Frogie: how to taper off Lexapro and Xanax?

[manymoretodays]

8 hours ago, Frogie said:

3/5/18

 

6:30 am woke up took 2.0mg Lexapro and 1mg Xanax

6:45 am fed Brownie 

7:00 am ate breakfast

11:00 am took 1mg Xanax and Milk Thistle

12:00 pm ate lunch

4:30 pm took 1mg Xanax 

6:00 pm ate dinner

7:00 - 10:00 pm watched tv

10:00 pm went to bed

1:30 am woke up got drink of water went right back to sleep

Watched tv all day

 

 

3/6/18

6:30 am woke up took 2mg Lexapro and 1mg Xanax 

6:45 am fed Brownie

7:00 am ate breakfast - started crying - cried all day

11:00 am took 1mg Xanax and Milk Thistle 

12:00 pm ate lunch - boiled eggs

2:00 (around - rode exercise bike for 15 minutes)

4:30 pm took 1mg Xanax 

6:00 pm ate dinner

7:00 - 9:00 pm watched tv 

9:00 pm went to bed

1:30 am woke up but went right back to sleep

Watched tv all day and cried

 

 

 

 

Hi Frogie,

Good job.  Have you dropped one dose of Xanax?  I'm counting only 3 doses.  Your signature notes say you take it 4x/day.

Sorry about the tears.  I still do them.......tears and release a lot of pent up stuff sometimes that way.  Also neuroemotions, I am sure are at play here.  You did great with that bike and perhaps taking it too easy........Idk really........maybe you need the rest and recoup short term right now.

 

I'll have to study this further with some of my newfound information at hand.  The snow in the valleys is mostly melted now and it is very springlike here.......getting some catchup home and other work done.  Self care too.......which often involves signing in here.  Hope things are well enough today for you.

But woah........excellent, well done!

 

Love, peace, inrecovery/healing, and growth,

mmt

[Frogie]

5 minutes ago, manymoretodays said:

 

Hi Frogie,

Good job.  Have you dropped one dose of Xanax?  I'm counting only 3 doses.  Your signature notes say you take it 4x/day.

Sorry about the tears.  I still do them.......tears and release a lot of pent up stuff sometimes that way.  Also neuroemotions, I am sure are at play here.  You did great with that bike and perhaps taking it too easy........Idk really........maybe you need the rest and recoup short term right now.

 

I'll have to study this further with some of my newfound information at hand.  The snow in the valleys is mostly melted now and it is very springlike here.......getting some catchup home and other work done.  Self care too.......which often involves signing in here.  Hope things are well enough today for you.

But woah........excellent, well done!

 

Love, peace, inrecovery/healing, and growth,

mmt

Thanks MMT:

 

I am "allowed" 4 Xanax a day, but rarely take the night one. It's for emergencies only lol... It's always been like that. 

I know I need to get on the exercise bike everyday, but had phone calls to make today. Maybe tonight while I'm watching tv. I just have to start out slow. I cried yesterday a lot. Pity party. But it felt good and I cleared myself up. I've been teary today but only once.

 

I'm so jelous of your snow. I don't think where I live it is supposed to get snow anymore. I think we get summer, summer, summer and a couple weeks of fall. It's going to be in the 70's this weekend and next week.

 

Let me know if you have any other questions.

 

Thanks for spending time with me.

 

Take care,

Frogie xx

[Frogie]

43 minutes ago, Flowers said:

Glad you are better today but annoying having to deal with all those phone calls.

 

We are Weds March 7 at 11.30 pm so we are 8 hours ahead of you.

 

Off to bed now!

 

Coco and Bailey are now drenched as it is raining heavily outside! They send hugs back to Brownie!

 

Love from Flowers xxx

You are 8 hours ahead. Just wondered. I go to bed between 8:30-9:00 every night, you beat me staying up. 

 

I would settle for rain if we can't get snow. But we are going to be in the 70's over the weekend and next week. All we get is summer, summer, summer and a couple weeks of fall where we have to rake leaves.

 

Brownie says thanks for the hugs but now I want to go outside. She knows it's nice out and loves to stand on the deck and bark.

 

Sleep well.

 

Take care,

Frogie xx

[Downbutnotout]

Sorry you’re having problems. At least you’re feeling emotions. So if you can cry, you’ll be able to feel happy too. That is a gift. 

[Frogie]

7 minutes ago, Downbutnotout said:

Sorry you’re having problems. At least you’re feeling emotions. So if you can cry, you’ll be able to feel happy too. That is a gift. 

I probably could feel happy if I wasn't stuck.

