j1290: gets off the Wellbutrin and on with life!

[j1290]

3 hours ago, Fifree said:

Anyway, it helped me today. I had those anxious feelings rising up in my chest and I was reacting at first and then I remembered this convo and went "Nope - this is a little wave of anxiety and it will pass soon". AND IT DID!

Wowwwwwwww.....It sucks to have those moments, but that's a solid W for the day if you're starting to short circuit the panic at the beginning.  Dr. Claire Weekes would love it! 

 

3 hours ago, Thorin said:

I’m using solid memory from now on.

I'm stealing it too.  Modern problems require modern solutions.  

[littlebird]

15 hours ago, Thorin said:

The good thing is my memory is crap so I'll forget all this next month 😄

 

Bwahahahahahahaha, insert GIF of rolling on floor laugh-crying here. I needed this one, thank you!

[Thorin]

11 hours ago, littlebird said:

 

On 5/17/2023 at 1:21 PM, Thorin said:

The good thing is my memory is crap so I'll forget all this next month 😄

 

Bwahahahahahahaha, insert GIF of rolling on floor laugh-crying here. I needed this one, thank you!

 

That was a John one as I’m sure you can tell 🤣

[j1290]

DAY 65  I've been trying to switch to daytime hours for the weekend and it's been great for my constitution.  I'm feeling really even keeled and less fatigued overall.  It's really nice, if just for a few days.   I still have the usual WD Normal side effects of headache and scalp burning, pressure, brain fog, etc.  They're inconvenient but still the best I've felt since I started tapering.   I'm a little scared to start up again.  Still waiting to get some projects done before I go back into those waters in the next week or so.   I don't want to delay but I'm getting to the hard part of tapering and the projects are important.   

 

Really glad I took the extra 30+ days to hold.   It helped me sort out a lot of things so I'm going in to this next phase of tapering in good shape.   

[Addax]

1 hour ago, j1290 said:

They're inconvenient but still the best I've felt since I started tapering.   I'm a little scared to start up again.

Very glad to read your feeling the best you have in awhile. I totally get the fear. I experience this too. The anticipation that the discomfort will return after feel WD-well is fear producing, yeah? Of course you don’t want to give up feeling well. But who knows? I wouldn’t be surprised if going into a drop having some stability under your belt is a protective factor.  It just makes sense to me.

 
Sticking it out a little longer until your projects are done sounds like a very solid plan. I may be a little bias, however, because I’ll be implementing the same plan. There are stress inducing things coming up that i simply don’t want to do will experiencing symptoms. I don’t want to risk it, so I’ll hold longer and have to resist the urge to plow through.

 

 

[j1290]

6 hours ago, Addax said:

Very glad to read your feeling the best you have in awhile.

LMAO within an hour of writing that I passed out for a few hours from fatigue. 🤷‍♂️  That's 3rd shift for you.  

 

6 hours ago, Addax said:

The anticipation that the discomfort will return after feel WD-well is fear producing, yeah?

That's a nice way of saying terrifying 😂😂😂  I try to get back on that horse as fast as I can, for just that reason.   I have to think you're right, the long hold is going to make it easier.   Or less bad.  😆🤷‍♂️

 

6 hours ago, Addax said:

I may be a little bias, however, because I’ll be implementing the same plan. There are stress inducing things coming up that i simply don’t want to do will experiencing symptoms. I don’t want to risk it, so I’ll hold longer and have to resist the urge to plow through.

I've plowed ahead and while it was the right choice for me at the time, it wasn't without consequences that I have to live with.   Tapering is a wrecking ball in most areas of my life, and for me damage control is the name of the game.    Super frustrating to wait an extra few weeks, I just want off this stuff, but I don't have the fight in me to do these projects with WD.   I think I could but I don't want to risk it either.   

 

So much easier to do stuff without Mega Anxiety.   I also tell myself it's a bit of a trial run to see if being on a lower dose of meds suits me.   The long hold is inconvenient but the data is useful.   It's nice to know the emotional lability does seem to mellow out.   

