☼ Petunia: recovering from 13 years of antidepressant use

[Muddles]

My gosh Petu - I can relate to so much of what you feel. It took the words from my mouth.

 

It's difficult to explain to anyone, but you are not alone here. It's nasty and cruel, but somehow we get through the day. Hugs to you.

[bubble]

Was looking for your thread to let you know we are thinking about you and you are not alone...

 

big hug

[Petunia]

Thanks Bubble, I almost wrote an update yesterday.  But I'm really not up to it.  I'm confused, very confused.  I started researching MTHFR gene mutations and some huge light bulbs lit up. A lot of the health problems related to it are scattered around my family and I've had a lot of them.   I read heaps about it and got my head around the theories and ideas for treatment.

 

I started very slowly taking a low dose of the recommended folate and one day later I started to feel much better.  I actually had 3 amazing days, all my symptoms, apart from feeling very tired, just disappeared.  My mood lifted, all the anxiety symptoms just seemed to vanish.  There was no morning adrenaline/ cortisol, I didn't wake up at night.  It was almost too good to be true.  I wasn't particularly motivated and had very little physical energy, but I was calm and happy and after 3 days of this, started to believe that I was actually going to be ok.  But yesterday morning, I woke up back with the same old symptoms and more.

 

From all my research on MTHFR treatment, I knew this kind of bad reaction after a few days was possible, its got something to do with the methylation process starting up again and it causing a level of something to rise, I can't remember what it was, but its a kind of detoxification.  The recommended treatment, if this happens, was to take very small doses of niacin, every hour, until the reaction stops.  Which I did, and it worked.

 

The whole gene mutation subject is very complex and there's not much agreement among all the 'experts' yet, so I'm confused about what to do now.  I'm also concerned about how to get folic acid out of my diet, apparently, people with this mutation can't metabolize it and it causes problems, unfortunately about 15 years ago, this synthetic version started being added to lots of different foods and its hard to escape from.

 

In some ways, I wish I hadn't started learning about this.  But the fact that I had such an amazing response for 3 days makes me realize that there is something here. 

 

I dropped back down to a very low dose of the folate and have continued to take a small amount of niacin.  Last night I slept well and didn't wake up at all.  This morning I have some symptoms, so as I wrote above, I'm a bit confused now.  I can also see myself getting a bit paranoid about food, not knowing what to eat.  The more I learn and read, the more I'm starting to think that everything is bad for me in one way or another.... so this is adding stress.  I'm not able to obtain a lot of the recommended organic, chemical free, unprocessed, natural foods and products recommended, so its very frustrating.  If I was feeling better, I might be able to do better, so its catch 22.

 

Now I'm wondering, was this just a 3 day window, and the fact that I started taking the folate just a coincidence.  It can't be.  I took the first small dose Thursday afternoon.  I started to feel very relaxed a few hours later.  I slept through the whole night and woke with no symptoms......this is just so confusing.

 

Looks like I wrote an update after all.

 

edit:  Taking folate and feeling badly - link  http://mthfr.net/taking-folate-and-feeling-badly-methylation-requires-balance/2011/11/15/

Edited April 22, 2014 by Petu
added link

[Narcissus]

 

 

Now I'm wondering, was this just a 3 day window, and the fact that I started taking the folate just a coincidence.  It can't be.  I took the first small dose Thursday afternoon.  I started to feel very relaxed a few hours later.  I slept through the whole night and woke with no symptoms......this is just so confusing.

 

This is always a possibility with these things.  I've come to think that the associations I make between causes and symptoms are not very reliable during withdrawal.  Of course the best way to be sure is to repeat whatever it is and see if the reaction is the same.

 

I hope that you're learning valuable things with your research and not just stressing yourself out!

[alex]

 

Now I'm wondering, was this just a 3 day window, and the fact that I started taking the folate just a coincidence.  It can't be.  I took the first small dose Thursday afternoon.  I started to feel very relaxed a few hours later.  I slept through the whole night and woke with no symptoms......this is just so confusing.

 

 

OMG dear Petu!! of course you are having windows!

That is a very good sign;and frustrating as it can be, relapses are part of this darn condition, but we have to hang on and keep walking.

I am coming out from one of the most brutal, frightening setbacks in this process....I thought I was gonna die;but I didn't.

 

Patience, Petu, and lots of b***S....

 

3 days window...GOOD!!

[arwen]

 

Everything you write helps very much, Petu. On your topic, and on many others. My withdrawal experience was/is lighter, but I can relate to most of what you write. 

 

I thought that I am the only one fearing that what I eat is the culprit for my problems. I  eat pretty healthy, but I still blame my diet. I think this is one of the ANTS (autonomic negative thoughts), cognitive mistake, when you feel the need to blame something or somebody for the problems. Ah, I want to understand everything, to control everything that is happening to me. I always wanted, but now, in withdrawal, with all the weird symptoms, not knowing when it will be over, the need to control increased. If I can just let it go.

 

Negative thoughts, negative feelings. Come and go, and come again. If we can just observe them, and let them go. They cannot really hurt us, unless we give them the power to do it. Mindfulness. If I could really do that. Observe and let go. In the healing process, maybe we need to go through all kind of feelings. The brain is practising emotions. I think writing on this site, describing what happens to us is also healing. In order to write it, we need to detached from it a little, we observe, we are mindful. 

 

Let's not try so hard to do the right thing. We are in withdrawal, convalescence time, we don't HAVE TO do anything during this time (except going to work, taking care of kids, but this is routine and can give meaning to life). We don't even have to do the healing, because the brain heals by itself, in time. We can take it easy, find any help we can. We went through a lot. We deserve to relax, to live day by day without worries. What will be, will be.

 

Yeah, Facebook and positive thinking. Not my preferred things... Up to a point, positive thinking may help: "Fake it until you make it". Positive behaviour, the one that really helps to break the vicious circle of hurtful feelings and thoughts is very important. Going for a walk, doing some gardening, listen to music, talking to a friend, helping a stranger, and you can add whatever works for you, all of this is positive and helps

 

But our culture developed this "positive thinking" philosophy to an extreme. It is almost like you feel guilty because you have negative thoughts. But they are natural, they are part of life. They serve us well (up to a point). The pessimists live longer and have a better life than the optimists. Because they (we) are more cautious. We are prepared. Our expectations are more realistic. We don't get disappointed so often. The problem appears when the negativity becomes an obsession, when it stops protecting us and becomes a problem in itself. If we can just stop the vicious circle of worries...   

[EternalOptimist]

Petu, what wonderful news in spite of the return to symptoms etc.  Reminder for us all.

Congrats for having this respite, short but sweet.
I did reply to you on my thread.

Hugs

EO

[Meimeiquest]

Hi Petu, I wonder if nutrition isn't a much bigger thing than we dreamed.

 

I've read studies show eating lots of regular produce far exceeds the risks from the chemicals in it. (I hope since we can't afford organic either). You can google organic dirty dozen for the worst offenders. A ten-minute soak In a sink of water with a cup of vinegar is said to help...who knows.

 

Folic acid is in enriched flours, so most commercial baked goods and normal flour, as well as labeled vitamins and supplements.

