littlebird: tried tapering Pristiq - will try tapering Wellbutrin instead

[Go2zero]

16 minutes ago, littlebird said:

Talked to the psychiatrist about this, she recommended I go from 80 to 50 but that seemed a bit quick

 

That would be way too fast in my opinion. First of all you will need to find the name brand equivalent of your 80 mg in generics. I can't tell for sure but I do not expect the generic to be more than 10-15% less in strength (read mg's) than the name brand. So that would be 80 mg minus 10-15%. 

 

If I were you, I would not taper more than 10%, so to 72mg name brand. And see how that feels. If  that still blows your head of after several days, you could try 68mg. Try to find out where the name brand feels more or less equal to the level you were the last months. 

 

Then stabilise for a while (I expect that will not need to be longer than 2 weeks, but not sure to tell at this moment). If you report your findings here, we will guide you through. 

 

It is definitely a good thing that you are on a stable quality med now. In my personal experience this may make things easier and less bumpy.

[littlebird]

23 hours ago, Go2zero said:

It is definitely a good thing that you are on a stable quality med now. In my personal experience this may make things easier and less bumpy.

I've been thinking it might be a good idea to switch to brand name when I taper something... would be easier to be on lower doses of Wellbutrin if each dose was a steady amount and I'm not too sure how well-dispersed the meds are with the fillers in these fragments. 

[Go2zero]

21 minutes ago, littlebird said:

I've been thinking it might be a good idea to switch to brand name when I taper something... would be easier to be on lower doses of Wellbutrin if each dose was a steady amount and I'm not too sure how well-dispersed the meds are with the fillers in these fragments. 

 

I completely agree with you. If it is possible to get brand name meds, I would certainly go that route. 

[littlebird]

On 9/9/2023 at 11:14 AM, Go2zero said:

If I were you, I would not taper more than 10%, so to 72mg name brand. And see how that feels. If  that still blows your head of after several days, you could try 68mg. Try to find out where the name brand feels more or less equal to the level you were the last months. 

Seems like it might be a bit more than 10%, this is much stronger! Seems to work more quickly too, instead of a slow falling asleep it's a BOOM knockout so fast I haven't been able to plug in my phone before dropping off. Kinda reminds me of general anesthetic, how you're there one minute and out the next. 

[Go2zero]

1 hour ago, littlebird said:

Seems like it might be a bit more than 10%, this is much stronger! Seems to work more quickly too, instead of a slow falling asleep it's a BOOM knockout so fast I haven't been able to plug in my phone before dropping off. Kinda reminds me of general anesthetic, how you're there one minute and out the next. 

 

Are the generic you used before and the name drug both the same form? 

 

I mean are both Instant Release or Extended Release. Or is one different from the other in form?

[littlebird]

29 minutes ago, Go2zero said:

Are the generic you used before and the name drug both the same form? 

 

I mean are both Instant Release or Extended Release. Or is one different from the other in form?

Same form, not XR, just seems much stronger/faster-acting than the generic was.

[Go2zero]

13 minutes ago, littlebird said:

Same form, not XR, just seems much stronger/faster-acting than the generic was.

 

OK, just wanted to be sure about that.

 

As said before it is important to find the equivalent in strength of your name brand compared to the generic. I cannot imagine the difference n strength will be more than 15%. 

 

Although we can never tell with generics... Not everybody will agee on this. But I have seen and heard enough problems about generics (some of them...., most are OK or not too bad)...

 

Try to find the equivalent in a safe way. So if you are sure it is more than 10%, try a bit more. But do not overdo it. After you  have found the equivalent, you are in safe waters.... Then tapering in a consistent way, will become much easier than before with your generics that could be changed by the insurance.

[littlebird]

1 hour ago, Go2zero said:

Although we can never tell with generics... Not everybody will agee on this. But I have seen and heard enough problems about generics (some of them...., most are OK or not too bad)...

I'm wondering if this is hitting harder because I was effectively on a lower dose while taking the previous generic the last few weeks. Wish I had a stash of the generic I was on for so many years so I could use that as the baseline. Ah well! What an unexpected tapering adventure this generic put me on. Thank you for your help!

[littlebird]

New Tapering Goals in chronological order:

- find equivalent dosage of brand name Serq and stabilize that

- taper Serq down to 50mg (if possible) and ease life by not having to measure fragments right before bedtime (I keep forgetting to work ahead on that homework; unmedicated ADHD strikes again)

- lower Gabapentin, for both focus/depression issues and to prepare to

- lower Wellbutrin, with the goal of taking it to zero

 

Feels like this could take me many months, if not a year or more. Not even gonna math that out, not sure I want to think about it! One day at a time. 

