BaccatePlayer: Immediate adverse reaction to sertraline

[mariamisery]

Thanks once again! You are such a big help. I will make a great effort to not lean into the symptoms.  I know it will be a challenge.  I admire your ability to be positive.  Yes, I too in fragile state. It is painful but I walk every day or get outside to get sunligjt. Try to get to gym but lately feels like whatever is going on in my body is making me feel weak and tired. Very difficult to process this as my body healing.  I think you will get through your journey quickly.  Will not be long. 

[BaccatePlayer]

24 minutes ago, mariamisery said:

Thanks once again! You are such a big help. I will make a great effort to not lean into the symptoms.  I know it will be a challenge.  I admire your ability to be positive.  Yes, I too in fragile state. It is painful but I walk every day or get outside to get sunligjt. Try to get to gym but lately feels like whatever is going on in my body is making me feel weak and tired. Very difficult to process this as my body healing.  I think you will get through your journey quickly.  Will not be long. 

I wish I could go to the gym, but this turned out to be very bad idea last time. Even walking now feels like a struggle with all these stability fireworks. Funny enough I was much more willing to engage in lifting, sex, even trying supplements, but last month I literally developed fear of any substances, even small arousal or situational running/carrying things. Even outside waves my body feels in such struggle that any acceleration or effort feels like adding stress to already unbearable symptoms. I was even wondering if it's normal to be this dysfuntional over 3 months in. Any conflict, worry, even fight scenes on TV or people mentioning diseases... like my body couldn't handle it without breaking down beyond my control. Sleeping through waves seems better idea. I hope it really is the last month of it and no new symptoms will appear. I never hallucinated before, but this is on Glenmullen's list, so I need to be vary. Also I wouldn't want to get injured or sick now because how would I even take meds. You're very kind Maria, I appreciate that! I wonder if people develop friendships here. Volunteerly supporting each other in such difficult times seems favourable circumstances despite everyone being in such pain.

[Kaylaq]

It’s the super reality of the moment that breaks me, that this is my life now, forever! Stuck in this place of despair and fear, the negativity of my thoughts are so overwhelming, physical symptoms intensify! 

[Kaylaq]

The best we can do is be here for each other, knowing that we are heard, and sending courage, strength and love to persevere this process each day or each moment! 💕💕🙏🙏💪💪 one step or one breath at a time!! 

[BaccatePlayer]

8 minutes ago, Kaylaq said:

It’s the super reality of the moment that breaks me, that this is my life now, forever! Stuck in this place of despair and fear, the negativity of my thoughts are so overwhelming, physical symptoms intensify! 

We all feel this, Kaylaq. Can you take a break for a while, just to take care of yourself? Maybe having someone who will keep you company? It feels like we need to fight and solve symptoms, but sometimes we're just in too much burden to do it ourselves.

[Kaylaq]

Thank you 🙏 I do have someone with me, but unfortunately they are burnt out, and overwhelmed trying to help! 😣

[Sonia009]

Hi guys, I know it sucks to feel like crap, I get that, but we have to be positive. We don't know how soon healing will happen but it will happen, maybe sooner than you think. There are better times ahead, we have to believe that.🙏😊

[BaccatePlayer]

Just now, Kaylaq said:

Thank you 🙏 I do have someone with me, but unfortunately they are burnt out, and overwhelmed trying to help! 😣

Yes, it happens. It's good that there are many of us here for each other, but if everything fails, remember you can always just lie down and even if you don't sleep, you can listen to relaxation podcast. Some moments are simply best to be skipped. Brain having lots to do, so I like to either close eyes or outright take a nap to deload it at least until mood improves. We're dealing with serious and lasting injures, so we need much regeneration.

[BaccatePlayer]

1 minute ago, Sonia009 said:

Hi guys, I know it sucks to feel like crap, I get that, but we have to be positive. We don't know how soon healing will happen but it will happen, maybe sooner than you think. There are better times ahead, we have to believe that.🙏😊

Yes, that's the spirit Sonia! Moods are temporary, but we have to know it always leads to recovery when we abstain from destabilizing ourselves even further. Maybe my today's self feels awful, but every bad time eventually ended sofar.

