FireflyFyte: Latuda withdrawal

[littlebird]

On 3/15/2023 at 11:03 AM, FireflyFyte said:

I had a friend ask if I was doing anything to care for myself and had to admit that I wasn't so tonight might try to carve out some time for coloring and/or meditation. I might also grab dinner with my Mom and spare myself from cooking this evening as well.

 

I'm so glad you're going to take time for yourself! Hope you have a lovely evening. 💜

[FireflyFyte]

Thank you, @Embi and @littlebird. I wasn't as gentle with myself as I should have been but have Monday off from work so after doing some cleaning, am going to decompress and work on some self-care.

[FireflyFyte]

I have still not been great with logs. My memory has been iffy, at best, this week which, again, could be the medication, withdrawals, and/or general stress from life so I keep forgetting to write down notes in addition to plenty else slipping from my mind.

 

I am also noticing that I am easily irritated. I am worried that irritable is my natural state and the drug(s) have been masking it but I suppose that I won't know until I am fully off of them and give myself some time to adjust. I really hope it isn't who I am, generally.

[Embi]

2 hours ago, FireflyFyte said:

I am also noticing that I am easily irritated. I am worried that irritable is my natural state and the drug(s) have been masking it but I suppose that I won't know until I am fully off of them and give myself some time to adjust. I really hope it isn't who I am, generally.

I also wonder this, but I don’t think it’s fair to judge tapering-you as being the same as off-meds-you. Going through all of this is very stressful and it’s no wonder you’re easily irritated.

[Thorin]

5 hours ago, FireflyFyte said:

I am also noticing that I am easily irritated. I am worried that irritable is my natural state and the drug(s) have been masking it but I suppose that I won't know until I am fully off of them and give myself some time to adjust. I really hope it isn't who I am, generally.

This old conundrum. Everyone seems to stress about this including me. It makes sense to be a bit worried about it when you’re not feeling great. Only time will tell. I wonder if you were irritable before you went on meds? If so was it situational or ‘you’?

[littlebird]

8 hours ago, FireflyFyte said:

I have still not been great with logs. My memory has been iffy, at best, this week which, again, could be the medication, withdrawals, and/or general stress from life so I keep forgetting to write down notes in addition to plenty else slipping from my mind.

 

Do you have google docs? I've been doing a monthly log in there, and I like that I can add things in from my computer or phone and it'll sync up. Helps me keep track of doses to log them right away from whatever device is closest. My memory has also been iffy, it's so frustrating!!

 

3 hours ago, Thorin said:

8 hours ago, FireflyFyte said:

I suppose that I won't know until I am fully off of them and give myself some time to adjust. I really hope it isn't who I am, generally.

This old conundrum. Everyone seems to stress about this including me. It makes sense to be a bit worried about it when you’re not feeling great. Only time will tell. I wonder if you were irritable before you went on meds? If so was it situational or ‘you’?

 

Great question, Thorin! 

 

5 hours ago, Embi said:

I also wonder this, but I don’t think it’s fair to judge tapering-you as being the same as off-meds-you. Going through all of this is very stressful and it’s no wonder you’re easily irritated.

 

Well said. Tapering-me is definitely not baseline-me, at least it doesn't feel like it. Hard to just be patient and see!

[FireflyFyte]

On 3/17/2023 at 5:00 PM, Embi said:

I also wonder this, but I don’t think it’s fair to judge tapering-you as being the same as off-meds-you. Going through all of this is very stressful and it’s no wonder you’re easily irritated.

 

Thank you, Embi. I am going to try and keep this in mind. How have you been feeling?

 

On 3/17/2023 at 6:55 PM, Thorin said:

This old conundrum. Everyone seems to stress about this including me. It makes sense to be a bit worried about it when you’re not feeling great. Only time will tell. I wonder if you were irritable before you went on meds? If so was it situational or ‘you’?

 

Yes, it's another lesson in patience, for sure.

 

On 3/17/2023 at 10:51 PM, littlebird said:

Well said. Tapering-me is definitely not baseline-me, at least it doesn't feel like it. Hard to just be patient and see!

 

Patience is most certainly not a strong suit of mine 😅

[FireflyFyte]

I haven't kept logs in a few days. Might have to take @littlebird's advice and try using Google Docs instead of pen and paper. I am on the computer enough.