 

I am hoping to read Nutrient Power by Walsh when it comes out digitally next month. It is about orthomolecular treatment.

 

If nothing else, we are learning "1000 ways not to make a light bulb." In the US, Edison is said to have said that BEFORE he changed the world (for better or worse) by inventing the light bulb.

[Petunia]

 I wonder if nutrition isn't a much bigger thing than we dreamed......

 

 

 

.......I am hoping to read Nutrient Power by Walsh when it comes out digitally next month. It is about orthomolecular treatment.

 

 

 

Over the last week or so, I've started to wonder the same thing.  I've been researching gene mutations and how they can effect nutrient metabolism, its SO complicated, but I'm certain that I have some underlying issues here.  I think I may have Pyroluria, I tested high for copper a few years ago, I was looking for high mercury, but was surprised to find my copper high, didn't think much about it at the time though.

 

Is that Walsh, Dr. Bill (William) Walsh of the Walsh Research Institute?  I was watching some of his youtube videos yesterday.

 

I've started experimenting with very low doses of some of the individual B group vitamins and zinc.  I've learned that just because I have an uncomfortable (bad) reaction to something, that's not necessarily a sign that I shouldn't be taking the supplement.  If my methylation cycle hasn't been working properly and I suddenly get it working better with nutrients, then all kinds of changes are going to occur and some of them might not feel so good at first.  I wasn't trying to detoxify anything and I think that starting on active folate and B12, and slowly increasing them may have caused a reaction so I have stopped them for now.

 

Instead, I have started on zinc and B6, very low doses to start.  These are the nutrients depleted by high copper and having Polyuria, already I can feel a lowering of my physical anxiety symptoms and my mood seems better.  But its all so complicated.  I didn't sleep well last night.  I just wasn't tired.  Not anxiety, but my head was full of everything I've been learning.  When I did dose off, I was quickly woken by a hot flash.  Usually they don't start until about 3am, but last night, they were happening all night.

 

I've been wanting to write on my thread for a few days, but haven't been able to get any words out.  I'm still struggling now.

 

Apart from the slightly renewed hope, because I'm taking this new, nutritional approach, I'm still struggling with major feelings of hopelessness, meaninglessness, loss and a fear that this is all there is going to be from now on.

 

The trauma of withdrawal is sitting heavily on top of the trauma, which in hindsight seems to have been running through my whole life and I feel trapped below the weight of all of it.  But even if I could throw off this heavy weight, when I try and look towards a future, there is nothing.

 

I just want some relief from these awful feelings, these sensations of being in constant, low level danger.  Its always been like this and looking back, most of what I have done, my whole life, has been, in one way or another, an attempt at getting some relief.  Just over a week ago, I had 3 days of relief..... I'm hanging onto the memory of those 3 days, but its fading.  For 3 days, everything was ok.  I was ok, even though I wasn't, the world was ok, even though it wasn't.

 

But now, the fear and the shame is back.  Why?  Because I can't seem to fix this..... I can't even put it into words properly now.  Tomorrow, my active versions of B6 and Zinc are going to arrive.  I'm feeling fairly hopeless again now, so I don't expect they are going to make much difference..... this is withdrawal wave talking I suppose, mixed with the morning cortisol. Actually, this morning isn't anywhere near as bad as mornings a year ago, but compared to the way I was feeling last night..... it doesn't make any sense.  This complete lack of control and understanding is mental torture.

 

Its like I'm being ripped apart by two opposite forces.  One side is acceptance and a kind of giving up hope that anything is going to be different and the promise of this is peace and contentment.  The other side is that of continuing to struggle and seek solutions, trying to do, in order to fix myself and my life.  While I'm struggling and seeking and trying, there is some hope, and that's like a drug, which I always seem to crash down from..... so I don't know.  I really don't know anything for certain, only that one day this body is going to die.  Up until now, I haven't done a very good job of living......wow!  I just noticed what I wrote, I must have an underlying belief that life is work.... a job, something which has to be worked at in order to get a reward after the hard work is done.

 

I'm feeling sick, nauseous, don't want to write any more, don't want to look at this, there must be some truth here I'm trying to avoid.....ok, I just got it.     going to do some deep breathing now.

[Petunia]

Copying this quote to my thread because I like it, thanks Edted

 

 

 Psychiatrists seem to me to be a bunch of monkeys trying to adjust a pocket watch with sledgehammers. ......Ed

[trouper]

Its like I'm being ripped apart by two opposite forces.  One side is acceptance and a kind of giving up hope that anything is going to be different and the promise of this is peace and contentment.  The other side is that of continuing to struggle and seek solutions, trying to do, in order to fix myself and my life.  While I'm struggling and seeking and trying, there is some hope, and that's like a drug, which I always seem to crash down from..... so I don't know.  I really don't know anything for certain, only that one day this body is going to die.  Up until now, I haven't done a very good job of living......wow!  I just noticed what I wrote, I must have an underlying belief that life is work.... a job, something which has to be worked at in order to get a reward after the hard work is done.

 

i've been feeling something like this for months now because of the horrible horrible wave i may finally be coming out of for now. day after day, month after month of this wet blanket over your mental state makes you believe this is the new you and how things are now. this week i'm finally getting a glimpse of my old self and this wet blanket is lifting (for now ). for months i felt i was just trudging through quicksand. you don't know its even there until it lifts and you realize its withdrawals. i'm hoping this is the case for you as well. it looks like we both had our last dose of meds around the same time.

[Nikki]

Hi Petu....haven't checked in for awhile.....as far a s supplements go I feel like Narcissus I never really know in WD.

 

Hugs

[Petunia]

Yesterday morning I felt so bad I was certain that I would never be able to leave the house again, my whole body was so tense with a feeling like I was about to explode, nothing would give me any relief.  My skin was burning in various places, my mind was racing with all kinds of ridiculous horror stories and I couldn't even remember what day it was.  I felt as bad as I ever have, and was so focused on trying to get through each moment, there was nothing left in me to worry about the future or even care.

 

But this morning was nowhere near as bad and now I'm about to go out in search of some organic..... well, organic anything really, some apples would be nice.  There is a store not to far which carries a small selection of organic produce, so I will see what I can find.

 

I'm still experimenting with various low doses of B group vitamins and zinc.  After a lot of reading, research and thinking back through my life, I think my underlying problems, which I've had all my life may be related to copper toxicity, or an inability to metabolize it properly.  Of course, 15 years of psyche drugging and the ongoing withdrawal issues have made life so much worse, but even before all that, something wasn't quite right.

 

I watched a few videos from the Mensah Medical website yesterday and I'm slowly starting to understand more about how nutrition works in our bodies in very individualized ways.

 

Another nasty wave seems to have come to an end.

 

[Jason]

Glad you had a good day today. I know what you mean about wondering if something had been wrong all along... Remember that the stress of withdrawal is enough to cause some of these things you're reading about to "flip on" too. Pyroluria, for example, can be caused by an ongoing illness that finally triggers enough stress to show actual symptoms. For whatever reason, I did not require this much hyper-supplementation until after withdrawal and living in that moldy environment. This isn't to say these problems weren't there on a much smaller scale while I was on psych drugs, but they were much less a problem. Of all the things we take, Petu, the most critical lack is from a balanced serotonin neural system. Nothing but time can correct that one. (No tryptophan and for goodness sakes no 5HTP, either!)

