Thorin: withdrawal from Latuda

[Thorin]

@Altostrata you don’t think the anxiety is a result of my brain still attempting to acclimate to the rapid reduction in Lurasidone? I don’t know. That’s just what I thought it was previously 

[Thorin]

When did you feel substantially better?

 

For those of you that tapered did you feel better as you came off the meds or did you not start to heal and really feel better until after you took your last dose?

 

Edited November 24, 2022 by ChessieCat
added Intro topic title before merging with intro topic

[ChessieCat]

healing-while-still-on-meds

 

what-does-fully-healed-mean

 

on-healing-and-removing-blocks-to-recovery

 

where-are-all-the-success-stories-does-nobody-ever-heal

 

does-the-brain-heal

 

[Thorin]

Thank you. I can never find these threads. I appreciate your help.

[Thorin]

I think I feel more stressed after reading those threads. Gonna take a break for tonight I think

[ChessieCat]

9 hours ago, Thorin said:

Thank you. I can never find these threads. I appreciate your help.

 

I used an internet search engine and added site:survivingantidepressants.org to the search term.  I used heal as my search word.

 

The above method returned the topics in the search results.  I tried using the site search function by going to the Symptom and Self Care forum and searching for heal, using the two different options:  this forum and topics;  this way of searching brought up every mention of the word.

[Thorin]

Thanks. I’ve done this in the past but can’t always find what I’m looking for. Then you find it immediately 😬

[ChessieCat]

2 minutes ago, Thorin said:

Thanks. I’ve done this in the past but can’t always find what I’m looking for. Then you find it immediately 😬

 

I've had a lot of practice.

[Thorin]

So frustrated. I’m pretty sure from the way I feel today that I double dosed my Lurasidone last night. I did this a couple of months ago too. Going to buy one of those pill boxes with the days of the week on it. So frustrated!

[RachelSusan]

@Thorin I decided to come over to your page to answer you about Thanksgiving. It is my favorite holiday of the year because it is all about family but it doesn't involve any gift giving. The food is great but there tends to be way to much of it.  I know that no one forces us to eat it and I stopped overeating a long time ago, but people just tend to really go for it that particular holiday. Because it is about family, in a lot of cases it can be large groups of people. And yes, very noisy.

 

I highly recommend those pill boxes for days of the week. Too many times I missed my dose or just couldn't remember if I took it. The pill boxes always reminded me of something an old lady would have so I resisted.  After too many mishaps I finally gave in. Life is so much easier.

 

Wishing you the best on your taper.

[Thorin]

Hi @RachelSusan thanks for visiting. So thanksgiving sounds sort of like Christmas here but without the presents. I’m actually staying away from my extended family for Christmas this year but the withdrawals are only part of that decision (although a big part). Instead I’m going to sit at the beach with my partner and my two kids (who can bring friends if they want) and we’re just going to relax for a change. I’m looking forward to it this year whereas I usually don’t.

 

Thanks for the recommendation of the pill box. I picked one up today. I can see this is going to be an invaluable tool! Don’t know why I didn’t get one years ago 🤨.

 

best luck on your taper also and please, drop by any time 😊

[j1290]

I've double dosed and missed doses before.  Left me a wreck.   I do a bunch of ways to track doses now that I take pills 3/day, but probably the single easiest help has been photographing my dose everytime before I take it.  Makes it a cinch to double check I got the right dose/time/didn't forget it.  I was so stubborn, but turns out being really careful about my doses is a lot less trouble than I thought, and it's great to not have the worry.  

 

Hang in there, bro, you'll feel better in no time!

 

 

[Thorin]

@j1290that’s a good idea. I might try that. Thanks mate

[Thorin]

2 hours ago, j1290 said:

I've double dosed and missed doses before.  Left me a wreck

Yeah it’s messing me up this afternoon…..

[Thorin]

Coming off meds is what I imagine bipolar disorder must feel like. Windows and waves. Just add some OCD and panic disorder and you’re getting close. Plus ADHD for the emotional dysregulation and inability to think, focus or concentrate…… no wonder doctors want to put us on meds when they see us withdrawing!

[ChessieCat]

8 hours ago, Thorin said:

So frustrated. I’m pretty sure from the way I feel today that I double dosed my Lurasidone last night. I did this a couple of months ago too. Going to buy one of those pill boxes with the days of the week on it. So frustrated!

 

tips-to-remember-to-take-your-dose-reminder-ideas

 

[Thorin]

Thanks ChessieCat. You’re always there. I appreciate it. I bought a pill case. Should be fine now.

[Thorin]

So many of my long term symptoms have greatly reduced since I double dosed last night. This would confirm that those symptoms were definitely withdrawals is that correct? Just thing of the waves of anxiety I’ve been experiencing @Altostrata? What are your thoughts?

[Altostrata]

I don't know what those long-term symptoms are, Thorin, so I can't answer your question.

