Ninabird: Effexor withdrawal?

[brassmonkey]

There can be several ranges of dose where the symptoms can be more pronounced. If a taper is done properly and slowly, taking holds when needed there should be almost no symptoms or very manageable symptoms when you get to the lower doses. The final jump to "0" should be a nonevent.

[Ninabird]

1 minute ago, brassmonkey said:

There can be several ranges of dose where the symptoms can be more pronounced. If a taper is done properly and slowly, taking holds when needed there should be almost no symptoms or very manageable symptoms when you get to the lower doses. The final jump to "0" should be a nonevent.

You just made my YEAR! That gives me so much hope! 

[Ninabird]

@Frogie @brassmonkey

 I am changing Real Estate Brokerages this week.Great timing, right?! It was a tough decision but it was the right one for me. After I made the change, I had a mini breakdown. I started to question if my mind was up for the change, the work...etc. Pre WD I would worry if I made the right choice and would move on.. but it seems with WD everything (and I mean EVERYTHING) seems magnified tenfold. There are times where I feel like I could go crazy. I know I am not and I understand that it is the drugs and WD. I wonder will I ever be able to multi task or get through a single task without losing focus twenty times. Even wind on my skin irritates me right now. 

Going straight to Cymbalta to Effexor was essentially a CT. I know that no-one can tell me when I will start to feel better. I am terribly afraid to resume my taper from Lexapro. I fear that the first drop will cause me to spiral into a dark abyss (future tripping is no good and I am a bit of a drama queen) Do you have any idea if the resuming the taper will cause me more harm or will I just have to wait and hope for the best? I also stopped eating candy and sweets two days ago. 

I look forward to looking in the mirror one day and not see bloodshot eyes and dark circles. Just ME, smiling back.

 

 

 

[Ninabird]

@frogie, @brassmonkey @ChessieCat
 

Im at the eye Dr right now. Is there any harm in getting my eyes dilated during WD?

 

sorry for tagging so many but I’m here now and want to make the right decision 

[Ninabird]

1 hour ago, Ninabird said:

@frogie, @brassmonkey @ChessieCat
 

Im at the eye Dr right now. Is there any harm in getting my eyes dilated during WD?

 

sorry for tagging so many but I’m here now and want to make the right decision 

They gave me drops for dry eyes. Active ingredient is Carbooxymethylcellulose. Is this ok to use?

[Ninabird]

@brassmonkey

 

Hello and happy Monday.

I hope you won't get upset or frustrated with me but I am going to tell you up front....I am mathematically challenged in every way imaginable. For Real Estate I am dependent on my calculator for everything. 

 

I weighed the 10 Lexapro pills on my Gemini scale (it's 3 years old. Is that ok?) 10 pills = 1.289 g or 455 oz 

I am super nervous about doing this perfectly. I will follow every single bit of your instruction to a T. Just teach me like a grade schooler on this.

Hard to believe I studied art history and am a Realtor but I can't do math. 

 

I am choosing to resume tapering the Lexapro and not the Cymbalta based on the advice from the Mod at Cymbalta hurts more. Thank you for your help with this. I made a donation to show my gratitude. Brassmonkey, I just want to look at myself in the mirror one day and see MYSELF smiling back instead of this sick individual I hardly recognize, I know it will take time. But I want to get to the end of this storm in one piece. 

 

Blessings to you.

[brassmonkey]

Not to worry, the calculations are really easy, especially with a calculator. It's pretty common for people to be in jobs that require a lot of math and yet don't really understand it. My first degree was in Motinpicture Production and used very little math. But I also have an engineering degree and have spent most of my working life building airplanes and being a research engineer for the composites industry. I have a condition called dyscalculia, similar to dyslexia but with numbers, they basically don't mean a thing to me. But somehow, I've managed to get pretty good with them. Any way.

 

Your 3 ear old scales should be fine, you might want to put a new battery in them.

 

We will be working in grams and milligrams, grams on the scale and milligrams for everything else.

 

So, your 10 pills weighed 1.289g. That means 1 pill weighs 0.1289g or 129milligrams. We are going to refer to this as 129mgpw (milligrams pill weight).