 

[manymoretodays]

On 3/7/2018 at 7:14 AM, Frogie said:

3/5/18

 

6:30 am woke up took 2.0mg Lexapro and 1mg Xanax

6:45 am fed Brownie 

7:00 am ate breakfast

11:00 am took 1mg Xanax and Milk Thistle

12:00 pm ate lunch

4:30 pm took 1mg Xanax 

6:00 pm ate dinner

7:00 - 10:00 pm watched tv

10:00 pm went to bed

1:30 am woke up got drink of water went right back to sleep

Watched tv all day

 

 

3/6/18

6:30 am woke up took 2mg Lexapro and 1mg Xanax 

6:45 am fed Brownie

7:00 am ate breakfast - started crying - cried all day

11:00 am took 1mg Xanax and Milk Thistle 

12:00 pm ate lunch - boiled eggs

2:00 (around - rode exercise bike for 15 minutes)

4:30 pm took 1mg Xanax 

6:00 pm ate dinner

7:00 - 9:00 pm watched tv 

9:00 pm went to bed

1:30 am woke up but went right back to sleep

Watched tv all day and cried

 

 

 

 

 

Hi Frogie,

So it sounds like the tears let up a bit perhaps?  Hope so.  I'm going through a bit of an adjustment myself.  Taking a day or more to lick my wounds before soldiering on.

 

The only thing that I think you might consider is perhaps changing your Xanax/alpralozam dose  to a different time than your Lexapro/excitalopram dose.  Perhaps a bit later in the morning....... and then continue on with the 4 and 1/2 hour intervals between dosing with the alpralozam for now.  You might want to wait another week or so however as you are just barely a week out from your 10% Lexapro/escitalopram taper.

 

Love, peace, healing/inrecovery, and growth,

mmt

 

 

Edited March 8, 2018 by manymoretodays

[Frogie]

1 hour ago, manymoretodays said:

 

 

Hi Frogie,

So it sounds like the tears let up a bit perhaps?  Hope so.  I'm going through a bit of an adjustment myself.  Taking a day or more to lick my wounds before soldiering on.

 

The only thing that I think you might consider is perhaps changing your Xanax/alpralozam dose  to a different time than your Lexapro/excitalopram dose.  Perhaps a bit later in the morning....... and then continue on with the 4 and 1/2 hour intervals between dosing with the alpralozam for now.  You might want to wait another week or so however as you are just barely a week out from your 10% Lexapro/escitalopram taper.

 

Love, peace, healing/inrecovery, and growth,

mmt

 

 

Hi MMT:

 

I'm sorry you are going through it today. It's horrible!

 

I've felt teary today but haven't cried. I rode the exercise bike for 20 minutes today. I actually went 12.4mph. Wore me out. I think every other day is good since I haven't exercised in who knows how long.  But I have absolutely no appetite today. I've drank water and eaten a banana, but don't feel sick. Do you ever do that?

 

Do you really think it's a good idea to move my meds? This is the way I've taken them since being on them. I just don't want to rock the boat.

 

We have a 40% chance of snow/rain Tuesday, but I'm sure it will change before Tuesday comes. I think they like to tease me lol...

 

Thanks.

 

Take care,

Frogie xx

[manymoretodays]

Hi Frogie,

 

I think that you are right, if you don't want to rock the boat.    And just 10 days out from your 10% decrease. 

 

Did you venture outside, even if just for a bit?  Thankfully we are having sunshine so I got outside and read for a bit.  No need for a jacket or anything which was great.  Dreaming on gardening, and I could actually start doing some prep now.

 

I suppose I did at one time way back, try to manage on a banana and water.........I wouldn't recommend it though.  I did do Ensure's for awhile and during that period would manage to eat at least one meal though.  Even when I had zero appetite.   Whether I was hungry or not.   Kind of did a every 4 hour feeding, at least......to keep my energy up and smooth out the moods.  Because it without a doubt, made me feel better.  It still does.  Smaller meals throughout the day, I'm like a toddler with my snacks.  Things like carrots and nuts and berries.  And then my ever present tea.  I really like my herbal teas a lot, and I swear that some of them do help me stay balanced and alert.

 

I'm doing okay.  Will get my one ski day in with my brother.  And lately.......with this adjustment/change that I precipitated........it's like good day.......tougher day.........then good day......so just going to get on back to every day is good enough.  Exactly what it's supposed to be.  And I do have a hand in it really.........as far as discipline goes and routines and attitudes and outlooks .  I'm not nearly as structured as you are........yet.  So there's that on your side. 

