Nikki: hi, my rundown with ADs

[tezza]

I wish I could give you a REALHUG!

[peggy]

Hi Nikki,

My gentle advice would be one day at a time - you have taken a lot on by starting your business and i know how it feels to have to be 'on top' and withdrawal feelings and an exacerbation in anxiety and depression make it almost impossible to see past the fog. I totally relate to that feeling of just wanting to go back up and staying there forever...Try not to think about reducing again for a while, but don't rule it out completely. Once you have stabilised and feeling more positive you might just like to do a 0.5mg reduction rather than 5 mg, you might be able to make tiny, tiny microcuts that can trick your brain into reducing without it realising it.

 

love and blessings

Peggy

[alexjuice]

Hey Nikki,

 

I think it's a great idea to try to help others and focus on positivity.

 

One problem that I have, personally, is that it's difficult to see the similarities in spite of the differences. Everyone on this site has had a similar but also very different experience. This leaves me lots of room to relate but also feel alienated from ... Sometimes I'm not aware that something I write can make others feel bad. I think everyone probably feels this way, I don't think there are any mean spirited posters who write things with the intention of causing discomfort to others.

 

best

Alex

[Altostrata]

Words of wisdom, Alex.

 

Nikki dear, please do ask your doctors to take a good look at ALL your medications and advise you if they see any conflicts. With 2 antidepressants on board, this can be tricky.

[tezza]

BIG HUGS and lots of love to my southern sunshine! I'm on my way out to church but wanted to send warm greetings your way first!

[Nikki]

Hi

 

I am going to start EMDR Therapy soon. There is a Therapist in the Office I clean on Fridays.

I asked him if we could barter. I could clean/organize for him in exchange for EMDR. He agreed.

 

The Psych Nurse I see told me to go for it. She said he is excellent and a caring person which I felt upon meeting him a few times. I've done EMDR before and it is very good.

 

I went back to my original dose of 30mgs. Celexa and 30mgs. Imipramine and I felt fine for a few days and not so good now. Depressed. Worried. Fear of the future all the time.

 

I have tried to infuse as much positivity as possible into my head by not reading WD posts, Meditation, Readings, Al-Anon meetings and a really nice craft project (making a wreath out of wine corks) and I am still depressed.

 

My friends at my Al-Anon meeting are loving and very supportive. I told them yesterday that I haven't called anyone because I feel like a broken record. I was hugged, assured I was not a broken record and that they are there at any time for support. Brought me to tears.

 

I was reminded that going for the therapy is living in the solution. However I feel that all I do is live in the problem.

 

I honestly don't know if the site is where I may find solutions. But I have to give myself every possible outlet.

 

Anxiety is a pain in the butt, but depression is the pits.

 

I was did drop from 30mgs. Celexa to 25. Upped the Imipramine to 40mgs. and then dropped back down to 30mgs. This may be a huge factor, but there is something underneath all of this that I must address.

 

I don't want to be this unhappy the rest of my days. For some reason, I seek happiness and find it for moments and then it's back to the grind.

 

Thanks

[tezza]

Hi Nikki,

 

I don't understand why the meds are so difficult for some of us. I think you are making wise choices, though, by reaching out in all the avenues.

 

Crafts have always been good for me and my son has suggested to me that I should try them again. I think they may be more help in anxiety situations.

 

I know you have real life friends that care about you, so don't hesitate to call them. If they are true friends, they will be there for you. From what you've said to me before, they sound like true friends.

 

I'm glad you'll be able to barter for the EMDR Therapy. That proves the man is, indeed, caring.

 

You have too much on your plate right now and it's just bogging you down. Plus, like you said, the medicine changes are most likely a huge factor.

 

You've always given me hope when I was down, so I'll be here any time you need a friend.

 

Feel free to PM me any time you want to. I know what that dark depression feels like and will help you any way I possibly can.

 

Hugs and love,

Tezza

[flower]

Nikki ..sorry to see you so sad..This Celexa is very tricky, 5mgs took me 8 weeks to get over. Remember how sick I got? Be easy on yourself. Listen to me telling you,lol. I'm in this with ya ladybug..I hope you have a better day..