 

You mentioned earlier that the strength of your pills is 10mg. we will refer to this as 10mgai (milligrams Active Ingredient).

 

This means that each pill is made up of 10mgai of medication and 119mg of filler. The fillers are basically sugar and baking soda.

 

Our first calculation is to divide the strength of the pill by the total weight of the pill.

 

10 / 129 = 0.08

 

This gives us the amount of active ingredient in 1mgpw of pill. Which is called the AIC (Active Ingredient Concentration). We don't need it now, but this number can be useful in the future.

 

The next big question is, how do you want to do your taper? SAs general recommendation is no faster than 10% every 4 weeks. Many people find this too harsh. I highly recommend the Brassmonkey Slide Method. That is 2.5% a week for 4 weeks with an additional 2 week hold period. We have had very excellent success with this method. It is designed to give the fastest rate of reduction while minimizing the symptoms caused by each drop. Once you decide which method you want to use, we can make the calculations for the reductions.

[Ninabird]

On 6/20/2022 at 12:46 PM, brassmonkey said:

The next big question is, how do you want to do your taper? SAs general recommendation is no faster than 10% every 4 weeks. Many people find this too harsh. I highly recommend the Brassmonkey Slide Method. That is 2.5% a week for 4 weeks with an additional 2 week hold period. We have had very excellent success with this method. It is designed to give the fastest rate of reduction while minimizing the symptoms caused by each drop. Once you decide which method you want to use, we can make the calculations for the reductions.

I will be doing the BMS taper. I am all for easier on my SNS. My PNP is helping me with this too. What should I do with the tablets? shave them down w a file? Crush them? I need so much help on this. My lack of knowledge on tapering is making me anxious. Thanks again for all of your help. You have no idea how much I appreciate your kindness. 

[Ninabird]

I am trying my best to hold myself together.The last couple of weeks have been pretty tough and seem to be getting more intense as far as anxiety is concerned. I wake up with anxiety. Right around 8am it has been starting to ramp up. I have burning on my skin. It is so hard for me to concentrate on my work. The thought of showing properties in this condition is making my anxiety worse. I have to work. There is no way around it. I find myself wringing my hands throughout the day and constantly fidgeting. I feel like I am in the Groundhogs Day movie. I want out of this hell. I am still on 10mg of Lex and 30mg of Cymbalta. Waiting to resume the taper of Lex when symptoms calm down but that doesn't seem to be happening. I seem to be getting worse. I push through every single day. I have moments in the day where things aren't as intense but how much more of this can I take before I just break in half? 

I just changed brokerages and I have a lot of new tech to learn and new policies. I can't fall apart at this point, I have to keep fighting. If I resume the taper of Lex feeling like this am I going to make my symptoms worse? Today I feel like I am slowly unravelling. 

 

[Ninabird]

@brassmonkey

How should I resume my taper? I am in a wave that I don't think will stop because of the ADR to the Lexapro. I have waited for 4 months now. I just seem to be getting worse.

[Ninabird]

@Frogie @ChessieCat @brassmonkey

 

I have spoken to my PNP and are ready to resume my taper on Lexapro. I have had help with Brassmonkey. I need help on how to start. I will be doing the Brassmonkeyslide. I will be doing pill form. Do I crush the pill? Shave and weigh? 

Thank you all so very much. I will do my daily journals once I get started. I need guidance, please. Thank you for your time.

[Faure]

Hi, I see you’re asking how to manage the practical side of the taper. This is what I do for my taper, using the brass monkey slide and scales:
 

When I started I weighed 3 whole pills and divided by 3 (the number of the pills I weighed) to get an average pill weight. I then took the percentage I needed off the average weight so I knew what weight needed to go in my capsule. Do all this with whole pills, before you grind. BrassMonkey has a useful website called taperoff.co which does the calculations for you. 

 

In my case the average pill weight was 0.152 mg and I took just 0.004mg (2.5%) off, so my first lot of pills weighed 0.148mg. Incidentally I’m now down to 6mg a year later. 