[Fifree]

I think this is brilliant that you're getting some stuff in place while you hold J. I understand wanting to get off ASAP. I'm (finally) coming around to the view that for most of us, we've been on it for freakin years already anyway. May as well chill on the last lil bit I reckon. Well that's where I am this week. In my own case I've been on ADs for around 29 years. I can rush my taper and will have taken them for 30 years total or I can take my time and have taken them for 33-35 max.  It's not that big a difference when I look at it that way.

 

Like I said this is where my mind is this week after having a rough bout of irritability/anxiety/spaciness on the last cut.

 

I want a turn of feeling actually GOOD again so I'm just gonna hang out here for a while and remind myself what it's all about.

[j1290]

DAY 71  I'm going to start my taper again in the next day or three, working around a project and my ever changing day/night schedule.  I got my hopefully last ever refill for psych meds, I'm meeting my psych doctor next month, so things are moving.  I don't even need a refill, I just want to check in and make sure he's current with my situation.  Get this, I'm switching to liquid AD shooters for the rest of my taper, I can throw out my pill trays and my old bottles of pills I don't need.  I'm not looking forward to the WD going forward, but I'm optomistic my WD normal is going to get easier from here on out.  

 

[Addax]

33 minutes ago, j1290 said:

I got my hopefully last ever refill for psych meds,

Wow! Throw it all out! I would tell you to melt it into something’s, but no… get the bottles out of your life.  Hopefully, if you move forward cautiously enough… er… as cautiously as you can tolerate 😉 symptoms will be minimal. 

[littlebird]

1 hour ago, j1290 said:

Get this, I'm switching to liquid AD shooters for the rest of my taper, I can throw out my pill trays and my old bottles of pills I don't need. 

 

Woohoo, hope it feels great! Exciting times, my friend

[Thorin]

1 hour ago, j1290 said:

DAY 71  I'm going to start my taper again in the next day or three, working around a project and my ever changing day/night schedule.  I got my hopefully last ever refill for psych meds, I'm meeting my psych doctor next month, so things are moving.  I don't even need a refill, I just want to check in and make sure he's current with my situation.  Get this, I'm switching to liquid AD shooters for the rest of my taper, I can throw out my pill trays and my old bottles of pills I don't need.  I'm not looking forward to the WD going forward, but I'm optomistic my WD normal is going to get easier from here on out.  

 

Big changes mate! Exciting stuff!!!

[j1290]

34 minutes ago, Addax said:

Wow! Throw it all out!

Done.  Good practice for when I can throw out the rest of my meds after I get to zero.  One day, that will be me!  

 

54 minutes ago, Addax said:

as cautiously as you can tolerate 😉 symptoms will be minimal. 

So nicely put.  As cautiously as I can tolerate, for sure!  😄 I'm definitely pumping the brakes now that I'm down so low. 

 

I hope it works both ways and that even a small cut will make me feel fewer side effects of the AD.  Fingers crossed I'm getting to the tipping point soon. 

 

On 5/22/2023 at 8:56 PM, Fifree said:

 It's not that big a difference when I look at it that way.

Totally valid.  As was suggested to me, I've been on this pill for 15 years or whatever, it's not like I'm racing the clock to avoid getting addicted  😂 so taper as comfortably as possible.   I just want to find out what the speed limit is on this part of the journey.  Then exceed it by just a smidge, just like I drive IRL 🤣

On 5/22/2023 at 8:56 PM, Fifree said:

 

I want a turn of feeling actually GOOD again so I'm just gonna hang out here for a while and remind myself what it's all about.

As someone who is experiencing one of my best days in tapering, I'll say Amen to that.   Feeling good, or the absence of feeling bad, is amazingly powerful.   I remind myself I'm doing this so I'll have a brighter tomorrow, but it sure is nice to enjoy a good window to get prepared for the road ahead.   

 

14 minutes ago, littlebird said:

Woohoo, hope it feels great! Exciting times, my friend

It's the little things.  I've had to be religious about filling and hauling around these pill trays for the last couple years.  The shooters bring their own hassles but this isn't forever(!).  

 

Quote

 

Big changes mate! Exciting stuff!!!