[strawberry17]

I'm all for doing lots of "feel good" things at times like these. Do you like reading? I love reading for pleasure, nothing better than getting lost in a good book. Lean on your friends.

Can you tell me what EMDR therapy is?

[Nikki]

Lovely Ladies.....

 

EMDR Therapy (google Emotional Freedom). There are two ways to do it. One is tapping on the patient. The other which I didn't like is flashing lights and hand held clickers.

 

You pick a subject that is making you nuts Then the counselor has you look at a scale from 1 - 10 to determine the strength of the trauma or incident, etc. You close your eyes and while you eyes are closed he/she asks questions while tapping on the top part of both knees.

 

For me I would release the deep pain/sorrow/fear. Then, you open your eyes and discuss it.

 

Close your eyes again and there is a different tempo of tapping.

 

After that she would write down affirmations that helped with the situation.

 

Immediately upon opening my eyes the trauma was gone. I could view it and remember it but

The Emotional Charge Was Gone.

 

Then once again to the 1-10 scale. I would always go back down the scale. And feel free.

 

There are other ways to do it and you can do it to yourself.

 

I know it works for me. One of the best things I've ever done.

 

And there you have it.

 

Flower....yes I remember your experience. I had not had a problem before in doing this.

Goes to show how AD's have a mind of their own.

 

I don't plan on tapering again. Thank you for replying. I get bad melancholy on Sundays.

The therapist who did the EMDR said she had to use her recovery tools on Sundays too. I do hope this episode ends and I can go on to enjoy life instead of fighting depression and fear.

 

Hugs

[peggy]

Dear Nikki, I feel confident you will recover - i think you are one of the strongest people here. View this as nothing more than a setback and learn from it. I am sure that the degree of your distress is from the large reduction in the celexa that you took - even though in the past you may have been able to handle a 5mg reduction, this time it was too much - if you try again, just do 1mg or even 0.5 mg. Doesn't matter how small.

[strawberry17]

Yes now you've told me I have heard of EMDR, I would imagine it's just quite comforting.

[Nikki]

Thanks Peggy...I am sure it hit big time.

 

In addition, I am not satisfied with my life. It seems rather unfulfilling for a long time.

My responsibility. Choices I've made. Alot of them out of fear.

 

Hugs

[tezza]

Good morning, Nikki...

 

I agree with Peggy. You really are one of the strongest people on the forum. It took a strong woman to have endured all you've been through. You're still going through a lot too, I understand.

 

The EMDR Therapy sound very interesting, I'm so glad it helps. Things have to start getting better for you from here on. We can only go so low, I believe, then there's no other way but up.

 

The economy is hard on everyone I know these days with the exception of only a few. You will make it though because you are talented and resourceful.

 

I'm so glad you're back with us, I was very sad, literally, while you were taking a break. I did understand your needing a break, it was just selfishness on my part.

 

Hugs and love

[tezza]

Wanted to add this link, just in case you didn't see this. I haven't yet downloaded them but hope to soon. It was so kind of Gia to share these.

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/3928-these-are-awesome-for-anxiety-sleeplessness-etcvery-calming/page__pid__45661#entry45661

[Nikki]

Tezza how sweet of you to think of me like that. I missed you and Flower too.

 

I am feeling better and I suppose Peggy was right about getting hit so hard. Yes, up is the way. All of us are stronger than we believe. When in a low mood none of us can see that.

 

A friend of mine said something to me this morning that made sense. When doing well on an AD, why do we (me or anyone else) decide it's time to change the dose or get off the stuff?

 

What I forget is that I was feeling well from the correct balance of medication. In other words, why rock the boat.

 

So for now I will remain where I am at with Celexa. I actually had a day off so I had lunch with my friends.

 

Sunita was posting about how exercise helped her alot and I remember when it helped me. I would very much like to get back into it. This is a warm climate, no shortage of ocean or pools

 

Some good news....My daughter was offered at a job at the Ritz-Carlton. She will be serving and move into training for a Concierge position There are three Ritz-Carltons in this area. One in Jupiter, one on Singer Island and the big on in Palm Beach.