 

You posted this only 5 days ago:

 

On 11/20/2022 at 1:14 PM, Thorin said:

I have been substantially better since I posted this. To the point where I’ve started thinking about my next drop in dose. I have this planned for January I think. It seemed like I had to get through that depression and then everything improved. Not perfect, but probably the best it’s been since I started reducing the Lurasidone. Seems to me I’d unknowingly been dropping too fast and my brain’s only just catching up now.

 

[Thorin]

@Altostrata the long term symptoms are the anxiety that you commented on the other day. That’s the main one I’ve been reporting for a long time. Then there’s the moderate dizziness I get and I usually have a feeling of agitation (akathisia?). Yes I did post that the other day. I had a week where I felt good after a day of severe depression. These things seem to come in waves which I understand is normal for withdrawal? 
 

the other day you said the anxiety was likely due to a paradoxical reaction to my meds, or low tolerance to caffeine, or potentially I was allergic to something in my environment. I was asking what you thought about the fact that it greatly reduced when I double dosed my Lurasidone. I thought that would suggest that it was a withdrawal symptom from Lurasidone rather than the other potential causes.

 

I’m a bit confused by what’s happening and I’m trying to understand.

 

cheers

[Altostrata]

On 11/22/2022 at 8:07 PM, Altostrata said:

...

The anxiety is probably a paradoxical reaction from overuse of clonazepam or an interaction with lurisidone -- too many "brakes" -- or hypersensitivity to caffeine or something else in your environment.

 

Read this again. 

 

Yes, increasing lurasidone may well mask paradoxical reactions to benzos, plus make you dopey, etc. You had said you hate the effect of lurasidone, but if you feel you'd do better on a higher dose, please feel free to talk to your doctor about this.

[Thorin]

21 minutes ago, Altostrata said:

but if you feel you'd do better on a higher dose, please feel free to talk to your doctor about this.

I’m not sure why you said this? Seems unnecessary. I’m trying hard to come off the meds. I’m taking the advice provided on this forum. I was simply trying to understand the source of my symptoms. I was simply wondering if the lessening of symptoms after a double dose suggests they were withdrawal symptoms. I even said ‘I don’t know, I’m just trying to puzzle it out’ or something along those lines. I guess I was hoping that it was just withdrawals at that would resolve itself over time and would be easier than a paradoxical reaction to a medication I’m stuck on for the time being. I’m not sure what I seem to be doing wrong here as at times it feels like you’re quite annoyed at me, or at something I’m doing? I apologise if I’ve done something wrong. I’m going through a horrible time (not as horrible as some) and I want to get better. I’ve been on meds since I was 16 and I’m now 43. I’m absolutely terrified of coming off meds, but I’m doing it and have come a long way. I came here for help as I cannot do it on my own. I’m also terrified of the symptoms I’m experiencing and the fact that they’re unpredictable and change constantly. And to be honest they’re often too much. If I’ve done something to anger you then, again, I apologise but I’m not sure what I’ve done that’s been inappropriate. I also spend time on here trying to get to know other members and offer support when I feel up to it. 

[Thorin]

@Altostrata but I see you did previously say the anxiety could be a paradoxical effect. Apologies for forgetting that. My brain is not working very well and this whole thing is a whirlwind that rarely stops.

[ChessieCat]

I suggest you go back and read your topic from the beginning.  You might find it helpful to jot down notes as you got, adding the date/time for where there information came from so that you can find it again if you need it.

[Thorin]

Thanks ChessieCat.

[Thorin]

Thanks ChessieCat, I read back through my thread which was a good idea. I can see I have been given some good advice since I joined up here. I can see things improved after stopping dextroamphetamine and that not drinking at all makes a massive difference. I’m hoping the healthy activities/diet I’ve started since joining are making a difference too. The most recent thing I’ve started is drinking milk kefir (fermented milk) for gut health as I read on here how important gut health is for us.

[ChessieCat]

5 minutes ago, Thorin said:

I have been given some good advice since I joined up here.

 

It can be hard to take it all in because we can be overwhelmed.

 

 

I suggest that you start your own personal log book of improvements so you can look back on them when you have times when you don't feel as good.

 

6 minutes ago, Thorin said:

I can see things improved after stopping dextroamphetamine

 

That is good.

 

6 minutes ago, Thorin said:

not drinking at all makes a massive difference

 

This is also good.

 

6 minutes ago, Thorin said:

I’m hoping the healthy activities/diet I’ve started since joining are making a difference too.

 

Healthy activities and diet are worthwhile for everyone, regardless of their psychiatric drug use.

[Thorin]

4 minutes ago, ChessieCat said:

I suggest that you start your own personal log book of improvements so you can look back on them when you have times when you don't feel as good.

Thanks ChessieCat, I’ve been doing this actually. I haven’t looked back over it for a bit though.

 

I give each day a score and when I have enough days down I plan to create a graph so I can see the improvement.

[ChessieCat]

There are computer and printable MONTHLY symptoms checklists with ratings here.  They are using the daily Glenmullen symptom list.

[Thorin]

8 minutes ago, ChessieCat said:

There are computer and printable MONTHLY symptoms checklists with ratings here.  They are using the daily Glenmullen symptom list.

Thank you. I will have a look and track these down. I have been using a simple spread sheet which is not particularly clear to read. Appreciate your help.