[Sonia009]

@BaccatePlayerWe will support one another to the best we can and we will get through this terrible phase.🙏😊

[mariamisery]

 Recently I have been unable to  watch  much on Tv because it is too overwhelming.  Don't know why I am now dealing with exhaustion more than before. I know you will say do not  pay attention to it because symptoms constantly change.  Good you are able to sleep. I sleep but only for  6 to 7.5 hours a night.  Wonder why your symptoms are not getting better? Does know yet if I will be able to get to gym this week. I hope you and Kaylaq get relief really soon!

[Kaylaq]

@mariamisery so glad you can get some decent hours of sleep 😴 that will really help with your recovery time!  I only get 4hrs, but body jumps into high cortisol mode after 4 hours! 
 

🙏🏻😊😊

[KaiLee]

@Kaylaq I really understand people around us trying to help getting overwhelmed over time.

I try so hard to explain what I'm going through, but it is so hard for 'normal' people to understand what this is. It's impossible, to be honest. I don't think this is a kind of thing a person can understand with just imagination.

I'm not even sure if I will remember what I've been through when this gets over... I've already forgotten so many things, and speaking of memory, I really don't remember anything at this moment! That part of my brain is still working hard to fix the problems.

I am sorry to hear that you're in waves again... And I really admire your courage and positivity.

[Kaylaq]

Yes, so much of our brain is rewriting its self, …. I too am losing so many memories,… 😥 

[KaiLee]

Sorry @Kaylaq, I have edited my post because it seemed weird after reading it again...

This happens. I see so many strange parts of 'me'. It's like my brain creates a hundred different realities for me in a hundred different days. Everything changes in the most unimaginable way. And then it disappears, and won't even let you remember what you've just been through. It's just too absurd...  

[mariamisery]

I do wake up several times during the night.  I hate this process.  They say we are healing but I don't really feel it. People on the outside are clueless to the pain we face. How do we somehow get through each day.,week, month. Hopefully not years. Holding onto the promises that we will come out on the other side.

[Kaylaq]

👍🏻🙏🏻 I have to hold onto hope and prayer that this will get better or else I will completely lose myself…. 🥰🥰

[mariamisery]

Does this recovery get worse before better?

[BaccatePlayer]

1 hour ago, Sonia009 said:

@BaccatePlayerWe will support one another to the best we can and we will get through this terrible phase.🙏😊

That's the best we can do!

1 hour ago, mariamisery said:

Recently I have been unable to  watch  much on Tv because it is too overwhelming.  Don't know why I am now dealing with exhaustion more than before. I know you will say do not  pay attention to it because symptoms constantly change.  Good you are able to sleep. I sleep but only for  6 to 7.5 hours a night.  Wonder why your symptoms are not getting better? Does know yet if I will be able to get to gym this week. I hope you and Kaylaq get relief really soon!

Because you are being exhausted by your recovery. People who go through chemotherapy or antibiotics are heavily taxed, need to rest and don't tolerate much stress either. We are living our lives and simultaneously our body tries to heal itself. It does make sense you are feeling tired because you're really going through hard work even if you stay in bed all day now. On top of that you are going to the gym, so your brain needs to stabilize neurotransmitters after it too. You may want to check if gym doesn't make your symptoms worse. It's honestly surprising to me that you are up for it especially since you mention breathing issues. Technically exercising should be healthy and supportive for recovery, but that's still stress and cortisol peaking which is not what CNS enjoys during withdrawal.

 

54 minutes ago, mariamisery said:

I do wake up several times during the night.  I hate this process.  They say we are healing but I don't really feel it. People on the outside are clueless to the pain we face. How do we somehow get through each day.,week, month. Hopefully not years. Holding onto the promises that we will come out on the other side.

That's because there are no pauses in our healing. Something is constantly messing with your mood, your thoughts and you can't feel the healing the same way you can't feel empty bladder until you finish. At least we have ourselves here. Hopefully not years as you said, but remember your case looks very promising based on your drug history. People went through different experiences here and you at least have the advantage that you know not to take any drugs and already are clear with your day-to-day med routine which is taking nothing. This may not save you from every upset, but if you take control over your reactions like panic and rumminations you could at least tell yourself that you are in the best possible circumstances and there's nothing that jeopardises your recovery time.

