Muddles: desperate

[bubble]

Dear Muddles,

 

crying is actually a blessing. (The worst sadness is when you can't actually cry!)

 

 

just don't feel that crying the whole day is a bad sign. Let yourself to those feelings, don't resist them, experience them fully and you will see how they will leave you much sooner (like a wave: if you just let go, it will take you to the shore).

 

Today you are wearing dark glasses so looking into the future today will unavoidably make it dark. That's natural. That's how our brain works. But if you think about it, it's not really logical. Nobody knows what future holds for us (except fortunetellers

 

This proces of healing is different from healing a physical wound in that it is not linear, that is things don't improve steadily but they go around in circles. Remember windows and waves?

 

Nothing is more disheartening than being a bit better only to be hit with the worst of the symptoms again and feeling like going back to square one. It obliterates all the positive things. A part of its horror is that it feels like it will never end. WE feel that and our feelings our authentic BUT we know we felt better again.

 

Understanding that this is the way this process functions, might help you feel more positive and accepting.

 

(It easy for me to talk like this now speaking from my window. But I'm also writing this for myself when I feel bad and I'm thinking of myself feeling the way you are feeling now). 

 

big hug!

[Muddles]

I have had an email back regarding Dr Healy. It invited me to do a Rxisk E Clinic consultation, and what I can gather it is American?? Don't understand this.

 

So I have manged to get hold of number and spoke with the secretary. Because I am not in his area I would have to speak to my doctor regarding secure funding. He may or may not be prepared as there are many so called phyciatrist's in my area. I will have to speak to my doctor but think this is going to be difficult. My doctor is not the easiest.

[Wolfhound]

Muddles,

hi. I felt like you yesterday and had a terrible night. I can feel what you are experiencing...

Concerning dr. Healy, I read on the forum that you can actually see him through some British system - NHS? when you insist that it is a patient´s choice...apparently you are intitled to it. I don´t remember where on this forum I read it, sorry.

[Muddles]

thank you bubble but I just can't help think that I'm in the worst possible situation. I'm scared that I've got that tardive dysphoria induced with long term antidepressant use. Depression was not the reason I was put on mirtazapine and this breaks me.

[Muddles]

Thank you Wolfhound. I am supposed to be going away with my husband, his family and the children for the weekend. I'm not in a place to go and it's heartbreaking. At the same time, I don't think it's a good idea to be on my own for that long either.

Sorry to hear you are suffering too....hugs from me to you.

 

Yes, we have NHS. I was prepared to pay private but he only takes through NHS.. I am going to see my doctor and push for this referal. No way will I see anybody else. Wales is quite a way from me, but will be well worth it. Fingers crossed.

 

I am thinking about trying fish oil but have no idea where from and what sort to buy?? I am wary on additives and could do with some suggestions?

I did buy some pure EPA but have noticed a lot of people use EPA/DHA combined.

Thank you.

[Muddles]

You have made me feel better bubble...I feel a bit a bit calmer, thank you.

[Wolfhound]

So in this case you should get to him because you have this right of patient choice....

I am using fish oil EPA/DHA combined but it´s some local label so it will not help you but people order it here online from iherb.com if I am not mistaken!

Keeping my fingers crossed for your doctor´s appointment. w.

[mammaP]

You can ask for a referral to Dr Healey Muddles, it is patient choice and you should 

tell the doctor that he is an expert on drug side effects and withdrawal. With all your 

problems I he should be happy to refer you. He won't even know Dr Healey or RXISK 

exist!  I have used cod liver oil capsules that I got locally and they've been good for me

but today will go to another chemist to see what else they have. 

It can be hard to find them without other vitamins and stuff added ! 

[Muddles]

I've just got back and am devestated. He does not and will not acknowledge drug side effects/withdrawel. He said I was not having any issues before losing my dad and that's it's all basically in my head. I asked him to look back through my notes - at the two major depressive breakdowns I have had since being on mirtazapine, which I had never had before. He dismissed this again saying yes I do need to see someone but not for those reasons and can not provide funding to see Dr Healy.

