birdsong: Is this AD withdrawal?

[birdsong]

Hello I will give a brief summary of what has happened after taking most recent drugs. I am a 21 yr old college student, low-income and person of color who recently had to drop their studies (September) due to what I think is OCD and quit their job (November) due to never before experienced debilitating and frightening symptoms. 

 

These began after stopping Luvox 50 mg and Prozac 20 mg. 

 

I have never been warned or informed or properly tapered off any psychotropic drug by any psychiatrists I have seen including the one (due to insurance I can only speak with him once a month) who prescribed me the last four recent drugs. I was unfortunately very naive in my decisions surrounding these drugs.

 

For clarity: I was being treated for "depression" and anxiety. Started at age 17. My signature is copied off records of prescription dates. For the most part I did not take pills regularly, I remember last year organizing my room and seeing that I had bottles full of pills I never took. A lot of prescriptions were what the psychiatrists called trial and error, so I was trying pills to see their effects which were miss which made me realize they were making me sick so I stopped. I unfortunately cannot remember which ones I did take consistently prior to this year (2021). 

 

Up until summer I was taking propranolol as needed for anxiety/stress (it had been I think ~1 yr more or less since I had taken any drug). During the summer I needed and wanted guidance to cope with anxiety/stress in the form of therapy. Through my insurance I emailed and left calls for many people but did not get responses and was getting discouraged. I was so desperate for relief that I was prescribed buspirone 10 mg, which did initially provide a calming relief. In the beginning of September 2021, I was overwhelmed with work and inability to properly cope with my internal problems which was taking a toll on my studies. *Here is where details become very blurry. I let the current psychiatrist know and he prescribed me Fluvoxamine 50 mg. The first two times I took it in the evening and found that it made me restless, it did not let me sleep. So I switched to taking it in the mornings and cut it in half; it still made me restless and I would be very sleepy during the day. I let the psychiatrist know and he told me to switch to Prozac 20 mg. I took it once it the morning before work and the restlessness was awful, I could not sleep at all. Note: I do remember taking advil pm and even buspirone alongside the fluvoxamine at the same time to abate the restlessness. I ceased all medications and after that and since then I have been experiencing things I have never experienced before. 

 

-acute short-term memory loss and other gaps in memory*

-frightening confusion*

-cognitive problems*

-weird thinking and feelings I do not know the words to describe*

-vision problems (after-image, visual snow/static, visual distortion, stars in vision)*

-loss of personality and identity*

-head ache/pain/pressure mostly* (this has been consistent, I remember waking up one day before work in October to a sharp pain only in the right side of my head, then afterwards feeling pressure localized around only the right side of my head/eye, and now a bit of the top of my head)

 -slipping in and out of consciousness when closing my eyes*

-dpdr*

-auditory problems (cannot focus on what I'm listening)*

-feeling stuck in my head*

-intrusive thoughts like never before*

-hypnagogia

-disorientation 

-delirium 

-coordination and balance problems

-fear and dread

-lack of motivation

-bizzare dreams

-heart/chest pain

-dreadful anxiety for no reason 

-severe depression/anhedonia (I have never in my life experienced actual depression)*

-crying so much 

 

There are more but I cannot remember right now. The ones with asterisks are the most concerning for me. Everything came on so suddenly and abruptly and unprecedentedly.

 

I am so afraid that I am developing a more serious mental illness and that I will have to take more drugs which I do not want. I have no support system, my family is busy and other people I know are as well. The psychiatrist doesn't think the drugs did anything. With what strength I have, I was able to schedule a neurologist appointment and will be getting studies done. I feel that I am wasting their time. I think deep down I want this to be something physical that can be cured. Which I know is wishful and doesn't serve me good. I am trying my best to not let my fear get to me but I am constantly reminded of my decisions.  I am beyond heartbroken, this is not who I am. I am a spirited and passionate person, I do not know what to do as I wait for answers. 

 

 

 

Edited December 17, 2021 by ChessieCat
added spacing

[getofflex]

Hello, and welcome to SA.  We are a volunteer-run community of people who have been or are getting off of psychiatric drugs.  I'm very sorry to hear that you are dealing with these symptoms, with minimal to no support.  You have come to the right place.  

 

So to make sure I'm understanding correctly, you are no longer on any of the drugs mentioned in your signature?  