[Addax]

Petu-

I was VERY glad to read that the wave has come to an end. I was wondering how you were doing after your post on the 26th but I'm new and didn't want to pry.

 

I hope you'll post about what you learn about nutrition along the way. I'm curious about such things as well.

[Petunia]

 I was wondering how you were doing after your post on the 26th but I'm new and didn't want to pry.

 

 

Its ok Addax, I don't mind you prying

 

I've been holding off writing an update, hoping that I could write something really positive, but I can't.  I managed to get myself into a new routine with supplements, very low dose of the new ones, watching for adverse reactions.  In a very small way, there seems to have been a slight improvement in my moods in the afternoons.  But at the same time, I've had some extremely bad mornings lately.

 

Hot flashes through the night were increasing, along with increased sweating.  I had stopped my morning Black Cohosh, and started that again, last night I took 2 instead of 1.  I slept all the way through without waking until 4am.  Then I was suddenly wide awake, thoughts racing, body shaking, dread and fear surging through me (again).  Nothing new, its just that its been a while since its started at 4am, lately it starts about 7am.  I swallowed down a taurine and a magnesium, then tossed and turned, dealing with the alternating hot flashes and chills, praying that they would work.  In about an hour, I felt slightly more relaxed, enough to take the edge off the panic feeling.

 

By 7am the panic had turned to more of a feeling of shaky, cold hopelessness, complete with nausea and increased tinnitus.  I am living here by myself now, and when I'm feeling like this, it increases my sense of loneliness and desperation, but at the same time I'm glad I don't have the stress of having to think about anyone else, because when it gets like this, I need all my energy just to keep myself alive.  Having to get up and face my row of supplement bottles seemed like a cruel joke.  I ignored them and made some ginger tea instead.

 

I had a really good day on Thursday, from early in the day.  My mood was good, lots of brain energy, not so much physical energy, but that was ok.  But that was followed by a bad night and an even worse morning.  Friday morning was so bad I kind of went into survival mode again, thinking that I probably would never be able to leave the house again.... seriously, I was sure of it.

 

But about 2pm I suddenly found myself in the car, in the pouring rain, driving to a garden center to shop for mothers day gifts.  It was quite a stressful situation (for me).  The weather was bad, the traffic was worse, but I was ok.

 

Last Sunday I had a few hours of inspiration and energy and got out and bought some organic food, a few interesting new things to try and miraculously found some 'raw' milk.  Not just raw, but A2 from Jersey cows.  Its called bath milk here, or pet milk.  There is a picture of a cow in a bath tub on the label.

 

So its been just over a year now, since I've been completely off all pharmaceutical drugs.  I've been off Lexapro for 4 years, after having taken that and first Zoloft for about 13 years.  Approx 6 years on Zoloft, 1 year on Serzone then 6 years on Lex. A 2 month taper which was as bad as cold turkey, with what I understand now

 

I crashed in Nov 2011, so I've been going through this for 30 months.  That's a lot of cortisol mornings/days.  I think I've had 3 mornings in all this time that I've woken up feeling almost normal.  Two of those were in the last 3 months.  Every other morning has been like getting a renewed dose of trauma causing physical sensations which vary in intensity and duration, depending on the day, but there is nothing I can do to escape them.  Every morning I wake up into a reality where I'm being tortured by my own body.  I know that sounds dramatic, but its the truth.  Eventually, at some point in the day, it starts to reduce and usually, stops completely.  But by then I'm often exhausted and trying to deal with the general trauma and grief of what my life has become. 

 

When I get a few window type days, which for me means the mornings aren't so bad and end sooner, my mood lifts, and some hope comes back.  What am I hoping for?  I'm not really even sure any more.  I'm almost scared to hope for anything and find myself grateful for the few hours of peace which I usually get every evening.  Hoping for more becomes too painful in the end because it gets crushed every morning.  But I think what I would like is to just be the way I was before I ever took any of these drugs... but with the wisdom I have gained now.  Problem is, I can't imagine it, because even if all my symptoms suddenly stopped, right now, I don't know how long it would take before I could trust that it was really over.  I've lost control of my own life, but not in a way which makes much sense,  my body, physically works ok, well enough to do the things I want to do.  But there is an invisible awful energy, attacking me from the inside for most of the daylight hours and its wearing me down.  I don't want to give up, but most days it wins because its stronger than me.  I don't know what 'it' is.

 

My neighbor is cutting his grass again.  I wish he would stop.  But more than that, I wish it didn't bother me.  But even more than that, I wish I was the way I used to be, then I would be able to go and buy a lawnmower, figure out how to use it and get on and cut my own grass.  It used to really matter to me the way things looked, I got pleasure from making things look 'nice'.  But so much has changed now, this experience is making me see everything differently.  Being able to have a few moments of being alive and free from feeling awful is like the highest value to me now..... when I do find myself in this state of peace, it feels so valuable to me, I don't want to waste it by doing anything, there is nothing now which feels better than just being free from symptoms.

 

Anxiety has been my life long problem, not depression.  But now, I wouldn't even call it anxiety, I just think I'm sensitive with an active imagination, high ideals and a strong sense of justice.  But now I'm depressed.  Who wouldn't be in this situation? I'm also angry at the injustice of the whole situation with medicine and pharmaceuticals, the imbalance of power and my inability to fix anything, not even myself.

 

I'm going to end on a positive note, been trying to find something which has obviously improved and I found one....

 

I still don't shower as often as I used to, but now when I do, its relatively easy and stress free.  The dread and panic which used to be associated with the whole overwhelming process has subsided now. Its still not a pleasant experience, even soaking in the bath, which I used to love, hasn't become pleasant, but I can keep myself clean again without it adding stress.

 

Oh! and of course the walking, when I walk now, I'm not filled with dread and horror, like I was.  Its either neutral or a bit depressing with the very occasional few seconds of pleasure (rare)....and one more, its been quite a while since I've had an urge to run out of a grocery store because its become terrifying just being there.  Now, its just mostly unpleasant, tiring or neutral.  Driving now causes low level anxiety, rather than panic.  Two years ago whenever I drove anywhere I would be dripping with sweat the whole time...... so, there are a few obvious improvements.

[alex]

 

I'm going to end on a positive note, been trying to find something which has obviously improved and I found one....

 

I still don't shower as often as I used to, but now when I do, its relatively easy and stress free.  The dread and panic which used to be associated with the whole overwhelming process has subsided now. Its still not a pleasant experience, even soaking in the bath, which I used to love, hasn't become pleasant, but I can keep myself clean again without it adding stress.

 

Oh! and of course the walking, when I walk now, I'm not filled with dread and horror, like I was.  Its either neutral or a bit depressing with the very occasional few seconds of pleasure (rare)....and one more, its been quite a while since I've had an urge to run out of a grocery store because its become terrifying just being there.  Now, its just mostly unpleasant, tiring or neutral.  Driving now causes low level anxiety, rather than panic.  Two years ago whenever I drove anywhere I would be dripping with sweat the whole time...... so, there are a few obvious improvements.

