Muddles: desperate

[Muddles]

 

 

I simply can't fight anymore. It's gotten hold of me.

[bubble]

I wish I coulddo something...

[Meimeiquest]

Muddles, I am so sorry it is so hard. I don't have nearly your level of pain, but I follow this pattern after a push for a special thing. I think this might just be backlash from your little trip. Hang on and see if it won't lighten.

[Muddles]

Thank you Bubble. That made me cry...not on a bad way. Comforting and wish sometimes we all lived in the same town. A hug from somebody who really 'gets it'.

 

I feel quite trippy today which is very uncomfortable. It's taking me back to when it happened not long after starting mirtazapine. It was awful. I remember phoning the Cpn and telling her but she had never heard such side effects and insisted it was anxiety.

 

Why would I listen to her? Why didn't I trust my own instincts? Why would the doctor tell me that citalapram wasn't an antidepressant and why did he refuse to believe I had a bad reaction to both drugs! And why the hell do they think prescribing drugs is a cure all! I was stressed...looking after 2 children on my own because my husband worked away, having to work myself in a stressful environment and basically trying to be superwoman! I missed the signs...I was running on adrenaline for a while. This could have been sorted by a simple few questions from the doc and maybe some CBT. He didn't ask about my lifestyle. He didn't have time. Chucking pills at me saved him time and money.

 

Questions that cannot be answered and I cannot turn back time but this keeps going around and around my head all day along with the other bad stuff.

 

I'm praying for a response of Dr Healy.

[bubble]

I liked this cartoon so much when I first saw it and it struck me as a simple and powerful truth: sometimes we don't need words and explanations, we know it all. It just hurts and all that helps is having somebody who doesn't give advice or asks questions but is just there for us and with us. That's why I went to find it for you yesterday...

 

It would indeed be great if we lived in the same town But we have this delightful community that Alto designed and maintains with so much wisdom.

 

I understand all those questions and the need to make them. But the only comforting thing is that we now know better and that this won't happen again.

 

Was also thinking that being hit by a wave is always brutal and especially so after the first window. Not only are you again going through all the horror as if it never abated but you also mourn the loss of that beam of light that said things might be coming to their end. The special awfulness of this process is that it is not linear, it doesn't get better continuously however slow and slight but it comes in windows and waves, 1 step forward and then maybe even 2 steps back. But if you accept this nasty nature of the recovery process, it gets a bit easier.

 

    When you come to your second window and see that things do get better again, it will be a tiny bit easier to accept the next way. Not to mention the fact that windows will get clearer and longer and waves less disturbing and dismantling.. So we just repeat to ourselves: this is a wave and it will pass, these are neuroemotions and I will not believe them. It makes the horror a tiny bit easier and that is a lot..

 

big hug!

[Muddles]

I really, really, can't go on. I have distorted vision and the deepest, most painful depression known to man. The thoughts are turning to urges again....I want to die. I'm sorry.

[Muddles]

I'm sorry. I shouldn't put such things on here.

[bubble]

it's ok. I'm thinking about you a lot. A lot of us are thinking about you.

 

I feel privileged that you came here today and shared with us how you are feeling.

 

I was thinking a lot yesterday and today how you said that you can't fight any more. Fight for 'normal' functioning, give in to the urge to just be the way you feel like now?

 

I felt exactly like that 6 months ago. I just lied in bed like a shapeless heap devoid of everything that used to define who I am. I was fighting so hard to change that and to be more like I was used to be. But I absolutely couldn't. I thought that giving up fighting at that time would mean I would from then on be a shapeless heap devoid of things that define me forever.

 

Yesterday I cleared my wardrobe after 6 months. I bought myself some new clothes after 6 months. It came naturally. I didn't fight for it. But I waited for it for 6 long, long months.

 

When I was lying, I read the Power of Now where it said if you feel like you can't do anything, don't do anything. Accept it in the present moment. just now I can't do anything. Try not to project it into future.

 

sorry for too much theory.

 

big, big hug

[bubble]

We are all privileged that you put such things here

[bubble]

I'm waiting for good news of dark clouds parting

 

but appreciate very much any update

 

I believe you can do whatever it takes

[Meimeiquest]

Dear Muddles, When all is black, I don't know if you would be frightened or encouraged by others' journeys through the valley. If you want, there is a thread on it. I believe it is called Suicide Ideation or Suicidal Ideation.

[mammaP]

Dear Muddles, When all is black, I don't know if you would be frightened or encouraged by others' journeys through the valley. If you want, there is a thread on it. I believe it is called Suicide Ideation or Suicidal Ideation.

Here is the thread Meime mentioned Muddles, it is good to read others experiences and know that you are not 

alone, and to know that this is not you it is the drugs.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/4678-suicide-ideation/?hl=%2Bsuicidal+%2Bideation#entry58265

This will not last forever, it will pass, I know I keep saying that

but just want to keep that thought at the fore.  I remember feeling the same way and it is crippling, but it did get better.

I hope you get another window very soon Muddles, we are all rooting for you. 

[Muddles]

Thank you all. I'm still here. I hope to see better times soon.

