☼ Petunia: recovering from 13 years of antidepressant use

[Addax]

Petunia, you write so beautifully and vividly. The picture you've painted is quite scary, and I'm just reading about it, not living with it as you are right now. This ancient enemy sounds fierce and cruel, but I know you are so much more fierce, a so much stronger because as you say, you've faced this enemy before, and here you are having won the battle.

 

I don't think you are frozen. I think you no longer feel the need to run from it. You've proved you can beat this thing already. It knows it too, because it's already backed into a corner.

 

You are strong and fierce, Petunia. You'll conquer this thing!

[brassmonkey]

The glowing red eyes in the corner are more than likely an old opossum.  It will snarl and hiss and snap when disturbed but will run away or play dead if you stand up to it.  The "good thing" about old traumas is that they are in the past, over and done with.  All that is left are the memories, not the event itself.  I'm not trying to trivialize what ever happened, but reminding you that it is only old emotions from a previous life that are talking, they have nothing new to say and are tired of saying it anyway.  One thing about WD is that it lets the old problems out a little at a time, so we can work through them in small pieces.  It's our brains way of protecting us from the big stresses.  As the small pieces are examined, accepted and disposed of the whole becomes smaller and easier to handle and in the end can be resolved to the point that something that no longer exists can't control us any more.  I've been through the process on several issues and as someone who was a professional at hiding from my past I know it can be done, isn't as painful as anticipated, and when you come out the other side the feeling of freedom is amazing.

 

(((((((((((((((((((((HUGS))))))))))))))))))))))

[btdt]

When I was there I prayed and stood my ground. 

[blackhill4]

Petunia I face a monster as well but it's a different one from yours (as it is for all of us). Your pain sounds so similar, the beast you can't run from or hide from. Now we are forced to face it and the only option is to win because like you said this is all there is right now, we have to fight this battle.

[btdt]

I would suggest another look at the supplements you taking. It has been an issue for me in the past. 

peace

[Petunia]

(Trigger Warning - long term protracted still suffering after 3+ years)

 

 

What to write, when there are no more words?  I've got to get something out here on my thread because all the awfulness inside is starting to congeal into a huge lump of ever growing suffering, its all I seem to be.

 

It just got worse again.  How can it get worse when its already too hard?

 

I'm trying desperately to remember, what to do to get through these rough times, but its not working.  All I'm getting is a swirling mess of fear and hopelessness and voices from the past saying....... all those things which make it so much worse.

 

I'm completely stuck and I can't even write about it any more..... because...... why?

 

Because if I'm going to write about it, that means I've got to dig into it, and feel it and face it and its already too much to face.  I want to be able to live without this constant shadow of fear and dread and hopelessness.  It makes it so much worse that the word 'depression' even exists, because that's what it probably is, depression caused by an antidepressant.  I've never felt this complete lack of hope and meaning so intensely and for so long.  I'm helpless to do anything to control the experience of my own life.  I'm at the mercy of my own out of control nervous system and it has no mercy.

 

For almost 4 years now I've been getting zapped by its random surges of all kinds of horrible sensations, day and night.  I can never get used to any patterns because they change.  This isn't depression, its a normal human response to an unbearable situation.  When you cant predict or control your own experience of life from one moment to the next, from one day to the next and it just goes on and on, month after month, year after year, who wouldn't start to feel hopeless and helpless and like giving up?

 

I'm not even sure when this actually started, I don't have a proper anniversary date to use to keep track of my 'progress'.  If I start measuring from when I stopped taking lexapro, which is when the first initial symptoms began, that would mean I'm about four and a half years into lexapro withdrawal after .... I was going to write too fast taper, but a 2 month taper after 13 years of use might as well be called CT.  I remember thinking, at the time that I was doing ok because I had actually managed to stay off them for longer than a week, this had been my fifth attempt at getting off them.

 

But then came the new dx and different drugs .... all adding further damage for the next couple of years.  I thought it was me, my brain, my life and that if I could just find the right combination of drugs, to balance everything properly, I would be fixed.  I still struggle to believe this is drug damage, that I've done this to myself by being tricked into believing there was an easy safe way to deal with my own difficult emotions.

 

I wasn't trying to get high or wanting to have more fun, I was looking for relief from emotional pain, and in the process I've made my life more painful than I ever thought possible.