 

I continue to deal with higher levels of irritability, feeling exhausted upon waking despite sleeping 8+ hours, and next to zero motivation. I am also having periods of depression which, always the conundrum, not sure if they are related to the drugs I am taking, withdrawals, and/or life in general.

 

I am leaving for a short vacation on Sunday and, once again, I wish I was excited but can't seem to access joy or excitement at the moment even though I am down to 2.025mg of the Olanzapine. Hopefully more of my emotions will surface once I am closer to 1 mg. 

[Embi]

1 hour ago, FireflyFyte said:

I continue to deal with higher levels of irritability, feeling exhausted upon waking despite sleeping 8+ hours, and next to zero motivation. I am also having periods of depression which, always the conundrum, not sure if they are related to the drugs I am taking, withdrawals, and/or life in general.

 

I am leaving for a short vacation on Sunday and, once again, I wish I was excited but can't seem to access joy or excitement at the moment even though I am down to 2.025mg of the Olanzapine. Hopefully more of my emotions will surface once I am closer to 1 mg. 

I can relate to a lot of these symptoms, especially not being able to access joy and excitement. I think that not having access to positive emotions really increases the lack of motivation and irritability. Hopefully your vacation will give you some time to rest, if nothing else.
 

I’m getting by, very up and down at the moment. Trying to just keep going.

 

[Thorin]

8 hours ago, FireflyFyte said:

am leaving for a short vacation on Sunday and, once again, I wish I was excited but can't seem to access joy or excitement at the moment even though I am down to 2.025mg of the Olanzapine. Hopefully more of my emotions will surface once I am closer to 1 mg. 

This only came for me once I’d been sitting at a lower dose for some time. But it came.

[littlebird]

3 hours ago, Thorin said:

This only came for me once I’d been sitting at a lower dose for some time. But it came.

 

I needed to hear it might come! Thank you

[FireflyFyte]

22 hours ago, Embi said:

I’m getting by, very up and down at the moment. Trying to just keep going.

 

Sometimes, that's all you can do. I hope it improves for you soon.

 

16 hours ago, Thorin said:

This only came for me once I’d been sitting at a lower dose for some time. But it came.

 

Appreciate the nugget of hope, Thorin. Fingers crossed that mine return when I get to lower doses.

[FireflyFyte]

I believe I have read here that withdrawal symptoms can be worse around one's period and I am starting to think that I fall into that category. Mine should be arriving in the next few days and am currently battling heavy depression, a near complete lack of motivation, and feelings of fatigue. 

 

Of course, this is happening right before my vacation 😅

 

If I continue to feel this way, I might push my next drop back by a week and give myself a little more time to settle. I will check in with myself on Sunday and make a decision one way or another.

 

In the meantime, trying to be as gentle as I can be with myself while still getting some work done and preparing to fly out tomorrow morning.

[Addax]

8 hours ago, FireflyFyte said:

I believe I have read here that withdrawal symptoms can be worse around one's period

I will attest to this. It was my experience during a previous taper years ago,  and has been my experience now. Of course, I am now also perimenopausal, which adds to the hormonal fluctuations. 

 

8 hours ago, FireflyFyte said:

In the meantime, trying to be as gentle as I can be with myself

You are doing it right. And I need to remind myself to do this.

[FireflyFyte]

12 hours ago, Addax said:

I will attest to this. It was my experience during a previous taper years ago,  and has been my experience now. Of course, I am now also perimenopausal, which adds to the hormonal fluctuations. 

 

I am glad to hear that I didn't pull this thought from nowhere (am also dealing with a lot of brain fog at the moment) and that I might improve in a few days.

 

12 hours ago, Addax said:

You are doing it right. And I need to remind myself to do this.

 

It seems like it should be such an easy thing to do but I wasn't treated with gentleness growing up so am having to learn how to reparent myself as an adult. 

[FireflyFyte]

I didn't sleep well last night as I had an early(ish) flight this morning which added to my baseline anxiety. I am thinking I might try to nap once I arrive at the AirBnB this afternoon. Sadly, I left my travel blanket at home (stupid brain fog) and am usually not able to fall asleep on planes regardless. 

 

I am leaning towards making my next drop this coming Sunday which will bring me past the 2mg threshold to 1.93mg. I know that I still have a long, long way to go but something about dropping below 2mg feels uplifting in this journey. Maybe it's healthy to try and find some remnants of hope to hold onto?

