How Psychiatric Drugs Remodel Your Brain

 

 

This helps you understand what withdrawal syndrome is: 

 

Video on Recovery from Psych Drugs

 

Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization

 

I would suggest you updose back up to 5 mg, and give it at least a week.  Updosing/reinstatements take time.  Let us know how you are.  Here is information about reinstating.  In a week or two, if this isn't enough, we can updose a little bit more.  Doing big dose increases put you at risk of kindling, so please don't do that.  

 

About Reinstating and Stabilizing to Reduce Withdrawal Symptoms

 

Please let us know what you decide to do. 

Edited November 30, 2023 by getofflex

[Tapertrauma]

Hiya getofflex?

 

Thank you so much for your comprehensive reply. I can honestly say this is the best information and advice I have ever been given and it made me cry with relief!

 

I am away in beautiful Ludlow with my husband, daughter and spaniel this weekend; it's been a real struggle but I don't want to spoil it for everyone else. We're home tomorrow so I'll start on the 5mg then. I am really optimistic that I can get through this given how well you have explained to me why I am feeling like this.

I'll certainly let you know how I'm getting on and I thank you from the bottom of my heart.

[Tapertrauma]

Angus,

I think this is true for many doctors. My next door neighbour is a GP and she had little awareness of AD withdrawal. I don't believe doctors realise how horrendous WD makes peopke feel.

[Tapertrauma]

So I've bitten the bullet and gone back up from 4mg to 5mg three days ago.

The first day was ok

Second day very fatigued but ok in rhe afternoon/evening.

Today debiltating fatigue and very vety dark thoughts. Gonna stick with it for now.

[getofflex]

Yes, please give it at least a week to 10 days, unless you feel significantly and consistently worse after you up dosed to 5 mg.  It takes that long for it to fully register with your system.  Keep us updated.  

 

This will help with intrusive dark thoughts:  

 

Acknowledge Accept Float

 

 

Dealing With Emotional Spirals

 

Edited December 7, 2023 by getofflex

[Tapertrauma]

Hi Getofflex,

Thank you so much for your support.

 It is so much appreciated and is really helpng me at the moment.

 

I will keep going with the 5mg. 

 

 

[Tapertrauma]

Day 6 of  being back in the 5mg

Feel absolutely horrendous

Feel absolutely hopeless and helpless. Can't see a way out of this.

So so tired, nausea, upset stomach, terrible headache but the worst is the feeling so helpless. I don't want to see anyone or fo anything and I feel numb to everything.

My husband's fed up with it all and I don't know what to do. 

[Angus]

@Tapertrauma I’m so sorry you are feeling so awful. I am thinking of you and hopeful this will resolve soon. Hopefully a mod will stop by and give some advice.💕

[Poppy745]

Hi @Tapertrauma. I am sorry to hear that things are not good for you. My husband is also starting to feel the strain. Please know that I understand. 💜

[Tapertrauma]

Thank you Angus,

I hope they do. I'm feeling desperate at the moment.

[getofflex]

3 hours ago, Tapertrauma said:

Day 6 of  being back in the 5mg

Feel absolutely horrendous

Feel absolutely hopeless and helpless. Can't see a way out of this.

Do you feel significantly worse since you up dosed to 5 mg?  If so, please go back down to the 4 mg right away.  

 

Have you varied, or missed/skipped any doses, or taken them at a different time of day?  Are you drinking any alcohol?  Have you had any undue stress, intense physical activity, change in diet, caffeine, sudden weather change, illness, or anything else that is unusual?