 

Then I ground a weeks worth of pills (keep the spare powder in a separate capsule for another day), emptied them into an egg cup,  stirred them and weighed the amount I needed for one pill, tipping it from the weighing tray into a folded piece of paper and into the capsule.
 

For weighing I scoop some powder up with a teaspoon and use a toothpick to knock bits onto the scale till I get to the exact amount. Accuracy is absolutely vital. Make sure you have calibrated the scale each time before you use it. 

 

I bought this pill grinder and size 0 gelatin capsules. 

 

I don’t know about your medication you’ll need to get input from a mod about that or look up tips tapering your particular medication. But this is how I manage the practical side. 
 

I hope it goes well for you. 

[Frogie]

@Ninabird

 

I'm going to give you a link that explains how to use a scale.

 

I haven't read it in a long time, but starting out you will weigh 10 tablets to get the average weight of each tablet. Once that is established, as long as you don't change brands (which is very difficult on your system in the first place), you won't have to do that again.

 

Using a scale to weigh and measure doses

 

Let me know if you have any other questions. I will be in and out. 

[brassmonkey]

Here's a lot of information on the Brassmonkey Slide Method:

 

The Brassmonkey Slide Method of Micro-tapering - Tapering - Surviving Antidepressants

 

It will be easiest if you crush your pills and weigh the powder and put it into gel caps.

 

Using the numbers from above your first cycle would go like this:

 

Week 1; 129mgpw X 0.975 = 126mgpw That is the amount of powder you weigh out.

Week 2; 129mgpw X 0.95 = 123mgpw

Week 3; 129mgpw X 0.925 = 119 mgpw

Weeks 4-6; 129mgpe X .9 = 116mgpw

 

For your second cycle you use the same calculations except using 116mgpw for the starting number.

 

Be sure to keep written records because it is really easy to lose track of where you are in the cycle. I usually make up a full weeks' worth of capsules at a time, so I don't have to do it every day.

[Chlo]

11 hours ago, Ninabird said:

@Frogie @ChessieCat @brassmonkey

 

I have spoken to my PNP and are ready to resume my taper on Lexapro. I have had help with Brassmonkey. I need help on how to start. I will be doing the Brassmonkeyslide. I will be doing pill form. Do I crush the pill? Shave and weigh? 

Thank you all so very much. I will do my daily journals once I get started. I need guidance, please. Thank you for 

 

[Chlo]

1 minute ago, Chlo said:

 

Nevermind 😁

[Greatful]

@Ninabird

How are you doing?

[Ninabird]

On 6/23/2022 at 12:50 PM, brassmonkey said:

Week 1; 129mgpw X 0.975 = 126mgpw That is the amount of powder you weigh out.

Week 2; 129mgpw X 0.95 = 123mgpw

Week 3; 129mgpw X 0.925 = 119 mgpw

Weeks 4-6; 129mgpe X .9 = 116mgpw

 

I THINK I understand. Do you mind if I run by numbers by you before I drop just to make sure I am doing it right?

Also, I watched your video on dumping the powder from your Prozac capsules. Why did you leave the veggie cap on the scale? I got totally lost on that part...

This all too confusing when your brain isn't functioning correctly.

Thank you for all of your help.

[Ninabird]

4 hours ago, Greatful said:

How are you doing?

Absolutely terrified to resume my taper.Last two days have been decent.

 How are you doing? I think and pray for you often. How is your summer in MN going?

[brassmonkey]

I would be happy to review any of your numbers, also most of the other mods are quite good at it too.

 

I've never done a video about removing powder from capsules.

 

I thought you were crushing tablets. Now that we have calculated the average weight of a pill and the weight of the dose you want, the pile of powder just becomes a stockpile from which you remove as much as you need, so the weight of the empty capsule wouldn't matter.

[Ninabird]

4 hours ago, brassmonkey said:

I thought you were crushing tablets

I am crushing the tablets.

[Ninabird]

4 hours ago, brassmonkey said:

I've never done a video about removing powder from capsules

I just assumed it was you....sorry. It was a video Frogie suggested on here. Very informative. Thankyou for all of your help. I hope you are having a great weekend!