 

Getting a little closer to zero every day, man.  I can't wait to make the Big Sweep of pills from the medicine cabinet after I get to zero.  It'll be positively vacant.  I think I'm as ready as I'll ever be for the next step down.  

[j1290]

DAY 74  I wound up holding to take care of some things without the added anxiety of WD.  I might have been just fine, but timelines have shifted so it seems like I made a good choice.   Will resume my taper shortly.   

[j1290]

DAY 1   Finished up my projects, so time to get back on the horse and start this tapering business again.  I'm going into this from probably the most stable position I've been in since I started 2 years ago, when I changed time releases and it never worked the same again.  One year ago, almost to the day, I had to reinstate and return to the original dose and time release in an attempt to stabilize, which was partly effective.   

 

I'm really glad I took the extra 45 days to hold, well worth doing, and now it's time to move forward.  I'm interested in seeing if my brain fog lifts in the early days after a cut, and if head pressure/headaches lightens up.   The process is a chore, but the payoff is so worth it.  

[Carmie]

@j1290 Yay to moving forward John, wishing you all the best with your taper💛

[littlebird]

18 hours ago, j1290 said:

I'm really glad I took the extra 45 days to hold, well worth doing, and now it's time to move forward.

 

Sounds like it was a great move! Glad you did that.

 

18 hours ago, j1290 said:

I'm interested in seeing if my brain fog lifts in the early days after a cut, and if head pressure/headaches lightens up.   The process is a chore, but the payoff is so worth it.

 

Also curious about this one! Hope you keep us posted.

[j1290]

DAY 3  I skipped day 2 because it was uneventful.   Cognition has been better today and yesterday.  This morning I felt less head pressure and activity, slightly elevated mood.  By afternoon/evening I started getting irritable and reacting to things with exaggerated intensity, along with more head pressure.   

 

@littlebird told me anxiety is imagination, which was buzzing through my head today as I got anxious.  Take away the imagination part and the anxiety can't get a toehold, but of course that's easier said than done.   Despite challenges, overall today was a win.  Today might be a little bit bumpy, but I'm doing this for a better tomorrow.  Totally worth it.   

 

On 6/2/2023 at 6:44 PM, Carmie said:

Yay to moving forward John, wishing you all the best with your taper💛

Thank you so much, Carmie!   It's been a real treat to learn more about Australia from some incredible people here.  It's endlessly fascinating!  

[littlebird]

12 hours ago, j1290 said:

Cognition has been better today and yesterday.  This morning I felt less head pressure and activity, slightly elevated mood.

 

Woohoo! Glad to hear there are positive changes. Hope the tougher symptoms pass fast. Your body is probably real pro at tapering by now, it knows the drill and is probably doing so much better than it did when first starting. 

 

12 hours ago, j1290 said:

@littlebird told me anxiety is imagination, which was buzzing through my head today as I got anxious.  Take away the imagination part and the anxiety can't get a toehold, but of course that's easier said than done.

 

Easier said than done for SURE! I'm trying to find where it's no longer useful, because anxiety is useful to a point: I'm real good at planning/packing for extenuating circumstances. Then it can keep doing and really take me down some dark worst-case scenario roads. Which makes sense given childhood trauma, "gotta be prepared for the worst."

 

If I could figure out how to redirect imagination into positive thinking, or even other parts of my brain, I'd be so much more creative! Maybe that can be a tapering goal, less investment of imagination energy into anxiety and learning to redirect it to more helpful areas of my mind.

 

12 hours ago, j1290 said:

It's been a real treat to learn more about Australia from some incredible people here.  It's endlessly fascinating!  

 

Seconded!!! I just learned about Australian Alone, where they drop people in remote areas and they film themselves trying to survive and hold onto whatever sanity they arrived with. I enjoyed the North American seasons I saw, but none of those animals were surprising to me. I bet things get real wild down under! It's going on the "must watch" list. 

[j1290]

52 minutes ago, littlebird said:

Woohoo! Glad to hear there are positive changes. Hope the tougher symptoms pass fast. Your body is probably real pro at tapering by now, it knows the drill and is probably doing so much better than it did when first starting. 