48 minutes ago, Kaylaq said:

👍🏻🙏🏻 I have to hold onto hope and prayer that this will get better or else I will completely lose myself…. 🥰🥰

Same. Way too many times I'd just snap under this burden, but it's really only a matter of going through it with hope or going through potentially worsened variant of it giving in to helplessness.

[mariamisery]

I plan on stopping going to gym for a bit and maybe just walk a little outside.  I went to gym with great difficulty! Right now the sensations in my body is awful and making me feel sick and emotionally unstable. Walking right now brings fast heartbeat. Wish I could sleep but can't.  I am doing best to not focus but failing.  I keep wishing that in the success stories people would have posted what they were feeling right up to  and before their victory. Need a section on how to survive this. Thanks for all the advice. I know we all healing but why does it have to feel like hell. 

[BaccatePlayer]

32 minutes ago, mariamisery said:

Does this recovery get worse before better?

That's not what people usually describe here. Waves are obviously "worse state before it gets better", but recovery is mostly described as feeling better and better each month until you forget and don't even notice when you reached such improvement that it's no longer felt. I had one friend who described end of his IAR as having terrible nausea even in the last week and suddenly recovering completely on day 90 (exactly 3 months), but it's generally believed here that your WDnormal drops gradually until it reaches 0 meaning it likely improves in paths like: wave, window, -10% of previous wave, +10% of previous window etc. Your body may surprise you multiple times, you may feel you are suddenly fully recovered at some points, but really just as it is hard to predict your symptoms or duration, there's not much you can do to predict how you're gonna feel when you will be close to recovery other than it getting better and better progressively.

 

16 minutes ago, mariamisery said:

I plan on stopping going to gym for a bit and maybe just walk a little outside.  I went to gym with great difficulty! Right now the sensations in my body is awful and making me feel sick and emotionally unstable. Walking right now brings fast heartbeat. Wish I could sleep but can't.  I am doing best to not focus but failing.  I keep wishing that in the success stories people would have posted what they were feeling right up to  and before their victory. Need a section on how to survive this. Thanks for all the advice. I know we all healing but why does it have to feel like hell. 

Taking walks outside is a good idea. As for sleeping, maybe try some relaxation techniques aimed at sleeping. There really are some good ones that may be helpful. I also had terrible insomnia in January, I was literally afraid of going to bed because I knew I won't sleep, further hinder my progress and be alone in my minds for so long. After a week it was just gone by itself. If it persists for extremely long time, have you considered melatonin? Obviously as little as possible for start, but some users use it here. I'd personally save it for last resort option if you really couldn't get at least 7 hours of sleep in total regardless of time in the day for over three weeks, but remember about it when you feel out of options. I know such thinking may not sound helpful, but keep in mind some people withdraw from years of using opiates and it's described as even worse. Some people take many years to get better. Also, you don't have all possible symptoms like for example I never had hallucinations, sexual dysfunctions, jaw or muscle stiffness and some other ones. Point is, you're not terminally ill, you won't collapse, you won't be having it worse with time. This doesn't make it less of a nightmare, but at least you're not sentenced to death. Sometimes telling yourself "it could be worse and I'd still need to bear it" just gives you the right shock to change the perspective.

[mariamisery]

Your knowledge patience  and help is priceless. I  appreciate the fact of what you said  that it could be worse.  I guess today is a strong day of healing. This is one of  the worse day so far. Hopefully it should only be a few months for me. From what it sounds like your journey will be short. I see that recovery does not look the same for everyone. Btw how are you?

[BaccatePlayer]

There wasn't much time (8 hours today) when neuroemotions were taking over my perception during this wave, but I've written down negative thoughts that were appearing:

-I worked so hard to survive until 3. month ends and got so little in return,

-I'm among people who report unbearable waves after 4 years of stopping meds... and the IAR topic states it's on average 1-7 years to recover. What am I even suppose to think?

-Give me 50% of what I went through this week and that's still unbearable, 

-It's so unbearable in the moment and there's literally no relief to that... Even cancer has some morphine or anaesthesia, how are you supposed not to panic knowing this? "It'll pass" is basically cancelling yourself,

-If even my thoughts are the triggers then how am I even supposed to react?