 

Yesterday was a high anxiety day, I was right up there on the verge of panic all day, every thought and sensation triggered surges of adreneline.  Today my body has swung to the opposite extreme and has been joined by thoughts of hopelessness, and despair as any beliefs about healing, which I had dragged together last week, just got shattered again.

 

Its been a long time since I had a real window.  Over a year ago.  I think I want to change my avatar, its not working.

 

This picture would be more accurate

 

[Muddles]

I'm so sorry. You've suffered for so long now....just remember that you are only coming up to 2 years free from any medication. I know for some, it can take such a long time. You have come so far and struggled through what we could only call hell.

 

Its relentless and I know how desperate you are feeling to just be able to see some kind of 'normality'. It will happen - your brain is working so hard to try and make this happen and it will...eventually.

 

Thinking of you.

[Nathalou]

Petunia, I have just read your thread. You have a lovely way with words, so gifted. You write beautifully even about the ugliest parts of your suffering. I feel for you deeply and understand you. I am but at the beginning of WD and I would lie if I didn't say that your last post frightened me. But this is the place for expressing our true, raw suffering and we cannot sugar coat it in any way. I do believe that the mental and physical suffering that WD causes is on another level than being human, if you know what I mean? It's emotions and symptoms that a human should never have to endure, because it's chemical and unnatural.

 

I sympathize greatly Petunia and know that not much can comfort when in that space if despair and suffering. But keep going, just keep moving forward. Healing is happening on some level, unbeknownst to us. ❤️

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Please don't be angry with me, I don't yet know how to get things out so they sound right.

 

Both pictures in your above post got quite a laugh from me, I don't know why. But please don't use either one as avatars, especially the humanoid one. It is completely ugly. I'd try the rainbow butterfly kitten thingy first. I have that one as my desktop pic. Never seen anything so ridiculous in my whole life.

 

What I have found through this experience? Life really sucks. Sometimes a little less than at other times but sucks nonetheless. I cannot imagine it getting any better. No matter what anyone says.

 

But you don't suck. You are delightful, even in misery, I envy you.

 

So I think you should keep posting in your thread (ask Meimei why, she told me the same thing.) It makes things a bit better for me when I do but I try not to use any critical thinking too much. Just sharing, that works better.

 

You know what is amazing? That a whole lot of time has managed to pass by since we have both been off the drugs. We have both had a few periods of feeling better. They have to make a reappearance again someday, right?

 

******* A!

[Petunia]

Thank you Muddles for your kind words, every time someone reminds me that I'm still not quite 2 years drug free, it helps to reinforce the reality. I may have been suffering much longer, but recovery has only been happening since more recently.

 

I'm so sorry Nathalou that my last post was frightening.  I can imagine it would be to someone newly off these drugs and in withdrawal.  I remember in early 2012 when I was probably at my worst, but didn't yet know what the real cause was, I thought to myself that whatever this was, I could probably deal with it for up to 6 months, as long as it started getting better.  I kind of gave myself 6 months and even though I didn't know what was wrong, I figured whatever it was would sort itself out by then.

 

But everyone is different and just because I seem to be taking a long time, it doesn't mean you will.  Most people recover much faster.  There are things about my life, and events which have happened over the last 10 years which have been incredibly stressful and I'm sure they have added to the cumulative damage to my nervous system.  These aren't things I want to write about, but I know they've had an impact on my recovery, most people haven't had to deal with this level of elevated stress for this long period of time.  Some of this was beyond my control, but part of the increased stress was caused by me pushing myself way out of my personal comfort zone to explore something new, at a time when I was already under too much stress.  In hindsight I understand that I was under the influence of a harmful medication interaction, which had completely changed my personality, for about a year, I was in a kind of drug induced mania without realizing it.

 

Please don't be angry with me, I don't yet know how to get things out so they sound right.

 

Both pictures in your above post got quite a laugh from me,...... I'd try the rainbow butterfly kitten thingy first. I have that one as my desktop pic. Never seen anything so ridiculous in my whole life.

 

Not angry at all .... we gotta be twins, I've also got the rainbow kitty as my desktop.

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

Its been 6 days since I've been taking high doses of vitamin c, so I guess its time I write something about it here.