I appreciate it.   Tapering has a different feel than it did at the higher doses, for sure.  This is going to be a challenge but the rewards will be there as well.  

 

1 hour ago, littlebird said:

I'm real good at planning/packing for extenuating circumstances.

Me too.  One of the talk-down methods I use is to ask myself how often those scenarios I imagine (anxiety) come true.  The answer is basically zero.  Never as bad as I think it'll be.   I project my family of origin onto every situation with a predictable outcome.   When it came to childhood stuff, everything really was the end of the world LOL.    No wonder I have anxiety.   EMDR has helped a lot.  

 

1 hour ago, littlebird said:

Maybe that can be a tapering goal, less investment of imagination energy into anxiety and learning to redirect it to more helpful areas of my mind.

I'm betting on you, LB!  You've got the biggest imagination I've ever seen, unleashing that would be incredible.  

 

OK, I just added Alone to my watchlist, I'm going to check it out and report back.   

[j1290]

DAY 4  Emotional, headachey, anxious.  More or less like the day 4 of my last cut.  The good news is so far nothing is worse than the last cut, but the next few days might be at least some kind of indication of the trend.   My last day 6 was bumpy, so I'll be interested to see if that repeats.  If I had to guess I'd say things are predictably intensifying as I get closer to zero in certain ways and easier in others, so I'm adjusting to the new, ever changing WD normal and will alter my taper as needed.  

 

At least so far, I'm just uncomfortable, not gritting my teeth to get through the day.   I'm a little weird and anxious, so be it.  I'll keep it up and sooner or later I'll be through.

[Fifree]

Great to see you're through the wave and back on the horse (to mix metaphors). 10% just like in the brochure! Hope it's smooth sailing from here. Good luck John!

[littlebird]

17 minutes ago, Fifree said:

Great to see you're through the wave and back on the horse (to mix metaphors). 10% just like in the brochure! Hope it's smooth sailing from here. Good luck John!

 

This made me imagine John sailing through wavy seas on a horse on a sailboat and it was the perfect absurd image to make me teeheehee a lil bit. Hope you're both doing well!

[Fifree]

1 minute ago, littlebird said:

perfect absurd image to make me teeheehee a lil bit.

It is a good image isn't it? Teehee indeed LB. I hope you're doing well too  

[j1290]

DAY 6  Listening to a new to me Moz album.  Best $9 I ever spent.  "They said they respect me, which means the judgment is crazy" LMAO Morrisey knows the drill. I'm certain lots of people "respect" me, but what can you do.   The die is cast.   Speaking of which, that's what I used to tell people when they asked me what I did at parties.   I invented dice.   Get it?  That's as old as the romans or something, unpossible for me to have invented.   I don't get invited to a lot of parties, so I don't use it much.  Still tickles me, though.  Heh!

 

I'm loosey goosey,  chok-full-o-lability today.   I'm trying to enjoy it.  Feelings are extra intense so might as well make good use of that opportunity to listen to music like a college freshman in the dorm.  Went to EMDR, it was really great, although difficult.   

 

You know, I'm beginning to suspect when Morrisey says I like you becuase you're not right in the head nor am I, the man's speaking from experience.   Can relate, sadly.  Explains a lot of my history.   

 

Tapering sucks.  Moz rules.  I'm out!

 

33 minutes ago, Fifree said:

Great to see you're through the wave and back on the horse (to mix metaphors). 10% just like in the brochure! Hope it's smooth sailing from here. Good luck John!

I love mixed metaphors.   Appreciate the support!

 

 

[j1290]

DAY 6  3/10 headaches, pressure

Day 6-13 are usually bumpy, and last cut were exceptionally so.  This time, things are going pretty well overall, and I think part of an overall trend of less intense physical symptoms, and possibly increasing emotional ones, as my anxiety got pretty well pegged a few days ago.  The headache hat makes it possible to get through this without needing migraine pills or anything, which is an improvement as well. 

