Ninabird: Effexor withdrawal?

[Chlo]

24 minutes ago, benesh said:

Dear determined Nina,

Everyday is a day closer to freedom. I am sorry it has been such a challenge. I can sure relate.

In my quiet time, I was thinking about the word heal.

Heal= Hope in Him

           Encourage me an others

           Accept by His mercy and grace

           Lean on,  learn from, listen to the Lord who loves you.

someday soon we will be singing hallelujah at the top of our lungs.

lots of strong hugs and prayers.

            Benesh

Such encouraging words ✝️

[Ninabird]

@benesh 

How beautiful was your post. Thank you so much! I know God is with us. 
 

Yesterday I went from feeling heavy mental symptoms, headache, a little dizzy, pain in my brain and tingling. Then in an instant all of that sudsided and my anxiety shot up for the rest of the day to an 8. It would ebb and flow in intensity for a few hours but then around 1 it stayed at an 8 and at 5pm went to 9. Accepting the symptoms is not as impossible as it once was. I have great women in my life who give me great guidance on how to get through. Some days though, it’s really really hard to “float.” 
 

Hiw are you doing Benesh? 

[Ninabird]

15 hours ago, Chlo said:

15 hours ago, benesh said:

Such encouraging words ✝️

Indeed. 🥰 Hi sweet Chlo. 

[benesh]

@Ninabird

@Chlo

 I am learning new ways to deal with these neuro-emotions...which helps allot. it is the intense anxiety coupled with bizarre unwanted  thoughts/images..YUK!!  how can something invisible cause so much pain?

I was watching Angie Peacock interview someone about his wife's benzo withdrawal. Checked out the site, benzoreform, and found a resource page for patients.MBSR it is FREE and so far it has been a good resource...if interested I can send the link. Even though mindfulness can be a wee bit new age,it really is foundational to faith. Present moment = the great I AM.

Also great news, Mark Horowitz, and others have begun a good resource called OUTRO. He has written so much about ways to taper, he himself having struggled to come off.

I remain in a wave but have a better routine that lends itself to momentum and hope. Despair and crying jags are the ultimate challenge. I am determined, with His help, to find ways to respond more effectively. Walking while listening to Sarah Kroger, The Detour, and other outside activivtes help somewhat.

My typing is a bit ferblongent(mixed up) but hopefully you catch what I am saying.

We are not alone..a great crowd of witnesses are cheering us on.

I am also cheering you on. WE will get out of this wilderness. Promised land here we come.

love,Benesh

 

 

[Chlo]

5 hours ago, benesh said:

@Ninabird

@Chlo

 I am learning new ways to deal with these neuro-emotions...which helps allot. it is the intense anxiety coupled with bizarre unwanted  thoughts/images..YUK!!  how can something invisible cause so much pain?

I was watching Angie Peacock interview someone about his wife's benzo withdrawal. Checked out the site, benzoreform, and found a resource page for patients.MBSR it is FREE and so far it has been a good resource...if interested I can send the link. Even though mindfulness can be a wee bit new age,it really is foundational to faith. Present moment = the great I AM.

Also great news, Mark Horowitz, and others have begun a good resource called OUTRO. He has written so much about ways to taper, he himself having struggled to come off.

I remain in a wave but have a better routine that lends itself to momentum and hope. Despair and crying jags are the ultimate challenge. I am determined, with His help, to find ways to respond more effectively. Walking while listening to Sarah Kroger, The Detour, and other outside activivtes help somewhat.

My typing is a bit ferblongent(mixed up) but hopefully you catch what I am saying.

We are not alone..a great crowd of witnesses are cheering us on.

I am also cheering you on. WE will get out of this wilderness. Promised land here we come.

love,Benesh

 

 

@benesh blessings to you! 

I too have been listening to Dr. Horowitz and others on Medicating Normal Facebook page. It's somewhat comforting to know and hear physicians speak about themselves going through this hell like us in the lay community. 

I hate how they had to come about finding out though. But I'm sure you'd agree that it's probably the only way doctors can truly understand what this poison can do to our brains, mental, and physical well being. The neuro-emotions is the hardest thing to deal with. Honestly, if I could stop the constant worry of my children and grandchildren I think I could pretty much get through each day with less anxiety and weeping. I give it to God all day. Taking thoughts captive and replacing them, over and over and over. Trying to break the generational fear, which then leads to panic attacks. Would you kindly send me the link to MBSR, please. I'm interested in reading it. I will also check out the site benzoreform, Outro, and The Detour. 

Heading to my grandsons baseball game and getting some much needed vitamin D.