 

I am at a loss. This poop-out or whatever we want to call it did come full force after I lost my dad, signs were there before...vertigo and low mood but my dads death just pushed it to the extreme.

 

How can I get anyone to believe me? I am not a hypochondriac and never have been.

 

For him to look and talk to me in this way has just pushed me over the edge. But then again - if most of my friends and certain family members do not understand or believe then why would a doctor?

 

What do I do from here? Would Dr Healy even believe me?

[Muddles]

The only health professional is willing to refer me to is a CPN - most probably the same one who I sat in front of crying from the severe depression that occurred when I was first put on to mirtazapine. The one who told me to 'stick it out, you are depressed and need medication'.

 

I think I will refrain from that avenue thank you Doctor. And I will refrain from ever sitting in that office again.

 

I need to switch doctors...he's messed me up far too much and he's attitude is abysmal.

[Wolfhound]

I feel so sorry for you.

But if you do have this patient choice, you must get it! I don´t know the British system, but shouldn´t it be a question of being assertive and repeat to the doctor that it´s your choice and you are entitled to it? The broken record technique...

Btw, I completely lost hope in that field. I will never get anyone to believe me. And there´s no dr. Healy here. Even if I had never in my life prior to meds any depression, anxieties and so on, not a single doctor believes me that I can have WD symptoms. It took me enormous force to persuade some that I had an adverse reactions to drugs, but all the symptoms I am currently having - no way. I feel so lonely and so bitter...what I find worse is that there is probably no therapist who will believe me. All is in your head, you are depressed, anxious and you have OCD. Plus you are unable to assess your personality, dear lady, when you don´t acknowledge that the problem is in you, you have serious personality problem.

So I have only SA as a support. I sincerely wish you can get to Healy.

[bubble]

I agree with Wolfhound, insist on your patient rights. But this is soooo hard even when you are at your best ;( fighting the system.

 

I also wouldn't expect any doctor to believe any of this (that's why somebody suggested put them all on ADs for a few months, preferablly trying out a few in the process to find out which suits them best, and increase it and decrease it here and there of course. Then ship them to a far away deserted island stripping them of ADs because they are not addictive and so on. And then come after a month to ask them if there is such thing as withdrawal.  

 

Changing doctors is another option. My GP can write a referral for any specialist of my choice here (except that there is no such specialist in my case as in Wolfhound's). 

 

hang in there!

[Meimeiquest]

You asked if Dr. Healy would believe you...several people from here have gone and he believed them all. However, he is a bit short on magic wands . But who knows what he might have for you. But even people he couldn't really help felt very validated.

[Muddles]

Thanks all for your input. It's very helpful.

 

I am going to seek out another doctor for sure.

This doctor has failed me many times. His anger towards me today was very un-professional and un-called for. My husband is disgusted.

 

I am determined to see Dr Healy now. I wish he would take private patients - would be so much easier. Doctors cannot refer patients to physchiatrist's from out of the area unfortunately. They need funds to do this and my Dr is no way prepared to do it.

 

I hope you've all had a better day than me????

[Altostrata]

Dr. Healy does see private patients.

[Muddles]

Thanks Alto but his secretary says he doesn't?

[Muddles]

I know a lot of ladies on here seem to suffer more when they have their monthly period.

I seem to be the opposite? It seems once I stop my contraceptive pill for the break I feel my depression lift slightly?? I have always been sensitive to hormonal changes - throughout pregnancy and after never felt right but am wondering if the contraceptive pill may be a factor?

 

Anybody stopped taking the pill while in withdrawel?

[mammaP]

I haven't stopped the pill in withdrawal but it definitely seemed to make me depressed. 

I tried a couple of different ones but didn't get on with them. 

 

I'm so sorry you doctor was being so awful to you. I was looking at the UK mind website

earlier, maybe someone there could advise you on how to get a referral to Dr Healey.

 

http://www.mind.org.uk/

[Muddles]

Thanks mammaP. Will look into that.

 

I have today felt like I've took 100 antihistamines. I used to use a nasal antihistamine before and the taste and sensation in my nasal area is the same.

 

I feel intoxicated. Does anyone ever feel like this?

