littlebird: tried tapering Pristiq - will try tapering Wellbutrin instead

[StayHopeful]

@littlebird

 

Your Dad will come around... He's just beguiled by the Wellbutrin, just drop a few thoughtful placed comments and keep gently talking to him.

 

I sooooooooo get your bewilderment, shock and anger!! 

 

I was started at 50mg of Seroquel for insomnia, off label - my records clearly state for INSOMNIA - not major depression, schizophrenia, bipolar, or psychosis. What happened? Within 4 years I was up to 800mg a night. I tolerated it quickly, several months after an increase, my insomnia would come back. However, I was taking 40mgs of Lexapro at the same time, not even a mention that Lexapro causes insomnia (OR all the side effects I was having from Seroquel OR that the combination of both caused my cardiac arrythmias) ... Hindsight, right?

 

Pharma feelings are a huge sore spot for me, I can't even get started on that... nope, not for a second.

 

Keep going strong, all the best wishes in the world Littlebird!!

[littlebird]

On 5/20/2023 at 6:16 PM, StayHopeful said:

Pharma feelings are a huge sore spot for me, I can't even get started on that... nope, not for a second.

 

Yeah, if I tug that thread I end up breathing fire like an out of control dragon! 😅🐉 Now that I'm measuring these Seroquel every day while trying a taper of 2.5%, there's MUCH more than a 2.5% variation in weight every day... so I've been doing occasional tapers some day, then taking more the next with these discrepancies. Hm.

 

Before finding this site, I had a lot of trust that things were more exact! Wondering how often having a groggy morning followed by a depressed day is after I took one of the very heavily weighted ones. I'm gonna turn back into a dragon if I think about it too hard, but I'm wondering how to manage this. 

[StayHopeful]

@littlebird

 

Wow, that far off? That might explain some things...

When it comes to trust, there is so much that we don't know, you/we had no reason to question it before. What a rabbit hole!🤔😳                                                                                                                                                   

[littlebird]

On 5/23/2023 at 2:00 PM, StayHopeful said:

Wow, that far off? That might explain some things...

When it comes to trust, there is so much that we don't know, you/we had no reason to question it before. What a rabbit hole!🤔😳         

 

WILDLY inconsistent! As sensitive as I am when I do a 2.5% taper on something, it's really got me wondering how it has been affecting me! Tried a 5% taper last night and woke up much less groggy than usual. Good sign!

[littlebird]

On 5/23/2023 at 11:40 AM, littlebird said:

Now that I'm measuring these Seroquel every day, there's HUGE variation in weight every day

 

I'm feeling so much better now that I'm just measuring out Seroquel and am taking the same amount every night: no more mornings where I wake up feeling like a zombie, which I'm now guessing happened after a heavy-dosed pill. Since I've got some heavy health and life stress, just holding for awhile so my body can get used to a steady dose. So far so good! Sleeping fine, waking up feeling better.

[littlebird]

5 hours ago, littlebird said:

I'm feeling so much better now that I'm just measuring out Seroquel and am taking the same amount every night: no more mornings where I wake up feeling like a zombie, which I'm now guessing happened after a heavy-dosed pill.

 

Realized today that I've been having less intrusive SI since tapering this. Also feeling a bit more light-hearted than I was, and remembering scraps of my dreams more often as well.

 

Since Wellbutrin SR was dampening the side effects of other things, it's got me wondering how much of the increase in depression after switching to IR was an increase in Seroquel side effects. It would be lovely to have less depression/suicidality so I find myself looking forward to the next taper, which is a new experience!

[StayHopeful]

@littlebird

 

That's awesome littlebird!!

So glad that things are improving. Now that you've noticed the inconsistency, you can taper more accurately and thus will hopefully really go a long way towards dampening symptoms and healing. That really is great! 

 

Keep hanging in there.😊

[littlebird]

Thank you! Doing my best to be like your name and @StayHopeful - thank you for stopping by and encouraging! How's your day going?

[StayHopeful]

 

Thanks for asking @littlebird,

 

I've had a decent day, still having a little aftereffects from my recent short wave but doing well. 😊

[littlebird]

Wow, wish I'd tapered Seroquel sooner. Feeling a lot more lively in the mornings and it feels like I'm sleeping better. I'm remembering dreams more, so maybe being less drugged means I'm in REM cycles more? Just guessing, like so much with meds.