[Thorin]

That looks better than what I have been using. I’ll start using that. Thanks

[Thorin]

Ok, this is just a wave. It will end. Going back on meds is a terrible idea. Such severe depression. Barely got out of bed yesterday although the depression seems to decrease a little around 3pm. Was going to stay off this website for a bit as I have been obsessing over it too much but need an outlet where I can say what I’m experiencing. Have been trying to take a break from reporting my med log/symptoms but may start again. I honestly don’t know how people keep up their strength when things get really bad. May have to take some time off work….. I think this is the worse wave I’ve had even though it’s mostly depression and not the more physical symptoms I was getting in the past. I hate hate hate the people that put me in this medication. They’re not even in my life anymore and they’re still ruining it.

[Thorin]

Ha I can’t post symptoms as I double dosed two days ago which will have thrown me off. I’ll wait

[Thorin]

Seems like the anxiety and fear is indeed a paradoxical effect of clonazepam or a reaction to maybe vitamin B. The anxiety hit about 2 hours after the clonazepam and about 30 mins after the vit b. Will try cutting out the vit b. Not sure what I can do about the clonazepam at the moment

[j1290]

Sounds like you're really having a day, bro! 

3 hours ago, Thorin said:

I honestly don’t know how people keep up their strength when things get really bad. May have to take some time off work…

 

I'd still go in to work despite feeling essentially non-functional and having heavy med side effects and get through as best I could.  Sometimes I'd take 1/8th of a Xanax if it came to that because it was all I had.  Now I have some migraine pills and blood pressure pills I take instead in case of emergency, in the smallest amounts I possibly can.  Haven't had to resort to the benzos in months, but it's nice to know I could if I absolutely had to.   

That said, yeah I screwed up a few relationships at work not even realizing it, due to diminished functioning.   When they had a meeting to discuss my future, that's when I knew I'd pushed my luck too far and went back to the last stable dose of meds that I'd been on.  

 

3 hours ago, Thorin said:

Going back on meds is a terrible idea.

 

On 11/25/2022 at 3:17 PM, Thorin said:

My brain is not working very well and this whole thing is a whirlwind that rarely stops.

Man, can I relate to this!  I was really irritated when a helpful poster suggested I consider going back to my last stable dose.  I'd spent a year trying to get stable on the instant release version of this drug, and they suggested I go back to where I started.  I wasn't about to backtrack!  Until they had the work meeting about me LOL  Then I remembered what that person had suggested and took their good advice and went back to the dose and time release that I'd been on for years.   My symptoms began lifting in a few days, and I was able to get enough functionality back to make the moves I needed to keep my job and figure out my plan to taper.   

 

On 11/25/2022 at 4:43 PM, Thorin said:

They are using the daily Glenmullen symptom list.

This is what I use.  Prior to that, I'd been using postit notes, which were inadequate.  I have a huge binder with tabs.  It's enormously helpful.

 

On 11/25/2022 at 2:55 PM, Thorin said:

I’m also terrified of the symptoms I’m experiencing and the fact that they’re unpredictable and change constantly.

I hear that!  As I said earlier, I spent a year trying to get stable on the Instant Release version of WB after decades on the Extended Release.   It was utterly baffling and disheartening and I despaired ever getting stable again.   When I started doing the daily WD checklist, I was able to figure out patterns and make decisions based on that data.   I read that it's incredibly difficult to remember exactly the symptoms of WD without recording them, and that has absolutely been my experience.   It has taken so much of the fear and confusion/anxiety out of this process, and let me make better decisions.   I spent the better part of that year legit terrified out of my mind, and I haven't felt that way other than a few brief moments for 4 months now.   It was really frustrating to get used to, but now I love it.   

4 hours ago, Thorin said:

They’re not even in my life anymore and they’re still ruining it.

I have a lot of opinions about the 'care' I've received, and I think they're justified.   Therapy has helped me a  lot and the EMDR we've discussed.   I still have opinions, but the intensity isn't there any more.  

 

4 hours ago, Thorin said:

Was going to stay off this website for a bit as I have been obsessing over it too much but need an outlet where I can say what I’m experiencing.

I hear that.  I talk to my therapist about the WD just to express it, but he can't offer any advice.  Truthfully I might be much further along in my taper if I'd discussed it more on this website and taken the advice offered me sooner, but I'm only human.  

 

Honestly all this stuff was very overwhelming to me when I started my taper in June of '21.   I just couldn't process all of it and there was too much information and too little at the same time.   Ultimately I had to do a ton of research and keep trying different things until I found a way that seems to work for now.   

 

TL;DR  You'll figure this puzzle out.  It might be frustrating and seem impossible at times, but eventually the pieces will start to come together and you'll connect different parts and before you know it you'll have the border figured out and be able to make a strategy. 

 

It won't be easy at all, but I have full confidence that if you stick with it, you'll figure out how to make this work.  Maybe even in a way that puts the taper in the background of your life rather than front and center!

[Thorin]

@j1290 thanks mate. Struggling badly today so will respond when feeling a bit better