 

You were on Luvox/fluvoxamine from early September to September 22, so about 2.5 to 3 weeks?  

 

17 hours ago, birdsong said:

A lot of prescriptions were what the psychiatrists called trial and error, so I was trying pills to see their effects which were miss which made me realize they were making me sick so I stopped

You say the drugs "made you sick".  Can you please be specific about what symptoms you had while on these drugs?  Can you remember which drugs caused which symptoms?

 

Here is some information about how these drugs actually work.   This explains why we get symptoms from going off of these medications.

 

How Psychiatric Drugs Remodel Your Brain

 

It sounds as though you also had adverse reactions to the drug(s).  This link explains about that: 

 

Adverse Reactions

 

 

This helps you understand what withdrawal syndrome is: 

 

Video on Recovery from Psych Drugs

 

What is Happening in Your Brain

 

Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization

 

Also, as we are recovering, we suggest keeping things slow, simple, and stable. 

 

Keep it Simple, Slow, and Stable

 

Here is a link with checklists of common WD symptoms: 

 

Dr Joseph Glenmullen Withdrawal Symptom Checklists

 

 

Here are some techniques to cope with symptoms: 

 

Non Drug Ways to Cope with Withdrawal Symptoms

 

 

We don't suggest many supplements, but 2 that many of us find helpful are magnesium and omega-3 fish oil. Here are the links for info about those. It is suggested to add one at a time, and start with a low dose to see how it affects you. 

Magnesium

 

Omega 3 Fish Oil

 

17 hours ago, birdsong said:

For the most part I did not take pills regularly,

This in and of itself can cause problems.  It can destabilize the nervous system, since there is not a steady level of the drug in the blood stream.  We suggest people do not skip doses when they are on SSRI drugs.  Did you miss doses of the recent Luvox and Prozac?  

 

I just want to reassure you that with proper self care and knowledge, you can and will recover from the withdrawal effects of these drugs.  However, it will take lots of time and patience.  It must be discouraging that the therapists you contacted did not contact you back.  I've had this happen to me, as well.  Hang in there, and it time you will slowly feel better.  Please keep us posted on how you are doing.  

[getofflex]

Not only that, but there are major drug interactions between: 

 

Buspirone and fluoxetine/Prozac

Buspirone and fluvoxamine/Luvox

 

This could very well be what has caused your symptoms.  Here are the reports from www.drugs.com: 

 

Interactions between your drugs

Major

busPIRone  FLUoxetine

Applies to: buspirone, Prozac (fluoxetine)

Using busPIRone together with FLUoxetine can increase the risk of a rare but serious condition called the serotonin syndrome, which may include symptoms such as confusion, hallucination, seizure, extreme changes in blood pressure, increased heart rate, fever, excessive sweating, shivering or shaking, blurred vision, muscle spasm or stiffness, tremor, incoordination, stomach cramp, nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea. Severe cases may result in coma and even death. You should seek immediate medical attention if you experience these symptoms while taking the medications. Talk to your doctor if you have any questions or concerns. Your doctor may already be aware of the risks, but has determined that this is the best course of treatment for you and has taken appropriate precautions and is monitoring you closely for any potential complications. It is important to tell your doctor about all other medications you use, including vitamins and herbs. 

 

Major

busPIRone  fluvoxaMINE

Applies to: buspirone, Luvox (fluvoxamine)

Using busPIRone together with fluvoxaMINE can increase the risk of a rare but serious condition called the serotonin syndrome, which may include symptoms such as confusion, hallucination, seizure, extreme changes in blood pressure, increased heart rate, fever, excessive sweating, shivering or shaking, blurred vision, muscle spasm or stiffness, tremor, incoordination, stomach cramp, nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea. Severe cases may result in coma and even death. You should seek immediate medical attention if you experience these symptoms while taking the medications. Talk to your doctor if you have any questions or concerns. Your doctor may already be aware of the risks, but has determined that this is the best course of treatment for you and has taken appropriate precautions and is monitoring you closely for any potential complications. It is important to tell your doctor about all other medications you use, including vitamins and herbs.

[birdsong]

@getofflex Thank you for your response. The Wellbutrin, Zoloft, and Effexor specifically made me nauseous, stomach cramps, and restlessness that were too uncomfortable to continue taking full prescriptions. 