 

A painful cyst (that prompted me to look into the connection with meds and cysts) has been shrinking too and isn't as painful, which could be a coincidence or could be related to less Seroquel in my system. I'm having so much less suicidal intrusive thinking too, which makes me want to taper faster... but I'm being a good kid and going slowly. 

 

Retroactively annoyed with my doctor who doubled the Serq dose from 50mg to 100mg and, instead of making the connection between my increased depression and the increased dose, added in Pristiq on top. Really hoping and praying that doctors learn more about the dangers of poly-drugging, and it becomes a last case scenario (as all psych meds should be tbh). 

[littlebird]

I miss doing gratitude lists!

- It's been sunny and lovely, starting to feel like summer

- Flowers blooming all over, which is great

- Planted some herbs, felt good to work the soil a bit

- Grateful for my dog and partner, I love our little family

- Been reaching out to friends a lot more since starting the tapering journey, has anyone else noticed an increase?

[littlebird]

A lot of this tapering is figuring out long-numb emotions. What's mine, what's a WD-related neuro-emotion, what's a side effect of still being on too many meds. Wish I had some sort of workbook: "So you're having feelings for the first time in a long time after being a numb lil bb, let's figure those out." I used to make that sort of stuff, maybe I could design my own? Maybe a flowchart that's interactive. Write the emotion, then a flow to "is it making you want to act" or "is it making you freeze." Hm. Interesting to think about!

[j1290]

1 hour ago, littlebird said:

Write the emotion, then a flow to "is it making you want to act" or "is it making you freeze." Hm. Interesting to think about!

This is very interesting!

[littlebird]

The less Serq in my system I have, the happier and motivated I feel. What a wack pill I got prescribed when I was already depressed! Feeling grateful the sun broke through the clouds, I got through some bureaucracy, and we have some soup to reheat for an easy supper. It was a hard day and I'm feeling emotionally drained, but a little walk and cuddle with the dog helped!

[littlebird]

On 6/7/2023 at 7:37 PM, littlebird said:

The less Serq in my system I have, the happier and motivated I feel.

Y'all, I want to do an art project and feel inspired/motivated to do so for the first time since before I started taking this. I've been such a numbed out zombie for years.

[j1290]

59 minutes ago, littlebird said:

Y'all, I want to do an art project and feel inspired/motivated to do so for the first time since before I started taking this. I've been such a numbed out zombie for years.

Sounds awesome.  Please tell us all about it when/if you feel like it.  And give your dog a pet for me. 😊

[littlebird]

21 minutes ago, j1290 said:

Sounds awesome.  Please tell us all about it when/if you feel like it. 

The one I want to do would require a lil supply buy, wouldn't cost too much but I'm wondering if I should find something else that I don't need to spend money on. Then again, if inspiration is striking, maybe I should just treat myself!

 

22 minutes ago, j1290 said:

give your dog a pet for me. 😊

She greatly appreciated it, and requested it be a belly rub (her personal fave)

[littlebird]

I'm on the hunt for a Covid Conscious group. Anyone know of one?

 

I would love to meet some more people who also give a ****. It's harder than I can say to be immunocompromised/still masking in a world that has decided repeated reinfection is fine.

 

At this point I can count on one hand the number of friends who still take precautions (and none of them live in my state).

 

Love,

 

Lonely LB

[littlebird]

Big brain fog day! Just gotta be patient. Had a few nightmare nights in a row, which is starting to take increasingly much of a toll each rough "trauma brain" morning. Hope whatever demons I'm fighting there give it a rest so I can get some!

[j1290]

24 minutes ago, littlebird said:

Big brain fog day! Just gotta be patient. Had a few nightmare nights in a row, which is starting to take increasingly much of a toll each rough "trauma brain" morning. Hope whatever demons I'm fighting there give it a rest so I can get some!

Variety is the spice of life!  If only WD were the *fun* kind of variety instead of nightmare fuel 🤷‍♂️🙃  For me, I think the nightmares are tied in to days of increased lability to some degree, one is the daytime version and the other the nighttime, more or less.  

 

It's unsettling for me, to be honest.  I think the physical side effects are easier to deal with.  