 

 

Dear Petu, that is the way this s****t goes.....

Panic, high anxiety levels, start to SLOWLY fade away..it is an incredible feeling to notice that this is happening.

I remember posting in other site, 1 year+ ago, that I was able, struggling, to watch the Oscars...

Today I can watch anything on TV;most of it crap though.

You are on your way to healing Petu, I have no doubt in my mind, because when I read your posts, it's like reading my own process..I've been there.

 

Hang in there.

 

Hugs,A.

[Addax]

As long as you don't mind...

 

First, those days that bathing becomes overwhelming, have you ever used those shower caps that contain no rinse shampoo? You pop them on your head, rub your head and hair through the cap, and viola! I have a good friend who used to panic in showers or if she has to submerge her head in a bath who used to have them on hand.

 

Thank you for sharing Petu. I'm sorry your struggle is feeling so painful and exhausting right now. Those improvements you talk about are enormous! I hope you are able to keep them in the forefront of your mind as much as possible.

 

Your post hit a few cords with me... Hence this long post.

 

because when it gets like this, I need all my energy just to keep myself alive.

 

 Keep yourself alive?? You mean emotionally?

 

 

Every morning I wake up into a reality where I'm being tortured by my own body.  I know that sounds dramatic, but its the truth.

This doesn't sound dramatic... Or more accurately, it doesn't sound OVERLY dramatic. What is true is this horrible experience of withdrawal IS dramatic, and I don't think it's a mistake that drama and trauma rhyme.

 

 

But I think what I would like is to just be the way I was before I ever took any of these drugs... but with the wisdom I have gained now.  Problem is, I can't imagine it, because even if all my symptoms suddenly stopped, right now, I don't know how long it would take before I could trust that it was really over.

 

This rings very true for me too. Except I've been on Prozac for so long, I'm not even sure I'd recognize if I were to end up the way I was before. I've been on this drug longer than I've been without it. I'm also wary of trusting "windows" and alleviation of symptoms, as you read in my post the other day

 

 

But there is an invisible awful energy, attacking me from the inside for most of the daylight hours and its wearing me down.  I don't want to give up, but most days it wins because its stronger than me.  I don't know what 'it' is.

 

If the invisible energy is the one I'm familiar with, it's one of the things that scares me most. What does "giving up" mean? Reinstating meds?

 

 

My neighbor is cutting his grass again.  I wish he would stop.  But more than that, I wish it didn't bother me.  But even more than that, I wish I was the way I used to be, then I would be able to go and buy a lawnmower, figure out how to use it and get on and cut my own grass.

  

Funny how something that most people see as a chore and procrastinate doing is something you want to do. If I lived in Australia, and had a lawn, I'd call you that moment you figured out how to use that lawn mower

 

 

... I just think I'm sensitive with an active imagination, high ideals and a strong sense of justice.

  

I too have an active imagination, and while sometimes people think it's wonderful, it can also be a curse of sorts. My own sense of justice, occasional idealism, combined with my imagination can cause me significant pain sometime.

 

 

But now I'm depressed.  Who wouldn't be in this situation? I'm also angry at the injustice of the whole situation with medicine and pharmaceuticals, the imbalance of power and my inability to fix anything, not even myself.

I'm so familiar with that anger. SO familiar. I avoid talking about it, and big pharm with others because I know how angry it makes me and how it sends me on a talking tangent that so few people can appreciate. I'm going to refrain here as well...

 

 

I just wanted list a couple of your quotes because they will provide hope to everyone who reads them.

 

But about 2pm I suddenly found myself in the car, in the pouring rain, driving to a garden center to shop for mothers day gifts.  It was quite a stressful situation (for me).  The weather was bad, the traffic was worse, but I was ok.

 

I still don't shower as often as I used to, but now when I do, its relatively easy and stress free.  The dread and panic which used to be associated with the whole overwhelming process has subsided now.  

 

Oh! and of course the walking, when I walk now, I'm not filled with dread and horror, like I was.

 

 

...its been quite a while since I've had an urge to run out of a grocery store because its become terrifying just being there. 

 

Driving now causes low level anxiety, rather than panic.  Two years ago whenever I drove anywhere I would be dripping with sweat the whole time...... so, there are a few obvious improvements.

[Petunia]

Thank you Alex, not feeling quite so bad today, I'm also glad you are out of your wave.
 
 

 

But there is an invisible awful energy, attacking me from the inside for most of the daylight hours and its wearing me down.  I don't want to give up, but most days it wins because its stronger than me.  I don't know what 'it' is.

 
If the invisible energy is the one I'm familiar with, it's one of the things that scares me most. What does "giving up" mean? Reinstating meds?

 

 
Reinstating meds is no longer an option for me, I tried early last year but reacted badly to trying Prozac and then when I tried to reinstate a low dose of Lexapro.  With both attempts I became significantly worse very quickly.  It was before I found this site.
 
Giving up, the way I wrote it, is more of a day to day experience for me.  Every morning I find myself in a new state of shock, faced with the discrepancy between how I actually am and the way I want to be (the way I was the previous night).
 
Actually, I'm struggling right now, not to give up.  Its almost 8am here now, been awake since 5.  I'm trying to not give up writing this post because its extremely difficult to make my brain work in the way I want it to, the way it will probably work later in the day.  I don't want to give up my expectations of myself of being able to get up, get dressed, eat breakfast and then start a 'normal' day at a normal time, like what seemed quite possible the night before.  But for some reason, every morning, my brain/body is operating differently and .... well, like right now, I don't want to give up trying to answer this, but I can't find the right words, I've got intense unpleasant emotions surging through me, vibrations, they are distracting me, there are the waves of heat and cold chills, also distracting, vision keeps going strange, there's the frustration and confusion.  Something is broken every morning and it slowly gets fixed as the day progresses.
 
I'm not even certain if giving up is a bad thing.  When I do stop pushing myself to do the things I've told myself I 'should' be able to do, I feel a lot better.  But when its something as simple as get up, make some toast and take my supplements, and I just can't seem to do it..... I feel pretty pathetic. No, I mean I think of myself as being pathetic, but I do actually feel better.  There seems to be a part of me which wont give up the illusion that there is some control to be had over this .... process.  That part doesn't want to give up because giving up in that way feels like dying, or like something is dying, which is scary.  Now I've got these waves of nausea to deal with, its like they are intentionally trying to stop me from writing....
 
Then there is the giving up on myself in general..... I often feel like I don't have any energy left to keep trying.  So much of my brain and body don't work properly for most of the day and no matter what I do, any progress I make in one particular day, seems to be completely lost again the next morning.
 

 
 

 

because when it gets like this, I need all my energy just to keep myself alive.

 
 Keep yourself alive?? You mean emotionally?