 

I got the idea to try this from the high cortisol/morning panic/anxiety thread, here:

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/33-reducing-cortisol-and-waking-with-panic-or-anxiety/?p=145082

 

...and its working,  this week I've felt so much better and its giving me relief from some of my worst symptoms.  Here is what I've been doing and how its helped:

 

Whenever I wake up in the night, which usually happens about 1am and 4am, but it varies, I take 1000mg vit c (ascorbic acid).  I've also been taking another one when I wake about 6:30, which used to be the time I gave up on sleep for the night, but now, I'm able to go back to sleep until that dose wears off about 2 hours later.

 

As long as I keep taking 1000mg every 2 - 3 hours through the morning, my body feels relaxed, calm and free from everything which gets called the fight/flight response.  I feel a definite rise in these symptoms when the supplement stops working through the morning, but by lunch time - early afternoon, I don't seem to need to take any more.

 

Unlike other supplements I've tried, which are reported to reduce cortisol, the vitamin c isn't causing depression, fatigue and negative/critical thinking, if anything, its improving my mood and mental/physical energy levels.  This seems to be improving a little more each day.

 

What surprises me is how much of this stuff I'm having to take though, its no wonder the 1000mg I took one morning didn't make a dent in my symptoms.  I was scared to take more than 1000mg, because of my sensitivity, but I'm going to experiment with taking 2000mg tomorrow and perhaps it will last a little longer, so I don't have to take it so often. So far I've been taking up to 5000mg per day total with no negative consequences.

 

So these are the changes I've noticed:

 

Adrenaline surges - gone

Morning terror/dread/ruminations - gone

Dreams turning dark/frightening towards morning - gone

Paranoid/anxious/negative thinking - gone

Body tension - gone

Inner shaking/trembling - gone

Nausea/churning gut - gone

Hypersensitivity - greatly reduced.

Confusion/brain fog - diminishing fast

Agoraphobia - gone

(this is like a miracle and I'm still in shock, its turned completely around. I've still been having to push myself to go out, because I've been in the habit of expecting it to be very unpleasant for so long.  But when I get out there, and find that its actually ok again, not like trying to function while being in a bad drug trip, its like I've been born again, or something.  Life is feeling new and full of hope, like anything is possible again, there is no longer an awful veneer of horror and dread over everything. The world is looking brighter and friendlier, I'm no longer about to be attacked or killed or become hopelessly lost every single moment. I don't want to come home, where as before I would do only what I needed to do and then hurry home to safely.  Yesterday I drove a long way to a grocery store quite far away, just to buy water, that I didn't really need, just to have something else to do.

 

Crushing fatigue - gone  (in a small way, this has become a minor problem.  I'm used to falling asleep from exhaustion early in the evening, after a day of high anxiety/cortisol, but for the last 3 nights I've been wide awake past midnight, wondering why I'm not asleep yet.  Usually I fall asleep listening to youtube videos and then turn my computer off.  But last night around midnight I was still awake, but bored with what I was listening to.  So I thought it was time I went to sleep.  So I shut off my computer and laid awake for another 2 hours just thinking about stuff and being bored.  But this wasn't all anxiety and insomnia and panicking about not sleeping, this was just  boring, eventually I must have fallen asleep because I woke up just before 4 and took a vitC, then went back to sleep until 6:30, took another one then finally woke up properly at 9:30.  This is unheard of for me to be able to sleep past 6:30.  A while back, I couldn't sleep past 5am, its gradually been getting later and later.

 

Anhedonia - decreased, earlier in the week I was enjoying the warmth of the sun on my skin and the smell of clothes drying in the dryer.

Pain/tension in shoulders, neck and upper back - gone

 

I'm still dealing with these symptoms:

 

Temperature dysregulation - through the night and early morning.  Night sweats. Blurry vision.  Tinnitus, I think this may have become slightly worse actually.  Cognitive issues/decision making. OCD (skin picking) Frequent waking in the night, mild twitching.