 

Hugs

[tezza]

Hooray!!!! It's good news when someone lands a job nowadays and that job sounds really good, a chance to advance!

[peggy]

I am so glad you are feeling better Nikki

 

Regarding your comment about why rock the boat when we are well.... I understand that idea and have had it many times especially after stabilising from a withdrawal attempt, however, what has motivated me to continue trying to get off is that we don't know the long term effects of these drugs on our brains. They were only ever designed for short term use and over time that use has escalated and now the APA has incorporated long term use into its algorithms for treating depression.

 

I am excited by the advancements in neuroplasticity understanding over the last few years and i believe there are ways to change our neurotransmitter systems that are not pharmacological - for example exercise, meditation, good diet and therapy - however when we are coming from a base of pharmacologically altered neurotransmitters we need to proceed more slowly.

 

But....three years ago i didn't think this way, i think we always need to be flexible in our approach to our lives and never say never!

 

Love and light

Peggy

[Nikki]

Good morning...

 

Another UTI. aaaarrrggghhh. OR should I say the same one. Stinks.

 

Yes Peggy, I have read many times that the meds were created for short term use.

 

I typed in "short term memory loss" in the search box, but did not come up with a title like that and I thought I made one a good while back.

 

Short term memory loss is something that is bugging me right now. since this last drop and reinstatement. Scary. So I do get your concern and opinion.

 

For people who have chronic depression what else is there to do? I guess it's just about making the best possible decision, armed with information and loving support from family and friends.

 

That dark place scares the Ba-Ge-Baz out of me......you have to pronounce

the word phonetically.

[Nikki]

I thought I posted this somewhere on the site, but I was unable to find it using the search box.

 

I was just telling Peggy that since my last drop/reinstatement my memory is faltering to say the least. I feel like I have Alzheimer's. Having trouble spelling and I was a Wiz at spelling.

 

I have had this happen before and the short term memory loss does stop.

 

What to do in the meantime? Be gentle with myself? Talk to myself about how it will ease up?

Would rather not fret over it, but it does bug me alot.

 

I do notice lack of sleep affects memory. So does sugar.

 

?

[tezza]

I had it really bad at some time in the past. With all of the meds I was on, is it any wonder?

 

It has improved but not as good as it once was. I'm hoping it will get better.

[peggy]

good morning Nikki, sorry that blasted UTI is still lingering.

 

regarding chronic depression and what else to do... well, we all do what we do with the best information we have at the time. Over the last couple of years my paradigm has changed. I endured 6 episodes of moderate -severe depressions. Each one a little worse that the one before, all about 5-6 months in duration and all 4 years or so apart. I now believe that my fear about the whole experience drove the episode further - i was so worried about how bad i would get i literally drove myself. My cognitions, thought patterns, understanding or whatever had me caught in a self fulfilling prophecy. Once I took medication my thought pattern took a different tack - i started to believe i had a chemical imbalance. And, of course when i went off my medications and 'relapsed' it was further proof of that.

 

Before antidepressants were used routinely (for other than hospitalised patients), depression was considered to be episodic (like mine was) and patients were reassured that the episode would pass. Now, depression is considered to be a chronic condition with the recommendation that lifelong medication be used. Is it possible that medications have CAUSED the chronicity?

 

To experience depression is part of the human condition - but we CAN do things that can alleviate suffering and influence neuroplasticity and restore homestasis of neurotransmitters that don't involve staying on high dose antidepressants. The culture of psychiatry today is to medicate, most GP's and even psychiatrists don't understand the biology of withdrawal, so how can we expect our friends, family or social aquaintances to understand or recommend a course of action that is any different to what is talked about so freely now. Mental health issues are at the tip of everyone's tongues now - feeling blue? go see your doctor... and come out with a prescription (or a sample pack).

 

Having said all that, I don't know how successful i will be at getting off my medication. I have just had to do a little updose and am still not feeling great, but I am doing things that help enormously, like exercise, meditation and watching my thoughts. Catastrophising and predicting the future are my two big faulty thought patterns.

[Jemima]

good morning Nikki, sorry that blasted UTI is still lingering.