 

No, I mean keep myself alive by continuing to do the actual physical things to sustain life, like go out and buy healthy food to keep trying to help myself recover.  Like keep going for walks so my body doesn't completely deteriorate.  Like force myself to keep eating and drinking when I don't feel like it because I know my body needs it.  It seems like my natural instinct for life, my life force, my drive for continued existence has gone, and its taking all my energy to keep remembering and pushing myself to keep doing the things which sustain life.

 

It hasn't completely gone, it often comes back for a few hours for part of the day..... later, but because its gone for most of the day, and at times, stays gone all day, I don't trust it.  This is all just so frightening and unfamiliar.

 

Then there is the guilt because part of me just wants to let go and give up completely.  I don't even know what that would mean.  I can't imagine that I would just stop eating and drinking completely.  I think if I got thirsty enough I would get up and get something to drink.

 

I remind myself of a sick cat.  I remember having a sick pet cat once and the vet telling me to offer strong smelling food and to force it to eat because cats often lose their sense of smell and will to live... or something like that.

 

Anyway, I'm giving up now, I can't write the way I want to at the moment, just not working properly.  This took over an hour to write.....that's what I mean, my brain isn't working properly, its a constant struggle to do anything earlier in the day.

 

 

[Barbarannamated]

Petu,

 

You described giving up, losing the will to try - and to live - perfectly.

[Addax]

Petu-

 

For someone whose brain wasn't working properly you write so eloquently, and you do so while persevering through your difficult morning. It means a great deal to me that you took the time to write while feeling so much like not writing. I wish you didn't see yourself as pathetic, because from all I've read, your so absolutely not. I also wish you didn't feel guilt over having thoughts and feelings that to me seem like normal responses to our abnormal experiences. I mean abnormal in that these drugs we've taken for so many years have resulted in a situation and experience that is not typical or usual in anyway.

 

Our experience as a result of these meds is abnormal, the thoughts an feelings and reactions to our abnormal situation are perfectly normal. I hope that makes sense.

 

Please don't be so hard on yourself.

[mattinsmom]

Hi

 

I will admit to skimming, I am trying to catch up quickly. A couple of things popped out at me.

 

1st - please don't censor your writing. We all, or at least I, feel/have felt the experiences you so eloquently explain. Your words have helped me on more than one occasion to understand myself.

 

Next, I read "I feel like I should be able to fix this" (something like that) and I want to say "Fix what"? You are not broken. Parts of you are healing, some are taking awhile, others are raising a little hell on the way to being better, but you don't have to be broken to become better. You are not broken.

 

Lastly, I read a post along the lines of "I didn't think I was a bully until I listened to the things I say to myself". You are being very harsh and critical of yourself. No shame, no blame. You are where you are, it will get better. You are so much stronger than you give yourself credit for. Don't give up now, the rainbow is just a little further.  

[NewMe]

 

 I was wondering how you were doing after your post on the 26th but I'm new and didn't want to pry.

 

 

Its ok Addax, I don't mind you prying

 

I've been holding off writing an update, hoping that I could write something really positive, but I can't.  I managed to get myself into a new routine with supplements, very low dose of the new ones, watching for adverse reactions.  In a very small way, there seems to have been a slight improvement in my moods in the afternoons.  But at the same time, I've had some extremely bad mornings lately.

 

Hot flashes through the night were increasing, along with increased sweating.  I had stopped my morning Black Cohosh, and started that again, last night I took 2 instead of 1.  I slept all the way through without waking until 4am.  Then I was suddenly wide awake, thoughts racing, body shaking, dread and fear surging through me (again).  Nothing new, its just that its been a while since its started at 4am, lately it starts about 7am.  I swallowed down a taurine and a magnesium, then tossed and turned, dealing with the alternating hot flashes and chills, praying that they would work.  In about an hour, I felt slightly more relaxed, enough to take the edge off the panic feeling.

 

By 7am the panic had turned to more of a feeling of shaky, cold hopelessness, complete with nausea and increased tinnitus.  I am living here by myself now, and when I'm feeling like this, it increases my sense of loneliness and desperation, but at the same time I'm glad I don't have the stress of having to think about anyone else, because when it gets like this, I need all my energy just to keep myself alive.  Having to get up and face my row of supplement bottles seemed like a cruel joke.  I ignored them and made some ginger tea instead.

 

I had a really good day on Thursday, from early in the day.  My mood was good, lots of brain energy, not so much physical energy, but that was ok.  But that was followed by a bad night and an even worse morning.  Friday morning was so bad I kind of went into survival mode again, thinking that I probably would never be able to leave the house again.... seriously, I was sure of it.

 

But about 2pm I suddenly found myself in the car, in the pouring rain, driving to a garden center to shop for mothers day gifts.  It was quite a stressful situation (for me).  The weather was bad, the traffic was worse, but I was ok.

 

Last Sunday I had a few hours of inspiration and energy and got out and bought some organic food, a few interesting new things to try and miraculously found some 'raw' milk.  Not just raw, but A2 from Jersey cows.  Its called bath milk here, or pet milk.  There is a picture of a cow in a bath tub on the label.

 

So its been just over a year now, since I've been completely off all pharmaceutical drugs.  I've been off Lexapro for 4 years, after having taken that and first Zoloft for about 13 years.  Approx 6 years on Zoloft, 1 year on Serzone then 6 years on Lex. A 2 month taper which was as bad as cold turkey, with what I understand now

 

I crashed in Nov 2011, so I've been going through this for 30 months.  That's a lot of cortisol mornings/days.  I think I've had 3 mornings in all this time that I've woken up feeling almost normal.  Two of those were in the last 3 months.  Every other morning has been like getting a renewed dose of trauma causing physical sensations which vary in intensity and duration, depending on the day, but there is nothing I can do to escape them.  Every morning I wake up into a reality where I'm being tortured by my own body.  I know that sounds dramatic, but its the truth.  Eventually, at some point in the day, it starts to reduce and usually, stops completely.  But by then I'm often exhausted and trying to deal with the general trauma and grief of what my life has become. 

 

When I get a few window type days, which for me means the mornings aren't so bad and end sooner, my mood lifts, and some hope comes back.  What am I hoping for?  I'm not really even sure any more.  I'm almost scared to hope for anything and find myself grateful for the few hours of peace which I usually get every evening.  Hoping for more becomes too painful in the end because it gets crushed every morning.  But I think what I would like is to just be the way I was before I ever took any of these drugs... but with the wisdom I have gained now.  Problem is, I can't imagine it, because even if all my symptoms suddenly stopped, right now, I don't know how long it would take before I could trust that it was really over.  I've lost control of my own life, but not in a way which makes much sense,  my body, physically works ok, well enough to do the things I want to do.  But there is an invisible awful energy, attacking me from the inside for most of the daylight hours and its wearing me down.  I don't want to give up, but most days it wins because its stronger than me.  I don't know what 'it' is.

 

My neighbor is cutting his grass again.  I wish he would stop.  But more than that, I wish it didn't bother me.  But even more than that, I wish I was the way I used to be, then I would be able to go and buy a lawnmower, figure out how to use it and get on and cut my own grass.  It used to really matter to me the way things looked, I got pleasure from making things look 'nice'.  But so much has changed now, this experience is making me see everything differently.  Being able to have a few moments of being alive and free from feeling awful is like the highest value to me now..... when I do find myself in this state of peace, it feels so valuable to me, I don't want to waste it by doing anything, there is nothing now which feels better than just being free from symptoms.