 

The book I ordered a few weeks ago arrived (The Narcissistic Family: Diagnosis and Treatment).  I started reading it yesterday and instead of feeling filled with despair and hopelessness, which I'm sure would have been the case last week, I was finding it validating and was feeling enthusiastic and hopeful as I was highlighting relevant parts and making my own notes in the margins.  I'm looking forward to reading more and I was even seeing a possibility of being able to get out and find a therapist now to help me with some of these issues.  But TBH, these 'issues' aren't feeling anywhere near as overwhelming and difficult as they were just last week.... maybe I'm in my first real, extended window and I'm going to come crashing down again, but VitC is obviously contributing.

 

I've still got a bit of DP/DR, especially when I'm out in bright light (sun) and in florescent light.

 

Over the weekend my daughter took a GPS, which I've had in a box for 3 years, out of its box and plugged it in.  She needed me to drive her somewhere on Saturday night and I would have had to come home by myself, and I would have got lost.  At first I told her to get a taxi, because I thought I couldn't do it, but I suggested the GPS, but wasn't up to figuring out how to work the thing.  So she set it up and I found it quite easy.  This week I've been using it to find new and different places to 'walk in nature', so that I don't have to be reminded of all the times I've been traumatized from trying to walk at the only places I knew, close to my house.

 

I used to be able to look in a street directory and keep a cognitive map of the route in my mind, but I can't seem to do that now, my memory doesn't work the same.  Blurry vision makes it difficult to read the map anyway, but now it doesn't matter

[LoveandLight]

Petu, I am soo happy for you xx

[bubble]

Dear Petunia, 

 

I haven't been around lately but always thinking about you. Now I updated myself on your posts from March and the beginning of April and was at a loss for words. And then that miracle post from today... amazing Again at a loss for words

 

All I can say is thank you for being here, thank you for being who you are and sharing that with us

 

(I will also get myself vitamin C in high doses Read about it from another member as well)

 

Hugs xxxxxxx

[Muddles]

Petu - I am so, so pleased to read this. Made my day.

 

May it continue! My gosh - you deserve it.

[Muddles]

I've notice my dp/Dr is worse now that the summer is here too.

[WinningThrough]

Petunia, I am so very happy to hear this! So happy. It's put a smile on my face.

[AliG]

  Petunia, what a turn around in 2 weeks. I'm so happy for you. Maybe you don't need to change your avatar, after all.  May your window continue. I'm off to look up more on vitamin C.

[Addax]

So happy for you, Petunia! After you mentioned the relief you felt since taking vitamin c I recalled the benefit of vitamin-C in decreasing cortisol after exercise. I googled "vitamin-c and cortisol" and the articles pertaining to the benefits of vitamin-c in regards to exercise came up, along with a slew of other articles.

 

Here's one that talks about several studies: https://www.psychologytoday.com/articles/200304/vitamin-c-stress-buster

 

I haven't yet looked up the individual studies it mentions, but intend to.

 

So happy for your relief!

[btdt]

That is a big difference from April 3 to April the 15.  None of it triggers me at this point it all seems normal to me how odd am I?  I can't help but wonder if it is a window and I want to know if you have been taking the probiotic you were on and the Vit C?  I tend to be careful about supplements and will be watching to see if this holds for you.  If it does I am going to try it.  

I too can't use a map to find my way around I think your the first "other" person to report this that I have noticed at least.  I thought I was out of the woods when I was presented with a GPS as a gift but lost my car due to financial failure soon after.  Still on occasion I use it when I get nominated to drive some place... I still try to rise to expected duties some of the time... I have one thing to say about it... be sure to update it on the computer as roads change.  I hope yours is better than the one I have ... and I suspect it needs to be updated but it may just be no good.  Hope yours is better. 

Thank you for sharing your experience I think your helping a lot of people. 

 

This helped me today:

" When you cant predict or control your own experience of life from one moment to the next, from one day to the next and it just goes on and on, month after month, year after year, who wouldn't start to feel hopeless and helpless and like giving up?"

 

Lately I have been told over and over I am negative about everything.  I just may be I sometimes can't tell often lose my perspective when I get sick and I have been ill a few wks... actually it could just be me but ill and more drugs to treat don't help.. especially steroids they destroy me. I think I am affecting people I live with in a negative way as I am told I am. I guess that is why I was asked to leave. There is something about the timeline that is daunting and wearing others don't understand.  When I see your night to day experience here I am both jaded and hopeful. I hope it lasts and I hope it works for others. 

peace

[direstraits]

petunia,so happy you're seeing such relief! I hope it continues...