The support here is invaluable. Thank you.

[Rhiannon]

I've been there, Muddles. It will pass. Hang on. You'll be glad later that you did.

[bubble]

Thank you for updating us. Every day is bringing you closer to the end of this wave. You are being very strong.

[Muddles]

I want to run - I don't know where.

 

I use to look forward to my children coming home from school. I use to get that lovely warm feeling. I used to burst with pride when I spoke about them. This has gone. It's replaced with a terrible feeling of something I can't describe. I look at mothers and envy there life. I have lost mine. I have lost that mother who did anything and everything for them. To have to face this for years, for them to grow up with this...tragic.

Totally robbed by antidepressants.

 

I would lose all my limbs and more to just be that mother I once was. I would do absolutely anything.

 

I hear of people suffering like this at the lower end of tapering or once getting off. I have not heard of anyone suffering so much in poop-out at a high dose like this. I cannot face years of this, I simply can't. I am wailing like a new born baby. None stop - this is cruel and ones most worst nightmare. Something none of us should have been subjected to.

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Yours is truly a sad story, Muddles. Hope you feel better soon. What are you doing to help yourself feel better?

[Petunia]

I'm sorry you are still in a bad wave Muddles, I know what its like, each one feels like its going to be for ever, but they never are.  Remember back to just over a week ago when you went away on holiday and felt a little better, it was a small window and how recovery begins, in tiny little stages.

 

This wave will decrease and better feelings will come, hang in there, it may take some time, but you will be ok.

 

If you put some information about your drug and withdrawal history in your signature, it would help members to relate to your particular situation and be better able to offer support and suggestions.  I know you are having a difficult time right now, but it would help us to help you more.  Here are the instructions for how to do it:

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/893-please-put-your-withdrawal-history-in-your-signature/

 

(hugs)

Petu.

[Muddles]

My husband mentioned hospital.

 

When I thought the depression could not get any worse it has. It's painful - I cannot sleep it too deep. Facial and sinus pain did not help either. I'm not quite sure what this is? Popping in my nose too!

 

I cannot do my med history off my phone?

[mammaP]

Muddles maybe you have a sinus infection?  I had sinus infections a lot in the past .

After a long time I eventually had antibiotics which cleared it pretty quickly .

 

I am so sorry that you are still in this wave. I hope Dr Healey sees you soon, I think 

I would send him a link to this thread, and tell him that you are here and Altostrata

recommended him.   Your doctor is a disgrace but sadly is typical of a lot of doctors.

   . I can see why your husband is suggesting hospital, it must be very difficult for

him seeing you in such pain, but I think hospital will pump you full of other drugs! 

 

I wish I could give you a real hug. 

Edited April 9, 2014 by mammaP
Correct error

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Maybe you could get better help from the group if you added a signature to your posts? After you sign in, scroll to the bottom of the page and click on 'full version'. Then go back up to the top right and click on your name. In the box that drops down click on 'my settings'. You'll find your signature entry there.

 

I read through your thread and could only find a mention of you taking 13.5 mg mirtazapine and at times quite a bit of Valium. Several mods recommended you start tapering the mirt but it seems you never did or didn't say so. So this could go in your SIG if you are tapering.

 

What are you doing to help yourself? Have you tried anything in the Symptoms and Self Care forum? Eating well, getting some exercise daily? Taking magnesium and fish oil? The volunteers here can only make suggestions, you have to be the one to do something. Everyone hopes to see your suffering lessen.

 

Hope you are feeling better today.

[Muddles]

I have added my signature.

 

MammaP - i read your post and for some reason went and checked up my nose. have polyps up there, which causes sinisitus.

 

I am so scared to try any supplements but I suppose I'll never know unless I try. I'm always worried about different brands and additives.

 

Two of my friends came to see me earlier. One of them has a husband who had to withdraw from an antidepressant that was taken off the market years ago. She totally understands how hard this is. She reminded me of how I was a couple off weeks ago....the cocky, funny Sarah was there for a short time....I need to hold on to that.

[Muddles]

I think the polyps are related to the reduction of anthistime in mirtazapine. Sinisitus is common in withdrawel. Ugh!!

[Muddles]

How can one be suicidle all day and then sit down calmly with my sister discussing my concerns about polyps???

[Meimeiquest]

That would be the medication-induced kind . I did the weirdest stop/start stuff with my Cymbalta WD.

[bubble]

I was away a bit but continue to keep an eye on you.

 

I'm glad you added your signature and that CW asked about it. I just assumed you were holding the dose (which you were...)

 

But now when I look at the sign, I don't know when you started taking Mirtazipine: you mention Citalopram in 2005, and then suffering on M., poop out in December 2013 but it doesn't say when you started it, at what dose and how that dose changed.

 

The most important thing is that you have been holding at 13.5 since December? (and started experiencing windows, that is a small one followed by  avery dark wave).

 

The timeline can't help us much now except explain and rationalise the severity of symptoms...