[Muddles]

I've made it away for the weekend with my family.

 

Was in the car travelling when I wrote my last post. Was really panicky and just wanted to cry as I just didn't feel right at all, new symtoms to have to deal with. I definitely think those symptoms are antihistamine related.

 

We have come down south to a caravan park with my husbands family. We are lucky as we have been upgraded and the caravan is brand new!

 

I've only cried twice since I've been here - basically because it's different now - nothing seems real or right. I thought those horrible thoughts would go for a while but the buggers are atill there! Ignore them...ignore them!!

 

Very different from the previous breaks we have.

However, I've done it! My kids are loving it and that's the main thing.

I will probably find it less stressful here to be honest. Hide away in my posh caravan while kids are off swimming and playing with their cousins who they adore. I couldn't have done this a few weeks ago. I couldn't even leave my bed with athkasia. Fortunately that has passed. I'm glad I'm having a break from that....torture.

 

I know I need to reduce mirtazapine again. Waiting to feel stable before I cut down isn't going to happen. Scary!????

 

Hope you are all ok. I really am grateful for this site. I always feel better after posting on here.

I Don't feel so alone.

[Petunia]

Hi Muddles,

I'm smiling and so happy to hear this update, even though you are not feeling the best, its still great that you are managing to do it, its such an improvement.  I'm sure you will make a full recovery in time, may take a while, but you will get there.

 

I'm glad you found this site and that we can all help you to feel less alone.

 

Petu.

[mammaP]

It is lovely to see that you have made it Muddles, it is such a huge step forward for you and 

proof that you are healing.  Enjoy the weekend and when you are home and recovered 

from the travelling maybe think about a tiny cut. I'm so pleased for you 

[mattinsmom]

You made it. What a huge step that was.

 

There is nothing wrong with crying. For years I refused and then it finally broke. I feel better after a good cry. I don't seem to have much say in when they come anymore, sometimes they pop up for no obvious reason. Go with it. It will pass. 

 

The pill - my son's girlfriend noticed a significant change when she went off of it. She hadn't realized how strongly she was feeling negative side-effects until she stopped taking it. Random info.

 

Have a great rest of your weekend. 

[Wolfhound]

Muddles,

it is really great that you made it. You see you are so strong!! I would not be able to do it, I am so happy for you!

How did you feel travelling? Were you more anxious?

I am simply amazed and that is a huge step forward.

W.

[Muddles]

Thank you, you lovely lot!

 

I am home now. I didn't struggle with travelling as I am feeling apathy and depression kind of mixed together if that's possible? I used to drive if we ever went away but couldn't because my concentration is not very good.

 

I had terrible fits of uncontrollable crying - still am. It's cones from nowhere and happens anywhere which is a bit embarrassing. The envy was there all weekend along with the thoughts. Doubts of 'how the hell am I going to get off this drug' and so on.

But I did it and did the best I could and kept telling myself that I couldn't have done this weeks ago.

The children loved being with their family. They are such a lovely, happy go lucky kind of family and made a big fuss of them. I had to tell them about what's going on as they could see I wasn't right. Not sure they totally understood but were very supportive.

 

I am going to hopefully change my doctor tomorrow. My friend has a female doctor who is supposed to be very nice. I am going to ring dr Healy's receptionist and beg for a private appointment....don't know if it will work but it's worth a shot.

 

Hope you all had a decent weekend .

 

Wolfhound - was thinking about you at the weekend.

[bubble]

I took some time off of the forum to enjoy nature and focus at but was thinking of you two

 

Things are continuing to improve I dare say. Very happy about your weekend away. Improving doesn't mean it's good but it's visibly different than what it was even a week ago. Very promising!