[Pugknows]

Petunia, so glad Vitamin C worked for you. I took just one 500 extended release pill and it made me feel drugged all day and still had the cortisol surging. Is it because I didn't take enough?

[alex]

YAY!!! So happy for you Petu.

It is happening....slowly but surely

[chia1214]

So glad for you Petunia, whether it's A, B, C, D, E or anything else! When something shifts and you get those kind of responses, that is great. All those things you reported as "gone", that's a pretty big deal.

 

My GPS died but my husband recently bought me an iphone to bring me to the 21st century. It has a GPS of sorts so I am learning to use that. It might work better if I actually went somewhere with it, ha ha.  In fact, I'm probably going to be learning how to use this iphone for quite some time. I had the original flip-phone for y-e-a-r-s.  -- Chia

[LoveandLight]

Just read your thread again..you've no idea how happy I am for you and to hear this. It's amazing!

[AliG]

  How are you doing , Petunia?    I hope this window holds for you.   This has been very hopeful.    It has been amazing, and I so hope it keeps up for you.    You so deserve this "window" to stay wide open,  for  a long while.     This  'News", made my day today.    Best wishes.     Ali .

[Petunia]

Thanks everyone for your well wishes, support and encouragement.  I'm still in this window (feeling much better), even though I've suddenly come down with a cold/flu.  Its ironic really, I'm taking more vitamin C than I've ever taken in my life and I've just got a cold, but I don't care, its a pleasure to be 'normally' sick and to be able to enjoy 'taking care of' my cold symptoms.  I made myself some hot honey and lemon drink and actually enjoyed the taste of it.  I haven't really been able to enjoy the taste of anything for about 4 years.  Pleasure from eating/drinking has come back.... and smell too, I'm enjoying the smell of things again, well I was before my nose got blocked up from the cold.

 

I went to visit my sister yesterday afternoon and it was so easy driving there.  Then when I left it was dark and I drove to a mall in an area I didn't know well because I needed to buy something, I was having such a good time, being out, not wanting to go home yet, feeling like a 'normal' person, able to do what I wanted to do again.

 

Last night and this morning I tried taking 2000mg, but I still woke up when it wore off about 2.5 hours later, so I'm hoping that the extended release is going to work better, when it arrives.  I've ordered several brands and strengths so I can experiment to see what works best.

 

 

(I will also get myself vitamin C in high doses Read about it from another member as well)

 

I'm hoping it works for you too bubble, I'll be waiting to hear about your results.

 

 I can't help but wonder if it is a window and I want to know if you have been taking the probiotic you were on and the Vit C? ....

 

I hope yours is better than the one I have ... and I suspect it needs to be updated but it may just be no good.  Hope yours is better. 

 

 

Me too bt, I'm wondering if this is is 'just' a window, that was going to happen anyway.  But even if it is, and it closes again for a while, it will still be my first real window after waiting for a long time to get something I hear other people get, and it will give me hope and some much needed proof that I am actually healing. I haven't really been bothering with a probiotic.  After I realized the Bimuno wasn't helping, I kept forgetting to take the probiotics too.  I took them when I remembered, but not regularly.  I think I've been forgetting for days at a time, but I did take one today and yesterday, for me, they don't seem to make much difference one way or the other.

 

My GPS is about 5 years old and wasn't new when I got it, it got passed around my family a few times and then sat in its box in my closet for 3 years.  It's map is very outdated, but the cost of buying a cable and updating the map would be close to the cost of buying a new GPS, so I'm not going to bother.  If I start having problems because of outdated maps, I'll probably buy a new GPS, I have to create a new life first though, so I have places to go.

 

Petunia, so glad Vitamin C worked for you. I took just one 500 extended release pill and it made me feel drugged all day and still had the cortisol surging. Is it because I didn't take enough?

 

I'm sorry the 500mg didn't help Pug.  I'm not sure why,. but if I were you, I would try a higher dose.  Member antidepressantsNoMore takes 3000mg at a time, perhaps you need a higher dose, especially as its extended release.  Even if it makes you feel tired and sleepy for a few days, it might be worth it to get some relief from the cortisol surges.  The first few days I took it, I was very lazy/relaxed and even though I was feeling better, I didn't have the energy to do anything, but I felt better psychologically and so I didn't really care.  It seemed to take about 3 - 4 days of taking it for my physical energy to build up.