[Go2zero]

8 hours ago, littlebird said:

Feels like this could take me many months, if not a year or more. Not even gonna math that out, not sure I want to think about it! One day at a time. 

 

Better not math it out. You can do of course to get an idea how long it may take. But it can be very frustrating as well, if things take more time. And strictly sticking to a plan can also be dangerous.

 

To follow reality is most often different. Best compass is listen to you body. Go slow and careful. When in doubt make a hold. Go with the flow instead of sticking to a plan. Acceptance of what is at the moment is also very helpful.

 

 

Edited September 11, 2023 by Go2zero

[FireflyFyte]

15 hours ago, littlebird said:

Feels like this could take me many months, if not a year or more. Not even gonna math that out, not sure I want to think about it! One day at a time. 

 I agree, wouldn't focus on the math. Instead, consider celebrating the milestones along the way.

[littlebird]

On 9/9/2023 at 11:14 AM, Go2zero said:

So that would be 80 mg minus 10-15%. 

Tried a 15% taper last night, slept through the night but woke up still pretty groggy. Wild how different the name brand feels!

 

I also feel more clarity, even while groggy, than I did on the generic. Might have to take Fifree's advice and look into the ingredients, wondering if there's some filler that I'm not tolerating well. 

 

If 15% still feels like more than the last generic I was on, wondering if I should bump that up a little bit (18% to pull a number out of my hat) so I can function for work. My responsibilities are increasing, so I need to get my focus as right as I can for this week. Got a deadline breathing down my neck and feeling groggy from the Serq is stressing me out as I try to focus.

[Go2zero]

2 minutes ago, littlebird said:

If 15% still feels like more than the last generic I was on, wondering if I should bump that up a little bit (18% to pull a number out of my hat) so I can function for work.

 

I understand what you mean. It is so hard to say what the difference with a generic could be. I guess the best you can do is try to cut a little bit more, until you start to feel more stable on it. But do it as careful as possible.... 

 

You also need to reckon that a change from one generic to another generic or to a name brand needs to settle in your body and nervous system. This can easily take 2 weeks. An extra reason to do this carefully.

[littlebird]

25 minutes ago, Go2zero said:

This can easily take 2 weeks. An extra reason to do this carefully.

Very true! So glad I found this site before this doctor, I would've taken her advice and gone straight down to 50mg if I didn't have all this tapering info in my back pocket.

[littlebird]

My Kaiser therapist said a lot of her clients are having new generic psych meds throw them for a loop. Wondering if it's supply chain, going for cheapest meds possible, or both? 

[Fifree]

9 minutes ago, littlebird said:

Wondering if it's supply chain, going for cheapest meds possible, or both

Maybe both. If the base ingredients are hard to get atm, manufacturers may be a stretching the allowable tolerances to the max so they can get as many pills as possible out of the active ingredients...

[littlebird]

3 hours ago, Fifree said:

manufacturers may be a stretching the allowable tolerances to the max so they can get as many pills as possible out of the active ingredients...

I was thinking about that! Bet you're right.

[littlebird]

💊 Grateful to be doing better with brand name Serq, it was getting a bit dicey on the weird generic and I was sliding downhill fast. Glad to have gained some footing again.

🌤️ So happy to have sunshine and warm weather! Makes a difference in mood for sure

🦌 Saw a deer recently while riding bikes down the coast. For a city kid, that's pretty cool and rare to see!

🌻 Was filling new therapist in on eating disorder history, and realized how far I've come in recovery. It might still be a real beast some days, but I'm doing so much better than I once was

🏖️ Got some beach time with my dog and partner this weekend 😎 Ooh I love the beach so much, would love to live within walking distance of one! Saw a seal real close to shore and it was very cute 🦭

👩‍⚕️ Working with a great mental health team! It's been such a wild ride to get to them, which has made me even more appreciative to have a psychiatrist and therapist who are so on point and consistently professional. 🎉

🦉 Procrastinated on work to right this list, but it put me in a better frame of mind and I'm a natural night owl anyway. It's gonna be just like the Uni days tonight, tea and late work! Another upside of needing to work late to be grateful for? Our chief engineer is on European time, aka just starting his day, and we have a chance to overlap on this project. Fingers crossed we can hash this out in time for a decent bedtime for me!

[littlebird]

OK, not sure if this should be on my thread or the symptoms subcategory, but I keep dropping things! All the time!!! I just dropped a full bottle of Gabapentin liquid (it bounced and it went everywhere, at least $5 lost). Dropped one of my favorite mugs, been dropping keys, stylus, med bottles, drinks. 