And yes!! JESUS COME! What a glorious day that will be when we see our promised land 🤗✝️

Big hugs! Love~Chlo

[benesh]

https://palousemindfulness.com

 Shalom dear @Chlo

It is a free program entitled 

mindfulness based stress reduction. Lots of research behind it.

Heading to slumber but wanted to respond sooner vs later. 
Let me know if you do it and we can encourage one another. 
Blessings to you.

Benesh

[Ninabird]

22 hours ago, benesh said:

am also cheering you on. WE will get out of this wilderness. Promised land here we come.

Thank you sweet Benesh. 

[Ninabird]

Magnesium question. 
I finally took the plunge and took my first magnesium glycinate 100mg last night. About how long will it take before I know wether or not it agrees w my body. If my body is ok with it, when can I add a morning dose? Thank you so much! 

I pray that we all have a gentle and blessed day. 
much love, 

Ninabird. 

[LotusRising]

From what I've seen, most people will react right away. If it were me, I would carry on with that dose for a few days to be sure, then add in more.

[Ninabird]

53 minutes ago, MedRN said:

From what I've seen, most people will react right away. If it were me, I would carry on with that dose for a few days to be sure, then add in more.

Thank you so much!! I really appreciate the response. 
I hope you are having a great day. ♥️🙏🏻❤️

Be well.

Ninabird

[Ninabird]

@MedRN

Good morning! I have a question. Not sure if you are able to answer. I took the Magnesium last night at 11pm and I feel very groggy this morning. Am I taking it too late? Is it pretty common to feel groggy in the morning? I didn’t feel that way yesterday. I did go to bed 2 hours later than I normally do but before I never felt groggy. 
 

Thank you so much! How are you today? ☀️

[LotusRising]

@Ninabird

 

Good morning! I'm great - my morning is off to a good start!

 

I have never heard of morning grogginess from taking magnesium. If anything, it should help you with more restful sleep. What type do you take and at what time?

 

I wonder if you aren't just groggy due to going to bed later than usual?

[Ninabird]

1 hour ago, MedRN said:

I have never heard of morning grogginess from taking magnesium. If anything, it should help you with more restful sleep. What type do you take and at what time?

I take 100mg of Magnecium glycinate. 
 

I think you are right. I’m sure it’s from going to bed too late. I’m overthinking this. 

[Ninabird]

@MedRN 

I took it last night pretty late. 11pm. 

[Ninabird]

FLOATING AND ACCEPTING. 

The more I work on it, the less painful this ordeal is. I’m not saying it’s easy by any means. When you start to “allow,” instead of “fight,” it does help. 
Last night I fell asleep on the couch. (If I fall asleep w the tv on & something jolts me awake, I get this huge rush of anxiety.) Well, it happened again last night. I got up from the couch and said out loud, “one day I’ll wake without a jolt and you, anxiety, will be nothing but a memory, bit@+!!!!” And then went to bed. 
Goodnight to all of you who are in the trenches. We will ALL recover. 
Be well. Be kind. 
ninabird

[LotusRising]

@Ninabird how are you making out with the mag glycinate?

[Ninabird]

1 hour ago, MedRN said:

 how are you making out with the mag glycinate?

I think I’m doing ok. I’m taking half of 100mg in the morning. After an another week or so, I’ll take the full 100mg. Thank you for asking. 
 

I’ve had a few days of feeling really strange, mentally. Like I have anxiety but underneath in my head I have this sadness and odd heavy emotional feeling. I dropped my dose by .001 on Saturday. I can’t imagine that’s what it is? I feel like crying right now. 
 

I have been blessed with over a week of easier days. I could be going into a wave? Hard to say. 
 

How are you doing?
 

[LotusRising]

@Ninabird 

 

It could certainly be related to the reduction, but it could also just be this whole process couldn't it? I know I felt deep, overwhelming sadness many times during my taper and a general sense of disconnect from people around me, even the ones I care about deeply. I just tried to give myself grace, understanding that it would pass and the feelings of love would return. 

 

I'm doing well   I'm just shy of 2 weeks from stepping off clonazepam, so I'm feeling relieved to not be reliant on daily dosing. Thank you for asking!

[Shep]

17 hours ago, Ninabird said:

I think I’m doing ok. I’m taking half of 100mg in the morning. After an another week or so, I’ll take the full 100mg. Thank you for asking. 
 

I’ve had a few days of feeling really strange, mentally. Like I have anxiety but underneath in my head I have this sadness and odd heavy emotional feeling. I dropped my dose by .001 on Saturday. I can’t imagine that’s what it is? I feel like crying right now. 
 

 

Nina, are you making changes to both the magnesium and the Lexapro? Please be careful not to do too much at one time. Please see:

 

The rule of 3KIS: Keep it simple. Keep it slow. Keep it stable.