 

We need to try and figure out if this is withdrawal, or if it is an adverse reaction or possibly a combination of both. To see if there is an adverse reaction going on, please do a daily drug and symptoms journal.  Keep track of taking your drug, symptoms, eating, sleeping, etc.  Write the time on the left, and describe the event on the right.  Pay attention especially to how you feel before, and then after, you take your drug. Please do this for 24 hours, and post an entry in here for each 24 hour period.  Here is an example: 

 

January 31, 2023

6 AM woke with anxiety

8 am took 2.5 mg lexapro

10 am stomach is upset

10:30 am ate breakfast

11:35 am got a headache, lasted one hour

12:35 ate lunch

4 pm feel a bit better

5 pm took 2.5 mg lexapro

6 pm ate dinner

9:20 pm headache 

10:00 pm took 50 mg Seroquel

10:30 pm feeling dizzy

10:30 pm fell asleep 

2:30 am woke, took 3 mg Ambien

2:45 am fell asleep

4:30 am woke, but got back to sleep 

 

There is a way out of this, but it takes lots of time and patience, and a little detective work.  

 

 

Edited December 9, 2023 by getofflex

[getofflex]

Please read this link, it is very helpful, especially when you are feeling desperate and hopeless.  

 

Techniques for Managing Withdrawal

[Tapertrauma]

17 minutes ago, getofflex said:

Do you feel significantly worse since you up dosed to 5 mg?  If so, please go back down to the 4 mg right away.  

 

Have you varied, or missed/skipped any doses, or taken them at a different time of day?  Are you drinking any alcohol?  Have you had any undue stress, intense physical activity, change in diet, caffeine, sudden weather change, illness, or anything else that is unusual?

 

We need to try and figure out if this is withdrawal, or if it is an adverse reaction or possibly a combination of both. To see if there is an adverse reaction going on, please do a daily drug and symptoms journal.  Keep track of taking your drug, symptoms, eating, sleeping, etc.  Write the time on the left, and describe the event on the right.  Pay attention especially to how you feel before, and then after, you take your drug. Please do this for 24 hours, and post an entry in here for each 24 hour period.  Here is an example: 

 

January 31, 2023

6 AM woke with anxiety

8 am took 2.5 mg lexapro

10 am stomach is upset

10:30 am ate breakfast

11:35 am got a headache, lasted one hour

12:35 ate lunch

4 pm feel a bit better

5 pm took 2.5 mg lexapro

6 pm ate dinner

9:20 pm headache 

10:00 pm took 50 mg Seroquel

10:30 pm feeling dizzy

10:30 pm fell asleep 

2:30 am woke, took 3 mg Ambien

2:45 am fell asleep

4:30 am woke, but got back to sleep 

 

There is a way out of this, but it takes lots of time and patience, and a little detective work.  

 

17 minutes ago, getofflex said:

Do you feel significantly worse since you up dosed to 5 mg?  If so, please go back down to the 4 mg right away.  

 

Have you varied, or missed/skipped any doses, or taken them at a different time of day?  Are you drinking any alcohol?  Have you had any undue stress, intense physical activity, change in diet, caffeine, sudden weather change, illness, or anything else that is unusual?

 

We need to try and figure out if this is withdrawal, or if it is an adverse reaction or possibly a combination of both. To see if there is an adverse reaction going on, please do a daily drug and symptoms journal.  Keep track of taking your drug, symptoms, eating, sleeping, etc.  Write the time on the left, and describe the event on the right.  Pay attention especially to how you feel before, and then after, you take your drug. Please do this for 24 hours, and post an entry in here for each 24 hour period.  Here is an example: 

 

January 31, 2023

6 AM woke with anxiety

8 am took 2.5 mg lexapro

10 am stomach is upset

10:30 am ate breakfast

11:35 am got a headache, lasted one hour

12:35 ate lunch

4 pm feel a bit better

5 pm took 2.5 mg lexapro

6 pm ate dinner

9:20 pm headache 

10:00 pm took 50 mg Seroquel

10:30 pm feeling dizzy

10:30 pm fell asleep 

2:30 am woke, took 3 mg Ambien

2:45 am fell asleep

4:30 am woke, but got back to sleep 

 

There is a way out of this, but it takes lots of time and patience, and a little detective work.  

 

 

Thank you so much for coming back to me. I feel 10 x worse since upping to the 5mg. I'll go back to 4mg and keep my diary frpm tomorrow. I can't tell you what your support means to me; it's life saving. 