The Luvox I took in total only 14 pills consistent. Then switched to Prozac, only one pill. 

[birdsong]

@getofflex 

Edit: I missed some questions, my apologies. Yes, not taking any medication since early October. The Luvox started September 22 ended October 5. Then psychiatrist switched over to Prozac which I took only one time. Stopped all since early October. 

[getofflex]

You were only on the Luvox for about 13 days, which is not enough time for your nervous system to become dependent.  You only took 1 pill of the Prozac.  I suspect that your symptoms are from your nervous system becoming confused by all the drugs you have been on in the past 3 years.  You have had 13 drug changes in the last 4 years.  Not only that, you have had adverse reactions to several of these drugs, which will add to the situation.  And on top of that, there is the major interactions between the drugs as described above.  I'm not saying all this in judgment, but just to try and figure out what is causing your symptoms.  If anything, I blame the doctors and health care system for how irresponsibly they prescribe these drugs that have significant impacts on our nervous systems.  

 

Q: How is your sleep?  

 

Q: How is your eating?

 

I will confer with the other staff, and we will get back to you.  In the meantime, be very gentle with yourself, and with your nervous system.  Check, out the non drug coping techniques in the link above, and see if some of these help.  Try reading some of the success stories for help.  We have other members who were on many drugs, and they have recovered.  Here is one example: 

 

Shep's Success Leaving Plato's Cave

 

Success Stories

[Altostrata]

Welcome, @birdsong

 

What happened when you started with 40mg Celexa? Were you taking Lexapro with Cymbalta? Lexapro with Wellbutrin? Why was trazodone added in January 2019? You were taking trazodone with Cymbalta and Lexapro or Wellbutrin? Why did you go off Wellbutrin?

 

Why did you go off Cymbalta and trazodone in May 2020?

 

Did you feel well at any time since you started antidepressants in March 2018? If yes, what was the combination of drugs you were taking then?

 

Did one psychiatrist prescribe all these drugs?

[birdsong]

On 12/18/2021 at 9:30 AM, getofflex said:

You were only on the Luvox for about 13 days, which is not enough time for your nervous system to become dependent.  You only took 1 pill of the Prozac.  I suspect that your symptoms are from your nervous system becoming confused by all the drugs you have been on in the past 3 years.  You have had 13 drug changes in the last 4 years.  Not only that, you have had adverse reactions to several of these drugs, which will add to the situation.  And on top of that, there is the major interactions between the drugs as described above.  I'm not saying all this in judgment, but just to try and figure out what is causing your symptoms.  If anything, I blame the doctors and health care system for how irresponsibly they prescribe these drugs that have significant impacts on our nervous systems.  

 

Q: How is your sleep?  

 

Q: How is your eating?

 

I will confer with the other staff, and we will get back to you.  In the meantime, be very gentle with yourself, and with your nervous system.  Check, out the non drug coping techniques in the link above, and see if some of these help.  Try reading some of the success stories for help.  We have other members who were on many drugs, and they have recovered.  Here is one example: 

 

Shep's Success Leaving Plato's Cave

 

Success Stories

@getofflex 

My sleep was fine until I started experiencing the symptoms I listed. I go to sleep anxious and wake up anxious. 

I eat but with little appetite. 

(I have been trying to stay offline, apologies for the late responses)

 

[birdsong]

On 12/18/2021 at 3:22 PM, Altostrata said:

Welcome, @birdsong

 

What happened when you started with 40mg Celexa? Were you taking Lexapro with Cymbalta? Lexapro with Wellbutrin? Why was trazodone added in January 2019? You were taking trazodone with Cymbalta and Lexapro or Wellbutrin? Why did you go off Wellbutrin?

 

Why did you go off Cymbalta and trazodone in May 2020?

 

Did you feel well at any time since you started antidepressants in March 2018? If yes, what was the combination of drugs you were taking then?

 

Did one psychiatrist prescribe all these drugs?

@Altostrata My memory is not good :(. I cannot remember the details anymore. I do know that my memory started to worsen when I was taking drugs consistently which started to affect my studies in 2018/2019. I started trazodone for sleep I think. Cymbalta was stopped. Lexapro I think I took at one point consistently. Wellbutrin made me very nauseous. I have seen three different psychiatrists. The last four were prescribed by the same psychiatrist. None of the psychiatrists I've seen tapered me off. I never really felt well on any drug. 