 

My GPS died but my husband recently bought me an iphone to bring me to the 21st century. It has a GPS of sorts so I am learning to use that. It might work better if I actually went somewhere with it, ha ha.  In fact, I'm probably going to be learning how to use this iphone for quite some time. I had the original flip-phone for y-e-a-r-s.  -- Chia

 

I desperately need to catch up with the 21st century too, but so far, its been impossible because I lost my ability to learn or retain new information, its been quite terrifying really, just thinking about getting an iphone would send me into a panic, my daughter is onto her third one and has it synced with a smart watch, I think that's what she has, I have no idea about 95% of her life now, she suddenly grew up and took control of her own life while I was struck down with withdrawal.  The last thing I remember was taking her to martial arts classes after school and soccer practice on the weekends, now suddenly she flies all over the world and books her own flights and accommodation and I couldn't even get myself together enough to drive her to the airport..... but I can now, because I'm getting better and I've got a GPS

[LoveandLight]

I bet your so relieved! And I bet relief isn't even the word

[mammaP]

Petu I am so glad that you have a beautiful wide open window, you deserve it, you really do.  I think you are amazing to get through the withdrawal symptoms you are plagued with and still be here to support others. I'm going to try the vit C too, I have a tub in the cupboard and don't know why I didn't start them, maybe I've been too scared of adverse effects! I tried the bimuno and felt really weird after taking it. I took a whole sachet just once and felt drugged! Head filled with cotton wool feeling, like everything was far away.  I might have another go with half a sachet, I have some probiotic sachets too. I had been taking multi-billion acidophilus 

but ran out and it is very expensive so bought the sachets instead and haven't tried them yet. Will try one at a time though starting with the vit C, hopefully will help with the insomnia.  To sleep for 2.5 hours in a stretch would be amazing! 

 

I hope your window stays open for a long time for you, enjoy every minute 

[Rhiannon]

Petu, I get really good results with vitamin C too.  Recently when I was struggling with pushing my taper too much I went through a bad spell that was just getting worse and worse, with panic attacks and constant anxiety and insomnia, then I realized that among other things I had not been taking my vitamin C regularly and got back on track with that and felt better within about two days.

 

If you take a lot of it (I take anywhere from 2 grams to 6-8 grams a day) it's also a powerful anti-histamine. It's springtime here now and everything is blooming, so I'm pretty sure that's part of why it hit me so hard this past few weeks when I wasn't taking it. I find that taking quercitin along with the vitamin C makes it work even better, so I take both.

 

Given how well you responded to the C I suspect you may have some histamine sensitivity going on here too. I remember Gia was so frustrated with not improving for years, before she figured out that the histamine connection was a problem for her. That was the piece that really turned things around for her, I think.

 

Personally I don't really follow the low histamine diet, mainly because I do best with a low-starch high-protein diet and that's hard to overlap with the low histamine diet. For me the vitamin C and quercitin seem to do the trick--when I don't forget to take them! Plus the C has the cortisol lowering effect too. 

 

I'm so glad to hear you're getting some improvement finally!

[Rhiannon]

Just FYI, the reason I started taking high doses of vitamin C (long before I started tapering meds) is because I found out that almost all mammals make their own vitamin C and they have MUCH higher amounts of it in their bloodstream than humans do (unless said humans are taking multi-gram doses).  At some point one of our primate ancestors acquired a mutation that made them unable to make their own vitamin C but it didn't kill it because it was a fruit eater, apparently. We and a small group of Old World apes still carry that mutation.

 

The only other mammals who have survived that same mutation are other fruit eaters. The reason we think of "guinea pig" as the prototypical example of "critters people experiment on" is because the guinea pig is one of those, it doesn't make its own vitamin C either, so it's the animal they usually do vitamin C experiments on, or used to anyway. (I don't think guinea pigs are actually used as guinea pigs much anywhere these days, it's mostly rats.)

 

Not really important, just sort of interesting. I figured what the heck, if high blood levels of vitamin C are the norm in almost all mammals on the planet and it's actually an exception to need to get it from your diet, it probably wouldn't hurt me to take high doses.  That was just my thinking for me, of course--I could be wrong!