 

[getofflex]

I didn't get a message, just a quote of what I said. 

[Tapertrauma]

Sorry

I'm a bit confused!!

I don't drink any alcohol. I've been sober for 20 years and I haven't done anything differently. We live really quietly in rural Shropshire and nothing exciting has happened.

 

I feel 10 x worse on the 5mg so I'll drop back down to the 4mg. I'd give anything to go back to how I was on 4mg.

 

I'll keep a diary from tomorrow.

 

I am so grateful for your support. I don't know what I'd do without it xxx

 

 

[getofflex]

I'm very sorry to hear that the 5 mg made you feel worse.  Yes, please immediately drop back down to 4 mg.  Please still do the daily drug/symptom journal, to see if we are dealing with an adverse reaction, and see if any symptom patterns emerge.  

Edited December 9, 2023 by getofflex

[Tapertrauma]

Thank you.

I've just taken 4mg. It's 10.00pm here in the UK. 

Will detail drug/symptom log from tomorrow.

 

Thanks again. 

[Greatful]

@Tapertrauma  H, I'm stopping by to bring a little bit of encouragement.  I turned 60 this last May also.  I am also a horse lover too😊  Who would have ever thought we would be going through this age😓 I can sooo relate to feeling frustrated and scared.  Try not to panic and look for a quick fix.  I really can validate to fatigue and feeling like you are sick with the flu.  You did do a lot of cuts early and a quick taper off of Venlafaxine but you can heal from this.  Our brains are always trying to find hemostasis. 

Here are some links to YT. Maybe these podcast/videos/interviews can help you learn more about these drug and hear some inspiring stories.  Angie has some interviews with care givers. Maybe you and your husband can watch/listen to a few of these.

Angie Peacock    https://www.youtube.com/@AngiePeacockMSW/videos  

Mad In America   https://www.youtube.com/@OpenParadigm/videos 

Medicating Normal  https://www.youtube.com/@MedicatingNormal/videos

Dr Josef  Witt-Doerring https://www.youtube.com/@wdpsychiatry/videos

 

Baylissa  Frederick has some nice meditations and short encouraging messages 

(she has recovered from Benzo) she also has a great book  Recovery and Renewal

 https://www.youtube.com/@BaylissaFrederick/videos

 

Michael Priebe has many clips  with encouragement   (he has recovered from ssri and benzos)

 https://www.youtube.com/@TheLovelyGrind/videos 

 

Remember you are not alone and you are stronger then you think.🌞

 

 

 

[Tapertrauma]

Hi Greatful,

Thank you fso much for reaching out and for your fabulous words of support. I'll certainly check out all of the YT videos. 

 

I really don't know what I'd do without fantastic people like you on this forum. Your words mean the world xx

 

 

[Tapertrauma]

10th December 2023

03.00 Dog woke me up to go out. Not reaĺly awake.but terrible headache; pressure on my cranium.
04.00 Cat woke me up chasing a mouse
08.00 Woke up. Feel like I've been heavily sedated
08.30 Nausea and headache kicking in
08.45 Still in bed. Legs feel like lead and stomach starting to churn.
9.00 Still in bed. Having one small coffee. Really hungry now but still nauseas
9.15 got up ate half a banana
10.00-11.00 Had to ride my pony in the rain but took my mind off it riding in the rain
11.00 Ate some toast and Marmalade and had a decaff coffee; very very anxious
13.10 Felt a bit better for about 10 min
13.20 Have to go out to town 10 miles away. Very very anxious
14.00 Posted parcel. Went into supermarket. Busy, anxious but managed.
15.00 Had biscuits and cheese
16.00 Very anxious and terrible headache. Have put my ponies to bed.
16.45 Now v v fatigued. Still have headache. Feels like I have flu.
17.15 Cup of tea and hot bath. Feeling slightly better.
18.00 Eating tea. Feel fluey and exhausted and very drained.
19.00 Very very tired with headache in top of head
21.00 Very very fatigued
22.00 Went out to shut my ponies in for the night. Felt strangely OK.
22.20 Took 4mg of Prozac in 1ml liquid form. One Calcium tablet with Magnesium and Vitamin D and 5ml Organic Flax Oil