 

Okay.....nightie nite on this side of the Mississippi,

L, P, H/IR, and Growth,

mmt

[Frogie]

8 hours ago, manymoretodays said:

Hi Frogie,

 

I think that you are right, if you don't want to rock the boat.    And just 10 days out from your 10% decrease. 

 

Did you venture outside, even if just for a bit?  Thankfully we are having sunshine so I got outside and read for a bit.  No need for a jacket or anything which was great.  Dreaming on gardening, and I could actually start doing some prep now.

 

I suppose I did at one time way back, try to manage on a banana and water.........I wouldn't recommend it though.  I did do Ensure's for awhile and during that period would manage to eat at least one meal though.  Even when I had zero appetite.   Whether I was hungry or not.   Kind of did a every 4 hour feeding, at least......to keep my energy up and smooth out the moods.  Because it without a doubt, made me feel better.  It still does.  Smaller meals throughout the day, I'm like a toddler with my snacks.  Things like carrots and nuts and berries.  And then my ever present tea.  I really like my herbal teas a lot, and I swear that some of them do help me stay balanced and alert.

 

I'm doing okay.  Will get my one ski day in with my brother.  And lately.......with this adjustment/change that I precipitated........it's like good day.......tougher day.........then good day......so just going to get on back to every day is good enough.  Exactly what it's supposed to be.  And I do have a hand in it really.........as far as discipline goes and routines and attitudes and outlooks .  I'm not nearly as structured as you are........yet.  So there's that on your side. 

 

Okay.....nightie nite on this side of the Mississippi,

L, P, H/IR, and Growth,

mmt

Ok I'm not going to change anything with the meds.

 

It's been windy (like usual), so I haven't been out. I need to though. But I rode the exercise bike again yesterday.

 

I did eat a little last night. I made an egg salad sandwich. I can't drink Ensure, has milk in it. If it was lactose free I would drink them.

 

I don't enjoy gardening. We did it when we 1st moved here. What a pain. All the weeds and having to water it 2-3 times a day because it was so hot. Now we have a hot tub sitting there.

 

They said 40% chance of snow already gone. No snow or rain. We are under fire watch. It's dry.

 

I'm not structured. If you could see me you would laugh.

 

Well, hope you get your skiing in and again, thanks for talking to me. It helps.

 

Take care,

Frogie xx

[Frogie]

I woke up with shortness of breath and a horrible headache.

 

The wind is blowing, it seems like 100mph but it's only 35mph.

 

Maybe it's the pressure change with the wind and 64 degrees.

 

I took 2 ibuprofen and just sitting here with Brownie hoping it works soon.

 

Hope everyone is well.

 

Don't forget to change your clocks ahead Sunday morning at 2am (we will before we go to bed Saturday).

 

Take care,

Frogie xx

[Dalalea]

9 hours ago, Frogie said:

I'm not structured. If you could see me you would laugh.

I have my entire "healing plan" on a checklist because of how unstructured I am! I would forget everything if I didn't. It goes with me everywhere! My husband was the structured one. When I lost him, I bounced around a lot! That's been going on 14 years and I still bounce from one thing to another! I guess it's my personality.

It's been dry here, too! You've probably heard about all the fires!

 

Windy days give me headaches and my asthma starts causing problems. I hope you're feeling a little better by now.

Have a good evening!

 

 

[Frogie]

1 minute ago, Dalalea said:

I have my entire "healing plan" on a checklist because of how unstructured I am! I would forget everything if I didn't. It goes with me everywhere! My husband was the structured one. When I lost him, I bounced around a lot! That's been going on 14 years and I still bounce from one thing to another! I guess it's my personality.

It's been dry here, too! You've probably heard about all the fires!

 

Windy days give me headaches and my asthma starts causing problems. I hope you're feeling a little better by now.

Have a good evening!

 

 

I don't even have a healing plan, sad I know. I just want off these meds and I guess I'll get one together then. I wouldn't even know how to make one.

 

We have had a lot of fires too. We are under fire warnings everyday.

 

I took 2 more ibuprofen. I hope it lets up soon. It's supposed to get windy all weekend.

 

Nice to talk to you.

 

Take care,

Frogie xx

[Dalalea]

2 minutes ago, Frogie said:

know how to make one

Here is a link to the post including an early copy of my checklist. You could make it your own if you want!

Talk to you later!

Dalalea

 

[Frogie]

17 minutes ago, Dalalea said:

Here is a link to the post including an early copy of my checklist. You could make it your own if you want!

Talk to you later!

Dalalea

 

Thanks! You are so kind.

 

Take care,

Frogie xx

[Frogie]

-Apace41-

 

I'm "butting heads" with my dr.