 

regarding chronic depression and what else to do... well, we all do what we do with the best information we have at the time. Over the last couple of years my paradigm has changed. I endured 6 episodes of moderate -severe depressions. Each one a little worse that the one before, all about 5-6 months in duration and all 4 years or so apart. I now believe that my fear about the whole experience drove the episode further - i was so worried about how bad i would get i literally drove myself. My cognitions, thought patterns, understanding or whatever had me caught in a self fulfilling prophecy. Once I took medication my thought pattern took a different tack - i started to believe i had a chemical imbalance. And, of course when i went off my medications and 'relapsed' it was further proof of that.

 

Before antidepressants were used routinely (for other than hospitalised patients), depression was considered to be episodic (like mine was) and patients were reassured that the episode would pass. Now, depression is considered to be a chronic condition with the recommendation that lifelong medication be used. Is it possible that medications have CAUSED the chronicity?

Have you read Anatomy of an Epidemic by Robert Whitaker? That is exactly his premise, that medications have caused the chronicity of mental health problems, and he argues the case very well. Dying for a Cure by Rebekah Beddoe is also quite the eye-opener. She went to the doctor for a bad case of fatigue and loneliness as a new mother, got diagnosed as having post partum depression, and went on a hellride of psychiatric medications and hospitalizations for the next five years. It is remarkable that she figured out what was wrong and set about getting herself off the drugs.

 

To experience depression is part of the human condition - but we CAN do things that can alleviate suffering and influence neuroplasticity and restore homestasis of neurotransmitters that don't involve staying on high dose antidepressants. The culture of psychiatry today is to medicate, most GP's and even psychiatrists don't understand the biology of withdrawal, so how can we expect our friends, family or social aquaintances to understand or recommend a course of action that is any different to what is talked about so freely now. Mental health issues are at the tip of everyone's tongues now - feeling blue? go see your doctor... and come out with a prescription (or a sample pack).

 

Having said all that, I don't know how successful i will be at getting off my medication. I have just had to do a little updose and am still not feeling great, but I am doing things that help enormously, like exercise, meditation and watching my thoughts. Catastrophising and predicting the future are my two big faulty thought patterns.

 

I don't mean to wag a finger at anyone, by the way. On bad days I've often wondered if taking just a teensy dose of antidepressant would be a good idea, but then I think of what they do to the brain and body and shudder. I've also discovered a number of faulty thinking patterns, catastrophizing and predicting the future among them, and IMO it's a lot healthier to break these patterns than to numb out the painful results.

 

As for short term memory problems, I definitely had trouble with that when I was "tapering" off Lexapro. It seemed that my thoughts were moving so fast I'd forget what I was doing when I walked a few steps to do whatever it was. Generally I could remember if I just quieted myself as best I could or let some time elapse.

[Nikki]

I must be coming out of the slump....depression stopped. Just bummed about the lingering UTI.

 

Practicing positive affirmations during the day. The type that are believable and are kind to myself.

 

Picked up some CD's from the Library from Deepak Chopra, Joyce Meyers (100 ways to Simplify Your Life).

 

Hugs

[Nikki]

It never ends with my daughter. The stress from this kid is unbelievable and from her father too.

 

She has chronic tonsillitis. Needs to have them removed. Last week she left her job to go he Ritz Carlton. She left her job on bad terms. She took alot of xanax. More than she needed This morning she told me she needs brakes on her car and it is leaking oil.

She needs money to get it fixed. The ex boyfriend is still harassing her and the police have a warrant to arrest him but they said they can't arrest him in the county he lives in.

 

Her father was in NYC then went to Hawaii for two weeks and back to NYC. He will not help her with her car. He is rather sadistic.

 

This week my property taxes are due. I don't have the extra money for her car.

 

Needed to vent. Thank you

[tezza]

Wow, Nikki! I think you are handling things very well considering everything that's going on. You are a strong woman. We think when our children get grown, life will be easier but that's not the case many times. Their needs just get more complicated.