22.30 Feeling not too bad. Off to bed.

[getofflex]

Excellent job on the drug/symptom journal.  Keep doing it, and we will see what patterns there may be, and how you are reacting to the 4 mg of Prozac.  I believe things will settle down for you.  In the meantime, here are some ways of dealing with the bad anxiety, which is a hallmark symptom of WD (withdrawal) and adverse reaction.  

 

Do please add the 5 mg Prozac updose and dates, and the date and dose of when you decreased back to 4 mg to your signature, as we work with many people, and need the info in your signature - thanks!  

 

I did want to mention, please take your calcium at least 2 hours apart from your magnesium, in order to get the calming effect from the magnesium.  I'm glad you were feeling better before bed.  How many hours of sleep are you getting?  

 

video: Claire Weekes: Managing Anxiety

 

 

video: Claire Weekes on Anxiety and Panic

 

Emotional Spirals

 

Acknowledge Accept Float

 

Music to Calm Anxiety

 

Breathing Technique for Anxiety

 

Anxiety Stuff - all kinds of stuff about anxiety attacks and things that help ...

 

15 hours ago, ChessieCat said:

Audio:  First Aid for Panic (4 minutes) Female voice - getselfhelp.co.uk

 

Audio:  First Aid for Panic (4 minutes) Male voice - getselfhelp.co.uk

 

Meditation

Edited December 10, 2023 by getofflex

[Tapertrauma]

Hi Getofflex

Sleep is the only thing I'm any good at, at the moment. My Fitbit is registering a good eight hours. But I feel totally sedated when I wake up and struggle to get out of bed.

 

11th December 

06.20 Dog woke me up to go out. Feel nauseas and very hungry.
8.30 Alarm woke me up. Very fatigued. Nauseas and guts churning. Runny nose. Had one small black coffee.
09.00 Dragged myself put of bed
9.15 Turned my ponies out
11.05 Ate some toast and had a decaff coffee. Very anxious but listening to Claire Weekes as I drink my coffee.
11.15 Very anxious and tension headache coming on
12.00 Rode my pony. Not quite as bad anxiety
13.00 Terrible anxiety and pain in the top of my head. Ate some lunch but feel sick
14.00 Watching YT video on The Floating Technique. Looks so hard and counter intuitive but am trying.
16.00 Have diarrhea (sorry, too much detail!)
16.30 Wrapping Christmas presents but very very anxious and terrible headache. Quite tearful
16.45 Terrible headache and nausea
18.00 Ate some cheese and biscuits only because I felt so hungry but really anxious and terrible headache and pins and needles in the top of my head
19.00 Still got a terrible headache and feel like I have bulging eyes; very uncomfortable
20.00 Feel starving hungry and exhausted
21.20 Feel not too bad. Same as yesterday; just before I took the Prozac.
10.00 Shut my ponies in
10.15 Took 4mg Prozac in 1ml liquid form. One, one a day Magnesium tablet and 1 teaspoon Flaxseed oil.
10.30 Off to bed with headache but not quite so anxious

[getofflex]

I'm so glad you are able to sleep well!  But I'm sorry about all the other symptoms.  Excellent job on working on non drug coping techniques.  I believe that gradually you should feel better since you reduced your Prozac back down to 4 mg.  Keep up with the journaling.  It looks like you feel better in the evening, which is typical of withdrawal.  I'll go ahead and add the attempted updose to your signature.   Hang in there - this too shall pass!  You are doing everything right, and it will pay off handsomely someday.  

Edited December 12, 2023 by getofflex

[Tapertrauma]

Hi Getofflex,

Thank you so much for your continued support and for updating my signature. I can't tell you how much your help means.