 

He has decided since I'm down to 2mg Lexapro I need to start tapering my Xanax.

 

I've tried to explain it to him that I only want to taper 1 med at a time. But now he's "threatening " to lower my prescrption of Xanax every month.

 

I wrote to Shep over on my benzo thread. If you read it you will get the information.

 

What do you think? I'm in panic mode!

 

Thanks...

 

Take care,

Frogie xx

[apace41]

16 minutes ago, Frogie said:

What do you think? I'm in panic mode!

 

I understand why you'd be upset, Frogie.  That is not a proper way for a doctor to treat you but that's what they do.

 

One cut of .25 might be okay since it is only around 8% but you need to look for a new doctor.  I know you are in a small town but he does not have your best interests at heart or he's ignorant.  Either way, you need to find someone who will work with you.

 

Best,

 

Andy

[Frogie]

16 minutes ago, apace41 said:

 

I understand why you'd be upset, Frogie.  That is not a proper way for a doctor to treat you but that's what they do.

 

One cut of .25 might be okay since it is only around 8% but you need to look for a new doctor.  I know you are in a small town but he does not have your best interests at heart or he's ignorant.  Either way, you need to find someone who will work with you.

 

Best,

 

Andy

Hi Andy:

 

Like I told Shep he is the only dr that will write prescrptions for antidepressants and benzos out here. There is a clinic here that has 6 Drs but they won't write these prescrptions at all. I've been there when I 1st moved here. But he is working with me in every way he can with my Lexapro taper. He writes my prescription and the instructions are taper as needed.

 

The only other dr is a phychiatrist that you talk to over the tv. He's the one that took me off of everything else before I started tapering Lexapro and wanted to take away my Xanax. I refuse to see him.

 

I feel like I'm in a rock and hard spot. As you know, we are moving back home. But not until the end of the year or beginning of next year. That's the soonest we can because of some circumstances beyond our control. I had to change insurance out here or I would go back to my old dr. But we have our "own world" here and my old dr won't take this insurance because it's only for out here. And I really don't want to drive 5 hours for a prescription each month if he did take my insurance.

 

Since I got home all I've done is sit and cry in panic mode, which doesn't help at all.

 

Sorry to bother you, but I didn't know what to do. 

 

My fiancé said I might have to make the little cut to keep the dr happy and then he will keep writing my prescriptions.

 

I'm a wreck.

 

Thanks...

 

Take care,

Frogie xx

 

 

[Dalalea]

5 hours ago, Frogie said:

Since I got home all I've done is sit and cry in panic mode

I'm so sorry you're having these problems, Frogie.

It's so hard to know what to do and when you feel like the doctor doesn't really understand what you're going through, it's scary! Praying for you to get a solution soon!

Dalalea

[Frogie]

8 hours ago, Dalalea said:

I'm so sorry you're having these problems, Frogie.

It's so hard to know what to do and when you feel like the doctor doesn't really understand what you're going through, it's scary! Praying for you to get a solution soon!

Dalalea

Thanks Dalalea:

 

I appreciate your concern.

 

I really thought this dr understood me, but apparently he doesn't.

 

At least he's not taking away my Lexapro.

 

Hope you are doing well.

 

Take care,

Frogie xx

[Frogie]

16 hours ago, Frogie said:

Hi Andy:

 

Like I told Shep he is the only dr that will write prescrptions for antidepressants and benzos out here. There is a clinic here that has 6 Drs but they won't write these prescrptions at all. I've been there when I 1st moved here. But he is working with me in every way he can with my Lexapro taper. He writes my prescription and the instructions are taper as needed.

 

The only other dr is a phychiatrist that you talk to over the tv. He's the one that took me off of everything else before I started tapering Lexapro and wanted to take away my Xanax. I refuse to see him.

 

I feel like I'm in a rock and hard spot. As you know, we are moving back home. But not until the end of the year or beginning of next year. That's the soonest we can because of some circumstances beyond our control. I had to change insurance out here or I would go back to my old dr. But we have our "own world" here and my old dr won't take this insurance because it's only for out here. And I really don't want to drive 5 hours for a prescription each month if he did take my insurance.

 

Since I got home all I've done is sit and cry in panic mode, which doesn't help at all.

 

Sorry to bother you, but I didn't know what to do. 

 

My fiancé said I might have to make the little cut to keep the dr happy and then he will keep writing my prescriptions.

 

I'm a wreck.

 

Thanks...

 

Take care,

Frogie xx

 

 

Hi Andy:

 

I talked to my fiancé about this last night like I said and he said I might have to make a little cut to keep the dr happy so he will keep writing my prescriptions.