-I can't get anxious, I can't get angry, I can't lift anything heavy, I have to forget about sex, I cannot feel myself for even a minute, during waves I may not even tolerate screens, walking and thinking overall, and who knows for how long, why is living in this state even allowed?

-What if I crossed the dark barrier and now my body will always have these reactions at hand?

-I'm probably making fool of myself thinking it will end this year. They know. They don't even react when I consider it cause they know it won't.

 

I may address them when I feel better but I really don't seem to be having any negative thoughts in regards to anything else than recovery time, severity of symptoms and helplessness around its restrictions. Really feels like all my other traumas just disappeared. Maybe discomfort and pain are the only real concerns of my ego?

 

Let's try to prepare a plan for potential wave with the same symptoms:

-breathing and heart rate fluctuations -> breathing should be ignored, as long as anxiety is in check, it doesn't create issues and for heartbeat, avoiding rapid changes of tempo like getting up too fast should be enough,

 

-internal discomfort and suffering crossing the pain thereshold -> not much can be done here, best to sleep through it since this really doesn't stem from an emotional reaction, it really was nothing but pain that you can't take painkiller for,

 

-jumpscares of few minutes internal terrifying states -> this is how I got a signal that a wave is starting and nothing except distractions and reassuring it will pass can be applied to this,

 

-right hand weakness -> already had a wave when this happened to left hand, but it's not a big deal, just... ignore it I guess?

 

-wave longer than last one -> reassuring myself it's not linear all the time and doesn't mean it's getting worse, may as well be bigger improvement underway,

 

-feelings of huge overall instability, lagging focus when processing real-time situations, feelings of collapsing and overloading burden in brain, propioception of head problems -> resting more, less screen time, slowing down the tempo, less thinking, sitting or lying more than standing or walking,

 

-head gripping and burning on extremely high intensity -> because brain burning has to do with panic disorders, it calls for relaxation and avoiding rumminations,

 

-depersonalization, dragged into terrifying state and poor mood after depersonalization -> waiting out around half an hour trying to connect with surrounding and maintaining composure, realizing this is neuroemotions in play thus either sleeping it through without thinking much or getting into big distraction if possible.

[mariamisery]

Wow! A lot going on. But you take out time to help and encourage others.   Sounds like you believe that longer and stronger waves mean more healing. I still think it will not take a year for you. Poweful experiences !!!

[BaccatePlayer]

7 minutes ago, mariamisery said:

Your knowledge patience  and help is priceless. I  appreciate the fact of what you said  that it could be worse.  I guess today is a strong day of healing. This is one of  the worse day so far. Hopefully it should only be a few months for me. From what it sounds like your journey will be short. I see that recovery does not look the same for everyone. Btw how are you?

Thank you Maria! When we're stuck in bad mood it's often helpful to drastically change the focus. Maybe there's even some frustration or anxiety that'a being stalled inside and needs a little shake to come out so you can move past that trap of feeling helpless. I was also thinking about last 24 hours as excessively bad but I usually have waves hitting the hardest when they're about to end and now I'm feeling better. It does look different for everyone, but I expect it to be rolling symptoms in first 3 months, then it slowly starts turning away. Currently having three milestones that I want to reach. One being 4 months mark, the other 6 months mark and last one 8 months mark. I don't even look further because by this time I really should be in satisfying shape. If you're young and in good overall health, you should recover in some similair pace, just keep working on your sleep, overthinking and panic. We're getting there!

[BaccatePlayer]

5 minutes ago, mariamisery said:

Wow! A lot going on. But you take out time to help and encourage others.   Sounds like you believe that longer and stronger waves mean more healing. I still think it will not take a year for you. Poweful experiences !!!

Yes, I highly rely on self-control thus every symptom that's new, alien, feels unnatural or destabilizing really shakes me for a while. If mood and thoughts are being altered by waves, it's really a challenge cause I have to let go of myself. Literally surrender and face the unknown with invisible premise of it ending soon and being harmless.

 

Being a sort of "team dad" has always been my role in most circles I participated in. Using precise words, metaphors that visualize experiences for others so they can relate to concepts better and capturing order in turmoil of feelings usually helps me to navigate myself and others through various struggles. We really need that here since doctors are mostly unhelpful and family members or friends can't exactly get our situation.