 

My daughter has had all her household stuff in our shop for over two years. She was living here until her husband got out of prison rehab a little over a year ago. then they moved in with his mother. They are doing better now and just rented a house so maybe now we will have our space back.

 

We help our kids so much that our own needs seem to be put on the back burner, so to speak.

 

Hang in there, we will get through it somehow!

[Nikki]

Tezza I feel a little bad now for posting about my daughter. We sound like white trash and we really aren't.

 

Her life, as young as she is, is full of drama. Alot of it is her own doing. Alot of it stems from pursuing a relationship with her father. I never disciplined her and in looking back I should have been a sterner parent.

 

She is actually a very intelligent, beautiful person. Bad choices. She still hasn't finished college and we pre-paid her college tuition at age 6.

 

It is time for me to live alone. It's time for her to get her own place.

 

Do they ever leave

[peggy]

 

Do they ever leave

 

NO!!

 

I have 3 adult children - one is married. The married one and his wife live with us as does the eldest. So we have 5 adults living here. We have a big house and we are not under each others feet. Housing is so expensive in Australia that it is very difficult for young people to get a start, so we are giving them an opportunity to save some extra dollars. We don't charge them rent - we say - as long as you look after us in our dotage

[tezza]

Oh Dear, sweet Nikki, you have never made it sound like y'all are white trash! If anyone sounds that way it's my dysfunctional bunch! I feel like I can talk about the things that bother or concern me more here than anywhere else, though.

 

I don't feel like our friends here are judgmental, so I open up. That's what peer support is all about. I feel love and concern is a two-way street here and am so thankful for that.

 

This is the only place I feel free to talk without being judged. It's strange how I feel so much love for people I've never actually met. This group is the finest bunch of folks I know.

[strawberry17]

Well reading this made me smile this morning after a miserable start, I never thought you ever sounded like white trash Nikki LOL

In the UK we say "Chavs"

[Nikki]

Well thank you all

 

the ex-boyfriend is going to be arrested. In talking to two of my married friends they told me they were stalked. One in college (guy was arrested) and the other was her ex-spouse (he was arrested).

 

My daughter will be starting at the Ritz and will be put into their training program for becoming a Concierge. They have marvelous benefits and the pay is very good. 23% gratuity is added into everything.

 

Okay now for my news:

 

Thank you Peggy. For the last two days I made the commitment to get up as soon as the alarm goes off and hop into the shower. No laying there ruminating and building anxiety. I laid my clothes out the night before.

 

I had time for a daily reading from Marianne Williamson on Faith. Very nice.

 

I sensed that the AM anxiety was lurking and I was able to not buy into it.

Hip Hip Hooray

[tezza]

Good for you Nikki! So happy to hear!

[tezza]

Good morning, southern Sunshine! How are ya?

[Nikki]

Happy Easter Weekend

 

 

Thanks to Sparrow I realized why I feel like a homicidal maniac the doctor lowered my progesterone (the calming hormone) from 100mgs. to 25mgs.

 

He is out of the office until Monday....Lovely, just lovely

 

I can't function without hormones, tried it, doesn't work.

 

I'd rather WD from AD's.

[areyouthere]

Thank you Peggy. For the last two days I made the commitment to get up as soon as the alarm goes off and hop into the shower. No laying there ruminating and building anxiety. I laid my clothes out the night before.

 

I had time for a daily reading from Marianne Williamson on Faith. Very nice.

 

I sensed that the AM anxiety was lurking and I was able to not buy into it.

Hip Hip Hooray

 

It just goes to show how important support from each other is here!!! Oh. And. I can't resist but... NIPPING OUT in a cold shower will yank one out from the drowsies like no other act!!!

 

YAY Nikki!!! You go!

 

RU

[flower]

Happy Easter Weekend

 

 

Thanks to Sparrow I realized why I feel like a homicidal maniac the doctor lowered my progesterone (the calming hormone) from 100mgs. to 25mgs.

 

He is out of the office until Monday....Lovely, just lovely

 

I can't function without hormones, tried it, doesn't work.

 

I'd rather WD from AD's.

 

I know what you mean.That stuff will make you crazy.. My Gyno Dr told me it will put some women over the edge. Hang in there..