Here's today's effort!

12th December
08.30 Alarm woke me up. Nauseas and churning stomach. Quite fatigued and aching legs.
9.15 Up and about. Not quite so bad as yesterday
10.00 -13.00 Outside with Saddler then rode pony. Anxious but manageable
14.00 Had a bit of lunch. Headache and feeling very sick
15.00 Wrapped some presents; very anxious but trying not to resist it
16.15 Very very cold and achey and anxious; feel sad
17.45 Had hot bath. Feel bad as I have all day. Very anxious and super fatigued. Want to lie down.
18.30 Ate cheese sandwich
20.00 Dull headache and achy shoulders. Anxiety has subsided a bit.
21.50 Anxiety has subsided a bit
22.00 Put ponies to bed. Felt not too bad
22.30 Took 4mg of Prozac in 1ml if liquid. One daily magnesium capsule and 1 teaspoon of Flax seed oil  Off to bed. Feeling not too bad.

 

[Tapertrauma]

13th December
08.30 Alarm woke me up. Feel very depressed and hopeless. Different to other days.
09.30 Finally Dragged myself out of bed. Had one black coffee. Have diarrhea again today.
11.00 Feel very sick and very very tired. No appetite at all
11.20 Took 1 of 2 a day magnesium tablets
12.00 Rode pony for an hour. Feeling nauseas
13.40 Still feel really sick; minor headache and eyes really ache.
14.35 Managed to eat some soup and a bread roll. Have terrible pressure headache.
16.00 Brought ponies in. Still got headache
16.30 Joined an Angie Peacock focus group. Terrified me what some people are going through
18.30 Managed some tea. Still have a terrible headache.
19.00 Still have a terrible headache
20.00 Feel relatively ok
21.15 Took 1 magnesium of 2 a day; one teaspoon Flax oil and 4mg Prozac in 1ml liquid
22.20 Starting to feel quite out of it. I've noticed I find this happening about an hour after taking the Prozac.
I wonder if someone could tell me if they think this is an Adverse reaction to the Prozac rather than WD as I tend to feel best before I take the Prozac in the evening?

[LotusRising]

Hi @Tapertrauma

 

Just wondering what type of magnesium you're taking? Is the diarrhea new? I don't see it in all of your notes ...

[getofflex]

Hello Tapertrauma, I will be away from this site for 4-5 days, as I have company coming to stay with me.  I've asked the other staff to keep an eye on you in the meantime.  

 

I'll just say you may very well be feeling an adverse reaction to your Prozac, especially since you had such a bad reaction to increasing your dose to 5 mg.  Please pay special attention to how you feel before you take it each day, and then what symptoms arise in the few hours after you take it.  Any other symptoms besides feeling out of it after you take it?  Do you go to bed shortly after you take it?  

 

I was glad to see that you felt some better on December 12.  Please give yourself some time to stabilize on the 4 mg.  I believe you will probably gradually feel better as time goes on, with ups and downs.  

 

[Tapertrauma]

11 hours ago, LotusRising said:

Just wondering what type of magnesium you're taking? Is the diarrhea new? I don't see it in all of your notes ...

Hiya -  Thank you so much for coming back to me. Your help and concern keeps me going.

I had been taking Calcium tablets which had vitamin D and Magnesium in. Getofflex kindly suggested I take the Calcium and Magnesium separately so I bought some new Magnesium Oxide only tables. Thinking about it the diarrhea is new and seems to tie in with the change of Magnesium - but I think the Magnesium is helping to a degree with my energy levels. Should I put the Magnesium in my signature?

[Tapertrauma]

11 hours ago, getofflex said:

Please pay special attention to how you feel before you take it each day, and then what symptoms arise in the few hours after you take it.  

Thank you so much for coming back to me. I will pay special attention to the symptoms before and after I take the Prozac. It does seem I feel better as the day goes on presumably the Prozac dissipates and then I feel bad once I take it again.

 

Enjoy your company coming to stay

 

Best regards as always