[littlebird]

4 hours ago, j1290 said:

For me, I think the nightmares are tied in to days of increased lability to some degree, one is the daytime version and the other the nighttime, more or less.

This makes so much sense...

[Carmie]

Hi @littlebird Just wanted to pop over and send you a hug🤗

 

I’m like you, I have to be so careful about catching any virus, even a common cold. I still social distance, get nearly everything online, only occasionally go into a shop if there’s hardly anyone in there and I can social distance. I also wear a mask indoors if I’m near people, like medical appointments. 
 

So many of my friends have or have had viruses recently as we are in winter now. My husband’s care home is in lockdown due to Covid cases too. 
 

Take care💛

[littlebird]

54 minutes ago, Carmie said:

Hi @littlebird Just wanted to pop over and send you a hug🤗

 

I’m like you, I have to be so careful about catching any virus, even a common cold. I still social distance, get nearly everything online, only occasionally go into a shop if there’s hardly anyone in there and I can social distance. I also wear a mask indoors if I’m near people, like medical appointments. 

 

Thank you, Carmie! It helps a lot to know I'm not alone in that! So glad you're taking precautions and being safe.

 

56 minutes ago, Carmie said:

My husband’s care home is in lockdown due to Covid cases too.

 

This sounds so lonesome, to not be able to have visitors! Hoping things get under control soon. 

 

Appreciate the hug and support, sending the same back! I hope your health has improved and you're feeling all right. I so enjoy your gratitude lists, thank you for sharing those! 

[littlebird]

If Seroquel makes you gain weight, and I'm tapering Seroquel... shouldn't I be losing weight? Why am I gaining?? 😱 Craving sugar like a mug, so that's probably why... really hard to resist comfort food. Seroquel can mess with blood sugar, so maybe that's part of it? Or just comfort-food-cravings as I have more emotions? So many unknowns. 

[littlebird]

Body is appreciating the Serq taper in a lot of ways, brain taking some time to catch up. I'm dead moody, but also there's a lot of life factors making things tough too. Hard to tell what is WD and what is just a particularly challenging bit of living I'm doing.

[littlebird]

I had a really frustrating intake with a therapist yesterday, who looked at the meds I'm on and announced that they should be working. Okay.

 

"All these meds you're on, you should be feeling better." She actually lectured me about it, and kept repeating that I shouldn't be this depressed on this many pills. Like.... what am I supposed to do with that information? Oh, my bad, let me tell the meds they should be working. Maybe if I concentrate real hard and cross my fingers and toes when taking each dose they'll help.

 

Gosh, it's almost like medication isn't a cure all?? 

 

She also lectured me to be honest with prescribers if something isn't working. LADY. Like I haven't been doing that. Every session. Not to mention taking clinical questionnaires (every session) that literally put my symptoms into numbers, and include the question "Do you think your psych meds are working?" To which I always answer no.

 

I was in such a mood by the end! I will not be seeing her again.

[Catina7]

3 minutes ago, littlebird said:

I had a really frustrating intake with a therapist yesterday, who looked at the meds I'm on and announced that they should be working. Okay.

 

"All these meds you're on, you should be feeling better." She actually lectured me about it, and kept repeating that I shouldn't be this depressed on this many pills. Like.... what am I supposed to do with that information? Oh, my bad, let me tell the meds they should be working. Maybe if I concentrate real hard and cross my fingers and toes when taking each dose they'll help.

 

Gosh, it's almost like medication isn't a cure all?? 

 

She also lectured me to be honest with prescribers if something isn't working. LADY. Like I haven't been doing that. Every session. Not to mention taking clinical questionnaires (every session) that literally put my symptoms into numbers, and include the question "Do you think your psych meds are working?" To which I always answer no.

 

I was in such a mood by the end! I will not be seeing her again.

 

I just happened to read your post.  You know it's time to get a new therapist when you have more insight than they do!  I hope you find someone who has more common sense than this numbskull.  

[littlebird]

2 minutes ago, Catina7 said:

I just happened to read your post.  You know it's time to get a new therapist when you have more insight than they do!  I hope you find someone who has more common sense than this numbskull.  