 

I'm cautiously optomistic.  I mean, if I got through many worse feeling cuts than this one on day 6, that should mean this one will be OK, right?  What could go wrong?!? hah!  who knows but at least it's a step in the right direction.  I guess I'll know for sure in 3 more weeks.  

[Addax]

It’s good to read that, overall, things are going pretty well. Step in the right direction, for sure, but the waiting part can be tough. I suppose waiting and seeing is a big part of this, eh?  I hope what you find in three weeks is nothing but windows!

[j1290]

8 hours ago, Addax said:

I suppose waiting and seeing is a big part of this, eh?  I hope what you find in three weeks is nothing but windows!

Isn't that the truth!  Just checked my notes and in comparison to my last cut, today is just run of the mill WD symptoms.  I'll call that a win.  Thanks so much, and wishing you the same!

[j1290]

DAY 7  3/10 brain lockup, headaches, pressure

It's been a lot to go through, but completely tolerable today.   Much better than my last cut, and basically matching the cut I did prior to that.  Luckily I haven't seen any warning signs.  

[j1290]

DAY 8   Nothing new or interesting.  Looking at my old notes, disregarding my last cut as an outlier, things are trending positively.  One day I'll be symptom free, and in the meantime I can manage.  I don't think I mentioned that I switched to all liquid for easier dosing.  It seems to be working just fine, no difference that I can tell.  I prep my vials for the next day after I take my 11:30 pm dose.  I use a 20mg size Oral Syringe to remove from my 1:1 solution enough liquid to get down to the MG I want.  Then I use that same syringe to distribute the solution into my 3 glass vials, and I got a tiny medicine funnel to pour the remainder of the solution that's too small to reach with the syringe into the vial with the lowest level.  Then I measure the water and split a pill to throw in my jar for tomorrow's dose.  Splitting the pill helps it dissolve, and 4 pieces is even better but I never bother.  It's less convenient than having a pill carrying case for sure, but it's worth it for the precision.   

 

At the risk of being optimistic, I think I've got this cut in the bag.  I expect the usual symptoms for the next few weeks.  I always get my hopes up that I'm going to turn the corner and all my symptoms will vanish after the next cut.  It's magical thinking.  I do think in 90 days I'll be feeling much better, so end of summer.  I'll update again in a week or so or if something interesting happens.  

[Stardust]

Hi j1290 -

I see you're down below 100mg - congratulations!  What rate are you planning to reduce by now?  I think I saw you say at one point you plan to slow down once you get to 75mg.  That's where I'm at right now.  I'm still plugging along with the Brassmonkey scale.  It's going okay.

Take care,

Stardust

[j1290]

2 hours ago, Stardust said:

Hi j1290 -

I see you're down below 100mg - congratulations!  What rate are you planning to reduce by now?  I think I saw you say at one point you plan to slow down once you get to 75mg.  That's where I'm at right now.  I'm still plugging along with the Brassmonkey scale.  It's going okay.

Take care,

Stardust

Hi Stardust 😊  Glad to hear everything is going smoothly for you.  Congrats on getting down to 75mg!  You bring up a great point about the Brassmonkey slide, maybe I'll switch to that at some point down the line.  I'm doing 10% drops and plan to continue to do that, unless things get weird and I need to move more slowly.   I heard some anecdotes that things might get tricky below 50-75 mg, so I'm going to keep an extra sharp eye out for new/stronger symptoms when I get to that area.  Fingers crossed.  

 

How are things going for you?  You getting any increased symptoms or anything?  

[Stardust]

Brassmonkey worked really well for me with citalopram taper so I have a lot of faith in it.  No increased symptoms so far but it's hard to know at times - dealing with a lot of situational stress at the moment so anxiety is elevated.  Would it be as elevated if I weren't tapering?  Who knows?  I certainly don't want to taper any slower than I am already but if it becomes glaringly obvious that it would help, I will slow down.