[btdt]

I can really identify with getting caught up and having difficulties with trying to learn.. the 21st century has left me in the dust.  

[Petunia]

I wrote this and now I'm finding it really difficult to press the 'add reply' button, but I will.  But a small warning first, its not a good update.

 

Thanks everyone for your comments, and Rhi for all the info, I wish I could write that things are still improving, but something has gone pear shaped again. Is that even an expression? I seem to doubt everything these days.

 

The vitamin C is still providing a physical calming effect, when I take it, as long as I stay home and don't do much. But because I was feeling a bit better, I was getting out and doing more, and I'm not sure why, but now I'm feeling even worse, but in a different way.

 

I just don't feel right, nothing feels familiar, even without the constant fight/flight feeling in my body, there's something very wrong, I can't seem to get back to safe ground, if that makes any sense. I can't even describe what's wrong. Its like I've developed an allergy to life, or myself, I can't figure out which. Every little movement of life has become incredibly difficult to tolerate, its excruciating, having to do anything. At the same time, there is no one familiar inside of me, no 'self' I recognize, who would normally help me figure out how to do things. All the old reasons for doing things are gone, and nothing new has taken their place.

 

At first, it was a 'relief' and sort of exciting to be feeling more relaxed in my body, and believing that I was finally getting back to 'normal'. But things are still feeling wrong. I went to a Tai Chi demonstration and introductory session yesterday and immediately I got there, I knew it was 'wrong'. It was just all wrong. I didn't want to be there, I wasn't supposed to be there. I didn't know what I was doing, why I was doing it. I had agreed to go because my mum suggested it and she was going, so I thought it might be good for me to try and do something, especially now I'm supposedly feeling better. I've done tai chi before and enjoyed it.

 

But I was like a perfectly functioning, empty shell, aware of too much, just wanting to go home.  I didn't want to be out in a meaningless world where I don't fit any more. I can't relate to normal people any more, its frightening to realize this. I've lost so much already, and now it seems its impossible to get back... to where? I don't even want to get back to anywhere, I just want a sense of something solid and meaningful and dependable. But there's nothing, just clear, open empty space with nothing to hold onto. I can't seem to get used to this weird way of experiencing life now. Its like its perfect and awful both at the same time. There's an acute awareness of wanting to run away, to escape, but there's nowhere left to go.  Realizing that I'm out of options makes it even more terrifying.

 

The strange thing was, while I was actually doing the tai chi, it was a good distraction and I became totally involved in the process, but it was everything else about the afternoon I found difficult, stressful and overwhelming.... getting ready to go, making sure I had what I needed. Meeting new people, filling in forms, trying to socialize, it was all too much.

 

But it wasn't only that it was cognitively challenging.  I'm not even sure it was that. It was more that I had an inner resistance to all the social and cultural expectations which were required. I was noticing everything and my emotional reactions, but feeling completely stuck, helpless and enmeshed in a culture I don't particularly like at the moment.  I resent having to look and act a certain way, in order to have my basic needs met and I seem to be connecting it with every little thing I do. Its like a game I don't want to be playing any more, but I don't have a choice. 

 

I'm able to do more things than I was a year ago. I can handle daily tasks of life without triggering the adrenal response so intensely now. I'm able to pay bills online, make phone calls, order things over the internet and load the dishwasher, without breaking out into a sweat and shaking. But now there's something else happening and I don't know how to describe it. Its like a deep and painful psychological resistance to existence itself, and anything which supports it. Something just doesn't want to be here, living this life any more, there no longer seems to be a valid reason. I cant go back and I can't see forward, I'm just stuck here between emptiness and lies, nothing feels real any more, not even me.

 

This is terrifying on a whole new level. I'm walking around in a physical world, which no longer feels real.  My own body and mind are no longer familiar, I'm not connected to them any more.  There's no pleasure, meaning or satisfaction in anything, just impulses to do things to keep this body alive, because for now, that seems like the only goal, to stay alive, but I have no idea why. I feel so scared in this experience of complete disconnection from everything which used to be me and the world. I'm completely alone, because nothing and no one seems real any more.