 

I would give yourself a couple of weeks before changes. This allows you to see how each change is affecting you. Also, it's good to note any external stressors or changes that may be involved in causing symptoms. As MedRn wisely notes, "it could just be this whole process." 

 

Please update your signature, as I see you haven't made any updates since January. 

 

Account Settings – Create or Edit a signature

[Ninabird]

3 hours ago, Shep said:

Nina, are you making changes to both the magnesium and the Lexapro? Please be careful not to do too much at one time. Please see:

Yes, I am. Should I stop the magnesium? I wanted to try the magnesium to see if it would help? I have noticed more negative mental symptoms since starting or could be coincidence? 
ill do whatever you suggest. Thank you for responding, Shep. I really appreciate it. 
 

[Ninabird]

3 hours ago, Shep said:

Please update your signature, as I see you haven't made any updates since January. 

I will. 😊

[Shep]

20 hours ago, Ninabird said:

Yes, I am. Should I stop the magnesium? I wanted to try the magnesium to see if it would help? I have noticed more negative mental symptoms since starting or could be coincidence? 
ill do whatever you suggest. Thank you for responding, Shep. I really appreciate it. 

 

Instead of removing the magnesium, you may want to simply hold for a few weeks without any changes to your drugs or your supplements. The more you come at this from a stable baseline, the better. And then when you do make your next change, only pick one item to change. 

[Ninabird]

5 hours ago, Shep said:

 

Instead of removing the magnesium, you may want to simply hold for a few weeks without any changes to your drugs or your supplements. The more you come at this from a stable baseline, the better. And then when you do make your next change, only pick one item to change. 

Shep, 

ughhhh…. I’m so sorry. I stopped the magnesium out of fear that it was causing additional problems. Is it ok if I just stick w what I’m on and just hold tight for a few weeks or should I restart the magnesium? 
From this day forward, I will not deviate from your suggestions. You have my word. My wish is to taper slowly without feeling like I’m being dragged through hell. Maybe it’s an unrealistic wish but it’s still my wish. 
 🌹nina

[Frogie]

@Ninabird

 

I would not start the magnesium up again since you stopped it. But give yourself a good 2-3 week hold on the Lexapro to make sure everything settles down.

 

[Ninabird]

9 minutes ago, Frogie said:

@Ninabird

 

I would not start the magnesium up again since you stopped it. But give yourself a good 2-3 week hold on the Lexapro to make sure everything settles down.

 

Thank you, Frogie. 
Do you think everything will settle down by then or is it impossible to tell?

[Frogie]

@Ninabird

 

It’s impossible to tell as everyone is different. Hopefully 2-3 weeks should give your system time to settle though.

[Ninabird]

5 hours ago, Frogie said:

@Ninabird

 

I would not start the magnesium up again since you stopped it. But give yourself a good 2-3 week hold on the Lexapro to make sure everything settles down.

 

Thank you, Frogie. 
Do you think everything will settle down by then or is it impossible to tell?

[Ninabird]

@Shep

Shep, I was told that you are the Benzo pro. 
Not sure if you are able to help but thought I’d try. 
I was on .25mg twice a day of Klonopin. I stayed on that for over a year 1/2 without and increase. A few months ago I was having a lot of anxiety in between my doses and the sensation was very different from my WD anxiety. So, I was added another .25mg in the afternoon. I’ve been on that dose now for 3 months? It has helped some. I understand it won’t take all of my WD away. That’s not my concern. My question is why after I added the moon dose do I still (4 or 5 days out of the week) have very strong WD-like symptoms starting at about 3pm? My evening dose time is 6:30pm. After I take my 6:30pm dose, the intensity calms down usually within 10 minutes ( placebo effect) my evenings are usually the best part of the day. 
Am I experiencing Torrance or interdose WD? 
or is this just good ole WD? 
I have the Klonopin and Cymbalta in my system. I understand if it’s impossible to answer the question. Thank you, Shep. 
 

BTW. Congratulations on being drug free!!!! 🥰
 

Nina 

[Ninabird]

1 hour ago, Ninabird said:

@Shep

Shep, I was told that you are the Benzo pro. 
Not sure if you are able to help but thought I’d try. 
I was on .25mg twice a day of Klonopin. I stayed on that for over a year 1/2 without and increase. A few months ago I was having a lot of anxiety in between my doses and the sensation was very different from my WD anxiety. So, I was added another .25mg in the afternoon. I’ve been on that dose now for 3 months? It has helped some. I understand it won’t take all of my WD away. That’s not my concern. My question is why after I added the moon dose do I still (4 or 5 days out of the week) have very strong WD-like symptoms starting at about 3pm? My evening dose time is 6:30pm. After I take my 6:30pm dose, the intensity calms down usually within 10 minutes ( placebo effect) my evenings are usually the best part of the day. 
Am I experiencing Torrance or interdose WD? 
or is this just good ole WD? 
I have the Klonopin and Cymbalta in my system. I understand if it’s impossible to answer the question. Thank you, Shep. 
 