[FireflyFyte]

Made another drop on Sunday and am now down to 1.93mg of Zyprexa. My current plan is to get down to 1mg of Zyprexa, hold for a little while, and then taper the Gabapentin down some - maybe try to get to 600mg a day instead of 900mg a day.

 

Otherwise, not much to report. My motivation is still low but am also just back from vacation so might take some time to get back into the swing of things.

[FireflyFyte]

Back to playing the ever fun game of "is this COVID and/or a cold and/or withdrawals" 😔

 

I made my latest drop Sunday night down to 1.93mg of Olanzapine and flew home from Florida Monday night so the cause of my current state is entirely unknown. Since Tuesday morning, I've been exhausted despite sleeping 8+ hours each night, have to blow my nose frequently, have a dry throat, and just feel generally "off". 

 

I don't have any COVID tests on hand but might go through the pharmacy drive thru to grab some. 

[Altostrata]

Do you have a few days of flu-ishness after every reduction?

[FireflyFyte]

12 hours ago, Altostrata said:

Do you have a few days of flu-ishness after every reduction?

 

No, I haven't experienced this before which is why I'm really not sure of the cause. 

[FireflyFyte]

Took an at-home COVID test which came up negative. I will continue to test over the next few days.

 

I am trying to get back into keeping logs so I can see if there is a pattern to my symptoms. Today, four days out from my last reduction, I am dealing with a front lobe headache (Tylenol helped), exhaustion, feeling warm but temperature is normal, diarrhea, occasional cough, and a nose that alternates between being runny and feeling stuffy.

 

I am hoping that I picked up a cold on my vacation or, if it is withdrawals, that they settle down in a few days. In the meantime, trying to stay hydrated, not overdo exercise, going to bed early, and eating healthy.

[FireflyFyte]

Day five out from my latest reduction and feeling markedly improved. The exhaustion has lifted, for the most part, no headache, nose is behaving, and the cough is almost entirely gone. I will test again today but am leaning towards having picked up a cold during my vacation.

 

Of course, if I see this pattern again after my next drop, I will know that it is withdrawal related and might have to make smaller cuts.

[FireflyFyte]

Eight days since my last drop and the exhaustion remains (despite sleeping 8 1/2 hours last night) but everything else has basically resolved. I'll make another drop this coming Sunday to 1.82mg and will monitor if some of the same flu-like symptoms arise again. If they do, I may have to switch to 2-3% drops every two weeks instead of my current 5% drops which would mean an even longer taper but the goal is to get off the medication with as little interruption to life as possible versus the fastest route but, still, patience is not my strong suit.

 

I am also almost entirely decided on dropping my Gabapentin down some once I get to around 1mg of Olanzapine so once there, will hold for an additional week, or two, and then begin a slow, and measured, drop of Gabapentin until I'm at around 600mg/day versus my current 900mg/day. I am hoping that being on lowered doses of Olanzapine and Gabapentin will mean more motivation, energy, and emotions can surface. I will then return to my Olanzapine taper and complete that before going back to lowering the Gabapentin.

 

Still undecided on whether I will drop the Prozac, or not, but have years to decide.

[littlebird]

On 4/3/2023 at 1:12 PM, FireflyFyte said:

Eight days since my last drop and the exhaustion remains (despite sleeping 8 1/2 hours last night) but everything else has basically resolved.

 

I find that sometimes my body needs much more sleep when it's doing some big stuff. Maybe it's okay that you need a bit more sleep to adjust?

 

Very curious how you find the drop in Gabapentin! Hope you're doing well. 

[FireflyFyte]

10 hours ago, littlebird said:

I find that sometimes my body needs much more sleep when it's doing some big stuff. Maybe it's okay that you need a bit more sleep to adjust?

 

This is a good point and trying to allow myself as much sleep as I need, currently. I have been going to bed a bit earlier and allowing myself a little more time in the morning.

 

10 hours ago, littlebird said:

Very curious how you find the drop in Gabapentin! Hope you're doing well. 

 

I am doing, well, OK, I guess? Beginning the process of selling my house which is generating a lot of anxiety and second thoughts.

[Altostrata]

Olanzapine and gabapentin can indeed be fatiguing.