[Altostrata]

18 hours ago, birdsong said:

My sleep was fine until I started experiencing the symptoms I listed.

 

This was after you went off fluvoxamine in September, 2021? Or after you quit buspirone in October?

 

On 12/16/2021 at 5:35 PM, birdsong said:

I am so afraid that I am developing a more serious mental illness

 

The symptoms you describe are not those of mental illness, but of adverse drug effects.

 

What did your last psychiatrist say about this outcome?

[birdsong]

2 hours ago, Altostrata said:

 

This was after you went off fluvoxamine in September, 2021? Or after you quit buspirone in October?

 

 

The symptoms you describe are not those of mental illness, but of adverse drug effects.

 

What did your last psychiatrist say about this outcome?

After I quit buspirone and fluvoxamine.

 

The psychiatrist said, "maybe". When I asked if perhaps my symptoms were due to the drugs. Every meeting I've had with this psychiatrist and previous ones have always been brief and always resulting in more prescriptions. Basically unhelpful.

[BelaLugosi]

Hi! can relate to most of your symptoms

I'm 24

Very sorry that you had to drop your studies

[Altostrata]

23 hours ago, birdsong said:

After I quit buspirone and fluvoxamine.

 

Did you quit these drugs at the same time? Did you cold turkey both?

 

Or did you quit fluvoxamine first, then buspirone some days later? Did your symptoms start before or after you quit buspirone?

[birdsong]

23 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

 

Did you quit these drugs at the same time? Did you cold turkey both?

 

Or did you quit fluvoxamine first, then buspirone some days later? Did your symptoms start before or after you quit buspirone?

@Altostrata Yes. Both stopped at the same time. Symptoms began a few days after (first two weeks of October). 

[Altostrata]

Quote

Buspirone 10 mg September 2021-October 2021 (twice daily; on/off)

 

What does "on/off" mean?

 

You took 20mg Prozac only once? When did you feel "the restlessness was awful, I could not sleep at all"?

 

After you that one dose of 20mg Prozac, how did you feel over the next week or so? Did your symptoms lighten at any time?

[birdsong]

39 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

 

What does "on/off" mean?

 

You took 20mg Prozac only once? When did you feel "the restlessness was awful, I could not sleep at all"?

 

After you that one dose of 20mg Prozac, how did you feel over the next week or so? Did your symptoms lighten at any time?

@Altostrata On/off; I would not take it daily/regularly/consistently. 

 

The one Prozac pill, I took it early in the morning before work and that whole day/evening I did not sleep. I cannot remember much after. Symptoms have not lightened. Currently feel apprehensive. 

[Altostrata]

23 hours ago, birdsong said:

On/off; I would not take it daily/regularly/consistently. 

 

Taking psychiatric drugs inconsistently can cause withdrawal symptoms and many other strange symptoms, which also adds to nervous system sensitization, which you may have mistaken for "a more serious mental illness".

 

Did you take all your drugs inconsistently, back to Lexapro and Cymbalta?

 

On 12/18/2021 at 3:22 PM, Altostrata said:

Did you feel well at any time since you started antidepressants in March 2018? If yes, what was the combination of drugs you were taking then?

 

Did you feel any different when Cymbalta was added to Lexapro? When trazodone was added to Cymbalta and Lexapro? Your signature shows you were taking these 3 antidepressants January- October 2019. Is that correct? 

 

How did you feel on the 3 drugs? That was about this time:

On 12/20/2021 at 9:49 PM, birdsong said:

I do know that my memory started to worsen when I was taking drugs consistently which started to affect my studies in 2018/2019.

 

You appear to have gone off Lexapro in October 2019, still on 60mg Cymbalta, a high dose, and 100mg trazodone, a lowish dose. How did you go off Cymbalta and trazodone in May 2020? Then this happened:

 

On 12/17/2021 at 1:51 PM, birdsong said:

The Wellbutrin, Zoloft, and Effexor specifically made me nauseous, stomach cramps, and restlessness that were too uncomfortable to continue taking full prescriptions.

 

In September 2021:

On 12/16/2021 at 5:35 PM, birdsong said:

I was so desperate for relief that I was prescribed buspirone 10 mg, which did initially provide a calming relief.