 

Anxiety has been my life long problem, not depression.  But now, I wouldn't even call it anxiety, I just think I'm sensitive with an active imagination, high ideals and a strong sense of justice.  But now I'm depressed.  Who wouldn't be in this situation? I'm also angry at the injustice of the whole situation with medicine and pharmaceuticals, the imbalance of power and my inability to fix anything, not even myself.

 

I'm going to end on a positive note, been trying to find something which has obviously improved and I found one....

 

I still don't shower as often as I used to, but now when I do, its relatively easy and stress free.  The dread and panic which used to be associated with the whole overwhelming process has subsided now. Its still not a pleasant experience, even soaking in the bath, which I used to love, hasn't become pleasant, but I can keep myself clean again without it adding stress.

 

Oh! and of course the walking, when I walk now, I'm not filled with dread and horror, like I was.  Its either neutral or a bit depressing with the very occasional few seconds of pleasure (rare)....and one more, its been quite a while since I've had an urge to run out of a grocery store because its become terrifying just being there.  Now, its just mostly unpleasant, tiring or neutral.  Driving now causes low level anxiety, rather than panic.  Two years ago whenever I drove anywhere I would be dripping with sweat the whole time...... so, there are a few obvious improvements.

 

Petu

 

Two things I have found induce anxiety & panic for me: black cohosh and glucosamine. 

 

Black cohosh may lower BP - which may result in vasovagal reaction such as vasovagal syncope - in those instances it may trigger excitation in of the parasympathetic nervous system (fight/flight). 

 

Hang in there -

[Petunia]

I can't post on anyone else's thread at the moment, my thinking is too messed up, so I guess I will just post here for now until I'm feeling better.

 

You described giving up, losing the will to try - and to live - perfectly.

 

I believe you Barb, and I think this is just part of what makes this so difficult and frightening.  My subjective experience of myself is that I'm falling apart, completely and yet from the outside, I seem to be functioning perfectly.

 

Petu-

For someone whose brain wasn't working properly you write so eloquently, and you do so while persevering through your difficult morning. It means a great deal to me that you took the time to write while feeling so much like not writing. I wish you didn't see yourself as pathetic, because from all I've read, your so absolutely not. I also wish you didn't feel guilt ...........

Please don't be so hard on yourself.

 

Thank you Addax, ditto what I wrote above.  Perhaps this is just part of the way I'm experiencing this stage of withdrawal and its something I also need to accept and get used to, until it stops.  Feeling like I can't think clearly and write properly is really quite terrifying for me.  I don't know if its because its part of my identity or if its something I've relied on my whole life to stay centered and sane.  I've always been able to re-balance myself, or get grounded by writing and have been keeping journals since I was a teenager.

 

I also wish I didn't feel guilt, but there it is, along with a bunch of other unpleasant emotions which seem to keep coming up, if its not one, its another.  I guess they are neuro-emotions, nothing stops these feelings and when they are strong, nothing distracts me from them either.

 

Neuro-emotions are deceptive and manipulative, they come without being triggered by anything apart from internal, nervous system glitches.  But in our attempt to understand and get a sense of control, we look for anything in our environment to attach the emotion to, if there is nothing, then we look for a memory or bring up a patterned habit of thinking, its like an instant response.  The more foggy my brain is at the time, the more I'm inclined to do this without realizing it and so I seem to be automatically entrenching negative thought patterns because I can't remember fast enough that these are neuro-emotions.  Later in the day I can see how I have been doing this, but at the time, there is no control because the part of my brain which controls this executive function ..unfortunately is offline.  I can't remember what I need to remember at the time I need to remember it because my rememberer isn't working properly.  It seems almost amusing now, but that's because its late afternoon and my sense of humor came back.

 

I've been reading sample pages of various self help books on amazon, trying to fix my childhood wounds.  Not really, just looking for distractions, something compelling enough to keep my attention and get me through the hours until the 'good brain' takes over for the day.  I've given up actually ordering books for now, I have enough to stock a small library, so many attempts throughout the years of trying to fix some aspect of myself or my life.  There probably wasn't anything wrong with me from the start, unfortunately I got brainwashed from a young age to believe that I was the cause of everything which went wrong and if I just behaved better (properly), then my life would be fine.  Early programming runs deep..... which is most likely why I'm also hard on myself, its what feels normal for me.

 

Someone on this site has a profile picture of someone pushing a huge boulder up a hill, that's how I'm feeling at the moment, weighed down with what feels like endless withdrawal symptoms on top of an even bigger pile of childhood wounds, which are coming up and getting blended in with the physical stuff, making a lovely, thick gluey sludge which follows me, dragging me back as I try and move through my days.  Today has been more old stuff, less about withdrawal.  Probably triggered by visiting my parents on Sunday and something I had to do yesterday, which brought up old, painful memories.

 

1st - please don't censor your writing. We all, or at least I, feel/have felt the experiences you so eloquently explain. Your words have helped me on more than one occasion to understand myself.

 

 You are so much stronger than you give yourself credit for. Don't give up now, the rainbow is just a little further.  

 

Hi Amy, I hope when you have more time you will write a little about your adventure in Peru, I'm so looking forward to hearing about it.  I'm doing my best not to censor myself, its easier to write in the afternoon, (its now the evening here).

 

After what I did yesterday afternoon, I realize that I have a lot more strength than what it feels like.  But it doesn't change the fact that my experience, the way I'm actually feeling inside, no matter what I do or think is horrendous.  I'm not entirely certain that its strength, yesterday afternoon felt like I was dissociating.  Lots of DP/DR.  The strange thing was, how I felt after I got out of that place and had accomplished what I went there to do.  There was no sense of accomplishment or even relief, I was suddenly plunged into a pit of depression, as horrible as it was to be sitting in that place, waiting for 2 hours to be called, it was somehow better than being swallowed by the void which is the rest of my life.  I put off going home for a little while by stopping and getting some Chinese takeout for dinner, its been ages since I bought out, been trying to cook healthy at home.

 

I'm not going to give up, even though I feel completely without hope, for varying amounts of time almost every day.  Sometimes its just for a couple of hours in the morning, today it lasted for 8 hours.  When I'm right in the thick of this solid wall of meaningless awfulness, and its been dragging on for a few hours and I'm feeling like I can't take another second, sometimes a weird thought will pop up.  Like today it was that I suddenly remembered that my brain isn't working properly because I've been poisoning it with toxic chemicals for 15 years and now its all out of balance, probably hasn't got enough of the neurotransmitters it needs to work properly, I wondered if a cheese sandwich would help it make some dopamine. Not that any of this is that simple, its just that it took me half a day, after waking up to remember the reason why I wasn't feeling well.

 

Two things I have found induce anxiety & panic for me: black cohosh and glucosamine. 

 

Black cohosh may lower BP - which may result in vasovagal reaction such as vasovagal syncope - in those instances it may trigger excitation in of the parasympathetic nervous system (fight/flight). 