[Thorin]

How are you going FfF? I’m sorry I haven’t checked in for a while. Sounds like you’re making good progress but not without some difficulty. Just have to keep putting one foot in front of the other…. Getting ready to restart my own taper….. not fun!

[FireflyFyte]

11 hours ago, Altostrata said:

Olanzapine and gabapentin can indeed be fatiguing.

 

I have been on this combination for over five months and only recently experienced this level of fatigue which is why I think it might be related to withdrawals and/or a cold I picked up on vacation. I am currently tapering the Olanzapine at the rate recommended by you, and this site, so not sure what else I can do at the moment. I would love to taper the Gabapentin as well but understand it isn't best practice to taper two drugs at the same time which is why I have decided to taper the Olanzapine down to 1mg, hold for a little while, and then taper the Gabapentin down to 600mg/day. If you have a better plan, I am all ears.

[FireflyFyte]

11 hours ago, Thorin said:

How are you going FfF? I’m sorry I haven’t checked in for a while. Sounds like you’re making good progress but not without some difficulty. Just have to keep putting one foot in front of the other…. Getting ready to restart my own taper….. not fun!

 

No need to apologize, am glad that you are getting less screen time. I am doing alright, really can't complain as my withdrawals have been minimal and manageable.

 

I am sure that you will be able to handle your taper this round as you approach it thoughtfully. 

[Altostrata]

@FireflyFyte what is your current drug schedule, with dosages? Is the fatigue worse at any particular times of day?

[FireflyFyte]

37 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

what is your current drug schedule, with dosages? Is the fatigue worse at any particular times of day?

 

• 7:30 AM - Gabapentin (300mg)
• 9:30 AM - Prozac (40mg)
• 2:00 PM - Gabapentin (300mg)
• 7:00 PM - Zyprexa (1.93mg)
• 9:00 PM - Gabapentin (300mg)

It is difficult for me to get out of bed in the morning and my body feels like it wants to sleep more even after sleeping 8 - 8 1/2 hours. Once I am up and moving, I am alright but then usually start to feel fatigued again around 4/5 PM.

[Altostrata]

You're fairly thoroughly over-medicated on brakes.

 

The dopiness in the morning is probably the Zyprexa.

 

You're taking 900mg gabapentin per day. If you put the Zyprexa taper on pause, you could reduce your 3 doses by 30mg each or 90mg total.

 

Or, you could try reducing only your 2 p.m. dose of gabapentin by 30mg-45mg, this dose may be causing drowsiness in the afternoon.

 

 

 

[FireflyFyte]

On 4/8/2023 at 6:44 PM, Altostrata said:

You're fairly thoroughly over-medicated on brakes.

 

The dopiness in the morning is probably the Zyprexa.

 

You're taking 900mg gabapentin per day. If you put the Zyprexa taper on pause, you could reduce your 3 doses by 30mg each or 90mg total.

 

Or, you could try reducing only your 2 p.m. dose of gabapentin by 30mg-45mg, this dose may be causing drowsiness in the afternoon.

 

The morning grogginess is the worst so I think I will continue my Zyprexa taper until I am down to around 1mg of Olanzapine and then will taper the Gabapentin down. If I continue with my 5% cuts every two weeks, I'll be down to 1mg in August.

[FireflyFyte]

Made another cut last night to 1.82mg of the Olanzapine. I will closely monitor myself over the next few days/week to see if any symptoms surface but my grogginess has been a little better and haven't had any headaches in quite awhile.

 

I am still mostly cut off from my emotions, which is frustrating, but I recognize that the only safe way to taper is via a slow, and steady, method so just have to try and be patient.

[FireflyFyte]

According to my Apple watch, I slept 8 hours and 45 minutes last night but my sleep felt disjointed and patchy. I didn't think I fell asleep until around midnight and woke up not feeling rested at all. I followed my usual bedtime routine - read for 30(ish) minutes and then put on a sleep meditation which I usually fall asleep during but did not last night. I'm not sure if this is related to my latest cut on Sunday (now down to 1.82mg of Olanzapine), my last cut, or something else entirely.

 

I will see how my sleep goes over the next few days and determine if I should up-dose back to 1.93mg, hold at 1.82mg a little longer than my usual two week hold, or push through to my next drop.

[Altostrata]

8.5 hours of even patchy sleep is not bad for withdrawal. This should go away in a few days. I would not be anxious to updose.