 

Anyone else had this happen?? Hoping it's a weird WD symptom (noticed it increasingly since doc had me drop Wellbutrin) and not a sign of degenerative disease (anxiety spiraling a little, cause this is weird). Reflexes also aren't as good, used to be able to catch things better. Also seems like my typing is slower, almost like I've lost some fine motor skills. Fingers feel clumsy and slow. 

[littlebird]

On 9/11/2023 at 10:39 AM, littlebird said:

Tried a 15% taper last night, slept through the night but woke up still pretty groggy. Wild how different the name brand feels!

Last night tried an 18% taper, got to go to bed earlier than expected and slept well but still woke up groggy (and pretty late tbh). Cognition is better than it was on the 10 or 15% taper, but still feeling like it's a "higher dose." Guessing taking that seemingly lower generic lowered my tolerance, in addition to the brand name being stronger (or more exact).

 

Still way too sedated, I think I need to bump it up slightly to 20% and see if that feels similar. If it feels like too little, will scoot back to 18%. Kinda reminds me of playing putt-putt and missing the hole over and over. Getting there! It's kinda late for caffeine, but I think I need some tea to keep going. This generic issue couldn't have come at a worse time for work! 😭 Rolling with the punches as best I can and figuring it out.

[littlebird]

24 minutes ago, littlebird said:

I keep dropping things! All the time!!!

24 minutes ago, littlebird said:

Reflexes also aren't as good, used to be able to catch things better. Also seems like my typing is slower, almost like I've lost some fine motor skills. Fingers feel clumsy and slow. 

Searched for "fine motor" on here, and found I'm far from alone with having my hands affected by WD! Grateful for this site and the information available to help us through this.

[Fifree]

24 minutes ago, littlebird said:

This generic issue couldn't have come at a worse time for work! 

Sorry to hear the generic adventure is interfering with work LB. I'd try and think about it as a free step in your taper. You're down 20% on your dose, just by switching brands. 

[j1290]

22 minutes ago, littlebird said:

Searched for "fine motor" on here, and found I'm far from alone with having my hands affected by WD! Grateful for this site and the information available to help us through this.

I feel like I've had times like this myself.   Kinda makes sense, if we're getting that strobing vision effect because the eye doesn't move right, why can't we have other fine motor skills problems?!  There's just so much weird stuff that happens with tapering.   I don't think it's your imagination, or anything to worry about.  

[littlebird]

21 minutes ago, Fifree said:

You're down 20% on your dose, just by switching brands. 

I've been thinking about that, also a great reason (in addition to being on more exact dosages per fragment) of switching to brand name when tapering! An unexpected cheat code?? Worth a weird week of adjustment!

 

7 minutes ago, j1290 said:

 I don't think it's your imagination, or anything to worry about.  

I keep telling myself that, like the other weird WD stuff, it'll ease. Big time dropsies in the meantime, though! 

[Go2zero]

7 hours ago, littlebird said:

Anyone else had this happen?? Hoping it's a weird WD symptom (noticed it increasingly since doc had me drop Wellbutrin) and not a sign of degenerative disease (anxiety spiraling a little, cause this is weird). Reflexes also aren't as good, used to be able to catch things better. Also seems like my typing is slower, almost like I've lost some fine motor skills. Fingers feel clumsy and slow. 

 

Also known by me. I have it now and then.  And after a while it goes again. Good that you already found it is a known and common symptom.

 

Ads yes, maybe you tapered 20% in one time just by switching brands. Just be careful until you feel stable enough on the name brand and the (to be found) right dose for now.

[littlebird]

9 hours ago, Go2zero said:

so known by me. I have it now and then.  And after a while it goes again.

Good to know it doesn't last long! It's a weird one.

 

9 hours ago, Go2zero said:

maybe you tapered 20% in one time just by switching brands. Just be careful until you feel stable enough on the name brand and the (to be found) right dose for now.

I have a strong feeling if I'd gone from the generic I took for years to the brand name it would be a much smaller cut, but being on that low-quality generic for a couple weeks lowered my tolerance real hard.

 

Been thinking about how the low quality generic and the seemingly higher dose of the brand name both had SI, but very different types. The longer I was on the generic, the more intrusive disturbing SI imagery I got throughout the day. The brand name made those intrusive thoughts die off, but the higher dose brought a severe depression that made me feel like there was no point in trying and I might as well just give up on life.

 

Happily, I seem to have found a workable sweet spot with last night's 20% taper. Fingers crossed this is it. Still a bit groggy and depressed, but not nearly as severely as I was when I was taking higher doses of brand name. Gonna hold here!