BTW. Congratulations on being drug free!!!! 🥰
 

Nina 

Oh jeeze, forgive all of my typo's! Embarrassing.

[Shep]

12 hours ago, Ninabird said:

I was on .25mg twice a day of Klonopin. I stayed on that for over a year 1/2 without and increase. A few months ago I was having a lot of anxiety in between my doses and the sensation was very different from my WD anxiety. So, I was added another .25mg in the afternoon. I’ve been on that dose now for 3 months? It has helped some. I understand it won’t take all of my WD away. That’s not my concern. My question is why after I added the moon dose do I still (4 or 5 days out of the week) have very strong WD-like symptoms starting at about 3pm? My evening dose time is 6:30pm. After I take my 6:30pm dose, the intensity calms down usually within 10 minutes ( placebo effect) my evenings are usually the best part of the day. 
Am I experiencing Torrance or interdose WD? 
or is this just good ole WD? 
I have the Klonopin and Cymbalta in my system. I understand if it’s impossible to answer the question. Thank you, Shep. 
 

BTW. Congratulations on being drug free!!!! 🥰
 

Nina 

 

Please update your signature to reflect your drug history, not just the past few months. Here is what we need:

 

How to Summarize Your Drug History in Your Signature

 

It will help to have your complete drug history (including benzos) in your signature before give advice. 

 

Also, please list what time(s) of day you take your drugs and the dose. Also include any supplements you are taking.

[Ninabird]

4 hours ago, Shep said:

 

Please update your signature to reflect your drug history, not just the past few months. Here is what we need:

@Shep Done. 😊

[Shep]

On 5/3/2023 at 6:18 PM, Ninabird said:

I was on .25mg twice a day of Klonopin. I stayed on that for over a year 1/2 without and increase. A few months ago I was having a lot of anxiety in between my doses and the sensation was very different from my WD anxiety. So, I was added another .25mg in the afternoon.

 

When did you go from .25 mg twice a day to .25 three times a day? In your signature, you have "Klonopin .25mg 2 times a day" in May 2022. Did you add in the extra dose in January 2023 at the same time you have Estradiol listed? 

 

Just trying to see if the increase in anxiety was due to withdrawal or to the addition of Estradiol. 

Edited May 5, 2023 by Shep
added more

[Ninabird]

4 hours ago, Shep said:

 

Just trying to see if the increase in anxiety was due to withdrawal or to the addition of Estradiol. 

I’ve been taking Estradiol since 2019

the extra dose of Klonopin in the afternoon was added in January 2023

Could the extra anxiety be benzo tolerance? 

[Shep]

19 hours ago, Ninabird said:

I’ve been taking Estradiol since 2019

 

Please update your signature to reflect this (right now it states "1/23 - Present."

 

19 hours ago, Ninabird said:

the extra dose of Klonopin in the afternoon was added in January 2023

Could the extra anxiety be benzo tolerance? 

 

If you had the anxiety before adding in the extra benzo, than it's likely not tolerance. If it were tolerance, adding in the extra benzo would have decreased your symptoms. 

 

We don't recommend increasing a benzo use to get off an antidepressant. A slow taper is the best route off. 

 

Quote

2022 december Prozac fast taper, January Lexapro 10mg, Fast taper off Trazadone, April Lexapro upped to 25mg, May fast taper tp 10mg Lexapro over 6 weeks, Klonopin .25mg 2 times a day,

 

I grabbed this from your signature. This likely has more to do with the upticks in anxiety you've had since the first of the year. 

 

I would stop tapering and hold. That's a lot of changes and puts you at high risk for hypersensitivity and kindling.

 

Hypersensitivity and Kindling

 

Holding can help let your nervous system catch up to all of those changes. Continuing to increase the benzo will only lead to more problems. 

[Ninabird]

3 hours ago, Shep said:

Holding can help let your nervous system catch up to all of those changes. Continuing to increase the benzo will only lead to more problems. 

Thank you so much, Shep for responding. I appreciate it so much. In your opinion, how long should I hold? 
♥️Nina

[Ninabird]

4 hours ago, Shep said:

 

I would stop tapering and hold. That's a lot of changes and puts you at high risk for hypersensitivity and kindling.

Is hypersensitivity and kindling permanent? Will my system eventually calm down? Will I eventually be able to resume my tapering?