 

I wrote to Shep. I'm waiting for a response so I can call and talk to my dr.

 

I know how you feel not sleeping. I didn't sleep last night and have an upset stomach this morning.

 

And I was doing so well. Wasn't posting or asking a million questions. Was trying to be quiet.

 

I just wanted to say thanks for being there for me and talking to me when I needed it.

 

Hope you are doing well.

 

Take care,

Frogie xx

[apace41]

5 minutes ago, Frogie said:

I wrote to Shep. I'm waiting for a response so I can call and talk to my dr.

 

I'm sure you will hear.  She is very attentive subject to her personal time constraints with work.

 

5 minutes ago, Frogie said:

I know how you feel not sleeping. I didn't sleep last night and have an upset stomach this morning.

 

Ironically, I must be having sympathy pains for you as I didn't sleep a wink last night after 2.5-3 weeks of not being "shut out."  Started with a panic attack as I was trying to fall asleep and the night went downhill from there.  I usually do okay on no sleep for a day or two but I'm really struggling big time today.

 

7 minutes ago, Frogie said:

I just wanted to say thanks for being there for me and talking to me when I needed it.

 

Hope you are doing well.

 

I don't have much to add to what Shep is suggesting.  I'm still in struggle mode but thanks for asking.

 

Best,

 

Andy

[Frogie]

1 minute ago, apace41 said:

 

I'm sure you will hear.  She is very attentive subject to her personal time constraints with work.

 

 

Ironically, I must be having sympathy pains for you as I didn't sleep a wink last night after 2.5-3 weeks of not being "shut out."  Started with a panic attack as I was trying to fall asleep and the night went downhill from there.  I usually do okay on no sleep for a day or two but I'm really struggling big time today.

 

 

I don't have much to add to what Shep is suggesting.  I'm still in struggle mode but thanks for asking.

 

Best,

 

Andy

Andy:

 

You must be having sympathy for me lol... I'm so sorry... I'm sitting here with tears running down my face again thinking what the h**l am I going to do?

 

I am still in shock, but I can understand my dr thinking that it's time to get off the meds. Just the wrong time. I really wanted to finish my Lexapro first. I told him that, but I guess he wasn't in "feeling sorry for me" mode yesterday.

 

I'm really sorry you are still in struggle mode. I was really trying to leave you alone. Now I've added to your plate. I'm sorry again...

 

I hope Shep will answer me today, so I can talk to the dr.

 

Take care,

Frogie xx

[apace41]

2 minutes ago, Frogie said:

I am still in shock, but I can understand my dr thinking that it's time to get off the meds. Just the wrong time. I really wanted to finish my Lexapro first. I told him that, but I guess he wasn't in "feeling sorry for me" mode yesterday.

 

Doctors should not be in the "forcing patients off medicine" mode, rather, they should be in the "work collaboratively to help patients carefully taper mode".  Unfortunately too few do.

 

Best,

 

Andy

[Frogie]

Just now, apace41 said:

 

Doctors should not be in the "forcing patients off medicine" mode, rather, they should be in the "work collaboratively to help patients carefully taper mode".  Unfortunately too few do.

 

Best,

 

Andy

I completely agree. I thought he was, but apparently he thinks I'm on too much Xanax for too long.

 

I hope it doesn't interfere with my Lexapro taper, I was doing so well.

 

Take care,

Frogie xx

[Rosetta]

Frogie, 

 

What exactly did your doctor say?  What does "threatening" mean? How soon is this reduction to happen?  Did he say "when?" Did he say how much?

 

If the prescription hasn't changed, then I'm thinking that calling your doctor is a bad idea.  This is because you may make him more likely to reduce your prescription sooner.  Is it possible he is just trying to prepare you for a future reduction?  

 

I agree it would be better to find another doctor, but if you can't then maybe the Mods can help you manage your response to your doctor better.  You have to manage your doctors perception of you.  He cannot see you as an addict.  Do you know what I mean?  If he sees you continue to panic over the mere thought (?) of reducing your Xanax he may be more certain that you must reduce it.  You want to try to control how much the reduction will be and how soon there may be another reduction.  You might do this by managing the doctor's perception of you and your addiction.  So, if he hasn't changed your prescription and it's not due to run out soon, I would not call him about this right now.  (If it is due to run out soon then you may need to drive the 5 hours and pay out of pocket, but don't think about that yet.)

 

So, how many days of Xanax do you have left?  Is there a refill left or is this one of those No Refill prescriptions? You want to think this through and not do anything while you feel panic.  Don't call him and panic.  Ok?