 

How did the buspirone effect change over time? What did you stop it?

[birdsong]

46 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

 

Taking psychiatric drugs inconsistently can cause withdrawal symptoms and many other strange symptoms, which also adds to nervous system sensitization, which you may have mistaken for "a more serious mental illness".

 

Did you take all your drugs inconsistently, back to Lexapro and Cymbalta?

 

 

Did you feel any different when Cymbalta was added to Lexapro? When trazodone was added to Cymbalta and Lexapro? Your signature shows you were taking these 3 antidepressants January- October 2019. Is that correct? 

 

How did you feel on the 3 drugs? That was about this time:

 

You appear to have gone off Lexapro in October 2019, still on 60mg Cymbalta, a high dose, and 100mg trazodone, a lowish dose. How did you go off Cymbalta and trazodone in May 2020? Then this happened:

 

 

In September 2021:

 

How did the buspirone effect change over time? What did you stop it?

@Altostrata

I think Lexapro was the one I did take consistently, at one point I just stopped. I honestly cannot remember what happened with Cymbalta. I do remember being tired a lot, so trazodone was added for sleep. For the most part, all drugs were taken inconsistently due to psychiatrist's phrase "trial and error". I was never at any point being monitored with care or properly advised to go off slowly. All were CT. Buspirone stopped "helping" once I started Luvox. 

[Altostrata]

How were you feeling when you dropped out of school?

[birdsong]

1 hour ago, Altostrata said:

How were you feeling when you dropped out of school?

@Altostrata Uncharacteristically anxious. 

[Altostrata]

On 12/23/2021 at 10:08 PM, birdsong said:

@Altostrata Uncharacteristically anxious. 

 

Please describe more what this felt like at that time.

[birdsong]

2 hours ago, Altostrata said:

 

Please describe more what this felt like at that time.

@Altostrata  Sharp pain in chest upon waking, shortness of breath, feelings of hyperarousal. It was unlike any stress or anxiety I have ever experienced. The intensity of these symptoms has definitely lessened over the weeks. 

[Altostrata]

What changes in your drugs did you make from July 2021 to September 2021, when you dropped out of school?

 

Had you been taking propanolol frequently in August 2021 and then abruptly stopped?

 

13 hours ago, birdsong said:

Sharp pain in chest upon waking, shortness of breath, feelings of hyperarousal. It was unlike any stress or anxiety I have ever experienced. The intensity of these symptoms has definitely lessened over the weeks. 

 

What is the chronology of your drug changes in the summer of 2021, emergence of the above symptoms upon waking, etc., dropping out of school, and start of insomnia in early October?

 

On 12/22/2021 at 6:34 PM, birdsong said:

Both stopped at the same time. Symptoms began a few days after (first two weeks of October). 

 

[birdsong]

1 hour ago, Altostrata said:

What changes in your drugs did you make from July 2021 to September 2021, when you dropped out of school?

 

Had you been taking propanolol frequently in August 2021 and then abruptly stopped?

 

 

What is the chronology of your drug changes in the summer of 2021, emergence of the above symptoms upon waking, etc., dropping out of school, and start of insomnia in early October?

 

 

@Altostrata 

July 2021-September 2021

I was taking propranolol PRN, abruptly stopped around end of July/early August.

Started Buspirone the first week of September PRN, abruptly stopped around first week of October.

Emergence of symptoms described above (the uncharacteristic anxiety) began the 2nd week of October. Dropped school thereafter. Currently am experiencing insomnia (since the beginning of December 2021), go to sleep between midnight-3 am and wake up by noon which has been consistent.

[Altostrata]

My guess is you have Cymbalta withdrawal from going off in May 2020, complicated by adverse reactions to all the drug combinations you took while taking Cymbalta and after going off.

 

Taking drugs irregularly for more than a month can also cause strange symptoms. If you had been taking propranolol more than once a day for several months, then suddenly quit, that can cause rebound blood pressure spikes, maybe palpitations, nervousness, and insomnia.

 

On 12/26/2021 at 3:39 PM, birdsong said:

Currently am experiencing insomnia (since the beginning of December 2021), go to sleep between midnight-3 am and wake up by noon which has been consistent.

 

Do you mean you sleep between midnight-3 a.m. and noon? How many hours of sleep do you get a night?