Real talk!! I kept wondering as she lectured for nearly five minutes, "Am I seriously the first person she's encountered who isn't totally cured by ADs? That can't be, or they wouldn't be reaching out about therapy, right?"

 

I thought about schooling her a lil bit, but honestly did not have the energy or gumption yesterday and just tried to get through it as quick as I could. Didn't seem like she'd be open to it anyways, and I wasn't trying to get anything problematic in my notes (she's through my insurance company, so all providers can see what she writes).

 

Staying polite/tractable was the move in the end, she called her supervisor and got me approved to get matched to a therapist 2 months sooner than it would have been if she hadn't asked on my behalf. Still, on the whole it was wildly frustrating and I'm still having grumbles remembering the 2 lectures.

 

Numbskull is the perfect term, thank you! I see why she was assigned to intake and not therapy, which unfortunately is also the case for the insurance company's crisis center. A therapist straight up told me once that people who fail as personal therapists get bounced to crisis. Wild! 

[Catina7]

2 minutes ago, littlebird said:

I wasn't trying to get anything problematic in my notes (she's through my insurance company, so all providers can see what she writes).

 

Staying polite/tractable was the move in the end

 

You're a smart cookie!  As Alto advises, you can't show any emotion or distress because then they'll think you're really looney.

[littlebird]

59 minutes ago, Catina7 said:

As Alto advises, you can't show any emotion or distress because then they'll think you're really looney.

 

For real! I didn't even get into the tapering... irrelevant to getting assigned to a therapist. Smile, nod, "Thank you," which is maybe why it's still bothering me today. I'd love to be upfront! Also I need to get care, so glad I went the way I did.

[Catina7]

32 minutes ago, littlebird said:

I'd love to be upfront!

 

Right!  It's a shame we have to play "the game."  We should be able to share things without fear!  It's supposed to be for our mental "health," right?  Ha!  

[FireflyFyte]

46 minutes ago, littlebird said:

For real! I didn't even get into the tapering... irrelevant to getting assigned to a therapist. Smile, nod, "Thank you," which is maybe why it's still bothering me today. I'd love to be upfront! Also I need to get care, so glad I went the way I did.

 

I am sorry to hear of your experience trying to access therapy, littlebird but it sounds like you navigated the situation well. Hopefully the therapist you end up with will be more understanding and actually helpful.

[Fifree]

4 hours ago, Catina7 said:

You know it's time to get a new therapist when you have more insight than they do! 

OMG I love this so much @Catina7 I have a challenging therapist sitch rn too. You've given me a good chuckle.

 

And @littlebird you 100% did the right thing to just play the game and score the win of an early appointment. One of my all-time favourite lines from a movie is Never hate your enemies. It affects your judgement (from The Godfather) Take the win LB and then you can have a good vent here.

 

 

[littlebird]

I've been trying to get match to a psychiatrist since I first joined this site, and have had 3 cancel/quit before our appointments. Just had a 4th cancel. There are "emergency med support" docs available on a hotline, but I have not enjoyed how often those doctors have told me most people go cold turkey psych meds just fine and this is all in my head. Cool. Cool cool cool.

 

For a company (Kaiser) whose main line of defense in mental health is prescribing meds, you'd think it would be easier to find a psychiatrist to talk to! Every time I call I have to listen to a pre-recorded message about no ADHD meds being available so if you're calling about that just hang up. Feels like things are falling apart all over in the psych med world!

[littlebird]

Trying to shift my grumbly mindset into an attitude of gratitude:

- I just got 2 perfectly sized WellyB fragments out of one pill. Squirreling those away in my on-the-go bag

- The sun has been so lovely!

- I recently planted a mini-garden in some abandoned space and it's rooting and flourishing

- My dog is truly adorable

- I'm making progress in finding a longer-term therapist

- I'm 100% going to get myself a treat after yet another therapy intake I have today (this time in person, which stinks, but is near places that sell chocolate for post-trauma treats)

- I've been enjoying the new Zelda game, and it's bribing my brain into taking rest breaks and lying down when I'm sleepy

[Catina7]

20 minutes ago, littlebird said:

attitude of gratitude

 

This is an awesome phrase!  I might have to steal it from ya lol!  But seriously, I'm glad you're taking time out to be grateful and thankful.  You're being your own therapist without even realizing it.