 

Now, none of this is to say I'm not furious with your doctor and angry that he's ignorant.  None of this is to say your feelings are illegitimate.  Not at all.  I'm furious; it's a breach of trust.  It just goes to show that anyone tapering an AD who is on a benzo should never trust a doctor with the knowledge that she is tapering the AD -- no matter how supportive the doctor may appear.  You could not have known it would go this way.  I see this ignorance on the part of doctors over and over.

 

But you have to do damage control.  You cannot think "catastrophe."  There is no reason to think this is going to be a disaster.  I put this next idea out there NOT to say that you should taper the benzo if you don't have to -- I say it to try to relieve your anxiety in case the doctor forces you to do that (only): Maybe a small cut of the Xanax (not ideal I know) will be possible if you stop tapering Lex.  Maybe you will not have to go that route, but I want you to calm yourself and not think that it will be disasterous if you do.  Some people taper the benzo in between cuts of the AD and do okay with it.  You might be one of those people, right?  

 

Finally, you really must find a doctor who won't reduce your Xanax.  You need someone who understands this process.  You need that emergency hatch.  You need the pressure to be off now that you know your doctor is waivering.  It's important that you start this process.  It will help to relieve anxiety to be working on a fail safe plan.

 

We need Mod input on this idea:  OR you need a doctor who will raise your Lexapro up to a level that gives the benzo dose a legitimacy.  I'm not saying that you should take a higher dose of Lex, mind you, but the doctors seem to think the benzo is helping with the Lex side effects and that reducing the benzo should have no ill effects (wrong) if the Lex dose is low.  If your Lex dose were higher maybe the Xanax dose would be considered ok?  Mods?  Is that an emergency hatch or not?  

[Shep]

2 minutes ago, Rosetta said:

I agree it would be better to find another doctor, but if you can't then maybe the Mods can help you manage your response to your doctor better.  You have to manage your doctors perception of you.  He cannot see you as an addict.  Do you know what I mean?  If he sees you continue to panic over the mere thought (?) of reducing your Xanax he may be more certain that you must reduce it.  You want to try to control how much the reduction will be and how soon there may be another reduction.  You might do this by managing the doctor's perception of you and your addiction.  So, if he hasn't changed your prescription and it's not due to run out soon, I would not call him about this right now.  (If it is due to run out soon then you may need to drive the 5 hours and pay out of pocket, but don't think about that yet.)

 

This is brilliant advice, Rosetta. A lot of the symptoms of benzo (and AD withdrawal) - panic, sweating, agitation, catastrophic thinking, high anxiety, etc. are all seen in people seeking recreational drugs and doctors do look for those signs, especially with benzos which are controlled substances. 

[Frogie]

4 minutes ago, Rosetta said:

Frogie, 

 

What exactly did your doctor say?  What does "threatening" mean? How soon is this reduction to happen?  Did he say "when?" Did he say how much?

 

If the prescription hasn't changed, then I'm thinking that calling your doctor is a bad idea.  This is because you may make him more likely to reduce your prescription sooner.  Is it possible he is just trying to prepare you for a future reduction?  

 

I agree it would be better to find another doctor, but if you can't then maybe the Mods can help you manage your response to your doctor better.  You have to manage your doctors perception of you.  He cannot see you as an addict.  Do you know what I mean?  If he sees you continue to panic over the mere thought (?) of reducing your Xanax he may be more certain that you must reduce it.  You want to try to control how much the reduction will be and how soon there may be another reduction.  You might do this by managing the doctor's perception of you and your addiction.  So, if he hasn't changed your prescription and it's not due to run out soon, I would not call him about this right now.  (If it is due to run out soon then you may need to drive the 5 hours and pay out of pocket, but don't think about that yet.)

 

So, how many days of Xanax do you have left?  Is there a refill left or is this one of those No Refill prescriptions? You want to think this through and not do anything while you feel panic.  Don't call him and panic.  Ok?

 

Now, none of this is to say I'm not furious with your doctor and angry that he's ignorant.  None of this is to say your feelings are illegitimate.  Not at all.  I'm furious; it's a breach of trust.  It just goes to show that anyone tapering an AD who is on a benzo should never trust a doctor with the knowledge that she is tapering the AD -- no matter how supportive the doctor may appear.  You could not have known it would go this way.  I see this ignorance on the part of doctors over and over.