 

Vitamin C might be blocking the fear response in my body, but it hasn't gone away, its just manifesting differently, I'm not even sure if taking it is a good idea, maybe I need to go through the process of feeling a lot of fear on a physical level, maybe its some kind of spiritual purification process. In a way, having intense, unpleasant physical sensations is less frightening than endless nothingness and infinite, meaningless possibility.

 

Something strange is going on, I don't understand it.  I found a way to stop a major symptom, I'm sure it was working, it wasn't my imagination.  There was a flow on effect to my mood and behavior.  I was 'getting better'.  But now, even with that symptom under control, I still have no control over this process.

 

I think I need to go back to the basics.  Breathing and moment to moment acceptance of reality, rather than trying to control it. I don't know what else to do, this is too hard.  I'm lost, alone, in the dark, scared, in pain and no one is coming to rescue me, there are no solutions, only this test of faith. But faith in what? That life actually knows what its doing?

 

Life never used to be this terrifying, even before medication, not even close.  I used to have a kind of built in protection from reality, but now even that's gone.

 

 

[mattinsmom]

I am so glad to hear that a window has opened for you and that you are able to enjoy it. I hope that it stays open while you find the right combination of vit c. I am picturing your vit c as a stick to use to prop that window open!!! Hang in there, love it, breathe it, grab it and hold it close. Windows are the best. I am so happy for you. 

[OffEFFexor]

Petu, I am sorry you are experiencing this weirdness.  I hope this frightening, not feeling right sensation passes soon, maybe this is just another strange manifestation of the healing/restructuring process.  Maybe that window and the relief the Vit C provided will return quickly.

[Rhiannon]

Petu, I know it's miserable, but what you describe is really from what I have seen a pretty normal part of this journey. You aren't well yet, you're just getting some relief from some of the harsh physical symptoms you were having. You still have a lot of reweaving of your brain to do. But this is how it goes. You just do what you can, and push it a little sometimes, and draw it back in often, and find the little things that help, and take it one day at a time. I think part of it is still the withdrawal, your brain regrowing itself and figuring out how to do that, and part of it is what anybody who goes through tremendous life-transforming trauma goes through--it completely changes how you relate to the world. The template for how to do that is within you, though, and you will continue to find your way.

Oddly, what you are saying sounds good to me, like yes, familiar, I remember that, and I have heard so many other people expressing similar things. It's the healing path. You, unfortunately, are one of the folks with a longer and more complex path, but I think down the road is a place you are going to be happy to be living in. Eventually.

 

Meanwhile, thank you as always for your eloquence! Please write a book someday. At least one.

[Muddles]

I'm sorry. I was so happy to see you had experienced your first real window.

 

I know exactly how this feels though - I thought it was dp/dr but not quite sure. It happened to me instantly in poop-out and I didn't know what was going on. Walking around the house - telling my husband I felt 'lost' and didn't know what to do with myself because It didn't matter what I did it just didn't feel right or normal.

 

I think maybe now the awful, intense, physical symptoms have died down - the DP/DR and emotional numbness is more noticeable. This was always probably there underneath but the fear and other symptoms were on top. I do not get the fear so experience what you do 24/7 along with the other awful symptoms.

I've just been to the supermarket and just couldn't wait to get back - not because I was scared and not because I was reacting to something in there - it was that awful uncomfortable feeling of not being part of 'normal' life. It's just the worst feeling ever and I'm constantly trying to just get something from anything.

 

I've read many people have come out of this though. I have had moments. It's just a matter of time - one day it will lift and you will feel present. How heavenly will that be.

 

Thinking of you.

[mammaP]

Petu I am sorry to see that your window was short lived but this sounds like a more positive wave if there is such a thing. I echo Rhi's thoughts that this is part of healing and getting back to homeostasis. Reading it reminded me of how I was for years with effexor, but couldn't have explained it like you have, you've a lovely way with words.  Being alone and not having work  makes this journey so much more difficult because it is so lonely, the hours and days tick by with no structure when suffering withdrawal. I find routine very hard being alone, it is easier when there is someone to look after and focus on but when all you have is what is going on inside you it is so hard.  

 

I hope your window opens again soon Petu, you deserve it and it is time you had a break for more than a day or 2.  Mamma hugs, big squishy ones.