 

Waves signal a struggle to find a balance and since our symptoms are different and disappear during different windows, each time something else is being healed. I had few wave days that were mostly structured around physical suffering and today was a one focused on mood. Things improve all the time, so if I post in mid April and declare I feel overall better than last month, it's not a big deal that some fluctuations took place now. I don't see many people on their first 3 months saying "ah, I'll just relax cause I'll surely recover". There's a reason why there's a main topic called something like "Did I break myself for good?" or "Will it always be like this?" and people saying that during waves we feel like it has been and always will be like that. Sadly as much as this is our reality in the moment it really is just a mood and externally it couldn't be proven in any way.

 

After each wave I feel some new sensation being unlocked. Last time it was goosebumps, now I feel some familair warmth like the feeling we get just before we start sweating (I stopped sweating after that reaction for some reason), so yes, maybe less than a year. The sharp contrast between say 10 hours ago and now shows how powerful neuromoods are. Had I not know what's happening I'd be ready to give up then, but now I feel like not that much needs to be fixed before recovery. Homogenization means death in biology, so if my affirmations carried over from my windows to my wave, it means they're taking over, so symptoms days are counted. I hope you're growing stronger.

[Kaylaq]

@BaccatePlayer I admire your courage and optimism during the waves!!

sending you strength, courage, support and love to carry you through the waves! 💪🥰🙏

[BaccatePlayer]

7 hours ago, Kaylaq said:

@BaccatePlayer I admire your courage and optimism during the waves!!

sending you strength, courage, support and love to carry you through the waves! 💪🥰🙏

Thank you Kaylaq! I try not to judge my condition by mornings, but today I felt like wave ended but still left me with that stability and processing issue on top of wierd, poor mood. Maybe it needs a few hours to fully stabilize or it's just the heavy symptoms that wave exaggregated but it doesn't change the fact that they're still there. Being desperate to be fully fixed within days would not help me now, so I'm trying to catch momentum of positivity. Right after a wave my motivation often drops back to 0, so I'll try to relax and focus on my surrounding as constant scanning my state isn't optimal. Sending you lots of good energy too!

[mariamisery]

 How to keep doing this everyday. Wake up feeling awful. Breathing but feelings like I can't.  So uncomfortable and challenging  I am trying to take everyones advice.  Trying to focus elsewhere. This is painful. 

[BaccatePlayer]

3 minutes ago, mariamisery said:

How to keep doing this everyday. Wake up feeling awful. Breathing but feelings like I can't.  So uncomfortable and challenging  I am trying to take everyones advice.  Trying to focus elsewhere. This is painful. 

Having similair thoughts. Cannot walk around because balance issues persisting, like everything going too fast for my brain to process it in motion. I'm staying in bed with my head supported by a pillow, that seems to reduce it to nausea alone. Maybe I should take more brakes from screens too.

 

I'd say try working on a deeper level of distraction. At some point a month ago I caught myself being decently preocuppied, but I wasn't actually out of my symptoms mood. Then I tried to ignore every thought about jow I was feeling that was popping out and after 1-2 weeks it got drastically better. Often we think just because we participate or observe something external our focus is there too, but you might not even be aware how rumminations keep running in the background pressing your impatience and still winning over your attention. For me dreams are a good metric for what's going on my head. If I complain, wonder when it will end in my dreams, that's too much thinking about it throughout the day. When I notice my dreams are about book analysis, some intimacy scenes or sports, that means I'm not stuck in this topic. Of course dreams about withdrawal state still occur during waves, but it's really only one or two nights. Have you tried APPLE technique by getofflex? Maybe AAF? It seems like the only way out of it is applying solution, but you should actually counter that urge for desperate relief. Remember that even if you don't see immediate improvement in your mood, surrounding yourself with stable and regular situations like watching pets playing, talking to someone, coloring, it still adds up and affects you. You may be feeling relaxation doesn't work in the moment but your CNS is very slow now and deals with symptoms less efficiently, so it will take some time before you get used to breaking negative thought patterns but sadly you can instantly break positive thought patterns because your mind is already wired for realizing danger. For around 3-4 hours in the morning I feel my brain is still sleeping and haven't woke up yet. This is why people report waves getting more intense when they get too comfortable with their endurance during windows. Your mood can shift drastically, so please refrain from fixating on the current one because it really isn't determining.