 

Hang in there -

 

 

I can understand how Black Cohosh might effect some people like that, thank you for mentioning it. 

 

I certainly don't need anything which increases anxiety.  But I've been taking it a while and also experimented a few times with not taking it just to be sure I wasn't getting an adverse effect.  For me, it reduces hot flashes/sweating and lets me sleep a bit better than what I do without it, no increase in anxiety that I can detect.

 

On the subject of supplements, I stopped taking B6, it was effecting my dreams, they were becoming too intense and I was remembering them, which in a 'normal' person might be an enjoyable or interesting thing, but I don't need the added stimulation.  This is actually a good example of how AD withdrawal complicates any other mode of treatment and why it needs to be given priority (I knew that    )

 

If I do actually have Pyroluria and need extra B6, then its just going to have to wait, I'm getting a small amount in the B complex (active version) anyway, I've been taking 1/6 of the recommended dose every morning.  Extra zinc....    I just realized what may be going on.  The extra zinc I've been taking to balance what I think is a problem with copper, may have caused a small copper detox and that's what's been making me feel so crazy these last few days.  I think I will leave that off for a while too.

 

Possible underlying nutritional imbalances are going to have to wait

[bubble]

Just have to say that what others wrote in those little bits you quoted perfectly expresses what I think and feel.

 

You aslo have this way of starting with writing about an issue and then ending offering yourself advice or finding a solution that I would also offered or indicated. So every tiem after reading what you wrote I can only say: Amen!

 

please don't censor as much as you can, you are the only person we know that can put into words what all of us feel but can't articulate. (Recurrent topic, for me as well, unlearn strategies of how to adapt and conform. Listen for the faint sounds of who you really are and when you hear them, stop the whole world to be that. Turn your guilt into celebration of your difference and, otherwise uncomfortable, uniquiness. Childhood trauma is healing as ). 

 

I also write and work through thick and thin (sometimes I'm just struggling trying to do so) but when I look at what I wrote in times I didn't quite know where I was, I'm surprised with the coherency of my writing. 

 

So is it extra zinc? No need to answer

 

big hug

[NewMe]

Hi Again Petu

 

Hope you wake up feeling better.

 

I understand about those hot flashes. Egads. Fun stuff.

 

b6 and b12 did not work in my favor. D3 seemed to improve things. Nutritional yeast caused manic like symptoms for me over time. 

 

I had a copper IUD which led to toxicity - I wish I had known more before contributing to creating a hostile environment within myself. Gee!

 

Zinc made me buggier than I already am - that aside I offer support of understanding for your struggle as of late. It is not easy is it? 

 

Xanax and Klonopin wd created the very worst of wd for me - I cannot even describe. I have to say it was above and beyond CT from paxil. But that is like comparing apples to oranges because comparative analysis does no favors when in the thick of it. I was struck by your symptoms seeming so similar to my wd from benzos. I am so sorry you are not feeling so hot. 

 

HUGS

 

 

Two things I have found induce anxiety & panic for me: black cohosh and glucosamine. 

 

Black cohosh may lower BP - which may result in vasovagal reaction such as vasovagal syncope - in those instances it may trigger excitation in of the parasympathetic nervous system (fight/flight). 

 

Hang in there -

 

 

I can understand how Black Cohosh might effect some people like that, thank you for mentioning it. 

 

I certainly don't need anything which increases anxiety.  But I've been taking it a while and also experimented a few times with not taking it just to be sure I wasn't getting an adverse effect.  For me, it reduces hot flashes/sweating and lets me sleep a bit better than what I do without it, no increase in anxiety that I can detect.

 

On the subject of supplements, I stopped taking B6, it was effecting my dreams, they were becoming too intense and I was remembering them, which in a 'normal' person might be an enjoyable or interesting thing, but I don't need the added stimulation.  This is actually a good example of how AD withdrawal complicates any other mode of treatment and why it needs to be given priority (I knew that    )

 

If I do actually have Pyroluria and need extra B6, then its just going to have to wait, I'm getting a small amount in the B complex (active version) anyway, I've been taking 1/6 of the recommended dose every morning.  Extra zinc....    I just realized what may be going on.  The extra zinc I've been taking to balance what I think is a problem with copper, may have caused a small copper detox and that's what's been making me feel so crazy these last few days.  I think I will leave that off for a while too.

 

Possible underlying nutritional imbalances are going to have to wait

[Petunia]

Posting a Rhi quote for my own reference.

 

You can't get off the drug (without major instability) faster than your brain can re-adapt itself to the absence of the drug. This involves changes in gene expression everywhere in the system (not a fast process), adjustment of populations of different receptors and cell types, et cetera. These are concrete processes and are not fast.

More to the point, they're also not very reliable and not very efficient. Healing a bone or an organ is one thing; we've had five billion years of evolution to get pretty good at that. Our brains have never before in evolution encountered anything like what these chemicals do to them. The kinds of changes in neurotransmitters that our brains know how to deal with are subtle--things like response to changes in day length, changes due to varying hormones in puberty and pregnancy and with aging, changes due to stressors in the environment, et cetera. We have never encountered ANYTHING like these extremely potent and precisely targeted chemical perturbations.

Our brains do their best to re-establish homeostasis when the drugs are introduced; this requires concrete changes in gene expression, cell populations, etc as above, which continue and change over time, because neuroplastic processes are happening in the brain all the time.

Reversing what the drugs do to them is just as complicated. It's no accident that (according to the Harm Reduction Guide by Will Hall) the single factor that best predicts the success of getting off psych meds is how long a person was on them to begin with. And that's just with a single med. Polydrugging takes the whole thing up to another level.

And when you've been on and off various meds, and on combinations of meds, there's really no telling what's happened, what kind of changes have taken place. Like Alto says (only she says it better)--our nervous systems are not infinitely pliable. Sooner or later something's gotta give.

Hence the need for caution when you start yanking stuff out and shoving stuff around. Ouch. It's your brain. You only get one.
 

 

[Rhiannon]

aw I'm so proud you like that! I'm glad you and Bubble have copies of a couple of my things, I don't keep track of the stuff I write so well. And sometimes I say it better than other times so I'm glad you have some of the better ones.

 

But before I got down here I was going to type a comment anyway because Petu your writing is so clear and complex and subtle already, and I believe you that you're not at your best (because you would know), I'm really looking forward to watching and hearing you as you get yourself back.

 

Hugs!

[bubble]

aw I'm so proud you like that! I'm glad you and Bubble have copies of a couple of my things, I don't keep track of the stuff I write so well. And sometimes I say it better than other times so I'm glad you have some of the better ones.

 

But before I got down here I was going to type a comment anyway because Petu your writing is so clear and complex and subtle already, and I believe you that you're not at your best (because you would know), I'm really looking forward to watching and hearing you as you get yourself back.

 

Hugs!

 

 

I'm not good at archiving but think it is very important to keep what you and Petu so beautifully put in various threads. I wish I had better skills at that or that somebody with such skills comes along to perform this important function

[mlrp]

Petu,

 

I am so new here but did want to add that I have gotten so very much -- insight, information, and inspiration -- out of reading your posts in various threads. I am grateful that you (are able to) post through the difficulties and second the thoughts of others that this is very much a testament to your inner strength.