 

But you have to do damage control.  You cannot think "catastrophe."  There is no reason to think this is going to be a disaster.  I put this next idea out there NOT to say that you should taper the benzo if you don't have to -- I say it to try to relieve your anxiety in case the doctor forces you to do that (only): Maybe a small cut of the Xanax (not ideal I know) will be possible if you stop tapering Lex.  Maybe you will not have to go that route, but I want you to calm yourself and not think that it will be disasterous if you do.  Some people taper the benzo in between cuts of the AD and do okay with it.  You might be one of those people, right?  

 

Finally, you really must find a doctor who won't reduce your Xanax.  You need someone who understands this process.  You need that emergency hatch.  You need the pressure to be off now that you know your doctor is waivering.  It's important that you start this process.  It will help to relieve anxiety to be working on a fail safe plan.

 

We need Mod input on this idea:  OR you need a doctor who will raise your Lexapro up to a level that gives the benzo dose a legitimacy.  I'm not saying that you should take a higher dose of Lex, mind you, but the doctors seem to think the benzo is helping with the Lex side effects and that reducing the benzo should have no ill effects (wrong) if the Lex dose is low.  If your Lex dose were higher maybe the Xanax dose would be considered ok?  Mods?  Is that an emergency hatch or not?  

Thanks for your input. I really appreciate it. You have no idea.

 

He gave me my usual prescription, but only for 30 days. Usually it's for 6 months. And told me to start tapering and he would see me in 30 days for a refill. So if I don't start tapering and showing him I'm trying he is going to cut the amount of Xanax I get a month.

 

I don't have a choice with dr's where I live. I live in a town of 600 people. We don't have a dr. I drive to the next town and was lucky to find this one that wrote prescriptions for antidepressants and benzos. The other 6 dr's refuse. And then there is a psychiatrist that you see on tv that took me off of everything else and was ready to take me off Xanax when I found this other dr so I'm not going back to him! The next town is another state, and they don't take my insurance. I already looked into that.

 

I live on disability and can't afford to drive 5 hours round trip (gas), pay out of pocket for an office visit (I think my old dr charges around $150) for an office visit. Then because he isn't on my insurance, I would have to pay full price for my Xanax. 

 

I have been been talking to mods about this. 

 

Somehow, someway, it's going to work out.

 

I will keep you informed on my thread.

 

I really appreciate all your input and concern. It means the world to me.

 

Hope you are doing well.

 

Take care,

Frogie xx

[Frogie]

16 minutes ago, Shep said:

 

This is brilliant advice, Rosetta. A lot of the symptoms of benzo (and AD withdrawal) - panic, sweating, agitation, catastrophic thinking, high anxiety, etc. are all seen in people seeking recreational drugs and doctors do look for those signs, especially with benzos which are controlled substances. 

Thanks Shep:

 

Can I answer you over on my benzo thread so we can keep all of this separate?

 

Take care,

Frogie xx

[Rosetta]

Shep, thanks.  This is all a matter of doctors failing to treat the whole person.  They chase symptoms, they go with the latest craze, in this case probably the emphasis in the news on addiction right now.  

 

There is another possibility -- the thyroid issue.  Did the doctor say anything about your thyroid when he mentioned the benzo reduction?  I looked up benzo and thyroid and found this article (below) about possible sub-clinical thyroid disorder in a patient taking a benzo.  I'm wondering if your doctor is frustrated that the thyroid medication was not working out.   Maybe he thinks a benzo reduction will help.  Maybe you can get him to go very slowly with it. Or maybe you can convince him it's unnecessary.  

 

This is just one article.  I haven't dug deep into this, but maybe someone else has.  Doctors love their test results and their easy answers, and their prescription pads, but the truth is that while we are in WD the test results aren't always right and the medications can be more harmful than helpful.  We need doctors who understand our condition and will stop chasing symptoms and blindly trusting test results.  If we can't find them then we have to protect ourselves from the ignorance of the doctors we have.  

 

I have no doubt AD WD can mess with the thyroid.  

 

https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/402f/2612cae43447c1c0f5ec577d86097e108ea8.pdf

[Rosetta]

You are welcome, Frogie.  I'm sorry about your doctor issue.  I'm glad they can help you on the benzo thread.  Good luck, honey. - Rosetta

[Frogie]

2 minutes ago, Rosetta said:

Shep, thanks.  This is all a matter of doctors failing to treat the whole person.  They chase symptoms, they go with the latest craze, in this case probably the emphasis in the news on addiction right now.  

 

There is another possibility -- the thyroid issue.  Did the doctor say anything about your thyroid when he mentioned the benzo reduction?  I looked up benzo and thyroid and found this article (below) about possible sub-clinical thyroid disorder in a patient taking a benzo.  I'm wondering if your doctor is frustrated that the thyroid medication was not working out.   Maybe he thinks a benzo reduction will help.  Maybe you can get him to go very slowly with it. Or maybe you can convince him it's unnecessary.  