[birdsong]

2 hours ago, Altostrata said:

My guess is you have Cymbalta withdrawal from going off in May 2020, complicated by adverse reactions to all the drug combinations you too while taking Cymbalta and after going off.

 

Taking drugs irregularly for more than a month can also cause strange symptoms. If you had been taking propranolol more than once a day for several months, then suddenly quit, that can cause rebound blood pressure spikes, maybe palpitations, nervousness, and insomnia.

 

 

Do you mean you sleep between midnight-3 a.m. and noon? How many hours of sleep do you get a night?

Yes, sleep between midnight until noon, so I am sleeping 9-12 hours a day but have difficulty falling asleep. 

Thank you for your insight @Altostrata. I have read a lot of good advice throughout the site and as of today, the intensity of all my symptoms has lessened. Thank you very much. 

[Altostrata]

16 hours ago, birdsong said:

Yes, sleep between midnight until noon, so I am sleeping 9-12 hours a day but have difficulty falling asleep. 

 

This is not insomnia. What symptoms have lessened?

 

To strengthen your sleep:

 

Tips to help sleep -- so many of us have that awful withdrawal insomnia

 

Path to Better Sleep FREE online for everyone from the US Veterans Administration

 

Music for self-care: Calms hyperalertness, anxiety, aids relaxation and sleep

 

White noise devices for sleep

 

Melatonin for sleep: Many people find it helpful

 

TV or computer use in evening can disrupt sleep: Bright light signals the brain that it's daytime

[birdsong]

Hello @Altostrata 

Symptoms as of now: 

-weird ocd like thoughts (not about symptoms)

-weird feelings 

-some depression and confusion

-dpdr (mild but annoying)

-extreme anxiety and irritation caused by overstimulation (I have been avoiding as much stress as possible by going on walks and being in quiet places)

-visual disturbance 

-memory issues

-feeling faint upon standing up/waking up 

-numbness in limbs when falling asleep

-pain in neck that extends down my right arm

-head pressure/ache/pain in right side of head only*

-have trouble falling asleep due to the aforementioned symptom (deep breathing, eye mask, and ice pack help to fall asleep)

 

Currently taking 1/4 of 200 mg Magnesium glycinate. 

 

I will be getting an MRI w/contrast for visual & memory issues (I can barely recall what I do in a day, I did not have these problems prior to September 2021). I am too afraid to ask without the contrast but I'm also worried that my body will not react well to the dye. 

 

*I wanted to know if you might have some insight into the particular symptom I have asterisked. Have others with drug withdrawal experienced similar sensations in only specific areas of their head? I feel that if this symptom resolved, I would feel much relief. 

 

Thank you in advance if you take the time to respond. 

[Altostrata]

All of these sound like protracted withdrawal syndrome to me. Unlikely an MRI will show anything.

 

How do you feel now compare to early December?

[birdsong]

On 1/25/2022 at 2:57 PM, Altostrata said:

All of these sound like protracted withdrawal syndrome to me. Unlikely an MRI will show anything.

 

How do you feel now compare to early December?

@Altostrata

While I am not feeling too well, I am not feeling as horrible and afraid as then in December. 

[Altostrata]

43 minutes ago, birdsong said:

While I am not feeling too well, I am not feeling as horrible and afraid as then in December. 

 

Which symptoms have gotten better?

[birdsong]

59 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

 

Which symptoms have gotten better?

@Altostrata 

I don't feel extreme anxiety or fear, confusion, lack of motivation, bizzare dreams, or a lot of crying. I still feel not well enough to continue school or work but I have noticed more stability in my overall mood and well-being as the weeks progress.  Definitely appreciate all the advice given on this site as it has helped me tremendously during this time. I may or may not continue updating on my thread for the time being. Thank you for your responses.

[Altostrata]

On 1/24/2022 at 9:46 PM, birdsong said:

Currently taking 1/4 of 200 mg Magnesium glycinate. 

 

This is a very little bit of mag glycinate. How about taking 1/4 tablet 4 times a day?

 

Did you try fish oil too? 

 

On 1/24/2022 at 9:46 PM, birdsong said:

-head pressure/ache/pain in right side of head only*

 

Have you tried acupuncture, massage, or chiropractic? Some postural habit might be adding to this. Do you also have jaw pain?

[Phoenixmama]

@birdsong i did you ever get the mri with contrast?