 

The discussion about polyps shows that horrible symptoms are just withdrawal induced symptoms and that beneath that surface there is still that beautiful and strong person and loving mother. (You know how the storm can rage at the surface of the ocean but beneath it its waters are calm and unperturbed).

 

Once this wave is over you will feel so much stronger. The first wave after the first window is the worst. Almsot worse than the initial withdrawal.

 

but you are getting there

 

big hug 

[Muddles]

Thanks Bubble. I'm so tired of it all.

I hope you are ok?

 

I started mirtazapine back in 2005.

It was given to me after what I know now to be an adverse reaction....that terrible akathasia.

Doctor kept me on it for a week, mentioning bi-polar. I had lost a stone in weight and had not slept a wink. Valium was given at an emergency out of hours doctor..it didn't touch it.

Went back to doc's - he was angry with me and told me I needed to calm down!!!!! Prescribed mirtazapine. Took only a couple of mg....zonked me out for 14 hours straight. Took tiny pieces for a month after. Stopped - had a big anxiety attack two weeks later. Took a small piece of mirtazapine again and this was a disaster...hence going up to 15mg. Akathasia developed - CPN involved. Told me to up my dose to 30 as at this point developed a crippling depression too.

Ignored Cpn...thank god and arrived on taking it at 15mg. Developed OCD and intrusive thoughts but was told it was me. I had developed all this over night!!! Carried on taking it for 5 years, suffered two big break downs.

December - poop out after my fathers death, although signs were there months before.

 

Can't remember when I did my first cut...a couple of months ago.

 

I know that person is still there somewhere. I experienced a bizarre episode that only lasted for minutes back in January....a moment of clarity where I was that person before drugs. It made me realise just how much these drugs had messed me up. It was a heavenly moment.

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

What are you doing to help yourself? Have you tried anything in the Symptoms and Self Care forum? Eating well, getting some exercise daily? Taking magnesium and fish oil?

Meditation? Supplements? Anything?

 

What can we do to help?

[mammaP]

Maybe you could try a tiny cut of  maybe half a mg?  How do you get your dose of 13.5, do you have 

liquid or tablets? Liquid would be best for titrating small amounts. Here is the topic on tapering

mirtazapine, I'm sure you will have read it but will put the link in for you. 

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/5301-tips-for-tapering-off-remeron-mirtazapine/?hl=mirtazapine

 

This will get better Muddles, it is really hard for you but you will get there. 

[Petunia]

Thank you for adding your signature Muddles.  I'm wondering if what you are experiencing is more an adverse reaction to the drug, from what you have written, that's what it looks like to me.  Have you ever felt well while taking them?

 

Perhaps you could do as MammaP suggested and try a small reduction.  It may not make you feel better, but if reducing doesn't make your symptoms worse, it may help in that as your reduce the dose over time, you could start to feel better.

 

You are having some small windows, so try and hold onto that as being a positive sign that you will recover.

[Muddles]

Thank you.

It's definitely an adverse reaction - but poop-out generally does that.

 

When you're are in this kind of depression - nothing but nothing helps. I try. I have absolutely no connection with my surroundings at all. The terrible thoughts and then the thoughts of leaving my babies is truly heartbreaking. The person has gone that once was - I am a shell.

 

You all truly believe that this journey will get better? My withdrawel has only just begun and symtoms are severe now....no way!

[bubble]

Yes, I most trully believe this journey will get better.

 

I've been in such states in my time that I thought nobody will ever put Humpty Dumpty together again. But after such experiences I had experiences of feeling better than ever.

 

There is yet another member who's been advised to go down in our slow way that helps us stay in control of the whole process. So I'm actually quite enthusiastic about this course of action. I think we have nothing to lose and it can only get better.

 

Any developments on dr. Healy front?

[Muddles]

I'm just so scared bubbles. I am bad now. If I cut and perhaps get worse i don't think I will trust myself. Dr Healy will not see me through the nhs, he will talk to me through his risk clinic though. He sent me an email this morning.

[bubble]

I understand completely. Fear is the worst part of it all. 

 

I've read what MammaP and Petu wrote several times but they don't seem to mention the possibility of things taking turn for the worse. So we better wait to see what they have to say on that. 

 

I'm glad you have finally found a way to talk to dr. Healy and I hope it happens soon

[Petunia]

 It may not make you feel better, but if reducing doesn't make your symptoms worse, it may help in that as your reduce the dose over time, you could start to feel better.

 

I'm sorry, I probably should have added, if it makes you feel worse, you could put the dose back up again.  But this has to be your decision Muddles, I really don't know, it was just a suggestion because you have been feeling so unwell on this dose and have a pattern of adverse reactions to these kinds of drugs.

 

Perhaps we should wait and see what Dr. Healy suggests. Was his email helpful?

[Muddles]

Thanks both.

 

Going up a is not an option. I really can't stabilize with what's happened.

 

This is not fair *stamps feet and shouts like a small child*!! This is truly gonna mess my kids up.

They are sensitive kids. I had so many plans made. My daughter is approaching her teenage years and needs her mum. All mum can do is stay in bed all day! What life is this for children?

 

I would have all of my limbs taken away to not have to go through this.