 

This is just one article.  I haven't dug deep into this, but maybe someone else has.  Doctors love their test results and their easy answers, and their prescription pads, but the truth is that while we are in WD the test results aren't always right and the medications can be more harmful than helpful.  We need doctors who understand our condition and will stop chasing symptoms and blindly trusting test results.  If we can't find them then we have to protect ourselves from the ignorance of the doctors we have.  

 

I have no doubt AD WD can mess with the thyroid.  

 

https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/402f/2612cae43447c1c0f5ec577d86097e108ea8.pdf

Hi Rosetta:

 

I don't know why all of a sudden he thinks my Xanax needs to be tapered. But I didn't panic yesterday. He said to cut it in 1/2 and I answered him by saying only if you want to see me in the hospital. He said for me to come up with a reasonable taper plan and he would see me in 30 days.

 

He didn't mention the thyroid yesterday. My fiancé and I went in with LOTS of articles regarding benzo's and Lexapro messing with the thyroid. He did agree and say it could be subclinical hypothyroidism and we are watching that. So, as long as it doesn't keep going up, I'll be ok in that subject.

 

I'm doing my best to keep calm. But it's kinda hard right now.

 

I won't call my dr. I promise. 

 

Thanks for all your help and research. You have no idea how much this means.

 

Take care,

Frogie xx

 

 

[brassmonkey]

American doctors now a days are under huge pressure from the government, the licensing agencies, the insurance companies, the Drug Enforcement Agency and other law enforcement agencies to reduce the number of prescriptions that they write for drugs that could be used for "recreational purposes".  They're facing loss of license, lose of income and jail time.  Many, many doctors across the country are starting to take a hard line on all of these prescriptions regardless of needs of the patient, because it is coming down to a matter of their personal survival.  Even the act of trying to taper a patient off of the drug can be seen as  illegal  and can be prosecuted, so a lot of these doctors are just pulling the prescriptions CT.  We complain all the time about doctors handing out drugs with no regard for their effects, now that that is being cracked down on once again everyone is going to pay the price.

 

Your PM arrived just as I pressed send.  Everything is going to be alright, but you can't let your panic get the better of you.  Your doctor is trying to work with you in a manner that will work for both parties.  He is recommending an 8% reduction, that is well with in keeping with out guidelines.  No, we don't like people tapering two drugs at the same time, so the answer might be to stop the lex taper and concentrate on getting off of the Xanax for a while.  It may be possible that once you have reduced the xanax some he will let you stay there for a while and restart the Lex taper.  It would be worth discussing it with him, make a solid plan instead of just reacting.

 

I suspect that he is under a lot of pressure from the "powers that be" and being the sole practitioner in the area is feeling a great responsibility to the population in general to maintain his practice.

Edited March 13, 2018 by brassmonkey
Added further thoughts

[Frogie]

21 minutes ago, brassmonkey said:

American doctors now a days are under huge pressure from the government, the licensing agencies, the insurance companies, the Drug Enforcement Agency and other law enforcement agencies to reduce the number of prescriptions that they write for drugs that could be used for "recreational purposes".  They're facing loss of license, lose of income and jail time.  Many, many doctors across the country are starting to take a hard line on all of these prescriptions regardless of needs of the patient, because it is coming down to a matter of their personal survival.  Even the act of trying to taper a patient off of the drug can be seen as  illegal  and can be prosecuted, so a lot of these doctors are just pulling the prescriptions CT.  We complain all the time about doctors handing out drugs with no regard for their effects, now that that is being cracked down on once again everyone is going to pay the price.

So, you know I live in a very rural area and he is the only dr that will write these prescriptions, do you think this could be the problem? His insurance, etc...  could be giving him a rough time because he writes them and not because of me? So now I'm paying the price! At least he is having me taper. Maybe he does have a heart.

 

He won't let me stop the Lexapro taper, but if I can show him that I'm making an effort to taper the Xanax he will be ok I'm pretty sure.

[brassmonkey]

You posted while I was editing my previous post, go back up and look at it.

[Rosetta]

13 minutes ago, brassmonkey said:

Even the act of trying to taper a patient off of the drug can be seen as  illegal  and can be prosecuted, so a lot of these doctors are just pulling the prescriptions CT.

 

Why is it seen as illegal to taper someone, do you know?

[Frogie]

9 minutes ago, brassmonkey said:

You posted while I was editing my previous post, go back up and look at it.

I just edited my post.