 

[Carmie]

19 hours ago, j1290 said:

DAY 8   Nothing new or interesting.  Looking at my old notes, disregarding my last cut as an outlier, things are trending positively.  One day I'll be symptom free, and in the meantime I can manage.  I don't think I mentioned that I switched to all liquid for easier dosing.  It seems to be working just fine, no difference that I can tell.  I prep my vials for the next day after I take my 11:30 pm dose.  I use a 20mg size Oral Syringe to remove from my 1:1 solution enough liquid to get down to the MG I want.  Then I use that same syringe to distribute the solution into my 3 glass vials, and I got a tiny medicine funnel to pour the remainder of the solution that's too small to reach with the syringe into the vial with the lowest level.  Then I measure the water and split a pill to throw in my jar for tomorrow's dose.  Splitting the pill helps it dissolve, and 4 pieces is even better but I never bother.  It's less convenient than having a pill carrying case for sure, but it's worth it for the precision.   

 

At the risk of being optimistic, I think I've got this cut in the bag.  I expect the usual symptoms for the next few weeks.  I always get my hopes up that I'm going to turn the corner and all my symptoms will vanish after the next cut.  It's magical thinking.  I do think in 90 days I'll be feeling much better, so end of summer.  I'll update again in a week or so or if something interesting happens.  

Hi John, 

 

Thanks for popping over to my thread. You’re doing amazing with your tapering, it looks like you’ve got it pretty much down pat. I love your optimism too. Yeah, we can’t seem to run away from those waves, I get waves with every drop.
 

I haven’t tapered for three months now as I had heaps of waves during these months, probably due to updosing the low dose naltrexone. I think it’s about time to do my next drop, I can only taper by 1.5% or so every six or seven weeks. I’ll have to stop the updosing of the LDN for a while then though. Before updosing it the waves weren’t too bad. It’s going to take me forever to get to 4.50mg as I’m only at 1.75mg. I need to taper the Seroquel though. I can’t do two things at the same times due to those ever delightful waves🤨. 
 

Again I’m really happy you’re doing so well with your tapering💛

[j1290]

DAY 12  Thank heaven, I've had totally average WD symptoms up to this point, nothing unusual.  It's been the physical symptoms, so I expect the emotional stuff to pickup over the next couple weeks.  

On 6/10/2023 at 5:22 PM, Stardust said:

Who knows?  I certainly don't want to taper any slower than I am already but if it becomes glaringly obvious that it would help, I will slow down.

I get Mega Anxiety certain days from tapering.  I think the literature politely calls it a lowering of your stress threshold.  Luckily it eventually goes away but if it sticks around too long or too intensely then it's a red flag for me.   My last cut, things were off, I could tell that things were different than any of the prior reductions.  Luckily an extra long hold seems to have fixed me right up and things are going fine, but I've slowed my roll, and so far it's working.   

 

Brass Monkey slide sounds great, I just might have to try that, maybe when I get to lower doses.   Have you noticed any differences between the cut and suffer method?  

 

On 6/10/2023 at 8:59 PM, Carmie said:

I think it’s about time to do my next drop, I can only taper by 1.5% or so every six or seven weeks.

Trudging the road to happy destiny, I see!  I had to taper Venlafaxine sloooooooow, but I still got to zero.  Can't wait for you to get there!  One foot in front of the other.   My last dose was such a non event, I'd built it up to be a big deal.  I hope yours is no big deal too!

 

On 6/10/2023 at 8:59 PM, Carmie said:

I need to taper the Seroquel though. I can’t do two things at the same times due to those ever delightful waves🤨. 

Back in the tapering Dark Ages when we didn't know a lot I tried to do 2 drugs at once.  I had partial success in the beginning but quickly took some good advice to just focus on one.   Glad I did, that was enough.  

 

On 6/10/2023 at 8:59 PM, Carmie said:

Again I’m really happy you’re doing so well with your tapering💛

Much appreciated!  I'll be happier when I'm done 😂  'till then, I'll take average symptoms any day of the week.    

[Carmie]

I think we’ll all be happier when it’s all done @j1290😂 I did another 0.05mg drop two days ago. Woohoo🎉😜💛

[j1290]

6 minutes ago, Carmie said:

I did another 0.05mg drop two days ago. Woohoo🎉😜💛

Man oh man, it's nice to have that number going down, isn't it?!?   Congrats on making the jump, you got this!