 

Love and light to you.

[Addax]

I think you moderators should have an "all star" or "best of" thread that includes comments, like the one Petu just posted for her own reference. Either as a group thread or something like, "Petu's favorite posts". Maybe in the members only/off-topic section?

 

Some of the things you guys write, be it insights, explanations, descriptions... are truly great but I'm concerned they may get lost deep in member's thread. Speaking for myself, I know I've come upon quite a few accidentally while perusing someone else's thread. If I were not so inclined to be nosey I may not have had the opportunity to read them.

[Petunia]

I completely agree with all these recent comments.  I sometimes read things in various threads, realize the value of it to others, but never quite know how to save it for future reference.  I will suggest a new section or thread for this purpose.

[Petunia]

mlrp

 

thank you so much for your lovely comment, I'm happy that some of what I've written has been helpful to you.

[mlrp]

Petu,

 

Thank you for posting some symptom spreadsheet links to my intro thread. I'm just now investigating them, and they look very useful.

 

I, too, second the idea of a "best of" thread. Is there any way to tag individual posts, I wonder?

 

Wishing you a measure of peace this weekend.

[Petunia]

I don't really want to post an update on myself, I feel very disappointed in my 'progress' (lack of) and would rather pretend I didn't exist.  But maybe it will help in some way.

 

Yesterday I was getting very worried that I might never leave the house again.  The only reason I got dressed yesterday was to go and get the sale papers from the mail box.... they went straight into the recycle bin, there's nothing I want, even if it is cheaper this month than last month.  What I really mean is there's nothing I want that money can buy, I want my health back, my ability to be happy and enthusiastic about life, I want another chance to make better choices, but instead I feel constantly punished for all the bad ones I've made.

 

I've tried forgiving myself, telling myself that I have always done the best I could with what I knew at the time, and with very little support, but it doesn't seem to make any difference, I'm still suffering the consequences of all my bad decisions, including my health, which prevents me from doing more than I'm doing.

 

Thankfully, I managed to go out for a walk today, just a short one, it started by just sitting outside.  The weather here has been bad, cold and raining, so that has added to my resistance to going out.  If there was something I really wanted to do, I would never let bad weather stop me, but when every activity brings either no pleasure, or an increase of the stress response, then there is no incentive to do things apart from what is needed to survive.

 

A couple of nights ago I was looking at the meetup.com groups in my area, trying to find something which interests me.  It made me feel worse because the reality is, I'm just not up to going out and meeting new people, even if there was a suitable group close by, which there wasn't.  There is one maybe/possibilty, but when I thought about uploading a photo, joining the group and writing a bit about myself, I started sweating and shaking, feeling nauseous and realized that if I can't join a group online, how am I going to actually do it in person.  A few years ago, I was able to join groups and activities by myself.  I'm an introvert and have always had some social anxiety in new situations, but I've never let it stop me from doing things I've really wanted to do.  But now..... these symptoms are completely overwhelming.

 

Maybe I should be happy that I found a few groups which interested me, even if they were far away, part of me hasn't completely given up on life having meaning again.  But I felt very sad and discouraged to find a group with people I may actually fit in with, only to find that it was beyond my reach, too far away for me to manage at the moment.  Then I asked myself the question:  if this group was located just down the road from where I live, in walking distance even, would I go and check it out?  Now?  Right then, the answer was no, I was physically exhausted from a day of symptoms (akathisia etc)  If a meeting happened to coincide with one of my rare window days, I most likely would go.... well I would, if it were closer.... so I guess there is still hope for me to have a life after long term drugs and protracted withdrawal... when I recover.

 

I had a shower last night.  That was another little success I had been putting it off, knowing I needed to have a shower, but there just seemed no point and I didn't have the energy to even think about it.  Earlier on in my withdrawal process it was fear and dread that stopped me getting in the shower, but now its exhaustion and lack of motivation.  For most of my life, I have showered daily, sometimes more often......why?  Social convention, enjoyment, wanting to be pleasing to myself and others, comfort.  None of those reasons are really relevant at the moment so I've had to 'invent' a new withdrawal related reason, which may actually be true.  I need to wash off the toxins contained in the sweat before my body reabsorbs them.  The fact that I don't feel any better after having a shower doesn't help much though.  Its a relief that its no longer a terror filled activity.

 

I did something else unexpected last night, I started a blog.  It might remain an empty blog though.  This is how it happened:

 

I was reading my new favorite blog about agoraphobia and started to write a comment, but then realized I had a lot more to say than what was contained in the original post, I figured it was probably more appropriate to reblog the post in my own blog and then ramble on about my own stuff.  So I hit the reblog button, but it didn't work, because I didn't have my own blog.  I knew I didn't have my own blog, but I sort of expected the site would automatically give me the option of starting a blog and then  handling the process.  But it didn't.  I had to figure it out myself, which I did, but it was frustrating and annoying and nothing worked easily and I kept forgetting what I was learning because the learning part of my brain is broken so by the time I had made something resembling a functional blog, I was exhausted and discouraged and had lost all my creativity and enthusiasm for writing what I was going to.  I used to be good at that sort of stuff.

 

Since my daughter went to Japan, the days and weeks have been merging into each other, I often don't know what day it is or even if its a week day or a weekend.  I can't believe that she has been gone 2 months.  Pretty much nothing has changed in my life.  I thought that perhaps, being alone would inspire me to become more active and get out and do some things, but ......  you can't walk on a broken leg until its healed and you can't drive a damaged nervous system the way you used to, without causing more damage.

 

I have a new symptom, maybe I should post it in the symptoms section to see who else has it.  When I wake up through the night I hear a new sound along with the two ringing tones which always keep me company.  Its like a pulsing sound in a varied rhythm and I don't know if its in my own head or if its the base sound of music coming from a neighbors house, or some other low frequency noise coming from somewhere.  When I put ear plugs in, it changes the sound, but I can still hear/feel it.

 

I think I've complained enough for today

 

 

[Jemima]

Petu,

 

I noticed in your history that you're taking Black Cohosh twice a day, and I'm wondering if that might be adding to your apathy.  I keep a jar of the dried root handy for making tea when I can't sleep and it's very effective. The first time I used it I wasn't aware that no more than three cups a day were recommended and I had them one right after another during the day. I had to lay down on the sofa and couldn't get up for several hours. I'm not sure how 80 mg. in capsule form translates into cups of tea, but you might try not taking it for a few days, or try just one capsule at bedtime.

 

It's surprising how seemingly small things like this affect me post-withdrawal. I was always sensitive to drug side effects, but that sensitivity is now heightened several fold. For the past two days I had--real, not the flavored black tea--mint tea when I got up and realized yesterday afternoon that it was making me very groggy. I was also using 3 mg. sublingual Melatonin for sleep, but was having trouble getting up and being irritable the next day.  I cut back to 2 mg. last night and feel a lot better.  Amazing what big differences these small changes make now.

 

Just a suggestion.