 

I just wanted to tell you that I very much liked the fact that you are looking at the positive developments (it's natural that you at the same time grieve the loss of normal experiencing) but focus on improvements however slight was something that saved me during my withdrawal. I worked all that time and I crammed as much activity as I could in however small windows I had being awfully grateful for them while at other times I would just check out and repeat to myself that that was going to pass. It's been 6 months since I reinstated and things are significantly better. 6 month s a lot of time. But in a bigger scheme of things it's not (Learnt many new things from great new people, etc. Learnt that I can survive unimaginable horrors, grateful for little blessings

 

hope you manage to get hold of dr. healey (athough you are succeeding just as well, additional reassurance is more than welcome)

 

big hug 

[Muddles]

Hi bubble! Thanks for thinking of us. Pleased to hear you have been enjoying nature! I plan to go for a walk over to the forest at the weekend if the weather is ok. I am so pleased you are in a better place now. 'Slowly and steady wins the race' as they say.

 

I spoke to Dr Healy's receptionist again and she said referal must be made by a doctor. I spoke to my doctor again and he is going to refer me but its down to Dr Healy if he decides to see me or not. I will change doctors once this is all sorted.

 

I am not seeping again as depression is so deep it keeps me awake. It feels so raw.

 

I am convinced this antidepressant has totally run it's cause and in the process taken away any all seritonin on its way. Hence the depression, suicidle thoughts and apathy and the frontal lobe complete dead strange feeling.

 

Is the brain capable of producing its own at any point in withdrawing or after? I'm really terrified at the moment. I keep thinking if a way out. Don't like it one bit ????. I just need to know what to expect. Not a lot of people are in this situation when withdrawing and I'm losing hope quickly.

[Muddles]

My friends mother has gone cold turkey off mirtazapine. Our other friend told me.

I'm sure they think I'm crazy with what's happening to me. I know she may have withdrawel but its obvious they have not taken anything i have stressed. She will probably sail through with no effects, who knows?

But like my husband said earlier - 'everybody reacts differently to medication, we don't know why but doctors need to be aware'. Why the hell aren't they aware after these drugs being in the market for so long? I cried for my god-mother earlier who took her own life whilst on Prozac. She probably wasn't aware that it was probably the antidepressant. Shucks - I wanna stand on the roof and shout about this crap. Wish I could maybe spread the word somehow without everybody thinking I was insane!

 

Peace to you all.

[mammaP]

I know exactly what you mean Muddles, I went through a phase of telling anyone who stood still

about how dangerous they are and how withdrawal is crippling people!  But they will not listen

because the doctors are still spouting the rubbish about them.  Hopefully your friends mum will 

be ok or reinstate at the first sign of withdrawal. 

[Wolfhound]

Great you got the referral to Dr. Healy! It´s really an achievement! I am happy for you.W.

[Muddles]

Back to where I was weeks ago. I really can't take this mental and physical torture anymore.

I am not strong enough, not like you guys on here. Looking at my children - what the hell have I done to them...what will I do to them and everyone else if I listen to my head.

Most beautiful children and they don't deserve this.

[mammaP]

Yes you can take it Muddles, you have had a window, a small one but a window. You will get more

windows, it is a sign that you are healing.  No your children don't deserve this, and neither do you.

No-one deserves it, it is not your fault. Your children had a lovely weekend and will remember that.

They will probably not even remember this when they grow up. They have other memories, other

people in their lives and are surrounded by love.  

 

You will get better, just remember that, and remember the moments that you enjoyed on your trip.

Hang on to those memories, they are a taste of what is to come. 

[mattinsmom]

You can do this. I believe in you. 

[Wolfhound]

Oh Muddles,

did you make a cut or did it just come?

Please, stay with us. I know EXACTLY where you are ... I have been in this place for more than seven months now. And you know I am desperate at times thinking all my strength and capacities are lost. But somehow I made it to this day.

You had better days. They will reappear. I personally hate to read these words when I am suicidal because I don´t believe it at the moment, but it is true, better days or maybe better hours will reappear.

I am thinking of you. If I could pray I would be praying for you but I could not. I am sending you a bunch of positive thoughts. You know I have children like you and my struggles are like yours. We can do it. W.

[Muddles]

Wolfhound - I have re-activated my Facebook account and sent you a friend request.

 

No words today but want to thank you for the encouragement, kindness and support you have given me over the last few months.

[bubble]

Sometimes words don't help...

 

but just want to say that I'm thinking about you and understand (and we all feel very, very weak sometimes, very often...)

 

big hug!