[KaiLee]

Struggling too. I can't even feel that I exist. 

[BaccatePlayer]

10 minutes ago, KaiLee said:

Struggling too. I can't even feel that I exist. 

So sorry KaiLee... Best we can do is to focus on the narrative that we indeed exist. Slowing down and trying to reconnect with our sense of reality seems at least good effort in the right direction. Please don't give up, we are in this together!

[Dahlia50]

Am in hospital but getting more support here from you. Which is wrong, we should get help from healthcare.

[BaccatePlayer]

7 minutes ago, Dahlia50 said:

Am in hospital but getting more support here from you. Which is wrong, we should get help from healthcare.

We are hoping to get better and we know what it's like. Doctors just earn money. It is unfair, especially since people going through withdrawals and immediate adverse reactions are most often already burdened by anxiety, depression and personality disorders to begin with and now they're even more tormented by drug effects. Most people wouldn't believe you can suffer withdrawal for more than a week or month at worst. I wonder if passing the topic from here to my psychistrist would do anything, all she do is fill something in her computer for five minutes, let me talk for two, prescribe something for another two and once she gets her money she quickly pushes me towards the exit. Then again, what we face is actually a rare condition and no wonder it's unknown. What is wondering is that psychiatrist whose job is dealing with these meds are so clueless or ignorant about it.

[mariamisery]

I was getting a few small windows . Now the waves are just staying. I stopped forcing myself  to go to  the gym on last Frday. It almost feel like my body is making up for lost time.  It must be a relief knowing that your suffering is not all day.  Again,  you are 3 months in withdrawal ?

[BaccatePlayer]

15 minutes ago, mariamisery said:

I was getting a few small windows . Now the waves are just staying. I stopped forcing myself  to go to  the gym on last Frday. It almost feel like my body is making up for lost time.  It must be a relief knowing that your suffering is not all day.  Again,  you are 3 months in withdrawal ?

Windows are our opportunity to learn about our real thoughts and emotions. Learn these patterns Maria! So that when a wave comes and tries to alter your perception you know what is your true belief and what is just a neuroemotion wanting to scare you.

 

It was a hard decision for me to leave the gym in December. I've been into bodybuilding for 10 years, learnt and taught about it, probably even more than about psychology. But it immediately kept worsening my symptoms. I had to let go of it. Don't force yourself to do things you don't necessarly need to do, Maria. I was saving myself until I learnt my granddad died in February. That's when I had to use my reserves. I know it sounds like you hold onto regular life going somewhere, but if you stress yourself and provoke symptoms, it's not worth it. There was a time in January where I couldn't get up from bed for days. Balance issues were so strong and I was so sleepy that I thought I'm getting worse. But these were just symptoms. I never lost the ability to walk or go outside, but during that week it just wasn't doing any good. I was sleeping a lot and it eventually allowed me to get back to do things later. Right now I'm also lying in bed just to save myself from experiencing these processing issues. Far objects, things moving rapidly - this simply may not be the week for it for me. But it does get better. It will eventually get back to normal. You will be back to exercising, but right now you won't gain much, but can make your waves a nasty time. Please be gentle for your body, a light walk should be alright, but if at the cost of you suffering later, maybe gazing through the window or balcony can be enough for now? I don't want you to get heart palpitations and breathing issues at higher rate than necessary. Accepting temporary limits is sometimes a step towards managing your symptoms better.

 

Yes, it is 93. day today. Absolutely worst 3 months of my life, but it seems stabilizing and getting more linear in how it loses its intensity. My mood is no longer that easily bent under neuroemotions, pain doesn't reach breakdown levels, I'm going to town every week and I don't experience panic nor anxiety lately. I wish next step in my recovery was no longer having these wierd thoughts and feeling myself in my own head again. No more depersonalization and derealization - that's the goal. Obviously less pain, no jumpscares or that internal overload would be nice too, but last month is already a stellar improvement I'm glad for.