[Ninabird]

On 6/24/2022 at 1:31 PM, Greatful said:

How are you doing?

Better the last few days. I have been enjoying this window! How are you doing grateful! I can't wait for you to feel good enough to start chatting on video or on the phone. Chlo and moon pie and I are chatting nearly everyday. I pray for you often. Thank you for checking in on me. 

[Ninabird]

On 6/23/2022 at 9:13 PM, Chlo said:

Nevermind 😁

You are the sweetest.

[Ninabird]

@brassmonkey @ArielAriel @Frogie @Moonpie @Chlo

 

Today was the first day of resuming my Lexapro. Thank you to everyone who helped me with the beginning calculations. I am especially grateful to @moonpie for the one-on-one FaceTime tutorial. You made it fun and educational.

Guys, I am beyond terrified at this point. I have had Dr's pull me off of AD's so quick and with very painful results. This is my first "safe and slow.\," taper but my body remembers the pain. I am still in pain everyday and have to accept that this may be my new normal for a while.When can I tell that a drop has occurred?  I cannot tell you all how much I appreciate ea and every one of you. You are doing a beautiful service to those that are suffering and need somewhere to turn to. @Ariel I am so proud of you, ma'am. 

[Greatful]

@Ninabird  congrats for taking the bull by the horns....I know that fear well.  This whole experience has pulled the rug out for most of us.   

Everyone feels it in their own time and even with that it can change from one drop to another. Maybe you will sail through it with just a little dip🤗

 

You got this this time.  You have your support from here and you will not be alone this time❤️

[Ninabird]

1 minute ago, Greatful said:

You have your support from here and you will not be alone this time❤️

I wish I could hug you. You are so wonderful. How are YOU doing?

[arbor]

All my best to you @Ninabird

I'm thinking of you 🙏

Arbor

[Ninabird]

@arbor

Thank you! I know everyone says your brain recognizes the drop a few days after but today is my first drop and I feel different today. I feel a lot more "off," and I am getting rushes of mild panic, mixed with other cognitive symptoms. I am very sensitive to meds...I am praying that I will be able to hold myself together as I nEED to keep working. 

 

How are you doing Arbor? I am always thinking of you. 

[Ariel]

@Ninabird

Good luck with your taper. 

You are brave and strong and you have already made it through so much. 

You can do this. 

 

[Faure]

11 hours ago, Ninabird said:

know everyone says your brain recognizes the drop a few days after but today is my first drop and I feel different today

I usually notice a drop the next day. In my case I usually feel a bit better - lighter, a bit more energy.  I am noticing now I’m tapering lower doses that my body also reacts a few days after - mostly tired and fleeting pains in my legs.  Good luck with your taper.

[Frogie]

@Ninabird

 

You've got this. Let me know if I can help in anyway😊

[Ninabird]

5 hours ago, Faure said:

sually notice a drop the next day. In my case I usually feel a bit better - lighter, a bit more energy.  I am noticing now I’m tapering lower doses that my body also reacts a few days after - mostly tired and fleeting pains in my legs.  Good luck with your taper.

Thank you. Yesterday was just such a wonky day. 
Today I have a little more anxiety than usual. It’s very early still. I’m about to take my med now. Praying it goes relatively ok. 
thank you for your support. 

[Ninabird]

2 hours ago, Frogie said:

 

@Ninabird

 

You've got this. Let me know if I can help in anyway😊

 

I had a few moments yesterday… just very teary and afraid. I have to work during my taper. Hoping it’s tolerable. Thank you for your support Frogie. 🥰

[Ninabird]

10 hours ago, Ariel said:

You are brave and strong and you have already made it through so much. 

Thank you sweet Ariel. 
How are you doing? I think of you often. 
🥰

[Faure]

You know, I think the start of a taper is very scary. I hope that it goes smoothly for you and you’ll start feeling a bit more confident. I remember about 4 nights into my first week of tapering I didn’t sleep much at all and it was very difficult, that was fortunately the worst it got. Once my body realised the drug was reducing it was able to adapt. Of course everyone is different. It has also got easier over time as the drug is reducing.