 

As depressed and unmotivated as I was on the brand name, it's really got me thinking that a lot of the issues I'd ascribed to "treatment resistant depression" or cPTSD might have been side effects of too much of an off label anti-psychotic. Live and learn. Grieving how much of my life has been devoured by meds, but that's part of this tapering journey too!

[littlebird]

2 hours ago, littlebird said:

Happily, I seem to have found a workable sweet spot

Celebrating having found a better level! Still not feeling back to normal (that'll probably take time, wary to adjust any further at the moment despite doc's urging to race to 50mg) but I'm so happy to be a little more clear-headed today than yesterday. Always nice to have a win in tapering.

 

Still quite foggy/groggy, but an improvement! Fingers crossed I can adjust quickly and the hold brings more clarity and focus. 

 

Motto of the day: It is what it is. Radical acceptance baybee!

[Go2zero]

15 hours ago, littlebird said:

Celebrating having found a better level! Still not feeling back to normal (that'll probably take time

 

So happy to hear that you are on the right track again. So what is your current dose now on the name brand? 

 

Could you please put the info also in your signature? 🙏

[littlebird]

Back in the "settle into a long hold" saddle, letting brain and body adjust. So far I'm sleeping great, even better than I was on a higher dose, so that's one tapering fear temporarily sorted. Foggy AF today, maybe I overdid it yesterday or stayed up too late? Or maybe just adjusting still to this new med? It might still be too high of a dose, but I'm not trying to make any more changes if I can help it.

 

Had another dropping things incident - this time holding my Gemini scale. It still functions, but the lid snapped off. I'm on my 2nd already, I'm rough on these things. Utilizing pockets more since dropping things often, gonna also try consciously holding on hard when it's something expensive and delicate like a scale. Hoping this evens out! Typing is easier than it's slightly easier than it was on the higher dose, I was clumsy and moving very slowly for awhile there on the name brand. Still not typing fast, but it's better.

[j1290]

2 hours ago, littlebird said:

I was clumsy and moving very slowly for awhile there on the name brand. Still not typing fast, but it's better.

I've had some of that come and go.  It's attention getting, for sure.  I don't like the head side effects, but its the visual and hand coordination and things that really give my anxiety a place to grow 😄😄😄  The good news is that stuff seems to leave as quick as it came, at least for me.  I hope it leaves soon for you too!!!!

[littlebird]

2 hours ago, j1290 said:

The good news is that stuff seems to leave as quick as it came, at least for me.  I hope it leaves soon for you too!!!!

Oh goooood! It was starting to get very WTF, but I did notice it rather suddenly. Poor lil CNS might be going through it. Concentrating was a herculean task today!

[Fifree]

6 hours ago, littlebird said:

Back in the "settle into a long hold" saddle, letting brain and body adjust.

Always a good plan when things get wobbly I’d say LB. Hope it all settles for you soon

[littlebird]

16 hours ago, Fifree said:

23 hours ago, littlebird said:

Back in the "settle into a long hold" saddle, letting brain and body adjust.

Always a good plan when things get wobbly I’d say LB. Hope it all settles for you soon

Maybe it's the increased irritability I've had lately, but internally holding is making me feel like a pacing tiger in a small cage. Don't get me wrong - I know I have to and it's fully the plan, there's just this restless annoyance at the only action I can take being inaction for the moment. I'm such a grumpy little bird today! Which I know is part of the process. 😎 

 

Your trip is coming up soon, yeah? Exciting!!

[littlebird]

Life feels a bit tough at the moment, but @Carmie inspired me to shift into an attitude of gratitude:

 

☀️ Just as I started on this list, the clouds opened and the sun came out for a moment! Lovely

💻 I'm so grateful for my work and my boss, the best boss I've ever had.

🐾 Getting our dog really improved our lives, so grateful every day! 

🍅 My partner's tomatoes are producing quite a bit, they've got some recipes in mind for them and I'm excited to see what happens!

🌈 Even though tapering has been rough lately, I've been thinking about how I felt back in the day when I was getting loaded up on all these meds and I do feel a lot more like myself and more in touch with myself and other people

🌱 Some plants I put in an abandoned area are thriving, nice to see them growing so big in between the concrete

🌻 Hummingbirds have been active, always nice to see one of my buds

🦝 Heard a rustling the other night when I was in the yard, and discovered a big ole raccoon harvesting lentils off my plants with those clever little hands. They're so cute (and scary)

[j1290]

1 hour ago, littlebird said:

I'm such a grumpy little bird today!

adorbs!🐥

[littlebird]

On 9/16/2023 at 3:50 PM, j1290 said:

On 9/16/2023 at 2:03 PM, littlebird said:

I'm such a grumpy little bird today!

adorbs!🐥

I had a shower and my hair is all fluffy so today I'm this grumpy birb